Messages in S-Trains group.

Page 1 of 1.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77164	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77165	From: poniaj	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77166	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: North Shore...Chicago
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77167	From: rick flaherty	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: New Year
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77168	From: Bill Lane	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Southwind box wanted
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77169	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77170	From: traindavid	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Berkshires & back up light
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77171	From: Bill Clark	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77172	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77173	From: racin510	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshires & back up light
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77174	From: snstrains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77175	From: beebear	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshires & back up light
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77176	From: Jim Schiele	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77177	From: racin510	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77178	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77179	From: poniaj	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77180	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77181	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77182	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77183	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77184	From: alevans51	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: BERKSHIRE ASSESSMENT
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77185	From: rxman46321	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77186	From: rick gough	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77187	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77188	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: New Year
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77189	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77190	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Sound low on Polar Express
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77191	From: henry_betz	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77192	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77193	From: beebear	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: : New S gaugre berks observation and fix
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77194	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77195	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77196	From: snstrains	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77197	From: racin510	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: : New S gaugre berks observation and fix
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77198	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77199	From: snstrains	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77200	From: traindavid	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77201	From: srjaynes	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Seeking Catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77202	From: James Lyle	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77203	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77204	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77205	From: wd511@att.net	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77206	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77207	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77208	From: traindavid	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77209	From: snstrains	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77210	From: mike rosz	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77211	From: altoonamark	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77212	From: racin510	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77213	From: wd511@att.net	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77214	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Factory lettering removal
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77215	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77216	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: 1/64 slot cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77217	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Seeking Catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77218	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77219	From: racin510	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77220	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: 1/64 slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77221	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77222	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77223	From: Rick Evans	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77224	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77225	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77226	From: Carey Probst	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77227	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77228	From: Herb and Bev Lanier	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77229	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77230	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77231	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77232	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77233	From: Tom	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77234	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77235	From: rick gough	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77236	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77237	From: rick gough	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77238	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77239	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77240	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77241	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77242	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77243	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77244	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77245	From: Tom	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77246	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77247	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77248	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77249	From: trndad	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77250	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77251	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77252	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77253	From: n6ojj	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77254	From: racin510	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77255	From: racin510	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77256	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Idea for new mods. Standards
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77257	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77258	From: allscalerails	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue # 6 Jan / Feb 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77259	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77260	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77261	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77262	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77263	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77264	From: rick flaherty	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77265	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77266	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77267	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77268	From: Herb and Bev Lanier	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77269	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77270	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77271	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77272	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77273	From: jaytewilli	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Berk "Flickering Firebox"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77274	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77275	From: Robert Graves	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: New Layout Tour Video is online
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77276	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77277	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77278	From: racin510	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77279	From: Bob Hannon	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77280	From: gregory mccormack	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: piggy back unloader ramps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77281	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Possible new AF track module Specifications
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77282	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Building the Lionel 14 car Tunnel at desribed on page 54 of Classic
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77283	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77284	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77285	From: racin510	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77286	From: Tom	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: AM flex track question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77287	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77288	From: Dennis Donovan	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77289	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77290	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77291	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77292	From: Roger Huber	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77293	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77294	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77295	From: snstrains	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77296	From: race944t	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Gilbert AF Parts List and internal diagrams
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77297	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77298	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert AF Parts List and internal diagrams
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77299	From: rick gough	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77300	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: A M reversing board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77301	From: trndad	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: A M reversing board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77302	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77303	From: wyoaf	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Automatic Operation of Magnetic Crane
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77304	From: racin510	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: Automatic Operation of Magnetic Crane
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77305	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77306	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77307	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: A M reversing board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77308	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77309	From: trndad	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77310	From: Dennis Donovan	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77311	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77312	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77313	From: racin510	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77314	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77315	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77316	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77317	From: trndad	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77318	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77319	From: trndad	Date: 1/15/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77320	From: Eric	Date: 1/15/2016
Subject: For Sale: Pine Canyon Fire Station
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77321	From: David Highfield	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77322	From: butch8339@atlanticbb.net	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: smoke fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77323	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77324	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77325	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77326	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77327	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77328	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77329	From: wema103	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: cti electronics review?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77330	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77331	From: tennsgauger	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77332	From: Jonathan Hatfield	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77333	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77334	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77335	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/20/2016
Subject: AF powered turnouts cost twice as much as manual ones.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77336	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/20/2016
Subject: Nice photo
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77337	From: trndad	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77338	From: Roy Inman	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77339	From: gartrain404	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77340	From: calleytwo	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77341	From: William Lewis	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77342	From: snstrains	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77343	From: racin510	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77344	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77345	From: poniaj	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77346	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77347	From: Milo Rodriguez	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77348	From: Milo Rodriguez	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: [showcaseline] Jim Lyle
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77349	From: traindavid	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY from Glenn Ritter
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77350	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77351	From: scaler164	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: New 1/64 Items
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77352	From: scaler164	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: [S Scale Model Railroading] New 1/64 Items
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77353	From: racin510	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: Re: New 1/64 Items
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77354	From: snstrains	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77355	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77356	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: The sixth floor
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77357	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77358	From: snstrains	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: Re: The sixth floor
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77359	From: snstrains	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77360	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77361	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Using my Ring wireless controler for turnouts.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77362	From: scaler164	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: !!! HEADS UP on PRS (and GC?) Parts !!!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77363	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Using my Ring wireless controler for turnouts.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77364	From: trndad	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Mystery Reefers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77365	From: Roger Young	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77366	From: trndad	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77367	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Model 1277 Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77368	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: February/March 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77369	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} ONE DOWN!!! But Still One To Go... [2 Attachments
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77370	From: rj4010d	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} ONE DOWN!!! But Still One To Go... [2 Attachments
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77371	From: Roy Inman	Date: 1/27/2016
Subject: Big Boy
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77372	From: michael Cantu	Date: 1/28/2016
Subject: American Flyer Lionel 42570 Set
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77373	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 1/28/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77374	From: Richard Hosmer	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77375	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77376	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77377	From: David Highfield	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77378	From: snstrains	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77379	From: Bob Groh	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77380	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77381	From: Alan Smith	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77382	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77383	From: Robert Graves	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77384	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77385	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 January 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77386	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Hindsight is always 20/20
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77387	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77388	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Current train prices
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77389	From: barb	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Current Train Pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77390	From: bill hoglund	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Hindsight is always 20/20
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77391	From: racin510	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Current Train Pricing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77392	From: wyoaf	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77393	From: mike gardner	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77394	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77395	From: scaler164	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Cars For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77396	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Big Boy
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77397	From: bstilesaf	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Wanted: #350 Royal Blue shell
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77398	From: rick gough	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77399	From: traindavid	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box & Royal Blue Shell
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77400	From: niblick_32966	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77401	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: SnS can motors
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77402	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box & Royal Blue Shell
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77403	From: snstrains	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: 770 "fix"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77404	From: mapman504	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77405	From: scaler164	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Cars SOLD
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77406	From: Carey Probst	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: SnS can motors
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77407	From: snstrains	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: SnS can motors (your answer).
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77408	From: John Davis	Date: 2/3/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77409	From: traindavid	Date: 2/3/2016
Subject: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77410	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77411	From: rfalzini	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Bob Board Video
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77412	From: Bill Clark	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77413	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77414	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Scale wheel sets for F3
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77415	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77416	From: pete.henningsen	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77417	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77418	From: pete.henningsen	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77419	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77420	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77421	From: Robert Graves	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77422	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77423	From: americanflyer	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77424	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77425	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: 481 Alco Loud Horn
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77426	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77427	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77428	From: racin510	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: 481 Alco Loud Horn
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77429	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: 481 Alco Loud Horn
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77430	From: traindavid	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77431	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77432	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77433	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77434	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77435	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77436	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77437	From: gregory mccormack	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: 521 T set
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77438	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77439	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77440	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel names
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77441	From: snstrains	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: 521 T set
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77442	From: traindavid	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77443	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77444	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77445	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77446	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77447	From: racin510	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77448	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77449	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77450	From: R G	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77451	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77452	From: racin510	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77453	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77454	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77455	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77456	From: gsc3	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: For sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77457	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: NMRA Convention in Indianapolis - S Scale Layouts ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77458	From: snstrains	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: SHS trucks for sale or swap
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77459	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77460	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77461	From: gsc3	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: For sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77462	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77463	From: portlines	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77464	From: Tom	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77465	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77466	From: trndad	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77467	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77468	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77469	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77470	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77471	From: rj4010d	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77472	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77473	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77474	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77475	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77476	From: mlprell	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Help With a 314 AW
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77477	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77478	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77479	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77480	From: NEIL FERRIS	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77481	From: Bob Groh	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77482	From: doheld	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: RRM Milw.Rd. Boxcar 50'-7" for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77483	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77484	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77485	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77486	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77487	From: lx5043	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77488	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77489	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Generation Gap
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77490	From: racin510	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77491	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77492	From: traindavid	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC, steam & chrome plating
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77493	From: racin510	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77494	From: poniaj	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77495	From: beebear	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77496	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: UP ALSO SHELLS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77497	From: traindavid	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77498	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Removing chrome and rechroming
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77499	From: Kyle	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: American Models GG1 lettering removal?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77500	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77501	From: Larry Moore	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77502	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: American Models GG1 lettering removal?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77503	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77504	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77505	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: American Models GG1 lettering removal?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77506	From: kempfam	Date: 2/14/2016
Subject: Lionel Fyer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77507	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77508	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77509	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77510	From: Dale Smith	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77511	From: snstrains	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77512	From: kerhart@frontier.com	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: American Flyer #336 For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77513	From: racin510	Date: 2/16/2016
Subject: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77514	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Freight trucks for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77515	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77516	From: carl4flyer	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77517	From: william lewis	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77518	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77519	From: richs009	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77520	From: snstrains	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77521	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77522	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77523	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77524	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77525	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two !
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77526	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Whats left of the trucks & couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77527	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Standard and O gauge catalogs
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77528	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Whats left of the trucks & couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77529	From: snstrains	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Whats left of the trucks & couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77530	From: rick gough	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two ! [3 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77531	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/18/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two !
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77532	From: George Cohn	Date: 2/18/2016
Subject: LED Stoplight kit
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77533	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Carton for 4611-A Set
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77534	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77535	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77536	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77537	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77538	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77539	From: traindavid	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77540	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77541	From: Eric	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: S Stuff for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77542	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Repairing Hudson tender steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77543	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77544	From: racin510	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson tender steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77545	From: Dale Smith	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77546	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77547	From: poniaj	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77548	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson tender steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77549	From: scaler164	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: LOOKING FOR : PRS Box Car - UNDEC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77550	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77551	From: barb	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77552	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77553	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77554	From: richs009	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77555	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77556	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77557	From: barb	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Straightening Hudson steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77558	From: G. Leigh Swanson	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77559	From: rudypenne	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77560	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77561	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77562	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 February 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77563	From: michael Cantu	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: Looking for 6-48136 rail sounds car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77564	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail DL 109
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77565	From: Raymond Kemper	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77566	From: Ben E. Colley	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77567	From: carl4flyer	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77568	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77569	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77570	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: wanted. AF slot car radio stat. It looks like a gas pedal.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77571	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: wanted. AF slot car radio stat. It looks like a gas pedal.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77572	From: tennsgauger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77573	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77574	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77575	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77576	From: Dale Smith	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77577	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: HO slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77578	From: Rick Evans	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: HO slot cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77579	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Found 20 slot car controlers on e-bay.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77580	From: njma41	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: 634/934 Search light car gasket
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77581	From: snstrains	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: 634/934 Search light car gasket
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77582	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77583	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77584	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77585	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: 634/934 Search light car gasket
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77586	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77587	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77588	From: Ben Perry	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77589	From: bill hoglund	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77590	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77591	From: George Cohn	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77592	From: Roy Inman	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77593	From: poniaj	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77594	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77595	From: James	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77596	From: ecphora123	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77597	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77598	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77599	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77600	From: richs009	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77601	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77602	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Getting still older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77603	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77604	From: Alan Smith	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77605	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77606	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77607	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older [9 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77608	From: poniaj	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77609	From: Roy Inman	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77610	From: traindavid	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: National S Gauge MONTH!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77611	From: traindavid	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Getting Old, or was always old
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77612	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77613	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77614	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77615	From: Carey Probst	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77616	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77617	From: JFrederick Roberts	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77618	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77619	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77620	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: Getting Old, or was always old
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77621	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77622	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77623	From: traindavid	Date: 3/6/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77624	From: vito4cal	Date: 3/7/2016
Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: 2016 O Scale West & S West 11
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77625	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/7/2016
Subject: Converting Flyonel to scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77626	From: pickycat95	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Converting Flyonel to scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77627	From: race944t	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Dunbar, WV train show
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77628	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Converting Flyonel to scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77629	From: Raymond Kemper	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77630	From: n6ojj	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77631	From: Doug Peck	Date: 3/9/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77632	From: racin510	Date: 3/9/2016
Subject: Tom Barker
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77633	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: AF Steamer Gear Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77634	From: snstrains	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Steamer Gear Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77635	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Steamer Gear Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77636	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77637	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77638	From: n6ojj	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77639	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77640	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: jeff faust book
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77641	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77642	From: beebear	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77643	From: R G	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77644	From: traindavid	Date: 3/16/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77645	From: Don Abrams	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77646	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77647	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77648	From: veronifamily	Date: 3/18/2016
Subject: structure kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77649	From: allscalerails	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #7 March / April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77650	From: Doug Peck	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: Re: structure kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77651	From: traindavid	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: Will miss Sunday Chat
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77652	From: Gerry Evans	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: In Print...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77653	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77654	From: Bill Lane	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: New YouTube clip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77655	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77656	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: A Newbie's Observations
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77657	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A Newbie's Observations
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77658	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A Newbie's Observations
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77659	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A newbie's observations
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77660	From: Randall Griggs	Date: 3/22/2016
Subject: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77661	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Re: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77662	From: rxman46321	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Blantant Ad
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77663	From: paul	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Re: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77664	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: April/May 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77665	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/24/2016
Subject: video of BSG operating session Mar. 19, 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77666	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77667	From: claudino.john	Date: 3/27/2016
Subject: Happy Easter.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77668	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 March 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77669	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 3/29/2016
Subject: TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED OPEN HOUSE
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77670	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/29/2016
Subject: Flyonel axle or wheel and axle set needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77671	From: lhralco21	Date: 3/31/2016
Subject: O and S Scale Show Sunday 4/10 in Hudson, MA Postponed to Sunday 7/1
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77672	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77673	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77674	From: smuel10263	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: Re: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77675	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: Re: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77676	From: traindavid	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: Sunday Chat
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77677	From: snstrains	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: Re: Sunday Chat
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77678	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77679	From: traindavid	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77680	From: chuck_7612	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77681	From: chuck_7612	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77682	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Bob Hammig ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77683	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: Bob Hammig ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77684	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77685	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Bob Hammig ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77686	From: tommcindc	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77687	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77688	From: rick gough	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77689	From: henrykoshollek	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77690	From: Bob Groh	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77691	From: snstrains	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77692	From: traindavid	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77693	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Small locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77694	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77695	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77696	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Small locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77697	From: daleminard	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77698	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77699	From: racin510	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Challenger Smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77700	From: zemouse2001	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77701	From: traindavid	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77702	From: lx5043	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77703	From: racin510	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77704	From: ecphora123	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77705	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77706	From: racin510	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77707	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77708	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77709	From: G C	Date: 4/10/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77710	From: traindavid	Date: 4/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77711	From: racin510	Date: 4/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77712	From: carl4flyer	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Re: Challenger Smoke
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77713	From: henry_betz	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77714	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77715	From: Thomas Kaufman	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Digest Number 7054
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77716	From: Robert Graves	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77717	From: traindavid	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77718	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77719	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: action car - player pianos etc.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77720	From: tennsgauger	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Have...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77721	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77722	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77723	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77724	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77725	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77726	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77727	From: Jim Alessio	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77728	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77729	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77730	From: John and Carol	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77731	From: James	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77732	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77733	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77734	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77735	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77736	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77737	From: traindavid	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77738	From: Roger Huber	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77739	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77740	From: Alan Bennett	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77741	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77742	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/18/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77743	From: tbennerohio	Date: 4/18/2016
Subject: new Fort Wayne Line update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77744	From: hspanier2000	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Operat
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77745	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77746	From: Scott Holm	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77747	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77748	From: R G	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77749	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Op
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77750	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77751	From: ee_train	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Op
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77752	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77753	From: barb	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Fort Wayne Line Update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77754	From: tbennerohio	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Fort Wayne Line Update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77755	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77756	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77757	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77758	From: Scott Holm	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77759	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77760	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77761	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77762	From: Gary Chudzinski	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77763	From: traindavid	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77764	From: n6ojj	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77765	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77766	From: traindavid	Date: 4/24/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77767	From: Bob Hannon	Date: 4/24/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77768	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77769	From: howardpape12	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77770	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77771	From: The Laniers	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77772	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77773	From: hobbycj1	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77774	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77775	From: Bill Clark	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77776	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77777	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77778	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77779	From: tennsgauger	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77780	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Memory Triggers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77781	From: pickycat95	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77782	From: racin510	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77783	From: mike_a_2001	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77784	From: poniaj	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77785	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Gloria eye dr, Wednesday, 27 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77786	From: roninscho	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77787	From: traindavid	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77788	From: trndad	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Cylindrical Hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77789	From: R G	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77790	From: lenscap76	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77791	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77792	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77793	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Plastic Steam Locomotives
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77794	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: AF Train, Thursday, 28 April 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77795	From: pickycat95	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77796	From: Kyle	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Plastic Steam Locomotives
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77797	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77798	From: trndad	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77799	From: traindavid	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77800	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Plastic Steam Locomotives
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77801	From: Rick Evans	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77802	From: The Laniers	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77803	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77804	From: Alan Smith	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77805	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77806	From: MARY & JAMES DAVIDSON	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77807	From: clifma19@cox.net	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77808	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77809	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77810	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77811	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77812	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77813	From: David Highfield	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77814	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77815	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77816	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77817	From: traindavid	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77818	From: srjaynes	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77819	From: srjaynes	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77820	From: racin510	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77821	From: poniaj	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77822	From: paul	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77823	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77824	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77825	From: calleytwo	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77826	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77827	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77828	From: traindavid	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77829	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77830	From: paul	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77831	From: snstrains	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77832	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Bent tender step
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77833	From: paul	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77834	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: SHS F-3 shorting plugs
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77835	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77836	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77837	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77838	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77839	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77840	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77841	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77842	From: George Cohn	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77843	From: traindavid	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77844	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77845	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77846	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77847	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77848	From: Cindy Buehling	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77849	From: snstrains	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77850	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77851	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77852	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77853	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77854	From: paul	Date: 5/4/2016
Subject: lets talk
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77855	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/4/2016
Subject: Re: lets talk [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77856	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Re: Bent tender step
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77857	From: nsupbnsf@juno.com	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77858	From: aleisen@juno.com	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77859	From: racin510	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77860	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77861	From: Mike Andrzejewski	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77862	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77863	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77864	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Help request from a group dying membert
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77865	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77866	From: zemouse2001	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77867	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77868	From: paul	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77869	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77870	From: srjaynes	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77871	From: rj4010d	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77872	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 08 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77873	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77874	From: snstrains	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77875	From: allscalerails	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #8 May / June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77876	From: racin510	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77877	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 08 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77878	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: American Models Catalogs -- fw
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77879	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77880	From: nsupbnsf@juno.com	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: S-Helper 2-8-0 Gear Replacement
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77881	From: attic02	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77882	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77883	From: william lewis	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77884	From: racin510	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77885	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77886	From: UNLV666@...	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: S-Helper 2-8-0 Gear Replacement
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77887	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77888	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77889	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77890	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77891	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77892	From: afot7	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77893	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Spring Spree
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77894	From: vu68	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77895	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77896	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77897	From: n6ojj	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77898	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77899	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77900	From: paul	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77901	From: daleminard	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Memphis, Tennessee Area
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77902	From: njma41	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77903	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Memphis, Tennessee Area
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77904	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77905	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77906	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77907	From: traindavid	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Group dying? ant other stuff that came up.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77908	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 15 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77909	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77910	From: beebear	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Great S Spree show!!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77911	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77912	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 15 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77913	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77914	From: rj4010d	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77915	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77916	From: Edward Loizeaux	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Lost & Found Help Needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77917	From: garydmccullah	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77918	From: racin510	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying ??
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77919	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77920	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77921	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77922	From: Roger Haag	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77923	From: wcbeverly	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Slim Gauge Guild Open House 6/5 & 6/7
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77924	From: snstrains	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77925	From: tennsgauger	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Trying to contact Rhett Graves of Huntsville Alabama
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77926	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Back from the Spree
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77927	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77928	From: Edward Loizeaux	Date: 5/17/2016
Subject: Lost & Found Help Needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77929	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/18/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77930	From: srjaynes	Date: 5/18/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77931	From: traindavid	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77932	From: snstrains	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77933	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77934	From: race944t	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77935	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77936	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77937	From: Ted Walton	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77938	From: traindavid	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77939	From: traindavid	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: New vehciles & trailers for layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77940	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 22 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77941	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: New vehciles & trailers for layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77942	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Back from the Spree
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77943	From: traindavid	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77944	From: sageviehe@att.net	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: American Flyer 12B transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77945	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 22 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77946	From: Art Cooper	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77947	From: Sage Viehe	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77948	From: racin510	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77949	From: chuck_7612	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77950	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 5/24/2016
Subject: June/July 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77951	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77952	From: snstrains	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77953	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77954	From: racin510	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77955	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77956	From: markaflyer	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77957	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77958	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77959	From: bowlsalot2	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77960	From: Al Baker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77961	From: alhbaker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77962	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77963	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77964	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77965	From: Ben E. Colley	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77966	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77967	From: yorktown26	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77968	From: chuck_7612	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77969	From: reefma_99	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77970	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77971	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77972	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77973	From: Lon Walker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77974	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77975	From: leflak	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77976	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77977	From: traindavid	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77978	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77979	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77980	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77981	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77982	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77983	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77984	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77985	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77986	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77987	From: bud9351	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: AF PA windshield info
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77988	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77989	From: rick flaherty	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77990	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77991	From: rick flaherty	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77992	From: JOHN METZGER	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77993	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77994	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77995	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77996	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77997	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77998	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 77999	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78000	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78001	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78002	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78003	From: racin510	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78004	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78005	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78006	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78007	From: Doug Peck	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78008	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 29 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78009	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78010	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78011	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 29 May 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78012	From: traindavid	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: 499 out of its shell--at last!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78013	From: traindavid	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78014	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78015	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78016	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78017	From: Paul Krause	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78018	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78019	From: George Cohn	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78020	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78021	From: racin510	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78022	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78023	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78024	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DRAK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78025	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78026	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78027	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78028	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78029	From: Charles Hancock	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78030	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78031	From: Alan Evans	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78032	From: traindavid	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78033	From: racin510	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78034	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78035	From: Dr Trains	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78036	From: Michael	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78037	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78038	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78039	From: chuck_7612	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78040	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78041	From: traindavid	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78042	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78043	From: sgaugian	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78044	From: Alan Evans	Date: 6/2/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78045	From: roninscho	Date: 6/4/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78046	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 05 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78047	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/5/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 05 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78048	From: aftrains4u	Date: 6/6/2016
Subject: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78049	From: R G	Date: 6/6/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78050	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78051	From: Doug Peck	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78052	From: frank emiro	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78053	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78054	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78055	From: traindavid	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78056	From: snstrains	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78057	From: RONALD KEMP	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: (no subject)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78058	From: John Keating	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78059	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: STILL NOTHING
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78060	From: snstrains	Date: 6/9/2016
Subject: Re:
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78061	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 12 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78062	From: Bill Lane	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: American Flyer LCL container
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78063	From: markaflyer	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer LCL container [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78064	From: bowes.craig	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer LCL container
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78065	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 12 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78066	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 19 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78067	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 19 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78068	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 6/19/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78069	From: snstrains	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78070	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum $ Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78071	From: Alan Smith	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum $ Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78072	From: Ray Puls	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78073	From: poniaj	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78074	From: traindavid	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78075	From: race944t	Date: 6/21/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78076	From: michael Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78077	From: sageviehe@att.net	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Alco PA Wheel Spin
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78078	From: Tom Crowley	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78079	From: michael Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78080	From: Mark Kiner	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78081	From: Mike Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78082	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78083	From: racin510	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Alco PA Wheel Spin
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78084	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Alco PA Wheel Spin
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78085	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78086	From: Bill Lane	Date: 6/25/2016
Subject: SHS SW1 for sale or trade
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78087	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 26 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78088	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 26 June 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78089	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/28/2016
Subject: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78090	From: Ray Puls	Date: 6/29/2016
Subject: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78091	From: lhralco21	Date: 6/29/2016
Subject: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78092	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78093	From: Dale Smith	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78094	From: first.lurk	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78095	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78096	From: lhralco21	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78097	From: racin510	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Lionel marker led's
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78098	From: onghoe2002	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: wow!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78099	From: srjaynes	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78100	From: first.lurk	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78101	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78102	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78103	From: tbennerohio	Date: 7/4/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78104	From: dphobbies	Date: 7/5/2016
Subject: New S Manufacturer at Indy NMRA TRainshow
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78105	From: beebear	Date: 7/5/2016
Subject: Re: New S Manufacturer at Indy NMRA TRainshow
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78106	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/7/2016
Subject: Beautiful Trestle for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78107	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78108	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78109	From: Bill Eppler	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78110	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78111	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78112	From: racin510	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78113	From: Bill Eppler	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78114	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78115	From: mike rosz	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78116	From: allscalerails	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #9 July / August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78117	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78118	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: New file uploaded to S-Trains
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78119	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78120	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78121	From: wyoaf	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Dump, dagnabit !!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78122	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF HO locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78123	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78124	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78125	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78126	From: Doug Peck	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78127	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78128	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78129	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78130	From: R G	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78131	From: traindavid	Date: 7/13/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78132	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78133	From: Robert Graves	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: For Sale: American Flyer 175W 16B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78134	From: Robert Graves	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: For Sale: American Flyer 585 Tool Shed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78135	From: Tom	Date: 7/15/2016
Subject: Chuff chamber question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78136	From: racin510	Date: 7/15/2016
Subject: Re: Chuff chamber question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78137	From: traindavid	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: MTH F3---Wait until October!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78138	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: New S-scale Figures
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78139	From: thecitrusbelt	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Layouts Needed For Central Coast RR Festival - Oct. 7-9 (Calif.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78140	From: tennsgauger	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Re: MTH F3---Wait until October!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78141	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78142	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Re: MTH F3---Wait until October!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78143	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: you tube
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78144	From: traindavid	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78145	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78146	From: Roy Inman	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78147	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Magnificent Passenger cars for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78148	From: snstrains	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Magnificent passenger cars for sale.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78149	From: Mark Kiner	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: F3 sf aba
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78150	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: F3 sf aba
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78151	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78152	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78153	From: Gary Chudzinski	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78154	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78155	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78156	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78157	From: traindavid	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78158	From: rm_hirailer	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78159	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78160	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Identifying self, was -- Re: [S-Trains] Re: MTH = YAWN
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78161	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78162	From: Doug Peck	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: SW-9 parts needed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78163	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: Identifying self, was -- Re: [S-Trains] Re: MTH = YAWN
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78164	From: traindavid	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78165	From: trndad	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Franklin Factory Presentation Model
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78166	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78167	From: chuck_7612	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78168	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78169	From: ac312	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Need hirail trucks and couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78170	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78171	From: Dr Trains	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: Need hirail trucks and couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78172	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 7/22/2016
Subject: Re: Need hirail trucks and couplers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78173	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 7/23/2016
Subject: June/July 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78174	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78175	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78176	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Paul Yorke's Web Site?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78177	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78178	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78179	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78180	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78181	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 July 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78182	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: a favorite loco and color scheme
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78183	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78184	From: R G	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78185	From: traindavid	Date: 8/1/2016
Subject: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78186	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78187	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78188	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/3/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78189	From: reefma_99	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78190	From: lionely6b	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: Digest Number 7155
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78191	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78192	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78193	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/5/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78194	From: michael Cantu	Date: 8/6/2016
Subject: 24221 Hopper and 24633 Caboose
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78195	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78196	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: 314 AW
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78197	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78198	From: ken	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78199	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78200	From: snstrains	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78201	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78202	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78203	From: snstrains	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78204	From: Phyllis Bothwell	Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Auction at Novi
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78205	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78206	From: Noplowboy@...	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78207	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78208	From: acgilbertguy	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: a-Koostikin AF 595 Talking Tool Shed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78209	From: stevew970	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: room share at Novi
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78210	From: William J. Gill	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78211	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: I gave in to temptation - my AF fleet doubled in size yesterday
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78212	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78213	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78214	From: bill hoglund	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: I gave in to temptation - my AF fleet doubled in size yesterday
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78215	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: K4 penn steam engine
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78216	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78217	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78218	From: poniaj	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78219	From: jhannawald	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78220	From: Jim	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78221	From: Eric	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78222	From: railandsail	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78223	From: Ray Puls	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78224	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Extruded Styrofoam layouts
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78225	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78226	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78227	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78228	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78229	From: rudypenne	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Extruded Styrofoam layouts
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78230	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Synopsis: pink foam good for layout but NOT good for noise
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78231	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78232	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: Re: Synopsis: pink foam good for layout but NOT good for noise
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78233	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78234	From: garydmccullah	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: Roadbed
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78235	From: kensington3121	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78236	From: traindavid	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Missed chat, probably will miss a lot for a while
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78237	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Re: Missed chat, probably will miss a lot for a while
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78238	From: portlines	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78239	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78240	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78241	From: Dale Smith	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78242	From: kissimmeeaf	Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Painted or unpainted.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78243	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Re: Painted or unpainted.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78244	From: skibbs4	Date: 8/20/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78245	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78246	From: traindavid	Date: 8/21/2016
Subject: Sunday Night Chat
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78247	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78248	From: The Laniers	Date: 8/22/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78249	From: Ingram-James4-YahooGrps-17701	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: =New Video: DCC Automatic Yard Controls 3 Trains on 1 Mainline
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78250	From: Roy Meissner	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: Fall S Fest
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78251	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: Loud grinding noise on a 326
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78252	From: Paul Krause	Date: 8/24/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78253	From: The Laniers	Date: 8/24/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78254	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 8/25/2016
Subject: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78255	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78256	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double Heading Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78257	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78258	From: John Davis	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78259	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: S-Mod - any action at all out there?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78260	From: ken	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double Heading Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78261	From: Tom	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78262	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78263	From: Tom	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78264	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78265	From: thecitrusbelt	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: Layout Tour #51: Riverside-San Bernardino (So. Calif.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78266	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78267	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 August 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78268	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78269	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics [3 Attachments]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78270	From: ken	Date: 8/29/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78271	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/29/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78272	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 9/1/2016
Subject: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78273	From: rebendever	Date: 9/1/2016
Subject: FS: Double Stall Engine House Model *Built-Up* Building & Structure
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78274	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: NASG Website update & all Websites Updates
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78275	From: Dale Smith	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Website update & all Websites Updates
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78276	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: Doujble Head
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78277	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: No train deliveries for a while???
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78278	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016, Saturday, 17 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78279	From: roninscho	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for a while???
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78280	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78281	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78282	From: Ben Perry	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78283	From: william lewis	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78284	From: Carey Probst	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78285	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78286	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78288	From: Tom	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: For sale: Lionel TMCC Direct Lock-On - NIB
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78289	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Finding work today (no train content)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78290	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78291	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78292	From: Ted Walton	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78293	From: George Cohn	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78294	From: Scott Holm	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78295	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78296	From: Carey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78297	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78298	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78299	From: snstrains	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78300	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78301	From: Carey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78302	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78303	From: snstrains	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78304	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78305	From: George Cohn	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78306	From: ken	Date: 9/7/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78307	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/7/2016
Subject: Topics, topics.....
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78308	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/8/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries OT!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78309	From: racin510	Date: 9/9/2016
Subject: Re: Topics, topics.....
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78310	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78311	From: allscalerails	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #10 Sept / Oct 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78312	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: Re: Topics, topics...
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78313	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78314	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: Re: All Scale Rails Issue #10 Sept / Oct 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78315	From: Tom	Date: 9/13/2016
Subject: 588 block signal including modern Lionel version
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78316	From: George Guzewicz	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78317	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78318	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78319	From: poniaj	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78320	From: ken	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78321	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78322	From: William Lewis	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78323	From: Fred Alles	Date: 9/19/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78324	From: rm_hirailer	Date: 9/19/2016
Subject: Trains in the park
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78325	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 9/20/2016
Subject: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78326	From: snstrains	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78327	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78328	From: timstrains2000	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78329	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78330	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78331	From: John Schoonenberg	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78332	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: October/November 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78333	From: Ray Puls	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin deraiment
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78334	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Baldwin Derrailment
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78335	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: AF 715 915 Automatic Flatcar Load
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78336	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derrailment
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78337	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: AF 715 915 Automatic Flatcar Load
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78338	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78339	From: poniaj	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78340	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78341	From: snstrains	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78342	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78343	From: poniaj	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78344	From: rick gough	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78345	From: racin510	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78346	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78347	From: timstrains2000	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derrailment
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78348	From: George Guzewicz	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78349	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78350	From: UNLV666@...	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: S Helper Right Hand Turnouts
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78351	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Re: S trax system
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78352	From: Don Abrams	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78353	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 September 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78354	From: Richard Reichard	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: York Tables
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78355	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: O and S Scale News!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78356	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Derailment
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78357	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/26/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78358	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78359	From: William J. Gill	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78360	From: n6ojj	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78361	From: Eric	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: engines for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78362	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78363	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78364	From: Paul Krause	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78365	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/28/2016
Subject: American Flyer in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78366	From: Doug Peck	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: ODD SIT PART
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78367	From: racin510	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78368	From: Bill Lane	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: SHS hoppers wanted
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78369	From: walling_m_i	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78370	From: NEIL FERRIS	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78371	From: Dale Smith	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78372	From: daleminard	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: 3-D Printed Details
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78373	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/1/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 02 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78374	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 10/1/2016
Subject: Birkshires for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78375	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 02 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78376	From: alsflyer	Date: 10/3/2016
Subject: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78377	From: Alan Smith	Date: 10/3/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78378	From: rick flaherty	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78379	From: wyoaf	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78380	From: william lewis	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78381	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78382	From: snstrains	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78383	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78384	From: George Cohn	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78385	From: Eric	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} engines for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78386	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78387	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78388	From: snstrains	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78389	From: snstrains	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78390	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78391	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/8/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 09 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78392	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 09 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78393	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 10/10/2016
Subject: OPEN HOUSE @ TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED York Week
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78394	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: eBay Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78395	From: snstrains	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78396	From: William J. Gill	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78397	From: americanflyer	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78398	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 16 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78399	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: Re: eBay auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78400	From: zemouse2001	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: Re: eBay auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78401	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 16 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78402	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78403	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78404	From: snstrains	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78405	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78406	From: daleminard	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78407	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78408	From: Lee Brown	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78409	From: Tom	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Piggyback unloader
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78410	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78411	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78412	From: acgilbertguy	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: Piggyback unloader
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78413	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78414	From: Tom	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: Piggyback unloader
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78415	From: kerhart@frontier.com	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Tom's Turnouts
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78416	From: ee_train	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: 710 Steam Whistle Control
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78417	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78418	From: Bill Drake	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A new home?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78419	From: rick gough	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A newhome?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78420	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: 1/64 Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78421	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78422	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 23 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78423	From: Ingram-James-Yahoo-Grps	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: =VIDEO: NCE Mini-Panel Controls 2 Trains, Using just ONE Reed Switch
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78424	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 23 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78425	From: amflyral	Date: 10/23/2016
Subject: For sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78426	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 10/24/2016
Subject: Re: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78427	From: racin510	Date: 10/24/2016
Subject: Re: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78428	From: amflyer336	Date: 10/26/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78429	From: John Degnan	Date: 10/27/2016
Subject: Gondola Load Of S-Helper Service AF Wheels & Couplers For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78430	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Lionel TMCC "wallwart"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78431	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: the wallwart
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78432	From: snstrains	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78433	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78434	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78435	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/29/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 30 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78436	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 30 October 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78437	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Large AF layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78438	From: beebear	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Train show in Dayton this weekend
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78439	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78440	From: beebear	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78441	From: railandsail	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78442	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78443	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 11/3/2016
Subject: Train Show November 5th & 6th in Raleigh, NC
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78444	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/6/2016
Subject: SHS Conrail caboose wanted
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78445	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78446	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: Re: American Models B unit
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78447	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: Re: American Models B unit
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78448	From: allscalerails	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #11 Nov / Dec 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78449	From: alhbaker	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78450	From: hobbycj1	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78451	From: jaytewilli	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: NETTE Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78452	From: Doug Peck	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78453	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78454	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78455	From: Ron Petersen	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78456	From: tbennerohio	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78457	From: rudypenne	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78458	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ? & new I D
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78459	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: LBR
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78460	From: Carey	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78461	From: vu68	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78462	From: George Dines	Date: 11/12/2016
Subject: Michigan's Largest Train Show, Sunday 11/13
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78463	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/12/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78464	From: rick gough	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78465	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78466	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78467	From: Eric	Date: 11/18/2016
Subject: 2 more items for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78468	From: Eric	Date: 11/18/2016
Subject: Re: 2 more items for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78469	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78470	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: NYC SHS hoppers possibly for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78471	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78472	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: new Linel S AF track turn out question.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78473	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: cars
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78474	From: chuck_7612	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: Re: new Linel S AF track turn out question.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78475	From: alhbaker	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78476	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78477	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: just a great aritcal
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78478	From: attic02	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78479	From: attic02	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78480	From: poniaj	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78481	From: snstrains	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78482	From: Default	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78483	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78484	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78485	From: poniaj	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78486	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78487	From: William Gill	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78488	From: wyoaf	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78489	From: poniaj	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78490	From: William J. Gill	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78491	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78492	From: Default	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78493	From: claudino.john	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: TRAINS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78494	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: TRAINS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78495	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting to build my first Flyer layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78496	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78497	From: David Dewey	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78498	From: David Dewey	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78499	From: Default	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78500	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Bill's Black Friday trades
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78501	From: Dale Smith	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78502	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78503	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78504	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78505	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78506	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78507	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78508	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78509	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 November 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78510	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 11/27/2016
Subject: December/January 2017 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78511	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 11/30/2016
Subject: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78512	From: Doug Peck	Date: 11/30/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78513	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78514	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78515	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78516	From: Don Abrams	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78517	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Conrail Caboose
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78518	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: Conrail Caboose
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78519	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/2/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78520	From: ronaldd757	Date: 12/2/2016
Subject: Brooks Stover article in Jan 2017 Model Railroder
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78521	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/3/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78522	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78523	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78524	From: Nick Colleran	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78525	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78526	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: WTB
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78527	From: snstrains	Date: 12/5/2016
Subject: Re: WTB
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78528	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 12/5/2016
Subject: 629 stock car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78529	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: AF + Scale Items Mixture For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78530	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: FOR SALE : Three SHS PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers - UNLETTERED (GREY)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78531	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: Toller AC Poer Packs/Transformers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78532	From: hhisgauger	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: Matte Finish AF/Lio hoppers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78533	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: SOLD : Three SHS PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers - UNLETTERED (GREY)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78534	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/7/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Toystrainsandotheroldstuff -
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78535	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: "It Was So Wide..." "How Wide Was It?"
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78536	From: Jim V	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78537	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78538	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78539	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Travel Trailers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78540	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Re: Travel Trailers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78541	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78542	From: Jim V	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78543	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78544	From: Walter Jopke	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: Travel Trailers
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78545	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78546	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78547	From: Robert Graves	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Two Great Books For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78548	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78549	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Disposition Of THE SUPPLY CAR Goods?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78550	From: snstrains	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78551	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Hi rail wheels & couplers for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78552	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Hi rail wheels & couplers for sale - slight correction
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78553	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78554	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78555	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78556	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78557	From: lgv_57	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78558	From: attic02	Date: 12/14/2016
Subject: Thanks From Ron Petersen
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78559	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Thanks from Ron Peterson
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78560	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78561	From: Bob Groh	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78562	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78563	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78564	From: snstrains	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Heavyweights for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78565	From: beebear	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson [1 Attachment]
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78566	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78567	From: beebear	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78568	From: Donald Mengle	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Heavyweights for sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78569	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78570	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78571	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78572	From: racin510	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78573	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78574	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78575	From: jhwysopal	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Talking Union Station not playing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78576	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78577	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78578	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Talking Union Station not playing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78579	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Polar Express Hand Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78580	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78581	From: racin510	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Talking Union Station not playing
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78582	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78583	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Polar Express Hand Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78584	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78585	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78586	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78587	From: carl4flyer	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78588	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78589	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78590	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78591	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78592	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78593	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78594	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78595	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78596	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78597	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78598	From: rick flaherty	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78599	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78600	From: hspanier2000	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Gargraves Track Pins - Free
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78601	From: hhisgauger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78602	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78603	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78604	From: ecphora123	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: AF Banana Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78605	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78606	From: lenscap76@yahoo.com	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78607	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78608	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78609	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78610	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78611	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78612	From: ecphora123	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: AF Banana Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78613	From: lenscap76@yahoo.com	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: AF Banana Car
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78614	From: beebear	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78615	From: R G	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78616	From: John and Carol	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78617	From: Lamont Heppe	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78618	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78619	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78620	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78621	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Banana Car and other Frontiersman stuff and falling prices
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78622	From: rick gough	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78623	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Banana Car and other Frontiersman stuff and falling prices
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78624	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78625	From: calleytwo	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78626	From: ALAN	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78627	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78628	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78629	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Banana cars & railroad sonds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78630	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sonds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78631	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78632	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78633	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Old Versus New ?????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78634	From: racin510	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78635	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78636	From: racin510	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78637	From: snstrains	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78638	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78639	From: beebear	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78640	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Prices and Old vs. New
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78641	From: poniaj	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78642	From: ljcamp2	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78643	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78644	From: paul	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78645	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78646	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78647	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78648	From: dewoods1972	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78649	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78650	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78651	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78652	From: R G	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78653	From: racin510	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78654	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: 19B transformer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78655	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78656	From: paul	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78657	From: Dave	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78658	From: paul	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78659	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Merry Christmas
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78660	From: snstrains	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Christmas wishes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78661	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78662	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78663	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78664	From: richs009	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78665	From: racin510	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78666	From: racin510	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78667	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78668	From: JFrederick Roberts	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78669	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 December 2016
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78670	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/25/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78671	From: racin510	Date: 12/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78672	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78673	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: 19B transfomer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78674	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transfomer repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78675	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78676	From: Roger Haag	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78677	From: attic02	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78678	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78679	From: Ray Puls	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78680	From: Roger Haag	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78681	From: biannaco@bellsouth.net	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78682	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/29/2016
Subject: PRS Kit For Sale
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78683	From: dewoods1972	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78684	From: wjgill1	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78685	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: PRS Kit For Sale - SOLD
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78686	From: R G	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78687	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78688	From: racin510	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78689	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78690	From: paul	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78691	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78692	From: William Gill	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78693	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78694	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78695	From: Dave	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78696	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Track
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78697	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78698	From: jhannawald	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78699	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: S-helper track Was:What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify th
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78700	From: snstrains	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78701	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78702	From: poniaj	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78703	From: beebear	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: New Project for 2017
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78704	From: poniaj	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78705	From: wema103	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Turntables for S Scale?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78706	From: Tom	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78707	From: JOHN METZGER	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78708	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78709	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: 934 floodlight car repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78710	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 January 2017
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78711	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 934 floodlight car repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78712	From: Tom	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 934 floodlight car repair
Group: S-Trains	Message: 78713	From: rick gough	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?

---

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77164	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question

I have both the P.E. Berk and the NKP Berk. The power route for these is through the coupling assembly to the tender. looking into the coupling it contains only four connectors, thus giving only two routes to power options in the tender, my preference would have been for the coupler on the NKP. In my opinion Lionel did well to give us the coupler. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77165	From: poniaj	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Save your time.  I called them and they told me that they have no parts to repair them.  Lesson learned... J. Poniatowski Disgusted in Wayne, MIchigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77166	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: North Shore...Chicago

Happy New Year, best of all things to you..... some time ago there were parties interested in North Shore items.....ran into a listing in S column on eBay late last night, someone has a North shore car kit (brass etchings it appears to be, listed for bids, around $80 +).....so go for it! Peter Loeb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77167	From: rick flaherty	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: New Year

Attachments : image001.gif Bugs P-38[15].png Same to all of you. Rick "The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the level of thinking that created them." Albert Einstein all of you From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "'Bob Iannacone' biannaco@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Organization: home Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, December 31, 2015 at 9:45 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] New Year     From the Central Time zone in the great USA we wish everyone a healthy and prosperous 2016! This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77168	From: Bill Lane	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Southwind box wanted

Attachments : IMG_5488.JPG I know this is a long shot but…. At some point years ago I got a Southwind PRR flat car mistakenly in a Southwind bulkhead flat car box. Later I got a Southwind bulkhead flat car without a box.   Looking for a Southwind 50’ flatcar box, preferably for PRR. Anyone somehow have a spare box?   Please reply directly.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL  & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1988 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale! PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society http://www.prslhs.com

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77169	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance??? Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH. I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.??? Thanks Peter Loeb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77170	From: traindavid	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Berkshires & back up light

That IS an interesting observation--it is, I believe, a carry-over of "three-rail thinking" to S. What is the use of an electro-coupler on ONE piece of equipment, when both knuckles need to open, and the other one is a standard Flyer lift-the-weight coupler? They put an electro-coupler on the back of the leading A unit of the Texas Special, when it's the trailing A unit which needs (if they're needed at all!) one on the NOSE where the train cars couple on; why would you want to uncouple half your locomotive? I too, would have gone for the tender light! Perhaps one can eliminate the coupler and hook up a tender light?? After the warranty expires, of course! :) The standard AF couplers (not the many incarnations that Flyonel has tried) worked/work fine for me! How often do you want to uncouple a train, and wouldn't it usually be in the same place (siding or yard area); so the AF uncoupler will do the job! They get it soooo close to right, then. . . . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77171	From: Bill Clark	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Hi Peter, Clay Buckage (Dave's Twacks & Twains) has the parts. He recently moved across country to California for his job, and the parts are all in storage. He's hoping to be up and running again by next Fall. Until then, the parts are unavailable. I'll send you a pdf of the 2-8-0 manual directly to your email address. Bill On 1/1/2016 2:35 PM, Dr Trains dtrains@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance??? Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH. I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.??? Thanks Peter Loeb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77172	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Hi Peter.  The spare SHS parts operation is currently being moved to CA from NC.  I believe they ran an ad about the move in S Gaugian magazine last month.  They will announce an opening when the move is complete.   Happy New Year.   Bob       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 01, 2016 1:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0     Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance???   Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH.   I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.???   Thanks Peter Loeb   Posted by: Dr Trains <dtrains@...> Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (1) Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group ·         New Members 1 ·         New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use . __,_._,___ This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77173	From: racin510	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshires & back up light

I would think there be no need to eliminate the electro-coupler when figuring out powering an LED in the tender. I'll do it well before the warranty period expires! I'll wait to see if Carl does it first, though.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77174	From: snstrains	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Peter, Contact me. I have what you need.   Steve SnS Trains   In a message dated 1/1/2016 1:44:02 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hi Peter.  The spare SHS parts operation is currently being moved to CA from NC.  I believe they ran an ad about the move in S Gaugian magazine last month.  They will announce an opening when the move is complete. Happy New Year. Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 01, 2016 1:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0   Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance??? Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH. I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.??? Thanks Peter Loeb Posted by: Dr Trains <dtrains@...> Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (1) Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group ·         New Members 1 ·         New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use . __,_._,___ This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77175	From: beebear	Date: 1/1/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshires & back up light

How does the electro coupler work? One channel to open and one to close?? Can they be bought and installed on other engines with DCC?   John Frankforther     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 01, 2016 6:49 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshires & back up light     I would think there be no need to eliminate the electro-coupler when figuring out powering an LED in the tender. I'll do it well before the warranty period expires! I'll wait to see if Carl does it first, though. This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77176	From: Jim Schiele	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77177	From: racin510	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question

We need to open up the tender and see what power options are in there. It doesn't take much to run an led and I don't care if it is on full time. I too prefer the electro-coupler.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77178	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: General Product Question

None of the Berks have a working Backup Light The 4 wires in the tender drawbar are used for the speaker and coupler.   Here is a look inside the Polar Express berk http://www.tuveson.com/Polar-Burk/polar-burk.html   This is a page of pics of the conversion of the Berk to TMCC. A work in progress,this page will be udated as work progresses with details. http://tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  It will have the backup light and a better speaker and 4 chuffs.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2016 3:59 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: General Product Question   We need to open up the tender and see what power options are in there. It doesn't take much to run an led and I don't care if it is on full time. I too prefer the electro-coupler.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77179	From: poniaj	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele Jim, Yours isn't the only one.  But mine had all sounds and electrocoupler working, it just went about a foot and stopped.  It would not go any further until shut down, powered up and then it went another foot and stopped.  Didn't matter what power source or switch position.  There was still power to the track since any illuminated cars are still lit.  I called Lionel Service and was informed that there are no repair parts.  I sent it back to Charles Ro where I bought it, and am waiting to see the result.  I don't hold out much hope.  I'd rather have a tender light than the electrocoupler too.  For the price, it isn't a bad deal..... unless the thing doesn't run.  Then all you have is a $300 paper weight. Jerry Poniatowski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77180	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Thanks for quick response and info, mutch appreciated, Peter From: "Bill Clark billclark424@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 1, 2016 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0   Hi Peter, Clay Buckage (Dave's Twacks & Twains) has the parts. He recently moved across country to California for his job, and the parts are all in storage. He's hoping to be up and running again by next Fall. Until then, the parts are unavailable. I'll send you a pdf of the 2-8-0 manual directly to your email address. Bill On 1/1/2016 2:35 PM, Dr Trains dtrains@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance??? Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH. I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.??? Thanks Peter Loeb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77181	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: Re: complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0

Thanks so much, I will get in touch this comming week, Peter From: "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 1, 2016 7:57 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0   Peter, Contact me. I have what you need.   Steve SnS Trains   In a message dated 1/1/2016 1:44:02 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hi Peter.  The spare SHS parts operation is currently being moved to CA from NC.  I believe they ran an ad about the move in S Gaugian magazine last month.  They will announce an opening when the move is complete. Happy New Year. Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 01, 2016 1:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] complete instructions/operating manual for SHS 2-8-0   Wonder if any body has a spare (or where I can get) an SHS 2-8-0 manual and operating instructions...info on DCC, AC, DC, and gen maintenance??? Also while I am on subject of SHS, I remember someone was going to be handling SHS spare parts/repairs, etc.....other than MTH. I did try to contact whom ever was noted a year or so ago...but no response. Web site ??? What is the latest on source for SHS parts/repairs etc.??? Thanks Peter Loeb Posted by: Dr Trains <dtrains@...> Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (1) Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group ·         New Members 1 ·         New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use . __,_._,___ This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77182	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: SHS 2-8-0

WOW ....thanks everyone for the fast and quite helpful responses from all ...I am once again reminded of what a great group of people S-gaugers (S-scalers too) are. I also enjoyed how this request for SHS 2-8-0 info, has stimulated further thinking and idea promulgation of more historical and current documentation of our S heritage, such as of Rex, Nimco, Nixon, Kinsman, Main line, Loeb Investments??/, and many whom I just can not recall at moment, BUT WHO CREATED AND PRODUCED GREAT PRODUCTS, KITS, AND ITEMS that kept S alive since Clevland Models in the 1930's. I have a number of "historical" items that will disapear with me...if they do not get "saved" by the NASG. Some examples might be: Kemtron S and Sn3, Hansel Main Kits, catalog of 50's hobby suppliers, Ace items, etc..... I am reminded that when some of us old farts move to the great RR in the sky, that what we know and have, often just seems to fade away and is lost. So wonder what will come? and what we may be able to dust off and share??? Best of a New Year to all, Peter Loeb,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77183	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77184	From: alevans51	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: BERKSHIRE ASSESSMENT

Received my NKP Berk today from Jay Budzon of New York Central Toys & Trains today.  He is a super guy I have known for some years now.  I paid around $320 or so for the loco.  This was the pre-order/reservation/privilege price. Scale & Fidelity: I am very impressed with the locomotive.  I placed it nose to nose with my scale River Raisin brass Berkshire, and I feel there is  enough styling in the Lionel AF unit to make it most roadworthy on anyone's "I love S" layout.  The wheels are modern hi-rail - not the old deep flange AF.  Plans:  Convert the loco to DCC, add Kadees and detail the rest of it for my own leisure.  Really, it will not take much -  maybe a cab light and tender light and some figures in the cab.  Perhaps move the tender closer to the engine.  A great loco.  Well played, Lionel!!  Hurraah !!  Allen Evans New Orleans Public Belt MRR Covington, LA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77185	From: rxman46321	Date: 1/2/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail

Troops, I am looking for at least 3 American Hi-rail DL109 shells, painted or unpainted, for a project. Contact me off line at rxman46321 @ aol dot com. Thanks, John Griffin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77186	From: rick gough	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

The PE has both electro-coupler and tender light?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Saturday, January 2, 2016 5:49 AM, "'Jim Schiele' jschiele1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77187	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

No.   Coupler only. There is a lens for the backup light but no electronics for it. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2016 1:34 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   The PE has both electro-coupler and tender light?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Saturday, January 2, 2016 5:49 AM, "'Jim Schiele' jschiele1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77188	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: New Year

Attachments : A Little late, but Happy New Year from Mason Ohio. Chris Burger From: "'Bob Iannacone' biannaco@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 1, 2016 12:45 AM Subject: [S-Trains] New Year     From the Central Time zone in the great USA we wish everyone a healthy and prosperous 2016! This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77189	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77190	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Sound low on Polar Express

I have done some work on the P.E. and my other Berk. My suspicions ere confirmed, the speaker that came in these engines was the reason for the low sound volume. I took out the speaker supplied with the units and replaced them with the standard "Fatboy" speaker from Electric Railroad and the volume was noticeably increased. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77191	From: henry_betz	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

Wish to get American Flyer S advice. I have purchased the aluminum passenger cars 660, 662, and 663. These were sold in sets in 1950 and in 1951.along with 661 in other sets.  In 1950 the folowing sets were sold:  #5011 with:  334DC Union Pacific Loco and Tender with smoke, Choo-Choo, ELECTRONIC Whistle, & Electronic Control. Included Passenger cars 660, 661, & 663.  #5008 with:  360 Santa Fe "A" Unit with twin motor, 361 Santa Fe "B" Unit No motor, A&B together are described as having Built-In ELECTRONIC Horn without clarifying if in A or B. In addition passenger cars 660, 662, & 663.  #362 Santa Fe "A" with twin motors and "B" Locomotive combination, seperate sale, no cars. With built=in ELECTRONIC horn, no clarification as to it being in "A" or "B"  In 1951 the following ad on page 14 & 15 states twin motor and Built-In AIR CHIME WHISTLE. The add illustrates as in 1950 the numbers 360 and 361 on the Locomotives.  5108W with:  365 Sante Fe Locomotive combined length 23 7/8" with 660, 662, & 663 passenger cars. Also Automatic Uncoupler-Air Chime Whistle Control.  #365 Sante Fe Locomotive "A" and "B" does not give individual numbers in illustration, gives NOW with AIR CHIME whistle  SO - - What's the problem.  1. In 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC WHISTLE with the UP.  2. In 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC Horn with the Sante Fe.  3. In 1951 it;s an AIR CHIME WHISTLE with the Sante Fe.  4. In 1951 no uncoupler track is provided, however, an AUTOMATIC UNCOUPLER-AIR CHIME WHISTLE CONTROLLER is provided with the passenger set.  What I wish is a correct Air Chime engine with the correct controller. I didn't find a number for the controller. It seems feasable that Air Chime is a marketing ploy to rebrand the ELECTRONIC Horn. Are they really different? Could they if different use the same controller. Are there controllers available on the market? Should I believe that Air Chime Whistles are reliable? Are they able to be fixed if they fail?  Hank Betz  P.S. I found a beautiful condition Silver Streak that was so bright it clashed with my recently buffed aluminum cars. Could there be more than one finish on the Santa Fe engines?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77192	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

There was also an uncataloged set with the 963 Pacific.  Sold at FA Schwartz, I believe.  The pacific had traction tires on the rear drivers. Ted Weiler Lone Star Flier member On Sunday, January 3, 2016 4:48 PM, "henry_betz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Wish to get American Flyer S advice. I have purchased the aluminum passenger cars 660, 662, and 663. These were sold in sets in 1950 and in 1951.along with 661 in other sets.  In 1950 the folowing sets were sold:  #5011 with:  334DC Union Pacific Loco and Tender with smoke, Choo-Choo, ELECTRONIC Whistle, & Electronic Control. Included Passenger cars 660, 661, & 663.  #5008 with:  360 Santa Fe "A" Unit with twin motor, 361 Santa Fe "B" Unit No motor, A&B together are described as having Built-In ELECTRONIC Horn without clarifying if in A or B. In addition passenger cars 660, 662, & 663.  #362 Santa Fe "A" with twin motors and "B" Locomotive combination, seperate sale, no cars. With built=in ELECTRONIC horn, no clarification as to it being in "A" or "B"  In 1951 the following ad on page 14 & 15 states twin motor and Built-In AIR CHIME WHISTLE. The add illustrates as in 1950 the numbers 360 and 361 on the Locomotives.  5108W with:  365 Sante Fe Locomotive combined length 23 7/8" with 660, 662, & 663 passenger cars. Also Automatic Uncoupler-Air Chime Whistle Control.  #365 Sante Fe Locomotive "A" and "B" does not give individual numbers in illustration, gives NOW with AIR CHIME whistle  SO - - What's the problem.  1. In 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC WHISTLE with the UP.  2. In 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC Horn with the Sante Fe. 3. In 1951 it;s an AIR CHIME WHISTLE with the Sante Fe.  4. In 1951 no uncoupler track is provided, however, an AUTOMATIC UNCOUPLER-AIR CHIME WHISTLE CONTROLLER is provided with the passenger set.  What I wish is a correct Air Chime engine with the correct controller. I didn't find a number for the controller. It seems feasable that Air Chime is a marketing ploy to rebrand the ELECTRONIC Horn. Are they really different? Could they if different use the same controller. Are there controllers available on the market? Should I believe that Air Chime Whistles are reliable? Are they able to be fixed if they fail?  Hank Betz  P.S. I found a beautiful condition Silver Streak that was so bright it clashed with my recently buffed aluminum cars. Could there be more than one finish on the Santa Fe engines?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77193	From: beebear	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: : New S gaugre berks observation and fix

Attachments : Untitled attachment 00013.txt Slide4.jpg Slide3.jpg Slide2.jpg Slide1.jpg Hi everyone: A Friend of mine is a proud owner of both a Polar express 1225 and nickle plate 765. They have had a lot of fun running them and excited that LTI has made these for us S gaugers. Although one should expect it to be assembled correctly out of the box, it appears that the factory missassembled the trailing truck of the engine. Via this email, I am showing you what I found, in the spirit of making sure all have smooth running and minimize operational problems. Share this with anyone you know of anyone that is getting a Berk to check the rear truck spring location. I will also send this to the LTI factory so they can be aware of the problem and deal with it as they see fit. -- While running we noticed that the 1225 Polar express would occasionally derail over flyer switches and also loose contact and periodically stop especially when run in transformer mode. The newer 765 has run flawlessly with no problem. Since the mechanisms are similar there should be no reason that one to work better than the other? After cleaning track over and over and fiddling with switches on the layout, we observed that when the 1225 tender is connected only the front axle of the rear truck of the 1225 is touching the rail. This is not the case with the 765!!?? Careful observation showed that that the the spring is over the drawbar on the 1225 which allows the truck to rise. The 765 has the spring below, which holds it down. See pictures. The problem on the 1225 is easily overcome by carefully removing the clip and screw and moving the spring and spacers from top of drawbar to below. After making the change, the Polar express 1225 is running continuously and runs smoothly through the switches. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77194	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

You are talking about the Berkshire, right.   The PE has light, but no electro coupler. Dale Smith On 1/3/2016 5:01 AM, carl@... [S-Trains] wrote:   No.   Coupler only. There is a lens for the backup light but no electronics for it. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2016 1:34 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   The PE has both electro-coupler and tender light?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Saturday, January 2, 2016 5:49 AM, "'Jim Schiele' jschiele1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77195	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Yes the PE does have the backup light but no Electrocoupler. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2016 6:27 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   You are talking about the Berkshire, right.   The PE has light, but no electro coupler. Dale Smith On 1/3/2016 5:01 AM, carl@... [S-Trains] wrote:   No.   Coupler only. There is a lens for the backup light but no electronics for it. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2016 1:34 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   The PE has both electro-coupler and tender light?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Saturday, January 2, 2016 5:49 AM, "'Jim Schiele' jschiele1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   I was not referring to the backup light. My Berkshire does nothing. Appears to not be receiving any power. It is interesting that the Polar Express has a rear tender light.   Jim Schiele

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77196	From: snstrains	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

The 963 is not a Pacific. It is an observation passenger car and came in many colors and road names.   Steve Blackburn Boise   In a message dated 1/3/2016 4:15:46 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   There was also an uncataloged set with the 963 Pacific.  Sold at FA Schwartz, I believe.  The pacific had traction tires on the rear drivers. Ted Weiler Lone Star Flier member

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77197	From: racin510	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: : New S gaugre berks observation and fix

Hmmm .... spring above the draw bar works fine on my Southern 2716; it seems to hold pressure down on both the draw bar and the entire trailing truck. I have to lift up on the back of the truck to raise the rear wheels off the  rails.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77198	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

OOps, it is a 263 Pacific.  CNW . On Sunday, January 3, 2016 7:30 PM, "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: The 963 is not a Pacific. It is an observation passenger car and came in many colors and road names.   Steve Blackburn Boise   In a message dated 1/3/2016 4:15:46 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   There was also an uncataloged set with the 963 Pacific.  Sold at FA Schwartz, I believe.  The pacific had traction tires on the rear drivers. Ted Weiler Lone Star Flier member

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77199	From: snstrains	Date: 1/3/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

I'm betting it's a 283   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/3/2016 10:54:47 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   OOps, it is a 263 Pacific.  CNW . On Sunday, January 3, 2016 7:30 PM, "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: The 963 is not a Pacific. It is an observation passenger car and came in many colors and road names.   Steve Blackburn Boise   In a message dated 1/3/2016 4:15:46 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   There was also an uncataloged set with the 963 Pacific.  Sold at FA Schwartz, I believe.  The pacific had traction tires on the rear drivers. Ted Weiler Lone Star Flier member

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77200	From: traindavid	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

Henry, OK, lots of variables here, as ACG worked out production problems & updates. First, the horn is in the B unit, all varieties. You didn't mention it, but one must be a bit careful when selecting the early link coupler Alcos as the first runs had a scale wheel, with very little flange. These wheels require good trackwork to not derail. They were early on changed to wheels with a deeper flange. Horns; the first ELECTRONIC horns used a large controller with a vacuum tube on it; the controller plugs into the wall. the air-chime horn used the more familiar vibrator tube controller powered by the transformer. I believe either controller can make the horn buzz, no matter which version of locomotive you have. the sound does vary depending on controller, but they all take a little imagination to "hear" a diesel horn! (This was one of my big childhood disappointments when I finally got an engine with a horn--I thought mine was broken!) The aluminum cars are heavy, and the non-pullmore powered locomotives will struggle with more than 3 cars. Silver engines came in chrome plate and silver paint. The Chrome varies a bit, as the clear coat put on to protect the chrome often yellows, changing the color of the chrome. The first 660 to 663 plastic bodied passenger cars came in Chrome, but were soon changed to silver paint. Locomotive USUALLY were finished to match the cars they came with--but these were toys and variations did happen to get product out. So, there's a brief primer in ACG early Alco PAs. This was all written from memory, so I may have forgotten something, or the books may have better information. S' David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77201	From: srjaynes	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Seeking Catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car

As the title suggest, I need a catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car.  Any spares out there at a reasonable price? Thanks, Steve Jaynes Portland, OR

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77202	From: James Lyle	Date: 1/4/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

Hank Go straight to DALLEE.com, Check out the new Diesel Sound board.   Far surpasses the original Jim Lyle Wardie Jay TinPlate Ties On Jan 3, 2016, at 5:37 PM, henry_betz@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Wish to get American Flyer S advice. I have purchased the aluminum passenger cars 660, 662, and 663. These were sold in sets in 1950 and in 1951.along with 661 in other sets.  In 1950 the folowing sets were sold:  #5011 with:  334DC Union Pacific Loco and Tender with smoke, Choo-Choo, ELECTRONIC Whistle, & Electronic Control. Included Passenger cars 660, 661, & 663.  #5008 with:  360 Santa Fe "A" Unit with twin motor, 361 Santa Fe "B" Unit No motor, A&B together are described as having Built-In ELECTRONIC Horn without clarifying if in A or B. In addition passenger cars 660, 662, & 663.  #362 Santa Fe "A" with twin motors and "B" Locomotive combination, seperate sale, no cars . With built=in ELECTRONIC horn, no clarification as to it being in "A" or "B"  In 1951 the following ad on page 14 & 15 states twin motor and Built-In AIR CHIME WHISTLE. The add illustrates as in 1950 the numbers 360 and 361 on the Locomotives.  5108W with:  365 Sante Fe Locomotive combined length 23 7/8" with 660, 662, & 663 passenger cars. Also Automatic Uncoupler-Air Chime Whistle Control.  #365 Sante Fe Locomotive "A" and "B" does not give individual numbers in illustration, gives NOW with AIR CHIME whistle  SO - - What's the problem.  1. In 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC WHISTLE with the UP.  2. I n 1950 it's an ELECTRONIC Horn with the Sante Fe.  3. In 1951 it;s an AIR CHIME WHISTLE with the Sante Fe.  4. In 1951 no uncoupler track is provided, however, an AUTOMATIC UNCOUPLER-AIR CHIME WHISTLE CONTROLLER is provided with the passenger set.  What I wish is a correct Air Chime engine with the correct controller. I didn't find a number for the controller. It seems feasable that Air Chime is a marketing ploy to rebrand the ELECTRONIC Horn. Are they really different? Could they if different use the same controller. Are there controllers available on the market? Should I believe that Air Chime Whistles are reliable? Are they able to be fixed if they fail?  Hank Betz  P.S. I found a beautiful condition Silver Streak that was so bright it clashed with my recently buffed aluminum cars. Could there be more than one finish on the Santa Fe engines?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77203	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

My website, TheGilbertGallery.org, shows pictures of these items. The early Santa Fe diesels: <thegilbertgallery.org/Engine%20Gallery/engines-Alcos.html> In addition to the variety of finishes, and the natural result of aging differently over 60 years, Gilbert originally made several different varieties of these engines as shown on that webpage. The Electronic Whistle Control and #708 Air Chime Whistle Control are shown on this page: <thegilbertgallery.org/Infrastructure%20Gallery/infrastructure_Electrical_Accessories.html> As for the realism of the sound, A. C. Gilbert mistakenly thought he was making toys, not model railroads! Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org On Jan 4, 2016, at 9:19 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Henry, OK, lots of variables here, as ACG worked out production problems & updates. First, the horn is in the B unit, all varieties. You didn't mention it, but one must be a bit careful when selecting the early link coupler Alcos as the first runs had a scale wheel, with very little flange. These wheels require good trackwork to not derail. They were early on changed to wheels with a deeper flange. Horns; the first ELECTRONIC horns used a large controller with a vacuum tube on it; the controller plugs into the wall. the air-chime horn used the more familiar vibrator tube controller powered by the transformer. I believe either controller can make the horn buzz, no matter which version of locomotive you have. the sound does vary depending on controller, but they all take a little imagination to "hear" a diesel horn! (This was one of my big childhood disappointments when I finally got an engine with a horn--I thought mine was broken!) The aluminum cars are heavy, and the non-pullmore powered locomotives will struggle with more than 3 cars. Silver engines came in chrome plate and silver paint. The Chrome varies a bit, as the clear coat put on to protect the chrome often yellows, changing the color of the chrome. The first 660 to 663 plastic bodied passenger cars came in Chrome, but were soon changed to silver paint. Locomotive USUALLY were finished to match the cars they came with--but these were toys and variations did happen to get product out. So, there's a brief primer in ACG early Alco PAs. This was all written from memory, so I may have forgotten something, or the books may have better information. S' David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77204	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

I had a A/B set of the first PAs and from what I remember they had a Gold cast to them from the get go.   The Electronic Horn never did work.   I had two dome cars and an observation in the original aluminum cars; never had a combine or flat top coach.   Don’t recall that the A/B set had any problems pulling the three cars so it is probably good that I never got more of them. Charlie Vlk     In addition to the variety of finishes, and the natural result of aging differently over 60 years, Gilbert originally made several different varieties of these engines as shown on that webpage. The Electronic Whistle Control and #708 Air Chime Whistle Control are shown on this page:   <thegilbertgallery.org/Infrastructure%20Gallery/infrastructure_Electrical_Accessories.html> __

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77205	From: wd511@att.net	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Fastrack

I wanted to replace more of my original AF track so bought some of Lionel's new track. 1) Their 90 deg crossover uses short non-standard track! Obviously, I can't drop it in place to replace the old AF crossover as there will be a gap of over an inch in all directions. Is there a better solution than cutting off a chunk of an insertion track piece to fit the gap on all four sides? (what a waste) 2)what is a good way of attaching FastTrack to S-Helper's track? thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77206	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/5/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack

To attach S-Helper to American Flyer Fastrack you cut the nub off of the S-Helper piece of track and they mate right up. Use track connecter to join them. Easy to do. The 90Dergree problem I am not sure of as I have not seen that up close and personal. Chris Burger From: "wd511@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2016 8:25 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Fastrack   I wanted to replace more of my original AF track so bought some of Lionel's new track. 1) Their 90 deg crossover uses short non-standard track! Obviously, I can't drop it in place to replace the old AF crossover as there will be a gap of over an inch in all directions. Is there a better solution than cutting off a chunk of an insertion track piece to fit the gap on all four sides? (what a waste) 2)what is a good way of attaching FastTrack to S-Helper's track? thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77207	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack

The Lionel Fastrack crossover needs four 5" sections to mate up to a complete Fastrack  figure-eight layout. Since you are using both standard AF and  Fastrack there may be cutting involved. Just so you know, if you were able to get a 90 degree crossover, (very common and cheap), you need four 5" sections to mate them to fit in a standard AF layoout.  Tom Kaufman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77208	From: traindavid	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

I thought I might add, that my description was for the early PA diesels only; later on the 405 Silver Streak PA was a one motor unit with horn, I believe the only PA with both motor and horn. Much later production had some A-A locomotives with the horn in the non-powered trailing A Unit, and some PAs had only one motor, like the 466 Comet. If you have an early PA with red-painted wheels, that is very early production, with scale flanges. I didn't get into the early wire handrails etc. variations--there's a book about them! S' David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77209	From: snstrains	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

David, You forgot the 481 Silver Flash with single motor and horn in it.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/6/2016 11:22:24 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I thought I might add, that my description was for the early PA diesels only; later on the 405 Silver Streak PA was a one motor unit with horn, I believe the only PA with both motor and horn. Much later production had some A-A locomotives with the horn in the non-powered trailing A Unit, and some PAs had only one motor, like the 466 Comet. If you have an early PA with red-painted wheels, that is very early production, with scale flanges. I didn't get into the early wire handrails etc. variations--there's a book about them! S' David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77210	From: mike rosz	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951

where is the book?  Author et all. From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 12:12 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Santa Fe Diesels with aluminum passenger cars 1950 1951   I thought I might add, that my description was for the early PA diesels only; later on the 405 Silver Streak PA was a one motor unit with horn, I believe the only PA with both motor and horn. Much later production had some A-A locomotives with the horn in the non-powered trailing A Unit, and some PAs had only one motor, like the 466 Comet. If you have an early PA with red-painted wheels, that is very early production, with scale flanges. I didn't get into the early wire handrails etc. variations--there's a book about them! S' David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77211	From: altoonamark	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

Let me begin by saying that I am a beginner and have very little knowledge beyond the basics. I decided to try to to set up my childhood Flyer for my grandkids. The trains have been in storage in various basements and attics for 50 years.  Amazingly, with a little bit of oil, most of the operating accessories still function very well. The problem that I am having with the milk car, is that when unloading the cans, the operator gets stuck in the door every time.  There appears to be a bar spring type mechanism that opens the door and he gets held by the end of this.  Any ideas on how to correct this problem? Thanks for any and all suggestions. Mark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77212	From: racin510	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

What I do: Take it apart and learn how it works and try and figure out how to get the man to return a little quicker or the door to close a little slower. I have several of these operating cars [milk is same as box car] and I do have one that malfunctions just like yours. Mine I've had apart numerous times, tried numerous tweeks, and have never been able to correct it. Others work perfectly and I can visually see no differences. So good luck, and get lucky, and welcome back to our world of little train travel. A great book for you to try and find on EBAY is: Greenberg's American Flyer S Gauge Operating & Repair Manual by Tom Barker.  It is an excellent resource especially for a beginner mechanic. Take your locomotives apart, clean up every moving part, resurface the commutator, replace brushes in steamers, use modern automotive grease and they will run much better than they do now. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77213	From: wd511@att.net	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Fastrack

thank you for the suggestions.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77214	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Factory lettering removal

Does anyone have any experience in removing the factory lettering and logos from Flyonel cylindrical hoppers without damaging the paint or the dimensional data? I have 4 that I want to redo by removing the BN  logo and reporting marks but I want to keep the dimensional data and original paint  intact. Someone suggested fingernail polish remover but i am afraid that may damage the plaxstic and the paint. Years ago i would use isopropyl alcohol but eventually that would remove the paint also. Anybody have an idea that will work?                                                                                                                          Bob Lampe                                                                                                                         Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77215	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

Hi.  It sounds like the spring inside the shell is worn and loose.  As the door opens a normal spring should snap the man back into the shell pretty quick as the door closes.  I’ve found this to be my problem in the past.  Also, while the shell is off I use electric cleaner to get rid of any corrosion on the working parts.  Great to see you back in Flyer trains.   Bob       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2016 1:48 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019     Let me begin by saying that I am a beginner and have very little knowledge beyond the basics. I decided to try to to set up my childhood Flyer for my grandkids. The trains have been in storage in various basements and attics for 50 years.  Amazingly, with a little bit of oil, most of the operating accessories still function very well. The problem that I am having with the milk car, is that when unloading the cans, the operator gets stuck in the door every time.  There appears to be a bar spring type mechanism that opens the door and he gets held by the end of this.  Any ideas on how to correct this problem? Thanks for any and all suggestions. Mark   This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77216	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: 1/64 slot cars.

Auto World seems to have 1/64 size cars. Has any one opened the slot in the tracks and added a flat head nail and made it possible to keep the cars from jumbling the track. I see there is a piece of track that has 1 lane merge so that a police car could pursue a car. If a police car was isolated and the section of the track was powered where it can be turned on it would be interesting. Some of you have seen my Back to the Future building. I am working on the Court House and would line to make the track turn red like the fire from the wheels of the Delorian. May be put red Led's under clear plastic installed into slot car track. Auto World has a BTTF race set coming out. I may attach a wire with a figure on a hover board if I get the set. I was looking for slot car people to ask some questions. Would scale speeds be possible to keep the cars on the roadway? Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77217	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Seeking Catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car

Hi   Are you talking about tank car platform if so several people have  them Doug Peck  doug@... Tom seccia seccia@... Todd Metcalf trainsandmore@... Bill parr bparrtrains@... They also have the ladders along with the hand rails thanks stan   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, January 04, 2016 2:43 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Seeking Catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car     As the title suggest, I need a catwalk for AF Kopper's Chemical Car.  Any spares out there at a reasonable price?   Thanks,   Steve Jaynes Portland, OR

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77218	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.

Jim,    I see no reason why that couldn't be possible. it would take some ingenuity and someone more knowledgeable in electronics than myself. I dabble in electronics but I am not talented enough to design the circuit needed for such an endeavor, Now that I have baffled everyone with all those 64 dollar words the bottom line is I don't have a clue how to design it. Once there is a design and a wiring diagram and parts list. I could build it.                                                                                                                                                    Bob Lampe                                                                                                                                                    Kalispell,MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 01:30:26 +0000 Subject: [S-Trains] 1/64 slot cars.   Auto World seems to have 1/64 size cars. Has any one opened the slot in the tracks and added a flat head nail and made it possible to keep the cars from jumbling the track. I see there is a piece of track that has 1 lane merge so that a police car could pursue a car. If a police car was isolated and the section of the track was powered where it can be turned on it would be interesting. Some of you have seen my Back to the Future building. I am working on the Court House and would line to make the track turn red like the fire from the wheels of the Delorian. May be put red Led's under clear plastic installed into slot car track. Auto World has a BTTF race set coming out. I may attach a wire with a figure on a hover board if I get the set. I was looking for slot car people to ask some questions. Would scale speeds be possible to keep the cars on the roadway? Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77219	From: racin510	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

I did stretch the spring in my box car, but he still couldn't escape the slamming door. Maybe our friend Mark will have better luck! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77220	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: 1/64 slot cars

My "second" hobby is slot cars and slotless cars.  But I am unclear about what you are wanting to do. Auto World makes two different types of slot cars: "Thunder-jets," which are about 1/76 scale, and based on the old Aurora Model Motoring cars, and "X-Traction," which are close to 1/64 scale, and based on the Aurora AFX cars.  They also have a "four gear" X-Traction type that is similar, just different chassis. I'm not sure what you're trying to do, but opening up the slot and putting a nail in it makes me shudder.  If you're looking for a way to fasten it down, use the counter sunk screw holes or silicone sealer under the track. Scale speed is problematic as these are race cars. They are supposed to go fast, and the X-Traction cars are capable of a few hundred scale miles per hour. The slower they run, the rougher and more likely to stall. I'm happy to help if I can. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77221	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

Rick,   I used a bit of graphite (dry lube) in the mail car to reduce friction.  Dry Molybdenum Sulfide should also work.  Don’t use oil as it will attract dust.    Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2016 6:49 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019     I did stretch the spring in my box car, but he still couldn't escape the slamming door. Maybe our friend Mark will have better luck! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77222	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 1/6/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.

I still have a Lionel slot car set from the 60's. Very much like the Aurora sets from that time period. You can run the cars slower than going all out, but they were not designed for slow speed running. You can run them slow enough to not even need guard rails on curves however they are still going pretty fast scale wise. The so called HO cars were and still are very close to S Scale. I plan to use the slot car track that I have on the layout that I am building.  I could do a S-Scale Le Mans  race.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77223	From: Rick Evans	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars

I still have MY Aurora Model Motoring cars! On Jan 6, 2016, at 6:16 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   My "second" hobby is slot cars and slotless cars.  But I am unclear about what you are wanting to do. Auto World makes two different types of slot cars: "Thunder-jets," which are about 1/76 scale, and based on the old Aurora Model Motoring cars, and "X-Traction," which are close to 1/64 scale, and based on the Aurora AFX cars.  They also have a "four gear" X-Traction type that is similar, just different chassis. I'm not sure what you're trying to do, but opening up the slot and putting a nail in it makes me shudder.  If you're looking for a way to fasten it down, use the counter sunk screw holes or silicone sealer under the track. Scale speed is problematic as these are race cars. They are supposed to go fast, and the X-Traction cars are capable of a few hundred scale miles per hour. The slower they run, the rougher and more likely to stall. I'm happy to help if I can. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77224	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77225	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77226	From: Carey Probst	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars.

From what I remember about my slot car days, scale speeds would be pretty slow.  It seems mine did a scale 300mph or better.  The problem was keeping them running slow. Can't help with the other things. Carey Probst Pennsyltucky RR Chief Microferroequineologist On 1/6/2016 8:30 PM, JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Auto World seems to have 1/64 size cars. Has any one opened the slot in the tracks and added a flat head nail and made it possible to keep the cars from jumbling the track. I see there is a piece of track that has 1 lane merge so that a police car could pursue a car. If a police car was isolated and the section of the track was powered where it can be turned on it would be interesting. Some of you have seen my Back to the Future building. I am working on the Court House and would line to make the track turn red like the fire from the wheels of the Delorian. May be put red Led's under clear plastic installed into slot car track. Auto World has a BTTF race set coming out. I may attach a wire with a figure on a hover board if I get the set. I was looking for slot car people to ask some questions. Would scale speeds be possible to keep the cars on the roadway? Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77227	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars

I'm not saying this will be an impossible task, but trying to use slot cars may not be the right solution. To get slot cars to run reliably at slow speeds is possible if you could regear them.  But unlike the bigger scales (1/32 or 1/24) the only gear sets I know of in "HO" slot cars are lighter alloy or gear sets to make the cars faster!  There ARE "magnet cars" the right size (Tomy, Life-Like) that will hold to the track at blender speeds due to added magnets, but will not run slow at all.  I use them as refrigerator magnets because they're too fast and unrealistic to drive.  I find 2,500 scale miles per hour and not "de-slotting" ridiculous. Another problem using slot cars is that you can't just rewire the track like you do model train track.  If you try to run two cars under separate control on the same track it will short and fry the power pack.  The old slotless cars could operate under separate control, change lanes, and worked fairly well if you kept speeds up, otherwise they could stall between lanes during the change.  But they were made to be driven and not left to run on their own because there was no guide slot to steer them. Gilbert (1/32 scale) and Tyco (HO) made track with "turnouts" so that vehicles could move to different roads. Some of the Tyco vehicles were modified with guide pins in front AND back of the car and a switch on the controllers allowed them to back up like any DC train. It's hard to find today, and it was not designed to run two vehicles on the same lane independently controlled. You could build a complete DCC system and maybe use N gauge decoders which only MIGHT fit in the car.  But that could get expensive.  You might also try a form of radio control, but again size and cost of the equipment are problems.  And correct scale speed would remain a problem. Again, not knowing specifically what is needed, I can't suggest alternatives.  I have seen vehicles animated at low speeds by scratch built cable systems, conveyor belt set ups, under road moving magnets, and motor driven screw mechanisms.  All have advantages and problems. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77228	From: Herb and Bev Lanier	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Just read these two posts after returning from delivering my 3 day old Berkshire to the local Lionel service station. I tried all of that time to get it to smoke correctly, but no luck. Will be interesting to see how long this takes. If they sold 999 good ones out of a 1000, I’d get the bad one. Story of my life.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 8:16 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire     Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire.   1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it.   2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!"   There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed.   Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77229	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars

Good Morning All and a belated Happy New Year. The slot car maker Scalextric makes a Micro Scalextric line that is 1/64. They may work with an AF layout.  I have some Scalextric 1/32 slot cars and sets. Mostly I collect the James Bond themed sets. The latest movie themed Bond  set has got the Aston Martin DB10 versus the new Jaguar roadster. Its a beautiful set. Regards Bob Moyer  On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 9:07 AM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I'm not saying this will be an impossible task, but trying to use slot cars may not be the right solution. To get slot cars to run reliably at slow speeds is possible if you could regear them.  But unlike the bigger scales (1/32 or 1/24) the only gear sets I know of in "HO" slot cars are lighter alloy or gear sets to make the cars faster!  There ARE "magnet cars" the right size (Tomy, Life-Like) that will hold to the track at blender speeds due to added magnets, but will not run slow at all.  I use them as refrigerator magnets because they're too fast and unrealistic to drive.  I find 2,500 scale miles per hour and not "de-slotting" ridiculous. Another problem using slot cars is that you can't just rewire the track like you do model train track.  If you try to run two cars under separate control on the same track it will short and fry the power pack.  The old slotless cars could operate under separate control, change lanes, and worked fairly well if you kept speeds up, otherwise they could stall between lanes during the change.  But they were made to be driven and not left to run on their own because there was no guide slot to steer them. Gilbert (1/32 scale) and Tyco (HO) made track with "turnouts" so that vehicles could move to different roads. Some of the Tyco vehicles were modified with guide pins in front AND back of the car and a switch on the controllers allowed them to back up like any DC train. It's hard to find today, and it was not designed to run two vehicles on the same lane independently controlled. You could build a complete DCC system and maybe use N gauge decoders which only MIGHT fit in the car.  But that could get expensive.  You might also try a form of radio control, but again size and cost of the equipment are problems.  And correct scale speed would remain a problem. Again, not knowing specifically what is needed, I can't suggest alternatives.  I have seen vehicles animated at low speeds by scratch built cable systems, conveyor belt set ups, under road moving magnets, and motor driven screw mechanisms.  All have advantages and problems. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77230	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Carl, Thanks for the answers.  I have a lifetime supply of Anormal1 fluid.  That's good news.  Not so good on the rock on the Berk.  I'll be dismantling my tinplate layout in a few weeks so I may just run it with the rock until then.  Maybe that will give Lionel time enough to get parts that may be needed. I saw your Berk TMCC conversion page last night.  That is some incredible work!  The video is great!  Highly recommended. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77231	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Am. Flyer Operating Milk Car #25019

Rick, Thanks for the mention of my AF Repair Guide. I revised it 2 years ago and it is now in its 3rd Edition available from Amazon directly for a lot less than the e-bay prices. http://www.amazon.com/Gilbert-American-Operating-Repair-Volume/dp/1466420715/ref=pd_rhf_gw_p_t_1 Tom Thomas B Barker 1223 Lake Point Drive Webster, NY 14580 (585) 265-4015 tbbeqa@... Your Guide in the World of Gilbert American Flyer S Gauge Trains https://www.amazon.com/author/thomasbarker

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77232	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Tim, Carl has some good ideas.  Once you have it upside down, you can also check on the traction tire rubber.  One or two may be out of their grooves.  It's worth a shot.  These things are also smoke fluid hogs!  5-6 is a good starting point.  But once warmed up, you'd better disconnect your smoke alarm!  (Just kidding) I also found out that you're a member of SMSG.  If you attend the next meeting (look in the newsletter) I, or someone else, can take a good look at it.  If it's serious, it will need to be returned to Lionel for service.  If it's simple, like the traction tire, it can be remedied quite easily. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77233	From: Tom	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Berkshire

Hello everyone, I just received my Berkshire and am overall delighted.  It is beautiful and the sound and smoke are excellent.  It runs well except that I noticed that it does have a “wobble” at high speed, just like Tim Benner reported.  In general I suspect that I won’t be running it at that speed but I wanted to test it out.  I’d like to know if others besides Tim have noticed this.  Is this issue something that is a concern for the long-term durability and functioning of the locomotive? I have two additional questions.  On the couplers, what activates the ElectroCoupler?  The FlyerChief remote does not activate the coupler assuming that you’re supposed to push the button with the coupler icon.  All I get is the whistle because its the other half of the button for the rear coupler.  Has anyone else encountered this issue or am I doing something wrong?  I did read the instructions completely and saw nothing to help with this.   Second, the instructions refer to making sure the “reverse unit switch is ON” on page 15 where there is a discussion of trouble shooting a problem with changing direction in conventional mode.  I have no problem changing direction in conventional mode.  However, I’d like to know if there is a button to turn the reverse unit ON and OFF as implied by the instruction.  I don’t see a switch to do that and the instructions refer to only three switches on page 5 - those for smoke, sound and conventional/remote operation.  What am I missing?  Is this an example of Lionel not editing the instruction manual carefully? Any advice on the reverse unit direction switch and on the coupler issue would be appreciated.   Tom Detmer On Jan 7, 2016, at 9:09 AM, 'Herb and Bev Lanier' hblanier@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Just read these two posts after returning from delivering my 3 day old Berkshire to the local Lionel service station. I tried all of that time to get it to smoke correctly, but no luck. Will be interesting to see how long this takes. If they sold 999 good ones out of a 1000, I’d get the bad one. Story of my life.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 8:16 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire     Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at.  http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com]  Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire.   1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it.   2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!"   There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed.   Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77234	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Herb, You and me both, brother!!!  Make that 998...  But mine refused to run at ALL. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI Just read these two posts after returning from delivering my 3 day old Berkshire to the local Lionel service station. I tried all of that time to get it to smoke correctly, but no luck. Will be interesting to see how long this takes. If they sold 999 good ones out of a 1000, I’d get the bad one. Story of my life.   Herb paflyrman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77235	From: rick gough	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Don't know if this got out there, but I have found that Smoke output is directly correlated to transformer output: 13 volts = Low Smoke; 16 volts = Medium Smoke; 18 volts = BIG Smoke. The Berk functions the same on 12 volts and up. And I have successfully wired my tender light to function off the tender trucks .... yea! Rick   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Thursday, January 7, 2016 1:30 PM, "poniaj@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Tim, Carl has some good ideas.  Once you have it upside down, you can also check on the traction tire rubber.  One or two may be out of their grooves.  It's worth a shot.  These things are also smoke fluid hogs!  5-6 is a good starting point.  But once warmed up, you'd better disconnect your smoke alarm!  (Just kidding) I also found out that you're a member of SMSG.  If you attend the next meeting (look in the newsletter) I, or someone else, can take a good look at it.  If it's serious, it will need to be returned to Lionel for service.  If it's simple, like the traction tire, it can be remedied quite easily. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77236	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

If your dealer has another one send it back to dealer, if not send it to Lionel and let them take it apart and put it back together right. They will and they will thoroughly test it, too. My favorite smoke fluid is JT's Mega Steam. it works very well in everything, be it Seuth, Fan Blown, or Mechanical.  Next I like Bachmann, then A-1 Normal, which works great in ACG 'real' Flyer. Super Smoke is OK, too. My Berk, which runs perfectly is happy on 8-10 drops, which lasts a long run. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77237	From: rick gough	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: 1/64 slot cars

Attachments : Slickster '77' 011.jpg Slickster '77' 002.jpg Stumpy, I still have the modified corvette I won the city of Utica, NY Aurora slot car Championship with in 1963 !!!!  Wish I'd kept the trophy. I was more proud of that than the Go-Kart trophy's !   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Thursday, January 7, 2016 7:47 AM, "Bob Moyer romoyer1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Good Morning All and a belated Happy New Year. The slot car maker Scalextric makes a Micro Scalextric line that is 1/64. They may work with an AF layout.  I have some Scalextric 1/32 slot cars and sets. Mostly I collect the James Bond themed sets. The latest movie themed Bond  set has got the Aston Martin DB10 versus the new Jaguar roadster. Its a beautiful set. Regards Bob Moyer  On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 9:07 AM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I'm not saying this will be an impossible task, but trying to use slot cars may not be the right solution. To get slot cars to run reliably at slow speeds is possible if you could regear them.  But unlike the bigger scales (1/32 or 1/24) the only gear sets I know of in "HO" slot cars are lighter alloy or gear sets to make the cars faster!  There ARE "magnet cars" the right size (Tomy, Life-Like) that will hold to the track at blender speeds due to added magnets, but will not run slow at all.  I use them as refrigerator magnets because they're too fast and unrealistic to drive.  I find 2,500 scale miles per hour and not "de-slotting" ridiculous. Another problem using slot cars is that you can't just rewire the track like you do model train track.  If you try to run two cars under separate control on the same track it will short and fry the power pack.  The old slotless cars could operate under separate control, change lanes, and worked fairly well if you kept speeds up, otherwise they could stall between lanes during the change.  But they were made to be driven and not left to run on their own because there was no guide slot to steer them. Gilbert (1/32 scale) and Tyco (HO) made track with "turnouts" so that vehicles could move to different roads. Some of the Tyco vehicles were modified with guide pins in front AND back of the car and a switch on the controllers allowed them to back up like any DC train. It's hard to find today, and it was not designed to run two vehicles on the same lane independently controlled. You could build a complete DCC system and maybe use N gauge decoders which only MIGHT fit in the car.  But that could get expensive.  You might also try a form of radio control, but again size and cost of the equipment are problems.  And correct scale speed would remain a problem. Again, not knowing specifically what is needed, I can't suggest alternatives.  I have seen vehicles animated at low speeds by scratch built cable systems, conveyor belt set ups, under road moving magnets, and motor driven screw mechanisms.  All have advantages and problems. Stumpy in Ahia

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77238	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Hi Carl...been enjoying your work for some time, nice job on Brekshire, not the best from Lionel, but also not bad either, certainly a nice addition to the "AF" roster, just not sure I would want to buy one, due to all the problems reported, as has been the case with Lionels 2-8-2, 4-8-4, 4-6-6-4 etc. Lionel WILL NOT stand behind their warranties, when loco (or other item) was purchased new from a non "authorized" dealer. So not a Lionel fan. On to main reason I am contacting you....been trying to find the electronic reverse unit you referenced in your articles for the $12-$13 mentioned....just nothing anywhere! The lowest price I found was over $30...maybe price was "years" ago??? Want to use at least 6 of the electronic (circuit board) reverse units... where are they available for the price you stated?...or alternatives? Also curious about the cost of the TMCC conversion on the Berkshire.... Thanks for your excellent web site and efforts, Peter Loeb web site: trains-4-u.com   From: "carl@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 6:16 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77239	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid

Back in the mid 60's When I was in Junior High we lived in a town that did not have an American Flyer dealer. i would have to go to the city of Missoula to buy any accessories including the little capsules of smoke fluid. One day i came home from school and decided to run my trains. Shortly after starting i noticed my steamer had w-quit smoking. Sure enough i was out of smoke fluid and not one spare capsule of smoke fluid. i had just finished practicing my trumpet lessons and looked over and spied my bottle of trumpet oil. Yup the gears started turning so I opened it and took a whiff. Smelled just like the AF smoke fluid. Ok what the heck so i used the eyedropper that came in the trumpet oil and filled the smoke fluid reservoir and started running the locomotive. After a few seconds as usual shetarted puffing smoke CLOUDS OF SMOKE grandma thought the house had caught fire there was so much smoke. what a bonanza. A local source for smoke fluid and not as spendy as the AF stuff. A bottle was like a buck and a half and lasted weeks. The only drawback was the excessive smoke. Bottom line that locomotive was still chugging away when I joined the Navy in 67. unfortunately it was sold after i went to boot camp.                                                                 Bob Lampe                                                                 Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77240	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

This should work.   6100103100 E-UNIT / CONVENTIONAL / DC MTR / (ALT: 6100107100)  $16.50    Berk conversion about $350 with labor.  More than the loco cost.. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 5:13 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Hi Carl...been enjoying your work for some time, nice job on Brekshire, not the best from Lionel, but also not bad either, certainly a nice addition to the "AF" roster, just not sure I would want to buy one, due to all the problems reported, as has been the case with Lionels 2-8-2, 4-8-4, 4-6-6-4 etc. Lionel WILL NOT stand behind their warranties, when loco (or other item) was purchased new from a non "authorized" dealer. So not a Lionel fan. On to main reason I am contacting you....been trying to find the electronic reverse unit you referenced in your articles for the $12-$13 mentioned....just nothing anywhere! The lowest price I found was over $30...maybe price was "years" ago??? Want to use at least 6 of the electronic (circuit board) reverse units... where are they available for the price you stated?...or alternatives? Also curious about the cost of the TMCC conversion on the Berkshire.... Thanks for your excellent web site and efforts, Peter Loeb web site: trains-4-u.com   From: "carl@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 6:16 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Tim,   I sounds like one of the drivers may be out of spec?  It may have to back to Lionel?   Run it upside down and look for a wobble?   As for the smoke unit 10 drops is what you should start with and add 5-6 as needed.   I have a web page for my TMCC version at. http://www.tuveson.com/Berk/burk.html  A-norma1 is a good smoke fluid to use.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 7:52 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Over the past few nights I have put about an hour of run time on the Berkshire. 1.  This locomotive rocks!  Literally.  When the rods are down on the left side the entire loco dips to the left.  When they are up it dips to the right.  Not noticeable at a crawl but at track speed it rocks. A lot. I can't see any bind in the rods and gear.  The traction tires look round enough.  It has been oiled sparingly.  The run-in time has not helped.  Any ideas on what to check next?  I waited years for an affordable Berk and don't want to send it back.  I really want to like it. 2. This is my first Lionel smoking locomotive.  After marvelling over the smoke synchronization and volume for about 20 minutes the smoke diminished and I turned it off.  Should I buy the recommended Lionel Premium smoke fluid for it or will Supersmoke work?  The manual says add 4 drops.  Really?  Is that enough to keep the wick wet enough to keep it from being charred?  Honestly it will run most of the time with smoke turned off.  But it would be nice to have the option of turning it on and saying, "hey, check out how this thing smokes!" There is a lot to like about this loco. Especially at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77241	From: poniaj	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Tom, I am not an expert on the Berks, but the PE one I have now runs fine after I resolved a batch of relatively minor problems, most of them with the passenger cars.  My PE doesn't have any wobble at all, and neither did my C&O Berk when it ran the foot or two and stopped (the unit has since been sent back)  I just received my Berkshire and am overall delighted.  It is beautiful and the sound and smoke are excellent.  It runs well except that I noticed that it does have a “wobble” at high speed, just like Tim Benner reported. Try running at it upside down with jumper wires powering it.  It may be something as simple as the traction tires being loose or not seated correctly.  If it's the wheel itself, it will need to be sent back.  Yours wouldn't be the first to have faulty wheels.   In general I suspect that I won’t be running it at that speed but I wanted to test it out.  I’d like to know if others besides Tim have noticed this.  Is this issue something that is a concern for the long-term durability and functioning of the locomotive? I have two additional questions.  On the couplers, what activates the ElectroCoupler?  The FlyerChief remote does not activate the coupler assuming that you’re supposed to push the button with the coupler icon.  All I get is the whistle because its the other half of the button for the rear coupler.  Has anyone else encountered this issue or am I doing something wrong?  I did read the instructions completely and saw nothing to help with this.  The ElecroCoupler activates upon hitting the button twice.  Try it.  Also be sure you're hitting the extreme edge of the switch.  Second, the instructions refer to making sure the “reverse unit switch is ON” on page 15 where there is a discussion of trouble shooting a problem with changing direction in conventional mode.  I have no problem changing direction in conventional mode.  However, I’d like to know if there is a button to turn the reverse unit ON and OFF as implied by the instruction.  I don’t see a switch to do that and the instructions refer to only three switches on page 5 - those for smoke, sound and conventional/remote operation.  What am I missing?  Is this an example of Lionel not editing the instruction manual carefully? That's been my understanding too.  The manual on my PE refers to not lubricating the center rollers....   Not on any of my S gauge things!  The C&O manual refers to two LEDs, but there is no tender back up light on the separate sale Berks (mentioned in at least two places).  It was either the ElectroCoupler or the light.  Which one you'd have preferred is a matter of personal preference.  The new Berks don't have a reverse lockout.  The reverse unit will reset to forward after a few seconds.   Any advice on the reverse unit direction switch and on the coupler issue would be appreciated.  Hope I've helped. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77242	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

My smoke output follows Rick's experience. The manual photo of the remote control is inaccurate as it doesn't show the actual configuration of the buttons. But the text is accurate. The right hand button must be pushed twice to fire the coupler. My coupler firing was very intermittent. A few drops of Labelle 108 got it to work 100% even with 13 volts on the track. Mine has a very slight wobble -- probably the traction tires. So far I've only run it on the floor using vintage AF track Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77243	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Jerry, Read my post on smoke output regulation. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77244	From: racin510	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

That's crazy because it must have been right on the edge of lighting off, Bic lighter style, yet the wick survived for years! To heck with the engine, do you still have any of the oil??! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77245	From: Tom	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Jerry, Thanks for the info. I did get the ElectroCoupler to operate as described. Lionel also had errors in the instructions for the smoking caboose. I appreciate them introducing new items but they could help themselves by proof reading their instructions for accuracy. On the wobble issue, initial inspection shows the traction tires seem to be seated correctly. I'll try running the loco upside down as you suggested to see if I can detect any wobble in the wheels that way.  Thanks. Tom On Jan 7, 2016, at 5:17 PM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Tom, I am not an expert on the Berks, but the PE one I have now runs fine after I resolved a batch of relatively minor problems, most of them with the passenger cars.  My PE doesn't have any wobble at all, and neither did my C&O Berk when it ran the foot or two and stopped (the unit has since been sent back)  I just received my Berkshire and am overall delighted.  It is beautiful and the sound and smoke are excellent.  It runs well except that I noticed that it does have a “wobble” at high speed, just like Tim Benner reported. Try running at it upside down with jumper wires powering it.  It may be something as simple as the traction tires being loose or not seated correctly.  If it's the wheel itself, it will need to be sent back.  Yours wouldn't be the first to have faulty wheels.   In general I suspect that I won’t be running it at that speed but I wanted to test it out.  I’d like to know if others besides Tim have noticed this.  Is this issue something that is a concern for the long-term durability and functioning of the locomotive? I have two additional questions.  On the couplers, what activates the ElectroCoupler?  The FlyerChief remote does not activate the coupler assuming that you’re supposed to push the button with the coupler icon.  All I get is the whistle because its the other half of the button for the rear coupler.  Has anyone else encountered this issue or am I doing something wrong?  I did read the instructions completely and saw nothing to help with this.   The ElecroCoupler activates upon hitting the button twice.  Try it.  Also be sure you're hitting the extreme edge of the switch.   Second, the instructions refer to making sure the “reverse unit switch is ON” on page 15 where there is a discussion of trouble shooting a problem with changing direction in conventional mode.  I have no problem changing direction in conventional mode.  However, I’d like to know if there is a button to turn the reverse unit ON and OFF as implied by the instruction.  I don’t see a switch to do that and the instructions refer to only three switches on page 5 - those for smoke, sound and conventional/remote operation.  What am I missing?  Is this an example of Lionel not editing the instruction manual carefully? That's been my understanding too.  The manual on my PE refers to not lubricating the center rollers....   Not on any of my S gauge things!  The C&O manual refers to two LEDs, but there is no tender back up light on the separate sale Berks (mentioned in at least two places).  It was either the ElectroCoupler or the light.  Which one you'd have preferred is a matter of personal preference.  The new Berks don't have a reverse lockout.  The reverse unit will reset to forward after a few seconds.   Any advice on the reverse unit direction switch and on the coupler issue would be appreciated.   Hope I've helped. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77246	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

I tried to check out trumpet valve oil to see what it really contains and that seems to be as much of a mystery as what smoke fluid contains.  The best I could come up with is that it is mineral oil, which is the same stuff A.C. used in his "non-toxic" formula.  Of course he added a little cedar oil for the scent.  I think the key is the viscosity of the mineral oil.  I have a friend who uses a mixture of drug store mineral oil mixed with essential cedar oil and seems to have had no trouble with it.  Not sure of the proportions though. Dale On 1/7/2016 3:21 PM, danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Back in the mid 60's When I was in Junior High we lived in a town that did not have an American Flyer dealer. i would have to go to the city of Missoula to buy any accessories including the little capsules of smoke fluid. One day i came home from school and decided to run my trains. Shortly after starting i noticed my steamer had w-quit smoking. Sure enough i was out of smoke fluid and not one spare capsule of smoke fluid. i had just finished practicing my trumpet lessons and looked over and spied my bottle of trumpet oil. Yup the gears started turning so I opened it and took a whiff. Smelled just like the AF smoke fluid. Ok what the heck so i used the eyedropper that came in the trumpet oil and filled the smoke fluid reservoir and started running the locomotive. After a few seconds as usual shetarted puffing smoke CLOUDS OF SMOKE grandma thought the house had caught fire there was so much smoke. what a bonanza. A local source for smoke fluid and not as spendy as the AF stuff. A bottle was like a buck and a half and lasted weeks. The only drawback was the excessive smoke. Bottom line that locomotive was still chugging away when I joined the Navy in 67. unfortunately it was sold after i went to boot camp.                                                                 Bob Lampe                                                                 Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77247	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid

I think you hit on the key part of the equation with the viscosity of the fluid being the key.  For instance the fluid used for the Seuthe type smokers (center element in a tube) is  a good deal thinner than what works well in the old Flyer locos.  MTH O gauge locos with the fan driven smokers used yet another fluid to make their system work at it's best.  There are "semi-generic" smoke fluids that do "okay" but having worked in every scale and gauge over the years and spending twenty years in a hobby shop, there seems to be no true replacement for what the manufacturer requires.  For the most part, they do the best job of smoke production without messing up the smoke unit in some way.  That the various "correct" formulas are a closely guarded secret is just good business.  But years down the road when the train is out of production, that can be a real pain for old train operators and collectors who want their trains to be just like they were. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77248	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

We are getting lots of good info in this thread. I ran the Berk upside down in the cradle last night and noticed a number of things. - the square bearings float up and down in the chassis easily.  Not sure if this is normal but assuming it is. - at any speed the (rear) wheels have a fair bit of run-out. Not just the tire, but the whole wheel.  You can see it from the sides and also comparing the distance of the wheel to the rear brake hanger.  It could just be the vertical movement from the bearings floating up and down.  - One tire narrows at one point, showing more of the metal wheel.  It could be bunched in the middle causing some if not all of the rocking when on the rails.  While thinking about how to flatten that part of the tire my work phone rang.  Oh well.  Maybe tonight.  Not looking forward to slipping an Xacto knife under that tire anyway.  Better get some tires on order. Something changed with the smoke.  Out of the box with the recommended 4 drops it smoked like crazy running on TMCC track power.  Voltage never exceeds 11, maybe 12.  Never even got the Flyer chief controller out of the box.  Last night I flipped the smoke back on, added 6 drops and now it only smokes a little, and only at slow speeds.  At track speed (11-12v) there is a little smell but no visible smoke.  The posted smoke output by voltage info is interesting.  I'll have to get the controller out and crank up the track voltage.  I would hate to think I charred the wick in the first 20 minutes.  But why else would it have changed?  Maybe I'd better get some wick on order with the tires. This is still a great locomotive at yard speed. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77249	From: trndad	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

If you have a Cab 1 or Legacy controller, instead of buying electronic reverse units from Lionel for $16.50 a pop you could instead buy Electric Railroad Co. Mini Commander II boards at $35 each.  They work just like an electronic reverse unit when run in conventional mode but give your engine TMCC capabilities.  They can control two LED's and have outputs that can control either coil couplers or incandescent lamps (or smoke I believe).    So if you use command control or plan on getting it in the future, a board that acts like an electronic reverse unit but can be controlled by TMCC or Legacy for just $18.50 more is hard to beat.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77250	From: Dr Trains	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Thanks for info and WOW expensive conversion....guess that's why Lionel did not do this from factory.....take it, that the Berk has a totally different system for control/sound etc.? than the LionelTMCC/Legac? Also whom would you suggest I contact to purchase the E-Unit? Best wishes, Peter Loeb From: "carl@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:14 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   This should work.   6100103100 E-UNIT / CONVENTIONAL / DC MTR / (ALT: 6100107100)  $16.50    Berk conversion about $350 with labor.  More than the loco cost..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77251	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

I don't have any of the original oil anymore but it must still be manufactured. Any music store that sells trumpets, trombones and the like should have it. Just ask for trumpet oil. Unfortunately the original stores where i bought it are long out of business.                   Bob Lampe                   Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 18:49:28 -0800 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   That's crazy because it must have been right on the edge of lighting off, Bic lighter style, yet the wick survived for years! To heck with the engine, do you still have any of the oil??! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77252	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

You can order direct from Lionel via the web of most dealers stock them From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 08, 2016 12:53 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Thanks for info and WOW expensive conversion....guess that's why Lionel did not do this from factory.....take it, that the Berk has a totally different system for control/sound etc.? than the LionelTMCC/Legac? Also whom would you suggest I contact to purchase the E-Unit? Best wishes, Peter Loeb From: "carl@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:14 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   This should work.   6100103100 E-UNIT / CONVENTIONAL / DC MTR / (ALT: 6100107100)  $16.50    Berk conversion about $350 with labor.  More than the loco cost..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77253	From: n6ojj	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Tim, A few diagnostic questions: 1.  Do the square bearings float up and down at the same time as the axle turns?  Or, do they rise on the left then the right?  2.  What happens if you were to hold the bearings in place with your fingers applying only light to moderate pressure?  We're not trying to break anything here.  Let us know what you find out.  Cheers, Dave McBrayer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77254	From: racin510	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

I add a few drops of Cedar oil to my various fluids to get more scent at times with no affect on operation. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77255	From: racin510	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Maybe you didn't put enough smoke fluid in it. 4 drops is nothing, even the Seuthe smoke unit in the Mikado requires a little more that that and they are ultra sensitive. Load it up with at least 8-10 drops. And the Voltage to Smoke output works, at least for mine and it pretty much does not smoke at 12v and lower. You do not have to run 18v to the track! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77256	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/8/2016
Subject: Idea for new mods. Standards

I built mods many years ago in Nashville, and was never able to connect with others. Now I am thinking of converting them for use with new AF track. The simplest ideas is to use 4 10 inch tracks and 2 half tracks at each end. That means 24 by 45 inch mods with 5 inch track connections at each . That means not having to cut connection tracks. I don't see that it would be hard to convert my 48 inch straight mods to 45 inch. So would the new AF track not work with most S track types? It is as real as SHS track. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77257	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77258	From: allscalerails	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue # 6 Jan / Feb 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #6  Jan / Feb 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.AllScaleRails.com Subscribe to out free email list & get notified when new issue come out. http://app.expressemailmarketing.com/Survey.aspx?SFID=207156 Click  HERE for Issue 6 http://www.allscalerails.com/ Included in this issue:  The Challenge, Trainfest 2015, How-To Dandelions, John Tindall's "Four Corners & Five lakes" Layout, Houston-White Company Mill & Basket Factory, Wooden Railway Car Builders Circle Word Puzzle, Part 1 C.M.St.P.&P. R.R. 1930 Bridge over Layton Ave. in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Blueprints, News & New Products, Snap Shots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77259	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Those who have removed chassis from shell, I did so a bit hastily in my desire to figure out how to light the fire box and some of the little black flat insulating washers hit the table. At least I suppose they insulate. Does anyone know how many washers go between  chassis and shell, esp in back? I put two in and it seemed to jack the shell off the chassis too much leaving a gap, so wound up leaving 4 washers out. I never feel good about having left over parts even though it runs fine. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77260	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Bob, I sell the Anormal1 brand which is original formula American Flyer Formula. It's 10 dollars for a 4 oz bottle with eye dropper and 3.34 for shipping if you are interested in a bottle. Chris Burger From: "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 8, 2016 4:04 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   I don't have any of the original oil anymore but it must still be manufactured. Any music store that sells trumpets, trombones and the like should have it. Just ask for trumpet oil. Unfortunately the original stores where i bought it are long out of business.                   Bob Lampe                   Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 18:49:28 -0800 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   That's crazy because it must have been right on the edge of lighting off, Bic lighter style, yet the wick survived for years! To heck with the engine, do you still have any of the oil??! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77261	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

There are 8 washers. They are used to insulate the shell from the chassis. The shouldered washer goes on the bottom and the flat washer goes on the top of the chassis screw hole.   Squeeze the flat washer a little to make it a bit egg shaped and that will help hold the washer onto the screw while you install the shell.   Very important to get them back in place correctly.You you can make a  track voltage short and also reduce the sensitivity of the receiver.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2016 2:37 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire   Those who have removed chassis from shell, I did so a bit hastily in my desire to figure out how to light the fire box and some of the little black flat insulating washers hit the table. At least I suppose they insulate. Does anyone know how many washers go between  chassis and shell, esp in back? I put two in and it seemed to jack the shell off the chassis too much leaving a gap, so wound up leaving 4 washers out. I never feel good about having left over parts even though it runs fine. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77262	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

I hate new math!  (LOL)  When I went to school your formula would come to only 10% of the total, and thus it begs the question of what makes up the remaining 90%?   I suspect you may have meant 70% pure kerosene + 30% cedar wood oil, but that still seems to be an awful lot of cedar wood oil in the mixture.  Perhaps it is 97% pure kerosene and 3% cedar wood oil.   So which is it?   Jerry F.    From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2016 2:20 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid     This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77263	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Your statement is flawed. The % is really off. The reason I know this is back before I started selling my fluid I sent a cap of ACG fluid to a lab, & they used a mass spectrometer. I used that info along with other info that I had & it all matched.  As far as just adding any Cedar fluid to any kero & expecting to get the same result, would be like taking grapes from your back yard & expecting to get wine that tastes like  it came from  Napa Valley. In nature there are differences in everything , like apples, oranges, grapes & the oils from Cedar trees. So the type of cedar maters, as does the "Carrier oil"  I've always for the 14+ years I have been selling my fluid had a 100% ,shipping included" guarantee , if you don't like it for any reason, you get your $$ Back. I can offer this because I know I have the "EXACT" formula. I have had only one person ask & they got their $$ back. Said his wife did not like the smoke in "her" house  So if you want to get your own ingredients & make your own & fill your boots with it, remember, not only will the ingredients cost you, so will getting rid of the result. Look, for $10 + shipping  you get enough (4 oz) to last most users a year+, if not longer.  PS: E-mail  ( Anormal1@... )me about my track cleaning kits...Same price except shipping $.50 more     In a message dated 1/9/2016 5:28:22 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77264	From: rick flaherty	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Attachments : Bugs P-38[14].png You tell `em, buddy ! Love your products and service.  Just the best. Rick "The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the level of thinking that created them." Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Saturday, January 9, 2016 at 11:03 AM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid    Your statement is flawed. The % is really off. The reason I know this is back before I started selling my fluid I sent a cap of ACG fluid to a lab, & they used a mass spectrometer. I used that info along with other info that I had & it all matched.  As far as just adding any Cedar fluid to any kero & expecting to get the same result, would be like taking grapes from your back yard & expecting to get wine that tastes like  it came from  Napa Valley. In nature there are differences in everything , like apples, oranges, grapes & the oils from Cedar trees. So the type of cedar maters, as does the "Carrier oil"  I've always for the 14+ years I have been selling my fluid had a 100% ,shipping included" guarantee , if you don't like it for any reason, you get your $$ Back. I can offer this because I know I have the "EXACT" formula. I have had only one person ask & they got their $$ back. Said his wife did not like the smoke in "her" house  So if you want to get your own ingredients & make your own & fill your boots with it, remember, not only will the ingredients cost you, so will getting rid of the result. Look, for $10 + shipping  you get enough (4 oz) to last most users a year+, if not longer.  PS: E-mail  ( Anormal1@... )me about my track cleaning kits...Same price except shipping $.50 more     In a message dated 1/9/2016 5:28:22 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77265	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Thanks Chris,      I had a sample bottle of the Anormal smoke fluid that was sent to me 6 years ago and it worked great...unfortunately it was stolen. but I was referencing the trumpet oil that I used when I ran out of smoke fluid as a kid. I don't even remember the brand name anymore (this was over 50 years ago) but it must still be in production. Actually thr trumpet oil was easier to use than the original Flyer smoke capsules/ampules. You just had to be careful to not overfill the smoke fluid reservoir. I don't think anything drastic would happen but it did get a tad messy.                 Bob Lampe                 Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 14:00:10 +0000 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   Bob, I sell the Anormal1 brand which is original formula American Flyer Formula. It's 10 dollars for a 4 oz bottle with eye dropper and 3.34 for shipping if you are interested in a bottle. Chris Burger From: "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 8, 2016 4:04 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   I don't have any of the original oil anymore but it must still be manufactured. Any music store that sells trumpets, trombones and the like should have it. Just ask for trumpet oil. Unfortunately the original stores where i bought it are long out of business.                   Bob Lampe                   Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 18:49:28 -0800 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   That's crazy because it must have been right on the edge of lighting off, Bic lighter style, yet the wick survived for years! To heck with the engine, do you still have any of the oil??! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77266	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Bob is an American Models/Scale man who doesn't even run Flyer. He was just relating a story about running out of smoke, living in the boonies, and getting lucky with using instrument oil .... back in the day. I've used Anormal since I got back into it 15 or so years ago; gotta say I have know idea what something smelled like 60 years ago ! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77267	From: racin510	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire

Carl, Besides getting to use the much nicer and smoother Legacy or TMCC remotes, what do you get out of the conversion?  I see Tender light in reverse only, varying whistle tone. Do you get brakes, cab light on/off, firebox lit, smoke in neutral ?  If there is nothing new to buy [steamers] from Lionel in a year I may want to do this but would like to know all the advantages as probably would others. Great video, too! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77268	From: Herb and Bev Lanier	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Does smoke fluid go bad with age? I’ve got some bottles that are a couple of years old, and when I use them all I smell is kerosene. Not the odor I want emanating from my train room.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 2:03 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid     Your statement is flawed. The % is really off. The reason I know this is back before I started selling my fluid I sent a cap of ACG fluid to a lab, & they used a mass spectrometer. I used that info along with other info that I had & it all matched. As far as just adding any Cedar fluid to any kero & expecting to get the same result, would be like taking grapes from your back yard & expecting to get wine that tastes like  it came from  Napa Valley. In nature there are differences in everything , like apples, oranges, grapes & the oils from Cedar trees. So the type of cedar maters, as does the "Carrier oil" I've always for the 14+ years I have been selling my fluid had a 100% ,shipping included" guarantee , if you don't like it for any reason, you get your $$ Back. I can offer this because I know I have the "EXACT" formula. I have had only one person ask & they got their $$ back. Said his wife did not like the smoke in "her" house So if you want to get your own ingredients & make your own & fill your boots with it, remember, not only will the ingredients cost you, so will getting rid of the result. Look, for $10 + shipping  you get enough (4 oz) to last most users a year+, if not longer. PS: E-mail  ( Anormal1@... )me about my track cleaning kits...Same price except shipping $.50 more     In a message dated 1/9/2016 5:28:22 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77269	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Berkshire smoke

The new Berkshire (not) smoking has gotten under my skin.  Can't let go of it even though it will be turned off as soon as it is working right again.  After chores and snow preparation today was supposed to be spent putting together more L-girder sections but ended up being spent trying to get the Berk to smoke like it did its first 20 minutes.  It smokes acceptably at a crawl.  Over 15 SMPH (10V), nothing.  Same behaviour using the remote with full track power.  Adding fluid makes no change.  Now I wonder if there is too much fluid in there. I can envision two scenarios and think the first is more likely.  - First, I added too little smoke on its first run.  It smoked very well but did not smell like AF smoke.  By the time smoke diminished the wick was scorched.  Now It cannot get fluid to the element fast enough to make enough smoke to be visible at speed.  Solution would be to replace the wick or the whole smoke unit.  But I do not want to open it up before knowing if the wheel wobble issue is a warranty issue. - Second, I added too much fluid and now either the intake air passage is blocked or the element cannot get hot enough to make smoke at speed.  I don't know enough about the Lionel smoke units to rule out the second scenario so I will be examining Carl's pages to see what I can learn from the pictures there.  Also checking Lionel's parts site to see if the smoke units or wicks are available.  I did see a YouTube video of a guy who replaced the stock Lionel wicking with what looked to be AF type fiberglass wicking.  He super-saturated the wick with fluid and had maybe too much smoke.  But that seemed to be what he was after.  And it was O-Gauge.  It was a fan type unit but who knows how close to what is in the Berk. Any other ideas?  Thanks, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77270	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77271	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Here is something I used on the y-3 smoke unit to make it a better smoker. The y-3 smoke unit has the same design as the Polar and Berk smoke unit. http://www.tuveson.com/hybrid-element/a_hybrid_smoke_element.htm   Carl     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2016 7:34 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Berkshire smoke   The new Berkshire (not) smoking has gotten under my skin.  Can't let go of it even though it will be turned off as soon as it is working right again.  After chores and snow preparation today was supposed to be spent putting together more L-girder sections but ended up being spent trying to get the Berk to smoke like it did its first 20 minutes.  It smokes acceptably at a crawl.  Over 15 SMPH (10V), nothing.  Same behaviour using the remote with full track power.  Adding fluid makes no change.  Now I wonder if there is too much fluid in there. I can envision two scenarios and think the first is more likely.  - First, I added too little smoke on its first run.  It smoked very well but did not smell like AF smoke.  By the time smoke diminished the wick was scorched.  Now It cannot get fluid to the element fast enough to make enough smoke to be visible at speed.  Solution would be to replace the wick or the whole smoke unit.  But I do not want to open it up before knowing if the wheel wobble issue is a warranty issue. - Second, I added too much fluid and now either the intake air passage is blocked or the element cannot get hot enough to make smoke at speed.  I don't know enough about the Lionel smoke units to rule out the second scenario so I will be examining Carl's pages to see what I can learn from the pictures there.  Also checking Lionel's parts site to see if the smoke units or wicks are available.  I did see a YouTube video of a guy who replaced the stock Lionel wicking with what looked to be AF type fiberglass wicking.  He super-saturated the wick with fluid and had maybe too much smoke.  But that seemed to be what he was after.  And it was O-Gauge.  It was a fan type unit but who knows how close to what is in the Berk. Any other ideas?  Thanks, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77272	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77273	From: jaytewilli	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Berk "Flickering Firebox"

I received my PM Berk today and on the box it says it has a "flickering firebox" in the cab.  I've been running it and I have yet to see a "flicker".  How bright is the flicker and where does it originate from?  BTW, my Berk does have a slight "wobble" at very high speed when not pulling a load. Daryl

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77274	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Rick,    Take my word for it the Anormal stuff IS for all intents and purposes Original formula American Flyer smoke fluid not only in in smell ,texture BUT performance as well. And no i am not employed by him lolololol.                                                                                                                                                 Bob Lampe                                                                                                                                                Kalispell, MT   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 14:37:13 -0800 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   Bob is an American Models/Scale man who doesn't even run Flyer. He was just relating a story about running out of smoke, living in the boonies, and getting lucky with using instrument oil .... back in the day. I've used Anormal since I got back into it 15 or so years ago; gotta say I have know idea what something smelled like 60 years ago ! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77275	From: Robert Graves	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: New Layout Tour Video is online

A new video tour of the San Diego S Gaugers modular layout is now online at the club's website:      <sites.google.com/site/sdsgaugers/Home/videos>   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77276	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Herb, I think you answered your own question.As a general rule of thumb, I feel that a 4oz bottle should last about a year & most users should not run into any shelf life issues. But this is just a guess as I have not heard this question before. Mike   In a message dated 1/9/2016 4:29:54 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Does smoke fluid go bad with age? I’ve got some bottles that are a couple of years old, and when I use them all I smell is kerosene. Not the odor I want emanating from my train room.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 2:03 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid     Your statement is flawed. The % is really off. The reason I know this is back before I started selling my fluid I sent a cap of ACG fluid to a lab, & they used a mass spectrometer. I used that info along with other info that I had & it all matched. As far as just adding any Cedar fluid to any kero & expecting to get the same result, would be like taking grapes from your back yard & expecting to get wine that tastes like  it came from  Napa Valley. In nature there are differences in everything , like apples, oranges, grapes & the oils from Cedar trees. So the type of cedar maters, as does the "Carrier oil" I've always for the 14+ years I have been selling my fluid had a 100% ,shipping included" guarantee , if you don't like it for any reason, you get your $$ Back. I can offer this because I know I have the "EXACT" formula. I have had only one person ask & they got their $$ back. Said his wife did not like the smoke in "her" house So if you want to get your own ingredients & make your own & fill your boots with it, remember, not only will the ingredients cost you, so will getting rid of the result. Look, for $10 + shipping  you get enough (4 oz) to last most users a year+, if not longer. PS: E-mail  ( Anormal1@... )me about my track cleaning kits...Same price except shipping $.50 more     In a message dated 1/9/2016 5:28:22 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This Smoke fluid topic has been re-hashed do many times ....But for those not in the know ...The Original formula for ACG smoke fluid is ..(7% Pure Kero ..+ 3 % cedar wood oil ....Nothing more ...Pure Kero is defined as being refined to the point that it was odorless ...it can still be bought for lamp purposes ..listed as Odorless ..cheap kero has a definite Stink....As far as the Viscosity is concerned it has been tried many ways and times by different people to duplicate a good working fluid ..by mixing with mineral oil .. etc etc etc ...to each their own ..So if your like me and want to take the time to make a couple quarts of fluid get what is required and fill your boots ...its Not Hard ....

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77277	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

My understanding was that the first "original" AF smoke fluid was based on kerosene, and have seen AF documentation that identifies the fluid as containing kerosene.   I understand it was later changed to a "mineral oil" base and that is what they called "non-toxic."   On another Yahoo group, I remember seeing an internet article referenced and recommended by one of the members who is a chemistry professor. The link is:   http://www.toytrains1.com/lamp_oil.htm It is very interesting and I believe informative.  I think Stumpy hit the nail on the head that each manufacturer has fine tuned the fluid for their own unique smoke units.  As for me, I am hesitant to put anything but Lionel smoke fluid in my Lionel AF Polar Express, but I am hoping I can find something that will work well and not smell so bad.  I have heard a lot of people recommend ANormal1 for vintage flyer and his mass spectrometer analysis doesn't sound like experimentation to me. My friend also told me lately that his mix was 7 parts mineral oil to 3 parts cedar oil. Dale Smith On 1/9/2016 5:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77278	From: racin510	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"

Straight from Lional customer service rep: " The firebox lighting was killed in pre-production, a management decision". NO Berk has fire in it's firebox, but it looks to be fairly easy to add once my flickering 3mm red LED's show up, just pull juice off the trailing truck and go straight up. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77279	From: Bob Hannon	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Jerry F. :   You’re absolutely right about the NEW MATH.  Back then, formulas were stated in terms of PARTS, and not PERCENTAGES.  So, the original formula of 7 Parts Kerosene / 3 Parts Cedar Oil was simplicity itself, did not involve math (beyond basic counting), and probably spurred the sales of non-Math-Based chemistry sets (counting by parts instead of percentages, i.e.).   And they probably encouraged Mom’s interest and participation in a scientific activity, whose cook books were stated in similar non-mathematical terms: teaspoons, tablespoons, pinches, smidges, drops, etc. (at least until some mixture Johnny concocted ‘lit off’ and had to be cleaned up, the house defumigated, etc.).   I mean, how many kids back then would even have attempted the old 7-3-1 Gunpowder formula (formula published in the old Guns & Ammo Magazine, and supplies readily available in 1 lb. cans at your local drug store) if it had been stated in percentages or fractions (63.6363636363...% - 27.2727272727...% - 9.0909090909 ... %)?   And, as far as ‘anormal’s smoke fluid goes, all I can say is:         !!! IT’S ... GRRRRRREEEEEEEEAAAT !!!   Bob Hannon

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77280	From: gregory mccormack	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: piggy back unloader ramps

Thanks for your reply . I missed it initially and just found it this morning. I will try them Greg On Monday, November 30, 2015 5:26 PM, "Larry Moore mo2337@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Greg, Doug Peck at Port lines Hobby, should have them. Larry   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, November 30, 2015 3:07 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] piggy back unloader ramps     Does anyone know how I can obtain the two ramps for the piggy back unloader car #25033? I received this car for Christmas in the 1960's but the ramps were not in the box. I finally have a layout with room enough for a siding to place this car, so I am hoping to find the ramps so I can finally display this car after all these years. Thanks,    Greg McCormack

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77281	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Possible new AF track module Specifications

ACSG Module Specifications               ACSG Module Specifications TRACK A. Cutting track with an Xacto saw medium blade works well. This is their most common blade and refers to the width of the blade, not the number of teeth. View on www.trainweb.org Preview by Yahoo   After studying these Module Specifications I see that it would require cutting 2 inches off a 10 inch section of straight track. So this would require putting on rail joiners.  So do we have a source of what type to use. Has any one connected new AF track that has been cut clean? May be it requires cutting the end of a 10 inch section as well? Perhaps we can come up with a NASG AF standard. I understand we have a person working on this.  I have a lot of time to decide what I will do before May.  So may be this info can get everyone on the same page. It looks like SHS track could use the same standards. My though was to find a paint for SHS track to help match up AF track color. Cutting a 10 inch track down to 8 inches might be a good way to match up AF and SHS track. Hope this info will help others. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77282	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Building the Lionel 14 car Tunnel at desribed on page 54 of Classic

They were trying to promote Magne-Traction. It looks like they used taller trestles. Has any one tried to do this using AF trains? I guess we could use AF trestles  closer together. I think a AF 300 might be the best engine to use or may be a pull more Atlantic might be the best. So this might be my 2016 Christmas layout if it can be done. May be Pike master track could be used under the table?  It seems a resistor could be used to cut down the voltage going down. This might be how I can use up the Polar Express 20 radius track. So is Pull-more equal to Magne-traction? The trick is getting the look of entering the tunnel and coming out with out cheating on the tunnel openings. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77283	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"

Thanks, Rick.  It's good information.  Lesson is don't believe what's printed on the box! Daryl On 1/10/2016 3:00 AM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Straight from Lional customer service rep: " The firebox lighting was killed in pre-production, a management decision". NO Berk has fire in it's firebox, but it looks to be fairly easy to add once my flickering 3mm red LED's show up, just pull juice off the trailing truck and go straight up. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77284	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77285	From: racin510	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"

Right, Lionel likes to live in their own universe when it comes to selling you what you thought you bought, and never with an apology: $1,000 wonderful Challenger = NO CREW. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77286	From: Tom	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: AM flex track question

I need some guidance on how to bend the American Models flex track and get a nice curve. I discovered that it is noticeably stiffer than the SHS flex track that I’ve used previously. The AM track does not bend easily. I seem to recall reading some tips about bending AM flex track and I can’t remember where I saw them. Does anyone have the secret to bending the AM track without destroying it? I’d appreciate any advice on how to accomplish this. Tom Detmer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77287	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: Berk "Flickering Firebox"

Rick, Even "back in the day", Gilbert would block off some bad information on a box before it went out the door.  Lionel should have told the supplier to take a roll of tape and cover up the "flickering firebox" printing on the box as they were coming down the line.  Daryl On 1/10/2016 5:50 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Right, Lionel likes to live in their own universe when it comes to selling you what you thought you bought, and never with an apology: $1,000 wonderful Challenger = NO CREW. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77288	From: Dennis Donovan	Date: 1/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

You’re on point here. Gilbert made mass produced items. They did not use a super secret formula for their smoke.  We’ve been making our own for 15 year and using it in customer’s locomotive with all positive comments. In fact, some wanted some to take home. We do it gratis if possible. We never charged. If I pay @1.61 for gasoline, I’m not going to pay $10 for 4 0z. of smoke fluid. The bottle is worth more than the fluid and so is the dropper. On Jan 9, 2016, at 8:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77289	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

"Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ." How is sending a sample of original AF smoke fluid to a chemist and getting the exact formula , experimentation?  Sounds like someone has some sour grapes here.Chris Burger. From: "Dennis Donovan rosegirl88@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 9:04 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid   You’re on point here. Gilbert made mass produced items. They did not use a super secret formula for their smoke.  We’ve been making our own for 15 year and using it in customer’s locomotive with all positive comments. In fact, some wanted some to take home. We do it gratis if possible. We never charged. If I pay @1.61 for gasoline, I’m not going to pay $10 for 4 0z. of smoke fluid. The bottle is worth more than the fluid and so is the dropper. On Jan 9, 2016, at 8:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77290	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Well, I suppose you would use 'analysis' rather than a true experimentation of trial and error.  On the other hand, the chemist had to do a lot of experimentation to come up with an accurate analytical method :-) ! regards, Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 1/11/2016 04:48, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   "Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ." How is sending a sample of original AF smoke fluid to a chemist and getting the exact formula , experimentation?  Sounds like someone has some sour grapes here.Chris Burger. From: "Dennis Donovan rosegirl88@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 9:04 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid   You’re on point here. Gilbert made mass produced items. They did not use a super secret formula for their smoke.  We’ve been making our own for 15 year and using it in customer’s locomotive with all positive comments. In fact, some wanted some to take home. We do it gratis if possible. We never charged. If I pay @1.61 for gasoline, I’m not going to pay $10 for 4 0z. of smoke fluid. The bottle is worth more than the fluid and so is the dropper. On Jan 9, 2016, at 8:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ... This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77291	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Do not see any problem with using measures like 2 parts citrus vodka, 1 part triple sec, 1 part cranberry juice and splash of sweet lime juice to suit. Makes either a cup full or a gallon. All same ratio. Ken Christiansen BHHS, Crosby Starck Real Estate 815-218-3957

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77292	From: Roger Huber	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

I remember my Father and Grandfather using Mineral Oil in our smoke units. Produced a lot of smoke! I'm sure OSHA would disapprove. Roger Huber From: "Ken Christiansen klchris@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 7:37 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF Smoke Fluid   Do not see any problem with using measures like 2 parts citrus vodka, 1 part triple sec, 1 part cranberry juice and splash of sweet lime juice to suit. Makes either a cup full or a gallon. All same ratio. Ken Christiansen BHHS, Crosby Starck Real Estate 815-218-3957

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77293	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

That is very much like saying that turning up the knobs on our transformers and seeing if our trains start to move, is an “experiment”.  Analyzing an unknown in a gas mass-spectrometer is NOT an experiment, neither does science advance by “trial and error”.  A mass spectrometer is basically a machine that heats up a sample of the unknown then detects the component parts as they pass through a long tube.  By looking at how long it takes a component to emerge, a computer analyzes the types and amounts of the component parts of the original sample.  Just follow the instructions.  Again, it is no more an experiment than mixing up a box of cake mix with water, and egg, and some oil, putting it into a pan, putting the pan into a hot oven and seeing if a cake emerges from the oven after a certain number of minutes.   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 5:36 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid     Well, I suppose you would use 'analysis' rather than a true experimentation of trial and error.  On the other hand, the chemist had to do a lot of experimentation to come up with an accurate analytical method :-) ! regards, Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 1/11/2016 04:48, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   "Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ." How is sending a sample of original AF smoke fluid to a chemist and getting the exact formula , experimentation?  Sounds like someone has some sour grapes here.Chris Burger.     From: "Dennis Donovan rosegirl88@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 9:04 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF Smoke Fluid     You’re on point here. Gilbert made mass produced items. They did not use a super secret formula for their smoke.  We’ve been making our own for 15 year and using it in customer’s locomotive with all positive comments. In fact, some wanted some to take home. We do it gratis if possible. We never charged. If I pay @1.61 for gasoline, I’m not going to pay $10 for 4 0z. of smoke fluid. The bottle is worth more than the fluid and so is the dropper.               On Jan 9, 2016, at 8:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...       This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77294	From: tbennerohio	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Carl, The Y-3 smoke unit is a really nice upgrade.  Wick, 38 ga nichrome wire and Stay Brite solder are on their way.  I could not find the 16 ohm resistor on the Lionel parts site so for now will just replace the wicking.  I will feel better about tweaking the resistor knowing I have an original on hand. While working on benchwork yesterday the Berk was inverted in a cradle for a few hours with a paper towel under the stack.  No fluid came out so it was not overfilled.  So I flooded it with 20 drops and got acceptable smoke up to about 10.5 V.  Smokes like crazy from 7-9 V.  So the element is fine and will make smoke as long as it is sitting in a pool of fluid.  Now I am fairly sure the wick is charred and not wicking. Itching to open it up and see the wick.  Or do I send it back for the wobble AND smoke issue. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77295	From: snstrains	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid

I don't know how mike (A Normal 1) came up with his formula, but I do know that many years ago over time he sent me 5 different 1/2 oz. vials of fluid to give my opinion on before he settled on his final product. The first couple had a peculiar kerosene type odor, but he said there were no kerosene products in any of them. I have no idea how many other people contributed to his formula choice, but the final product is excellent. What he has been selling for several years now is very much the same in odor and smokability as the Original Gilbert. I use it and sell it exclusively except for seuth type smoke units which work better with the thin blue LGB type fluids.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77296	From: race944t	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Gilbert AF Parts List and internal diagrams

Question 1: Does anyone know of a searchable database program for original Gilbert Parts?  I have the old Greenberg Numerical Parts listing and it has some generally vague description of the part but I was hoping someone had taken the time to create a searchable database showing a part number and all of its applications.  For instance Greenberg shows PA18770 as "spring" and S-171 as "Screw".  I have taken the time to enter all the part numbers I have in an Excel spreadsheet and can do a "Find" within Excel but there is so much lacking in what I have.  I know various parts dealers have their catalogues I could thumb through but I'm looking for something more than that. Let's say for instance I wanted to find part number PA18770 Pantograph Spring used on the 499 & 21573.  I would like to be able to search on the part number, the description, or the engine numbers and find the specific part.  Does such a reference exist? Also, let's say I'm looking for screw S-171, which has several applications including holding the grease pan on the bottom of many different steam engines.  Is there any existing documentation that describes the screw as slotted, flat head, #4-40 x .25 inches? Question 2: Several years ago there was mention of someone doing a book about the internal wiring & mechanicals of Gilbert accessories.  We probably all have the wiring hookup and operation instructions that have been produced by various publishers, but I'm not aware of any reference guide for someone wanting to restore/repair back to factory specs.  The guide I would like to see would give internal wiring diagrams, wire dimensions, wire type, internal structural diagrams and anything else needed to accurately restore or repair an accessory.  My vision is that such a reference guide would fill in details between Bob Hannon's excellent electrical component book and the general setup and operation sheets widely available.  Any suggestions on Questions 1 & 2 could be answered here or e-mail me directly. Thanks, "Banker" Bill Clark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77297	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

If it were me I would wait and send it back.  Get an RA from Lionel and get it started.   Once the drivers are repaired and it is out of warranty then upgrade the smoke element if needed.   Any high value resistor will work, 10K or more as the form for the hybrid smoke element core. Just use one that is the right physical size.  (1/2 watt?)   When you do take the boiler shell off of the chassis be sure to be careful not to loose the 8 insulating washer on the 4 screws. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:28 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Berkshire smoke   Carl, The Y-3 smoke unit is a really nice upgrade.  Wick, 38 ga nichrome wire and Stay Brite solder are on their way.  I could not find the 16 ohm resistor on the Lionel parts site so for now will just replace the wicking.  I will feel better about tweaking the resistor knowing I have an original on hand. While working on benchwork yesterday the Berk was inverted in a cradle for a few hours with a paper towel under the stack.  No fluid came out so it was not overfilled.  So I flooded it with 20 drops and got acceptable smoke up to about 10.5 V.  Smokes like crazy from 7-9 V.  So the element is fine and will make smoke as long as it is sitting in a pool of fluid.  Now I am fairly sure the wick is charred and not wicking. Itching to open it up and see the wick.  Or do I send it back for the wobble AND smoke issue. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77298	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert AF Parts List and internal diagrams

I am only familiar with the exploded parts reference, utilizing original part numbers and diagrams, afforded free of charge via Hobby Surplus Sales, who bought out the remaining parts inventory of the A.C. Gilbert Co. when they closed shop in 1967.  You should be able to Google them.   Regarding your second question, I believe my friend Tom Barker produced a book within the last 5 years or so that may satisfy Question #2.  I’ve “known” Tom since he published his first Flyer Repair Manual back in the early to mid 70s.  He is a Gilbert repair guru.   Hope this helps.   Bruce R. DeGailler, Sr.   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 11:44 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Gilbert AF Parts List and internal diagrams     Question 1: Does anyone know of a searchable database program for original Gilbert Parts?  I have the old Greenberg Numerical Parts listing and it has some generally vague description of the part but I was hoping someone had taken the time to create a searchable database showing a part number and all of its applications.  For instance Greenberg shows PA18770 as "spring" and S-171 as "Screw".  I have taken the time to enter all the part numbers I have in an Excel spreadsheet and can do a "Find" within Excel but there is so much lacking in what I have.  I know various parts dealers have their catalogues I could thumb through but I'm looking for something more than that. Let's say for instance I wanted to find part number PA18770 Pantograph Spring used on the 499 & 21573.  I would like to be able to search on the part number, the description, or the engine numbers and find the specific part.  Does such a reference exist? Also, let's say I'm looking for screw S-171, which has several applications including holding the grease pan on the bottom of many different steam engines.  Is there any existing documentation that describes the screw as slotted, flat head, #4-40 x .25 inches? Question 2: Several years ago there was mention of someone doing a book about the internal wiring & mechanicals of Gilbert accessories.  We probably all have the wiring hookup and operation instructions that have been produced by various publishers, but I'm not aware of any reference guide for someone wanting to restore/repair back to factory specs.  The guide I would like to see would give internal wiring diagrams, wire dimensions, wire type, internal structural diagrams and anything else needed to accurately restore or repair an accessory.  My vision is that such a reference guide would fill in details between Bob Hannon's excellent electrical component book and the general setup and operation sheets widely available.  Any suggestions on Questions 1 & 2 could be answered here or e-mail me directly. Thanks, "Banker" Bill Clark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77299	From: rick gough	Date: 1/11/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Tim and anyone the Lionel number for the 16OHM resistor is:  691RS16OHM or alt: 691RESCO16.  It's $2.00, of course they'll likely charge $9.95 shipping! FYI  MY Y-3 smokes just fine as is. I did cook the original wick by not keeping it soaked and running high smoke and my local Lionel tech replaced it under warranty. While you have it, USE your warranty, it's money in the bank ..... for 1 year, then it's gone. Rick   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Monday, January 11, 2016 11:43 AM, "carl@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   If it were me I would wait and send it back.  Get an RA from Lionel and get it started.   Once the drivers are repaired and it is out of warranty then upgrade the smoke element if needed.   Any high value resistor will work, 10K or more as the form for the hybrid smoke element core. Just use one that is the right physical size.  (1/2 watt?)   When you do take the boiler shell off of the chassis be sure to be careful not to loose the 8 insulating washer on the 4 screws. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:28 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Berkshire smoke   Carl, The Y-3 smoke unit is a really nice upgrade.  Wick, 38 ga nichrome wire and Stay Brite solder are on their way.  I could not find the 16 ohm resistor on the Lionel parts site so for now will just replace the wicking.  I will feel better about tweaking the resistor knowing I have an original on hand. While working on benchwork yesterday the Berk was inverted in a cradle for a few hours with a paper towel under the stack.  No fluid came out so it was not overfilled.  So I flooded it with 20 drops and got acceptable smoke up to about 10.5 V.  Smokes like crazy from 7-9 V.  So the element is fine and will make smoke as long as it is sitting in a pool of fluid.  Now I am fairly sure the wick is charred and not wicking. Itching to open it up and see the wick.  Or do I send it back for the wobble AND smoke issue. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77300	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: A M reversing board

I am wondering if someone might be able to post a picture and or schematic of the properly wired reversing board as used in the RS-3 locomotive. I have recently acquired one of these locomotives, it runs on ac current but only in one direction. When looking inside of the shell I can see it, the board, has been re-purposed to run only forward. Any help? Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77301	From: trndad	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: A M reversing board

Attachments : Typical Reverse Unit Wiring.jpg Ray, here is what I found on my computer for a typical AM reverse unit wiring diagram.  I believe I got it off the AM website at some point.  Hope it helps. Dean Hall

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77302	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: AF Smoke Fluid

Hi   I sent this to the group back in 2007, and Mike ( A Normal 1 ) as well.   For Those who want to make there own Smoke fluid. I found this formula for American Flyer original smoke fluid in a back issue of  S Gaugian Magazine a fews years ago.   1 Part Cedarwood Oil ( Oil from the wood of Juniperus Virginiana )  and 16 parts Shell Dispersol ( Kerosene Code 8233 )   Since it's mostly kerosene I have used a mixture of lamp oil and RFG's brand of smoke fluid. It seems to work well.   Someone also mentioned WD-40. My observations of the smoke units I have repaired is when the smoke fluid evaporates from long periods of storage it turns to a hard pine sap consistency. In Barkers repair manual he suggests try using a non flammable solvent to dissolve the residue on the wick. I have used WD-40 and it has worked well for cleaning the smoke units.  Some were to far gone and had to be replaced.  But be careful.   Al ____________________________________________________________ Fast, Secure, NetZero 4G Mobile Broadband. Try it.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77303	From: wyoaf	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Automatic Operation of Magnetic Crane

This past weekend, I attended the World's Greatest Hobby Show in Indianapolis, and the Miami Valley S Gaugers had a modular layout up and running.   One of the modules, entitled "the scrapyard" had what appeared to be a 583 Magnetic Crane operating automatically.  It was on a timer of some sort, and periodically would rotate, pick up a load of scrap metal pieces, then rotate back and drop the scrap into a gondola, then stop,and then repeat this automatically about every 45 seconds.    I asked a club member "how do you do that ?"  and he replied that it was a "new" Lionel remake of the 583 and had a microprocessor built into it that prevented it from "turning too far"  when operated.   That feature, coupled with a "PRP Switch" (or something like that) enabled the automatic operation.  I thought that this feature was way cool, and wondered if the Group is familiar with it and can better explain how to set it up.  I have an old A.C. Gilbert 583 Crane that is neat, but not kid-friendly as they can hold the button down and pull the wires out of it inadvertently.  It likely cannot be configured to operate automatically because of the "E Unit" within it, but maybe one of you guys has figured out how to do it.  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77304	From: racin510	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: Automatic Operation of Magnetic Crane

No wonder Lionel wants so much money for that crane! If you want a kid friendly crane, get a Lionel just post war one. They are great, Lionel's best accessory, rotate 360deg. I have 2 along with a 583A, which has a 'NO TRESPASS' sign next to the control! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77305	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Hi Al, Yes this is the formula for ACG Smoke fluid. But it is NOT for the fluid that came in the caps., this came in the bottle. Those of you that tried my first attempts can attest to this. For those of you that want to believe this mixture, go ahead. You can find out for yourself, what I found out. Hence the use of a lab. This is NOT what I use. DO NOT USE Kerosene in your smoke units, the flash point is too low. Yes I also researched the flash point for the different parts of the mixture. I didn't want to sell someone something that would go up in flames & burn your dreams to the ground. This is another reason, to buy from someone that has put the work into finding out what is not only an original product, but a safe one.    I will be posting another reply to the person that started this thread. He seems to like doing it every 2 years or so. I'll thank him here for that as I had a great deal of sales from his post. Not only for my fluid but also for my track cleaning kits. But I also have some questions about his last post. I find it to be a bit untrue.   Mike     In a message dated 1/12/2016 10:55:39 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hi   I sent this to the group back in 2007, and Mike ( A Normal 1 ) as well.   For Those who want to make there own Smoke fluid. I found this formula for American Flyer original smoke fluid in a back issue of  S Gaugian Magazine a fews years ago.   1 Part Cedarwood Oil ( Oil from the wood of Juniperus Virginiana )  and 16 parts Shell Dispersol ( Kerosene Code 8233 )   Since it's mostly kerosene I have used a mixture of lamp oil and RFG's brand of smoke fluid. It seems to work well.   Someone also mentioned WD-40. My observations of the smoke units I have repaired is when the smoke fluid evaporates from long periods of storage it turns to a hard pine sap consistency. In Barkers repair manual he suggests try using a non flammable solvent to dissolve the residue on the wick. I have used WD-40 and it has worked well for cleaning the smoke units.  Some were to far gone and had to be replaced.  But be careful.   Al ____________________________________________________________ Fast, Secure, NetZero 4G Mobile Broadband. Try it.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77306	From: rudypenne	Date: 1/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF Smoke Fluid

Well first off I'd like to know where you buy your ingredients as, I pay over $11 an ounce for the cedar oil alone....The carrier fluid is $25+ a gallon. So if you can get everything needed for under a $1.00 a bottle, I'd like to know where I can buy the same.  I know where you are going with the $1.61 a gal for gas. But when gas prices rose, postage, shipping costs & food costs along with just about everything. Now that the price of gas has dropped, you infer that everything will drop as fast as they rose.  I'm just having trouble believing that you can produce a "Quality" smoke fluid for less than the cost of the bottle & the dropper. I'm sure you would not make such a statement without the proof to back it up.  I don't know why you bring this up almost every 2 years & I seem to be a target of your postings. What have I ever done to you?Or is it just envy, that I put the work into something that has now become successful?   In a message dated 1/10/2016 6:57:20 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   You’re on point here. Gilbert made mass produced items. They did not use a super secret formula for their smoke.  We’ve been making our own for 15 year and using it in customer’s locomotive with all positive comments. In fact, some wanted some to take home. We do it gratis if possible. We never charged. If I pay @1.61 for gasoline, I’m not going to pay $10 for 4 0z. of smoke fluid. The bottle is worth more than the fluid and so is the dropper. On Jan 9, 2016, at 8:22 PM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Its My Big Fingers on the wrong key ....Its 97 % Kero    -- 3% cedar wood oil.... and Anormals  is NOT original it is of his own making though experimentation ...Good on him ...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77307	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: A M reversing board

Dean, Thank you so much for this reference, I will try to set board back the way it should be, again, thank you. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77308	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Smoke Fluid

rudypenne Iam not trying to state argument on the list. My point about the original Gilbert was for information only. I never bought ingredients to make my own smoke fluid. I know Mike ( A Normal 1 ) spent a lot of time on his Smoke Fluid. He sent me and others his samples 1-5 to test. I applaud Mikes for all his efforts , and he was gracious enough to send me a bottle of his final type 4. Lets be real here when Gilbert made the smoke fluid when there was no Ossa or other agencys to test this stuff. Even today Lionel smoke fluid that is included in Flyer engines has a waring that it contains a petroleum product. I have tried others but I use Mike's and Barts pneumatics which has been around for quite a while. I think Doug Pecks sells it. Al ____________________________________________________________ NetZero now offers 4G mobile broadband. Sign up now. http://www.netzero.net/?refcd=NZINTISP0512T4GOUT1

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77309	From: trndad	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Thought I'd share my experience with my PE set and Southern Berkshire.  I got the PE set in late September and set it up around the Christmas tree (yes, the tree was already up - a long story).  It ran well and everything worked except the smoke output was barely visible.   As some have described it on this forum, it took a few minutes of running to start smoking, and did better at slower speeds, but even then it was hard to see the smoke.  But my grandson was having such a good time with it that I decided not to send it back for repair until after Christmas.   I called Lionel the week after Christmas and they gave me an RA number and said to pack the engine and tender along with the controller and send it back.  In about a week I got a message that it was already on its way back to me with a new smoke unit.  I got it back last week and, as it turns out, the Southern Berkshire I had ordered arrived as well.  So, last night I set up the track again to test them both.   I tried the PE first. It took a couple minutes to start smoking and, after adding 8 drops of fluid, continued to smoke reasonably well at slow to moderate speeds.  It was a definite improvement, but still a bit difficult to see smoke at full speed. It may get better if run longer, but it was set up in the den and my wife was annoyed that I was interrupting her show, so I had to keep the run time short.   Next I tried out the Southern Berkshire. I added 8-10 drops of fluid and ran it at various speeds. The smoke behavior mirrored that of the PE's, but was perhaps a bit less in volume.  Assuming the right hand coupler button on the control is the only coupler button that is supposed to work, all items functioned as they should.  Again I didn't get to run it but for a minute or two, so I am hoping the smoke output will improve a bit as it gets hotter.   I powered these in remote mode using an AF 15B 110 watt transformer. I am pleased with these locomotives, and hope they give many years of service, but as soon as the warranty expires and they break down, like Carl I'll probably install an ERR TMCC board and sound card.   Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77310	From: Dennis Donovan	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

On Jan 13, 2016, at 10:00 AM, Allan V Eisenhaur aleisen@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: rudypenne Iam not trying to state argument on the list. My point about the original Gilbert was for information only.  I never bought ingredients to make my own smoke fluid. I know Mike ( A Normal 1 ) spent a lot of time  on his Smoke Fluid. He sent me and others his samples 1-5 to test. I applaud Mikes for all his efforts ,  and he was gracious enough to send me a bottle of his final type 4. Lets be real here when Gilbert made the  smoke fluid when there was no Ossa or other agencys to test this stuff.  Even today Lionel smoke fluid that is  included in Flyer engines has a waring that it contains a petroleum product. I have tried others but I use Mike's  and Barts pneumatics which has been around for quite a while. I think Doug Pecks sells it. Al _ There is no argument here. This is how an open forum works. We have found out, through various contributors to the topic, good information. There is one simple base stock. To it is added cedar oil. One product used a trial and error approach to get a specific result. As far as I know, all fluids come labeled as flammable. None claim any government of outside certification. None claim to be F.D.N.Y. or L.A.F.D. approved.  It is simple stuff to make from ingredients readily available.  There is a similar situation with the Lionel folks. The myth states the original smoke pellet formula is missing and cannot be duplicated . I’ve heard this from many local Lionel Club members and operators. When I tune-up a Lionel steamer or rebuild it’s smoke box, I don’t use pellets. A couple of drops of fluid does the trick, and no residue is left. But that’s different discussion for another forum.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77311	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/13/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

I have learned a lot from this thread.   I think they are all basically petroleum derivatives, but there is a big difference in them.  In the article I cited, there is a distinction between "flammable" (flash point under 100) and "combustible," (flash point 100-200) which is an important difference.   Bart's Pneumatics lists the flash point of his fluid as 370.   While Mike hasn't stated what the flash point of his is, I am sure it is equally high.  Even if home mixed fluids seem to work, there is the issue of consistency between batches.   How do you know that the next bottle of mineral oil you buy at the drugstore will be the same viscosity and chemical make up as the last.   Smoke units are not a use for which mineral oil is marketed and the manufacturers are not under any obligation of disclosure when they change their product in ways not relevant to the marketed use. Actually the best thing I learned from this thread is the extensive research Mike put into the manufacture of his fluid.   Use of a mass spectrometer is not just guess work, but solid science.  I plan to use something I can count on in my trains, which regardless of their cost are important to me.   I will probably be placing my order with Mike when I can get my train board back up and running. Dale Smith On 1/13/2016 2:23 PM, Dennis Donovan rosegirl88@... [S-Trains] wrote:   On Jan 13, 2016, at 10:00 AM, Allan V Eisenhaur aleisen@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: rudypenne Iam not trying to state argument on the list. My point about the original Gilbert was for information only.  I never bought ingredients to make my own smoke fluid. I know Mike ( A Normal 1 ) spent a lot of time  on his Smoke Fluid. He sent me and others his samples 1-5 to test. I applaud Mikes for all his efforts ,  and he was gracious enough to send me a bottle of his final type 4. Lets be real here when Gilbert made the  smoke fluid when there was no Ossa or other agencys to test this stuff.  Even today Lionel smoke fluid that is  included in Flyer engines has a waring that it contains a petroleum product. I have tried others but I use Mike's  and Barts pneumatics which has been around for quite a while. I think Doug Pecks sells it. Al _ There is no argument here. This is how an open forum works. We have found out, through various contributors to the topic, good information. There is one simple base stock. To it is added cedar oil. One product used a trial and error approach to get a specific result. As far as I know, all fluids come labeled as flammable. None claim any government of outside certification. None claim to be F.D.N.Y. or L.A.F.D. approved.  It is simple stuff to make from ingredients readily available.  There is a similar situation with the Lionel folks. The myth states the original smoke pellet formula is missing and cannot be duplicated . I’ve heard this from many local Lionel Club members and operators. When I tune-up a Lionel steamer or rebuild it’s smoke box, I don’t use pellets. A couple of drops of fluid does the trick, and no residue is left. But that’s different discussion for another forum.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77312	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Dean, If your AF 15B only puts out 15 volts that may explain your smoke output situation. The manual states 18 volts AC or DC. Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77313	From: racin510	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

Lionel includes smoke fluid with their new AF locomotives? That's news to me !!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77314	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

Speaking of Bart's Pneumatics years ago I had a great A gauge video produced by them does anyone have it? I would like to get another copy as mine was lost when I moved. Thanks Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 7:49 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have learned a lot from this thread.   I think they are all basically petroleum derivatives, but there is a big difference in them.  In the article I cited, there is a distinction between "flammable" (flash point under 100) and "combustible," (flash point 100-200) which is an important difference.   Bart's Pneumatics lists the flash point of his fluid as 370.   While Mike hasn't stated what the flash point of his is, I am sure it is equally high.  Even if home mixed fluids seem to work, there is the issue of consistency between batches.   How do you know that the next bottle of mineral oil you buy at the drugstore will be the same viscosity and chemical make up as the last.   Smoke units are not a use for which mineral oil is marketed and the manufacturers are not under any obligation of disclosure when they change their product in ways not relevant to the marketed use. Actually the best thing I learned from this thread is the extensive research Mike put into the manufacture of his fluid.   Use of a mass spectrometer is not just guess work, but solid science.  I plan to use something I can count on in my trains, which regardless of their cost are important to me.   I will probably be placing my order with Mike when I can get my train board back up and running. Dale Smith On 1/13/2016 2:23 PM, Dennis Donovan rosegirl88@... [S-Trains] wrote:   On Jan 13, 2016, at 10:00 AM, Allan V Eisenhaur aleisen@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: rudypenne Iam not trying to state argument on the list. My point about the original Gilbert was for information only.  I never bought ingredients to make my own smoke fluid. I know Mike ( A Normal 1 ) spent a lot of time  on his Smoke Fluid. He sent me and others his samples 1-5 to test. I applaud Mikes for all his efforts ,  and he was gracious enough to send me a bottle of his final type 4. Lets be real here when Gilbert made the  smoke fluid when there was no Ossa or other agencys to test this stuff.  Even today Lionel smoke fluid that is  included in Flyer engines has a waring that it contains a petroleum product. I have tried others but I use Mike's  and Barts pneumatics which has been around for quite a while. I think Doug Pecks sells it. Al _ There is no argument here. This is how an open forum works. We have found out, through various contributors to the topic, good information. There is one simple base stock. To it is added cedar oil. One product used a trial and error approach to get a specific result. As far as I know, all fluids come labeled as flammable. None claim any government of outside certification. None claim to be F.D.N.Y. or L.A.F.D. approved.  It is simple stuff to make from ingredients readily available.  There is a similar situation with the Lionel folks. The myth states the original smoke pellet formula is missing and cannot be duplicated . I’ve heard this from many local Lionel Club members and operators. When I tune-up a Lionel steamer or rebuild it’s smoke box, I don’t use pellets. A couple of drops of fluid does the trick, and no residue is left. But that’s different discussion for another forum.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77315	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

Sorry i meant to say s gauge video it was at least 2 hours long, maybe longer Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 11:32 PM, Richard Falzini rfalzini@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Speaking of Bart's Pneumatics years ago I had a great A gauge video produced by them does anyone have it? I would like to get another copy as mine was lost when I moved. Thanks Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77316	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Smoke Fluid

Sorry i meant to say s gauge video it was at least 2 hours long, maybe longer Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 11:32 PM, Richard Falzini rfalzini@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Speaking of Bart's Pneumatics years ago I had a great A gauge video produced by them does anyone have it? I would like to get another copy as mine was lost when I moved. Thanks Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android   I have learned a lot from this thread.   I think they are all basically petroleum derivatives, but there is a big difference in them.  In the article I cited, there is a distinction between "flammable" (flash point under 100) and "combustible," (flash point 100-200) which is an important difference.   Bart's Pneumatics lists the flash point of his fluid as 370.   While Mike hasn't stated what the flash point of his is, I am sure it is equally high.  Even if home mixed fluids seem to work, there is the issue of consistency between batches.   How do you know that the next bottle of mineral oil you buy at the drugstore will be the same viscosity and chemical make up as the last.   Smoke units are not a use for which mineral oil is marketed and the manufacturers are not under any obligation of disclosure when they change their product in ways not relevant to the marketed use. Actually the best thing I learned from this thread is the extensive research Mike put into the manufacture of his fluid.   Use of a mass spectrometer is not just guess work, but solid science.  I plan to use something I can count on in my trains, which regardless of their cost are important to me.   I will probably be placing my order with Mike when I can get my train board back up and running. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77317	From: trndad	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

You may be correct.  I'll reconnect up my 6-81603 72-watt wall wart and see if they preform any better using it.  It is rated at 18 volts output.  It's what I was using before I shipped the PE to Lionel for repair.  I'll post back with the results. Dean

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77318	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 1/14/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

I don't have many modern Flyonel engines, but the ones I do have perform much better using the Lionel CW-80 transformers.  I've got three CW-80's for track-only conventional operation.  Even my little Docksiders smoke well.  I use my old Flyer transformers to power accessories. Jim Ensign From: "trndad@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 11:19:23 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire smoke   You may be correct.  I'll reconnect up my 6-81603 72-watt wall wart and see if they preform any better using it.  It is rated at 18 volts output.  It's what I was using before I shipped the PE to Lionel for repair.  I'll post back with the results. Dean

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77319	From: trndad	Date: 1/15/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Attachments : Southern Berkshire.jpg Well, I have to say I am pleased with the volume of smoke output on these two engines.  Last night I was able to spend more than a minute running the Southern Berkshire.  First, using the 15B, I ran it at a slow speed, and after 2-3 minutes it was smoking profusely.  It smoked well at all speeds.  I then switched to the 72 watt wall wart and the performance was equally as good.  I snapped a picture in which I tried to show the engine’s smoke output after a couple of minutes (I stopped it after another minute or so for fear of setting off a smoke alarm, although I’m not sure that toy train smoke would do that).   If you are interested, I am using JT's Mega Steam Peppermint Pattycake scented smoke fluid. My wife is bothered by most smoke formulas, but for some reason this brand of "flavored" ones doesn't bother her.  In fact she enjoys the scent.    Looking forward to getting a permanent layout started.   Dean Hall

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77320	From: Eric	Date: 1/15/2016
Subject: For Sale: Pine Canyon Fire Station

Attachments : For Sale january 2016.docx For Sale  January 2016…..I found another item hiding in a cabinet to sell. These have been long listed as out of stock. Pine canyon Kit #602  -    New, never out of the Box. Canyon  County Firehouse station number 2 Low Relief  (Meaning that the depth  [front to back] is about  1/2  that of what full size would be). Fits a medium Flat rate USPS Shipping box. ($ 12.65) First $100 plus shipping can have it………Make an offer off list. > Eric Reis EricRhere@... > Kenmore Wa. 98028 > NASG since 86, TCA since 87,  Ebay since 99 (over  1100 positives) > > Paypal, Postal Money orders, Checks (held to clear) all work It should look something like this without the engines.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77321	From: David Highfield	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

I ran my NPR Berkshire for a longer time yesterday with a long consist. I was pleased with the smoke and delighted with the slow speed sensitivity off of the Lionel remote. I still haven't quite figured out the rear coupler release and how to release it on the first try. It seems the toggle blows the whistle no matter which way I push it. Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77322	From: butch8339@atlanticbb.net	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: smoke fluid

I use jt's fluid and it seems to work well with my pe

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77323	From: carl4flyer	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Double click the button From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 8:38 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire smoke   I ran my NPR Berkshire for a longer time yesterday with a long consist. I was pleased with the smoke and delighted with the slow speed sensitivity off of the Lionel remote. I still haven't quite figured out the rear coupler release and how to release it on the first try. It seems the toggle blows the whistle no matter which way I push it. Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77324	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77325	From: Don Abrams	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

Lubricate the coupler! Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77326	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77327	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 1/17/2016
Subject: Re: Berkshire smoke

From: Alan Lambert          Fort Worth, Texas   Don, And remind everyone to Double click the horn button for the uncoupler to work. Read in the owners manual. It is covered.    Alan From: "Don Abrams donabrams@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2016 9:19 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Berkshire smoke   Lubricate the coupler! Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77328	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

So how do we power them? Been waiting for a review. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77329	From: wema103	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: cti electronics review?

I was wondering if anyone had experience with cti electronics (http://www.cti-electronics.com/index.htm) and their system? It looks great for someone who doesn't want to convert all the locos to DCC (like me). Thanks for the help in advance!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77330	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/18/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

The remote Turnouts are for use with Legacy control I believe and thus the cost difference. MTH /SHS turnouts are still available used and much cheaper Chris Burger From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 18, 2016 6:05 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.   So how do we power them? Been waiting for a review. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77331	From: tennsgauger	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

I have no interest in the new AF turnouts but it is good for the hobby that they finally are making them available.  And I like the idea of being able to control the turnouts automatically through a digital system, though I have no experience with Legacy.   Can anyone share their experience operating the new turnouts?  Are they durable?  Does rolling stock go through the turnouts smoothly without derailments?  Are they easy to control through Legacy?     -  Earl Henry, Nashville       In a message dated 1/18/2016 10:59:50 P.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   The remote Turnouts are for use with Legacy control I believe and thus the cost difference. MTH /SHS turnouts are still available used and much cheaper Chris Burger [Unable to display image] From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 18, 2016 6:05 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.   So how do we power them? Been waiting for a review. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77332	From: Jonathan Hatfield	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

If they are like the O scale versions they are powered from the track normally but can be powered separately if desired. Set the ID and the throw them from Legacy or TMCC. Super easy. Beats installing switch machines or running wires IMHO. Jonathan Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77333	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

Anyone know if they are they only the #3+ turnouts, or do they have some #5+ coming down the pike? Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 1/19/2016 17:55, tennsgauge@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I have no interest in the new AF turnouts but it is good for the hobby that they finally are making them available.  And I like the idea of being able to control the turnouts automatically through a digital system, though I have no experience with Legacy.   Can anyone share their experience operating the new turnouts?  Are they durable?  Does rolling stock go through the turnouts smoothly without derailments?  Are they easy to control through Legacy?     -  Earl Henry, Nashville     This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77334	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 1/19/2016
Subject: Re: AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.

Jim,    Are you talking about powering the rails or making them remote control like scale turnouts? I have no experience with them but it would seem to me that you should be able to make them remote control much the same as you would scale turnouts.                                               Bob Lampe                                               Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2016 23:05:25 +0000 Subject: [S-Trains] AF powered turnuts cost twice as much as manual ones.   So how do we power them? Been waiting for a review. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77335	From: Ray Puls	Date: 1/20/2016
Subject: AF powered turnouts cost twice as much as manual ones.

The new turnouts, I do not have but I use the original Gilbert switches on my Legacy powered layout, of course my track also is original Gilbert. I would believe that the manual turnouts could be powered as scale turnouts are and be operated from the hand held remote of the Legacy system. I do this on my Gilbert switches through the use of the Lionel SC-2. These SC-2s can also be utilized to power operating accessories from the Legacy remote. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77336	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/20/2016
Subject: Nice photo

I like the nice photo at the top of the page.  While the standard "S Trains" group photo is traditional, I like the thinking of photos changing from time to time too.  Could this shot have been taken on Carl's railroad? Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77337	From: trndad	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog

I see the new Lionel 2016 American Flyer catalog is on the Lionel website: http://catalogs.lionel.com/16af/ I see a Flyerchief Northern and a Flyerchief docksider among several new items.  Check it out! Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77338	From: Roy Inman	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog

My LHD, Fred’s Train Shop in Overland Park, has the Water Tower With Shed and it is very nicely done indeed. Much more impressive than in the photo. The weathering is pretty cool :) Roy Inman on 1/21/16, 8:25 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           I see the new Lionel 2016 American Flyer catalog is on the Lionel website: http://catalogs.lionel.com/16af/ I see a Flyerchief Northern and a Flyerchief docksider among several new items.  Check it out! Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77339	From: gartrain404	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Today is a sad day. It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that my friend Jim Lyle, the founder and inspiration of the Pequea Valley Model Railroaders, passed away January 20, 2016 at 9:00 pm in the Wilmington Veterans Hospital.   Glenn Ritter

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77340	From: calleytwo	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Sad day! My condolences to his family and close friends. Alistair McAllister  ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Cc: Sent: Thu, 21 Jan 2016 13:37:46 -0500 Subject: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Today is a sad day. It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that my friend Jim Lyle, the founder and inspiration of the Pequea Valley Model Railroaders, passed away January 20, 2016 at 9:00 pm in the Wilmington Veterans Hospital.   Glenn Ritter

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77341	From: William Lewis	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Oh how sad. My condolences to his family. He was a great guy.  Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "alizoo@... [S-Trains]" Date:01/21/2016 1:23 PM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Sad day! My condolences to his family and close friends. Alistair McAllister  ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Cc: Sent: Thu, 21 Jan 2016 13:37:46 -0500 Subject: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Today is a sad day. It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that my friend Jim Lyle, the founder and inspiration of the Pequea Valley Model Railroaders, passed away January 20, 2016 at 9:00 pm in the Wilmington Veterans Hospital.   Glenn Ritter

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77342	From: snstrains	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Condolences to Family and associates from S-'n-S Trains   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/21/2016 1:19:18 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Sad day! My condolences to his family and close friends. Alistair McAllister  ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Cc: Sent: Thu, 21 Jan 2016 13:37:46 -0500 Subject: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Today is a sad day. It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that my friend Jim Lyle, the founder and inspiration of the Pequea Valley Model Railroaders, passed away January 20, 2016 at 9:00 pm in the Wilmington Veterans Hospital.   Glenn Ritter

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77343	From: racin510	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog

Nice they are back out with the Northern. Easily updated to Flyer Chief, for another $200. over the Berk who knows maybe the firebox will get lit. Is that Universal [3 engine] remote real or just for Lion Chief?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77344	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

My condolences to family and friends. Jim Ensign From: "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2016 3:07:54 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Condolences to Family and associates from S-'n-S Trains   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/21/2016 1:19:18 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Sad day! My condolences to his family and close friends. Alistair McAllister  ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Cc: Sent: Thu, 21 Jan 2016 13:37:46 -0500 Subject: [S-Trains] JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY   Today is a sad day. It is with a heavy heart that I must inform you that my friend Jim Lyle, the founder and inspiration of the Pequea Valley Model Railroaders, passed away January 20, 2016 at 9:00 pm in the Wilmington Veterans Hospital.   Glenn Ritter

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77345	From: poniaj	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 AF Catalog

Attachments : lionel.JPG As far as what Lionel says on their site and in catalogs, the "universal" three engine remote is for either LionChief or FlyerChief.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77346	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/21/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

My condolences as well. I never had the opportunity to meet him like i would like to meet all of you here. Unfortunately that was not to be. R.I.P. Jim                                                     Bob Lampe                                                     Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77347	From: Milo Rodriguez	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Sadly he will be missed,...may he rest in Peace Best Regards, Thanks            Milo

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77348	From: Milo Rodriguez	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: [showcaseline] Jim Lyle

Sadly he will be missed,...may he rest in Peace Best Regards, Thanks            Milo  On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 12:39 PM, Don Thompson don@... [showcaseline] <showcaseline-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I just saw this on FB, Jim Lyle passed away last evening. Jim used to help us (SHS) with our semi annual York presentations at the TCA museum. He will be missed. Don Thompson ---------- Sent from my iPhone [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77349	From: traindavid	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY from Glenn Ritter

Glenn, Our condolences to you, Jim's family & the club. We have lost a real icon in our hobby. The names I've known in S since my High School days are leaving us, but they leave us with quite a legacy to live up to and pass on. S'incerely, David & Linda Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77350	From: Dale Smith	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: JIM LYLE PASSED AWAY

Jim was a great source of historical information.  He gave me great information concerning the location of the Boys Railroad Club Layout for my website.   He will certainly be missed. Dale Smith On 1/22/2016 4:31 AM, Milo Rodriguez milorod@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Sadly he will be missed,...may he rest in Peace Best Regards, Thanks            Milo

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77351	From: scaler164	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: New 1/64 Items

A couple of neat, new items here :    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL29832    - http://diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL32050-C     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77352	From: scaler164	Date: 1/22/2016
Subject: Re: [S Scale Model Railroading] New 1/64 Items

Try these links as well :    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/catalogscale.asp?Scale=64&Type=B    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/catalogscale.asp?Scale=64&Type=F   John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77353	From: racin510	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: Re: New 1/64 Items

Really neat but why didn't they make a passenger bus!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77354	From: snstrains	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)

I have a lot of tires removed from worn out wheel hubs of different flange sizes. Anybody need a few they are $1 each.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/22/2016 5:14:44 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   A couple of neat, new items here :    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL29832    - http://diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL32050-C     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77355	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 24 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77356	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: The sixth floor

I sent in my registration for the Spring S Spree at Strongsville, Ohio yesterday.  Having gotten that taken care of, the wife also called for reservations at the headquarters Holiday Inn Express and found out that the showroom is on the sixth floor!  Kind of "upside down" from most venues, so being "sensitive" to heights, I'd better not look out the windows! If this Spree is like most of the others we've been to in the past ten years, there probably won't be a lot of time for that anyway.  We have a new layout to replace the rather boring one we've used in recent years, but it's an experimental deal.  I used all refurbished American Flyer Pike Master track from the early sixties.   This required some research and a lot of brainstorming to figure out, but the track looks pretty darn good, not obvious toy track as the standard Flyer track does.  I learned some tricks to using it, and I might do another layout with it in the future.  I might bring a few items for sale to help "pay the freight" to attend this event too. Can't wait for the second weekend of May! Stumpy Stone in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77357	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)

Hi Steve, I could use a few. Maybe 4 should work. Want me to send payment through paypal friends and family so you don't get charged fee's? CHris From: "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2016 7:03 PM Subject: [S-Trains] American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)   I have a lot of tires removed from worn out wheel hubs of different flange sizes. Anybody need a few they are $1 each.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/22/2016 5:14:44 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   A couple of neat, new items here :    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL29832    - http://diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL32050-C     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77358	From: snstrains	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: Re: The sixth floor

Me either, I'll be going over to the Oregon coast.   Steve B   In a message dated 1/23/2016 6:53:03 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes: Can't wait for the second weekend of May! Stumpy Stone in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77359	From: snstrains	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)

Email me direct Chris.... snstrains@...   In a message dated 1/23/2016 8:41:51 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hi Steve, I could use a few. Maybe 4 should work. Want me to send payment through paypal friends and family so you don't get charged fee's? CHris From: "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2016 7:03 PM Subject: [S-Trains] American Flyer Steamer wheel tires (rims)   I have a lot of tires removed from worn out wheel hubs of different flange sizes. Anybody need a few they are $1 each.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/22/2016 5:14:44 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   A couple of neat, new items here :    - http://www.diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL29832    - http://diecastdirect.com/asp_modules/add_item.asp?ProductCode=GL32050-C     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77360	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 24 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77361	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Using my Ring wireless controler for turnouts.

Ring Engineering RailPro Software               Ring Engineering RailPro Software Click Cart to Checkout RailPro Assistant Software View on www.ringengineering.com Preview by Yahoo   Looks like I will buy Manual AF turnouts and power them.  My cost will be $20 plus motor costs which will be less then the $60 cost to buy AF powered switches. I can use Ring sounds units on DC S engines that are 1 AMP and not metal. Funny that the new AF sound systems are radio control like the Ring system.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77362	From: scaler164	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: !!! HEADS UP on PRS (and GC?) Parts !!!

Just in cast anyone out there is interested... I just got the following statement from Felix Verser about his current stock level of S scale Pacific Rail Shops parts, etc...        "... most of my extra parts are about gone, couple more months and I'll no longer be selling any S items."   (This statement may or may not include his Gold Coast line of detail parts... I didn't think to ask about that line.)   So there you have it.  If you have any plans to pick up some PRS parts from him via ebay or otherwise, now would be the time to stop putting it off.   The links below should take you to his current FOR SALE list on ebay : (copy and paste it if the link is not 'hyper')        http://www.ebay.com/sch/gabbysuz/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=        http://stores.ebay.com/railwayworld/     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77363	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Using my Ring wireless controler for turnouts.

Hi Jim: I would be interested in finding out what and how you will motorize the switches.  Might as well save money! thanks Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 1/25/2016 06:02, JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ring Engineering RailPro Software               Ring Engineering RailPro Software Click Cart to Checkout RailPro Assistant Software View on www.ringengineering.com Preview by Yahoo   Looks like I will buy Manual AF turnouts and power them.  My cost will be $20 plus motor costs which will be less then the $60 cost to buy AF powered switches. I can use Ring sounds units on DC S engines that are 1 AMP and not metal. Funny that the new AF sound systems are radio control like the Ring system. This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77364	From: trndad	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Mystery Reefers

Attachments : Hersheys 1000 Reefer.jpg CN205800 Reefer.jpg I was hoping someone could help me identify these two reefers.  Both are obviously original Gilbert Pikemaster that have been repainted.  The lettering is not waterslide decals, nor do they appear to be dry transfers.  Instead they appear to me to be screen printed.   The first is a Canadian National plug door reefer numbered 205300 (or possibly 205800). The lettering is black. There are only one or two tiny spots in the silver paint where the base color is showing.  That appears to be orange.   The second one is a Hershey’s plug door reefer numbered 1000. The lettering is silver. There are several scratches where the base green color is showing through the brown paint.   I'm guessing these were produced by Hobby Surplus Sales.  They still offer original unused custom decorated reefer bodies with reproduction Pikemaster or reproduction knuckle coupler trucks.  I know they have doing this for many years.  Anyone out there have one of these?    Dean Hall

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77365	From: Roger Young	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]

I believe they are Kris Model Trains.  You can find more info here with pictures  Gallery :: KRIS MODEL TRAINS - S GAUGE PRODUCTON               Gallery :: KRIS MODEL TRAINS - S GAUGE PRODUCTON View on myflyertrains.org Preview by Yahoo   thanks Roger Young On Monday, January 25, 2016 12:08 PM, "trndad@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I was hoping someone could help me identify these two reefers.  Both are obviously original Gilbert Pikemaster that have been repainted.  The lettering is not waterslide decals, nor do they appear to be dry transfers.  Instead they appear to me to be screen printed.   The first is a Canadian National plug door reefer numbered 205300 (or possibly 205800). The lettering is black. There are only one or two tiny spots in the silver paint where the base color is showing.  That appears to be orange.   The second one is a Hershey’s plug door reefer numbered 1000. The lettering is silver. There are several scratches where the base green color is showing through the brown paint.   I'm guessing these were produced by Hobby Surplus Sales.  They still offer original unused custom decorated reefer bodies with reproduction Pikemaster or reproduction knuckle coupler trucks.  I know they have doing this for many years.  Anyone out there have one of these?    Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77366	From: trndad	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]

Perfect!  Thanks Roger!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77367	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 1/25/2016
Subject: Model 1277 Transformer

I have a Model 1277 American Flyer Transformer. It has an A and a B Post with a range of 6.5 V to 10 V .  I do not know if this output is AC or DC. Input is 100 -120 volts.  Here is where I get confused  "25 - 40 cycles Alternating Current Only" as stated on the top of transformer. Cord looks good, but I have not plugged it in because of the "25-40 cycles". Looks like new except for the dust.  Any information, please share, any interest  let me know as I will not use it. Wayne ( zebbie61354@... )

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77368	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: February/March 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ S Scale News Working With Glass What's on Your Workbench Kit Bashing An Unusual Gondola Some Layout Ideas with Roy Meissner Adding Heap Shields to Your Hopper Fleet Shows, Meets and Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77369	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} ONE DOWN!!! But Still One To Go... [2 Attachments

To members of both groups: In response to the request below, I checked my 20 or so PRS kits that I have.  Unfortunately, no Seaboard boxcars.  However, I do have two PRR box cars that might be of interest to one of the people in the Seaboard contest (or any others on the lists).  They are: PRS B515 50' PRR single door boxcar (built), and PRS Special South Jersey S-Scalers PRR Automobile carrier, 40' double door (kit). Please contact me off list for these and other PRS, AM, or SHS freight cars in which you might be interested.  I could send a list of those cars that might be available. regards Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) On 1/24/2016 16:43, Scaler164@... [S-Scale] wrote:   The earliest of my posts that I can find record of on the various S scale groups was on Wed, December 5th of 2001.  That post, however, was a reply to an earlier post, so I must have made earlier posts.  My point is this - I've been in S scale for at LEAST 15 years.  That is relevant to point out, because, during nearly all of that time, I have been unsuccessfully hunting two, specific Pacific Rail Shops (PRS) models :          B354.1  --- 40' Double Door Box Car - Seaboard # 23307          B354.2  --- 40' Double Door Box Car - Seaboard # 23312   Early on I was able to find  the following two :          B354.3  --- 40' Double Door Box Car - Seaboard # 23315          B354.4  --- 40' Double Door Box Car - Seaboard # 23318   This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77370	From: rj4010d	Date: 1/26/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} ONE DOWN!!! But Still One To Go... [2 Attachments

I have 3 PRS 3 bay covered grain hoppers NIB . Contact me off list if you are interested. 2 undec & 1 is L& N.  bjg@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77371	From: Roy Inman	Date: 1/27/2016
Subject: Big Boy

Have a mint, never-opened-in-the-original-shipping-carton Lionel American Flyer Big Boy for sale. Please contact me off list if interested. Roy Inman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77372	From: michael Cantu	Date: 1/28/2016
Subject: American Flyer Lionel 42570 Set

Looking for American Flyer Lionel 42570 Set Delaware and Hudson alcos to buy if anyone has one to buy. I have paypal. Let me know. Mike Cantu Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77373	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 1/28/2016
Subject: Re: Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]

Hi Yes Hobby Surplus / Amatos has many of the unprinted reefer car and hopper car body’s and bases I don’t think they did these two they did ACE reefer car and several others there are several company’s who do screen painting LBR was one of them you might want to call them if they answer to see if they did them good luck Stan   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, January 25, 2016 12:02 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Mystery Reefers [2 Attachments]     I was hoping someone could help me identify these two reefers.  Both are obviously original Gilbert Pikemaster that have been repainted.  The lettering is not waterslide decals, nor do they appear to be dry transfers.  Instead they appear to me to be screen printed.   The first is a Canadian National plug door reefer numbered 205300 (or possibly 205800). The lettering is black. There are only one or two tiny spots in the silver paint where the base color is showing.  That appears to be orange.   The second one is a Hershey’s plug door reefer numbered 1000. The lettering is silver. There are several scratches where the base green color is showing through the brown paint.   I'm guessing these were produced by Hobby Surplus Sales.  They still offer original unused custom decorated reefer bodies with reproduction Pikemaster or reproduction knuckle coupler trucks.  I know they have doing this for many years.  Anyone out there have one of these?    Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77374	From: Richard Hosmer	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize. I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins. Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down. Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on? Thanks, Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos  at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/    VISIT YOUR GROUP  New Members 1  New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77375	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

Dick,   The condition of the economy certainly has an affect on values.  All you have to do is look at the latest Greenberg guide, published in 2014 for prices being garnered by sellers in 2013, when the economy was in the toilet, many people were unemployed, and the priority shifted from buying trains to paying bills and putting food on the table.  However, the depressed economy was and is temporary.  My theory has always been that the more direct affect on values results as more and more collectors of these older Pre-War trains operated in their youth pass away, demand diminishes.  As demand diminishes, values decrease.  I believe that’s it in a nutshell.   Bruce     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Current train pricing     This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize. I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins. Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down. Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on?   Thanks,   Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos  at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/    VISIT YOUR GROUP  New Members 1  New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77376	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 1/29/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

I have found that after ebay came along many of the items that were considered rare may not be so rare. I have been collecting for over 40 years and find the market still firm. Sure you are not getting those 80s prices but Flyer is still holding better then Lionel. Mark -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 1/29/16, Richard Hosmer richardahosmer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Current train pricing To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, January 29, 2016, 3:39 PM This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize.I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins.Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down.Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on? Thanks, Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77377	From: David Highfield	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

Regarding current train pricing, Bruce is correct. Consider that wages have generally not increased to meet the rising costs of health care, food, and education, Social Security payments have not increased for 2016, and the stock market is in correction territory, disposable cash for boys and our toys is limited. Further, I suspect we'll see a glut of model trains of all types on the market at estate sales, etc. unless there is a resurgence of passion for collecting and operating model trains by our children and grandchildren. Therefore... run 'em and enjoy 'em while we can because we can't take 'em with us! Dave Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77378	From: snstrains	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

The S Scale Flyer is down a lot too in the past couple of years.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 1/29/2016 5:14:08 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize. I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins. Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down. Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on? Thanks, Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos  at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/    VISIT YOUR GROUP  New Members 1  New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77379	From: Bob Groh	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

I certainly second David Highfield's comments - run them and enjoy them!!!  I have never considered my trains (yeah, I have way too many of them) as a 'collectable'. They are fun and I enjoy them.  Bob Groh Blue Springs, MIssouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77380	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

Sadly, a lot of train collectors have died off, are dying off, or are getting old and selling off their collections. While there  are young people coming into the hobby, there probably are not as many as are leaving it. The trains the young people (and even older people) are interested in are usually much newer. While the old trains have their charm, the new ones are generally much better.   Ebay and the internet certainly made the availability of trains much easier. If you miss something, it WILL show up again, unless it really is one of a kind. With less scarcity, I have noticed prices going down, although I am not around the collectors arena very often.   There never has been a better time to be a model railroader. I notice that a lot of the scarce older trains are being released mainly from collections now instead of being found at second hand stores and garage sales.   For those trying to sell old trains and make lots of money, though, the glory years are over.   Mike Vana  Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77381	From: Alan Smith	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

Fellow Train hobbyist, Mike is right — Us old folks are fading away. - It’s a shame the younger generation will never hear the cry of a steam whistle far off in the still night air.  The sweet sounds of a steam monster spinning drivers to start a long consist.  The smell of coal smoke puffing out of a steamers stack. The chuff - chuff of the monster starting to move.   The clatter of wheels as they cross the rail joints. Track gangs singing in unison while moving a track section into place.  Hobos coming to a house asking for a little food.   AH - time marches on !  The new diesels just HUM - What’s in that to create imagination . NO ONE THING!!!  The new engines have all kind of new features   BUT they will never last 50 + years.  The old Flyers still run great and will continue to do so with a little TLC.    Add a few L/E/D’s and they come to life as never before.  Train shows are a thrill to us old guys when the kids see the trains running, puffing smoke and pulling all sorts of cars, Their eyes twinkle with great delight while watching, the saw mill sawing lumber, the mail car grabbing and throwing out a bag, the coal loader handling coal, the barrel loader carrying and loading barrels,etc.   Or maybe double header pulling a long string of cars or maybe even with a pusher in the back.   THAT IS imagination in action !   It’s not that expensive to start a youngster into  trains if  being careful while buying on Ebay.   We, as a group need to take all the opportunities we can to create interest in the hobby.  All Clubs need to do more promotion to get new blood into the hobby.  LONG LIVE the memories and the hobby. Old A in Ohio   On Jan 30, 2016, at 11:49 AM, 'Mike and Debra Vana' amflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Sadly, a lot of train collectors have died off, are dying off, or are getting old and selling off their collections. While there  are young people coming into the hobby, there probably are not as many as are leaving it. The trains the young people (and even older people) are interested in are usually much newer. While the old trains have their charm, the new ones are generally much better.   Ebay and the internet certainly made the availability of trains much easier. If you miss something, it WILL show up again, unless it really is one of a kind. With less scarcity, I have noticed prices going down, although I am not around the collectors arena very often.   There never has been a better time to be a model railroader. I notice that a lot of the scarce older trains are being released mainly from collections now instead of being found at second hand stores and garage sales.   For those trying to sell old trains and make lots of money, though, the glory years are over.   Mike Vana  Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77382	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

When I first got in to model railroading way back in the late 50's early 60's. it was in HOand Athearn was one of the big manufacturers (still is in fact) and you could buy an F-7 or a GP-7 for less than $10.00 and depending on the type freight cars were as little as a buck 49. The only thing is if you wanted a superdetailed model you did it yourself. Oh how times have changed. Athearn locomotives can be as much or more than an American Models locomotive depending on if they are equipped with a decoder or not and are superdetailed to the nines.                                                               Bob Lampe                                                               Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77383	From: Robert Graves	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

So true. I handle estates and I'm lucky to get half of the Greenberg prices for Lionel equipment. It just isn't moving at all. I haven't handled any pre-war Flyer, but post-war Flyer is a much stronger market than Lionel.   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "Mark Speichert mspeichert@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 29, 2016 5:48 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Current train pricing   I have found that after ebay came along many of the items that were considered rare may not be so rare. I have been collecting for over 40 years and find the market still firm. Sure you are not getting those 80s prices but Flyer is still holding better then Lionel. Mark -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 1/29/16, Richard Hosmer richardahosmer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Current train pricing To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, January 29, 2016, 3:39 PM This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize.I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins.Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down.Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on? Thanks, Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77384	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

One time when i lived in Idaho a friend of mine who was a Lionel collector went to a yard/garage sale And bought a box of trains for 5 bucks. When he got home he started rummaging in the box and called me very excited. When i got to his house he showed me what got his excitement level to about 50 lol. in the bottom of the box under a bunch of track and freight cars were about 7 vintage locomotives from all I could tell was that all were pre WWII and it was my opinion that they were valuable. He contacted a dealer somewhere and it turned out they were more valuable than I first thought and as I recall he made something like $10,000 on those locomotives. He went back to the lady from who he bought them at the yard/garage sale and offered her $500.00 but she refused saying I said $5.00 and a deal is a deal. Some people, especially women( not meaning to discredit them) have absolutely no idea what older Lionel or even American Flyer is really worth.                                                 Bob Lampe                                                 Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77385	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 January 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 31 January 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77386	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Hindsight is always 20/20

When I was in the Navy i had the extreme pleasure of visiting Mr Tenshodo san and his factory. I had the opportunity to purchase most any Northern pacific locomotive that he produced AT EXTREMELY REDUCED PRICES. But did I? Oh no. I had other purchases on my mind like a stereo system and cameras and the like. i could have gotten an HO Northern pacific Z-8 Challenger for just over $100.00 or an A-4 Northern for about 90 bucks. I had the money too as we had just arrived from Vietnam for a 2 week stay and had just gotten paid which also included 2 months combat pay. I have regretted not buying those locomotives since 1968.                                                                        Bob Lampe                                                                        Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77387	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 1/30/2016
Subject: Re: Current train pricing

I believe a lot of the older collectors are starting to pass on now and more items are becoming available again. More supply less demand. As well as the economy stinks. I used to buy at least one or two items off of e-bay monthly before I lost my job in Sept last year. Chris Burger From: "Richard Hosmer richardahosmer@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 29, 2016 6:39 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Current train pricing   This may be a little off-topic, for which I apologize. I collect, and operate, prewar AF 3/16" O, and have been looking at Ebay lately, just for grins. Is it just me, or has the bottom dropped out of the market? Take for example, the diecast heavyweights (521, 524) - specimens used to command $200 plus, now they seem to go for around $50? Similarly, the tinplate 12-wheel cars (496, 497) made only in 1941 and once considered scarce, if not rare, are likewise way down. Other that the general sense that money is tight, and many have had to scale back, or eliminate, their "toy" budget - is anything else going on? Thanks, Dick Enjoy thousands of great photos  at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/    VISIT YOUR GROUP  New Members 1  New Photos 2 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77388	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Current train prices

I spent a little over twenty years working part time in a friend's hobby shop, which also bought and sold old trains. The owner used to tell everyone that was interested in getting into collecting was; "Collect what you like, not what you think is an investment.  If you're looking for an investment get into the Stock Market or put your money in the bank."  He also advised that they never buy collectibles on credit, spend only what they could afford. The point being that the collectible toy train market was already far over priced and the bubble was going to burst.  When the inevitable downturn came, you at least had stuff you liked, not a bunch of overpriced junk that you could only lose money selling.    Few listened, and with the economic mess in 2007, things were getting tough around here they were trying to sell off stuff to pay bills and buy food.   The shop was not buying as he felt the market still had a distance to go lower. Some collectors blamed him, and one guy called him "a heartless bastard."  But he was in business, not running a charity for those who didn't listen to his advice.  He had stopped being a Lionel dealer and "Service Station" a few years before because he felt their prices were far too high and quality too low. I ventured that the days of setting the prices of new trains at collector levels and not actual costs was going to end sooner or later, and he agreed.  We also often discussed the aging of the hobby and major collectors being another reason to take a hard look at the future.  He was right.  The shop closed at the end of 2009 and he moved on.  Things only got worse economically and high prices and low quality have become a Lionel hallmark.  HO got way too expensive and that is going down the tubes now as well.  Young folks can buy the Trainz Simulator and get a whole hobby for less than the price of one HO locomotive. So, it comes down to this: Enjoy the hobby at your own level of affordability, buy food and take care of your health. The hobby will never again be what we used to enjoy, but there's no point in giving up.  And now you might be able to get a few of those pieces you couldn't afford before!  WE can still play with our trains right up to the moment we each keel over and fall on our transformers.  :-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77389	From: barb	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Current Train Pricing

Putting the disparaging remarks about women aside, I am not at all sure I totally agree  with the comments regarding this topic.  I have a lot of Flyer trains and I know what they are worth. At the local train shows there are   hardly any "deals". Even at the York train show the prices are not low for Flyer. Maybe it is  an ebay thing that the prices seem lower.  I have a substantial layout (360 sq. ft.) and many kids (both boys and girls) come to see my layout.  Seven trains and a trolley run on 4 levels. The kids get very excited and many of them have  started their own collections and small layouts. So we can do our best to pass on this  wonderful hobby by having a layout up and inviting visitors. Many of mine come back year after  year to see what I have added.  Just my 2 cents... Barb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77390	From: bill hoglund	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Hindsight is always 20/20

Happens to all of us! On Saturday, January 30, 2016 7:13 PM, "danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   When I was in the Navy i had the extreme pleasure of visiting Mr Tenshodo san and his factory. I had the opportunity to purchase most any Northern pacific locomotive that he produced AT EXTREMELY REDUCED PRICES. But did I? Oh no. I had other purchases on my mind like a stereo system and cameras and the like. i could have gotten an HO Northern pacific Z-8 Challenger for just over $100.00 or an A-4 Northern for about 90 bucks. I had the money too as we had just arrived from Vietnam for a 2 week stay and had just gotten paid which also included 2 months combat pay. I have regretted not buying those locomotives since 1968.                                                                        Bob Lampe                                                                        Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77391	From: racin510	Date: 1/31/2016
Subject: Re: Current Train Pricing

Thanks for that Barb. Values for Flyer were kept artificially high for decades because your only access to dealers was few and far between train shows. That's how I started [re]building my set from the '50's around 1997. A few years later I got a computer and a couple years after that I discovered eBay trains and tentatively started learning how to approach the auction process, while train show dealers universally warned of all the crooks on eBay. Scare tactics didn't work and I discovered the gold mine of supply nobody could reach previously. At a big train show I might find one Northern and one Seaboard Coaler for sale, on eBay I could have a shot at either almost any day. Ebay opened up a free market place governed by supply and demand and there is a lot more supply than anyone ever anticipated in the past.It's a little like your gas prices, which were for years artificially manipulated by Wall Street and Big Oil to gouge us, but even they can't buck the supply power of the Saudi's when they choose to open the spigot wide to counter new competitors in the market place. Train shows are still great and a lot of people have to see and touch before buying, along with the fact most nice pieces have been checked and serviced by dealers before  offering for sale since they want happy customers coming back. And they serve as an opportunity for kids to become interested, where unlike needing to spend too much for new Lionel, one can get started in classic Flyer still very reasonably. Rick    Am I really the only operating S-Flyer layout in the city of Seattle?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77392	From: wyoaf	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Frankenstein swats the box

I have a 770 Gilbert AF baggage loading platform that does not work well, and has never been an accessory that I've had much confidence in. I've graphite lubed the ramp, adjusted the height of Frankenstein, polished the boxes and still it is inconsistent.  Some boxes get thrown off the layout, others only go halfway down the ramp. The question for the Group is:  Can a 770 be tuned to provide reliable, trouble free operation (akin to say, the Oil Drum Loader or 751 Log Loader) or are they all pesky and unreliable ?  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77393	From: mike gardner	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

I do not know if this will help but I polished the ramp with Semichrome (sold at motorcycle shops to polish motorcycle chrome) and It made it more consistent. There are other things you should check such as rust on the solenoid core and return spring tension. They may never as reliable as a drum loader but should work more consistently.                Thanks Mike Gardner On Monday, February 1, 2016 12:19 PM, "wyoaf@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have a 770 Gilbert AF baggage loading platform that does not work well, and has never been an accessory that I've had much confidence in. I've graphite lubed the ramp, adjusted the height of Frankenstein, polished the boxes and still it is inconsistent.  Some boxes get thrown off the layout, others only go halfway down the ramp. The question for the Group is:  Can a 770 be tuned to provide reliable, trouble free operation (akin to say, the Oil Drum Loader or 751 Log Loader) or are they all pesky and unreliable ?  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77394	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

The loader is not as reliable as say the barrel loader and it is difficult for it to reliably load a operating baggage or box car. It is just the nature of the beast. I have found acceptable performance if the ramp is sprayed with WD-40.  Loading a regular box car or gondola with the small square boxes is easier for the loader to do.  Also original cubes are much better made than the repro ones and work better!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77395	From: scaler164	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Cars For Sale

I have helping a friend sell TWO Smoky Mountain Model Works TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Car kits... some of you may remember these being initially offered by Chad Boas.      Reference 1 :    http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/S_scale_kits.html      Reference 2 :    http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/images/CB&Q%2089445%20pilot%20model%20(S)%20lo%20rez%20+%20text.jpg   Both kits come with decals, but NO trucks or couplers.   Asking price is $45 each if sold individually or $40 each if someone wants them both.   Shipping is an additional $7.   Please contact me off list if interested at the e-mail address below.     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77396	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Big Boy

on 1/26/16, 11:28 PM, Roy Inman at rinphoto@... wrote: Have a mint, never-opened-in-the-original-shipping-carton Lionel American Flyer Big Boy for sale. Open to offers. Please contact me off list if interested. Roy Inman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77397	From: bstilesaf	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Wanted: #350 Royal Blue shell

I recently bought a #350 Royal Blue with a boogered cow catcher. Would like to replace the shell only. Please contact me if you have one available for sale along with your price. Thanks! Ben

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77398	From: rick gough	Date: 2/1/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

Gilbert's attempt to mimic UPS 2015 ..... throw that box as far and hard as possible. The harder Frank throws the more possible it will wind up in the box car, and maybe roll down the ramp. Everything needs to be clean and dry. I use 19 volts to it and a quick hit of the button. If you round off the corners of the boxes they will work better, but don't expect perfection from this one. Rick   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Monday, February 1, 2016 9:38 AM, "wyoaf@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   I have a 770 Gilbert AF baggage loading platform that does not work well, and has never been an accessory that I've had much confidence in. I've graphite lubed the ramp, adjusted the height of Frankenstein, polished the boxes and still it is inconsistent.  Some boxes get thrown off the layout, others only go halfway down the ramp. The question for the Group is:  Can a 770 be tuned to provide reliable, trouble free operation (akin to say, the Oil Drum Loader or 751 Log Loader) or are they all pesky and unreliable ?  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77399	From: traindavid	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box & Royal Blue Shell

Contrary to one suggestion, I would not use WD-40 as a lube--it's is NOT a lubricant, nor a penetrating oil, although many use it as such; it is a water displacer that can, sometimes soften hardened, gummy oil, but then you have to apply new oil as the carrier fluid (which is what does the softening) evaporates. The 770 can be made to work more reliably by polishing the slides and, I've found, by tilting it slightly towards the loading car; however, note my phrasing "more reliably" -- it still isn't as reliable as the oil drum loader, or the mail pickup car, IMHO, the two best operating accessories. As to the Royal Blue, smushed cowcatchers/pilots seem to be common with this boiler shell. I have been successful with heating the pilot with a blow drier, or heat gun (better if you have it) and then GENTLY coaxing the pilot back into place. I'd say success ration is about 50/50, the Zamak does tend to be brittle, warming it up a lot helps it be a little more fluid. I've used this same method on other loco pilots that were bent down. Good luck! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77400	From: niblick_32966	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

---In S-Trains@yahoogroups.com, <wyoaf@...> wrote : I have a 770 Gilbert AF baggage loading platform that does not work well, and has never been an accessory that I've had much confidence in. I've graphite lubed the ramp, adjusted the height of Frankenstein, polished the boxes and still it is inconsistent.  Some boxes get thrown off the layout, others only go halfway down the ramp. The question for the Group is:  Can a 770 be tuned to provide reliable, trouble free operation (akin to say, the Oil Drum Loader or 751 Log Loader) or are they all pesky and unreliable ?  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN After 40 years in the attic, I fixed my #770. Mine is a toy and I wanted it to work every time before I gave it to my grandson. I tried every lube, wax, polisher, and powder I could think of to reduce the friction of the ramp. I finally used 15# solid stainless steel fishing leader, fashioned two parallel "rails" and bent them around the ramp. By reducing the surface area the baggage boxes touched, the toy worked every time the button was pushed. I had to run the train for one loop around the track to enable the baggage box to move down the car rollers to get into position to unload. The two "rails" wouldn't be allowed by "originalists", but they made my toy work....every time. Hope this helps. Regards, Don Birdey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77401	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: SnS can motors

Hey Steve,   Do you know the current drawn by one of your can motors?  I guess we should assume DC.  The question is from the 0 Gauge Forum (s-scale trains page) and concerns converting Flyer to DCC and the amp rating of the DCC decoder to be used.   I don’t know if you are on that forum, if you are not, I’ll pass the info along.  I know any help will be appreciated.   Bill Clark, I know you have knowledge about this topic… would you care to share some?   Thanks,   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77402	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box & Royal Blue Shell

A lubricant that I use which works well I discovered in the Army. We used it to lube our weapons and a little did a lot so iItried it on my trains and lo and behold it works great. It comes in several ways and several sizes. For our use the small bottle will last for a very long time. it is called break-Free and I apply it using a toothpick and as I stated a little goes a long way.The first timeIi tried it outside my Army job was on a small portable heater that was not running as it should. I took the heater apart cleaned it and lubed the bearings with Break-Free and it ran better than new.                      Bob Lampe                      Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77403	From: snstrains	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: 770 "fix"

Now that was plain and simple genius Don. Good for you. I haven't had the trouble with mine but if I do I'm sure going to use your fix.    Steve Blackburn SnS Trains Boise, Idaho   After 40 years in the attic, I fixed my #770. Mine is a toy and I wanted it to work every time before I gave it to my grandson. I tried every lube, wax, polisher, and powder I could think of to red uce the friction of the ramp. I finally used 15# solid stainless steel fishing leader, fashioned two parallel "rails" and bent them around the ramp. By reducing the surface area the baggage boxes touched, the toy worked every time the button was pushed. I had to run the train for one loop around the track to enable the baggage box to move down the car rollers to get into position to unload. The two "rails" wouldn't be allowed by "originalists", but they made my toy work....every time. Hope this helps. Regards, Don Birdey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77404	From: mapman504	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

Take a look at this YouTube video; this one seems to work well. Maybe this person can give you some tips. American Flyer 770 Loading Platform American Flyer 770 Loading Platform This is an American Flyer 770 loading platform being tested on my American Flyer S-gauge layout. The 770 was produced by A. C. Gilbert from 1950 - ... View on www.youtube.com Preview by Yahoo   Gerry West Chester PA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77405	From: scaler164	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Cars SOLD

Thanks to all who replied... but the models have now been spoken for.  Thanks.     John Degnan Scaler164@...   From: "Scaler164@... [SSPM]" <SSPM@yahoogroups.com> To: "POST Group : (S)" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com>, "POST Group : (S)" <sscalemodelrailroading@yahoogroups.com>, "POST Group : (S)" <S-Scale@yahoogroups.com>, "POST Group : (S)" <S-Scale-ProgreSSive@yahoogroups.com>, "POST Group : (S)" <SSTOT@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, February 1, 2016 5:43:54 PM Subject: [SSPM] TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Cars For Sale I have helping a friend sell TWO Smoky Mountain Model Works TWO CB&Q 53' 6" FM14/FM14A Flat Car kits... some of you may remember these being initially offered by Chad Boas.      Reference 1 :    http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/S_scale_kits.html      Reference 2 :    http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/images/CB&Q%2089445%20pilot%20model%20(S)%20lo%20rez%20+%20text.jpg   Both kits come with decals, but NO trucks or couplers.   Asking price is $45 each if sold individually or $40 each if someone wants them both.   Shipping is an additional $7.   Please contact me off list if interested at the e-mail address below.     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77406	From: Carey Probst	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: Re: SnS can motors

Answering from experience. I have 20 engines with his can motors, both steam and diesel and from what I remember they all draw under 1 amp with no load based on my test track and gauges.  I don't remember the exact amount but can check. I haven't tested under load since I am currently layoutless. If we don't hear something more definite from Steve I can run some tests tomorrow night. Carey On 2/2/2016 4:40 PM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Hey Steve,   Do you know the current drawn by one of your can motors?  I guess we should assume DC.  The question is from the 0 Gauge Forum (s-scale trains page) and concerns converting Flyer to DCC and the amp rating of the DCC decoder to be used.   I don’t know if you are on that forum, if you are not, I’ll pass the info along.  I know any help will be appreciated.   Bill Clark, I know you have knowledge about this topic… would you care to share some?   Thanks,   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77407	From: snstrains	Date: 2/2/2016
Subject: SnS can motors (your answer).

All of the different motors I use draw 1/4 amp or less under no load, BUT most of them stall at around 3 amps  at 15v. I recommend heavy duty (4 or more) amp decoders if you are going to install in heavy locos or pull big loads. It's what I do. Why take a chance on sucking the guts out of a 1 or 2 amp HO decoder?   Steve Blackburn SnS Trains Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77408	From: John Davis	Date: 2/3/2016
Subject: Re: Frankenstein swats the box

Thank you to all who replied.  The Youtube video of the good-working 770 reveals that his metal "boxes" have rounded edges while mine are squared off.  I will manipulate my boxes prior to attempting the steel fishing leader work around, which I think is a brilliant solution.  The Gilbert factory would have been impressed by that improvement/solution.  John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77409	From: traindavid	Date: 2/3/2016
Subject: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0

Hi all. My friend Mike has an ATSF 2-8-0 that does not like to go into reverse, if ever, and is rather flatulent when the power is turned off. I think it needs a new board, as I don't see any way to service this board, all surface mounted components (save for some large capacitors). The board is marked "S HELPER Service LM-3-S" . Has anyone "gutted" one of these locos and has a board they would be willing to part with? Thanks! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77410	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0

David, Check on the yahoo S-Helper Group. I think Don is still active on the group and he may be able to help put you in the right direction.   I want to say it was Dallee that made them or it was Tsunami if different. Chris From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 3, 2016 6:33 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0   Hi all. My friend Mike has an ATSF 2-8-0 that does not like to go into reverse, if ever, and is rather flatulent when the power is turned off. I think it needs a new board, as I don't see any way to service this board, all surface mounted components (save for some large capacitors). The board is marked "S HELPER Service LM-3-S" . Has anyone "gutted" one of these locos and has a board they would be willing to part with? Thanks! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77411	From: rfalzini	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Bob Board Video

Years ago I had a video of Bob Boards layout, I made several moves though out the last 10 years and in my moves I lost several things one being the video of Bob's layout. I attempted to contact him and I got no reply, I wanted to ask this group if a member here has a copy of the video and can possibly make me a copy so I can view it once again? I would be happy with either a VHS or DVD format Thanks Rich rfalzini@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77412	From: Bill Clark	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: Looking for reverse/sound board for SHS 2-8-0

Hi David, I believe I have a LM board for the 2-8-0.  Bill Sent from my iPhone On Feb 3, 2016, at 6:33 PM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hi all. My friend Mike has an ATSF 2-8-0 that does not like to go into reverse, if ever, and is rather flatulent when the power is turned off. I think it needs a new board, as I don't see any way to service this board, all surface mounted components (save for some large capacitors). The board is marked "S HELPER Service LM-3-S" . Has anyone "gutted" one of these locos and has a board they would be willing to part with? Thanks! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77413	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: INFO for AF # 299

Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal or plastic ? Frank R. EMIRO

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77414	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Scale wheel sets for F3

I am looking for 2 sets of scale wheels for the F3. Also need: Open Nose piece for Santa Fe Passenger A 2 sets of screws for the scale coupler assembly 3 DL109 shells from American HiRail Thanks, John Griffin rxman46321 @ aol dot com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77415	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77416	From: pete.henningsen	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. EMIRO >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77417	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/4/16, amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. EMIRO >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77418	From: pete.henningsen	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Yes ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 5:28 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------- > ------------------------ On Thu, 2/4/16, > amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] > Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for > AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February > 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on > mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- > From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: > Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for > AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo > of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? > Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. > EMIRO > >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77419	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Frank,      Both always plastic with large 299. Harwood -----Original Message----- From: frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thu, Feb 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299   Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal or plastic ? Frank R. EMIRO

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77420	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/4/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Thx.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 4, 2016, at 6:43 PM, amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Yes ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 5:28 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------- > ------------------------ On Thu, 2/4/16, > amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] > Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for > AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February > 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on > mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- > From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: > Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for > AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo > of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? > Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. > EMIRO > >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77421	From: Robert Graves	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

There's a picture in The Gilbert Gallery:        <http://thegilbertgallery.org/Engine%20Gallery/engines-Atlantic.html> Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299   Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/4/16, amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. EMIRO >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77422	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.   The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77423	From: americanflyer	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Hi I belive they were plastic boiler and tender but you can look in Greenberg book have a lot of variations remember lot of reproductions out there  Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "Robert Graves theupstairstrain@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: 02/05/2016 1:08 AM (GMT-05:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299   There's a picture in The Gilbert Gallery:        <http://thegilbertgallery.org/Engine%20Gallery/engines-Atlantic.html> Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299   Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/4/16, amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. EMIRO >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77424	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.   Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.   The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77425	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: 481 Alco Loud Horn

Attachments :   Hi S-Gaugers’.  Is there a way to control the horn volume on the 481 Silver Flash Alco other than disconnecting the horn?  I have one that is very loud.  Any solutions will be appreciated.   Take care.   Bob This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77426	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

I was  disappointed they didn't box it as "American Flyer".. It's a fantastic piece, at least what I see in photos.. I could still use some info on the lengths of these newer hoppers and the PS-2 hopper, compared to the older ones.. Or a photo of the original connected to all the newer Lionel produced S hoppers..  And, if anyone out there can confirm whether or not those 2 holiday cars (Route of the Reindeer and Christmas Sprinkles) are the newer hoppers or PS-2 hoppers.. It may seem like an odd request, but I'm not too mobile these days, and train shows with S vendors don't make my hometown a stop.. I'd just like to know if I like the way they look next to the older ones, and separate photos just don't cut it..   And while I'm on the subject, are any of the O scale hoppers close enough to use as S? I'm planning on investing in some 3D scanning software.. The cost of those MTH hoppers is too steep for my budget. I have access to a very nice 3D printer that can do the metallic aluminum powder ABS plastics: Even if I can't capture as much detail as I hope to, there's always rivet decals and chopping up 3/16 O cars to make brass additions to the models..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77427	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: INFO for AF # 299

Thx Robert. Someone in Conn. had the engine and was looking for the proper tender. Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/5/16, Robert Graves theupstairstrain@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, February 5, 2016, 1:08 AM   There's a picture in The Gilbert Gallery:        <http://thegilbertgallery.org/Engine%20Gallery/engines-Atlantic.html> Bob GravesTheGilbertGallery.org From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299   Does it say Reading and AFL ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/4/16, amerflyerwanted@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016, 5:03 PM Boiler & Tender car body both plastic on mine. Pete Henningsen Milford, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" Date: Thursday, February 4, 2016 4:07 pm Subject: [S-Trains] INFO for AF # 299 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com > Does anyone have a photo of the full unit and info on the > electronics it operated on ? Also was the boiler n tender metal > or plastic ? > > > Frank R. 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77428	From: racin510	Date: 2/5/2016
Subject: Re: 481 Alco Loud Horn

I'd be happy to buy the horn from you. I like loud ones! Substitute a new 8ohm speaker for it. Someone said Electric Railroad sells very good ones. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77429	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: 481 Alco Loud Horn

Good morning Rick.  Thanks for the suggestion on using an 8 ohm speaker on the 481 Silver Flash to reduce loud sound.   It is appreciated.  Have a great Super Bowl weekend.   Bob   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 9:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: 481 Alco Loud Horn     I'd be happy to buy the horn from you. I like loud ones! Substitute a new 8ohm speaker for it. Someone said Electric Railroad sells very good ones. Rick This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77430	From: traindavid	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers

I am confused here; the Route of the Reindeer and Christmas Sprinkles car are made by Lionel/AF (Flyonel, etc.) from copies of the original tooling (if not still the original tooling?). The MTH cars are made from the SHS tooling, and never were "American Flyer" branded, although made to be compatible. The "new" AF Christmas cars are mostly special paint jobs on standard production, although Big L has seen fit to modify the truck and coupler designs, sometimes to a non-functioning arrangement. According to the new catalog, both the trucks and couplers have been re-worked to be "more durable" and "more reliable." We'll see. . . . My big complaint is that, although Big L has apparently seen the light; the the American Flyer name and brand are marketable, they still haven't put "American Flyer" on the bottom of any of their new products; it's just labeled, "Lionel". Heck, I'd even go for "American Flyer by Lionel" That seems like such a simple, but significant thing to do. MTH also has a similar problem: if you look at their mailings, the footer lists all their brand names, EXCEPT the S gauge line--this even true of the S-gauge emails they send out. Ya can't sell it if ya hide it! Getting off soapbox now, it's too slippery up here! :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77431	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 07 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77432	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/6/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

Frank, you said look at the superliner head dome. Is that the new longer vista dome you are speaking of? If it is I will have to take a look. I do have the new Texas Special and so far I love it after two years of running it. Chris From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.   Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.   The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77433	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

Chris, yes it is the new ones with the full dome. Check both sides of the super dome. If you ever ride on a real train, you would know it is not proper. ACG also changed the both sides when the dome went to being made into plastic.   Sent from my iPhone On Feb 6, 2016, at 11:53 PM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Frank, you said look at the superliner head dome. Is that the new longer vista dome you are speaking of? If it is I will have to take a look. I do have the new Texas Special and so far I love it after two years of running it. Chris From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.   Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.   The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77434	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 07 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77435	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

I will check mine out. Never ridden in a superliner before so I wouldn't know what I am looking for LOL! From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2016 8:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, yes it is the new ones with the full dome. Check both sides of the super dome. If you ever ride on a real train, you would know it is not proper. ACG also changed the both sides when the dome went to being made into plastic.   Sent from my iPhone On Feb 6, 2016, at 11:53 PM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Frank, you said look at the superliner head dome. Is that the new longer vista dome you are speaking of? If it is I will have to take a look. I do have the new Texas Special and so far I love it after two years of running it. Chris From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.   Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.   The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77436	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers

OK duck, American Flyer by Lionel can not and does not exist. Why can't people get this in their head? Lionel is made in the same Chinese factory as American Flyer is made in. Lionel is not  really a company. It is a name of a former company Like American Flyer and and both names are owned by a company the has the rights to use the names and tooling. One does not make the other.  What is so hard to understand about this? I know I am barking up a dead tree, but I will continue. Chris. From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 6, 2016 4:40 PM Subject: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers   I am confused here; the Route of the Reindeer and Christmas Sprinkles car are made by Lionel/AF (Flyonel, etc.) from copies of the original tooling (if not still the original tooling?). The MTH cars are made from the SHS tooling, and never were "American Flyer" branded, although made to be compatible. The "new" AF Christmas cars are mostly special paint jobs on standard production, although Big L has seen fit to modify the truck and coupler designs, sometimes to a non-functioning arrangement. According to the new catalog, both the trucks and couplers have been re-worked to be "more durable" and "more reliable." We'll see. . . . My big complaint is that, although Big L has apparently seen the light; the the American Flyer name and brand are marketable, they still haven't put "American Flyer" on the bottom of any of their new products; it's just labeled, "Lionel". Heck, I'd even go for "American Flyer by Lionel" That seems like such a simple, but significant thing to do. MTH also has a similar problem: if you look at their mailings, the footer lists all their brand names, EXCEPT the S gauge line--this even true of the S-gauge emails they send out. Ya can't sell it if ya hide it! Getting off soapbox now, it's too slippery up here! :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77437	From: gregory mccormack	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: 521 T set

Dear Readers,  A friend of mine was offered a 521 T set (for free) from someone who found  it in his attic. It has the original set box, yellow/blue AF boxes for the the two cars, and the corrugated cardboard roll for the engine/tender. I do not know what condition the boxes are in. The engine and tender seem to be in very good condition judging from a picture he sent me. It also includes the AF instruction manual, the 25 watt transformer, uncoupler, clip-on and track.  He is curious as to what it might be worth. Although I have the Doyle manual, I do not have a current AF price guide. Would anyone be able to give a "ball park" figure as to what the set may be worth based on the information (admittedly limited) I have available? Thank you.  Greg McCormack

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77438	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

You are looking to walking into the car without hitting your head on a low upper floor. American Models did the Amtrak car properly. Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 2/7/16, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..? To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, February 7, 2016, 3:29 PM   I will check mine out. Never ridden in a superliner before so I wouldn't know what I am looking for LOL! From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2016 8:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, yes it is the new ones with the full dome. Check both sides of the super dome. If you ever ride on a real train, you would know it is not proper. ACG also changed the both sides when the dome went to being made into plastic.   Sent from my iPhone On Feb 6, 2016, at 11:53 PM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Frank, you said look at the superliner head dome. Is that the new longer vista dome you are speaking of? If it is I will have to take a look. I do have the new Texas Special and so far I love it after two years of running it. Chris From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.  Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though. Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.  The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77439	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers

 ----- Original Message ----- From: Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com OK duck, American Flyer by Lionel can not and does not exist . . . . . > > > > > > > > Most call me Tom, not "duck," but here's some interesting reading.   Have a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lionel,_LLC   Note especially "Although Lionel, LLC now owns all of the trademarks and most of the product rights associated with Lionel Corporation, the original producer of Lionel trains founded in 1900, there is no direct connection between the two companies."   Now if someone could just explain the importance of all this.  Or better still, drop it.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michitgan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77440	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel names

Well, I suppose most companies that have been in business for 100+ years like Lionel, have changed ownership. Contrary to what the SCOUS has ruled, corporate entities are not people. Makes no difference where the product is made. Your statement that “American Flyer by Lionel can not (sic) and does not exist” is puzzling. Of course they exist, just not in the revered way that many recall them. The Lionel name or the Ford name or the Kodak name, etc., still represent the company if not the one or ones who founded it. Lionel bought the Gilbert/AF name (IP) and so for all intents and purposes, American Flyer is owned by Lionel. Typically, when one company buys the assets of another it also buys the intellectual property and all the branding that goes with it. If I had the money, and if Mike Wolf were willing, I could buy MTH and I could choose to keep the name MTH or I could change the name.   Roy Inman on 2/7/16, 2:42 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           OK duck, American Flyer by Lionel can not and does not exist. Why can't people get this in their head? Lionel is made in the same Chinese factory as American Flyer is made in. Lionel is not  really a company. It is a name of a former company Like American Flyer and and both names are owned by a company the has the rights to use the names and tooling. One does not make the other.  What is so hard to understand about this? I know I am barking up a dead tree, but I will continue. Chris.          From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com>  To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com  Sent: Saturday, February 6, 2016 4:40 PM  Subject: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers               I am confused here; the Route of the Reindeer and Christmas Sprinkles car are made by Lionel/AF (Flyonel, etc.) from copies of the original tooling (if not still the original tooling?). The MTH cars are made from the SHS tooling, and never were "American Flyer" branded, although made to be compatible. The "new" AF Christmas cars are mostly special paint jobs on standard production, although Big L has seen fit to modify the truck and coupler designs, sometimes to a non-functioning arrangement. According to the new catalog, both the trucks and couplers have been re-worked to be "more durable" and "more reliable."  We'll see. . . . My big complaint is that, although Big L has apparently seen the light; the the American Flyer name and brand are marketable, they still haven't put "American Flyer" on the bottom of any of their new products; it's just labeled, "Lionel". Heck, I'd even go for "American Flyer by Lionel"  That seems like such a simple, but significant thing to do. MTH also has a similar problem: if you look at their mailings, the footer lists all their brand names, EXCEPT the S gauge line--this even true of the S-gauge emails they send out. Ya can't sell it if ya hide it! Getting off soapbox now, it's too slippery up here! :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77441	From: snstrains	Date: 2/7/2016
Subject: Re: 521 T set

About $130-$140 if everything is there and in "excellent" condition. Steve SnS Trains   In a message dated 2/7/2016 3:35:15 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Dear Readers,  A friend of mine was offered a 521 T set (for free) from someone who found  it in his attic. It has the original set box, yellow/blue AF boxes for the the two cars, and the corrugated cardboard roll for the engine/tender. I do not know what condition the boxes are in. The engine and tender seem to be in very good condition judging from a picture he sent me. It also includes the AF instruction manual, the 25 watt transformer, uncoupler, clip-on and track.  He is curious as to what it might be worth. Although I have the Doyle manual, I do not have a current AF price guide. Would anyone be able to give a "ball park" figure as to what the set may be worth based on the information (admittedly limited) I have available? Thank you.  Greg McCormack

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77442	From: traindavid	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers

Tom, I'm "Duck" so the posting from Chris was directed at me (Last name is Dewey, ie: Duck, although the family name predates Disney--by centuries). So, I was not claiming anything about the current user of the L name, but because they do own the properties of the old L Corporation, they also own the name and tooling (although by now, I suspect they are using new tooling) of American Flyer (purchased when ACG liquidated); therefore they can say "American Flyer by L...l" (I really hate to type out that name!! :) ). But, regardless of one's opinion of all this, I believe all of us American Flyer devotees can complain that the trains they buy, in "American Flyer" labeled boxes, are not themselves marked with the American Flyer name, but with that L name on them What's with that? Do they consider the AF name inferior to their own?? As I said, it's very similar to MTH not putting their S Gauge line branding on all their emails and catalogs when they list all their other brands. Does no one but American Models want to admit they make S gauge trains???? S'incerely, David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77443	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers

Thanks Mr. Duck LOL!. I can agree with you on that. I love stirring the pot on this one. Chris From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 8, 2016 5:18 AM Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers   Tom, I'm "Duck" so the posting from Chris was directed at me (Last name is Dewey, ie: Duck, although the family name predates Disney--by centuries). So, I was not claiming anything about the current user of the L name, but because they do own the properties of the old L Corporation, they also own the name and tooling (although by now, I suspect they are using new tooling) of American Flyer (purchased when ACG liquidated); therefore they can say "American Flyer by L...l" (I really hate to type out that name!! :) ). But, regardless of one's opinion of all this, I believe all of us American Flyer devotees can complain that the trains they buy, in "American Flyer" labeled boxes, are not themselves marked with the American Flyer name, but with that L name on them What's with that? Do they consider the AF name inferior to their own?? As I said, it's very similar to MTH not putting their S Gauge line branding on all their emails and catalogs when they list all their other brands. Does no one but American Models want to admit they make S gauge trains???? S'incerely, David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77444	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers

Sorry Tom I thought I was responding to David Dewey.  We call him Duck as in Dewey Duck from Disney. He knows I how I am with the response about Lionel and American Flyer. My eyesight must have played games with me when I clicked on the mail to reply to. Please forgive me. Chris From: "'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2016 5:21 PM Subject: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers    ----- Original Message ----- From: Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com OK duck, American Flyer by Lionel can not and does not exist . . . . . > > > > > > > > Most call me Tom, not "duck," but here's some interesting reading.   Have a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lionel,_LLC   Note especially "Although Lionel, LLC now owns all of the trademarks and most of the product rights associated with Lionel Corporation, the original producer of Lionel trains founded in 1900, there is no direct connection between the two companies."   Now if someone could just explain the importance of all this.  Or better still, drop it.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michitgan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77445	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

ouch, never paid attention to that as it is a toy LOL! I will look today for sure. Chris From: "frank emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2016 4:43 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   You are looking to walking into the car without hitting your head on a low upper floor. American Models did the Amtrak car properly. Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Sun, 2/7/16, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..? To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, February 7, 2016, 3:29 PM   I will check mine out. Never ridden in a superliner before so I wouldn't know what I am looking for LOL! From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2016 8:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, yes it is the new ones with the full dome. Check both sides of the super dome. If you ever ride on a real train, you would know it is not proper. ACG also changed the both sides when the dome went to being made into plastic.   Sent from my iPhone On Feb 6, 2016, at 11:53 PM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Frank, you said look at the superliner head dome. Is that the new longer vista dome you are speaking of? If it is I will have to take a look. I do have the new Texas Special and so far I love it after two years of running it. Chris From: "Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?   Chris, Oh I agree with you.  ACGilbert made a great product that was to be as close an original RR product that could operate on 2 rail track for us when youngsters.  Lionel makes to many fake AF trains. Just look at the super liner head dome. One side is done and the other is coach. The new diesels and Berkshire are great though. Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Feb 5, 2016, at 6:27 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The MTH cars are the exact copy of the S-Helper Cars. Why were you disappointed the MTH made them. Much better quality than American Flyer. I would rather have MTH put on a car than Lionel any day. In a perfect world, Don would still be owner and commander in chief of S-Helper. But it is what it is. Hat I get disappointed with is when people call American Flyer something other than what it is, eg. Flyonel, Chionel or even when they Stamp Lionel on the American Flyer car.  The best thing the company that owns the rights to these names has finally done correctly is use the name Flyer Chief for the remote control for the new American Flyer Engines. It is what it is these days, a company that owns the names Lionel and American Flyer  getting made in the same factory some where in China. At least Lionel does Not own American Flyer even though the Address is at A "Lionel Head Quarters "address and their catalog hosted on the Lionel Web sight. Just my thoughts which some already know from being on the FB group pages too. Chris Burger From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 3:54 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF/Lionel hoppers..?    I own a few of the older ones, the 640 and 940 versions.. It's been a while, so I was a bit surprised by the newer ones, seems to be a lot more details to them.. then surprised again that MTH made a PS-2 ore car/hopper. When I looked at more on Ebay, the Christmas Sprinkles hopper and Route of the Reindeer cars, they look a lot shorter than my originals. Can anyone tell me the lengths of these holiday cars, the newer hoppers, and the old ones too(sorry, mine packed up for a move)? I was excited at first when I heard Lionel bought SHS, but seeing their PS-2 cars get labeled MTH was a let down.. If I've missed the ones labeled as American Flyer, could someone please share a model number or box description so I can pull up all the road names?    Jim #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379 -- #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp #yiv8273608379hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp #yiv8273608379ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp .yiv8273608379ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp .yiv8273608379ad p { margin:0;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-mkp .yiv8273608379ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-sponsor #yiv8273608379ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv8273608379 #yiv8273608379ygrp-sponsor #yiv8273608379ygrp-lc #yiv8273608379hd { margin:10px 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77446	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF/Lionel hoppers..?

I recently bought 4 of the Lionel /American Flyer cylindrical hoppers painted and lettered for BN. i am in the process of removing the BN lettering and logo but leaving the dimensional data intact as these cars are identical to the 34 cars purchased by the Butte Anaconda & Pacific. The basic color is the same as the BN cars. There are a few differences in the cars. BAP used 100 ton roller bearing trucks and in addition they only had a triple digit number. on the ends was a sheet of metal with the numbers cut out because after loading the cars with milk of lime the painted black numbers were almost invisible and hard to read. Those number plates are going to be a PITA to model. I will be adding draft gear for kadees and the 100 ton roller bearing trucks. Removal of the BN lettering, logos and numbers at first was a PITA then I tried Cody Grivno's method in his video on Model Railroader's website and it works like a charm. I use a cotton swab and cover the lettering/logo to be removed with Micro Sol let it set for a wile and then use an eraser. Lettering comes right off and does not hurt the base color. Weathering will be a relatively easy process. I think i mentioned previously I use a ladies makeup kit for weathering. They have their own applicators and after adding weathering what i like is i can change it if i don't like it. When weathered they i add a coat of dullcote to seal the weathering.                                            Bob Lampe                                            Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77447	From: racin510	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC -- was Re: [S-Trains] re: AF/Lionel hoppers

Let us just be very pleased that these manufacturers are taking the chance of delving into S gauge and they are coming out with American Flyer catalogs. 95% of Lionel sales are O gauge, they're not very dependent on Flyer sales.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77448	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC

Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77449	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/8/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

On Feb 8, 2016, at 11:31 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77450	From: R G	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

You are absolutely correct Stumpy Stone! On Tuesday, February 9, 2016 12:27 AM, "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77451	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

Stumpy, in my experience the Flyonel stuff is superior in most ways to the old Gilbert line. All of my engines, etc., have performed fine right out of the box. General build quality, paint, decoration, all better. Couplers are screwy. Roy Inman on 2/9/16, 12:07 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           On Feb 8, 2016, at 11:31 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original too ling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so toolin g costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77452	From: racin510	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

Doesn't Lionel, LLC also own the factory in China and thus do the manufacturing as well as the design and engineering?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77453	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

No. the factory in China produces product for other companies around the world. Some products are made in China then shipped to Lionel for painting. S small number of O gauge rolling stock is produced in the US. Roy Inman on 2/9/16, 2:47 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           Doesn't Lionel, LLC also own the factory in China and thus do the manufacturing as well as the design and engineering?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77454	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

I have to disagree again. The large percentage of the new American Flyer works just fine right out of the box.  I buy a lot and sell a lot and have had 1 issue with a truck on a passenger car after I ran it to death for 3 Christmas running seasons for public viewing.  Just because people won't let go of the past is no reason to bash a new company holding onto a past dream for many.   In Teri's own words, follow along,...."  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge." Exactly what I said.  And in this very statement it does not say Lionel owns or Makes American Flyer. So my question back is, yes, why is it so hard to see.   You have Pre War Gilbert, Post War Gilbert, and New Era Gilbert. So simple A child can understand this. At least my 16 year old daughter does.  To Clarify my statement, A.C. Gilbert and American Flyer by Gilbert does not exist any more. Only the things made before 66 when the Gilbert Factory Ceased production.    Chris in Ohio From: "R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 9, 2016 8:04 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC   You are absolutely correct Stumpy Stone! On Tuesday, February 9, 2016 12:27 AM, "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77455	From: Roy Inman	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

Agreed. There is such a thing as “corporate lineage.” Roy Inman on 2/9/16, 8:55 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           I have to disagree again. The large percentage of the new American Flyer works just fine right out of the box.  I buy a lot and sell a lot and have had 1 issue with a truck on a passenger car after I ran it to death for 3 Christmas running seasons for public viewing.  Just because people won't let go of the past is no reason to bash a new company holding onto a past dream for many.  In Teri's own words, follow along,...."  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name Americ an Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge." Exactly what I said.  And in this very statement it does not say Lionel owns or Makes American Flyer. So my question back is, yes, why is it so hard to see.  You have Pre War Gilbert, Post War Gilbert, and New Era Gilbert. So simple A child can understand this. At least my 16 year old daughter does.  To Clarify my statement, A.C. Gilbert and American Flyer by Gilbert does n ot exist any more. Only the things made before 66 when the Gilbert Factory Ceased production.    Chris in Ohio        From: "R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com>  To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com  Sent: Tuesday, February 9, 2016 8:04 AM  Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC               You are absolutely correct Stumpy Stone!       On Tuesday, February 9, 2016 12:27 AM, "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:               Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and L ionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77456	From: gsc3	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: For sale

A S Helper 52' trailer flatcar with a SHS Seaboard trailer.  The flatcar is like new but the wood deck has been weathered.  The price for both is $35 + actual shipping.  Yahoo blocks me from adding attachments, but if you are interested, I can send three photos directly to you offline. If interested, please contact me offline at gsc3@... or if Yahoo blocks you, gsc3 at yahoo.com.  I will be happy to e-mail you the photos or answer questions.  It includes AF type wheels and couplers. George Courtney

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77457	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: NMRA Convention in Indianapolis - S Scale Layouts ?

I plan on attending the NMRA National Convention in Indianapolis, July 3-10.  I will also be participating in the USS Indianapolis Survivors Reunion, July 7-10, which will be headquartered in the Hyatt Hotel which is just one block away from the NMRA host hotel, the Westin.  Very convenient scheduling for me, just by luck.  The USS Indy reunion is usually two weeks later.   My purpose in writing this message is to inquire about S participation in the convention or associated National Train Show.  I know the NASG will have a table or exhibit at the National Train Show.  But I am wondering whether there will be tours to local S scale layouts and S scale modular layouts on exhibit.  The NMRA Convention website already has a lot of information including a nice list of layout tours.  I see no S scale layouts listed.  Maybe one or more will be added.  I hope so.        -  Earl Henry, Nashville, TN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77458	From: snstrains	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: SHS trucks for sale or swap

I have 3 packaged pairs of SHS Andrews 70 ton powered tender trucks with code 110 wheel sets. Will trade for Flyer compatible sets or sell these. Maybe a wheel set swap in store is a possibility also. Contact me off line at snstrains@...   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77459	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

I have had bad experiences with the modern lionel /flyer trucks. I do mind when the car cost $60 bucks. If i find them at train shows, I just fix them and move on. In all honesty, im just glad the manufacturers are making what they do. It would a sad day when all we had available was vintage pieces and nothing new. It makes you appreciate the original Gilbert i suppose.  Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains]" Date:02/09/2016 8:55 AM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC   I have to disagree again. The large percentage of the new American Flyer works just fine right out of the box.  I buy a lot and sell a lot and have had 1 issue with a truck on a passenger car after I ran it to death for 3 Christmas running seasons for public viewing.  Just because people won't let go of the past is no reason to bash a new company holding onto a past dream for many.   In Teri's own words, follow along,...."  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge." Exactly what I said.  And in this very statement it does not say Lionel owns or Makes American Flyer. So my question back is, yes, why is it so hard to see.   You have Pre War Gilbert, Post War Gilbert, and New Era Gilbert. So simple A child can understand this. At least my 16 year old daughter does.  To Clarify my statement, A.C. Gilbert and American Flyer by Gilbert does not exist any more. Only the things made before 66 when the Gilbert Factory Ceased production.    Chris in Ohio From: "R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 9, 2016 8:04 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC   You are absolutely correct Stumpy Stone! On Tuesday, February 9, 2016 12:27 AM, "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Okay, let me see if I understand all this in a less complicated manner.  The current Lionel, owned by a holding company, exists and also owns the rights to the name American Flyer and it's original tooling.  It is not the manufacturer, but the "designer" and "distributor" of Chinese made trains, that are sold as Lionel in O gauge and American Flyer in S gauge. So, that would still make American Flyer sold by Lionel LLC what many of us call "Flyonel."  Flyonel distinguishes between original Gilbert production and Lionel production, with the Lionel era being Flyonel.  I don't understand what is so tough to figure out, or if it matters, other than to distinguish between the Gilbert and Lionel era American Flyer trains. To my mind the REAL distinction between Gilbert AF and Lionel AF, since Lionel still uses mostly Gilbert tooling, is the high price and poor quality of Flyonel products.  That original tooling is long since paid for many times over, so tooling costs are nil.  There is a LOT of Gilbert Flyer still running after more than 65 years, while a high percentage of Flyonel is defective right out of the box.  One of the major problems is the poor trucks and couplers, which are newer tooling designed by Lionel. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77460	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

What the heck difference does it make? As I see it two great American icons of the past are still in production regardless of where they are made. Otherwise these two companies could have been lost forever. Maybe they aren't the same Lionel and American Flyer most of us grew up with but in some respects they are better or is that new and improved? At least you can still buy a Lionel or American Flyer freight car or locomotive or other piece of equipment. Most definitely the newest items have bugs that need to be worked out but what new item doesn't Given time they'll get it worked out.                                                               Bob Lampe                                                               Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77461	From: gsc3	Date: 2/9/2016
Subject: Re: For sale

This car and trailer have been spoken for. George Courtney

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77462	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: AM passenger cars question?

Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they where made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. Any ideas on other products? I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77463	From: portlines	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Port Lines website

I understand that there has been considerable discussion on Facebook about the restructuring of my website, and the difficulty a few folks are having using it. I am not on Facebook....this is a one-man business (with frequent help from my wife whenever needed to keep up with orders) I simply don't have the time to deal with Facebook after 9+ hours a day, 6, if not 7, days a week, filling and shipping orders and all the other work that goes along with that.  So I have no problem with someone copying this posting over to the Am Flyer Facebook page. The site is not THAT much different from the past. All sales categories are now in the tan Index column on the LEFT. All non-sales categories, including our popular Repair Clinics, are at the TOP of the homepage. As for the AF Parts section, formerly one would see a list of all the Categories (e.g, Bulbs, Motor Parts, Sawmill, etc). Then you would click on that category to see a listing of all related parts. It is very little different now. To see a list of all the Categories, click on Overview. Once you've identified the appropriate category for whatever you are looking for, click on Inventory. Then a drop-down menu divides those categories into 4 segments, from which you select the appropriate category. It is not that difficult as long as you don't rush. It DOES require that you move horizontally across the sub-menus, not diagonally, however. Other than that, there are no significant differences to the website. Finally....WHY did we do this? The former site was producing numerous errors in orders submitted. Customers were receiving the automatic email Order Confirmations containing items they didn't order...(I don't send those personally.....they go out automatically from the Shopping Cart system).... . I am not exaggerating when I say that I was even receiving orders for THOUSANDS of dollars worth of items completely unrelated to the small parts order the person actually placed ! This was happening more and more frequently, and neither I or my website host could determine why that was happening. His solution was to re-design the ordering process.  It took us over 6 months of re-design, testing, and re-testing before everything seemed to work OK, and we went "live" with the new site.  Since doing so, we have not had a single error in orders submitted via the site. I understand frustration with "change" after being used to a system that existed for over 20 years! But consider my frustration with incorrect orders, orders that slipped through and had to be returned & replaced, refunds, and related email exchanges. The new website format works properly....it just takes a bit of getting used to, like any website upgrade. Use OVERVIEW for information, and INVENTORY for availability. And if you still can't handle it, I have no problem with receiving a straight-forward email order instead of using the website system. Hope that addresses most of your issues and questions, and I welcome your constructive Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby doug@... Click here Click here View on www.portlines.com Preview by Yahoo comments.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77464	From: Tom	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

I have used the new site for ordering a couple of times now, as well as navigating around to check on items, etc.  I’ve found it intuitive and fairly easy to use.  I recommend that everyone just go on the site and explore a little bit.  I think you’ll find it easy to navigate and not as big a change as you think it might be.  The look is a little different and in some ways I find it easier to use than the prior site.  So let’s just take some time to check out the new site.  I think you’ll like it if you give it a chance. Tom On Feb 10, 2016, at 8:02 AM, doug@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I understand that there has been considerable discussion on Facebook about the restructuring of my website, and the difficulty a few folks are having using it. I am not on Facebook....this is a one-man business (with frequent help from my wife whenever needed to keep up with orders) I simply don't have the time to deal with Facebook after 9+ hours a day, 6, if not 7, days a week, filling and shipping orders and all the other work that goes along with that.   So I have no problem with someone copying this posting over to the Am Flyer Facebook page. The site is not THAT much different from the past. All sales categories are now in the tan Index column on the LEFT. All non-sales categories, including our popular Repair Clinics, are at the TOP of the homepage. As for the AF Parts section, formerly one would see a list of all the Categories (e.g, Bulbs, Motor Parts, Sawmill, etc). Then you would click on that category to see a listing of all related parts. It is very little different now. To see a list of all the Categories, click on Overview. Once you've identified the appropriate category for whatever you are looking for, click on Inventory. Then a drop-down menu divides those categories into 4 segments, from which you select the appropriate category. It is not that difficult as long as you don't rush. It DOES require that you move horizontally across the sub-menus, not diagonally, however. Other than that, there are no significant differences to the website. Finally....WHY did we do this? The former site was producing numerous errors in orders submitted. Customers were receiving the automatic email Order Confirmations containing items they didn't order...(I don't send those personally.....they go out automatically from the Shopping Cart system).... . I am not exaggerating when I say that I was even receiving orders for THOUSANDS of dollars worth of items completely unrelated to the small parts order the person actually placed ! This was happening more and more frequently, and neither I or my website host could determine why that was happening. His solution was to re-design the ordering process.  It took us over 6 months of re-design, testing, and re-testing before everything seemed to work OK, and we went "live" with the new site.  Since doing so, we have not had a single error in orders submitted via the site. I understand frustration with "change" after being used to a system that existed for over 20 years! But consider my frustration with incorrect orders, orders that slipped through and had to be returned & replaced, refunds, and related email exchanges. The new website format works properly....it just takes a bit of getting used to, like any website upgrade. Use OVERVIEW for information, and INVENTORY for availability. And if you still can't handle it, I have no problem with receiving a straight-forward email order instead of using the website system. Hope that addresses most of your issues and questions, and I welcome your constructive  Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby doug@... Click here Click here View on www.portlines.com Preview by Yahoo  comments.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77465	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

I like the new site. Keep up the good work.  Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "doug@... [S-Trains]" Date:02/10/2016 8:02 AM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Port Lines website   I understand that there has been considerable discussion on Facebook about the restructuring of my website, and the difficulty a few folks are having using it. I am not on Facebook....this is a one-man business (with frequent help from my wife whenever needed to keep up with orders) I simply don't have the time to deal with Facebook after 9+ hours a day, 6, if not 7, days a week, filling and shipping orders and all the other work that goes along with that.  So I have no problem with someone copying this posting over to the Am Flyer Facebook page. The site is not THAT much different from the past. All sales categories are now in the tan Index column on the LEFT. All non-sales categories, including our popular Repair Clinics, are at the TOP of the homepage. As for the AF Parts section, formerly one would see a list of all the Categories (e.g, Bulbs, Motor Parts, Sawmill, etc). Then you would click on that category to see a listing of all related parts. It is very little different now. To see a list of all the Categories, click on Overview. Once you've identified the appropriate category for whatever you are looking for, click on Inventory. Then a drop-down menu divides those categories into 4 segments, from which you select the appropriate category. It is not that difficult as long as you don't rush. It DOES require that you move horizontally across the sub-menus, not diagonally, however. Other than that, there are no significant differences to the website. Finally....WHY did we do this? The former site was producing numerous errors in orders submitted. Customers were receiving the automatic email Order Confirmations containing items they didn't order...(I don't send those personally.....they go out automatically from the Shopping Cart system).... . I am not exaggerating when I say that I was even receiving orders for THOUSANDS of dollars worth of items completely unrelated to the small parts order the person actually placed ! This was happening more and more frequently, and neither I or my website host could determine why that was happening. His solution was to re-design the ordering process.  It took us over 6 months of re-design, testing, and re-testing before everything seemed to work OK, and we went "live" with the new site.  Since doing so, we have not had a single error in orders submitted via the site. I understand frustration with "change" after being used to a system that existed for over 20 years! But consider my frustration with incorrect orders, orders that slipped through and had to be returned & replaced, refunds, and related email exchanges. The new website format works properly....it just takes a bit of getting used to, like any website upgrade. Use OVERVIEW for information, and INVENTORY for availability. And if you still can't handle it, I have no problem with receiving a straight-forward email order instead of using the website system. Hope that addresses most of your issues and questions, and I welcome your constructive Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby doug@... Click here Click here View on www.portlines.com Preview by Yahoo comments.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77466	From: trndad	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC

I am somewhere in the middle on this "Lionel-produced-Flyer-is-great-stuff vs. Lionel-produced-Flyer-is-junk" discussion.  The fit and finish of the modern production is by far superior to what Gilbert produced, but the mechanicals and electronics on many items rarely survive past the warranty period if that long.    For example, members of our train club bought a dozen or more Big Boys when they came out and without exception every one failed within their first few months of operation, some more than once. For many, now that the warranty is expired, they are just expensive display models.   So, why do I continue to buy Flyonel?  I like the Legacy/TMCC control system and features, and I like what I see.  My biggest problem is I don't have a layout, just a small oval test track, so I buy this stuff and sock it away for that day when I will have a layout to run it on. If and when I do get to run it and it proves to be defective right out of the box, I'll be stuck since the 1-year warranty will have long since expired.  Furthermore, Lionel doesn't stock parts for very long (if at all), so repairing it will be problematic.   Personally I like what Carl Tuveson does.  He engineers a fix for most problems himself, or just guts the stuff and installs components from ERR.  In every case he improves on the design and/or operation of the equipment 100%.  I intend to do the same, but unlike him, I will probably let the warranty period expire first.   For those of you who prefer original Gilbert, and wish there had been a bit more variety in what he produced, check out the creations of one of our club's well know members, Joe Deger (http://www.trainweb.org/acsg/TD/TD_JD.html).  He takes original basket case Flyer and creates incredible variations of engines and rolling stock that Gilbert himself might have made had he lived long enough.    Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77467	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

Jim, personally I like the chrome plating on the AM Budd cars.  I will agree that they are little too reflective and thus perhaps a little too toylike.  The less bright scale Budd cars may be more realistic but do not have nearly the reflectiveness of the prototype cars.    Southern's stainless steel cars are the ones I am most familiar with.  They do not have what I would call exactly a mirror finish but its somewhat close.  Looking out the vestibule door, the color of the car sides looks like the colors of the scenery that the train is passing.  At night the cars reflect all the lights being passed whether they be signals or flashing lights at crossings or whatever.  The highrail finish on the American Models Budd cars do a pretty good job of this, and the AM scale Budd cars do not.    Of course its strictly a personal decision whether to choose the scale version or the highrail version.  But it sure sounds like a lot of trouble and expense to buy these cars, which are not cheap, and then do a homemade chroming of the cars.    Now the American Flyer Budd cars might be a different matter.  The silver versions vary so greatly in reflectiveness depending on when they were produced and on which production runs.  Some of the Gilbert chrome cars had great reflectiveness.  I don't know about many of the silver Budd cars produced by Flyonel other than the California Zephyr cars, which have an awful finish.  The finish of those cars look more gray than silver to me, and I don't know why anyone would want those cars on the layout.  If I really wanted a California Zephyr train of American Flyer Budd cars, I would consider chroming all of them to include one of American High-rails' observation cars that had the dome.  Flyonel botched so many details of their California Zephyr train.  Its one of Flyonel's biggest marketing failures.  I am sure they sold of lot of the sets but the marketing potential was huge and they simply wasted market opportunities.  (I could go on and on about this). You can buy these cars pretty cheap nowadays on eBay and elsewhere.   Good luck with whatever you decide to do.  Although I made a comparison with AF Budd cars, I much prefer the AM Budds.  AM did a really great job on them even though I wish they were full-length cars.     -  Earl Henry, Nashville        In a message dated 2/10/2016 7:28:37 A.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they were made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. Any ideas on other products? [Unable to display image] I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77468	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

Doug, I sympathize with the problems you have had with your shopping cart system.  The shopping cart system on my tiny business website has been extremely frustrating.  My webguy just cannot seem to get it to work on a consistent basis.  Like you, I am a one-person business.  It would be nice to have an in-house computer and website expert, but this is a luxury that most small businesses do not have.  I have been on your website within the last few weeks and have no complaints.  It may take a little patience to get to what I am looking for but I can usually find it in due time.  Its always interesting to look at the large variety of parts and products that are listed.  But I realize too that the variety greatly complicates the shopping cart.  So again I sympathize with your frustrations with the website.  And I value the reputation for great service and integrity that you and your business are known for.     -  Earl Henry, Nashville, TN    In a message dated 2/10/2016 8:31:07 A.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I understand that there has been considerable discussion on Facebook about the restructuring of my website, and the difficulty a few folks are having using it. I am not on Facebook....this is a one-man business (with frequent help from my wife whenever needed to keep up with orders) I simply don't have the time to deal with Facebook after 9+ hours a day, 6, if not 7, days a week, filling and shipping orders and all the other work that goes along with that.  So I have no problem with someone copying this posting over to the Am Flyer Facebook page. The site is not THAT much different from the past. All sales categories are now in the tan Index column on the LEFT. All non-sales categories, including our popular Repair Clinics, are at the TOP of the homepage. As for the AF Parts section, formerly one would see a list of all the Categories (e.g, Bulbs, Motor Parts, Sawmill, etc). Th en you would click on that category to see a listing of all related parts. It is very little different now. To see a list of all the Categories, click on Overview. Once you've identified the appropriate category for whatever you are looking for, click on Inventory. Then a drop-down menu divides those categories into 4 segments, from which you select the appropriate category. It is not that difficult as long as you don't rush. It DOES require that you move horizontally across the sub-menus, not diagonally, however. Other than that, there are no significant differences to the website. Finally....WHY did we do this? The former site was producing numerous errors in orders submitted. Customers were receiving the automatic email Order Confirmations containing items they didn't order...(I don't send those personally.....they go out automatically from the Shopping Cart system).... . I am not exaggerating w hen I say that I was even receiving orders for THOUSANDS of dollars worth of items completely unrelated to the small parts order the person actually placed ! This was happening more and more frequently, and neither I or my website host could determine why that was happening. His solution was to re-design the ordering process.  It took us over 6 months of re-design, testing, and re-testing before everything seemed to work OK, and we went "live" with the new site.  Since doing so, we have not had a single error in orders submitted via the site. I understand frustration with "change" after being used to a system that existed for over 20 years! But consider my frustration with incorrect orders, orders that slipped through and had to be returned & replaced, refunds, and related email exchanges. The new website format works properly....it just takes a bit of getting used to, like any website upgrade. Use OVERVIEW for information , and INVENTORY for availability. And if you still can't handle it, I have no problem with receiving a straight-forward email order instead of using the website system. Hope that addresses most of your issues and questions, and I welcome your constructive Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby doug@... Click here Click here View on www.portlines.com Preview by Yahoo comments.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77469	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

!. I would like to know how to get the old chrome finish on AF cars off and clean....and then maybe re-chrome??? 2. Would love to have someone make tender water scoops, to fit under various AF tenders (Pennsy and NYC???) something that would look correct and be able to be glued/screwed on 3. Sure could use a bunch of S passenger car diaphrgms Some thoughts for your son????   Thanks Peter L. From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 5:00 AM Subject: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they where made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. Any ideas on other products? I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77470	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

I use dot 3 brake fluid to strip paint off of plastic.  Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "Dr Trains dtrains@... [S-Trains]" Date:02/10/2016 4:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   !. I would like to know how to get the old chrome finish on AF cars off and clean....and then maybe re-chrome??? 2. Would love to have someone make tender water scoops, to fit under various AF tenders (Pennsy and NYC???) something that would look correct and be able to be glued/screwed on 3. Sure could use a bunch of S passenger car diaphrgms Some thoughts for your son????   Thanks Peter L. From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 5:00 AM Subject: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they where made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. Any ideas on other products? I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77471	From: rj4010d	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

I have some "S" diaphrams  that I would like to sell.  Bob Guckian Eaton, Oh bjg@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77472	From: tennsgauger	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

Back about 35 or 40 years ago I removed the chrome on some Budd car shells by using Easy Off Oven Cleaner.    I applied the Easy Off and let it stay on for about 30 minutes or so and then brushed the loose chrome off.  I had to repeat this process several times on some of the cars but I eventually got it all off.     I had read about using Easy Off Oven Cleaner in one of the S publications and it did work.   These were not rare collectables because the chrome was flaking badly on all the cars.  If you are lucky enough to have chromed cars that are not flaking, I recommend you leave them as they are.  There are enough junk Budd shells including a lot of painted cars.       -  Earl Henry, Nashville         In a message dated 2/10/2016 5:31:33 P.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   !. I would like to know how to get the old chrome finish on AF cars off and clean....and then maybe re-chrome??? 2. Would love to have someone make tender water scoops, to fit under various AF tenders (Pennsy and NYC???) something that would look correct and be able to be glued/screwed on 3. Sure could use a bunch of S passenger car diaphrgms Some thoughts for your son????   Thanks Peter L. From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 5:00 AM Subject: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they where made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. [Unable to display image] Any ideas on other products? I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77473	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel...

My opinion of Flyonel (Lionel era American Flyer) comes from having worked in a hobby shop for twenty years, having owned and run most brands of S gauge locos and rolling stock, and rebuilding and customizing over thirty old Gilbert steam locos from junk boxes in the past ten years.  I run everything, much of it for hours at a time at train shows, and because my stuff is often before the public eye,  I value reliability, durability, and value for the price.     We sold all brands of S for some time, and got the most customer returns with Flyonel.  This was especially troubling because Flyonel cost more than the other brands, still used 1950's tooling, and was almost impossible to get parts for from the manufacturer.  S Helper and American models had far fewer defects and if we did need to repair something for a customer, there was seldom a problem getting whatever we needed from them.  On the other hand, we made a jig to hold the Flyonel trucks so we could glue them together because the problem was so common.  We even got to the point that we could adapt SHS couplers to Flyonel trucks by cutting the knuckle off and gluing on an SHS one so they had couplers that worked well.  We charged only for parts used.  The shop owners valued customer service. Since there were no electronics coming from Lionel, we would gut the loco and set it up to run as Gilbert did, or if the customer would spend the money replace the Lionel stuff with aftermarket vendor electronics such as Dallee or Electric Railroad Company we did that.   We were already doing this for Lionel O gauge 3 rail anyway.   Seeing all this going on, I modified the few pieces of Flyonel I'd bought and concentrated on purchasing SHS and AM after that as well as some Des Pains and Pacfic Rail.  Eventually all my locos were rebuilt wrecks because they were the most fun to do, were reliable, and far more cost effective. The only Flyonel I currently own are two Docksiders which are starting to get tired, but so far have done amazingly well for the price. I hold no favor for any manufacturer, nor am I a collector of any certain brand.  Yes, Flyonel looks better.  It would be shocking if it didn't with today's paint and graphics technology when compared to a sixty year old product.  But it's still not as well done as American Models, Des Plains or others.   Of course, as those who know me will tell you, I'm not typical of most S gaugers today.  I did S gauge a long time ago (1970's) and like to build and customize things.  Real value for a dollar still means something to me. Your mileage may vary..... Stumpy in Ahia ...certified grumpy old man. :-)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77474	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/10/2016
Subject: Lionel LLC products

I’ve been accused of being a shill for American Models, so let me do a little shilling for Lionel too. I’m sorry to read that so many people have had trouble with Lionel LLC’s new American Flyer, and I don’t doubt the problems are real. But I’ve bought a bunch of their new U33C, SD70, and ES44 diesels, and I’m very satisfied and pleased with all of them. I have a set of three, 2 SD70s & one ES44 that I’ve consisted together using NCEs DCC controller, and they’ll run all weekend pulling a 50 car train. If you were at the Spring Spree last year you probably saw that train. I haven’t kept a scorecard as I’ve read all the messages, but my impression was that most of the locomotive problems were with steam engines. Well, you know, the real railroads had more maintenance and repair work with steam locos than they cared for, which is part of what drove the conversion to diesels. "A boy wants realism," Mr Gilbert has been quoted as saying. ( http://tombarker.net/Gilbert_American_Flyer_Trains/Gilbert_%26_A_F_History.html ) There’s your realism. Tom Hawley – Lansing Michigan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77475	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel...

Hi...you are correct sir...I have had similar experiences ....IDEA!!!....send a copy of this email to all Lionel department heads and their general public address. Peter Loeb From: "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 7:55 PM Subject: [S-Trains] RE: Lionel...   My opinion of Flyonel (Lionel era American Flyer) comes from having worked in a hobby shop for twenty years, having owned and run most brands of S gauge locos and rolling stock, and rebuilding and customizing over thirty old Gilbert steam locos from junk boxes in the past ten years.  I run everything, much of it for hours at a time at train shows, and because my stuff is often before the public eye,  I value reliability, durability, and value for the price.     We sold all brands of S for some time, and got the most customer returns with Flyonel.  This was especially troubling because Flyonel cost more than the other brands, still used 1950's tooling, and was almost impossible to get parts for from the manufacturer.  S Helper and American models had far fewer defects and if we did need to repair something for a customer, there was seldom a problem getting whatever we needed from them.  On the other hand, we made a jig to hold the Flyonel trucks so we could glue them together because the problem was so common.  We even got to the point that we could adapt SHS couplers to Flyonel trucks by cutting the knuckle off and gluing on an SHS one so they had couplers that worked well.  We charged only for parts used.  The shop owners valued customer service. Since there were no electronics coming from Lionel, we would gut the loco and set it up to run as Gilbert did, or if the customer would spend the money replace the Lionel stuff with aftermarket vendor electronics such as Dallee or Electric Railroad Company we did that.   We were already doing this for Lionel O gauge 3 rail anyway.   Seeing all this going on, I modified the few pieces of Flyonel I'd bought and concentrated on purchasing SHS and AM after that as well as some Des Pains and Pacfic Rail.  Eventually all my locos were rebuilt wrecks because they were the most fun to do, were reliable, and far more cost effective. The only Flyonel I currently own are two Docksiders which are starting to get tired, but so far have done amazingly well for the price. I hold no favor for any manufacturer, nor am I a collector of any certain brand.  Yes, Flyonel looks better.  It would be shocking if it didn't with today's paint and graphics technology when compared to a sixty year old product.  But it's still not as well done as American Models, Des Plains or others.   Of course, as those who know me will tell you, I'm not typical of most S gaugers today.  I did S gauge a long time ago (1970's) and like to build and customize things.  Real value for a dollar still means something to me. Your mileage may vary..... Stumpy in Ahia ...certified grumpy old man. :-)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77476	From: mlprell	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Help With a 314 AW

I'm in the process of repairing my 314AW.  Last evening I dis-assembled the Whistle box in the tender and discovered two wafer-like items under the 6 screw plates. Both are in fairly gunked-up shape, suggesting to me that they need attention. Can these be cleaned and if so, with what? If not, are replacements available? Any help will be greatly appreciated. Mike Prell

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77477	From: Dr Trains	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

Hi Earl...Appreciate the quick response....the easy off method is certainly possible, fumes/heavy duty chemicals though....I may try this approach outside, with gloves and eye protection.... How are things model train wise in Tennessee, miss the NE group in and around Johnson City..was hoping to find a home with a large layout space...tried for more than three months...just did not happen, finally found home in Nampa idaho, near Boise....and a large double garage which is still waiting for me to build my "last" layout....if my health improves. best to you, Peter Loeb From: "tennsgauge@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 7:35 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   Back about 35 or 40 years ago I removed the chrome on some Budd car shells by using Easy Off Oven Cleaner.    I applied the Easy Off and let it stay on for about 30 minutes or so and then brushed the loose chrome off.  I had to repeat this process several times on some of the cars but I eventually got it all off.     I had read about using Easy Off Oven Cleaner in one of the S publications and it did work.   These were not rare collectables because the chrome was flaking badly on all the cars.  If you are lucky enough to have chromed cars that are not flaking, I recommend you leave them as they are.  There are enough junk Budd shells including a lot of painted cars.       -  Earl Henry, Nashville         In a message dated 2/10/2016 5:31:33 P.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   !. I would like to know how to get the old chrome finish on AF cars off and clean....and then maybe re-chrome??? 2. Would love to have someone make tender water scoops, to fit under various AF tenders (Pennsy and NYC???) something that would look correct and be able to be glued/screwed on 3. Sure could use a bunch of S passenger car diaphrgms Some thoughts for your son????   Thanks Peter L. From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 5:00 AM Subject: [S-Trains] AM passenger cars question?   Since my son will be able to chrome plate any thing. I was considering having him chrome plate a set of AM passenger cars.  These cars do not look like they where made in stainless steel. I had a chrome Comet set as a kid.  I always wanted another in Santa Fe. Jimmy works for Universal Studios and has take a course from a distributor of chroming products. [Unable to display image] Any ideas on other products? I was considering making a train of the future from the Disneyland monorail. It looks like it will fit over a NSSL power truck. Jimmy is a model maker and can mold any thing.  Trying to come up with a car to kit bash from the Disney Land set. It look like the skirt would cover  using any kind of trucks. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77478	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: AM passenger cars question?

Ammonia strips chrome almost instantly. Spray it with Windex, and watch what happens. We also re-chrome….vacuum-plating, not chrome “paint”. Details in one of our Repair Clinics.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77479	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

I should have also mentioned----there is a SEARCH button in the upper right of the homepage. Type in a key word (don’t get TOO specific) and you’ll immediately get a listing of every occurrence of that word throughout the entire website and all inventories….and you can immediately order directly from that spot !  Then go back and SEARCH another term !   How easy can that get !!!!   Every week, I get an automated report of all SEARCH results----terms that have been searched, and how many times.  It gets a lot of use, but not as much as one would expect. Also on ANY page, you can also use Ctrl-F to find a specific term on that page.  Very useful, especially on a lengthy inventory page such as the Prewar AF parts page.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77480	From: NEIL FERRIS	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

Thanks Doug!  I have found these 2 tips to be extremely useful.  If I were to give any constructive criticism, I would say the items on the drop down menus are a little narrow and it's tricky to keep your pointer on the line you want.   The search box works well and that's what I've been using. Thanks for all you do for the hobby, Neil in Oregon On Thursday, February 11, 2016 7:27 AM, "'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I should have also mentioned----there is a SEARCH button in the upper right of the homepage. Type in a key word (don’t get TOO specific) and you’ll immediately get a listing of every occurrence of that word throughout the entire website and all inventories….and you can immediately order directly from that spot !  Then go back and SEARCH another term !   How easy can that get !!!!   Every week, I get an automated report of all SEARCH results----terms that have been searched, and how many times.  It gets a lot of use, but not as much as one would expect. Also on ANY page, you can also use Ctrl-F to find a specific term on that page.  Very useful, especially on a lengthy inventory page such as the Prewar AF parts page.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77481	From: Bob Groh	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

Ah, Tom, you got a chuckle from me with your email about Lionel, quality with a great comment about diesel vs. steam engines. Maybe we need a bit less 'true to real life' in our 'model' trains!! Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 10:20 PM, 'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I’ve been accused of being a shill for American Models, so let me do a little shilling for Lionel too. I’m sorry to read that so many people have had trouble with Lionel LLC’s new American Flyer, and I don’t doubt the problems are real. But I’ve bought a bunch of their new U33C, SD70, and ES44 diesels, and I’m very satisfied and pleased with all of them. I have a set of three, 2 SD70s & one ES44 that I’ve consisted together using NCEs DCC controller, and they’ll run all weekend pulling a 50 car train. If you were at the Spring Spree last year you probably saw that train. I haven’t kept a scorecard as I’ve read all the messages, but my impression was that most of the locomotive problems were with steam engines. Well, you know, the real railroads had more maintenance and repair work with steam locos than they cared for, which is part of what drove the conversion to diesels. "A boy wants realism," Mr Gilbert has been quoted as saying. ( http://tombarker.net/Gilbert_American_Flyer_Trains/Gilbert_%26_A_F_History.html ) There’s your realism. Tom Hawley – Lansing Michigan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77482	From: doheld	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: RRM Milw.Rd. Boxcar 50'-7" for sale

Imlay Train Station still has one RRM Milw.Rd. Boxcar 50'-7" for sale.  $200.00 in original box (plus p0stage).  See Imlay Train Station Imlay Train Station Imlay Train Station sells and distributes new and used S Scale rolling stock and locomotives. View on www.imlaytrains.com Preview by Yahoo

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77483	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

Doug - I would ditto what Neil shared about the drop-down menu.  By the time I get over to the specific item, the bar exits and I had y go back over to the left and start over. I can relate to your frustration in getting an efficient website operation when you have to depend on others' experise. Jim E. From: "NEIL FERRIS bowlsalot2@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2016 8:51:56 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Port Lines website   Thanks Doug!  I have found these 2 tips to be extremely useful.  If I were to give any constructive criticism, I would say the items on the drop down menus are a little narrow and it's tricky to keep your pointer on the line you want.   The search box works well and that's what I've been using. Thanks for all you do for the hobby, Neil in Oregon On Thursday, February 11, 2016 7:27 AM, "'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I should have also mentioned----there is a SEARCH button in the upper right of the homepage. Type in a key word (don’t get TOO specific) and you’ll immediately get a listing of every occurrence of that word throughout the entire website and all inventories….and you can immediately order directly from that spot !  Then go back and SEARCH another term !   How easy can that get !!!!   Every week, I get an automated report of all SEARCH results----terms that have been searched, and how many times.  It gets a lot of use, but not as much as one would expect. Also on ANY page, you can also use Ctrl-F to find a specific term on that page.  Very useful, especially on a lengthy inventory page such as the Prewar AF parts page.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77484	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

I don;t have any experience with Flyonel locomotives but i did recently purchase 4 of their BN cylindrical hoppers. They do have scale wheels but have the truck mounted couplers which I have never liked. I have been removing the BN logo, name and BN number so as to add the reporting marks and number for the BA&P. the base body color is the same so i have to work so as to not remove body paint. I am also going to add 100 ton roller bearing trucks and Kadee body mount couplers. All-in-all these are very nice models.                           Bob Lampe                           Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77485	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/11/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

Ah —- To all the younger whipper snappers who have never experienced the awesome power of  a steam locomotive.   Felt the mighty beast start a heavy consist.  Felt the ground as the drivers spin trying to grasp traction.  Witnessed the glow of the fire box on a cold winter night.   Heard the whistle moan “clear the tracks her I come” !  Felt the air blast as a passenger train roars passed at full speed.  Witnessed the mail arm grab a mail bag and nearly at the same time deposit a bag  and watch it bounce along the ground.  Watch the whisker of steam off the engine piping ports.  Felt the cinders sprinkle your head.  The air compressor chomping air and the squeal of brake shoes bringing a train to a stop.  The sounds of signal charges, that were strapped to the rails detonating under the engines weight.  The sight of a double or triple header working hard under heavy load. The guard shanties at major crossings .   The track gangs driving spikes with their long beak hammers, many times singing in unison,as one on each side of the track took runs driving the spikes home. Or moving a newly built track section into alignment. Today is a different world as the necessity for lower operating cost came about.  Railroading  began to lose money as modern highways were developed.   More and more efficient motive power was and is required in todays world of railroading, but it does little to stir the imagination.  Massive volumes of freight can be moved by rail versus truck - but delivery times to a final destination cannot be matched. Gone are those days of the real railroading  of our youth —- which brought forth the imagination in every boy.  - “someday I would want to be in control of all that power”   Diesels - hum and that is about it - nothing to nurture the imagination.  May be modern day railroading  but no real interest at train shows among the kids.  My OLD Gilbert  flyers run just fine after 65 years and counting.  An old  guy just saying, Al in Hamilton On Feb 11, 2016, at 12:28 PM, Bob Groh bob.groh@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Ah, Tom, you got a chuckle from me with your email about Lionel, quality with a great comment about diesel vs. steam engines. Maybe we need a bit less 'true to real life' in our 'model' trains!! Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 10:20 PM, 'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I’ve been accused of being a shill for American Models, so let me do a little shilling for Lionel too. I’m sorry to read that so many people have had trouble with Lionel LLC’s new American Flyer, and I don’t doubt the problems are real. But I’ve bought a bunch of their new U33C, SD70, and ES44 diesels, and I’m very satisfied and pleased with all of them. I have a set of three, 2 SD70s & one ES44 that I’ve consisted together using NCEs DCC controller, and they’ll run all weekend pulling a 50 car train. If you were at the Spring Spree last year you probably saw that train. I haven’t kept a scorecard as I’ve read all the messages, but my impression was that most of the locomotive problems were with steam engines. Well, you know, the real railroads had more maintenance and repair work with steam locos than they cared for, which is part of what drove the conversion to diesels. "A boy wants realism," Mr Gilbert has been quoted as saying. ( http://tombarker.net/Gilbert_American_Flyer_Trains/Gilbert_%26_A_F_History.html ) There’s your realism. Tom Hawley – Lansing Michigan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77486	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

65 years from Now Al, I'll bet some old geezers like us will be keeping them and the new ones running. All the kids today will be learning electronics and will replace them just the same as we replaced brushes and springs and learned how to rewind and re-bush the Gilbert trains. Gilbert was not perfect either. And a lot of guys have selective memory. When I was a kid and received my American Flyer 336 it always was going in the shop for something to be repaired. My 355 Baldwin never ran right. So I know for a dang fact that Gilbert Trains had the same problems as todays American Flyer. Also Couplers back in the day. I have a boat load that had to be glued shut in order to get them to work.   I'm sorry , but I have been playing with my AF since I was 5 and I am just about 59 now. I have also worked in Hobby shops and even owned my own. I have repaired, re-motored, restored and done it all too.I believe my "opinion" is just as good as someone else's "opinion." Want to see a picture of the glued couplers? I still have them all. My 355 Baldwin I still have and finally last December I got it to run using a new Can motor conversion from SnS. Ha, Bet AC never saw those coming.  A C Gilbert American Flyer was no better than what is made today.  The problem today is we have social media so everyone can see a complaint all over the internet when something happens.  Back in the day, Word of mouth and Party line telephones if you were lucky to have one.  Today we have an outlet to piss and moan over and over about an item that has a wheel fall off, or a broken coulper, or a smashed car which could or could not be broken after it left the factory due to sorry people working in the post office, UPS or FED EX that are to lazy to set a package down and instead toss it.   So I still say that just because the Holding company uses the Lionell LLC branding to Market the trains. It does not mean that American Flyer is owned or made by Lionel. They Market on the Lionel website because the name is much more popular than the American Flyer Name. No More No less.Enough said. Stubborn nit wits want to call it Flyonel then Call it Flyonel.  As far as the steam train thing Alan I agree with you.  Sorry for the rant again.  Good day, Chris Burger AKA Cbtrainnut in OHIO.( Learn how to spell) From: "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2016 6:24 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC products    Ah —- To all the younger whipper snappers who have never experienced the awesome power of  a steam locomotive.   Felt the mighty beast start a heavy consist.  Felt the ground as the drivers spin trying to grasp traction.  Witnessed the glow of the fire box on a cold winter night.   Heard the whistle moan “clear the tracks her I come” !  Felt the air blast as a passenger train roars passed at full speed.  Witnessed the mail arm grab a mail bag and nearly at the same time deposit a bag  and watch it bounce along the ground.  Watch the whisker of steam off the engine piping ports.  Felt the cinders sprinkle your head.  The air compressor chomping air and the squeal of brake shoes bringing a train to a stop.  The sounds of signal charges, that were strapped to the rails detonating under the engines weight.  The sight of a double or triple header working hard under heavy load. The guard shanties at major crossings .   The track gangs driving spikes with their long beak hammers, many times singing in unison,as one on each side of the track took runs driving the spikes home. Or moving a newly built track section into alignment. Today is a different world as the necessity for lower operating cost came about.  Railroading  began to lose money as modern highways were developed.   More and more efficient motive power was and is required in todays world of railroading, but it does little to stir the imagination.  Massive volumes of freight can be moved by rail versus truck - but delivery times to a final destination cannot be matched. Gone are those days of the real railroading  of our youth —- which brought forth the imagination in every boy.  - “someday I would want to be in control of all that power”   Diesels - hum and that is about it - nothing to nurture the imagination.  May be modern day railroading  but no real interest at train shows among the kids.  My OLD Gilbert  flyers run just fine after 65 years and counting.  An old  guy just saying, Al in Hamilton On Feb 11, 2016, at 12:28 PM, Bob Groh bob.groh@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Ah, Tom, you got a chuckle from me with your email about Lionel, quality with a great comment about diesel vs. steam engines. Maybe we need a bit less 'true to real life' in our 'model' trains!! Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 10:20 PM, 'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I’ve been accused of being a shill for American Models, so let me do a little shilling for Lionel too. I’m sorry to read that so many people have had trouble with Lionel LLC’s new American Flyer, and I don’t doubt the problems are real. But I’ve bought a bunch of their new U33C, SD70, and ES44 diesels, and I’m very satisfied and pleased with all of them. I have a set of three, 2 SD70s & one ES44 that I’ve consisted together using NCEs DCC controller, and they’ll run all weekend pulling a 50 car train. If you were at the Spring Spree last year you probably saw that train. I haven’t kept a scorecard as I’ve read all the messages, but my impression was that most of the locomotive problems were with steam engines. Well, you know, the real railroads had more maintenance and repair work with steam locos than they cared for, which is part of what drove the conversion to diesels. "A boy wants realism," Mr Gilbert has been quoted as saying. ( http://tombarker.net/Gilbert_American_Flyer_Trains/Gilbert_%26_A_F_History.html ) There’s your realism. Tom Hawley – Lansing Michigan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77487	From: lx5043	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Port Lines website

Doug, you can't teach people how to use the computer. Trying not to be a sycophant I find your revised website intuitive and fairly easy to navigate. Like anything new there is a slight learning curve. I do have one request however for possible future improvement of the website. Most of the items you sell are very familiar to the members of our group and to Flyer hobbyists in general, but not all items. I have come across some items that could really use a link to a photo for clarification. If this is practical or possible for the person who works on your website in would in my opinion be a very helpful option. Remember, you are not just a business but you perform a service for all of us in the hobby by helping to keep it alive. We depend on you, at least I know I do. Thanks for all you do to support the model train hobby, hope to see you at York. Regards, John Palmisano

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77488	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail

I am looking for at least 3 American Hi-Rail DL109 shells, painted, unpainted what ever. John Griffin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77489	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Generation Gap

The discussion of Lionel has declined into the typical "I love 'em/I hate 'em" thing so common online.  But even so, there may be something to be learned.  For instance, I notice that in this case, part of the difference of opinion could be due to a "generation gap" in toy and model train enthusiasts.  And in this case the gap may only be a few years, number of "bells and whistles" desired, or the amount of money which can be spent Basically, older folks tend to demand more value for the dollar and to use things for years and years.  I'm almost 66 and my parents were "children of the Depression."  Because the people who bought my toys demanded reliability and durability for a reasonable price, my toys were crude compared to today's, yet have proven their quality and durability as we grumpy old folks are STILL playing with them! Younger folks, who did not grow up with such tight fisted parents as mine, benefited from better technology toys, and want detail, sound, and special control systems.  They have grown up with more money to spend than I did, and with better toys. "Different strokes for different folks," you might say.  I was brought up spending less money and developing skills to compensate.  More recent toy and model train folks tend to see things from a nearly opposite viewpoint, so there will be differences in focus and opinion. I have also observed that in more recent years we all will accept less reliability and durability as normal because even very high dollar products don't last as long as they used to.  For instance, I've been married over 39 years, and we're only on our second washer and dryer set, while my nieces, none of which are yet 39 years old, let alone married that long, are already on their second!  My parents used to gripe about this turn of events almost daily to the day they died.  As I age I am seeing what they did. As for real life steam locomotives being more maintenance and labor intensive than diesels, that is VERY true!  I've ridden in the cabs of both, and I can tell you that, as much as I love steam, I'd rather run diesels for a living. However, that is not applicable to toy or model trains, and is not an excuse for poor engineering and quality control.  Certainly toy steamers are tougher to make than toy diesels, but at the prices charged for steam, there's no excuse for "dropping the ball."   But, I'm an old guy.  I see the world through different eyes.   Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77490	From: racin510	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

My feeling is that new American Flyer is quite well engineered, better so as it should be than the originals. However, quality control on the production line along with real world testing can't compare to what went on in AC's Hew Haven works back in the day. Rick  [last Flyer running in Seattle]

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77491	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

As I stated previously I like the new Flyer(Flyonel) as it seems to be well built but again I have no experiences as yet with locomotives. I have been told that virtually all of the Flyonel stuff is easily converted to scale which is my preference. I do not begrudge anyone who prefers "tinplate" over scale because like me it is their choice. I look at it this way....If it makes you happy running it then who cares? And if someone does not like it that is their problem. I am sorry to hear that some of you have had less than good luck running your locomotives. Hopefully those bugs will be worked out and those locomotives will give years of flawless service. When I was in HO (God forbid) I would sometimes get a locomotive that would not run no matter what I did to it until I'd swap out a motor. Tyco and the original Life-Like were two I had problems with. I had a Bachmann Northern one time that had a really funky motor in it so I got the old Dremel out and made a motor mount and added a Sagami can motor. That thing ran like a charm as long as I had it. So I would venture to say that given time Lionel will get the bugs worked out.               Bob Lampe               Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77492	From: traindavid	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC, steam & chrome plating

first I'll mention chrome plating, IMHO, Nickel plating would look a lot more like stainless steel. I still think the poor sales figures for the WP Zephyr set we/are because of the lousy finish on them. IF they'd been nickel-plated, I think they would have flown off the shelves, in spite of the WP never having had PAs. That dull silver finish made the WPs engine scheme look boring; and I'm partial to it, having been (I believe) the last person to have applied that paint scheme to a real locomotive (WP 805A). Ah mainline steam! Al, your posting re-kindled memories. Although I was around steam while younger, it was the McCloud River Railroad, a logging railroad, so the steam I was used to was seldom running very fast. But in 1977, the Royal Hudson steam engine from Canada with a string of period matching Vermillion smooth-sided passenger cars did a promotional tour of the west, and she came through Dunsmuir & Redding. We had a meeting, or something, in Redding the night she went south; so we waited at the train station for her passing, somewhere close to midnight, I believe it was. First you heard the whistle in the distance, echoing off the low valley beneath the high trestle that brings the mainline into Redding proper. So we were ready! Then the headlight appears in the distance, and again the whistle, louder still,and haunting in the night air, for the crossings just before the station. And Whoosh! A flash of lights and motions streaks past you, and you feel a rush of air, the heat off the cylinders and the firebox, and then the smell of the exhaust. Clickity-clack, Clickity-clack as the train's wheels go over the rail joint nearby, all the time this blur of vermillion-sided cars and window lights assails your eyes. And then it's gone, just a red tail light disappearing into the distance, and an occasional "clank" of a side rod as she 'hunts' down the straight track at speed. She whistles for the crossings ahead, the sound becoming fainter each time. The smell of the engine still wafts around you, leaving you spellbound for a minute, before you think to find the now-flat bi-centennial quarter you put on the track (Yes, I know, that's a bit of a dangerous thing to do, the wheels could have spit it out at a high velocity and injure someone--but, hey, I was much younger then!). It was nothing like watching the McCloud 25 steam by; I was totally unprepared for the sensory overload it provided, and I feel privileged to have witnessed it.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77493	From: racin510	Date: 2/12/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

Don't count on it because it's all about electronics, boards if you will; the more of it the more issues. Be very careful spending big bucks for those fancy new washers and dryers, though unlike Lionel they will likely make it thru the warranty period!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77494	From: poniaj	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

Agreed on electronic boards.  Our REFRIGERATOR has one!  During a power failure, it fried, and cost a bundle to replace.  But now I know where to get the board at a third the price we were charged for its replacement by a technician.  The trouble with Lionel's boards is that they're not available!  For a company NOT to have repair parts is inexcusable.  But most of my problems with their products have been quality control issues.  A broken shell due to poor assembly, a cruise control band simply FALLING off the flywheel, a poorly located LED headlight affixed by hot glue, wrong frames used on passenger cars, etc. I tend to agree that the engineering at Lionel is just fine.  But better than A.C. and Co.?  Perhaps.  Almost everything is better engineered nowadays.   At least more complicated which necessitates better engineering.  But A.C. did all their things with relays and solenoids rather than PC boards.  More technology, not better engineering?  I'll leave that for others to argue about.  ;>) Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77495	From: beebear	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

I guess I don’t see the problem!! At LEAST they are making stuff we can run. I mean I was buying S Helper and American Models stuff for a while.  Who would be complaining if everyone just STOPPED building ‘Flyer equipment all together????   Just get over yourself and enjoy what is being made. If you DON”T like it DON’T buy it!!   John   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 3:14 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel LLC products     My feeling is that new American Flyer is quite well engineered, better so as it should be than the originals. However, quality control on the production line along with real world testing can't compare to what went on in AC's Hew Haven works back in the day. Rick  [last Flyer running in Seattle] This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77496	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: UP ALSO SHELLS

Good Morning All - I'm looking to buy two Union Pacific ALCO diesel loco shells.  Anyone have a couple they would like to get rid of? Jim Ensign

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77497	From: traindavid	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

As has been mentioned here, ACG also had product problems, just as "Flyonel" has problems. Back in '46 the steam locomotives were recalled because the insulators came loose on the drive wheels. The fix was to drill the wheels in three places (some guys did four) and insert wooden pegs; these repairs were done at the "Authorized Service Stations" mostly, but some large retailers were visited by the "factory Rep" who did the fix "in warehouse." Yes, the 355 Baldwins (and all the 4-step reverse unit Baldwins) had/have a design flaw; the motor is engineered for a lower amperage than the reverse unit requires to cycle, so it zooms down the track and suddenly "click!" and it stops in neutral. The modern fix is to take the green wire, which goes from one truck straight to the motor, disconnect it at one end, take a RS full wave bridge rectifier chip, connect the DC output leads together, and connect the ends of the green wire to the AC leads; this drops the voltage to the motor about 2 to 3 volts and lets the reverse unit activate before the motor moves much. It also gives you better slow speed. For the collector, this is an easily reversible fix even. However, I didn't start this thread to explain how to fix ACG Flyer, but to discuss the big differences between the two manufactures. Back to product "recalls;" Back in the 90s Flyonel produced a wonderful reproduction of the ACG Northern Pacific passenger train; however, someone there, using 3-rail logic, decided to "improve" the couplers by making them out of die-cast metal. This works fine on 3-rail, where the trucks are all connected to the same side of the electric circuit, but not on two-rail where each truck is picking up one side or the other of the electrical circuit. As soon as the paint, serving as an insulator, wears off, the couplers become a short circuit! When I get around to regularly operating my NP set, I will have to change out the couplers to the plastic versions. This would have been a product recall "in the old days." On to manufacturing "philosophy." ACG used a standard design that kept their production costs down. The steamer motors were all the same through the line; although there were design improvements. This kept parts inventories down and production costs down. Same with the diesels, until the Baldwin. Same with the 4-step reverse units, although mounting methods changed, as did the location of the lock-out lever. The same SIB smoke unit fit all (except the late production units, which sometimes were the HO smoke unit), even with design changes (elimination of the bottom plate, change in orientation of the heating element, etc.). This continuity of design allowed improvements as problems were discovered (steam drive wheels went through at least 3 design changes, that are not readily visible on an assembled wheel). I do not see this continuity in Flyonel production; it seems that each locomotive offered is designed from scratch; although the diesel power trucks do seem to be standardized. This makes it harder to keep parts available, and there's the next BIG difference: parts & service. ACG knew their trains would need servicing, they created break-down parts lists and a franchise of service stations to do repairs and a parts department with a stock of replacement parts--so many parts that even today, brand new "old stock"parts can be had. In the early 1960s, my dad had our 1955 307 repaired (I forget the problems, I was too young yet to do them myself; maybe my older brothers (whose locomotive it originally was) "experimented" with it). It was no problem (except we lived in the mountains and the service station was 150 miles away). I know from personal experience (and I still have one of the letters) that ACG would write back to an 11-year-old kid who hand-wrote that he needed some parts for his train. They would even send a copy of the parts diagram so I could order the proper pieces., and filled my order! I do not see this level of service/caring from the present manufacturers. (American Models, however has been very helpful like this--if you're reading this, thank you Ron! And SHS was/still is too! So thank you Don!) Some will say, "But that's just the way it is in this modern world." I say "WHY?" With the ease of communications we have, and the ability to send money instantly, why is service no longer done? When I was a kid, you hand-wrote the letter, put it in an envelope, Leo (our mailman) would take it out of our home's mailbox and off it would go to New Haven 6, Conn (boy is that ingrained into my memory banks). A few weeks later Leo would drop off an envelope from The A. C. Gilbert Co. and inside would be a price list and diagram of my sick locomotive. OK, I'd figure out what parts I needed, Compose a letter, by hand, back to them, and enclose, carefully wrapped up, my $3.50 for the parts and shipping. Put this all in an envelope, and into my mailbox; Leo would pick it up, and about 3 weeks later a small package would arrive from The A. C. Gilbert Co. with all my needed parts. Gee, I can play with my train again!! Nowadays this could all happen with a simple email; in one day the order would be made & paid for, and then we're back to the 1950s, waiting for the package to arrive! Why doesn't it happen this way? Not to be commercial, but it did just this week, I called Ron at American models, he told me what parts I'd need, went online, ordered them (here's where life changes, the parts were $10, shipping was $6, oh well. . . ) and yesterday a padded envelope arrived in my mailbox. The RS-3 will run again! Life can be good. . . . And don't tell me that Flyonel is too big to do that, ACG was big too, a giant in the toy industry, yet they did it! IMHO, Flyonel could take a lesson. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77498	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Removing chrome and rechroming

A while back Earl Henry mentioned a means of removing the flaking and peeling chrome plating from models. This method does work and works quite well BUT what about getting that nice shiny stainless steel look back. rechroming can be a PITA. There is an alternative. Maybe not easier but surely less costly than rechroming. Microscale (yup the decal folks) has a product called Micro Metal Foil Adhesive that will actually cement aluminum foil to models. You can even simulate the weathering on stainless steel depending on which side of the foil you have facing out. You apply the adhesive to the foil and by working very carefully burnish it to the area you want to cover then cut any openings for windows doors etc. By taking your time and working slowly and carefully you can produce a prize winning model.    Bob Lampe    Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77499	From: Kyle	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: American Models GG1 lettering removal?

Does anyone have experience in removing just the lettering from an AM GG1 (in green) without damaging the underlying paint?   I want to change the number to that of the GG1 in the PA RR Museum and don’t want to even attempt to repaint the whole shell.   Our club will be setting up our modular layout there this August and I want to have the matching GG1 for the show.   Kyle Russell BAAFC 447 NASG 06F0022E

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77500	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

So, back to customer service and the New American Flyer.  It was just 8 years ago my German Shepard decided he wanted to have a meal on two of my Christmas car Boxes.  I wrote an Email to the Customer Service Dept. A week later I had two new boxes with the correct labels for the Christmas cars that had been all chewed up. No cost to me either. I have had other small issues come up over the years and never Have I had Customer service tell me they can't help. So I guess it is just how some want to see the New American Flyer Trains. I choose to see in a good light and I choose to call them American Flyer. The rest of yopu can continue calling them by the stupid name you all made up. Happy in America with My American Flyer Trains, New and Old. Chris Burger AKA CBtrainnut From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 3:19 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products   As has been mentioned here, ACG also had product problems, just as "Flyonel" has problems. Back in '46 the steam locomotives were recalled because the insulators came loose on the drive wheels. The fix was to drill the wheels in three places (some guys did four) and insert wooden pegs; these repairs were done at the "Authorized Service Stations" mostly, but some large retailers were visited by the "factory Rep" who did the fix "in warehouse." Yes, the 355 Baldwins (and all the 4-step reverse unit Baldwins) had/have a design flaw; the motor is engineered for a lower amperage than the reverse unit requires to cycle, so it zooms down the track and suddenly "click!" and it stops in neutral. The modern fix is to take the green wire, which goes from one truck straight to the motor, disconnect it at one end, take a RS full wave bridge rectifier chip, connect the DC output leads together, and connect the ends of the green wire to the AC leads; this drops the voltage to the motor about 2 to 3 volts and lets the reverse unit activate before the motor moves much. It also gives you better slow speed. For the collector, this is an easily reversible fix even. However, I didn't start this thread to explain how to fix ACG Flyer, but to discuss the big differences between the two manufactures. Back to product "recalls;" Back in the 90s Flyonel produced a wonderful reproduction of the ACG Northern Pacific passenger train; however, someone there, using 3-rail logic, decided to "improve" the couplers by making them out of die-cast metal. This works fine on 3-rail, where the trucks are all connected to the same side of the electric circuit, but not on two-rail where each truck is picking up one side or the other of the electrical circuit. As soon as the paint, serving as an insulator, wears off, the couplers become a short circuit! When I get around to regularly operating my NP set, I will have to change out the couplers to the plastic versions. This would have been a product recall "in the old days." On to manufacturing "philosophy." ACG used a standard design that kept their production costs down. The steamer motors were all the same through the line; although there were design improvements. This kept parts inventories down and production costs down. Same with the diesels, until the Baldwin. Same with the 4-step reverse units, although mounting methods changed, as did the location of the lock-out lever. The same SIB smoke unit fit all (except the late production units, which sometimes were the HO smoke unit), even with design changes (elimination of the bottom plate, change in orientation of the heating element, etc.). This continuity of design allowed improvements as problems were discovered (steam drive wheels went through at least 3 design changes, that are not readily visible on an assembled wheel). I do not see this continuity in Flyonel production; it seems that each locomotive offered is designed from scratch; although the diesel power trucks do seem to be standardized. This makes it harder to keep parts available, and there's the next BIG difference: parts & service. ACG knew their trains would need servicing, they created break-down parts lists and a franchise of service stations to do repairs and a parts department with a stock of replacement parts--so many parts that even today, brand new "old stock"parts can be had. In the early 1960s, my dad had our 1955 307 repaired (I forget the problems, I was too young yet to do them myself; maybe my older brothers (whose locomotive it originally was) "experimented" with it). It was no problem (except we lived in the mountains and the service station was 150 miles away). I know from personal experience (and I still have one of the letters) that ACG would write back to an 11-year-old kid who hand-wrote that he needed some parts for his train. They would even send a copy of the parts diagram so I could order the proper pieces., and filled my order! I do not see this level of service/caring from the present manufacturers. (American Models, however has been very helpful like this--if you're reading this, thank you Ron! And SHS was/still is too! So thank you Don!) Some will say, "But that's just the way it is in this modern world." I say "WHY?" With the ease of communications we have, and the ability to send money instantly, why is service no longer done? When I was a kid, you hand-wrote the letter, put it in an envelope, Leo (our mailman) would take it out of our home's mailbox and off it would go to New Haven 6, Conn (boy is that ingrained into my memory banks). A few weeks later Leo would drop off an envelope from The A. C. Gilbert Co. and inside would be a price list and diagram of my sick locomotive. OK, I'd figure out what parts I needed, Compose a letter, by hand, back to them, and enclose, carefully wrapped up, my $3.50 for the parts and shipping. Put this all in an envelope, and into my mailbox; Leo would pick it up, and about 3 weeks later a small package would arrive from The A. C. Gilbert Co. with all my needed parts. Gee, I can play with my train again!! Nowadays this could all happen with a simple email; in one day the order would be made & paid for, and then we're back to the 1950s, waiting for the package to arrive! Why doesn't it happen this way? Not to be commercial, but it did just this week, I called Ron at American models, he told me what parts I'd need, went online, ordered them (here's where life changes, the parts were $10, shipping was $6, oh well. . . ) and yesterday a padded envelope arrived in my mailbox. The RS-3 will run again! Life can be good. . . . And don't tell me that Flyonel is too big to do that, ACG was big too, a giant in the toy industry, yet they did it! IMHO, Flyonel could take a lesson. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77501	From: Larry Moore	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

Attachments : To all participants, After almost a week of this back and forth over this topic, I for one would like to see you put this subject to rest. We all have our opinions, about politics, religion, and obviously, Lionel’s version of American Flyer. All of the statements and all of the rebuttals are not going to change anybody’s, set in concrete, views one way or the other. Please put it to bed and find another argumentative topic. Thank you, Larry Moore   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 4:18 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products     So, back to customer service and the New American Flyer.  It was just 8 years ago my German Shepard decided he wanted to have a meal on two of my Christmas car Boxes.  I wrote an Email to the Customer Service Dept. A week later I had two new boxes with the correct labels for the Christmas cars that had been all chewed up. No cost to me either. I have had other small issues come up over the years and never Have I had Customer service tell me they can't help. So I guess it is just how some want to see the New American Flyer Trains. I choose to see in a good light and I choose to call them American Flyer. The rest of yopu can continue calling them by the stupid name you all made up. Happy in America with My American Flyer Trains, New and Old. Chris Burger AKA CBtrainnut   From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 3:19 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products     As has been mentioned here, ACG also had product problems, just as "Flyonel" has problems. Back in '46 the steam locomotives were recalled because the insulators came loose on the drive wheels. The fix was to drill the wheels in three places (some guys did four) and insert wooden pegs; these repairs were done at the "Authorized Service Stations" mostly, but some large retailers were visited by the "factory Rep" who did the fix "in warehouse." Yes, the 355 Baldwins (and all the 4-step reverse unit Baldwins) had/have a design flaw; the motor is engineered for a lower amperage than the reverse unit requires to cycle, so it zooms down the track and suddenly "click!" and it stops in neutral. The modern fix is to take the green wire, which goes from one truck straight to the motor, disconnect it at one end, take a RS full wave bridge rectifier chip, connect the DC output leads together, and connect the ends of the green wire to the AC leads; this drops the voltage to the motor about 2 to 3 volts and lets the reverse unit activate before the motor moves much. It also gives you better slow speed. For the collector, this is an easily reversible fix even. However, I didn't start this thread to explain how to fix ACG Flyer, but to discuss the big differences between the two manufactures. Back to product "recalls;" Back in the 90s Flyonel produced a wonderful reproduction of the ACG Northern Pacific passenger train; however, someone there, using 3-rail logic, decided to "improve" the couplers by making them out of die-cast metal. This works fine on 3-rail, where the trucks are all connected to the same side of the electric circuit, but not on two-rail where each truck is picking up one side or the other of the electrical circuit. As soon as the paint, serving as an insulator, wears off, the couplers become a short circuit! When I get around to regularly operating my NP set, I will have to change out the couplers to the plastic versions. This would have been a product recall "in the old days." On to manufacturing "philosophy." ACG used a standard design that kept their production costs down. The steamer motors were all the same through the line; although there were design improvements. This kept parts inventories down and production costs down. Same with the diesels, until the Baldwin. Same with the 4-step reverse units, although mounting methods changed, as did the location of the lock-out lever. The same SIB smoke unit fit all (except the late production units, which sometimes were the HO smoke unit), even with design changes (elimination of the bottom plate, change in orientation of the heating element, etc.). This continuity of design allowed improvements as problems were discovered (steam drive wheels went through at least 3 design changes, that are not readily visible on an assembled wheel). I do not see this continuity in Flyonel production; it seems that each locomotive offered is designed from scratch; although the diesel power trucks do seem to be standardized. This makes it harder to keep parts available, and there's the next BIG difference: parts & service. ACG knew their trains would need servicing, they created break-down parts lists and a franchise of service stations to do repairs and a parts department with a stock of replacement parts--so many parts that even today, brand new "old stock"parts can be had. In the early 1960s, my dad had our 1955 307 repaired (I forget the problems, I was too young yet to do them myself; maybe my older brothers (whose locomotive it originally was) "experimented" with it). It was no problem (except we lived in the mountains and the service station was 150 miles away). I know from personal experience (and I still have one of the letters) that ACG would write back to an 11-year-old kid who hand-wrote that he needed some parts for his train. They would even send a copy of the parts diagram so I could order the proper pieces., and filled my order! I do not see this level of service/caring from the present manufacturers. (American Models, however has been very helpful like this--if you're reading this, thank you Ron! And SHS was/still is too! So thank you Don!) Some will say, "But that's just the way it is in this modern world." I say "WHY?" With the ease of communications we have, and the ability to send money instantly, why is service no longer done? When I was a kid, you hand-wrote the letter, put it in an envelope, Leo (our mailman) would take it out of our home's mailbox and off it would go to New Haven 6, Conn (boy is that ingrained into my memory banks). A few weeks later Leo would drop off an envelope from The A. C. Gilbert Co. and inside would be a price list and diagram of my sick locomotive. OK, I'd figure out what parts I needed, Compose a letter, by hand, back to them, and enclose, carefully wrapped up, my $3.50 for the parts and shipping. Put this all in an envelope, and into my mailbox; Leo would pick it up, and about 3 weeks later a small package would arrive from The A. C. Gilbert Co. with all my needed parts. Gee, I can play with my train again!! Nowadays this could all happen with a simple email; in one day the order would be made & paid for, and then we're back to the 1950s, waiting for the package to arrive! Why doesn't it happen this way? Not to be commercial, but it did just this week, I called Ron at American models, he told me what parts I'd need, went online, ordered them (here's where life changes, the parts were $10, shipping was $6, oh well. . . ) and yesterday a padded envelope arrived in my mailbox. The RS-3 will run again! Life can be good. . . . And don't tell me that Flyonel is too big to do that, ACG was big too, a giant in the toy industry, yet they did it! IMHO, Flyonel could take a lesson. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77502	From: frank emiro	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: American Models GG1 lettering removal?

Why not call AM ? Frank R. EMIRO -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/13/16, 'Kyle' kbrussel@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] American Models GG1 lettering removal? To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, February 13, 2016, 4:58 PM   Does anyone have experience in removing just the lettering from an AM GG1 (in green) without damaging the underlying paint?  I want to change the number to that of the GG1 in the PA RR Museum and don’t want to even attempt to repaint the whole shell.  Our club will be setting up our modular layout there this August and I want to have the matching GG1 for the show.  Kyle RussellBAAFC 447NASG 06F0022E     #yiv0047568313 #yiv0047568313 -- #yiv0047568313ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv0047568313 #yiv0047568313ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv0047568313 #yiv0047568313ygrp-mkp #yiv0047568313hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv0047568313 #yiv0047568313ygrp-mkp #yiv0047568313ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv0047568313 #yiv0047568313ygrp-mkp .yiv0047568313ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv0047568313 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77503	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 14 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77504	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel LLC products

If you don't like the topic, skip over it. Nobody says you have to read or participate in it. Chris Burger, Stubborn AKA CBtrainnut. From: "Larry Moore mo2337@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 6:36 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products   To all participants, After almost a week of this back and forth over this topic, I for one would like to see you put this subject to rest. We all have our opinions, about politics, religion, and obviously, Lionel’s version of American Flyer. All of the statements and all of the rebuttals are not going to change anybody’s, set in concrete, views one way or the other. Please put it to bed and find another argumentative topic. Thank you, Larry Moore   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 4:18 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products     So, back to customer service and the New American Flyer.  It was just 8 years ago my German Shepard decided he wanted to have a meal on two of my Christmas car Boxes.  I wrote an Email to the Customer Service Dept. A week later I had two new boxes with the correct labels for the Christmas cars that had been all chewed up. No cost to me either. I have had other small issues come up over the years and never Have I had Customer service tell me they can't help. So I guess it is just how some want to see the New American Flyer Trains. I choose to see in a good light and I choose to call them American Flyer. The rest of yopu can continue calling them by the stupid name you all made up. Happy in America with My American Flyer Trains, New and Old. Chris Burger AKA CBtrainnut   From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2016 3:19 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Lionel LLC products     As has been mentioned here, ACG also had product problems, just as "Flyonel" has problems. Back in '46 the steam locomotives were recalled because the insulators came loose on the drive wheels. The fix was to drill the wheels in three places (some guys did four) and insert wooden pegs; these repairs were done at the "Authorized Service Stations" mostly, but some large retailers were visited by the "factory Rep" who did the fix "in warehouse." Yes, the 355 Baldwins (and all the 4-step reverse unit Baldwins) had/have a design flaw; the motor is engineered for a lower amperage than the reverse unit requires to cycle, so it zooms down the track and suddenly "click!" and it stops in neutral. The modern fix is to take the green wire, which goes from one truck straight to the motor, disconnect it at one end, take a RS full wave bridge rectifier chip, connect the DC output leads together, and connect the ends of the green wire to the AC leads; this drops the voltage to the motor about 2 to 3 volts and lets the reverse unit activate before the motor moves much. It also gives you better slow speed. For the collector, this is an easily reversible fix even. However, I didn't start this thread to explain how to fix ACG Flyer, but to discuss the big differences between the two manufactures. Back to product "recalls;" Back in the 90s Flyonel produced a wonderful reproduction of the ACG Northern Pacific passenger train; however, someone there, using 3-rail logic, decided to "improve" the couplers by making them out of die-cast metal. This works fine on 3-rail, where the trucks are all connected to the same side of the electric circuit, but not on two-rail where each truck is picking up one side or the other of the electrical circuit. As soon as the paint, serving as an insulator, wears off, the couplers become a short circuit! When I get around to regularly operating my NP set, I will have to change out the couplers to the plastic versions. This would have been a product recall "in the old days." On to manufacturing "philosophy." ACG used a standard design that kept their production costs down. The steamer motors were all the same through the line; although there were design improvements. This kept parts inventories down and production costs down. Same with the diesels, until the Baldwin. Same with the 4-step reverse units, although mounting methods changed, as did the location of the lock-out lever. The same SIB smoke unit fit all (except the late production units, which sometimes were the HO smoke unit), even with design changes (elimination of the bottom plate, change in orientation of the heating element, etc.). This continuity of design allowed improvements as problems were discovered (steam drive wheels went through at least 3 design changes, that are not readily visible on an assembled wheel). I do not see this continuity in Flyonel production; it seems that each locomotive offered is designed from scratch; although the diesel power trucks do seem to be standardized. This makes it harder to keep parts available, and there's the next BIG difference: parts & service. ACG knew their trains would need servicing, they created break-down parts lists and a franchise of service stations to do repairs and a parts department with a stock of replacement parts--so many parts that even today, brand new "old stock"parts can be had. In the early 1960s, my dad had our 1955 307 repaired (I forget the problems, I was too young yet to do them myself; maybe my older brothers (whose locomotive it originally was) "experimented" with it). It was no problem (except we lived in the mountains and the service station was 150 miles away). I know from personal experience (and I still have one of the letters) that ACG would write back to an 11-year-old kid who hand-wrote that he needed some parts for his train. They would even send a copy of the parts diagram so I could order the proper pieces., and filled my order! I do not see this level of service/caring from the present manufacturers. (American Models, however has been very helpful like this--if you're reading this, thank you Ron! And SHS was/still is too! So thank you Don!) Some will say, "But that's just the way it is in this modern world." I say "WHY?" With the ease of communications we have, and the ability to send money instantly, why is service no longer done? When I was a kid, you hand-wrote the letter, put it in an envelope, Leo (our mailman) would take it out of our home's mailbox and off it would go to New Haven 6, Conn (boy is that ingrained into my memory banks). A few weeks later Leo would drop off an envelope from The A. C. Gilbert Co. and inside would be a price list and diagram of my sick locomotive. OK, I'd figure out what parts I needed, Compose a letter, by hand, back to them, and enclose, carefully wrapped up, my $3.50 for the parts and shipping. Put this all in an envelope, and into my mailbox; Leo would pick it up, and about 3 weeks later a small package would arrive from The A. C. Gilbert Co. with all my needed parts. Gee, I can play with my train again!! Nowadays this could all happen with a simple email; in one day the order would be made & paid for, and then we're back to the 1950s, waiting for the package to arrive! Why doesn't it happen this way? Not to be commercial, but it did just this week, I called Ron at American models, he told me what parts I'd need, went online, ordered them (here's where life changes, the parts were $10, shipping was $6, oh well. . . ) and yesterday a padded envelope arrived in my mailbox. The RS-3 will run again! Life can be good. . . . And don't tell me that Flyonel is too big to do that, ACG was big too, a giant in the toy industry, yet they did it! IMHO, Flyonel could take a lesson. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77505	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/13/2016
Subject: Re: American Models GG1 lettering removal?

Something that worked for me on some Flyonel cylindrical hoppers was Microscale's Micro-Sol and an eraser. Ihad to experiment for a bit but it eventually worked pretty well. I had to remove the old road name and reporting marks and logo and number and leave the base color alone. You might also view Cody Grivno's video on the Model Railroader website.                                                          Bob Lampe                                                          Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77506	From: kempfam	Date: 2/14/2016
Subject: Lionel Fyer

My interests today don't really fall into the Flyer category.  That being said, after having the opportunity to help man the NASG booth at the WGH show in St. Paul last weekend, I was really happy with the quality and level of detail proveded by the Polar Express.  The positive comments received, the smooth running, the wireless throttle and the recognition by young children of what the set represented, was something for which Lionel should be commended.  Very young kids were able to easily control operation and the throttle was robust enough to handle hard landings on the concrete floor.   The 2-6-6-2, not subjected to the kids, was absolutely beautiful.   Count your blessings with the breadth of product offered today. Ron Kemp Sent from Samsung tablet

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77507	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 14 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77508	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

This post is aimed toward those with lots of knowledge about American Flyer. Recently I acquired a 21106 Reading 4-4-2. Greenberg books state that 21106’s had smoke and choo-choo, but this does not. It has plastic drivers and no headlight, which is about all that makes it different than a 21100. This engine came with the whole set in the original box, so has not been modified. It got me to wonder if there are any variations, or if Greenberg was in error on this one. Does anyone know?   Mike Vana   Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77509	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

It could come either way. The set box is either 20059 or 9992 made for Sears,Roebuck&Co. Should have five freight cars. Mark -------------------------------------------- On Mon, 2/15/16, 'Mike and Debra Vana' amflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, February 15, 2016, 9:16 AM   This post is aimed toward those with lots of knowledge about American Flyer. Recently I acquired a 21106 Reading 4-4-2. Greenberg books state that 21106’s had smoke and choo-choo, but this does not. It has plastic drivers and no headlight, which is about all that makes it different than a 21100. This engine came with the whole set in the original box, so has not been modified. It got me to wonder if there are any variations, or if Greenberg was in error on this one. Does anyone know?   Mike Vana   Omaha, NE. #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455 -- #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp #yiv5022810455hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp #yiv5022810455ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp .yiv5022810455ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp .yiv5022810455ad p { margin:0;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-mkp .yiv5022810455ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-sponsor #yiv5022810455ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-sponsor #yiv5022810455ygrp-lc #yiv5022810455hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv5022810455 #yiv5022810455ygrp-sponsor #yiv5022810455ygrp-lc 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77510	From: Dale Smith	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

Mike, You may be looking at an older version of the Greenberg Guide.  As more is learned, more apparently is added.  The Fifth Edition by Joe Deger lists two variations as shown below.  In case the image is stripped out, the first version has metal whistle and bell, cast drivers, white tires, and smoke and choo-choo.  The second version as "Integral" bell and whistle, black plastic drivers, white painted tires, no smoke and choo-choo and one type 10 truck and one type 11 truck, referring to the tender.  From what I gathered, the main difference is that the type 11 has a step-up ledge leading into the journal box and the type 10 does not. You probably have the second type.   The values are way off even in the latest Greenberg book.   T&M lists the loco in excellent condition at $500.  It  doesn't specify the type. What else is in the set.  This loco came in only two uncataloged sets, 9992 and 20059, according to Tufts' book on sets.   I think both sets are rare also. Dale Smith On 2/15/2016 9:16 AM, 'Mike and Debra Vana' amflyer@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This post is aimed toward those with lots of knowledge about American Flyer. Recently I acquired a 21106 Reading 4-4-2. Greenberg books state that 21106’s had smoke and choo-choo, but this does not. It has plastic drivers and no headlight, which is about all that makes it different than a 21100. This engine came with the whole set in the original box, so has not been modified. It got me to wonder if there are any variations, or if Greenberg was in error on this one. Does anyone know?   Mike Vana   Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77511	From: snstrains	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

Are the plastic drivers solid black or have a painted white sidewall?   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 2/15/2016 10:45:12 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   This post is aimed toward those with lots of knowledge about American Flyer. Recently I acquired a 21106 Reading 4-4-2. Greenberg books state that 21106’s had smoke and choo-choo, but this does not. It has plastic drivers and no headlight, which is about all that makes it different than a 21100. This engine came with the whole set in the original box, so has not been modified. It got me to wonder if there are any variations, or if Greenberg was in error on this one. Does anyone know?   Mike Vana   Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77512	From: kerhart@frontier.com	Date: 2/15/2016
Subject: American Flyer #336 For Sale

I have an American Flyer #336 locomotive and tender for sale.  It is a good-running unit that I have stored for about thirty years in a smoke-free home.  When tested, the headlight, diesel horn choo-choo and smoke all work. The locomotive is in very good condition with one numberboard being blank and missing the "336".  I believe it has the large motor.  The tender has missing paint on both sides.  I am asking $285 plus USPS shipping.  If interested, contact me for photos.  Thank you. Keith Erhart

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77513	From: racin510	Date: 2/16/2016
Subject: Reverse Light Wiring

Does anyone know how to wire a tender light to the ACG reverse unit such that it only comes on in reverse?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77514	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Freight trucks for sale.

I have several sets of S-Helper freight trucks for sale. They are the American Flyer compatible version as well as 3 pair of code 110 freight trucks. . I also have several sets of SHS couplers for sale as well. In addition I have several pair of K-Line S-gauge trucks for sale (the ones Lionel were going to use) (ha!) All these trucks are new.     Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77515	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Since I am not familiar with the reverse unit you are referring to, I can only assume it is wired similar to a Dallee unit. In any case. I wired a Dallee unit in a AF 372, Union Pacific GP7. I contacted Dallee and asked the same question. I know from being in HO for many years that now with DCC that reversible head lights was possible. The tech from Dallee answered my request and stated yes it is possible. what you need to do is wire the second headlight and reverse the leads to either the brush wires or the field wires but not both. After I did that the locomotive headlights operated in the direction the locomotive was operated. This locomotive was a big hit at our local American Flyer train shows. Some even asked me if this was the way the locomotive came from the factory in New Haven. I told him no. I usually convert my Flyer locomotives immediately after purchase, but now I wait until the Flyer reverser wear out. I know I can replace the fingers but I prefer the electronic reverser account reliability of operation. Hope this helps you.  Thomas Kaufman Seminole FL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77516	From: carl4flyer	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Wire the backup light across either the bottom set of fingers or the top set of fingers on the reverse unit depending on how your loco's direction is wired. Carl

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77517	From: william lewis	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.

How much are you asking for the code 110 trucks and the flyer compatible S helper. Is it all or nothing or by the pair etc... -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/17/16, SnSTrains@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Freight trucks for sale. To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 17, 2016, 12:47 AM I have several sets of S-Helper freight trucks for sale. They are the American Flyer compatible version as well as 3 pair of code 110 freight trucks. . I also have several sets of SHS couplers for sale as well. In addition I have several pair of K-Line S-gauge trucks for sale (the ones Lionel were going to use) (ha!) All these trucks are new. Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77518	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

I don't think you can control a tender light with just the reverse unit.  I know a way to do it with a current sensing switch, but the last time I looked at those, they were very expensive. Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77519	From: richs009	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Carl - brilliant! (pun intended)  I always thought it would be cool to be able to have directional lighting on some of my locos, like the Pennsy B6 (0-6-0) switcher.  I'll give this idea a try. - Rich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77520	From: snstrains	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.

Only have 4 pair of code 110 SHS trucks available along with a few K-Line trucks. SHS are $10 pair and couplers are $2 pair. K-line are $10 pair with SHS couplers which work on these too. Shipping is extra of course.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 2/17/2016 9:04:05 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   How much are you asking for the code 110 trucks and the flyer compatible S helper. Is it all or nothing or by the pair etc... -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/17/16, SnSTrains@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Freight trucks for sale. To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 17, 2016, 12:47 AM I have several sets of S-Helper freight trucks for sale. They are the American Flyer compatible version as well as 3 pair of code 110 freight trucks. . I also have several sets of SHS couplers for sale as well. In addition I have several pair of K-Line S-gauge trucks for sale (the ones Lionel were going to use) (ha!) All these trucks are new. Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77521	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

I  add Backup lights and  rear markers to most all My AF engines using the original  reverse switch - NO PROBLEM !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77522	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Could you expand on this? Fingers across from each other simply make a switch don't they? How would wiring a light to each finger get juice to it? I'd think one wire should go to ground, but I thought I  tried all combinations and it still comes on in forward regardless. Confused

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77523	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Waiting for Alan to tell us how. His tender obviously lit up real pretty ... of course the 'tail lights' would be on all the time.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77524	From: racin510	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring

Nice, is 'how' a big secret?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77525	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two !

Guys,   One wire to the back truck rivet { or the common connection at the e-unit} .     The other to the bottom left finger post  (facing the front looking to the rear) , This may not the case on all engines .      The advent of L.E.D.’s changes our world ! ——-OLD Flyers Forever !!!!!    Reference a NYC 5344    Once a badly damaged 354  Fire box flicker  Rear markers and backup light  on the NYC 20th Century

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77526	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Whats left of the trucks & couplers

All the K-Line trucks are gone and I have 4 pair of code 110 SHS 70 ton Andrews tender trucks with current pickups (all wheel) left. I also have 14 pair of SHS freight couplers and 5 pair of SHS caboose couplers left. The response has been overwhelming.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77527	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Standard and O gauge catalogs

Is there a website where I can view the Standard and O Gauge Flyer catalogs? Or does any one have them scanned they can send me as a link? Thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77528	From: William Lewis	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Whats left of the trucks & couplers

How much for two regular SHS trucks. Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "SnSTrains@... [S-Trains]" Date:02/17/2016 5:06 PM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Whats left of the trucks & couplers   All the K-Line trucks are gone and I have 4 pair of code 110 SHS 70 ton Andrews tender trucks with current pickups (all wheel) left. I also have 14 pair of SHS freight couplers and 5 pair of SHS caboose couplers left. The response has been overwhelming.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77529	From: snstrains	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Whats left of the trucks & couplers

$10   In a message dated 2/17/2016 5:16:39 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   How much for two regular SHS trucks. Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message --------

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77530	From: rick gough	Date: 2/17/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two ! [3 Attachments]

Allan, Beautiful Silver Bullet ... very nice job. I will try what you say on my Bullet. I'm pretty sure I tried that combo on the 326 I'm putting together and it lit the head light as did the top inner finger contact. What do you use for a bezel ? Thanks, Rick   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Wednesday, February 17, 2016 3:20 PM, "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com  Guys,   One wire to the back truck rivet { or the common connection at the e-unit} .     The other to the bottom left finger post  (facing the front looking to the rear) , This may not the case on all engines .      The advent of L.E.D.’s changes our world ! ——-OLD Flyers Forever !!!!!    Reference a NYC 5344    Once a badly damaged 354  Fire box flicker  Rear markers and backup light  on the NYC 20th Century On Feb 17, 2016, at 4:45 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Nice, is 'how' a big secret?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77531	From: Alan Smith	Date: 2/18/2016
Subject: Re: Reverse Light Wiring -- take Two !

Rick,   Contact me off line.   There are several things to consider on such fun projects. Alan On Feb 17, 2016, at 10:56 PM, rick gough racin510@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Allan, Beautiful Silver Bullet ... very nice job. I will try what you say on my Bullet. I'm pretty sure I tried that combo on the 326 I'm putting together and it lit the head light as did the top inner finger contact. What do you use for a bezel ? Thanks, Rick   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Wednesday, February 17, 2016 3:20 PM, "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Guys,   One wire to the back truck rivet { or the common connection at the e-unit} .     The other to the bottom left finger post  (facing the front looking to the rear) , This may not the case on all engines .      The advent of L.E.D.’s changes our world ! ——-OLD Flyers Forever !!!!!    Reference a NYC 5344    Once a badly damaged 354  Fire box flicker  Rear markers and backup light  on the NYC 20th Century On Feb 17, 2016, at 4:45 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Nice, is 'how' a big secret?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77532	From: George Cohn	Date: 2/18/2016
Subject: LED Stoplight kit

I just got this from Jameco electronics, a kit to control traffic lights for up to 3 four-way intersections. Might be just the thing to help those traffic jams! https://tinyurl.com/led-stoplight George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77533	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Carton for 4611-A Set

All, In cleaning out the family home that we moved to in the early 1950s, I found an empty box at the back of a hall closet for an American Flyer 4611-A set.  (My father always used to buy individual bits and pieces, so I was surprised to find that some of the trains I played with as a kid actually came from a set.)  As might be expected for a 65 year-old corrugated cardboard carton, it is a little the worse for wear (i.e. somewhat soiled, the edges are a bit tattered and it has a bit of scribbling on the side, but the label on the end is still in intact and in reasonable shape.  Please send any requests for photographs and/or offers off the list please.  Jerry F. gfeldman2904@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77534	From: i_am_3_16_o	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Help with Track Trips..?

My original plan to use light sensors is a bust, so I'm looking for any info on making my own track trips.. Some of the track (American Models & SHS flex) is already laid, so I'm looking for simple and also anything less invasive I can use for the pre-laid areas. RR X-ings are really befuddling me, trying to figure out how to drop the gate in time, then have it go up after the last car passes.   I know reed switches are an affordable option: as long as there's weight on the track, the circuit is on, but how do you wire it so it drops ahead of the train and goes up after it's gone? I thought about putting tiny super magnets in locos and cabooses, but there's a flaw there.. if there's no caboose, the gate stays down..   I thought about DCC too, but aside from horns and lights, know nothing about that either. I read about using a Lego NXT brain for the DCC software, but can't seem to find where to download it from.. I also kind of read about using Raspberry Pi to hold the DCC programming, but that too wasn't really explained. Seems like everywhere I go to try and read up on it, it's either way over my head or written for my grandfather who never used a computer other than a calculator.   I don't want to give up my switch/turnout controls, I already ran the wires for that. My layout is sectional, but not according to NMRA sectional standards. I built a sub table, and the layout is built on 2 inch thick structural foam board. Joints are similar to feather boards used in woodworking, kind of like 2 combs meant to come together seamlessly. I needed a system I could assemble and tear down without assistance, not an easy task with a broken back and narrow stairways. The first attempt was old school AF track with rubber roadbed, but way too heavy and time consuming. Then I switched to Gargraves on plywood. Again too heavy, so I switched to AM track and foam board, and it's finally manageable. I know RF sensors are another option, but don't know how many I can have working in a small space.. 20+ years ago, working with N scale, I didn't bother with this stuff, but it's noticeable in S, so I need to address it. Any help with any of this greatly appreciated I'd love to have these electrical issues fixed by the end of summer.    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77535	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?

From: Alan Lambert I don't have any ideas about track trips, but for the railroad crossings I got mine from Z-Stuff for Trains Z-stuff for trains O-gauge signals O-scale parts                Z-stuff for trains O-gauge signals O-scale parts Order by Phone from Z Stuff Express: (708)352.9105 View on www.z-stuff.net Preview by Yahoo    Look at the DZ-1010/1020/1030 set. They say they are o-gauge but they look good on my layout. They use block signals to activate the arms when the train passes by, then when it passes the other signal the arms go up. They say sink the bases into your layout but I did not yet but might later. Hope this helps some.   Alan From: "phuster_6@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2016 4:48 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Help with Track Trips..?   My original plan to use light sensors is a bust, so I'm looking for any info on making my own track trips.. Some of the track (American Models & SHS flex) is already laid, so I'm looking for simple and also anything less invasive I can use for the pre-laid areas. RR X-ings are really befuddling me, trying to figure out how to drop the gate in time, then have it go up after the last car passes.   I know reed switches are an affordable option: as long as there's weight on the track, the circuit is on, but how do you wire it so it drops ahead of the train and goes up after it's gone? I thought about putting tiny super magnets in locos and cabooses, but there's a flaw there.. if there's no caboose, the gate stays down..   I thought about DCC too, but aside from horns and lights, know nothing about that either. I read about using a Lego NXT brain for the DCC software, but can't seem to find where to download it from.. I also kind of read about using Raspberry Pi to hold the DCC programming, but that too wasn't really explained. Seems like everywhere I go to try and read up on it, it's either way over my head or written for my grandfather who never used a computer other than a calculator.   I don't want to give up my switch/turnout controls, I already ran the wires for that. My layout is sectional, but not according to NMRA sectional standards. I built a sub table, and the layout is built on 2 inch thick structural foam board. Joints are similar to feather boards used in woodworking, kind of like 2 combs meant to come together seamlessly. I needed a system I could assemble and tear down without assistance, not an easy task with a broken back and narrow stairways. The first attempt was old school AF track with rubber roadbed, but way too heavy and time consuming. Then I switched to Gargraves on plywood. Again too heavy, so I switched to AM track and foam board, and it's finally manageable. I know RF sensors are another option, but don't know how many I can have working in a small space.. 20+ years ago, working with N scale, I didn't bother with this stuff, but it's noticeable in S, so I need to address it. Any help with any of this greatly appreciated I'd love to have these electrical issues fixed by the end of summer.    Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77536	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 21 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77537	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 21 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77538	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?

I have a circuit for a track trip in My AF Repair and Operating Guide, Volume 1, Page 86. Tom Barker

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77539	From: traindavid	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?

Alan posted; "Look at the DZ-1010/1020/1030 set. They say they are o-gauge but they look good on my layout. They use block signals to activate the arms when the train passes by, then when it passes the other signal the arms go up. They say sink the bases into your layout but I did not yet but might later. Hope this helps some. " I used some Z-stuff sensors on a friend's layout to control the AF Semaphores, the Semaphores don't control the track, like ACG planned, but just react to the trains going by the sensors, as the train approaches the semaphore, it goes green, after it passes, it goes red. I don't know if they can take the amperage of the switch coils if you wanted them to control the switches though. Pretty neat stuff, although a bit pricey, IMHO (OK, I know, I am CHEAP!). The other nice thing is they blend right in with normal trackside equipment.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77540	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car

Apparently the new waffle-sided cars are out; I see one reviewed in the S Gaugian.  The reviewer states that it comes "with the same size chassis" as the old Gilbert AF boxcar.    That would imply the floor, bottom, underframe, or whatever one would call it could be replaced by an ACE underframe.  Can anyone confirm that, or at least confirm that the bottom of, say,  my old AF 633 boxcar and the bottom of this new car are interchangeable?   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77541	From: Eric	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: S Stuff for sale

Attachments : For Sale  February 2016…..I found some other items to sell. Lionel Flyer ES44AC Diesel engine  (6-42582)—Canadian Pacific Red---Includes Everything from new.  Box, shipping box, manual,  inner bag and box stuffings.  This is like new, it has been test run on DCC and works.  I also ran it on AC.  It will run also on  Lionel Legacy but I have not tested that .  $390 shipping included to USA    ( I added the Kadee couplers but the knuckles and their hardware are in the box. 5 - Blue mountain loads for S Helper Ore Cars  - $30 plus shipping Lionel American Flyer Truck (Actual truck model) -  $15 plus shipping. Make me an offer……. > Eric Reis EricRhere@... > Kenmore Wa. 98028 > NASG since 86, TCA since 87,  Ebay since 99 (over  1100 positives) > Paypal, Postal Money orders, Checks (held to clear) all work they look something like this attached picture)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77542	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Repairing Hudson tender steps

Does anyone have a technique to straighten a bent Hudson step on the cast shell? I'm afraid to take a hammer to it for fear of breaking it off. Its not that bad but I see it  and it bothers me. I'd love some advice. Thanks Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77543	From: Mike and Debra Vana	Date: 2/21/2016
Subject: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

The 21106 is sitting right in front of me as I write this. From what Dale Smith said, I must have the second version, because it has the "Integral" bell and whistle, black plastic drivers, white painted tires, no smoke and choo-choo, and additionally, no headlight.   I have a lot of American Flyer trains, but few sets in boxes. I acquired this set with the plain brown box, which on two sides, reads “#20059 SEARS NO. 9992 TRAIN SET.” For cars the set has the New Haven 24559 flatcar, 24203 B&O hopper, 24036 New Haven boxcar, 24109 Pennsylvania gondola, and 24627 caboose with just one coupler. The Greenberg volume 3 book on sets states that some sets had the NH boxcar instead of the IC 24403 reefer.    I want to thank everyone who responded to my questions about this 21106. As uncommon as these engines are, it is surprising, to me, anyway, that there are two variations of it.   Mike Vana  Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77544	From: racin510	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson tender steps

I think best left as is. You can try and very slowly bend it close to where it once was, but if it's much it will probably break. Then it's off to Portlines for replacements, which actually look great and may be what you really want to get the look right.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77545	From: Dale Smith	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

Mike, Just for your information, Bob Tufts book on sets list both a 9992 and a 20059 both 1959 and with pretty much the same set contents, except he omits the caboose from the 9992 listing.   That isn't the first time that I have seen a caboose omitted from the listings.  According to Tufts, there was also a 9992 set from 1957 that has a totally different set of contents and which was headed up by a 293 or "21024."  I can't find a 21024 in any reference books.  It is in parentheses so maybe it is just a number Gilbert used to inventory it, as they did use multiple stock numbers for the same item, depending on how it was to be sold. Dale On 2/21/2016 10:23 PM, 'Mike and Debra Vana' amflyer@... [S-Trains] wrote:   The 21106 is sitting right in front of me as I write this. From what Dale Smith said, I must have the second version, because it has the "Integral" bell and whistle, black plastic drivers, white painted tires, no smoke and choo-choo, and additionally, no headlight.   I have a lot of American Flyer trains, but few sets in boxes. I acquired this set with the plain brown box, which on two sides, reads “#20059 SEARS NO. 9992 TRAIN SET.” For cars the set has the New Haven 24559 flatcar, 24203 B&O hopper, 24036 New Haven boxcar, 24109 Pennsylvania gondola, and 24627 caboose with just one coupler. The Greenberg volume 3 book on sets states that some sets had the NH boxcar instead of the IC 24403 reefer.    I want to thank everyone who responded to my questions about this 21106. As uncommon as these engines are, it is surprising, to me, anyway, that there are two variations of it.   Mike Vana  Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77546	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?

Unfortunately, Z-stuff is out of stock on some of the items.  They do look quite nice, and I will order a few in the near future. Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 2/21/2016 21:10, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Alan posted; "Look at the DZ-1010/1020/1030 set. They say they are o-gauge but they look good on my layout. They use block signals to activate the arms when the train passes by, then when it passes the other signal the arms go up. They say sink the bases into your layout but I did not yet but might later. Hope this helps some. " I used some Z-stuff sensors on a friend's layout to control the AF Semaphores, the Semaphores don't control the track, like ACG planned, but just react to the trains going by the sensors, as the train approaches the semaphore, it goes green, after it passes, it goes red. I don't know if they can take the amperage of the switch coils if you wanted them to control the switches though. Pretty neat stuff, although a bit pricey, IMHO (OK, I know, I am CHEAP!). The other nice thing is they blend right in with normal trackside equipment. This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77547	From: poniaj	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car

Tom, The frames are the same size as the other Flyer cars.  The method of attachment may be different, since it seems to vary from year to year, but the width and length are even the same as the Gilbert cars. Good luck! Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77548	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson tender steps

Heat it with a hair dryer, then bend the step back in place a little at a time.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2016 11:20 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Repairing Hudson tender steps     Does anyone have a technique to straighten a bent Hudson step on the cast shell? I'm afraid to take a hammer to it for fear of breaking it off. Its not that bad but I see it and it bothers me. I'd love some advice. Thanks Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77549	From: scaler164	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: LOOKING FOR : PRS Box Car - UNDEC

WANTED : ONE... al least one one...undecorated, 40' double door Pacific Rail Shops box car.   Trucks and couplers NOT required, but I do want the original box that the model shipped in..   Will consider 'decorated' models if no undecorated ones turn up.   Thanks.     John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77550	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Freight trucks for sale.

Hi Steve,   I got the package today. Thank you! Chris From: "boss31@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 17, 2016 2:55 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Freight trucks for sale.   Only have 4 pair of code 110 SHS trucks available along with a few K-Line trucks. SHS are $10 pair and couplers are $2 pair. K-line are $10 pair with SHS couplers which work on these too. Shipping is extra of course.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 2/17/2016 9:04:05 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   How much are you asking for the code 110 trucks and the flyer compatible S helper. Is it all or nothing or by the pair etc... -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/17/16, SnSTrains@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Freight trucks for sale. To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 17, 2016, 12:47 AM I have several sets of S-Helper freight trucks for sale. They are the American Flyer compatible version as well as 3 pair of code 110 freight trucks. . I also have several sets of SHS couplers for sale as well. In addition I have several pair of K-Line S-gauge trucks for sale (the ones Lionel were going to use) (ha!) All these trucks are new. Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77551	From: barb	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Repairing Hudson Steps

Hi Ernie, I have had some success straightening Hudson steps using a hair dryer. Don't use the high heat as that will be too hot. As the metal heats up it will become more pliable and you can GENTLY, using tweezers or small needle nose pliers bend the step a bit at a time. Good luck... Barb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77552	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: New American Flyer "Waffle" sided car

 ----- Original Message ----- From: poniaj@... [S-Trains] Tom, The frames are the same size as the other Flyer cars.  The method of attachment may be different, since it seems to vary from year to year, but the width and length are even the same as the Gilbert cars. Good luck! > > > > > > > thanks.  I have something cooking.   tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77553	From: Stanley Sobieski	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's

Hi Mike   Can you please send me a pic of the box showing the B number and measure box LxWxh  and a pic of the box labeling  thank you Stan Sobieski   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, February 22, 2016 1:23 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Variations on American Flyer 21106 4-4-2's     The 21106 is sitting right in front of me as I write this. From what Dale Smith said, I must have the second version, because it has the "Integral" bell and whistle, black plastic drivers, white painted tires, no smoke and choo-choo, and additionally, no headlight.   I have a lot of American Flyer trains, but few sets in boxes. I acquired this set with the plain brown box, which on two sides, reads “#20059 SEARS NO. 9992 TRAIN SET.” For cars the set has the New Haven 24559 flatcar, 24203 B&O hopper, 24036 New Haven boxcar, 24109 Pennsylvania gondola, and 24627 caboose with just one coupler. The Greenberg volume 3 book on sets states that some sets had the NH boxcar instead of the IC 24403 reefer.    I want to thank everyone who responded to my questions about this 21106. As uncommon as these engines are, it is surprising, to me, anyway, that there are two variations of it.   Mike Vana  Omaha, NE.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77554	From: richs009	Date: 2/22/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson Steps

Barb and Herb - I'm a little surprised that these old castings will tolerate 'straightening' (but I don't doubt your success).  Do you let the metal cool down between 'straightenings' or just keep going incrementally while the metal is hot?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77555	From: Doug Peck	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with Track Trips..?

We have most, but not all, of the Z-Stuff items in stock. They are listed on our ELECTRONICS Inventory page. We also always bring them all to York.  Visit our booth in PURPLE Hall there!   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77556	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Repairing Hudson Steps

It has been a while since I’ve done one, but I remember that the more the step is bent the slower you go.   Keep the step warm and bend it back a little at a time. For the worse ones I’ve used several sessions over a number of days.   I’ve never had one break when taking my sweet time. You get in a hurry and they’re sure to snap.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2016 12:19 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Repairing Hudson Steps     Barb and Herb - I'm a little surprised that these old castings will tolerate 'straightening' (but I don't doubt your success).  Do you let the metal cool down between 'straightenings' or just keep going incrementally while the metal is hot?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77557	From: barb	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Straightening Hudson steps

I generally keep the heat on the step. But then again I am only straightening a little. Although, I have used the heat, bend, cool, heat, bend,cool method, that has also worked for me. If the step does break off, email Doug at Port Lines.... Barb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77558	From: G. Leigh Swanson	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps

I have to agree with Barb and others who recommend continuous but gentle heat along with bending the damaged step back slowly slowly slowly. The same technique works well on bent cab roofs, unless the bend is deep or sharp. Because I was a firefighter I never really had enough hair growth for it to ever need drying so I never owned a hairdryer. However I do own a "two-heat-setting" Black & Decker hand-held heat gun intended for releasing floor tile glue and old paint that needed to be scraped off. The lowest heat setting is best. Do this project when you're in a good mood and not rushed for time. A light-weight ball peen hammer seemed to work best for me on cab roofs and Channel Lock Pliers for the tender steps.  Good luck. G. L. (Leigh) Swanson, Summerfield North Carolina

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77559	From: rudypenne	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps

Just from reading this thread, How about using a "C" Clamp to add the pressure a little bit at a time & hold the shape?  Mike in Ore   In a message dated 2/23/2016 12:00:17 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I have to agree with Barb and others who recommend continuous but gentle heat along with bending the damaged step back slowly slowly slowly. The same technique works well on bent cab roofs, unless the bend is deep or sharp. Because I was a firefighter I never really had enough hair growth for it to ever need drying so I never owned a hairdryer. However I do own a "two-heat-setting" Black & Decker hand-held heat gun intended for releasing floor tile glue and old paint that needed to be scraped off. The lowest heat setting is best. Do this project when you're in a good mood and not rushed for time. A light-weight ball peen hammer seemed to work best for me on cab roofs and Channel Lock Pliers for the tender steps.  Good luck. G. L. (Leigh) Swanson, Summerfield North Carolina

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77560	From: The Laniers	Date: 2/23/2016
Subject: Re: Bending and repairing Hudson Steps

I suspect the C clamp would act as a heat sink removing the heat from the step and leaving it less pliable and more apt to break.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2016 5:29 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Bending and repairing Hudson Steps     Just from reading this thread, How about using a "C" Clamp to add the pressure a little bit at a time & hold the shape? Mike in Ore   In a message dated 2/23/2016 12:00:17 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I have to agree with Barb and others who recommend continuous but gentle heat along with bending the damaged step back slowly slowly slowly. The same technique works well on bent cab roofs, unless the bend is deep or sharp. Because I was a firefighter I never really had enough hair growth for it to ever need drying so I never owned a hairdryer. However I do own a "two-heat-setting" Black & Decker hand-held heat gun intended for releasing floor tile glue and old paint that needed to be scraped off. The lowest heat setting is best. Do this project when you're in a good mood and not rushed for time. A light-weight ball peen hammer seemed to work best for me on cab roofs and Channel Lock Pliers for the tender steps.  Good luck. G. L. (Leigh) Swanson, Summerfield North Carolina

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77561	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 28 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77562	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 February 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 28 February 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77563	From: michael Cantu	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: Looking for 6-48136 rail sounds car

I am looking for a Lionel American flyer Sante Fe rail sounds b unit for sale. Product number is 6 - 48136. Please get back to me on this thread or in private. I have paypal. Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77564	From: rxman46321	Date: 2/28/2016
Subject: American Hi-Rail DL 109

Troops, Does ANYONE have a DL 109 shell from American HiRail sitting neglected on a shelf somewhere? Am looking for at 3 for a project. John Griffin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77565	From: Raymond Kemper	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77566	From: Ben E. Colley	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Our club built a new, updated, lighter, etc layout using Fastrack and we ran into the same problems…  I have a couple of new engines that chatter when running so I quit bringing them to run.  A couple of other new engines work just fine.  It seems to be hit or miss by engine.   I don’t think we have seen a problem with any original Flyer engines, nor on any of the American Model engines I have brought in.    I have not tried my Texas Special because my Missouri Pacific set chattered…   I have not had this problem on my SHS S-Trax layout…   Ben Colley     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 12:36 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack     I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77567	From: carl4flyer	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Lionel had a run that the spikes were a few thousandths too tall. Not all track Fastrack had the problem. As silly as it sounds the easiest solution is to wear them down with the deep flanges. We have some on the store layout and this was the solution we used.   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 1:36 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack   I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77568	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 2/29/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

It would seem to me that by wearing the spikes down like that there would be a weak bond of rail to tie. I know it might sound like a lot of work but wouldn't it be better to turn the flanges down by a couple thousands of an inch?                                                                                        Bob Lampe                                                                                        Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77569	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

I have the same thing with the Texas Special engine on my S-Helper Track. Been meaning to turn it upside down and take a file to remove a little of the flange until it clears. Simple solution really. But, that being said I have been running it like this for almost 3 years with no problems and it hasn't worn the plastic down yet and I run it quite a lot. Chris Burger, good luck From: "Raymond Kemper chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 1:35 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack   I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77570	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: wanted. AF slot car radio stat. It looks like a gas pedal.

Want to control slot cars at a slow speed. The Aurora one will work and has a brake feature. I will wire the other side of the road to go the opposite direction with a double pole switch. So it will go both ways. Then I will use a second AW controller as a booster. May use a switch later all around the layout to add a burst of speed  at different stretches if I try to run more then one car in the same direction. The idea is not to have to run around putting cars on the track. Most Auto World cars are 1/64. The public thinks they are HO. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77571	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: wanted. AF slot car radio stat. It looks like a gas pedal.

I have thought The Aurora cars and track with the steering wheel controller would work perfect with AF also. The track has the dotted white lines and looks like real road. Never thought about the DPDT switch for the other track. That is a great idea! There is an Aurora Slot car group on FB I belong to. Chris Burger From: "JAMES SLEETH aztecfan@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 1, 2016 8:15 AM Subject: [S-Trains] wanted. AF slot car radio stat. It looks like a gas pedal.   Want to control slot cars at a slow speed. The Aurora one will work and has a brake feature. I will wire the other side of the road to go the opposite direction with a double pole switch. So it will go both ways. Then I will use a second AW controller as a booster. May use a switch later all around the layout to add a burst of speed  at different stretches if I try to run more then one car in the same direction. The idea is not to have to run around putting cars on the track. Most Auto World cars are 1/64. The public thinks they are HO. Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77572	From: tennsgauger	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

One would hope that Lionel will quite making the flanges so ridiculously deep to avoid having their locos bounce on the flanges of their own track system, along with S-trax.    - Earl Henry, Nashville       In a message dated 3/1/2016 6:16:17 A.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I have the same thing with the Texas Special engine on my S-Helper Track. Been meaning to turn it upside down and take a file to remove a little of the flange until it clears. Simple solution really. But, that being said I have been running it like this for almost 3 years with no problems and it hasn't worn the plastic down yet and I run it quite a lot. Chris Burger, good luck From: "Raymond Kemper chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 1:35 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack   I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77573	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Earl , you are 100% true in your comment.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Mar 1, 2016, at 3:06 PM, tennsgauge@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   One would hope that Lionel will quite making the flanges so ridiculously deep to avoid having their locos bounce on the flanges of their own track system, along with S-trax.    - Earl Henry, Nashville       In a message dated 3/1/2016 6:16:17 A.M. Central Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I have the same thing with the Texas Special engine on my S-Helper Track. Been meaning to turn it upside down and take a file to remove a little of the flange until it clears. Simple solution really. But, that being said I have been running it like this for almost 3 years with no problems and it hasn't worn the plastic down yet and I run it quite a lot. Chris Burger, good luck From: "Raymond Kemper chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 29, 2016 1:35 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack   I just bought the AF Alco PA Texas Special for my son and immediately discovered Lionel's incompatibility between their own current products. The wheel flanges are hitting the cross ties and/or tie brackets of my AF Fastrack layout. I called Lionel. Their answer was sorry about your luck, just run it until it grinds down the plastic. I assume the scale wheels for the U33C or SD70 will not fit the trucks, but they could not tell me for sure. Anyone know the answer or another solution?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77574	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Thanks all. I guess I'll get to work filing down 24 flanges.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77575	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

 ----- Original Message ----- From: chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]    Thanks all. I guess I'll get to work filing down 24 flanges. > > > > > > > > > Be careful not to get filings into the gears.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan USA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77576	From: Dale Smith	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

If the problem is on the track, I would tackle it there, not on the flanges.  If the spikes are too high, then wearing them down shouldn't affect the integrity of the track.   Have you tried it on SHS track? Dale Smith On 3/1/2016 4:24 PM, chuck_7612@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Thanks all. I guess I'll get to work filing down 24 flanges.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77577	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/1/2016
Subject: HO slot cars

Actually, there are four different slot car scales currently, none of which are completely accurate to scale.  Some of the 1/32 scale an 1/24 scale cars are real close, the 1/43 are barely in the ballpark, but what passes for "HO' are way off the mark!  The closest to HO were the Aurora "vibrator motored" cars of the early sixties that ran on AC power.  They were sold as Model Motoring and were originally intended to be used with HO train layouts.  But a lot of we Baby Boomers liked racing them a lot more, and HO racing quickly caught on! (Yes, I've also been playing with slot cars since 1961 and belong to two racing clubs.) The problem was that there weren't all that many motors small enough to fit in HO trains back in the days "HO" slot cars got started. So the cars were often out of scale to get a motor in them.   As different manufacturers got into small slot cars, the scales kept getting bigger to attain higher performance.  About twenty years ago they were pretty much either 1/76 scale or 1/64 scale, though both are only approximations.  Auto World makes the 1/76 scale as Thunder-Jets with screw mounted bodies, and 1/64 scale X-Traction with bodies that snap on.  Both are based on earlier Aurora T-jet and AFX cars. Isolating each lane and wiring them to run the correct opposite directions works fine.  I think you'll find that making slot cars go realistically slow without stalling somewhat problematic.  The faster the car, the less likely it will run as slow as you wish.  About the best for what you want to do in 1/64 scale cars is the Auto World X-Traction.  Most other 1/64 cars available today are faster and equipped with traction magnets so they don't "idle along" too well.  The magnet cars" are so fast that watching them race is like watching cars in a blender. But they make great refrigerator magnets.  Keeping the pick up rails and the pick ups on the cars clean will be very important to prevent stalling at slow speeds.  At racing speeds you can get past dirty spots with no problem, but prototype city street speeds will be tough.  You can modify some controllers by taking the return spring for the trigger out and rigging up a long machine screw to adjust the throttle.  I've done this for running my Slotless car collection ( http://slotless.weebly.com )   Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77578	From: Rick Evans	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: HO slot cars

I still have mine!  :^) The closest to HO were the Aurora "vibrator motored" cars of the early sixties that ran on AC power.  They were sold as Model Motoring and were originally intended to be used with HO train layouts.   But a lot of we Baby Boomers liked racing them a lot more, and HO racing quickly caught on!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77579	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Found 20 slot car controlers on e-bay.

I am building my "Happy Place".  So looking at slot cars like trains may allow for more control.  The idea is to keep them running.  I think people seeing my trains will have more fun with the cars.  If they fall off the lay out it will not cost as much as falling trains. Song of the South - Everybody's Got A Laughin' Place               Song of the South - Everybody's Got A Laughin' Place View on www.youtube.com Preview by Yahoo

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77580	From: njma41	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: 634/934 Search light car gasket

I need the rubber gasket for the 634/934  searchlight car.  where can I get this at?  Nick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77581	From: snstrains	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: 634/934 Search light car gasket

Try port lines hobby   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 3/2/2016 1:18:40 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I need the rubber gasket for the 634/934  searchlight car.  where can I get this at?  Nick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77582	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Will do. I'll remove from the trucks first.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77583	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/2/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel wheel problems on AF Fastrack

Well then maybe I'll run it for the next couple of months to see if the spikes are wearing down and reducing the noice before I try grinding/filing the flanges. No, I do not have any SHS track. I just broke into the hobby in the last few weeks after a couple of months of researching and designing layouts using RRTRACK. I settled on Fastrack because I accomplished my favorite design of all my experiments using their components. The layout is under construction, but we have been running the trains on the floor in another room because we couldn't wait to get them rolling. Everything was fine until we assembled a loop using the large radius curves (R 27) and ran the Texas Special on it. Fortunately, the only other locomotive we have purchased was an AF U33C with scale wheels, thus no rattling.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77584	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: I must be getting old...

I must be out of touch somehow, probably an age thing.  You see, when I was young, and for many years after that, nobody would purchase a product that was widely known to be defective.  In fact, a company which continuously produced badly engineered or manufactured items generally went bankrupt in short order. Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so. Today I see all kinds of products which are of low quality which people just keep buying and struggling with.  For instance, Microsoft's computer systems, which they leave it up to the customer to do the research and development, and customers even pay to do it!  Garbage like Vista, and Windows 8 and 10 are examples of systems sold that are full of bugs and undesirable characteristics, yet customers still buy them. I've watched Bachmann Trains climb from being junk in the sixties and seventies, to top quality items in their Spectrum Series in the nineties and early two thousands, and back to being overpriced trains of very dubious quality in the past several years.  Yet people not only buy their crap, and then buy parts to fix brand new stuff, but they even defend the company!  I see the same being done with Lionel and their many problems.  I just don't understand the logic behind this, particularly from a financial perspective.  It defies common sense.   Well, perhaps common sense as we geezers know it.  I was raised by "children of the Depression" who always made damn sure they "got their money's worth" of every product.  There's no chance they would have bought me an American Flyer train set when I was four years old if it was made the way they are now, especially at the ridiculous price!  AF would have been held accountable, which would have meant they would "clean up their act" in short order or go under. Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77585	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: 634/934 Search light car gasket

What about just making one? It can't be that hard.                                                        Bob Lampe                                                        Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77586	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Attachments : Bugs P-38[36].png Bugs P-38[34].png PS.  I have a lot of Flyer stuff and love it all.  But I have to say that the Japanese brass trains were of exceptional quality. I used to see the engines in the glass case at the original location of Allied Model Trains, on Pico Bl, and was quite impressed.  That was the 60s. They were like jewels.  Not Jap crap.  And the Japanese were known for the high quality of the trains they built, even before WWII. Now, the rest of the stuff we imported from Japan was another case. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: rick flaherty <flick23@...> Date: Thursday, March 3, 2016 at 12:18 AM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] I must be getting old... Anything made in China, including their mentality/morality, is of low value and deceptive, at best.  They lie like there’s no tomorrow. Even their old boats were called Junk.  How fitting to a cultural society that was not to be trusted, ever. The embrace of comunism just locks in the the treachery.  Kind of like Steve Jobs, the slob that made Face(ass)book and the like that want to take over our minds. Chop Suey, anyone? Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Wednesday, March 2, 2016 at 8:22 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] I must be getting old...   I must be out of touch somehow, probably an age thing.  You see, when I was young, and for many years after that, nobody would purchase a product that was widely known to be defective.  In fact, a company which continuously produced badly engineered or manufactured items generally went bankrupt in short order. Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so. Today I see all kinds of products which are of low quality which people just keep buying and struggling with.  For instance, Microsoft's computer systems, which they leave it up to the customer to do the research and development, and customers even pay to do it!  Garbage like Vista, and Windows 8 and 10 are examples of systems sold that are full of bugs and undesirable characteristics, yet customers still buy them. I've watched Bachmann Trains climb from being junk in the sixties and seventies, to top quality items in their Spectrum Series in the nineties and early two thousands, and back to being overpriced trains of very dubious quality in the past several years.  Yet people not only buy their crap, and then buy parts to fix brand new stuff, but they even defend the company!  I see the same being done with Lionel and their many problems.  I just don't understand the logic behind this, particularly from a financial perspective.  It defies common sense.   Well, perhaps common sense as we geezers know it.  I was raised by "children of the Depression" who always made damn sure they "got their money's worth" of every product.  There's no chance they would have bought me an American Flyer train set when I was four years old if it was made the way they are now, especially at the ridiculous price!  AF would have been held accountable, which would have meant they would "clean up their act" in short order or go under. Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. Stumpy in Ahia

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77587	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Stumpy,   It makes about as much sense has going out to buy a new smart phone every year or two.  It is what today’s generation is used to doing.  They both expect and accept mediocrity.   Jerry F.    From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2016 8:22 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] I must be getting old...     I must be out of touch somehow, probably an age thing.  You see, when I was young, and for many years after that, nobody would purchase a product that was widely known to be defective.  In fact, a company which continuously produced badly engineered or manufactured items generally went bankrupt in short order.   Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so.   Today I see all kinds of products which are of low quality which people just keep buying and struggling with.  For instance, Microsoft's computer systems, which they leave it up to the customer to do the research and development, and customers even pay to do it!  Garbage like Vista, and Windows 8 and 10 are examples of systems sold that are full of bugs and undesirable characteristics, yet customers still buy them.   I've watched Bachmann Trains climb from being junk in the sixties and seventies, to top quality items in their Spectrum Series in the nineties and early two thousands, and back to being overpriced trains of very dubious quality in the past several years.  Yet people not only buy their crap, and then buy parts to fix brand new stuff, but they even defend the company!  I see the same being done with Lionel and their many problems.  I just don't understand the logic behind this, particularly from a financial perspective.  It defies common sense.   Well, perhaps co! mmon sense as we geezers know it.  I was raised by "children of the Depression" who always made damn sure they "got their money's worth" of every product.  There's no chance they would have bought me an American Flyer train set when I was four years old if it was made the way they are now, especially at the ridiculous price!  AF would have been held accountable, which would have meant they would "clean up their act" in short order or go under. Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77588	From: Ben Perry	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so. Greetings All, My parents were so poor, that i was made in Japan. Ben Perry From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2016 20:22:10 -0800 Subject: [S-Trains] I must be getting old...   I must be out of touch somehow, probably an age thing.  You see, when I was young, and for many years after that, nobody would purchase a product that was widely known to be defective.  In fact, a company which continuously produced badly engineered or manufactured items generally went bankrupt in short order. Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so. Today I see all kinds of products which are of low quality which people just keep buying and struggling with.  For instance, Microsoft's computer systems, which they leave it up to the customer to do the research and development, and customers even pay to do it!  Garbage like Vista, and Windows 8 and 10 are examples of systems sold that are full of bugs and undesirable characteristics, yet customers still buy them. I've watched Bachmann Trains climb from being junk in the sixties and seventies, to top quality items in their Spectrum Series in the nineties and early two thousands, and back to being overpriced trains of very dubious quality in the past several years.  Yet people not only buy their crap, and then buy parts to fix brand new stuff, but they even defend the company!  I see the same being done with Lionel and their many problems.  I just don't understand the logic behind this, particularly from a financial perspective.  It defies common sense.   Well, perhaps common sense as we geezers know it.  I was raised by "children of the Depression" who always made damn sure they "got their money's worth" of every product.  There's no chance they would have bought me an American Flyer train set when I was four years old if it was made the way they are now, especially at the ridiculous price!  AF would have been held accountable, which would have meant they would "clean up their act" in short order or go under. Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77589	From: bill hoglund	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

I agree!I do not understand people putting up with crappy products either!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77590	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Oh Stumpy, we are getting old but not as old as the younger people that insist on the latest POC tech. Everything from HDCP 2.2 & Sony Acc-OS in home electronics to DCC etcetera in model railroading. HO is raft with POC products that your are lucky to get out of the box without them falling apart. Imagine a super detailed Box Car with the doors molded shut! Really! Should S & O be any different. The new stuff does not stay on the track any better than the old but one of those snazzy electronic DCC locomotives derails and your out $300 for a dorked board. The old locomotive just put it back on track and it goes on & on. Yep we are getting old. Ever wonder why you need E-bay to get a VCR these days? Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77591	From: George Cohn	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

On 3/2/2016 9:22 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, > and do it again and again. I just don't understand that kind of > thinking. Like I say, it must be an age thing. > > > Stumpy in Ahia I agree Stumpy. My professional career for 32 years was working in telecommunications and we strived to provide the best phone service possible with clarity and reliability. Now we accept lousy service , dropped calls, and ridiculous prices for same. Many of our quality American brands have been outsourced to other countries with seemingly little care for quality or reliability. Another old geezer unhappy with the quality of some modern products. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77592	From: Roy Inman	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Aren’t we ALL getting old. But as my brother says, “it’s better than the alternative.” :) Although I am not so old that I have forgotten the really lousy paint and decorating jobs on Gilbert and Lionel trains. It wasn’t just our toy trains. My first car, a ‘53 Packard, could pass up anything but a gas station and kept breaking down. My dad was an auto mechanic and even he had a hard time keeping the thing on the road-components were less reliable back then. And less expensive of course. Since this is an election year, it may be timely to remind us all that the outsourcing of manufacturing jobs is the direct result of who we, the people elected to Congress. Large corporations especially have saved billions through tax breaks by moving their plants from America. It is probably far to late to bring back jobs (like making toy trains for example) to these shores, but it is something to bear in mind for the 25% of us who vote.   With cheer, Roy Inman on 3/3/16, 8:46 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           On 3/2/2016 9:22 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, > and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of > thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. > > > Stumpy in Ahia I agree Stumpy.  My professional career for 32 years was working in telecommunications and we strived to provide the best phone service possible with clarity and reliability. Now we accept lousy service , dropped calls, and ridiculous prices for same. Many of our quality American brands have been outsourced to other countries with seemingly little care for quality or reliability. Another old geezer unhappy with the quality of some modern products. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77593	From: poniaj	Date: 3/3/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

I agree with you, Roy.  And also some of what Stumpy says.  That's the reason Lionel is now on what my mom so politely called her "It list".  Fill in the first two letters for yourself.  One reason why most of my purchased now are from American Models.  They paid a ransom to get their tooling back from China and are making their things here again.  Yes, today's cars are light years more reliable and efficient, and that comes from a documented car guy who drives a 1937 Ford when the weather permits!  But also comes with that is the admonition from dear ol' dad who cautioned "more to go wrong" when he was offered automatic transmissions!  Progress is what it is, for better or worse.  In many things, it's better and in some it's not.  It's up to the individual to determine what's better for him or her.  Gilbert trains were incredibly well built, but think for a minute.  The stuff under the tables that Stumpy and I vie for, didn't get there because they lasted.  They either fell apart or were misused.  But for every piece of unmolested NIB thing you see on the net, or elsewhere, you will have dozens of others in those boxes under tables at shows. Just my two centavos from us here in FL on vacation, and a victim of happy hour.... Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77594	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

like Ben I can remember when MADE IN JAPAN was a joke but over time Japanese products and quality improved. Today Japanese cars are some of the most reliable. Japanese model trains are some of the most highly detailed. Then the Koreans stepped in and their products too are slowly improving. I would venture to say that given time the Chinese too will improve the quality of their products.   Bob Lampe  Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77595	From: James	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Ya, Starting this year you can buy a Buick made in China. The new Envision is going to be built in China. Jim On 3/3/2016 9:00 PM, danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains] wrote:   like Ben I can remember when MADE IN JAPAN was a joke but over time Japanese products and quality improved. Today Japanese cars are some of the most reliable. Japanese model trains are some of the most highly detailed. Then the Koreans stepped in and their products too are slowly improving. I would venture to say that given time the Chinese too will improve the quality of their products.   Bob Lampe  Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77596	From: ecphora123	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Been reading some of this thread..... Heard the other day, that they (whoever they is?) are coming out with a new cell phone that does only one thing... It makes and receives phone calls. That's all! I suppose it's for us older folks who don't have a thirteen year old handy. I have great respect for simplicity. That's why I like the option of taking an AC Gilbert Flyer locomotive and replacing the guts with a can motor as desired. Could someone explain to me why we can't have the option of just a simple can motor (without all the literal bells and whistles) in the newer stuff? Yes I understand the bigger toys for bigger boys concept, but if you want to run trains and not have to worry about blowing out a cheap defect ridden circuit board, then why can't we go that direction? In other words choice is always good! Gene Cimino

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77597	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Last time we were in China (~2009), there were many Buicks on the road!  Pretty much all were black, however. Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) On 3/4/2016 15:09, James baldone@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ya, Starting this year you can buy a Buick made in China. The new Envision is going to be built in China. Jim On 3/3/2016 9:00 PM, danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains] wrote:   like Ben I can remember when MADE IN JAPAN was a joke but over time Japanese products and quality improved. Today Japanese cars are some of the most reliable. Japanese model trains are some of the most highly detailed. Then the Koreans stepped in and their products too are slowly improving. I would venture to say that given time the Chinese too will improve the quality of their products.   Bob Lampe  Kalispell, MT This email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77598	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: I must be getting old...

Hey, I have one of those phones. Use it once or twice a week too.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 3/4/2016 9:30:08 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Been reading some of this thread..... Heard the other day, that they (whoever they is?) are coming out with a new cell phone that does only one thing... It makes and receives phone calls. That's all! I suppose it's for us older folks who don't have a thirteen year old handy. I have great respect for simplicity. That's why I like the option of taking an AC Gilbert Flyer locomotive and replacing the guts with a can motor as desired. Could someone explain to me why we can't have the option of just a simple can motor (without all the literal bells and whistles) in the newer stuff? Yes I understand the bigger toys for bigger boys concept, but if you want to run trains and not have to worry about blowing out a cheap defect ridden circuit board, then why can't we go that direction? In other words choice is always good! Gene Cimino

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77599	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Attachments : Bugs P-38[38].png Gene, I think the non-bells and whistles people realize that having something do everything for you makes you stupid. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "ecphora123@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Friday, March 4, 2016 at 6:40 AM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] I must be getting old...   Been reading some of this thread..... Heard the other day, that they (whoever they is?) are coming out with a new cell phone that does only one thing... It makes and receives phone calls. That's all! I suppose it's for us older folks who don't have a thirteen year old handy. I have great respect for simplicity. That's why I like the option of taking an AC Gilbert Flyer locomotive and replacing the guts with a can motor as desired. Could someone explain to me why we can't have the option of just a simple can motor (without all the literal bells and whistles) in the newer stuff? Yes I understand the bigger toys for bigger boys concept, but if you want to run trains and not have to worry about blowing out a cheap defect ridden circuit board, then why can't we go that direction? In other words choice is always good! Gene Cimino

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77600	From: richs009	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Well, ok - as someone who is approaching excessive maturity, I like to think of myself as an enlightened curmudgeon -- as in "hey you kids get off my lawn - and get up here a and show me how to use this %$#%& iphone..." I have a number of old ACG engines and like the fact that they still operate - or can be made to operate - 60+ years later.  On the other hand, stubborn e-units are still the bain of their existence, so those Dallee boards and can motors are looking more attractive all the time.  All of these things were designed and built in a time when almost all motors and controls were electromechanical, not to mention the old plate rectifiers used to convert AC to DC.  Now, all that is done electronically and, I would argue, more reliably for the most part.  Sure, most of us can't get in there and 'fix' the individual components anymore - but its also been a long time since any of us could do any real work on a new automobile engine, which now run with greater fuel efficiency and much lower emissions (and a lot longer time between oil changes). Still, those old engines don't have the nice slow speed control, the sound cards (too bad there aren't speakers small enough to fit in the loco instead of the tender), etc.  Admittedly, "progress" is a mixed bag - mostly good but not always (e.g., the pathetic Seuthe smoke unit in my Flyonel Mikado). nostalgia ain't what it used to be... and is probably overrated

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77601	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Ya know I am old, but one of the automobiles I enjoyed most was a 1961 Corvair Monza,  As long as you did not lift off the gas it would take a 90 degree corner flat at 50 mph.  Of course it did have a habit of leaking oil at the push rod tubes o-rings.  Got pretty good at dropping the engine in under 30 minutes..  What does that say about me?  Only that I liked getting involved with fixing.   Now I understand why I only have old Flyer engines, they require bonding and love to keep them running.  Humm, wonder how much trouble it is to convert to DC with a DCC control?   Ken C. President, State-Line S Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77602	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Getting still older

I know there are folks out there that say Gilbert stuff was crude, and they were, but only as compared to stuff that would be made fifty years later.  And there's a lot of Gilbert stuff still around to be compared.  It was pretty well made to survive being played with by children, some of which are STILL playing with by the same children! I very much doubt there will be any of this modern stuff around in another half century, unless it's been left in the box. I like the idea of giving me a choice of whether to take the "base" version, or spend "too much money" for all the electronics.  But like the automakers, there's ALWAYS profit in what used to be called "optional equipment."  Only with so many things sold today we're forced to take the "loaded" version because there's so much money to be made. And then (also as mentioned during this discussion) there's the constant din in advertising that if you don't buy a new version of what you already have, you're missing out somehow.  Hell, this is just the old "keeping up with the Joneses" crap run amok!  And once again it's the electronics industry driving that hardest.  Isn't it amazing that something made in such numbers that they are dirt cheap (microchips and other components) are turned into products so expensive and profitable? I think we, as a society accepting poor quality at high prices, are illustrating what many scientists have started to hint at, that we are "dumbing down" as a people.  I agree that our reliance on letting other people or electronics do all our thinking for us creates a situation where our brains decline from lesser use.  I don't recall any advertisements for "brain games" or "brain training courses" until recent years.  Maybe that's because we used to actually use them? Stumpy in Ahia ...just an old guy thinking out loud.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77603	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older

Attachments : Bugs P-38[40].png Old shit is the best!  Even when I was a kid, I didn’t like the new trains. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Friday, March 4, 2016 at 4:05 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] Getting still older   I know there are folks out there that say Gilbert stuff was crude, and they were, but only as compared to stuff that would be made fifty years later.  And there's a lot of Gilbert stuff still around to be compared.  It was pretty well made to survive being played with by children, some of which are STILL playing with by the same children! I very much doubt there will be any of this modern stuff around in another half century, unless it's been left in the box. I like the idea of giving me a choice of whether to take the "base" version, or spend "too much money" for all the electronics.  But like the automakers, there's ALWAYS profit in what used to be called "optional equipment."  Only with so many things sold today we're forced to take the "loaded" version because there's so much money to be made. And then (also as mentioned during this discussion) there's the constant din in advertising that if you don't buy a new version of what you already have, you're missing out somehow.  Hell, this is just the old "keeping up with the Joneses" crap run amok!  And once again it's the electronics industry driving that hardest.  Isn't it amazing that something made in such numbers that they are dirt cheap (microchips and other components) are turned into products so expensive and profitable? I think we, as a society accepting poor quality at high prices, are illustrating what many scientists have started to hint at, that we are "dumbing down" as a people.  I agree that our reliance on letting other people or electronics do all our thinking for us creates a situation where our brains decline from lesser use.  I don't recall any advertisements for "brain games" or "brain training courses" until recent years.  Maybe that's because we used to actually use them? Stumpy in Ahia ...just an old guy thinking out loud.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77604	From: Alan Smith	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older

Guys,  Old—then there’s old.   - However - Good Old stuff  can be renovated into a whole new Beast that will run another 75 years . This one is the prototype to see if it could be done.  She just lacks the decals.  Here is a 354 that had a big hole in the boiler shell on the left side.  It’s now my version of the  NYC 20 th Century limited  J-3  w/ Dreyfuss drivers— Rooster comb boiler face - L.E.D. head light — 4 wheel trailing truck Wire hand railings Yellow frt markers (only because I had no green)  L.E.D Reverse light - L.E.D red rear markers - — five axle tender — Bigger coal bunker   L.E.D. Flickering fire box lights,  Knuckle coupler,  loop ladder up the back of the tender, shortened tender drawbar, weighted front pilot, custom traction skins on 4 drivers, etc. It still the old AC motor and Reverse switch.  It still runs great, smoke and all.  It was put out on the scrap heap.  It is ready to run the “sea level route” again. LONG LIVE OLD FLYERS  and old guys that have an imagination.    The next one will be much nicer as a result of the learning phrase on this prototype

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77605	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 3/4/2016 5:23:42 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Ya know I am old, but one of the automobiles I enjoyed most was a 1961 Corvair Monza,  As long as you did not lift off the gas it would take a 90 degree corner flat at 50 mph.  Of course it did have a habit of leaking oil at the push rod tubes o-rings.  Got pretty good at dropping the engine in under 30 minutes..  What does that say about me?  Only that I liked getting involved with fixing. Now I understand why I only have old Flyer engines, they require bonding and love to keep them running.  Humm, wonder how much trouble it is to convert to DC with a DCC control? Ken C. President, State-Line S Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77606	From: snstrains	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

It's a piece of cake to convert old Flyers to DC/DCC. Do it all the time.     Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 3/4/2016 5:23:42 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Ya know I am old, but one of the automobiles I enjoyed most was a 1961 Corvair Monza,  As long as you did not lift off the gas it would take a 90 degree corner flat at 50 mph.  Of course it did have a habit of leaking oil at the push rod tubes o-rings.  Got pretty good at dropping the engine in under 30 minutes..  What does that say about me?  Only that I liked getting involved with fixing. Now I understand why I only have old Flyer engines, they require bonding and love to keep them running.  Humm, wonder how much trouble it is to convert to DC with a DCC control? Ken C. President, State-Line S Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77607	From: rick flaherty	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older [9 Attachments]

Attachments : Bugs P-38[41].png Alan, that totally rocks! Thank you so much. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Friday, March 4, 2016 at 6:14 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Getting still older [9 Attachments] Guys,  Old—then there’s old.   - However - Good Old stuff  can be renovated into a whole new Beast that will run another 75 years . This one is the prototype to see if it could be done.  She just lacks the decals.  Here is a 354 that had a big hole in the boiler shell on the left side.  It’s now my version of the  NYC 20 th Century limited  J-3  w/ Dreyfuss drivers— Rooster comb boiler face - L.E.D. head light — 4 wheel trailing truck Wire hand railings Yellow frt markers (only because I had no green)  L.E.D Reverse light - L.E.D red rear markers - — five axle tender — Bigger coal bunker   L.E.D. Flickering fire box lights,  Knuckle coupler,  loop ladder up the back of the tender, shortened tender drawbar, weighted front pilot, custom traction skins on 4 drivers, etc. It still the old AC motor and Reverse switch.  It still runs great, smoke and all.  It was put out on the scrap heap.  It is ready to run the “sea level route” again. LONG LIVE OLD FLYERS  and old guys that have an imagination.    The next one will be much nicer as a result of the learning phrase on this prototype                                      NYC  # 5344  On Mar 4, 2016, at 7:05 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I know there are folks out there that say Gilbert stuff was crude, and they were, but only as compared to stuff that would be made fifty years later.  And there's a lot of Gilbert stuff still around to be compared.  It was pretty well made to survive being played with by children, some of which are STILL playing with by the same children! I very much doubt there will be any of this modern stuff around in another half century, unless it's been left in the box. I like the idea of giving me a choice of whether to take the "base" version, or spend "too much money" for all the electronics.  But like the automakers, there's ALWAYS profit in what used to be called "optional equipment."  Only with so many things sold today we're forced to take the "loaded" version because there's so much money to be made. And then (also as mentioned during this discussion) there's the constant din in advertising that if you don't buy a new version of what you already have, you're missing out somehow.  Hell, this is just the old "keeping up with the Joneses" crap run amok!  And once again it's the electronics industry driving that hardest.  Isn't it amazing that something made in such numbers that they are dirt cheap (microchips and other components) are turned into products so expensive and profitable? I think we, as a society accepting poor quality at high prices, are illustrating what many scientists have started to hint at, that we are "dumbing down" as a people.  I agree that our reliance on letting other people or electronics do all our thinking for us creates a situation where our brains decline from lesser use.  I don't recall any advertisements for "brain games" or "brain training courses" until recent years.  Maybe that's because we used to actually use them? Stumpy in Ahia ...just an old guy thinking out loud.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77608	From: poniaj	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

YOU can buy a Buick made in China.... I never will. Jerry Poniatowski Michigan The State from which Buicks first came

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77609	From: Roy Inman	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older [1 Attachment]

Attachments : Compare the sales of Williams by Bachman vs. Lionel and MTH. The Williams stuff runs like a top and apparently has a long life. But it just ain’t “sexy.” If this hobby is going to appeal to the younger demographic, it will have to be continually reinventing itself with more and better electronics. I see where the Bachman HO trains has a line that can be run from an iphone. Roy Inman on 3/4/16, 6:47 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           Old shit is the best!  Even when I was a kid, I didn’t like the new trains. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" & lt;S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Friday, March 4, 2016 at 4:05 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] Getting still older          I know there are folks out there that say Gilbert stuff was crude, and they were, but only as compared to stuff that would be made fifty years later.  And there's a lot of Gilbert stuff still around to be compared.  It was pretty well made to survive being played with by children, some of which are STILL playing with by the same children! I very much doubt there will be any of this modern stuff around in another half century, unless it's been left in the box. I like the idea of giving me a choice of whether to take the "base" version, or spend "too much money" for all the electronics.  But like the automakers, there's ALWAYS profit in what used to be called "optional equipment."  Only with so many things sold today we're forced to take the "loaded" version because there's so much money to be made. And then (also as mentioned during this discussion) there's the constant din in advertising that if you d on't buy a new version of what you already have, you're missing out somehow.  Hell, this is just the old "keeping up with the Joneses" crap run amok!  And once again it's the electronics industry driving that hardest.  Isn't it amazing that something made in such numbers that they are dirt cheap (microchips and other components) are turned into products so expensive and profitable? I think we, as a society accepting poor quality at high prices, are illustrating what many scientists have started to hint at, that we are "dumbing down" as a people.  I agree that our reliance on letting other people or electronics do all our thinking for us creates a situation where our brains decline from lesser use.  I don't recall any advertisements for "brain games" or "brain training courses" until recent years.  Maybe that's because we used to actually use them? Stumpy in Ahia ...just an old guy thinking out loud.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77610	From: traindavid	Date: 3/4/2016
Subject: National S Gauge MONTH!

Did anyone notice that, this being 2016, that means all of March is S Gauge--3/16! Someone posted me that 3-16 is also Saint Gilbert's Day, celebrating his chasing that ugly third rail out of the Toy Train world! :) Run 'em if ya got 'em! David "two rails" Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77611	From: traindavid	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Getting Old, or was always old

OK, I will admit that in High School I listened to Big Band music more than "my generations" music---OK, I did a lot of Simon & Garfunkel & I thought the Mothers of Invention were cool, but I think I've always been "behind the times" Heck, all through High School I was restoring my Model A Ford--was able to drive it to school the last week of my senior year & drove it to my graduation & I still have it! So, I like old ACG stuff--I like open-frame motors and finicky reverse units. Yes, I will admit the modern units that start in forward if the loco's sat a while are neat, but it's very hard to fix them when something goes wrong! I have seen a modern can motor "bird-nest" in a Flyonel GP engine. "Can't fix that!" Ever try to rewind a can motor armature? Nothing against can motor conversions, a good friend sells a lot of them, but different strokes for different folks. Hey, what do you expect from a guy who thinks a cool ride is a Model T or a Model A? As for a simple phone; mine is pretty close to one, except I can text and take photos, but it's still an old flip-phone. Does everything I expect a phone to do! Years ago, when we were taking car of Linda's aged parents I knew there is a market for simplified home appliances--Linda's Dad just couldn't handle anything more than pretty much "On & Off." My mom's almost there now too.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77612	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

My wife and I used to live in Butte. In 2008, 2009 and 2010 We were volunteers at the National Folk Festival that was held there those 3 years. Our position was beverage(soft drink) bottled water and ice delivery to the various vendors.  The second year a local car dealership who sold a Chinese made vehicle called a ZAP loaned the use of a pickup. ZAP which stood for Zero Air Pollution were 3 wheel electric vehicles. They had disk brakes on the 2 rear wheels only. A 100pound chunk of concrete with a chain in it with the free end welded to the frame would have been safer.The battery was supposed to be good for 8 hours. One trip of about 3 blocks almost drained the battery. Then it had to charge for 3 hours. What a piece of junk. I had another term but this is also a family oriented forum. Maybe in another 20 years but not yet.  Bob Lampe Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77613	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Lol, very true comment. How about all the foods we now eat that come from China ? They create big bellies n butts.  If there are batteries in our new model trains, I would be careful where they are and run. They might have issues like what is blowing up and fire issues with smart phones.    What is real these days ? Frank  Sent from my iPhone On Mar 4, 2016, at 10:00 PM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   YOU can buy a Buick made in China.... I never will. Jerry Poniatowski Michigan The State from which Buicks first came

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77614	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting older

I am definitely amongst this group that is getting older, crossed into the 70's last year. I for one love the old Gilbert trains but, I also embrace the newer Flyonel equipment. These trains, "when they are right", can do things we only dreamed of a few years back. There is problems with some of the equipment but in my experience Lionel has stood behind their products and continues to do it. Do I like the fact that I had to send some things back for warranty and pay for the shipping? No but, at the same time I never had trains before where they were capable of truly being operated, we used to just run trains. I see us now with a system where I can have, for example three engines sitting on the same piece of rail and energize the one of my choice, be it Gilbert or Flyonel, and build a train and "operate it" while leaving the others at rest. I have a system where I can take a seventy year old conventional Gilbert engine and run it with a wireless remote and view it, as I control it, from any place on the layout. This give me much more enjoyment in a hobby that I dearly love. I can take, if I so desire, that 70 year old engine and give it a new life by installing an ERR motor driver board in it and run it completely independent of other locomotives on that same piece of track. I do not say that these developments are for everyone but we have a number of members of the BSG that have to different levels adopted the TMCC/Legacy system and are quite happy with it. When this group does get together to run trains we can operate or run five or six or even more trains on one layout all at the same time and it can be a mix of the old and new, and they can be taken to anyplace desired on the layout. This can be done without a need for a system of blocks to separate the power to each engine. On my layout ,"if" we would want to do, it we could run three of the conventional Gilbert engines on independent blocks and still do it with the wireless control. The TMCC/Legacy system also is not a complicated system to operate, all that needs to be done is to power up the layout, punch in a two digit number for the engine you desire to run, into the handheld remote and you are up and running. Now also thanks to Electric Rail Road I can take a conventional Flyonel passenger set and convert it to TMCC and have the conventional Railsounds B-unit horn or whistle and bell triggered in the TMCC mode. I for one, although I know I am not alone, thank Lionel for bringing this system to S gauge. Trains for me are much more fun than they have ever been. Yes there can be and is some frustration but the fun overcomes it. We also have so members on the scale side that use DCC and I think that is great, why not use the advancements that modern technology has given us. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77615	From: Carey Probst	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

No trouble at all.  Just get some can motors for the appropriate engine from SnS Trains and go at it. Takes very little time in most cases, depending on how hard the stock motor is to remove.  I've done all my steamers and Steve did all my diesels for me. Adding DCC should be simple since you now have a standard 2 wire dc connection and a lot more room than in HO. They run so much better with the can motors.  I chose the slow speed ones for realism rather than the drag racing versions. Carey, looking forward to having a place to run all those great running engines. On 3/4/2016 6:17 PM, 'Ken Christiansen' klchris@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ya know I am old, but one of the automobiles I enjoyed most was a 1961 Corvair Monza,  As long as you did not lift off the gas it would take a 90 degree corner flat at 50 mph.  Of course it did have a habit of leaking oil at the push rod tubes o-rings.  Got pretty good at dropping the engine in under 30 minutes..  What does that say about me?  Only that I liked getting involved with fixing.   Now I understand why I only have old Flyer engines, they require bonding and love to keep them running.  Humm, wonder how much trouble it is to convert to DC with a DCC control?   Ken C. President, State-Line S Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77616	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

Yeah, I bought one of those phones years ago. Still use it, works great! It is just a telephone, wait I didn't buy it, Verizon gave it to me! Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77617	From: JFrederick Roberts	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

But, where do you go to get anything better? On Thursday, March 3, 2016 3:00 AM, "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I must be out of touch somehow, probably an age thing.  You see, when I was young, and for many years after that, nobody would purchase a product that was widely known to be defective.  In fact, a company which continuously produced badly engineered or manufactured items generally went bankrupt in short order. Even an otherwise decent outfit that made something not up to par was badly maligned, such as Ford's Edsel or Chevy's Corvair.  I remember well when an item stamped "made in Japan" denoted a product that was cheaply made.  In fact "made in Japan" was more or less a running joke for years.  It appears that "made in China" is quickly gaining the same reputation today, and deservedly so. Today I see all kinds of products which are of low quality which people just keep buying and struggling with.  For instance, Microsoft's computer systems, which they leave it up to the customer to do the research and development, and customers even pay to do it!  Garbage like Vista, and Windows 8 and 10 are examples of systems sold that are full of bugs and undesirable characteristics, yet customers still buy them. I've watched Bachmann Trains climb from being junk in the sixties and seventies, to top quality items in their Spectrum Series in the nineties and early two thousands, and back to being overpriced trains of very dubious quality in the past several years.  Yet people not only buy their crap, and then buy parts to fix brand new stuff, but they even defend the company!  I see the same being done with Lionel and their many problems.  I just don't understand the logic behind this, particularly from a financial perspective.  It defies common sense.   Well, perhaps common sense as we geezers know it.  I was raised by "children of the Depression" who always made damn sure they "got their money's worth" of every product.  There's no chance they would have bought me an American Flyer train set when I was four years old if it was made the way they are now, especially at the ridiculous price!  AF would have been held accountable, which would have meant they would "clean up their act" in short order or go under. Yet today a lot of folks will accept poor quality at an insane price, and do it again and again.  I just don't understand that kind of thinking.  Like I say, it must be an age thing. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77618	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: I must be getting old...

I agree 100% Rich! Chris Burger From: "richs009@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 4, 2016 3:13 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] I must be getting old...   Well, ok - as someone who is approaching excessive maturity, I like to think of myself as an enlightened curmudgeon -- as in "hey you kids get off my lawn - and get up here a and show me how to use this %$#%& iphone..." I have a number of old ACG engines and like the fact that they still operate - or can be made to operate - 60+ years later.  On the other hand, stubborn e-units are still the bain of their existence, so those Dallee boards and can motors are looking more attractive all the time.  All of these things were designed and built in a time when almost all motors and controls were electromechanical, not to mention the old plate rectifiers used to convert AC to DC.  Now, all that is done electronically and, I would argue, more reliably for the most part.  Sure, most of us can't get in there and 'fix' the individual components anymore - but its also been a long time since any of us could do any real work on a new automobile engine, which now run with greater fuel efficiency and much lower emissions (and a lot longer time between oil changes). Still, those old engines don't have the nice slow speed control, the sound cards (too bad there aren't speakers small enough to fit in the loco instead of the tender), etc.  Admittedly, "progress" is a mixed bag - mostly good but not always (e.g., the pathetic Seuthe smoke unit in my Flyonel Mikado). nostalgia ain't what it used to be... and is probably overrated

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77619	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older

Attachments : Roy, MTH and Lionel have those same APPS now. Just about anything with electronics in it can be run with the Apps on and I phone, Tablet etc. Today's trains and controllers are so much better than the old ones or as someone said,"Old shit". LOL!  Looks, sounds and controls. All better and sexier than the old stuff. I agree when someone else said Nostalgia is over rated.  I'll take today over yesterday ANY Day Chris Burger From: "Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 4, 2016 9:50 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Getting still older   Compare the sales of Williams by Bachman vs. Lionel and MTH. The Williams stuff runs like a top and apparently has a long life. But it just ain’t “sexy.” If this hobby is going to appeal to the younger demographic, it will have to be continually reinventing itself with more and better electronics. I see where the Bachman HO trains has a line that can be run from an iphone. Roy Inman on 3/4/16, 6:47 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           Old shit is the best!  Even when I was a kid, I didn’t like the new trains. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" & lt;S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Friday, March 4, 2016 at 4:05 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] Getting still older          I know there are folks out there that say Gilbert stuff was crude, and they were, but only as compared to stuff that would be made fifty years later.  And there's a lot of Gilbert stuff still around to be compared.  It was pretty well made to survive being played with by children, some of which are STILL playing with by the same children! I very much doubt there will be any of this modern stuff around in another half century, unless it's been left in the box. I like the idea of giving me a choice of whether to take the "base" version, or spend "too much money" for all the electronics.  But like the automakers, there's ALWAYS profit in what used to be called "optional equipment."  Only with so many things sold today we're forced to take the "loaded" version because there's so much money to be made. And then (also as mentioned during this discussion) there's the constant din in advertising that if you d on't buy a new version of what you already have, you're missing out somehow.  Hell, this is just the old "keeping up with the Joneses" crap run amok!  And once again it's the electronics industry driving that hardest.  Isn't it amazing that something made in such numbers that they are dirt cheap (microchips and other components) are turned into products so expensive and profitable? I think we, as a society accepting poor quality at high prices, are illustrating what many scientists have started to hint at, that we are "dumbing down" as a people.  I agree that our reliance on letting other people or electronics do all our thinking for us creates a situation where our brains decline from lesser use.  I don't recall any advertisements for "brain games" or "brain training courses" until recent years.  Maybe that's because we used to actually use them? Stumpy in Ahia ...just an old guy thinking out loud.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77620	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: Re: Getting Old, or was always old

Come on Duck, you are still on Dial up. It's expected from you! LOL! CB From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 5, 2016 1:54 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Getting Old, or was always old   OK, I will admit that in High School I listened to Big Band music more than "my generations" music---OK, I did a lot of Simon & Garfunkel & I thought the Mothers of Invention were cool, but I think I've always been "behind the times" Heck, all through High School I was restoring my Model A Ford--was able to drive it to school the last week of my senior year & drove it to my graduation & I still have it! So, I like old ACG stuff--I like open-frame motors and finicky reverse units. Yes, I will admit the modern units that start in forward if the loco's sat a while are neat, but it's very hard to fix them when something goes wrong! I have seen a modern can motor "bird-nest" in a Flyonel GP engine. "Can't fix that!" Ever try to rewind a can motor armature? Nothing against can motor conversions, a good friend sells a lot of them, but different strokes for different folks. Hey, what do you expect from a guy who thinks a cool ride is a Model T or a Model A? As for a simple phone; mine is pretty close to one, except I can text and take photos, but it's still an old flip-phone. Does everything I expect a phone to do! Years ago, when we were taking car of Linda's aged parents I knew there is a market for simplified home appliances--Linda's Dad just couldn't handle anything more than pretty much "On & Off." My mom's almost there now too.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77621	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/5/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 06 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77622	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 06 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77623	From: traindavid	Date: 3/6/2016
Subject: Re: Getting still older

Yes, I too like some of the new stuff. The Y-3 will just crawl through switches--and the sounds! Oh Vey! However, I do remember my sister hearing them for the first time, and she said, "Sounds like a recording!" Hmm, one vote for the old mechanical "Choo-Choo"--and this from someone who doesn't run trains! The PE engine can creep around the track, so slowly it's like watching grass grow! HOWEVER! Once all this neat stuff ceases to function, I dunno what to do! I just fixed a friends SHS SP F unit--took three different sound/control boards before I found one that still worked--I can't fix the boards, just change them out. The old stuff, however, I can (until the eyes and hands go) tear it down put it back together--steal parts from junkers--and keep it going! Might not do all the neat stuff, might just run like a toy train, but it will still run! So, as with everything in life, Ying & Yang. So, Run 'em if ya got 'em AND if they still work! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77624	From: vito4cal	Date: 3/7/2016
Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: 2016 O Scale West & S West 11

2016 O Scale West & S West 11   Largest S scale show west of the Mississippi!   There will be S standard and narrow gauge dealers, clinics, videos & contest.   The BASS club will have their modular layout up and running – bring your equipment to run on the layout.  Equipment must meet NASG standards.     Convention info:   May 5-7, 2016 – NOTE NEW DATE Hyatt Regency Santa Clara 5101 Great America Parkway Santa Clara, CA  95054 Reservations: 800-233-1234 Hotel Switchboard: 408-200-1234 Hotel Fax: 408-980-3939   Admission: $35 for registrations postmarked by March 31, 2016; $40 at the door; registration includes spouse and all children under age of 18   Saturday only - $20   -Table Rentals: $45/table if registration is postmarked by March 31, 2015; $50 after March 31, 2016, e-electrical hook up is free.   Additional information & registration forms available at:  http://www.oscalewest.com.   Additional questions, please contact John Gibson at gibson@... or at 916-580-5444.   Look forward to seeing you at the show.   S West Convention Chairman,   John Gibson

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77625	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/7/2016
Subject: Converting Flyonel to scale

I have 4 Flyonel cylindrical hoppers to which I want to add different trucks and Kadee body mount couplers. The prototypes for these cars were equipped with Barber 100 ton roller bearing trucks. In this conversion would it be to my benefit to add truck bolsters as well as the draft gear for the Kadees?                                                  Bob Lampe                                                 Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77626	From: pickycat95	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Converting Flyonel to scale

Bob, I have installed American Models roller bearing trucks directly to the bolsters (I can't remember, but I think I used a shortened Atlas O-gauge track screw to fasten).  I attached Kadee 802s directly to the body using the shorter screws.  Couplers end up being at perfect height off the rail per NASG standards. Ben Trousdale

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77627	From: race944t	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Dunbar, WV train show

Anyone going to the Dunbar, WV (near Charleston, WV) this weekend?  It is Friday, Saturday and Sunday at the Dunbar Community Center.  It is being put on by the Kanawah United Model Railroaders Association.  I will have S for sale and parts. Banker Bill Clark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77628	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Converting Flyonel to scale

Ben,    Thank you very much that is good to know. The cars I have are BN prototype and as such have the stock trucks. The cars are  being converted to the type used by the Butte Anaconda & Pacific and luckily the only changes that need to be done to the main car body is to remove the BN lettering, logo and number. The main car body color is the same as will be the data on the car. All I have to add is the BA&P and a 3 digit number and a plate on the ladder end with the numbers cut out. That part I have yet to figure out how to do those. The reason for the plate with cut out numbers was that after time the painted on numbers were all but impossible to read as they were covered by what was called milk of lime. I'm working on some ideas for those plates. The trucks I plan on using are the 100 ton barber roller bearing trucks sold by Jim King at Smoky Mountain Model works. if these are anything like his 70 ton roller bearing trucks they are very nice indeed. I have some of the 70 ton trucks for another project I am working on. it's going to be a while before I finish all of these projects but I will post photos when they are finished.                 Bob Lampe                 Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77629	From: Raymond Kemper	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout

While Lionel makes insulating pins for AF tubular track, I haven't found any insulating connectors for Fastrack nor has my research on various sites yielded any methods. If I cut a rail, I am not sure how to fill the gap, or is there another better approach/product that anyone could share?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77630	From: n6ojj	Date: 3/8/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout

Chuck, If you can't get suitable insulating track pins, it's on to plan B. May I suggest the following: 1. Fasten the affected track pieces to the layout top; 2. Cut a narrow gap in the affected rail. Depending on the metal thickness, it may be easier to use a motor tool equipped with a cut-off wheel. 3. Place a piece of styrene in the gap. It's okay if it is a bit oversize, so long as the thickness is correct. You want to completely fill the gap. "Glue" the styrene in place with a small amount of CA adhesive (a.k.a. 'Super glue', or equivalent). If you use more than one layer of styrene, glue them together before any trimming. Check the packaging to confirm suitability for plastic and metal. 4. After the CA is fully cured, trim the styrene to be flush with the top and the inside-the-gauge surfaces. Medium and fine files work well. You don't want the engines and rolling stock bouncing when they roll over the gap. The outside and bottom surfaces are not so critical. Painting is optional. Good luck, Dave Sent from my iPad

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77631	From: Doug Peck	Date: 3/9/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout

While I can’t say that I have tried this, I’d be surprised if the SHS/MTH insulating railjoiners wouldn’t work on FasTrack, since the rail is essentially identical.  MTH has released the insulators, and we have them in stock. Has anyone tried this????? <<< While Lionel makes insulating pins for AF tubular track, I haven't found any insulating connectors for Fastrack>>> Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77632	From: racin510	Date: 3/9/2016
Subject: Tom Barker

Can someone, or Tom if you see this, send me your email address? Rick Gough

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77633	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: AF Steamer Gear Question

Good Morning everyone: Even after downsizing our home and moving to Florida, and my wife finding out how many trains I do have and moved with us down to FL, we went to a big antiques show in central FL a couple of weekends ago and I bought ------ Flyer Trains! Not a big purchase, 4 KC Freights and a 283 Steamer. All dirty but complete. While in the process of cleaning the 283 I found the main gear on the rear driving wheels that connects to the worm shaft is worn to the point that the gears don't mesh if going forward but mesh when in reverse. Upon further inspection the gear is decidedly worn to one side. This engine wasn't a shelf queen. It got ran. No problem that's what toy trains were made for.  I've had the dummy wheels and axles off of steamers before. Any tricks/tips to taking the one with the drive gear off and replacing the gear? I have a good replacement gear but the fix isn't on youtube! Help/advice would be appreciated. Regards Bob Moyer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77634	From: snstrains	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Steamer Gear Question

Since the axle is swaged you can only press it out in one direction. You need to press it out toward the engineers side.  We have tools for that, but you can use a small punch. It will most often ruin the axle and you MAY need a replacement one as well as the gear. Both parts are available from Port Lines Hobby. www.portlines.com or phone 978-465-8798. But you may want to send it to a repair shop so that critical quartering is done properly.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 3/10/2016 10:23:39 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Good Morning everyone: Even after downsizing our home and moving to Florida, and my wife finding out how many trains I do have and moved with us down to FL, we went to a big antiques show in central FL a couple of weekends ago and I bought ------ Flyer Trains! Not a big purchase, 4 KC Freights and a 283 Steamer. All dirty but complete. While in the process of cleaning the 283 I found the main gear on the rear driving wheels that connects to the worm shaft is worn to the point that the gears don't mesh if going forward but mesh when in reverse. Upon further inspection the gear is decidedly worn to one side. This engine wasn't a shelf queen. It got ran. No problem that's what toy trains were made for.  I've had the dummy wheels and axles off of steamers before. Any tricks/tips to taking the one with the drive gear off and replacing the gear? I have a good replacement gear but the fix isn't on youtube! Help/advice would be appreciated. Regards Bob Moyer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77635	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 3/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF Steamer Gear Question

The gear comes off as easy as the wheels however only on one side  of the axle.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77636	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 13 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77637	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

I have been searching, without success, for the part number of the standard Lionel American Flyer knuckle coupler.  Does anyone on the list know what it is? Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77638	From: n6ojj	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

A few questions.--  Freight car or locomotive tender installation?   If you are not finding them at Lionel, suitable replacements can be found at Des Plaines Hobbies and at LBR Enterprises.  Each has a website at their store name dot com.   There are other dealers carrying this part, including eBay.   Good luck,  Dave McBrayer  Sent from my iPad On Mar 14, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Victor Bereskin vbereskin@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have been searching, without success, for the part number of the standard Lionel American Flyer knuckle coupler.  Does anyone on the list know what it is? Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77639	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: Re: Creating blocks in an AF FastTrack layout

Thanks. I am going to try the MTH insulated railjoiners first, and if no luck, I'll try what you have suggested.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77640	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 3/14/2016
Subject: jeff faust book

Does any one have a copy of the Jeff Faust book? I have a copy that was scanned but page 18 is blurry. If someone has it can they please scan me page 18? Thanks Rich Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77641	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

>A few questions.-- >Freight car or locomotive tender installation? >If you are not finding them at Lionel, suitable replacements can be found at Des Plaines Hobbies and at LBR Enterprises. Each has >a website at their store name dot com. There are other dealers carrying this part, including eBay. >Good luck, >Dave McBrayer I believe the freight car, passenger car and tender couplers are all the same (excluding electro-couplers on newer locomotives), as they were on Gilbert American Flyer. I have had very poor luck with reproductions of Gilbert couplers.  The distance that the weight hangs below the coupler body is inconsistent and the lower hanging ones are prone to opening when going over switches and crossings.  Lionel, SHS/MTH, and American Models all work well, but only the Lionel couplers can be installed on American Flyer trucks. Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77642	From: beebear	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

Speaking of couplers Will the new electric couplers fit on the older AF engines. If so does anyone carry them except Lionel and price??   Thanks   John Frankforther   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2016 8:51 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Flyonel Couplers     >A few questions.-- >Freight car or locomotive tender installation? >If you are not finding them at Lionel, suitable replacements can be found at Des Plaines Hobbies and at LBR Enterprises. Each has >a website at their store name dot com. There are other dealers carrying this part, including eBay. >Good luck, >Dave McBrayer I believe the freight car, passenger car and tender couplers are all the same (excluding electro-couplers on newer locomotives), as they were on Gilbert American Flyer. I have had very poor luck with reproductions of Gilbert couplers.  The distance that the weight hangs below the coupler body is inconsistent and the lower hanging ones are prone to opening when going over switches and crossings.  Lionel, SHS/MTH, and American Models all work well, but only the Lionel couplers can be installed on American Flyer trucks. Vic Bereskin Checked by Avast Antivirus. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77643	From: R G	Date: 3/15/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

The electro couplers are probably Lionel O gauge couplers mounted on flyer equipment as Lionel couplers are actually the same size to a little smaller than Flyer couplers. The electro couplers do not mate well with original Flyer couplers or even the new Flyonel couplers and on my two berkshires the will not uncouple from Flyer or newer couplers since they do not open far enough!.  They're a nice idea but the execution is flawed!  On Tuesday, March 15, 2016 3:20 PM, "'beebear' beebear@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Speaking of couplers Will the new electric couplers fit on the older AF engines. If so does anyone carry them except Lionel and price??   Thanks   John Frankforther   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2016 8:51 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Flyonel Couplers     >A few questions.-- >Freight car or locomotive tender installation? >If you are not finding them at Lionel, suitable replacements can be found at Des Plaines Hobbies and at LBR Enterprises. Each has >a website at their store name dot com. There are other dealers carrying this part, including eBay. >Good luck, >Dave McBrayer I believe the freight car, passenger car and tender couplers are all the same (excluding electro-couplers on newer locomotives), as they were on Gilbert American Flyer. I have had very poor luck with reproductions of Gilbert couplers.  The distance that the weight hangs below the coupler body is inconsistent and the lower hanging ones are prone to opening when going over switches and crossings.  Lionel, SHS/MTH, and American Models all work well, but only the Lionel couplers can be installed on American Flyer trucks. Vic Bereskin Checked by Avast Antivirus. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77644	From: traindavid	Date: 3/16/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

Actually, most of the Flyonel couplers this last decade don't open far enough to couple or uncouple easily. The latest catalog states that they have "improved" them, so maybe someone finally realized there has to be more than 1/16" of movement between open and closed! The new elctromatic couplers are smaller than the 0 gauge versions, however, they are specific to each locomotive AND you need the electronics on board to make them operate. My Big Boy coupler never worked from the start, and the one on the Texas Special is on the rear of the leading A unit; not very useful at all if you are running an A-A or even an A-B-A set of engines. This is just one more "not thought through" example of Flyonel engineering. They could have put it on the nose coupler and then you could run the motorized A as the trailing unit hand have remote control uncoupling. Actually, I think the ACG version works just fine and is uncomplicated! And yes, there are variations in quality on reproduction couplers; there's more than one maker, but I don't know just who sells the "good stuff." Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77645	From: Don Abrams	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

David, The electro couplers work off the TMCC/Legacy track voltage being supplied. I've found that below 16 VAC uncoupling is hit or miss. Also lubricating the coupler makes a big difference! Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77646	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

That is the discouraging thing. Ready to run should mean that it will work out of the box. But instead it has become part of the hobby to spend hours re-engineering that which does not work. To be truthful it should say right on the box: "Doubtful that this will work in any way you should normally expect". Or maybe change the name to "Take a Chance Trains"! Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77647	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/17/2016
Subject: Re: Flyonel Couplers

Sometimes R-T-R does not stand for Ready-To-Run it stands for Ready-To-Repair.                          Bob Lampe                          Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77648	From: veronifamily	Date: 3/18/2016
Subject: structure kits

Hi, looking for a couple of S scale Structure  kits, building and structure co, Hodges Hardware, and pine Canyon models kit 8045 small corner store, part of the main st series, these were brick kits, and both companies I believe  are now out of business, please contact off list if you are interested in parting with them thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77649	From: allscalerails	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #7 March / April 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #7  March / April 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.AllScaleRails.com Subscribe to out free email list & get notified when new issue come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join Click  HERE for Issue 7 http://www.allscalerails.com/ Included in this issue:  How-To Bring Old Lionel Locomotives Back To Life, Milwaukee Lionel Railroad Club's Layout, Seneca Glass Company, Rail America Circle Word Puzzle, Part 2 C.M.St.P.&P. R.R. 1969 Bridge over Layton Ave. in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Blueprints, News & New Products, Snap Shots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77650	From: Doug Peck	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: Re: structure kits

PCM is still in business, but has suspended production due to a move to SC, where they do not yet have a production facility ready. B&S was sold long ago to Banta Modelworks, and has since been sold again to Commercial Scale Models, of RI.  They catalog many of the S-scale kits.   We have neither of those kits left in stock, although we have MANY no-longer-available kits from an estate on our Consignments page, with still more to be listed this spring. It’s possible I will come across those two kits, as there are many still to be unpacked and listed, so keep watching !   <<< both companies I believe are now out of business,>>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77651	From: traindavid	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: Will miss Sunday Chat

Hi All, I won't make it to this Sunday's Chat--It's Linda's Birthday and she has other plans that require my presence! Have a great chat, catch ya in two weeks (I'll be in Dunsmuir next Sunday, mot likely I'll have a chance to drop in then either. Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77652	From: Gerry Evans	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: In Print...

I just finished reading and enjoying the pix in the current "NMRA Magazine" article by Brooks Stover and Gaylord Gill. This wonderful article covered just about any aspect of S. Also, in addition to the five and one-half page article, S is displayed on the magazine's cover. Brooks and Gaylord, great job! Just one question to Jan Burdzinski whose RS-1 is shown on the cover. The building behind the RS-1 appears to be a doubled-up infamous NASG brick building. Am I correct?   Gerry Evans In St. Louis-Go, Cards!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77653	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 20 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77654	From: Bill Lane	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: New YouTube clip

I finally made a new YouTube clip of models I made last year, are new to me, or have mostly not been featured in my previous clips. Most models are NOT brass, which is a departure from my usual model clips. Many cars and some locos are 1 of a kind, or are not common. S Scalers will be able to see that as they go by.   There is a heavy Reading beginning from my Reading modeling binge last year, with some Seaboard mixed in. Of course a massive Pennsylvania train finishes it off. It is all my loosely based attempt at modeling my PRSL.   This clip is not as polished as my older clips. A crash of my Mac Mini made me “upgrade” to IMovie 11 which is absolutely horrible. Words simply cannot describe how bad it is compared to my previous 09 version.   Please give it a look. Enjoy! https://youtu.be/Y_CkZrbWlzI     Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL  & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1988 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale! PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society http://www.prslhs.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77655	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 20 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77656	From: chuck_7612	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: A Newbie's Observations

In the spirit of helping others new to modeling, and S modeling in particular, I wanted to share what I have observed in my first couple months of looking into and now starting this hobby.  I got the itch in January to get into modeling (and to bring my 16 year old son in with me) despite not owning or operating a train for the last 35 years.  I began doing my research, studying every aspect I figured I would need to know to get up and running.  I don't consider myself mechanically adept, so I read a lot material online and watched lots of videos.  I decided on S gauge, even though I had no familiarity with it other than a vague recollection of my father owning a few AF items that he sold to fund our 4'X8' HO layout when I was 10.  S seemed like the right size.  I did not want the tediousness of HO which I recalled well from my childhood, and I didn't think O would lend itself to a very interesting layout in my available space (11.5' X 5.5' w/ a 3' X 2.5' L at one end). I set out some principles for what we wanted to do: -While I want some realism, I am not getting hung up on everything being scale. - I like high tech when it come to things I buy for leisure purposes, so DCC was very attractive to me as was the prospect of wireless control of the layout.  But another principle was that we would create one loop with conventional control so that we could run non-DCC locomotives if we ever wanted to and so that my younger son could participate too by using a transformer to run a train on that loop. - Buy mostly locomotives and rolling stock with road names that have significance for us.  My grandfather worked over 40 yrs. for Illinois Central.  A Louisville & Nashville line ran less than 200 feet from the home in which I grew up.  And we live in and love Texas (so all names with Texas work). - Make it a tropical setting - palms and beach required - No impulse buying - Research all purchases on all the online stores I can find selling that particular product. - Go slow and accept that we will make some mistakes because everything we are doing has a bit of guesswork to it since we know no one else who models.  We have finished the benchwork and purchased our track, power and controls, sub-terrain materials, and some maintenance tools and materials.  We went with AF FasTrack because we wanted switches that we could control with the remote (and eventually like a modern control room on a computer/iPad screen when we add LCS wifi). We have also purchased 3 AF Legacy diesel locomotives and some rolling stock. Here's some of what I have learned so far.... The Good - Modelers like to share what they know online.  This forum, as an example, has already resolved a couple of questions I posted. - Some very useful sites helped me to understand S and the lingo such as web pages for NASG, S Scale SIG, Port Lines, and the S Scale Model Railroading Homepage - RR Track design software.  This is a fabulous tool.  I thoroughly enjoyed learning and using this CAD software to design my layout.  Now that I have assembled the track for test runs on my benchwork before we build the sub-terrain, we have only discovered one short section where it's not fitting up, and that is my error for stretching the limits of flexible joint options in the program.  I'll be attempting to cut MTH Flextrack to fill this gap.  - I am sure my stuff will not look like their ads, but Woodland Scenics products and videos have been very helpful in planning my undulations, tunnels, streets, ballast, groundcover, etc., and Hobbylinc seems to have good prices for their products. - Building benchwork with my son.  Neither of us will win carpentry awards, but because of all the tips I picked up in my research, I am delighted with the 3 tables we built and the efficiency with which we completed them. - Legacy Command is very cool (speed control, braking, smoke control, light control, sounds, etc.).  While initially I was attracted to MTH's DCC & wifi products, I chose Lionel's because of MTH's tiny selection of Protosound locomotives for S and AF's impressive selection of locomotives with Legacy.  As an example, the AF SD70 has fantastic sounds and lighting.  I love the rpm increases and decreases and the flashing headlights when you sound the horn. - I only have a few, but I am impressed by both the American Models and the extinct K-Line rolling stock. - The AF Texas Special Alco PA A-A set + plus the 5 passenger related cars, although almost cartoonish with regard to scale, are stunning in their bold red and silver. - Jim Robinson of BridgeBoss has been very accommodating in custom designing and building a long curved girder bridge.  It's not done yet, but I have really appreciated Jim's approach. - Running the trains is fun even though we are just testing them on our plain, flat, unadorned tables for now. The Not so Good - Wheels & rails - S is too complicated (my view) when it comes to wheels and rails, but I guess you just have to live with it.  I have had specific issues with current model AF locomotive wheels (of which there are 3 sizes). I was shocked to learn that 2 of my 3 current model AF diesels were not compatible with AF FasTrack.  In the case of the Texas Special Alco PA, the flanges are incredibly deep and interfere with the track spikes on the long radius curves thus making an annoying loud chattering noise.  At the other end of the spectrum, I was surprised to find that my SD70 derails incessantly on AF FasTrack because of its scale wheels being too small. When I replaced them with what Lionel calls 'traditional' wheels (generously supplied by Tom Hawley of this group), it worked fine.  - Lionel Legacy Command CAB 2 - After two weeks, the throttle stopped working.  It will only decrease no matter if turned clockwise or counter clockwise. - AF FasTrack remote/command switches - 4 of the 14 I bought did not work out of the box.  I had to disassemble 3 of them and re-attach an actuator that does not secure very well.  I have not yet figured out the issue with the 4th, but the remote will not close it, only opens it. - Lionel CW-80 transformer - While this has a connection that you can program for a constant voltage to power accessories, what they don't tell you is that you cannot use this feature to power switches.  I planned to do this for the 3 switches associated with my conventional loop since track power is insufficient for them, so on to plan B which will be powering these by tapping into the bus from my PowerHouse 180W supply which will power the loops and yard in my DCC block. - Smoke unit for AF Alco PA - Stopped working during second usage ever.  Shipped it off for warranty service and awaiting its return now. - User manual for SD70 - Provides no information on what engine type you are supposed to make in setting it up on the CAB 2.  This is indicative of many issues that are not addressed in Lionel's manuals.  The answers are sometimes found in their product videos on Youtube as was this one (BTW - it  is 'Flyer Pullmor Diesel').  - Current model AF Electrocouplers are nearly useless. - Creating blocks with AF Fastrack -  Lionel has no railjoiners for this.  I have ordered some MTH insulated railjoiners at the suggestion of Doug Peck of this group to see if they will fit the FasTrack - Lionel customer service - I have called them on 3 of the issues above.  On 2 of them, they gave no help.  On another, they made me try some solutions which made no sense before they would set up my warranty service. - Model railroad online stores seem below standard in ordering and shipping practices vs. online stores in general.  I have ordered items from 7 of them so far. Each has had their issues, and most l put in the 'poor' category.  I do almost all of my shopping online, and I was very surprised to find poor service from almost all of these model railroad suppliers while I rarely encounter any problems in all of my other online shopping. - Product reviews - While I have seen that some of the railroading magazines have reviews available for their subscribers, it doesn't seem that they nor any non-subscriber sites have many reviews for S products (I recognize it is a much smaller market than other gauges).  Nor does it seems that manufacturers, other than Lionel, post demo videos.  For example, I want to buy a steam engine in the future, but Lionel seems to be the only one with videos posted showing you the functionality.  It seems like a huge leap of faith to spend >$500 (or >$1,000 for a brass one) on something for which you cannot read a review or see a demo like I do on even $10 purchases in all of my other shopping. To Be Determined - The fuss about couplers.  I haven't paid enough attention to the topic yet, but everywhere I turn, I find articles and discussions online about S couplers.  Not sure what it's all about yet, but I am sure I'll need to get into the subject eventually given how much attention it gets from S enthusiasts. ******************* Overall, we are having great fun thus far, and I do not regret diving in with hours of research and thousands in expenditures. I am, of course, incredibly disappointed in Lionel, and now am conditioning myself what to expect from  their products.  I am hoping that I can find features similar to Legacy in locomotives from other manufacturers.  We are really looking forward to our next steps of building terrain and landscapes. Thanks to all on this forum who are so helpful to us newbies. Chuck

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77657	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A Newbie's Observations

Hi Chuck,    Welcome to the fascinating hobby of model railroading. I have been an S scale modeler for a long time. I started with an American Flyer set in the late 50's then discovered HO which I modeled in for quite a few years then came back to S. I am both amazed and thrilled  at the stuff now available in S. I read your message with great interest and wanted to add my thoughts on your topic. You want cramped?? lol. My wife and I live in a motorhome but we ARE trying to find just what we want. Right now we have to back out in order to change our mind lol. I do manage to build a model now and then. You mentioned the good, not so good and bad. With a little work I have transformed not so good or even bad models into pretty good scale models. Just be patient and work slow it can be done.                                    Bob Lampe                                   Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77658	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A Newbie's Observations

5 x 9 was a common Flyer layout back in the day too.  Sent from my iPhone On Mar 20, 2016, at 5:30 PM, chuck_7612@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   In the spirit of helping others new to modeling, and S modeling in particular, I wanted to share what I have observed in my first couple months of looking into and now starting this hobby.  I got the itch in January to get into modeling (and to bring my 16 year old son in with me) despite not owning or operating a train for the last 35 years.  I began doing my research, studying every aspect I figured I would need to know to get up and running.  I don't consider myself mechanically adept, so I read a lot material online and watched lots of videos.  I decided on S gauge, even though I had no familiarity with it other than a vague recollection of my father owning a few AF items that he sold to fund our 4'X8' HO layout when I was 10.  S seemed like the right size.  I did not want the tediousness of HO which I recalled well from my childhood, and I didn't think O would lend itself to a very interesting layout in my available space (11.5' X 5.5' w/ a 3' X 2.5' L at one end). I set out some principles for what we wanted to do: -While I want some realism, I am not getting hung up on everything being scale. - I like high tech when it come to things I buy for leisure purposes, so DCC was very attractive to me as was the prospect of wireless control of the layout.  But another principle was that we would create one loop with conventional control so that we could run non-DCC locomotives if we ever wanted to and so that my younger son could participate too by using a transformer to run a train on that loop. - Buy mostly locomotives and rolling stock with road names that have significance for us.  My grandfather worked over 40 yrs. for Illinois Central.  A Louisville & Nashville line ran less than 200 feet from the home in which I grew up.  And we live in and love Texas (so all names with Texas work). - Make it a tropical setting - palms and beach required - No impulse buying - Research all purchases on all the online stores I can find selling that particular product. - Go slow and accept that we will make some mistakes because everything we are doing has a bit of guesswork to it since we know no one else who models.  We have finished the benchwork and purchased our track, power and controls, sub-terrain materials, and some maintenance tools and materials.  We went with AF FasTrack because we wanted switches that we could control with the remote (and eventually like a modern control room on a computer/iPad screen when we add LCS wifi). We have also purchased 3 AF Legacy diesel locomotives and some rolling stock. Here's some of what I have learned so far.... The Good - Modelers like to share what they know online.  This forum, as an example, has already resolved a couple of questions I posted. - Some very useful sites helped me to understand S and the lingo such as web pages for NASG, S Scale SIG, Port Lines, and the S Scale Model Railroading Homepage - RR Track design software.  This is a fabulous tool.  I thoroughly enjoyed learning and using this CAD software to design my layout.  Now that I have assembled the track for test runs on my benchwork before we build the sub-terrain, we have only discovered one short section where it's not fitting up, and that is my error for stretching the limits of flexible joint options in the program.  I'll be attempting to cut MTH Flextrack to fill this gap.  - I am sure my stuff will not look like their ads, but Woodland Scenics products and videos have been very helpful in planning my undulations, tunnels, streets, ballast, groundcover, etc., and Hobbylinc seems to have good prices for their products. - Building benchwork with my son.  Neither of us will win carpentry awards, but because of all the tips I picked up in my research, I am delighted with the 3 tables we built and the efficiency with which we completed them. - Legacy Command is very cool (speed control, braking, smoke control, light control, sounds, etc.).  While initially I was attracted to MTH's DCC & wifi products, I chose Lionel's because of MTH's tiny selection of Protosound locomotives for S and AF's impressive selection of locomotives with Legacy.  As an example, the AF SD70 has fantastic sounds and lighting.  I love the rpm increases and decreases and the flashing headlights when you sound the horn. - I only have a few, but I am impressed by both the American Models and the extinct K-Line rolling stock. - The AF Texas Special Alco PA A-A set + plus the 5 passenger related cars, although almost cartoonish with regard to scale, are stunning in their bold red and silver. - Jim Robinson of BridgeBoss has been very accommodating in custom designing and building a long curved girder bridge.  It's not done yet, but I have really appreciated Jim's approach. - Running the trains is fun even though we are just testing them on our plain, flat, unadorned tables for now. The Not so Good - Wheels & rails - S is too complicated (my view) when it comes to wheels and rails, but I guess you just have to live with it.  I have had specific issues with current model AF locomotive wheels (of which there are 3 sizes). I was shocked to learn that 2 of my 3 current model AF diesels were not compatible with AF FasTrack.  In the case of the Texas Special Alco PA, the flanges are incredibly deep and interfere with the track spikes on the long radius curves thus making an annoying loud chattering noise.  At the other end of the spectrum, I was surprised to find that my SD70 derails incessantly on AF FasTrack because of its scale wheels being too small. When I replaced them with what Lionel calls 'traditional' wheels (generously supplied by Tom Hawley of this group), it worked fine.  - Lionel Legacy Command CAB 2 - After two weeks, the throttle stopped working.  It will only decrease no matter if turned clockwise or counter clockwise. - AF FasTrack remote/command switches - 4 of the 14 I bought did not work out of the box.  I had to disassemble 3 of them and re-attach an actuator that does not secure very well.  I have not yet figured out the issue with the 4th, but the remote will not close it, only opens it. - Lionel CW-80 transformer - While this has a connection that you can program for a constant voltage to power accessories, what they don't tell you is that you cannot use this feature to power switches.  I planned to do this for the 3 switches associated with my conventional loop since track power is insufficient for them, so on to plan B which will be powering these by tapping into the bus from my PowerHouse 180W supply which will power the loops and yard in my DCC block. - Smoke unit for AF Alco PA - Stopped working during second usage ever.  Shipped it off for warranty service and awaiting its return now. - User manual for SD70 - Provides no information on what engine type you are supposed to make in setting it up on the CAB 2.  This is indicative of many issues that are not addressed in Lionel's manuals.  The answers are sometimes found in their product videos on Youtube as was this one (BTW - it  is 'Flyer Pullmor Diesel').  - Current model AF Electrocouplers are nearly useless. - Creating blocks with AF Fastrack -  Lionel has no railjoiners for this.  I have ordered some MTH insulated railjoiners at the suggestion of Doug Peck of this group to see if they will fit the FasTrack - Lionel customer service - I have called them on 3 of the issues above.  On 2 of them, they gave no help.  On another, they made me try some solutions which made no sense before they would set up my warranty service. - Model railroad online stores seem below standard in ordering and shipping practices vs. online stores in general.  I have ordered items from 7 of them so far. Each has had their issues, and most l put in the 'poor' category.  I do almost all of my shopping online, and I was very surprised to find poor service from almost all of these model railroad suppliers while I rarely encounter any problems in all of my other online shopping. - Product reviews - While I have seen that some of the railroading magazines have reviews available for their subscribers, it doesn't seem that they nor any non-subscriber sites have many reviews for S products (I recognize it is a much smaller market than other gauges).  Nor does it seems that manufacturers, other than Lionel, post demo videos.  For example, I want to buy a steam engine in the future, but Lionel seems to be the only one with videos posted showing you the functionality.  It seems like a huge leap of faith to spend >$500 (or >$1,000 for a brass one) on something for which you cannot read a review or see a demo like I do on even $10 purchases in all of my other shopping. To Be Determined - The fuss about couplers.  I haven't paid enough attention to the topic yet, but everywhere I turn, I find articles and discussions online about S couplers.  Not sure what it's all about yet, but I am sure I'll need to get into the subject eventually given how much attention it gets from S enthusiasts. ******************* Overall, we are having great fun thus far, and I do not regret diving in with hours of research and thousands in expenditures. I am, of course, incredibly disappointed in Lionel, and now am conditioning myself what to expect from  their products.  I am hoping that I can find features similar to Legacy in locomotives from other manufacturers.  We are really looking forward to our next steps of building terrain and landscapes. Thanks to all on this forum who are so helpful to us newbies. Chuck

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77659	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 3/20/2016
Subject: Re: A newbie's observations

Welcome aboard, you'll get lots of info and help here.  I've been at this for quite a while.  Got started as a child in the fifties.  When my professional modeler father decided I was ready, I moved to HO.  I returned to S in the seventies when we rebuilt and customized American Flyer and built craftsman kits.  Hi-railing was common (using toy train trucks, couplers, and track to do more realistic railroading) in those days and S products were hard to find. From that point I have worked in every scale a gauge from Z scale up to "ride on" size, 7 1/2 inch gauge, and several of the narrow gauges.  I returned to S again in 1999 and found it had changed enormously.  But I've found my own unique place in it, while also working in HO and On30.  The crossing over between scales has taught me a lot of things that you can't learn otherwise. It appears that you've learned a LOT in a short time.  Woodland Scenics makes a lot of good products, though they can get a bit costly.  However, they make an interlocking product line that is very user friendly.   Keep at your hobby and remember, when you stop learning new things, it's time to die.  I intend to make i to at least 150.  :-)  From your trials and tribulations, I can tell that you are trying to work with Lionel made American Flyer.  Many of us call it "Flyonel" because it's easier than saying "American Flyer by Lionel."  Unfortunately, while many guys remain loyal to Flyonel, this product line has had ongoing problems for some time.   The track made by S Helper Service and American Models is made to operate both scale and "toy" wheel flanges reliably.  The S Helper line was bought out by MTH (Mikes Train House) a few years back and they have been slow to get the line up and running.   Don't bother with Margraves track, it is "toy" only. I can't advise you about "high technology" as I'm an old dog that doesn't learn new tricks well.  I just keep honing the way I've done things for years.  I've loved trains all my life.  It's been a great hobby and it DOES bond fathers and sons, and grandsons (and even the girls in many cases.)  Enjoy! Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77660	From: Randall Griggs	Date: 3/22/2016
Subject: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility

Will the "MTH 351013 S Railjoiner (Insulated) For STrax (36)" work with American Models 'S' track?  I need to insulate some American Models switches and think this would be the easiest method.  Also, will the "K-Line K-491 S Insulator Pins (dz.)" work with standard American Flyer (old style) tubular track?  (I understand these Insulator Pins are nylon, NOT Fiber, as were the original American Flyer fiber insulating pins. Nylon is probably BETTER!) :-)  Regards, Randy Griggs

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77661	From: fyrrfytr49	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Re: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility

What ever happened to using Toothpicks for Track insulators ..we used both the round and flat quality tooth picks and cut them to size and wood always did an excellent job and they never failed  ...we didn't fall for paying big bucks for something we had around the house ..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77662	From: rxman46321	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Blantant Ad

I have 7 1/2 packages of  ACE brass journals for sale. First $40.00 gets them with free shipping. John Griffin rxman46321@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77663	From: paul	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: Re: TRACK INSULATOR PINS Compatibility

and toothpicks are still a great way to go if you are using old Flyer or Marx tubular AF track, but the SHS (now MTH) and Lionel flexible and the ones with cast plastic roadbed are solid rails like HO stuff.  they use a joiner that slides under the rail for alignment and conductivity and extends up both sides. it is long enough to capture the ends of two pieces of track and cradle them. the insulated joiners for these are non conducting and have a bump in the middle to keep the ends of the rails from touching, but still slide under and up both sides of the ends of the rail for alignment and stability.        paul       On 3/23/2016 5:44 AM, am-flyr@... [S-Trains] wrote:   What ever happened to using Toothpicks for Track insulators ..we used both the round and flat quality tooth picks and cut them to size and wood always did an excellent job and they never failed  ...we didn't fall for paying big bucks for something we had around the house .. Posted by: am-flyr@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77664	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 3/23/2016
Subject: April/May 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ Combining Objectives Roy Meissner Trucking The Port Huron and Northern What's on your Workbench? New York Central Lot 588H Hopper Shows, Meets and Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77665	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/24/2016
Subject: video of BSG operating session Mar. 19, 2016

Hi folks, We had a meeting of the Badgerland S Gaugers on Mar 19, 2016, I am posting a link to a video that was made of the operating session after the meeting. Hopefully for your enjoyment. Ray Puls https://youtu.be/6AUB7D8lXTA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77666	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 27 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77667	From: claudino.john	Date: 3/27/2016
Subject: Happy Easter.

Happy Easter to all. John Claudino aztectrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77668	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 3/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 March 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 27 March 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77669	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 3/29/2016
Subject: TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED OPEN HOUSE

OPEN HOUSE WEDNESDAY April 13, 2016 STARTING AT 2:00 PM (around)   TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED 38 YORK ST.  HANOVER PA. 17331 ( 25 minutes from York, PA FAIRGROUNDS ) 1-717-637-4717     FOOD, DRINKS & PLENTY OF GOOD CONVERSATION       Toy Trains Unlimited, 38 York St., Hanover PA. 17331,will be having an open house on Wednesday, April 13, 2016. This is the week of the York TCA, Meet.      This Spring's event will start at 2 PM., and will continue until everyone has left or has been thrown out, including myself (Ron). There will be food, drinks, and a large selection of American Flyer & Lionel trains and accessories. Hopefully there will be some very unusual and interesting Flyer items to show and tell about (please bring  in your interesting Flyer items), and of course we will also have a large group of Flyer and Lionel operators and collectors visiting. Make plans to attend this yearly event and please tell your American Flyer & Lionel friends to come along. There is plenty of that stuff here to choose from. DIRECTIONS: From the York Fairgrounds, take Market St. to Carlisle Ave. until you get to Route 30 west.  Follow Route 30 west (for approximately 8 miles) until you come to the intersection of Rt.116 & Route 30.  Turn left onto Rt.116.  From route 116 & 30 you will travel approximately 20 miles where Rt. 116 will become York St. in the town of Hanover.  As you enter the town of Hanover, travel approximately 2 miles. The train shop will be on the right side of York St./116.  Look for the Railroad Flag hanging from the front of the store.    POST & PRE-WAR LIONEL  ////  TRAINS & ACCESSORIES AMERICAN FLYER  ////  New & Used  TRAINS & ACCESSORIES MTH  ////  S & O Gauge TRAINS & ACCESSORIES AMERICAN MODELS, S-HELPER, K-LINE, DISCOUNT  TRAIN SETS THERE IS NO RETAIL PRICES IN THIS STORE !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77670	From: Ray Puls	Date: 3/29/2016
Subject: Flyonel axle or wheel and axle set needed

I am looking to acquire a couple of Flyonel pointed axles or axle and wheel sets, would also consider the entire truck assembly X 2. Does anyone have these that you don't need or want. I am willing to trade equal number of S Helper scale wheel sets or purchase them outright. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77671	From: lhralco21	Date: 3/31/2016
Subject: O and S Scale Show Sunday 4/10 in Hudson, MA Postponed to Sunday 7/1

Attachments : MMRS_Vendor_Sheet_201604710.doc The Elks' Hall has a brand new interior but the paperwork for the work has not been processed by the town. Please accept my apologies for the postponement but mark your calendars for Sunday, July 10, 2016. I have enclosed a "vendor's sheet" in case any of you would like to rent a table. Thank you for your understanding, Larry Grant

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77672	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77673	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77674	From: smuel10263	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: Re: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016

how do  sign up   ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77675	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 4/3/2016
Subject: Re: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 April 2016

S-Trains Chat - phpMyChat-Plus               S-Trains Chat - phpMyChat-Plus phpMyChat View on myflyertrains.org Preview by Yahoo   Go to this link, copy and paste if necessary, and create your sign in. Ed Eckert moderator

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77676	From: traindavid	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: Sunday Chat

Oops, my bad! I forgot about chat yesterday!! Too many things going on here; nice weather, player piano testing (after major rebuild), nice weather, moving lumber off porch (Fire Department didn't like my wood project storage area!), oh, did I mention nice weather? And next Sunday we'll be in Lodi at a theatre organ concert with an organist from Scotland (Oh dear, stuck in Lodi again!). So, chat with y'all in two weeks, IF I remember! (Yes Steve B. I had a birthday last month and AM a year older, so I do forget things more easily now -- if I didn't admit this now, Steve wouldn't let me live it down anyways!). Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77677	From: snstrains	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: Re: Sunday Chat

Apology NOT accepted David. AND, Barb was on.....   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 4/4/2016 11:35:38 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Oops, my bad! I forgot about chat yesterday!! Too many things going on here; nice weather, player piano testing (after major rebuild), nice weather, moving lumber off porch (Fire Department didn't like my wood project storage area!), oh, did I mention nice weather? And next Sunday we'll be in Lodi at a theatre organ concert with an organist from Scotland (Oh dear, stuck in Lodi again!). So, chat with y'all in two weeks, IF I remember! (Yes Steve B. I had a birthday last month and AM a year older, so I do forget things more easily now -- if I didn't admit this now, Steve wouldn't let me live it down anyways!). Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77678	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 4/4/2016
Subject: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch

It is 15 inches long on the straight side and one full curve. The fog has to be powered because it moves in the direction as the rails. I have never seen any thing like this going back to 1950. As soon as someone figures out how to power it let me know. Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77679	From: traindavid	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Idea for a new "action car"

I just posted this to the toytrain list as part of a reply about an April Fool's joke that caught some of us off-guard (Yep, me too!). I don't think my idea is that far fetched, what think y'all? I just got an idea for a new billboard car: "Cable Piano Company -- Self-Playing Pianos" ; and a sound unit inside playing something Liberace style! OK, I was inspired by me just finishing rebuilding my Cable player piano (Now I can play "Rhapsody in Blue" and look Ma--No Hands!). I’m also suggesting over on the S side of the O forum, for those of you who are going to York and if Big L is having a demo seminar, we can rally for a new loco in S--An SP GS-4 Daylight engine! How about a bunch of S guys sit at the York presentation and start chanting, "Daylight Steamer in S! Daylight Steamer in S, Daylight Steamer in S! Daylight, Daylight, Daylight, Daylight, GOOOOO S!" Heh heh heh, I can see it now, "S Gaugers demonstrate at York! Read all about it, Big Upset!" Oh, right, no newsboys on the corner anymore hawking papers. . . Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D. Hmm, Maybe I AM staying up too late at night (uh, morning?)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77680	From: chuck_7612	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch

If it is manual and you are just trying to get the rotating piece in the frog to turn, then I gore what I wrote previously. when you turn the switch lamp, it should rotate. If it doesn't you likely need warranty service.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77681	From: chuck_7612	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: AF fast track 27 radius manual switch

If you don't have the manual, you can download it here by searching for 6-49885: https://www.lionelsupport.com/service-documents/ Page 11 has the instructions on how to power them separately from the track power.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77682	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Bob Hammig ?

Does anyone in the group know anything about Bob Hammig, in Colorado ? He’s been a regular customer of mine for some time, but I’ve had no success contacting him for many months now. No email, or snail-mail, responses. ????????????   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77683	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 4/5/2016
Subject: Re: Bob Hammig ?

Sorry, Doug.  I know several fellow Colorado train guys, but don't know Mr. Hammig. Jim Ensign, Louisville, Colo. From: "'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 7:13:01 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Bob Hammig ?   Does anyone in the group know anything about Bob Hammig, in Colorado ? He’s been a regular customer of mine for some time, but I’ve had no success contacting him for many months now. No email, or snail-mail, responses. ????????????   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77684	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

How about a Calyopy Action Car for a circus train? Personally, I am thinking about making a Carnival train since I don't have a circus. Same thing for the carnival action car, playing all kinds of carnival music. Things that make us go Hmmmmm. Or, David, make a model of the Delta Queen sitting dockside on the river and a calyopy car playing! CB From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 5:19 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Idea for a new "action car"   I just posted this to the toytrain list as part of a reply about an April Fool's joke that caught some of us off-guard (Yep, me too!). I don't think my idea is that far fetched, what think y'all? I just got an idea for a new billboard car: "Cable Piano Company -- Self-Playing Pianos" ; and a sound unit inside playing something Liberace style! OK, I was inspired by me just finishing rebuilding my Cable player piano (Now I can play "Rhapsody in Blue" and look Ma--No Hands!). I’m also suggesting over on the S side of the O forum, for those of you who are going to York and if Big L is having a demo seminar, we can rally for a new loco in S--An SP GS-4 Daylight engine! How about a bunch of S guys sit at the York presentation and start chanting, "Daylight Steamer in S! Daylight Steamer in S, Daylight Steamer in S! Daylight, Daylight, Daylight, Daylight, GOOOOO S!" Heh heh heh, I can see it now, "S Gaugers demonstrate at York! Read all about it, Big Upset!" Oh, right, no newsboys on the corner anymore hawking papers. . . Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D. Hmm, Maybe I AM staying up too late at night (uh, morning?)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77685	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Bob Hammig ?

Re: Bob Hammig ? If all else fails try white pages search.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77686	From: tommcindc	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

a word from those of us with little space:  I'd love a Daylight but it would have to sit on a shelf. how about some smaller motive power for a change - a Mogul?  an 0-4-0? a 10-Wheeler? a Plymouth industrial diesel? just wishin' Tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77687	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

Hey Tom,     Ya wanna talk limited space? I live in a 23 foot motorhome with my wife, 5 cats and a dog. We have to back out in order to change our mind lololol.      Bob Lampe      Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 17:45:05 -0400 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   a word from those of us with little space:  I'd love a Daylight but it would have to sit on a shelf. how about some smaller motive power for a change - a Mogul?  an 0-4-0? a 10-Wheeler? a Plymouth industrial diesel? just wishin' Tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77688	From: rick gough	Date: 4/6/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

Bob, your motorhome has a BIG FLAT ROOF ..... get busy!!   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Wednesday, April 6, 2016 4:55 PM, "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Hey Tom,     Ya wanna talk limited space? I live in a 23 foot motorhome with my wife, 5 cats and a dog. We have to back out in order to change our mind lololol.      Bob Lampe      Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 17:45:05 -0400 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   a word from those of us with little space:  I'd love a Daylight but it would have to sit on a shelf. how about some smaller motive power for a change - a Mogul?  an 0-4-0? a 10-Wheeler? a Plymouth industrial diesel? just wishin' Tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77689	From: henrykoshollek	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Gilbert Black engine paint

Where does one purchase ta can of Gilbert black engine and tender paint. I have a few of the Northern's and  Hudson's that need to be dressed up just a bit. I've tried a couple of homemade mixtures and not the correct paint of older paint types. Would it be a flat black enamel or a flat black out door semi barbecue range type paint. Also a spray of clear coat the unit with a splash of testors satin or dull coat to kind of look like original ? Thanks Hank Koshollek Stoughton Wi

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77690	From: Bob Groh	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

OH, yeah, I would go with one of the smaller motive engines - a Plymouth Industrial diesel or a little 0-4-0. Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77691	From: snstrains	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

It has a big flat spot under it too...Get busy   In a message dated 4/6/2016 8:57:58 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Bob, your motorhome has a BIG FLAT ROOF ..... get busy!!   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Wednesday, Apr il 6, 2016 4:55 PM, "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Hey Tom,     Ya wanna talk limited space? I live in a 23 foot motorhome with my wife, 5 cats and a dog. We have to back out in order to change our mind lololol.      Bob Lampe      Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 17:45:05 -0400 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   a word from those of us with little space:  I'd love a Daylight but it would have to sit on a shelf. how about some smaller motive power for a change - a Mogul?  an 0-4-0? a 10-Wheeler? a Plymouth industrial diesel? just wishin' Tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77692	From: traindavid	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

Chris, I love the calliope car idea--if you need any music for it, I have recordings! I even have ones of the Delta Queen's calliope. Tom, Smaller motive power?? I'd love an SP Mogul; to be exact, SP1727 on display in Dunsmuir, CA! Once again though, I dunno if Flyonel or even MTH would know how to make an oil burner tender, so far, in either line there have only been coal burners. Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77693	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Small locos

I have been "experimenting" with the Flyonel Docksider 0-6-0 tank engines.  They show some promise for kit bashing.  As for  small steam locos and "critter" diesels, I haven't seen anything like that since Terry Putt went out of business.  The "light" 2-6-0 Mogul was a dandy, as was the 2-4-4 Suburban and switchers.  The little diesels and Trolleys were neat too. You can build a reputable "Ten Wheeler" (4-6-0) out of the Gilbert plastic Pacific and a Casey Jones cab.  Look for how I did it on http://myflyertrains.org  in the Archives section under "Stumpy's Station."  There is also an Atlantic (4-4-2) with the Wooten firebox replaced by a more common one as well as other inexpensive projects. I wish Gilbert had made more small freight engines.  I had to build a 2-8-0 out of a 343 I found about half of in a junk box, and scrounged and made the rest.  It seems that Gilbert loved passenger engines, not the low driveled workhorses. The idea of sound equipped cars reminds me of those MTH made in O gauge years back.  The car load of "cows" was funny at speed, but the "chicken car" was downright hilarious when whipping around those sharp curves at speed!  You'd have thought there was a fox in the car with them! Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77694	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

David,  I think right after the spree I will work on the Calyope car Idea. CB From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 11:28 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   Chris, I love the calliope car idea--if you need any music for it, I have recordings! I even have ones of the Delta Queen's calliope. Tom, Smaller motive power?? I'd love an SP Mogul; to be exact, SP1727 on display in Dunsmuir, CA! Once again though, I dunno if Flyonel or even MTH would know how to make an oil burner tender, so far, in either line there have only been coal burners. Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77695	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Idea for a new "action car"

Lololololololololol there may be a solution in the not too distant future I will keep y'all posted                  Bob Lampe                  Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 23:06:09 -0400 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   It has a big flat spot under it too...Get busy   In a message dated 4/6/2016 8:57:58 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Bob, your motorhome has a BIG FLAT ROOF ..... get busy!!   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Wednesday, Apr il 6, 2016 4:55 PM, "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Hey Tom,     Ya wanna talk limited space? I live in a 23 foot motorhome with my wife, 5 cats and a dog. We have to back out in order to change our mind lololol.      Bob Lampe      Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 17:45:05 -0400 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Idea for a new "action car"   a word from those of us with little space:  I'd love a Daylight but it would have to sit on a shelf. how about some smaller motive power for a change - a Mogul?  an 0-4-0? a 10-Wheeler? a Plymouth industrial diesel? just wishin' Tom

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77696	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Small locos

I saw a variation on this when I was a kid. A circus came to town and they put the wagon on a flatbed semi trailer. By the way it is spelled calliope. Seems to me however that this idea is doable. A small speaker connected to an MP-3 player that has calliope music pre loaded on it, Should work fine.    Bob Lampe    Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77697	From: daleminard	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale

I have to confess, I’ve been drawn to science fiction since I was a kid.  I read everything I could get my hands on; paper backs, hard cover books and comic books feed my passions for many years.  Current movies (Theaters & T.V.) have me spinning with delight with all of the special effects and developing story lines. My excitement, however, has been dulled by the inability to include my favorite superhero’s on our club’s layout.  I’ve looked high and low, exploring every avenue I could think of in my search for an 1/64 size superman.  Then, one day this past Christmas, I struck pay dirt!  Our club had set up an exhibit at a local shopping center; we were only a couple of doors down from a Comic Book Store.  I figured, what the heck, and went in to see if they had any miniature superhero figures on the shelf.  WOW!  Was I ever shocked at what today’s Comic Book Store had developed into.  After recovering, I was pleasantly surprised by the sales clerk’s response.  He took me over to the “HeroClix” game pieces saying that they were the closest he could come to what I was looking for.  I was ecstatic! HeroClix is a game that centers on the world of superhero comic books, especially the Marvel and DC Comics universes. Players construct teams of comic book heroes, villains, or other characters  and engage in a turn-by-turn battle on grid maps based on various storyline locations.  The game pieces are…are you ready for this?...miniature figures mounted on bases much like chess pieces and are made out of a plastic or resin material.  Many of the superhero's come in different versions and stances. The first figure I bought was Superman; using an S-Scale ruler, he stood 7 ft tall.  It was easy to separate the figure from the base.  The result?  I’ve now got Clark Kent ripping open his shirt (revealing his superman costume underneath) as he enters a phone booth. I’ve continued to collect various superhero’s (most were purchased on eBay – enter in the phrase “HeroClix”) and have been introducing them onto our club layout as they appear on T.V. and at the Movies.  The kids love them and have fun searching for new additions. The only downfall is that they are slightly larger than the standard S-Scale figure; but what the heck, aren’t superhero’s supposed to be bigger-than-life anyway? Dale Minard San Diego S-Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77698	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale

 ----- Original Message ----- From: daleminard@... [S-Trains] I have to confess, I’ve been drawn to science fiction since I was a kid.  . . . . . . we were only a couple of doors down from a Comic Book Store.  . . . . The first figure I bought was Superman; > > > > > > > > > > > Wasn't there some kind of advertising tie-in between Superman and AC Gilbert?   Many years ago the Fall S Fest special car was, as I recall, a blue coal hopper with some Superman symbols and a statement something like "Railroading is fun and exciting," attributed to Superman.  Mine's in the house here somewhere, but I haven't seen it in years.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77699	From: racin510	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Challenger Smoke

Should the Challenger blow smoke when at stand still? I can not remember. Mine doesn't but otherwise smokes as it should. My Y-3 does smoke at stand still.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77700	From: zemouse2001	Date: 4/7/2016
Subject: Re: Super Hero Figures for S-Scale

Absolutely exciting! Oh, that will give the kid's a heck of charge!  Well, and some of the adults also!  Got to look into it. Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77701	From: traindavid	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Gilbert Black engine paint

Krylon Semi-Gloss Black seems to be a really good match, better than their semi-flat black. Paint generally comes in Gloss, Semi-Gloss, Satin, Semi-Flat, and Flat finishes; at least in the spray can selections. I think I've arranged those in a declining-gloss order.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77702	From: lx5043	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

I use Rust-oleum spray paint because I like its spray nozzle and paint consistency. That said, I always use their plastic safe paint. I assume you are stripping the paint from the engine shell first, so use a coat or two of their plastic safe primer, even though their paint claims built in primer. Then wait 24 hours to apply either their flat black or satin black, your preference really. I have used both. For the older engines you will probably prefer the flat as the satin has a very slight finish shine. Try them both. Also, Krylon used to make a semi-flat which as I understand it they have stopped producing, but you might be able to find some on the shelves of some old mom and pop hardware stores. Anyway, this also produced an excellent black finish. John Palmisano

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77703	From: racin510	Date: 4/8/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

Here is my once secret method and it works beautifully. Two paints and these are a must: 1.Krylon Semi FLAT Black    2.Krylon FLAT Clear #-53530  can be very hard to find but worth the search and the trip. I went from Seattle to Vancouver, WA to get a can. No one in the whole Seattle area carried it ... option was to order a case though. Scotch Brite/320 sand to blend chips. Lather the shell with automotive engine degreaser to get every bit of 60 year grunge gone. Tooth brush scrub and rinse with warm water. Dry. Two light coats of primer, one if it looks OK. No sanding. One light followed by two good coats of Semi Flat Black. Two coats of FLAT Clear. I make a T out of wood to place inside the shell to hold it up and act as a handle, which once a coat of paint is applied can be held in a vice until ready for the next coat. This keeps your fingers far away from your new beauty. I've done 4 Hudsons this way, and even my C-6 Northern among others. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77704	From: ecphora123	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

If you're attempting to match the original paint, then the three posts probably will help you. But, if you want a steam locomotive look, then you could try stove paint. I believe either Rustoleum or Krylon sells this in spray can form. I've seen references to doing this several times over the years. Gene Cimino

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77705	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77706	From: racin510	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

I've seen the #700 Northern located in Portland ..... and it doesn't look like a stove!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77707	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/9/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

Rustoleum X2 Black Semi Works well also. I have used the Krylon ran out of it and used the Rustoleum to finish up. Personally could not tell a difference in color, but I like the Rustoleum finish better. Just an option.  CB From: "racin510@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 9, 2016 1:17 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Gilbert Black engine paint   Here is my once secret method and it works beautifully. Two paints and these are a must: 1.Krylon Semi FLAT Black    2.Krylon FLAT Clear #-53530  can be very hard to find but worth the search and the trip. I went from Seattle to Vancouver, WA to get a can. No one in the whole Seattle area carried it ... option was to order a case though. Scotch Brite/320 sand to blend chips. Lather the shell with automotive engine degreaser to get every bit of 60 year grunge gone. Tooth brush scrub and rinse with warm water. Dry. Two light coats of primer, one if it looks OK. No sanding. One light followed by two good coats of Semi Flat Black. Two coats of FLAT Clear. I make a T out of wood to place inside the shell to hold it up and act as a handle, which once a coat of paint is applied can be held in a vice until ready for the next coat. This keeps your fingers far away from your new beauty. I've done 4 Hudsons this way, and even my C-6 Northern among others. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77708	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77709	From: G C	Date: 4/10/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

It's called Hi-Heat Rustoleum.It's meant for things like BBQ grills. Also, I'm sure that your 700 has been very well cared for and isn't that typical of what an actual working steam engine would have looked like. Gene

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77710	From: traindavid	Date: 4/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

Interesting discussion on ACG paint and prototype. Gene, hate to tell you this, but out here in the west where we burned mostly oil, engines (especially passenger engines) retained their shiny "factory" paint finish for a long time--it really depended on the local crews, some were fastidious, others, very less so. Coal burners did tend to get a lot of soot, or at least ashes on them and achieved a "grimy" look quickly--although the N&W was pretty proud of their fleet and the "Lubritorium" included a "loco wash" station too. When the locos left the factory, they were painted with a gloss finish; however, the paints used in those days lost much of their sheen exposed to the weather. Model T's for instance had a near-mirror finish from the factory (based on photographs), but the sheen was gone within months of outdoor use, unless the owner polished regularly. As to ACG's loco finish, it was a satin black, not flat for many years, although the level of "satin" was sometimes very small, it wasn't completely flat. I remember reading that someone like do overcoat the satin with flat clear. Um, unless you are sealing decals or press-on lettering, I don't see that advantage, and you might as well have applied flat black, as the clear coat's level of sheen finish is what you end up with. There is a disadvantage to putting too much paint on: detail is lost and chipping is more likely. Um, what do I know about paint?? Well, I painted antique cars for a living for over 25 years and I did teach finishes & coatings at Chico State (OK, ended up being only one semester, as the college dropped the department) -- however, paints & coatings have changed a lot since I was doing the stuff "full-time." With environmental controls and restrictions becoming more stringent, I am starting to worry about my ability to get paint to finish my Model Ts when the time comes. So much of what we spray today is not anything like what they had "in the day." And yes, being around those chemicals did effect me--one of the reasons I got out of the biz (It's called 'Long-Term Solvent Exposure Syndrome). So, if I don't remember stuff--it's not old age!! (Yet-and that's my story!!) So do be careful when painting your trains; I've known more than one person who has died from the side effects doing model painting (although they were doing it as a full-time occupation).

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77711	From: racin510	Date: 4/11/2016
Subject: Re: Gilbert Black engine paint

I have a 313 and a 326 with original finish, C-6, made around the same ACG time frame 60 years ago. The 313 now is flat showing no sheen while the 326 still exhibits a pretty decent sheen. My custom 326 is  in between, but closer to the 326. The benefit of using semi flat black is if there is a loss of clear coat you still have a nice non flat base color. Otherwise on it's own it is the closest match to original you are going to find on the shelf. You don't have to clear coat it and you don't have to primer under it either. Advantages of clear coating with FLAT clear, which cuts gloss while creating a mellow sheen, are that a real finish is produced, paint protection greatly enhanced, and it locks in and protects those beautiful dry transfers you were so meticulous about putting on right. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77712	From: carl4flyer	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Re: Challenger Smoke

Lionel changed the smoke fan to run at low speed at idle to help keep the element cooler in the latest models. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 11:46 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Challenger Smoke   Should the Challenger blow smoke when at stand still? I can not remember. Mine doesn't but otherwise smokes as it should. My Y-3 does smoke at stand still.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77713	From: henry_betz	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.

Hello all, I wish to know what style engine was sold as a mate to Pullman Green Heavyweight passenger cars #652, 653,654. It would seem that Tuscan should have a 4-6-2 Pacific.  Also, what engine belongs with the Light green New Haven labeled #650 passenger cars and the #651 Light green New Haven labeled baggage car. Best, Hank Betz

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77714	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 4/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.

My greens had the K5 #312 My cousin had red with a reading Atlantic.  Sent from my iPhone On Apr 13, 2016, at 8:58 PM, henry_betz@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hello all, I wish to know what style engine was sold as a mate to Pullman Green Heavyweight passenger cars #652, 653,654. It would seem that Tuscan should have a 4-6-2 Pacific.  Also, what engine belongs with the Light green New Haven labeled #650 passenger cars and the #651 Light green New Haven labeled baggage car. Best, Hank Betz

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77715	From: Thomas Kaufman	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Digest Number 7054

Henry, In 1954 the Meteor set had the #293 Pacific lettered for NYNH&H. I am assuming the #312 K5 lettered for PRR came from an earlier set.  Tom Kaufman From: "S-Trains@yahoogroups.com" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2016 4:48 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Digest Number 7054 S-Scale and S-Gauge (1/64th) S-Trains Group 3 Messages Digest #7054 1a Re: Challenger Smoke by carl4flyer 2a Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars. by henry_betz 2b Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars. by "Frank Emiro" femiro2002 Messages 1a Re: Challenger Smoke Wed Apr 13, 2016 6:17 pm (PDT) . Posted by: carl4flyer Lionel changed the smoke fan to run at low speed at idle to help keep the element cooler in the latest models. _____ From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 11:46 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Challenger Smoke Should the Challenger blow smoke when at stand still? I can not remember. Mine doesn't but otherwise smokes as it should. My Y-3 does smoke at stand still. Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (2) . Top ^ 2a Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars. Wed Apr 13, 2016 6:17 pm (PDT) . Posted by: henry_betz Hello all, I wish to know what style engine was sold as a mate to Pullman Green Heavyweight passenger cars #652, 653,654. It would seem that Tuscan should have a 4-6-2 Pacific. Also, what engine belongs with the Light green New Haven labeled #650 passenger cars and the #651 Light green New Haven labeled baggage car. Best, Hank Betz Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (2) . Top ^ 2b Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars. Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:18 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Frank Emiro" femiro2002 My greens had the K5 #312 My cousin had red with a reading Atlantic. Sent from my iPhone > On Apr 13, 2016, at 8:58 PM, henry_betz@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > Hello all, > > > > I wish to know what style engine was sold as a mate to Pullman Green Heavyweight passenger cars #652, 653,654. It would seem that Tuscan should have a 4-6-2 Pacific. > > > > Also, what engine belongs with the Light green New Haven labeled #650 passenger cars and the #651 Light green New Haven labeled baggage car. > > > > Best, > > > > Hank Betz > > Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (2) . Top ^ Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group New Photos 1 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77716	From: Robert Graves	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.

For such questions, refer to my website, The Gilbert Gallery:         http://thegilbertgallery.org/Passenger%20Gallery/Pullman_Heavyweight_sets.html Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "henry_betz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 5:58 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars.   Hello all, I wish to know what style engine was sold as a mate to Pullman Green Heavyweight passenger cars #652, 653,654. It would seem that Tuscan should have a 4-6-2 Pacific.  Also, what engine belongs with the Light green New Haven labeled #650 passenger cars and the #651 Light green New Haven labeled baggage car. Best, Hank Betz

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77717	From: traindavid	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars

Hank, There are lots of choices of engines--without looking at the uncataloged sets, and sets dealers would put together ("Say, I really like this train set, but I want green cars" "No problem sir, I have separate sale green cars here, I'll just trade them out for you"). So, I in the catalogs I see green heavyweights LC type, behind Hudsons and Northerns. The New Haven LC types behind a 302AC , a 290, and a 285. In the KC series, the heavywieghts are pulled by the 293, the New Havens by 302,. It seems the KC sets with the Hudsons and Northerns are all red cars.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77718	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars

This is true.  Case in point is the 4745 Rocket Set my Dad bought in 1953 from Nicholas Smith Trains in Philadelphia.  Instead of the three Vista Domes and Observation Cars that were supposed to come with that passenger set, they sold him the 474/475 Chrome Rocket Diesels with one each chrome 960, 961, 962 and 963.  All in a set box and all in their original boxes/wrappers.   Bruce DeGailler     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2016 11:19 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] RE: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars     Hank, There are lots of choices of engines--without looking at the uncataloged sets, and sets dealers would put together ("Say, I really like this train set, but I want green cars" "No problem sir, I have separate sale green cars here, I'll just trade them out for you"). So, I in the catalogs I see green heavyweights LC type, behind Hudsons and Northerns. The New Haven LC types behind a 302AC , a 290, and a 285. In the KC series, the heavywieghts are pulled by the 293, the New Havens by 302,. It seems the KC sets with the Hudsons and Northerns are all red cars.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77719	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: action car - player pianos etc.

A boxcar decorated for a company that manufactures player pianos would be fun. There were many sorts of mechanical instruments in the 1800s, before phonographs came in One bus tour at the upcoming NASG convention will see many examples in operation: See photos at          http://stahlsauto.com/index.cfm/music-instruments/ Mark Charles Join us in Novi, Michigan for the National Association of S Gaugers annual convention: August 10-14, 2016. Layouts, operating sessions, tours, vendors and more! See www.smsgtrains.org/2016conv for details.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77720	From: tennsgauger	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Re: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Have...

My grandparents bought me the two Rocket PAs and substituted the green heavyweights for the steamlined cars, because that is what I wanted.  I was used to seeing the heavyweights and not used to seeing streamlined cars.  They bought the set from a department store in Knoxville, TN.  I am going to guess that was around 1953 or 1954.    - Earl Henry, Nashville.       In a message dated 4/14/2016 6:46:01 P.M. Central Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:     This is true.  Case in point is the 4745 Rocket Set my Dad bought in 1953 from Nicholas Smith Trains in Philadelphia.  Instead of the three Vista Domes and Observation Cars that were supposed to come with that passenger set, they sold him the 474/475 Chrome Rocket Diesels with one each chrome 960, 961, 962 and 963.  All in a set box and all in their original boxes/wrappers.   Bruce DeGailler     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2016 11:19 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] RE: Pullman Dark Green Heavyweight cars, Light green New Haven cars     Hank, There are lots of choices of engines--without looking at the uncataloged sets, and sets dealers would put together ("Say, I really like this train set, but I want green cars" "No problem sir, I have separate sale green cars here, I'll just trade them out for you"). So, I in the catalogs I see green heavyweights LC type, behind Hudsons and Northerns. The New Haven LC types behind a 302AC , a 290, and a 285. In the KC series, the heavywieghts are pulled by the 293, the New Havens by 302,. It seems the KC sets with the Hudsons and Northerns are all red cars.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77721	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/14/2016
Subject: Non-train stores that sold trains

Here in the backwater of Kansas City there used to be many places besides hobby shops that sold model trains. There were of course department stores and hardware stores and Katz Drug stores, but one of what seemed to me to be the most unusual points of sale was a carpet store called Vendembooms on Broadway. I believe they only sold them around Christmas, but they had one heck of a layout in the front window. Firestone and Western Auto also sold trains. BTW, I recall quite well seeing a stack of Lionel Girl’s Trains in the basement of the old Sears Store on the Country Club Plaza and they were discounted to about 30 bucks. If we only knew then what we know now :) Just curious if there were any other odd places in the country that sold trains back in the 50’s or so? Roy Inman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77722	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

On 4/14/2016 7:50 PM, Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Just curious if there were any other odd places in the country that sold > trains back in the 50’s or so? > > Roy Inman I grew up in a mining town in Arizona. The town was owned and operated by Phelps-Dodge Copper Company. Think Tennessee Ernie's, 16 tons - "I owe my Soul to the Company Store." ;-) The company stores were called Phelps Dodge Mercantile and at Christmas they had huge displays of mostly American Flyer trains. My dad bought me my first set around 1952 or so then later bought the store display. Every year for about ten years he added a set to my collection along with Erector and chemistry sets. We also had a local Western Auto but I don't remember if any of my trains came from there. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77723	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

After the war my dad operated a Sinclair gas station in Berwyn, Illinois.   He is a little fuzzy on the details, but I think he sold American Flyer during the holidays c.1948-9 because I ended up with three Nickel Plate 0-8-0s and other than them being leftovers I can’t imagine why he would purposely go out and buy duplicates.   I did enjoy having them, however, because they were the only steam engines that you could double and triple head!!! Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77724	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

All - I grew up in a tiny town of 900 in Eastern Colorado, called Hugo.  There was a fella there that had a small repair shop, selling tires and re-winding motors, generators, etc.  He had a Flyer dealership in the 50's.  Don't know how much he sold to that small market, but that's where my Dad picked up our first set - a 302AC and a used 661 chrome streamliner.  Those two items and enough track for a 4X8 sheet of plywood.  I'm sure that purchase was more than they could afford as money was tight at our house.  Still have the two items and returned them to running status a few years ago.  They now have a place of honor in their own case on a walll in my train room.  Jim Ensign From: "Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: "S-Trains" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2016 8:50:39 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Non-train stores that sold trains   Here in the backwater of Kansas City there used to be many places besides hobby shops that sold model trains. There were of course department stores and hardware stores and Katz Drug stores, but one of what seemed to me to be the most unusual points of sale was a carpet store called Vendembooms on Broadway. I believe they only sold them around Christmas, but they had one heck of a layout in the front window. Firestone and Western Auto also sold trains. BTW, I recall quite well seeing a stack of Lionel Girl’s Trains in the basement of the old Sears Store on the Country Club Plaza and they were discounted to about 30 bucks. If we only knew then what we know now :) Just curious if there were any other odd places in the country that sold trains back in the 50’s or so? Roy Inman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77725	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/15/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

George, Any memories of which display you had?  I would love to have something more about it for the American Flyer Displays website.   Take a look at the following link to maybe jog your memory.  http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/factory_layouts/index-factory_layouts.htm Dale Smith On 4/14/2016 10:16 PM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote: My dad bought me my first set around 1952 or so then later bought the store display.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77726	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

On 4/15/2016 7:47 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: > George, > > Any memories of which display you had? I would love to have something > more about it for the American Flyer Displays website. Take a look at > the following link to maybe jog your memory. > http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/factory_layouts/index-factory_layouts.htm > > Dale Smith > > On 4/14/2016 10:16 PM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote: >> My dad bought me my first set around 1952 or so then later bought the >> store display. It is the number 300 display from 1954. Believe it or not, I still have it, stored away in the rafters of my garage. The tunnel is long gone but I have all of the other structures. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77727	From: Jim Alessio	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Attachments : Instead of a store, how about a newspaper?  My first American Flyer set came as a Christmas gift in 1951.  I was nearly seven years old - a January birthday.  The Chicago Tribune had an offer for an "American Flyer Electric Train" for boys and "Twin Walking Dolls" for girls "for only 8 subscriptions to the Daily Tribune."  My father got the eight subscriptions and I got my first set which I still have.  Jim Alessio On Thu, Apr 14, 2016 at 10:50 PM, Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Here in the backwater of Kansas City there used to be many places besides hobby shops that sold model trains. There were of course department stores and hardware stores and Katz Drug stores, but one of what seemed to me to be the most unusual points of sale was a carpet store called Vendembooms on Broadway. I believe they only sold them around Christmas, but they had one heck of a layout in the front window. Firestone and Western Auto also sold trains. BTW, I recall quite well seeing a stack of Lionel Girl’s Trains in the basement of the old Sears Store on the Country Club Plaza and they were discounted to about 30 bucks. If we only knew then what we know now :) Just curious if there were any other odd places in the country that sold trains back in the 50’s or so? Roy Inman -- Jim Alessio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77728	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Most recently is Menards. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77729	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Attachments : Wow, now there is an unusual source :) Hey, maybe an idea for newspaper circulation managers to boost subscriptions today :) Roy Inman on 4/16/16, 9:44 AM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           Instead of a store, how about a newspaper?  My first American Flyer set came as a Christmas gift in 1951.  I was nearly seven years old - a January birthday.  The Chicago Tribune had an offer for an "American Flyer Electric Train" for boys and "Twin Walking Dolls" for girls "for only 8 subscriptions to the Daily Tribune."  My father got the eight subscriptions and I got my first set which I still have.  Jim Alessio On Thu, Apr 14, 2016 at 10:50 PM, Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:           Here in the backwater of Kansas City there used to be many places besides hobby shops that sold model trains. There were of course department stores and hardware stores and Katz Drug stores, but one of what seemed to me to be the most unusual points of sale was a carpet store called Vendembooms on Broadway. I believe they only sold them around Christmas, but they had one heck of a layout in the front window. Firestone and Western Auto also sold trains. BTW, I recall quite well seeing a stack of Lionel Girl’s Trains in the basement of the old Sears Store on the Country Club Plaza and they were discounted to about 30 bucks. If we only knew then what we know now :) Just curious if there were any other odd places in the country that sold trains back in the 50’s or so? Roy Inman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77730	From: John and Carol	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Non-train stores that sold trains

Skaggs Drug Store in Boise, Idaho, 8th and Idaho Streets--basement was chock-full of American Flyer back in the late 50s/early 60s.   John Eichmann Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers Boise

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77731	From: James	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Did you go to Borah in '65? Jim B. Borah '65 On 4/16/2016 1:44 PM, John and Carol number22@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Skaggs Drug Store in Boise, Idaho, 8th and Idaho Streets--basement was chock-full of American Flyer back in the late 50s/early 60s.   John Eichmann Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers Boise

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77732	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

George, Have you ever given any thought to restoring it?  The tunnel could be reconstructed.   The book "How to Build and Operate a Model Railroad" has a glossy center section with photos of Frank Castiglione building a layout.  The finished layout is a 300, but the photos seem to switch at times to either a 301 or 302, but the tunnel is the one from the 300.  The photos go into a lot of detail concerning the construction of the tunnel.  You can skip the "asbestos plaster" that seemed to be a favored construction material at that time. Dale Smith On 4/15/2016 11:44 PM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote:   On 4/15/2016 7:47 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: > George, > > Any memories of which display you had? I would love to have something > more about it for the American Flyer Displays website. Take a look at > the following link to maybe jog your memory. > http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/factory_layouts/index-factory_layouts.htm > > Dale Smith > > On 4/14/2016 10:16 PM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote: >> My dad bought me my first set around 1952 or so then later bought the >> store display. It is the number 300 display from 1954. Believe it or not, I still have it, stored away in the rafters of my garage. The tunnel is long gone but I have all of the other structures. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77733	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I got my second set, a 1953 Silver Bullet passenger set at Merrill Drug at 4th and Market Sts. in San Francisco.  I think it was the only set they were selling and if I remember correctly it was around $15.   I remember the display was elevated and more or less an oval, but since the Silver Bullets had only a circle of track, the oval was composed of a series of reverse curves.  The train looked pretty silly running on it. Dale Smith On 4/16/2016 12:44 PM, John and Carol number22@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Skaggs Drug Store in Boise, Idaho, 8th and Idaho Streets--basement was chock-full of American Flyer back in the late 50s/early 60s.   John Eichmann Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers Boise

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77734	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77735	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

On 4/16/2016 3:50 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: > George, > > Have you ever given any thought to restoring it? The tunnel could be > reconstructed. The book "How to Build and Operate a Model Railroad" > has a glossy center section with photos of Frank Castiglione building a > layout. The finished layout is a 300, but the photos seem to switch at > times to either a 301 or 302, but the tunnel is the one from the 300. > The photos go into a lot of detail concerning the construction of the > tunnel. You can skip the "asbestos plaster" that seemed to be a favored > construction material at that time. > > Dale Smith Several summers ago I gave it some serious thought as I had a spare room to set it up in. I spent some time repairing a couple of the mini-craft buildings and they are just stored away in Rubbermaid containers. But now that room has been taken over with my wife's projects and the garage has two cars in it and no room. I will definitely take a look at that book if I can find it. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77736	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/16/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

George, There are two editions.  The first has a photo of the 2nd floor layout at the NY Hall of Science on the front cover.  The 2nd Edition has a photo of the large super layout built for the 1st floor of the Hall of Science, which is frequently misidentified as being from the 2nd floor layout.  Check here for a photo of first edition cover   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/ghos/2ndfloor_catalog.htm and here for a photo extracted from the cover of the 2nd edition    http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/ghos/1stfloor_3.htm Dale On 4/16/2016 6:19 PM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote:   On 4/16/2016 3:50 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: > George, > > Have you ever given any thought to restoring it? The tunnel could be > reconstructed. The book "How to Build and Operate a Model Railroad" > has a glossy center section with photos of Frank Castiglione building a > layout. The finished layout is a 300, but the photos seem to switch at > times to either a 301 or 302, but the tunnel is the one from the 300. > The photos go into a lot of detail concerning the construction of the > tunnel. You can skip the "asbestos plaster" that seemed to be a favored > construction material at that time. > > Dale Smith Several summers ago I gave it some serious thought as I had a spare room to set it up in. I spent some time repairing a couple of the mini-craft buildings and they are just stored away in Rubbermaid containers. But now that room has been taken over with my wife's projects and the garage has two cars in it and no room. I will definitely take a look at that book if I can find it. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77737	From: traindavid	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Well, in the small SP town of Dunsmuir, CA, the L & L Hardware store sold some AF at Christmas, as did the Western Auto parts store. The Big Liquor store sold L, and the 5 & 10 sold Marx, track and a few pieces year-round, with sets at Christmas. About 1981 the new owner of the L & L, now known as Dunsmuir Hardware called me to offer some American Flyer he found in the back of the store room he finally cleaned out--two pairs of remote control switches, NIB, and a green reefer car. The previous owners were the ones who first made me aware that ACG was going out when in 1966 they showed me their wholesale catalog for the fall, and the AF pages were blanked out!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77738	From: Roger Huber	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I grew up in the Baltimore, MD area in the 1950s and '60s. There was a hardware/plumbing store on the NE area of downtown that also sold Flyer and Lionel all year. Not a huge selection but you could get the latest stuff, track and parts.I assume they did servicing too. I vaguely remember a sign as such in te window. Also out closer to me in Perry Hall was a Western Auto store that carried Flyer S and HO all year long too. Mostly sets but sometimes pieces and always track. Roger Huber From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2016 2:07 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains   Well, in the small SP town of Dunsmuir, CA, the L & L Hardware store sold some AF at Christmas, as did the Western Auto parts store. The Big Liquor store sold L, and the 5 & 10 sold Marx, track and a few pieces year-round, with sets at Christmas. About 1981 the new owner of the L & L, now known as Dunsmuir Hardware called me to offer some American Flyer he found in the back of the store room he finally cleaned out--two pairs of remote control switches, NIB, and a green reefer car. The previous owners were the ones who first made me aware that ACG was going out when in 1966 they showed me their wholesale catalog for the fall, and the AF pages were blanked out!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77739	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 April 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 April 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77740	From: Alan Bennett	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Hello Friends, From 1960 through 1963 our family lived in Wenatchee, WA.  As kids, we rode our bikes everywhere including down to Columbia Cycle and Toy where I would get new bike tires and parts as needed.  I would also buy plastic models of airplanes and cars there. Deeming me finally old enough to take proper care of them, my Dad officially turned "possession" of our three AF train sets over to me on Christmas Day, 1960.  I don't remember Columbia Cycle carrying much in the way of trains (my interests at that young age included trains, sports, cars and girls, though not necessarily in that order), but I still have a blue 21158 Dockside switcher that I purchased from Columbia Cycle during one of those summers for $3.99. My interest in ACG American Flyer trains was rekindled by my girlfriend, now wife of 47 years, a few years later while I was in college, but that is another story. Cheers! Alan Bennett Keizer, OR Sent from my iPad On Apr 17, 2016, at 8:33 AM, Roger Huber trainpainter@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I grew up in the Baltimore, MD area in the 1950s and '60s. There was a hardware/plumbing store on the NE area of downtown that also sold Flyer and Lionel all year. Not a huge selection but you could get the latest stuff, track and parts.I assume they did servicing too. I vaguely remember a sign as such in te window. Also out closer to me in Perry Hall was a Western Auto store that carried Flyer S and HO all year long too. Mostly sets but sometimes pieces and always track. Roger Huber From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2016 2:07 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains   Well, in the small SP town of Dunsmuir, CA, the L & L Hardware store sold some AF at Christmas, as did the Western Auto parts store. The Big Liquor store sold L, and the 5 & 10 sold Marx, track and a few pieces year-round, with sets at Christmas. About 1981 the new owner of the L & L, now known as Dunsmuir Hardware called me to offer some American Flyer he found in the back of the store room he finally cleaned out--two pairs of remote control switches, NIB, and a green reefer car. The previous owners were the ones who first made me aware that ACG was going out when in 1966 they showed me their wholesale catalog for the fall, and the AF pages were blanked out!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77741	From: Ken Christiansen	Date: 4/17/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

My aunt worked at Gold's department store in Lincoln NB and she bought for my parents to give my brother and I after we settled in a house with an attached garage. That would have been 1953. Ken Christiansen BHHS, Crosby Starck Real Estate 815-218-3957

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77742	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/18/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I lived in the small town of Anaconda, Montana and the only trains you could buy there were Lionel from 2 of the hardware stores and then only at Christmas time. My first Flyer set was purchased with 7 books of green trading stamps (not S&H) that my grandmother got for me at about age 10. We then in 1960 moved to Missoula, Montana where I discovered State Hardware who sold everything Flyer from sets to individual locomotives and cars and accessories to transformers. About a year later I ended up moving back to Anaconda and when I finally got back to State Hardware Flyer had gone out of business.                                                                 Bob Lampe                                                                 Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2016 00:07:13 -0700 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains   Well, in the small SP town of Dunsmuir, CA, the L & L Hardware store sold some AF at Christmas, as did the Western Auto parts store. The Big Liquor store sold L, and the 5 & 10 sold Marx, track and a few pieces year-round, with sets at Christmas. About 1981 the new owner of the L & L, now known as Dunsmuir Hardware called me to offer some American Flyer he found in the back of the store room he finally cleaned out--two pairs of remote control switches, NIB, and a green reefer car. The previous owners were the ones who first made me aware that ACG was going out when in 1966 they showed me their wholesale catalog for the fall, and the AF pages were blanked out!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77743	From: tbennerohio	Date: 4/18/2016
Subject: new Fort Wayne Line update

It' been a while.  Some decisions and progress have been on the Ft. Wayne line.  The (almost) final track plan is in photos under the new Ft. Wayne line.  Check it out.  Suggestions and comments are welcome. The last time I posted in Fall 2015 I was still looking for a home for the old tinplate layout.  That has a new home in my brother-in-law's basement.  And there were still  decisions to be made on what track to use.  Those decisions have been made.  I chose: - Midwest cork roadbed 1/2 O and1/2 HO.  This is not without its challenges when trying to lay on a centerline but it can be dome if one lays the HO half first with an 'offset block'.   - SHS/MTH flextrack.  Cost-effective and after bending Gargraves on the last two tinplate layouts, it is like a dream come true. - American Models turnouts.  I planned to hand lay turnouts but these will facilitate trains running by the time the snow flies again.  Matching the code 125 flex to the code 148 turnout rail takes some doing but it is possible to make conversion rail joiners.  Some day the turnouts will be replaced with hand laid code 125 turnouts. The next decision to be made is how to power this RR.  I would like to be able to run my old 'nostalgia' trains, most of which have been re-motored with can motors.  But DCC is alluring so I am wiring to DCC standards.  This will be another post along with some reverse loop questions..  For now I am seeking opinions on whether 18 GA is heavy enough wire for drops from the track to the bus or if 16 might be a better idea.  The bottom loop of the stacked looks has track laid (glued with DAP Dynaflex) and ready to solder the rail joiners.  So it is time to order wire for feeders and the bus. 30 or 45 or 60 minutes a day, progress is being made.  The way I see it, almost 10% of the track is laid! Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77744	From: hspanier2000	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Operat

Can anyone give me an idea (off line: hspanier@...) what something like this is worth? It is in very nice shape and appears to be from 1960. It has sections on Loco & Tenders, Accessories, and Transformers. Seems to have parts and prices for all items. I am knowledgeable about many items but not this. It is in a black binder. Thank you, Mike Spanier

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77745	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update

Tim Benner wrote: <- SHS/MTH flextrack. Cost-effective and after bending Gargraves on the last two tinplate layouts, it is like a dream come true. - American Models turnouts. I planned to hand lay turnouts but these will facilitate trains running by the time the snow flies again. Matching the code 125 flex to the code 148 turnout rail takes some doing but it is possible to make conversion rail joiners. Some day the turnouts will be replaced with hand laid code 125 turnouts. >   Hi Tim,   SHS flex track is .138”.  That is only .01” difference in height from the AM turnouts.  I have used both systems interchangeably for years without any modification.  Just use 148 rail joiners.  I run Flyer, Hi-rail and scale and I don’t even file the rails.   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77746	From: Scott Holm	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Polk Brothers in Chicago was a furniture and appliance store that sold Flyer. I remember how disappointed I was when I went there around 1970 when there was barely a trace of Flyer left. Cut to about 14 years later when I went to Townhouse TV & Appliances and encountered Flyonel cars for the first time!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77747	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

One of the most wonderful stores in Chicago in the early 1950s was Vaughn Seeds.   While primarily a purveyor of seeds and nursery stock, they had a store in downtown Chicago that had at least one full floor of toys…..not only American Flyer and Lionel trains, but imported stuff like Schuco (very sophisticated wind-up cars running on wire track with switches and crossings or even steered with a steering wheel connected with a cable, or free-running).   The store smelled like a nursery but had a better selection of toys than even Marshall Fields!   A place I haven’t seen mentioned that was a train-only store was The House of Trains on South Cottage Grove Avenue.  It had the largest stock of S of any place in Chicago including Miller (self contained power trucks with the motor armatures on the axles and Alco switcher kit), Nimco, Rex, Enhorning, and others.   Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77748	From: R G	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Wiebolts in Chicago also sold Flyer, That is where my father got me a "Truscott" Franklin set in 1959.  There was also a appliance store on North Avenue that sold Flyer into the late 60's early 70's that I would frequent when I was attending the U 0f Illinois at Chicago Circle campus. On Tuesday, April 19, 2016 2:44 PM, "Scott Holm imsscott@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Polk Brothers in Chicago was a furniture and appliance store that sold Flyer. I remember how disappointed I was when I went there around 1970 when there was barely a trace of Flyer left. Cut to about 14 years later when I went to Townhouse TV & Appliances and encountered Flyonel cars for the first time!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77749	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/19/2016
Subject: Re: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Op

Did you post a photo somewhere? Dale Smith On 4/19/2016 6:49 AM, hspanier@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Can anyone give me an idea (off line: hspanier@...) what something like this is worth? It is in very nice shape and appears to be from 1960. It has sections on Loco & Tenders, Accessories, and Transformers. Seems to have parts and prices for all items. I am knowledgeable about many items but not this. It is in a black binder. Thank you, Mike Spanier

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77750	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds

Vaughns seeds was one of my favorite places. An unusual hobby shop and gardening store with tropical birds ans MR stuff on different floors. I was so disappointed when they went away. You just don't find places like that now and the malls have become such boring dorky places. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77751	From: ee_train	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Property of the A.C.Gilbert Co, To Remanin at Repair Station, Op

Hi Mike - Is this a three ring binder of service station papers? Official ones are in binders that are maroon with gold lettering. The binders did not hold up under heavy use and some of the service stations replaced with vinyl off the shelf binders. Value would depend upon the quantity of different sheets and the condition of the sheets. Early sheets from the 1950's are more common than the 1960's sheets. Original binders (3") with hundreds of sheets have sold on ebay recently for $100 to $150.  On another topic, the Edobaud loco frame I received from you has rigid buffers, The loco I am restoring has buffers that are spring loaded "telescoping". Perhaps they morphed over time as the complex ones are clearly more expensive to manufacture.  Bill Drake San Jose

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77752	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds

The entire downtown Chicago Loop has become a dorky mall with nothing but Starbucks and other yuppified national chains.   I'm not sure but I bet you couldn't buy a train set there and would have to drive miles to find a place that sells anything.....and there are less than a handful of Hobby Shops anywhere in Chicago at all! Dorky.... A great way to describe what,s left!!! Charlie Vlk   Sent from my iPhone On Apr 20, 2016, at 9:30 AM, Anthony Cynor tonycynor@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Vaughns seeds was one of my favorite places. An unusual hobby shop and gardening store with tropical birds ans MR stuff on different floors. I was so disappointed when they went away. You just don't find places like that now and the malls have become such boring dorky places. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77753	From: barb	Date: 4/20/2016
Subject: Fort Wayne Line Update

Tim, on my layout I used 14 gauge lamp wire to carry power to my tracks. I made significant use of terminal blocks and added a feeder wire every 6 to 8 feet. Since my layout is 360 sq. ft. (18x20) Some track was quite a distance from my transformers. The 14 gauge wire has worked well. Congrats on your progress... Barb

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77754	From: tbennerohio	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Fort Wayne Line Update

Barb and Tom, Thanks!  I also used 14ga lamp wire extensively on the last layout.  Still have most of a 250' roll of it left over. That will get used up for the (Tortoise) switch motor bus.  It's overkill but cheaper than buying new wire.  For the track bus to be DCC ready I think I will need to use 14 or even 12ga solid wire because it will need to be twisted pairs.  So basic house wire from the big box store.  For feeders I would like to go with 18ga solid wire so they are easier to hide but keep second guessing if 16ga might do a better job.  I am a soldering fiend.  But with feeders attaching to a solid bus wire every three feet, suitcase connectors are starting to make a lot of sense.  The section under construction is the lower return loop.  Much of this track will be covered by the upper loop so it needs to be as perfect as possible.  The feeders need to be soldered on so the track can be painted and ballasted before the upper return loop can go on.  Why paint and ballast hidden track?  Practice makes perfect. I am using the .148 rail joiners to join the SHS flex track to AM turnouts.  I just stretch half of the joiner open and slide a tin shim in the bottom before sliding on to the SHS track.  After soldering to the AM turnout, using a wood block to hold the rail tops even, the joint is level and in gauge.    Speaking of soldering, all the rail joints are soldered.  I wonder if it might be wise to use the Dremel to cut some relief gaps in the rail in case the plywood sub-roadbed expands or contracts.  It is always 66-68 degrees down there but humidity fluctuates from 30% in the Winter to 50% in the Spring and Fall.  Usually back to 30-some% in the Summer. More on wiring, both plans and questions, in another post. Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77755	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds

I've been in Orange County now since late 68. Same thing here now too. There used to be hobby shops all over and now there are none except a few chains which are mostly empty when visited. All Nation used to be downtown in Chicago also and that is long gone as well as most other hobby shops. Dullsville. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77756	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds

To All: I travel around with my work. Mostly North and South America. I used to visit hobby stores in my travels. Those visits are getting fewer and fewer but you can still come up with some trains. I moved to SW Florida about six months ago. We went to a big Renningers antique flea market in central FL in February. I got some trains. There's a store in Sarasota about 90 miles away I need to visit. In the past I remember going to a store in Chicago at Belmont and Western. I bought my AF UP Challenger there. Someone just brought it in to sell and I bought it 5 minutes after they went out the door. There used to be a good store in Huntington WV I got a bunch of trains from. I don't know if they're still there. Isn't that around you Stumpy?  When I was a kid in Philly there was Nicholas Smith and Beckers on the same block of 11th St. where the convention center is now. That was a easy ride in town on the Route 23 trolley. Farther in Philly but like the other side of the world was Hill Cycle in Chesnut Hill. Bikes and trains. I was there in the early 60's. They had racing bikes for over $500 ! They're gone too. Allied Hobbies on Rising Sun Ave in Somerton was a good place too but that was a trolley, subway, bus ride to get there. Don't know about them.  Thanks to whoever started this thread. Its a fun one. Regards Bob Moyer On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 11:29 AM, Anthony Cynor tonycynor@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I've been in Orange County now since late 68. Same thing here now too. There used to be hobby shops all over and now there are none except a few chains which are mostly empty when visited. All Nation used to be downtown in Chicago also and that is long gone as well as most other hobby shops. Dullsville. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77757	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains/ Vaughn's Seeds

I used to work at All Nations in Chicago and they were not very big on Lionel but sold a few sets at Christmas.  I don’t know if they ever had much in the way of tinplate as AF was gone long before I started working there and Flyionel production hadn’t started up. The big tinplate store was Downtown Hobbies which was at the time above the Walgreens on State Street.   Later they moved into the basement arcade and still later over to the First National Plaza. La Grange Hobbies used to have Authorized Repairs for both Lionel and American Flyer.   My grandfather bought a 8’x16’ layout from Chick Evans who used to be their repair guy and paid him to set it up in our basement.   It had Marnold DC throttles and panel switches to throw the turnouts.   I later added a 4x8 to one end and another 4x8 to the side to expand it.   The attic repair area at La Grange Hobbies was wonderful…with boxes and boxes of used Lionel and AF track, switches, and equipment.   Sadly when the shop moved from that location on Calendar Avenue to the place they are now on La Grange Road the train department went to hell in a handbasket for all interests. Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77758	From: Scott Holm	Date: 4/21/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Marshall Fields in Chicago also had American Flyer. My father once bought a 293 Pacific steam engine off the "junk" table for a dollar that only had a missing brush wrong with it! It still has the 1.00 scribed on the bottom.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77759	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I grew up in CT, and when I was about 7 or 8, my folks bought me my first and only train set….a freight set headed by the K335…..they obviously didn’t skimp on a cheap set back then !  I still have that set today. I have vivid memories of visiting the train section of G Fox in Hartford (No….unfortunately, I never got the G Fox boxcar!), and also Brown Thompson’s department store which was right next door to G Fox. For some reason, my memory of BT is stronger than G Fox, so maybe their display area was larger and more impressive to a young kid?  I also recall walking down the street a few blocks to a small hole-in-the-wall train shop; can’t remember the name.   My one memory of that store, other than it being small, is a strange one----I remember buying a package of “brick” paper there !   I’m sure I purchased other stuff there too, but that’s the one thing I recall. More than once, my father remarked to me before he passed in 2004 at age 98, “Amazing what that one train set has turned into !”, referring not only to my personal collection, but also the business.  I owe the passion of the last 40+ years to him.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77760	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I grew up in Mt. Vernon, NY. My first set was the K-5 PRR # 312 with the green NH baggage and two OB passenger cars. They came from Hobby House in Cleveland, Ohio. In my home town was Zephyr Hobby and Christmas time Telly's Hardware did some Flyer too. I was told the owner of Zephyr started a distributorship in the Connecticut area (State). He was very good. Being near Dah (the) Bronx, I went to Hong's on White Plains Road near Allerton Ave. they did great repairs on AF. There was a hobby shop across the street from them too ( can not remember the name). When I went to Manhattan, I always visited the the Hall of Science, Lionel, Madison Hardware, Julie's on 23rd street and Merchants Mercantile. Oh yes I did go the the toy building on 5th and 23rd too. I loved seeing the plague for ACG , Cowan, Marx and others too. Does anyone know if the plague is still in the building, being it is now a condo type residence ? The 1950's , for me, were the BEST . I love my trains. Frank. Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77761	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/22/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

It is amazing how many of us have memories of these places, especially the department stores, but how few photos of these displays survive.  As to G. Fox, I do have a photo of the layout on americanflyerdisplays.org (http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/department_store/g_fox.htm ) and as Doug intimates, it isn't that impressive.  I think the photo dates from 1947. Dale Smith On 4/22/2016 4:50 AM, 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I grew up in CT, and when I was about 7 or 8, my folks bought me my first and only train set….a freight set headed by the K335…..they obviously didn’t skimp on a cheap set back then !  I still have that set today. I have vivid memories of visiting the train section of G Fox in Hartford (No….unfortunately, I never got the G Fox boxcar!), and also Brown Thompson’s department store which was right next door to G Fox. For some reason, my memory of BT is stronger than G Fox, so maybe their display area was larger and more impressive to a young kid?  I also recall walking down the street a few blocks to a small hole-in-the-wall train shop; can’t remember the name.   My one memory of that store, other than it being small, is a strange one----I remember buying a package of “brick” paper there !   I’m sure I purchased other stuff there too, but that’s the one thing I recall. More than once, my father remarked to me before he passed in 2004 at age 98, “Amazing what that one train set has turned into !”, referring not only to my personal collection, but also the business.  I owe the passion of the last 40+ years to him.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77762	From: Gary Chudzinski	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

In Fremont, OH during the 40's and 50's, the Lionel and American Flyer dealership was a sporting good store. It was a daily stop walking home from school during Christmas season! Gary Chudzinski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77763	From: traindavid	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

This has sort of morphed into any stores that sold trains when we were kids & our experiences. My Dad bought AF because the high school science teacher, Mr. Wright, who was a family friend told him they were the most realistic of the options. He had AF, as did his sons Peter & MIke, who were my Brothers' ages (I was about 4-6 years younger--still am!). Their AF was set up every year at Christmastime, and his wife painted mountain backdrops on cardboard to go against the wall. They had engines that smoked, passenger sets, a semaphore and other neat accessories. So, when I was almost 2, my brothers got their first set, "The Crusader Freight" with the 307 and three cars, no smoke, no choo-choo! Grandpa & Grandma added to the set with two pairs of remote control switches, more track, a Lionel revolving beacon, a Marx barrel loader and some freight cars. I remember being in San Francisco, probably at the "Big E" (Emporium Department store, now condos) and my mom getting a piggy-back flat car for my brothers. A few years later my oldest brother, Louie, got a 355 Baldwin diesel set with his paper route money. When I was about 5 or 6 I figured out how to hook up the transformer and ran trains. The 307 had problems, I forget what, and Dad sent it to "The Roundhouse" a train store down in San Jose/Saratoga area and some weeks later it came back repaired. Later I would write ACG and get my own parts and do my own repairs. Meantime, Mr. Wright always had the Christmastime layout on the floor, and eventually his son Mike took over the trains and bought more AF when he was away at college & elsewhere. He still has them, still sets them up at Christmas, and usually uses his Mom's backdrops, although he mostly runs modern production engines nowadays. Mike became the music teacher at the Elementary School and is still in Dunsmuir, retired now. Meantime, I added to the trains, collecting my cousin's sets, buying other kid's sets as they "grew out of them," some stuff mail order from Hobby Surplus Sales and Dan Olsen (and reading S Gauge Herald) and even buying trains at second hand stores when I was at college (and still reading the S Gauge Herald)! The sets I got in Dunsmuir most all were originally bought Mail-Order, although the L&L Hardware store (Now Dunsmuir Hardware, still in business--and they sell some trains still!) and the Western Auto store carried some AF during Christmas Season--as did the Sears Catalog Store. If you wanted to visit a real Hobby Shop, that was a 2 hour drive to Redding down the Sacramento River Canyon (now an hour drive, all freeway with most of the curves eliminated and the river far below it). I don't remember what trains they carried, but I did buy my Schuco Disneyland Monorail set there when I was about 13.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77764	From: n6ojj	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

DJ, Are you still in the Dunsmuir area?  I have visited three S modelers in the region (Weed, Dunsmuir, Mt. Shasta City).  The three have layouts.  I live four hours south, in the East Bay.   Cheers,  Dave McBrayer  Castro Valley, CA  Sent from my iPad On Apr 23, 2016, at 10:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   This has sort of morphed into any stores that sold trains when we were kids & our experiences. My Dad bought AF because the high school science teacher, Mr. Wright, who was a family friend told him they were the most realistic of the options. He had AF, as did his sons Peter & MIke, who were my Brothers' ages (I was about 4-6 years younger--still am!). Their AF was set up every year at Christmastime, and his wife painted mountain backdrops on cardboard to go against the wall. They had engines that smoked, passenger sets, a semaphore and other neat accessories. So, when I was almost 2, my brothers got their first set, "The Crusader Freight" with the 307 and three cars, no smoke, no choo-choo! Grandpa & Grandma added to the set with two pairs of remote control switches, more track, a Lionel revolving beacon, a Marx barrel loader and some freight cars. I remember being in San Francisco, probably at the "Big E" (Emporium Department store, now condos) and my mom getting a piggy-back flat car for my brothers. A few years later my oldest brother, Louie, got a 355 Baldwin diesel set with his paper route money. When I was about 5 or 6 I figured out how to hook up the transformer and ran trains. The 307 had problems, I forget what, and Dad sent it to "The Roundhouse" a train store down in San Jose/Saratoga area and some weeks later it came back repaired. Later I would write ACG and get my own parts and do my own repairs. Meantime, Mr. Wright always had the Christmastime layout on the floor, and eventually his son Mike took over the trains and bought more AF when he was away at college & elsewhere. He still has them, still sets them up at Christmas, and usually uses his Mom's backdrops, although he mostly runs modern production engines nowadays. Mike became the music teacher at the Elementary School and is still in Dunsmuir, retired now. Meantime, I added to the trains, collecting my cousin's sets, buying other kid's sets as they "grew out of them," some stuff mail order from Hobby Surplus Sales and Dan Olsen (and reading S Gauge Herald) and even buying trains at second hand stores when I was at college (and still reading the S Gauge Herald)! The sets I got in Dunsmuir most all were originally bought Mail-Order, although the L&L Hardware store (Now Dunsmuir Hardware, still in business--and they sell some trains still!) and the Western Auto store carried some AF during Christmas Season--as did the Sears Catalog Store. If you wanted to visit a real Hobby Shop, that was a 2 hour drive to Redding down the Sacramento River Canyon (now an hour drive, all freeway with most of the curves eliminated and the river far below it). I don't remember what trains they carried, but I did buy my Schuco Disneyland Monorail set there when I was about 13.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77765	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/23/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

David, Actually the Big E Emporium is now Bloomingdales and is part of the Westfield San Francisco Centre Shopping Mall.   They did preserve the dome of the old store and it can be viewed and is probably more viewable than it was originally, but the only clear view is from several floors up, making it quite a different experience.   As to Flyer Trains, I don't think the Emporium ever carried them.   I always went to J.C. Penney in the next block up on Market St.   I did hear there was also a big layout in the City of Paris, but I never saw it.   Maybe it was before my time. Dale Smith On 4/23/2016 10:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This has sort of morphed into any stores that sold trains when we were kids & our experiences. My Dad bought AF because the high school science teacher, Mr. Wright, who was a family friend told him they were the most realistic of the options. He had AF, as did his sons Peter & MIke, who were my Brothers' ages (I was about 4-6 years younger--still am!). Their AF was set up every year at Christmastime, and his wife painted mountain backdrops on cardboard to go against the wall. They had engines that smoked, passenger sets, a semaphore and other neat accessories. So, when I was almost 2, my brothers got their first set, "The Crusader Freight" with the 307 and three cars, no smoke, no choo-choo! Grandpa & Grandma added to the set with two pairs of remote control switches, more track, a Lionel revolving beacon, a Marx barrel loader and some freight cars. I remember being in San Francisco, probably at the "Big E" (Emporium Department store, now condos) and my mom getting a piggy-back flat car for my brothers. A few years later my oldest brother, Louie, got a 355 Baldwin diesel set with his paper route money. When I was about 5 or 6 I figured out how to hook up the transformer and ran trains. The 307 had problems, I forget what, and Dad sent it to "The Roundhouse" a train store down in San Jose/Saratoga area and some weeks later it came back repaired. Later I would write ACG and get my own parts and do my own repairs. Meantime, Mr. Wright always had the Christmastime layout on the floor, and eventually his son Mike took over the trains and bought more AF when he was away at college & elsewhere. He still has them, still sets them up at Christmas, and usually uses his Mom's backdrops, although he mostly runs modern production engines nowadays. Mike became the music teacher at the Elementary School and is still in Dunsmuir, retired now. Meantime, I added to the trains, collecting my cousin's sets, buying other kid's sets as they "grew out of them," some stuff mail order from Hobby Surplus Sales and Dan Olsen (and reading S Gauge Herald) and even buying trains at second hand stores when I was at college (and still reading the S Gauge Herald)! The sets I got in Dunsmuir most all were originally bought Mail-Order, although the L&L Hardware store (Now Dunsmuir Hardware, still in business--and they sell some trains still!) and the Western Auto store carried some AF during Christmas Season--as did the Sears Catalog Store. If you wanted to visit a real Hobby Shop, that was a 2 hour drive to Redding down the Sacramento River Canyon (now an hour drive, all freeway with most of the curves eliminated and the river far below it). I don't remember what trains they carried, but I did buy my Schuco Disneyland Monorail set there when I was about 13.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77766	From: traindavid	Date: 4/24/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Dave M. No, not in Dunsmuir anymore, I live outside of Oroville, CA, but my family still has Cave Springs Resort in Dunsmuir, so I am up there a few times a year. I knew there was a layout in Mt. Shasta, wasn't aware of the others though. Dale, Ah, then it probably was the City of Paris, as we always parked in the garage under Union Square; my eye doctor was in the Fitzhugh Building on the uphill side of the square, Blums was on the other side of the square where I remember having lunches, and City of Paris was on the corner, so handy for shopping! Good memories. Ah, I thought the Big E was scheduled for condos the last time I was in The City, but that's at least a decade ago! Sometimes these trips to The City involved taking the SP Shasta Daylight to get to my Grandparents' house in Walnut Creek; I would go as often as 3 times a year. I don't remember if we ever took the trains across the Bay Bridge, but I do remember in later years when we took a car looking at the long lines of the Bridge transit train sets stored in the yards near the Toll Plaza, and the tracks on the lower deck. And I remember driving over "the hump" in the tunnel during the track removal project (for those that don't have a clue what that's about; when they removed the tracks, they had to also remove the pillars supporting the upper roadway in the tunnel and build new support system, so they designed this moveable "hump" for the traffic to drive over, yet leave room underneath for the construction project. No tall trucks on the bridge while that was going on!) Oh, and the other thing was the guard buildings on the City side of the bridge left over from WWII. Those disappeared in the 1960s, I think.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77767	From: Bob Hannon	Date: 4/24/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Doug:   Holy smoke ! G-Fox & Brown Thompson !     And just across the street: J.J. Newberry, W.T. Grant. A hobby shop on Pearl St . And a few scattered on down Park St ., including an F.W. Woolworth.   Greatest Toy Town in the world, Hartford , Ct.   Thanks for dredging up those happy memories !!!   Bob Hannon

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77768	From: Doug Peck	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

And a late addition I thought of……across the street from Brown Thompson was EJ Korvettes, one of the early discount dept stores.  . As I recall, they carried trains in the 60s, when things were fading. OK, Bob……let’s hear your story, and your CT connection.     <<<Doug: Holy smoke ! G-Fox & Brown Thompson ! And just across the street: J.J. Newberry, W.T. Grant. A hobby shop on Pearl St. And a few scattered on down Park St., including an F.W. Woolworth. Greatest Toy Town in the world, Hartford, Ct. Thanks for dredging up those happy memories !!! Bob Hannon>>>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77769	From: howardpape12	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

I remember Modell's when it was a department store in the fifties. Also sold American Flyer in their East Meadow store on Long Island, N.Y. Howard Pape On Monday, April 25, 2016 7:30 AM, "'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   And a late addition I thought of……across the street from Brown Thompson was EJ Korvettes, one of the early discount dept stores.  . As I recall, they carried trains in the 60s, when things were fading. OK, Bob……let’s hear your story, and your CT connection.     <<<Doug: Holy smoke ! G-Fox & Brown Thompson ! And just across the street: J.J. Newberry, W.T. Grant. A hobby shop on Pearl St. And a few scattered on down Park St., including an F.W. Woolworth. Greatest Toy Town in the world, Hartford, Ct. Thanks for dredging up those happy memories !!! Bob Hannon>>>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77770	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Hi Doug.  As you know, Ct was heavily populated with American Flyer during the 50’s decade.  We had an amazing hobby store in South Norwalk.  It’s no longer in business, but it had every conceivable Flyer product.  The name was HOBBYLAND at 57 North Main Street in South Norwalk, Ct.  I still have the #, Temple 8-6833.  HOBBYLAND was next door to the Rialto movie theater.  Every Saturday my brother and I would spend a dime to ride the bus to the theater to catch the latest Roy Rogers and Gene Autry shows.  However our ultimate motive was to visit HOBBYLAND to see the newest American Flyer products.  My Dad finally bought us a 312 Pacific with four cars.  He also built us a table and created a layout.  I don’t know how he could afford the train package with accessories.  He worked at the Hat Corporation of America as a laborer.  It didn’t pay much back then.    Our home in Norwalk and Westport was only 36 miles from New Haven and Gilbert’s factory.  We had many great stores around us that sold American Flyer such as Sears, Montgomery Ward and even Caldor’s the major discount department store in East Norwalk that operated from 1951 to early 1991. Overall, It was a great place to grow up and especially our visits to Macy’s in New York at Christmas to see the wonderful window train displays .  Trains were everything.   Even watching the giant steam engines at the stations in Norwalk and Saugatuck.  We miss those days.   That’s my story Doug.   Bob       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 5:54 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains     And a late addition I thought of……across the street from Brown Thompson was EJ Korvettes, one of the early discount dept stores.  . As I recall, they carried trains in the 60s, when things were fading. OK, Bob……let’s hear your story, and your CT connection.     <<<Doug: Holy smoke ! G-Fox & Brown Thompson ! And just across the street: J.J. Newberry, W.T. Grant. A hobby shop on Pearl St. And a few scattered on down Park St., including an F.W. Woolworth. Greatest Toy Town in the world, Hartford, Ct. Thanks for dredging up those happy memories !!! Bob Hannon>>>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77771	From: The Laniers	Date: 4/25/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Interesting what some folks can remember from fifty or sixty years or so ago. I’ll tell you what I don’t remember and perhaps someone else can. I grew up south of Richmond Virginia and a big shopping day for my family was a visit to the Sears store on West Broad Street in Richmond. At Christmas time the lawn and garden portion of the store between the auto and tire shop and the main store was converted to a huge toy land. Or so it seemed to me. There was a large train layout there, but I don’t remember what was sold. Lionel, Flyer, Marx? Or all three? Probably everything that was shown in their catalog. Would love to hear from someone who remembers it in detail.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 7:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains     Hi Doug.  As you know, Ct was heavily populated with American Flyer during the 50’s decade.  We had an amazing hobby store in South Norwalk.  It’s no longer in business, but it had every conceivable Flyer product.  The name was HOBBYLAND at 57 North Main Street in South Norwalk, Ct.  I still have the #, Temple 8-6833.  HOBBYLAND was next door to the Rialto movie theater.  Every Saturday my brother and I would spend a dime to ride the bus to the theater to catch the latest Roy Rogers and Gene Autry shows.  However our ultimate motive was to visit HOBBYLAND to see the newest American Flyer products.  My Dad finally bought us a 312 Pacific with four cars.  He also built us a table and created a layout.  I don’t know how he could afford the train package with accessories.  He worked at the Hat Corporation of America as a laborer.  It didn’t pay much back then.  Our home in Norwalk and Westport was only 36 miles from New Haven and Gilbert’s factory.  We had many great stores around us that sold American Flyer such as Sears, Montgomery Ward and even Caldor’s the major discount department store in East Norwalk that operated from 1951 to early 1991. Overall, It was a great place to grow up and especially our visits to Macy’s in New York at Christmas to see the wonderful window train displays .  Trains were everything.   Even watching the giant steam engines at the stations in Norwalk and Saugatuck.  We miss those days. That’s my story Doug. Bob  From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 5:54 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Non-train stores that sold trains   And a late addition I thought of……across the street from Brown Thompson was EJ Korvettes, one of the early discount dept stores.  . As I recall, they carried trains in the 60s, when things were fading. OK, Bob……let’s hear your story, and your CT connection. <<<Doug: Holy smoke ! G-Fox & Brown Thompson ! And just across the street: J.J. Newberry, W.T. Grant. A hobby shop on Pearl St. And a few scattered on down Park St., including an F.W. Woolworth. Greatest Toy Town in the world, Hartford, Ct. Thanks for dredging up those happy memories !!! Bob Hannon>>> Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 wlmailhtml:doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted. Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77772	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

Sears sold Lionel and Allstate trains.  Allstate were Marx, custom labeled for Sears.  On rare occasion, they had uncatalogued Flyer. Vic Bereskin > Interesting what some folks can remember from fifty or sixty years or so ago. I’ll tell you what I don’t remember and perhaps > someone else can. I grew up south of Richmond Virginia and a big shopping day for my family was a visit to the Sears store on > West Broad Street in Richmond. At Christmas time the lawn and garden portion of the store between the auto and tire shop and the > main store was converted to a huge toy land. Or so it seemed to me. There was a large train layout there, but I don’t remember what > was sold. Lionel, Flyer, Marx? Or all three? Probably everything that was shown in their catalog. Would love to hear from someone  > who remembers it in detail. > Herb > paflyrman

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77773	From: hobbycj1	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Non-train stores that sold trains

There was a large Sears Store in Hackensack which did the same toyland in the outdoor dept. & they sold an Allstate Train set made by Marx. I already had both Standard guage & O guage Lionel, so didn't pay 2 much attention. They also had great rosted spanish peanuts which you could smell the minute you entered the store. And, I had to have a bag!! Thanks  CJB

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77774	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Lionel plastic steam

Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77775	From: Bill Clark	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Here is a link to the discussion on Lionel S Gauge steam engines with plastic shells that Tom is referencing: http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/topic/what-if-lionel-were-to-build-s-gauge-steam-engines-with-plastic-shells On 4/26/2016 10:36 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77776	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

All While I don't really have a dog in this fight since all my AF was sold off c.1960.... ....but I am an independent full time Model Railroad Consultant and have done work in S for The factory that makes Lionel S, although most of my work is for HO and N projects. Sent from my iPhone On Apr 26, 2016, at 9:36 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77777	From: keyhole_corona	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

I saw that thread on the ORG forum and boy did it go off track!  I didn't respond there but here is my 2cents worth. I see nothing wrong with a plastic steam engine. Many HO steam locomotives are plastic and they look great!  Think about it,  we do not question if a S Scale diesel locomotive is plastic do we?!!!  They have great detail!  Then why do we put down plastic Steam locomotives?  The plastic industry has come a long way since the 1950's and any new plastic Steam locomotive would have better and greater detail than Old A.C. Gilbert locomotives of the 50's and 60's.  People on the ORG forum talked about pulling power. To me that is a non issue as most of us never run prototypical length trains anyhow! Most of my old flyer plastic  steam engines  will easily pull 15+ traditional Flyer cars and over 20 newer MTH/S-helper, American Models cars. That is probably more than the average modeler runs on their layouts.  I would definitely purchase a S-Scale plastic steam locomotive, no doubt about it.  Rich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77778	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Darn cellphones!!!!  The rest of my message was going to be essentially what the last poster stated.... .....it is just within the last five years that it is possible to equal injection molded plastic detail with diecast metal. Weight can be added to bring a model up to desired heft. Adding detail parts on plastic is much easier than metal and once painted there is no difference in appearance. The old idea that plastic is junk went out with warped tank cars in the 50s.    Charlie Vlk Sent from my iPhone On Apr 26, 2016, at 10:41 AM, Charlie Vlk cvlk@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   All While I don't really have a dog in this fight since all my AF was sold off c.1960.... ....but I am an independent full time Model Railroad Consultant and have done work in S for The factory that makes Lionel S, although most of my work is for HO and N projects. Sent from my iPhone On Apr 26, 2016, at 9:36 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77779	From: tennsgauger	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Tom, thank for reporting this on the S-Trains Yahoogroup.  This is the first I have heard about this.  I am not a member of the O forum though maybe I should be.   I have nothing against using plastic and am all for reducing the costs.  Whether I would buy a Lionel plastic steam locomotive largely depends on what model becomes available and in what road name.  I model L&N, Southern, NC&StL, and a little Tennessee Central.    I would be much more likely to buy a loco with scale wheels and couplers than with highrail.    I know just a little about Legacy and Flyer Chief.  I use NCE DCC.  Am not sure how easy it is to convert the Lionel to DCC.    Thanks for reporting this news.        -  Earl Henry, Nashville       In a message dated 4/26/2016 11:08:50 A.M. Central Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Here is a link to the discussion on Lionel S Gauge steam engines with plastic shells that Tom is referencing: http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/topic/what-if-lionel-were-to-build-s-gauge-steam-engines-with-plastic-shells On 4/26/2016 10:36 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77780	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Memory Triggers

The thread that wandered into favorite places where trains were sold made me think of this…. ….just walking into a train show and smelling the smoke from an AF steamer transports me back more than a half century… ….or, just finding something as small as an AF Mail Pickup mail bag brings on a flood of memories!!!   On a somewhat unrelated but similar theme, someone mentioned dimestores that sold trains….how about the holiday smell of cedar smoke from those little wooden log cabins with the metal chimneys that burned cones of incense??!!!!   What memories will our grandkids have….the sound of the cellophane being ripped off of Carjacker III Murder Nation game discs???   Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77781	From: pickycat95	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

My thoughts are along the lines of Earl.  Lionel and S Scale Loco Supply collaborated on the Y-3 to allow SSLS to convert it to scale and adjust the programing of the electronics to make it DCC ready.  I don't know how 'successful' the project was, but I have one and it is a really nice piece of work and looks great with the scale wheels.  Problem is that I'm a modern guy and can't justify buying any more steam locos for excursion passenger junkets.  I'd much rather see big L figure out a game plan to introduce modern rolling stock to go with their gorgeous GE and EMD behemoths.  I was really bummed when they canceled the 57' reefer and am discouraged that they haven't fixed the issues with the 'scale' Barber roller bearing truck in that its bolster makes the car body ride way too high.  A lower profile stamped bolster should be a simple fix but no-oh after at least 3 years.  I really hate the idea of having to swap out trucks of $70 - $80 cars and lose the rolling endcaps.  :-(. Ben Trousdale

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77782	From: racin510	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Why would we be looking at an 'O' forum?  Lionel should float the idea here and get real market feedback. I for one would buy a very detailed plastic Hudson in a minute. Pulling power is not an issue and detail, if anything, would be at least as good as their cast metal. AC went to plastic because, even in the 1950's, if you could afford the tooling plastic yielded much better detail. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77783	From: mike_a_2001	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S

Tichy Train Group expanded their line of details in S to add road signs that include railroad crossing signs, stop, speed, parking, and other signs.  They also added tools and more window castings. S Scale S Scale View on www.tichytraingroup... Preview by Yahoo Mike Andrzejewski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77784	From: poniaj	Date: 4/26/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Why look at an O gauge forum?  I thought the same thing too, but there's a sub-group for S gauge too!  It's full of good guys and good discussion (like this one).  Try it.  There's  also a bunch of links to topics that deal with O guage, but also apply to our type of modeling too.  At least it's interesting to see.  Look at it and decide for yourself. Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77785	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Gloria eye dr, Wednesday, 27 April 2016

Attachments : "Gloria eye dr" reminder When Wednesday, 27 April 2016 08:30 AM to 09:00 AM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where 11:00 tomorrow From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77786	From: roninscho	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

be aware the O gauge mag. is friendly with the L. B. R.  guy . ????

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77787	From: traindavid	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Hmm, wasn't one of the reasons the PE was delayed to change the tender from plastic to die-cast? As an "entry-level" set, this would have been a good one to try out the plastic steam loco idea. I agree that no one seems to be bothered by the plastic diesels, so why is the steamer line only die-cast? Granted, in the old days, the better engines were die-cast, but I think that perception is pretty much long-gone, at least in the smaller scales. As long as the level of detail and durability are not compromised, I think a plastic-boilered steamer may do great. I propose a good candidate for such an experiment, due to it's streamlining, would be an SP Daylight engine (the N&W J would also work). Both engines are large in the public's eye and either should sell very well--but that's just my "gut" feeling. Heck, with the Daylight, they already have passenger cars to match it! Actually would match better, as the PAs were used on the Shasta Daylight which had mostly slab-side cars, not fluted ones.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77788	From: trndad	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Cylindrical Hoppers

Can someone summarize for me all of the issues that the Flyonel cylindrical hoppers had?  I have several of them packed away for that time when I finally get a layout, and want to know what I may have to do to get them to run on a highrail layout.    I have a good supply of S-Helper track and currently run mostly Fyonel engines on a small oval test track.  I purchased a few of the 70 ton highrail trucks to swap out on these cars after reading something about the wheels that came on them were scale.  However I think S-Helper can handle scale wheels so perhaps that was not necessary.  What else will I need to do to run these reliably on this track? Dean

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77789	From: R G	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers

The only problem I encountered on the first issued ones were the Scale wheels.They will not track well on Flyer track and derail. Other Scale folks said that they were gauged incorrectly. I have replace the offending trucks with high rail versions and am completely satisfied.  Others also said that the car with the as purchased trucks rode to high. To me the cars look fine next to my American Model, or pacific rail shop cars. I like the cars as the graphics look great! Rich in Gettysburg.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77790	From: lenscap76	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Look at what Hornby did with their  “Design Clever” approach to less detail. Yes make a less expensive QUALITY product, that most folks can afford, and yes we would seriously consider buying it.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77791	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 4/27/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers

I bought 4 of them that I am removing the prototype name and reporting marks from but leaving the car data intact as the main color is correct for the railroad I model. I will be adding 100 ton roller bearing trucks from Smoky Mountain Model Works as the prototype for my railroad had them. I am also adding Kadee 802's. To remove the factory lettering I used Microscale Micro-sol and an ink eraser. With a little work the factory lettering came off and did not harm the paint.                                                                                               Bob Lampe                                                                                              Kalispell,MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2016 23:34:02 +000 Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Cylindrical Hoppers   The only problem I encountered on the first issued ones were the Scale wheels.They will not track well on Flyer track and derail. Other Scale folks said that they were gauged incorrectly. I have replace the offending trucks with high rail versions and am completely satisfied.  Others also said that the car with the as purchased trucks rode to high. To me the cars look fine next to my American Model, or pacific rail shop cars. I like the cars as the graphics look great! Rich in Gettysburg.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77792	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

This group has pretty much died with most moving to Face Book. I am suprised it hasn't been mentioned on the Official American Flyer FB page. Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 10:36 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Lionel plastic steam   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77793	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Plastic Steam Locomotives

I've worked in every scale from Z to "ride on" sizes and never had a problem with whatever the material was they were made from as long as they looked okay and ran reliably.   As pointed out, plastic has been THE medium of choice since it started to appear in the 1950's and allows for more detail at lower manufacturing cost.  Weight on drivers is acquired by using metal weights in the boiler as necessary, so "tractive effort" in relation to the shell materials is a "non-starter." Metal has a "charm" by connecting us to the "good old days" and so it tends to appeal mostly to collectors.  The O gauge three rail manufacturers all have backgrounds in making trains mostly for collectors since toy trains moved from being toys in the fifties and early sixties to being collectables in the seventies and onward. It seems therefore a natural move to stick with metal as it is seen as a more "quality" material. Model railroaders follow a different course, and plastic is favored.  It can carry more detail (molded on or added later) and is easier to modify as necessary to match certain prototypes.  I buy old Flyer locos in junk boxes to rebuild and avoid metal shells for the same reason.  Plastic is cheaper and easier to work with. I have always wondered why Gilbert made almost all "passenger" engines, when freight was actually always the bread and butter of railroads and even toy trains with freight cars were more varied and interesting.  I'd like to see some Moguls, Ten Wheelers, Mikados, and Consolidations with plastic shells and without all the electronics so the price could be more attractive.   Simple is also usually more reliable too as there's less to go wrong.  In a hobby which is aging, these things would seem to be a good step toward attracting new blood.  But that's just my thinking... Stumpy in Ahia   ...see ya' at the Spree in a few weeks.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77794	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: AF Train, Thursday, 28 April 2016

Attachments : "AF Train" reminder When Thursday, 28 April 2016 02:00 PM to 02:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where Van Kal & R south of Q 10.00 From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77795	From: pickycat95	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers

Dean, That depends upon your flavor of modeling:  'AF', hirail or scale.  Probably very few issues if your Flyer except for some issue with the coupler causing the cars to derail and wheels that are out of gauge. Scale and Hi-rail might have issues with floor height, Kadee coupler mounting and wheels that are out of gauge (too narrow). If you want to mount a Kadee 802 coupler directly to the body and have the car ride lower (more prototypical) you need to remove the trucks, install AM, MTH/SHS, old ACE or other truck (PRS/SSA) with a spacer between the car bolster and truck bolster. Ben Trousdale

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77796	From: Kyle	Date: 4/28/2016
Subject: Re: Plastic Steam Locomotives

One thing that Don Thompson brought up a few years ago,  when he asked Lionel why they were still using diecast for their tenders they replied that their sound system was able to produce better and louder sound from a metal as opposed to a plastic body. Kyle   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 5:16 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Plastic Steam Locomotives     I've worked in every scale from Z to "ride on" sizes and never had a problem with whatever the material was they were made from as long as they looked okay and ran reliably.   As pointed out, plastic has been THE medium of choice since it started to appear in the 1950's and allows for more detail at lower manufacturing cost.  Weight on drivers is acquired by using metal weights in the boiler as necessary, so "tractive effort" in relation to the shell materials is a "non-starter."   Metal has a "charm" by connecting us to the "good old days" and so it tends to appeal mostly to collectors.  The O gauge three rail manufacturers all have backgrounds in making trains mostly for collectors since toy trains moved from being toys in the fifties and early sixties to being collectables in the seventies and onward. It seems therefore a natural move to stick with metal as it is seen as a more "quality" material.   Model railroaders follow a different course, and plastic is favored.  It can carry more detail (molded on or added later) and is easier to modify as necessary to match certain prototypes.  I buy old Flyer locos in junk boxes to rebuild and avoid metal shells for the same reason.  Plastic is cheaper and easier to work with. I have always wondered why Gilbert made almost all "passenger" engines, when freight was actually always the bread and butter of railroads and even toy trains with freight cars were more varied and interesting.  I'd like to see some Moguls, Ten Wheelers, Mikados, and Consolidations with plastic shells and without all the electronics so the price could be more attractive.   Simple is also usually more reliable too as there's less to go wrong.  In a hobby which is aging, these things would seem to be a good step toward attracting new blood.  But that's just my thinking... Stumpy in Ahia   ...see ya' at the Spree in a few weeks.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77797	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

I am a member of facebook, but don't get any S-trains info.  Is the group under S-trains?  Will have to look them up and become 'friends' with same. tx Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 4/28/2016 03:47, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This group has pretty much died with most moving to Face Book. I am suprised it hasn't been mentioned on the Official American Flyer FB page. Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 10:36 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Lionel plastic steam   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77798	From: trndad	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Cylindrical Hoppers

Ben, thanks to you and all the others who have weighed in.  I have a smattering of everything from Gilbert to hi-rail, including some scale equipment, but I lean toward the original Flyer and/or hi-rail side of the tracks.  Once I build my layout, if my cylindrical hoppers with the hi-rail trucks installed will run reliably behind my Flyonel EL U33C or my American Models NS SD60, I'll be happy.  For that matter if my AF 303 Atlantic will pull them that works for me as well.  As long as they'll run on my track and stay upright and coupled. Dean

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77799	From: traindavid	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Group dying??

Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77800	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Plastic Steam Locomotives

I'm not sure I "buy" Lionel's story that metal tender shells give their sound system any better clarity than plastic, since most others have been using sound in plastic shells for years.  Could it be that the Lionel system is in some way "tuned" to the resonance of metal? Once again, using just common sense, I'd have to say that if others, in smaller scales especially, can make sound work very well, how can there be any advantage to metal.  To my mind this is like arguing that metal loco shells give more tractive effort, while a plastic shell with a weight in it does the same thing. Aside from collectors liking metal shells, there may also be a possibility that the older tooling for metal shells may still be in use.  If so, this begs the question of why are we paying 21st century prices for trains made with long paid for 20th century tooling?   Until forced by competition from MTH and others, Lionel did this for decades in O gauge three rail, yet set retail prices to meet the higher collector prices being paid for Post War Lionel trains, not actual manufacturing costs.   It was VERY profitable because there were NO tooling costs!   Now to be fair, I really have a soft spot in my heart for the colorful Lionel, American Flyer, Ives, Dorfan, and other old "Standard Gauge" trains of the past.  But for new manufacture, it makes sense to use new technology, especially if the product costs less to manufacture and looks better.   Stumpy Stone in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77801	From: Rick Evans	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77802	From: The Laniers	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I questioned this assessment also.   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:41 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Group dying??     Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77803	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

FROM; Alan Lambert I'm still here, but don't have anything to post yet. I check this list every day. From: "Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??   I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77804	From: Alan Smith	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to  Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in  the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you  start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated  them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible  with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive  for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and  recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77805	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Herb, Are you too far removed down canyon from a public library? Most libraries in America have free internet access and you can establish an account with you own password. Using a public computer also distances a person from spam and recording of personal computer usage. And for the friends who think they are not open to such invasion, they need to think again. Merely connecting to the ‘net is all that is required. Those robot crawlers have vays of finding you... Just a thought. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 12:51 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           I questioned this assessment also.   Herb paflyrman From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:41 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Group dying??      Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77806	From: MARY & JAMES DAVIDSON	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

try american flyer for a facebook pate On Friday, April 29, 2016 9:29 AM, "Rance Velapoldi rvelapoldi@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am a member of facebook, but don't get any S-trains info.  Is the group under S-trains?  Will have to look them up and become 'friends' with same. tx Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 4/28/2016 03:47, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This group has pretty much died with most moving to Face Book. I am suprised it hasn't been mentioned on the Official American Flyer FB page. Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 10:36 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Lionel plastic steam   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77807	From: clifma19@cox.net	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I too read the list everyday.  clifma19@...   Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone     ------ Original message------ From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [... Date: Fri, 4/29/2016 1:56 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com; Subject:Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FROM; Alan Lambert I'm still here, but don't have anything to post yet. I check this list every day. From: "Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??   I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77808	From: George Cohn	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

On 4/29/2016 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and > recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! > OK, off soapbox, back to trains. I teach computer science at the community college level and hate social media. It is used to mine your personal data and subject you to all of the spam associated with it. Yes, I have a facebook account but it exposes very little of my personal life and I only have it because of a corporation that I am involved with. Like most of the apps on your smartphone, you have to give away too much personal detail for very little benefit. Georg Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77809	From: Roy Inman	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77810	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

David and the rest of you who will post. Please don't get your panties in a bunch. Yes, this group is dying when compared to 10 years ago. First David, if you think Yahoo doesn't do the same collecting of information, then your dial up is really slow. There has never been a free lunch on the internet.  That being said, There are so many FB pages that deal with 1/64th scale trains. Not all great, but all have good and different info. It is fresh info. It is very informative much like this group used to be before the nasty Scale /Hi RAIL SPLIT.  Some of the same people who were here have moved on to Face book because it is faster getting messages and info back and forth.  Much easier posting pictures and videos than here. This group was a God send back when Paul York created it.  This group now is a small bunch and if you tend to disagree with a certain one or two you get chastised. Not for me. Everyone has an opinion and one is as good as the next. And this, is my opinion. Like it or hate it, there are a lot of truths and facts to what I say and I am sticking to it.   Sunday night chat. Hmmmmm, same 4 or 5 people every week even after not having been on it for quite a long time. Ron, Steve, David, JFred and one or two others. See you there Sunday Night. Chris B From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:41 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Group dying??   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77811	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Alan, on FB too? LOL Rick Evans, on FB too? I see you guys more there than on here.  Same with some others.  CHeck the membership numbers and see how many people are really active here from those people. Not many. Just some holding on. Hey, I am one still holding on. CB From: "Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??   FROM; Alan Lambert I'm still here, but don't have anything to post yet. I check this list every day. From: "Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??   I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77812	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/29/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Roy, I might be one of the smart ackers LOL! sorry. But yes, it is a great place and no more invasive than any where else on the internet. With Privacy setting you can control some of the problems. Also, just like Abe Lincoln once said, you can believe everything on the internet. CB From: "Roy Inman rinphoto@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 7:39 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??   FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77813	From: David Highfield	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I read this email group post daily looking for hints that might help me. I'm also on AF Facebook sites. Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77814	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

Rance, in the Search box on FB type, American Flyer, you will get a lot of recommendations. Also if interested I have a FB page titled S-Helper/American Models, 1/64th scale/gauge trains you can search and join. All are very active groups. Chris From: "Rance Velapoldi rvelapoldi@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 2:47 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Lionel plastic steam   I am a member of facebook, but don't get any S-trains info.  Is the group under S-trains?  Will have to look them up and become 'friends' with same. tx Rance Velapoldi  (Tranby, Norway) On 4/28/2016 03:47, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This group has pretty much died with most moving to Face Book. I am suprised it hasn't been mentioned on the Official American Flyer FB page. Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 10:36 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Lionel plastic steam   Hello All,   I have a question about the lack of discussion by this group on a topic that is big over on the 0 Gauge Forum.  Lionel is floating the idea of perhaps producing a fairly detailed S gauge plastic steam engine.  I though sure someone would bring the topic over here.   Does this mean the members here are also members on the 0GF or just not interested in things Lionel?  I am told Lionel is watching the discussions…   Tom Stoltz in Maine Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77815	From: Dale Smith	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I preface my comments by saying that I am a member of the American Flyer Facebook group, as well as this group.  I also visit the OGR S forum.  In addition, I organized the Gilberthotrains group on Yahoo.   Many of the criticisms of Yahoo made below are the choices of the moderators.  On my Gilberthotrains group, everything posts instantly because it is not moderated.  I check each membership request to insure that they are really interested in the subject matter and from then on they are free to post and there has never been a problem.  I allow attachments and that has enhanced a lot of posts.  I know attachments can spread viruses, but you can also avoid accidents by not driving.   It is a question of benefits vs. risks.  As to this group being a small bunch, it is a small bunch of 1820 people.  Granted only a small percentage post, but that doesn't mean the others aren't enjoying the list.  It takes both talkers and listeners to communicate.  My interest is in American Flyer - Postwar, HO, and Gilbert Prewar AF.   I am simply not interested in a lot of the posts about current production, but that's fine.  I just skim those and obviously don't post on those threads.   I did enjoy the thread about non-train stores selling AF though and a lot of others. The nice thing about Yahoo groups is that the messages are delivered to my mailbox.  I don't have to log on to a specific location as I do with the OGR S forum or Facebook.   I use an email client and have the messages sorted into a separate box for each group I belong to.   All I need to do is click on the email application.  I do get notifications of Facebook posts to the American Flyer group, and the link to "View on Facebook" is nice, but another step.   I can reply from the email, but I don't get to see the other replies. As to information gathering, I think with Yahoo, it is mostly the email address and comes from using the email.   Worst mistake I ever made was saying yes when setting up my ATT internet and they asked me if I wanted to merge my Yahoo account with the ATT account.  On Facebook, I keep a low profile and have never sent a friend request.   My only friends are those who found me on Facebook.   I keep it mainly to utilize things like the American Flyer Group.  Other than that, I don't really know what to do with it as I prefer to talk one on one with my friends or to a group that shares my interest, rather than everyone I know or everyone in the world.  I also believe that Facebook pages can peacefully co-exist with websites.   I maintain the website for the Golden Gate American Flyer Club (ggafc.org) and another member does the Facebook page.   I link to Facebook and the Facebook page links to my website.   They reach different audiences and that is fine.   As you said, one opinion is as good as another. Dale Smith On 4/29/2016 5:37 PM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote:   David and the rest of you who will post. Please don't get your panties in a bunch. Yes, this group is dying when compared to 10 years ago. First David, if you think Yahoo doesn't do the same collecting of information, then your dial up is really slow. There has never been a free lunch on the internet.  That being said, There are so many FB pages that deal with 1/64th scale trains. Not all great, but all have good and different info. It is fresh info. It is very informative much like this group used to be before the nasty Scale /Hi RAIL SPLIT.  Some of the same people who were here have moved on to Face book because it is faster getting messages and info back and forth.  Much easier posting pictures and videos than here. This group was a God send back when Paul York created it.  This group now is a small bunch and if you tend to disagree with a certain one or two you get chastised. Not for me. Everyone has an opinion and one is as good as the next. And this, is my opinion. Like it or hate it, there are a lot of truths and facts to what I say and I am sticking to it.   Sunday night chat. Hmmmmm, same 4 or 5 people every week even after not having been on it for quite a long time. Ron, Steve, David, JFred and one or two others. See you there Sunday Night. Chris B From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 12:41 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Group dying??   Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77816	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77817	From: traindavid	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Yes, my connection is so slow (average, 33K) that I don’t even need anti-virus protection! As for the Library, I have keys to the Theatre, so I don't have to worry about "hours open" to connect--but both locations are a 20 minute drive, and I avoid going except when necessary! I even bought a laptop just to pick up stuff--like tonight I downloaded a Model T Ford parts catalog. I even have a Facebook account--until their upgrade about a year ago, it WAS compatible with dial-up! I even have a website that I will probably sell the domain soon, as I cannot keep it updated, and I'm no longer certain I want the whole world to know what I do/have at home! Fortunately the URL is almost the same as a ski resort back east, so I'm hoping they might want it--cheap too! Maybe I can get a year's subscription to the S Gaugian out of the sale! :) Well, been a long day at the theatre listening to some folk with talent and some without. I call it "prison music"--the singer is behind a few bars and looking for a key. One singer was so bad we were howling to each other on the clear-com. Fortunately what happens on the Clear -Com stays on the Clear -Com. So I’m gonna call it a day--might clean some ACG wheels in the ultrasonic before I hit the hay (I just ran across a bag of them I bought at a train show a while ago--forgot I had them!).

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77818	From: srjaynes	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I think many of us are content to read the daily summaries. If questions have already been answered, we remain quiet. I don't have much to add but am cleaning and overhauling another 8 steam engines and 6 diesels. I'm toying with w posting regarding using Atlas electrics to control AF switches/turnouts and Atlas Snap Relays to replace AF Reverse Loop Relays which are getting somewhat expensive. Any takers?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77819	From: srjaynes	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Oh yes. I also visit the AF groups on FaceBook.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77820	From: racin510	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel plastic steam

I'd like to 'second' this question, how does one connect with the FB group?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77821	From: poniaj	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I can easily imagine a world without FB since I'm in it.  What do I do with all my time?  I spend time maintaining our 1922 house and yard, I do the same with my 1937 Ford that I use whenever the weather permits, I spend time with my grandson, I spend time with my lovely wife of 42 years, I visit with friends both in person and on a forum like this one, I attend train shows and car shows, I involve myself with high end car events, I "work" two days a week driving Model Ts at the Henry Ford's Greenfield Village.  In my spare time, I actually do some S scale modeling and running. If folks enjoy FB, more power to them!  Life's too short to involve yourself with things that don't interest you.  Oh yeah, I'll also be attending the upcoming Spring S Spree with my club's sectional layout.  See you guys there? Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77822	From: paul	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media

High five Jerry,    The other day I was reminded that I have not been doing/saying much on any of the groups I belong to. Once in a while I have hit the club (MVSG) mailing group, but been really quiet on the S Trains and I realized also the Crosley auto group I belong to. I am wondering though about Dale's settings, I have considered a FB account, but the only associations I have with them are negative. my grand-daughter came to visit a while back, used the wife's laptop to access her own FB and I spent a couple of evenings making the laptop run again. I admit it was likely the kid's fault but I got skeeerd. I have lots of family on FB and I don't want any of them to find me if I venture that direction. This year is my 50th high school reunion, nobody wanted to associate with me back then for various reasons, I have never been to a reunion, but they are hunting me hard this year, I'm not looking for rekindling friendships that didn't exist then, I choose who I want to communicate with for obvious reasons. The only 2 who know I am still alive are a girl who lived close back then and my doctor's receptionist, one used to tell my dad I should come, she didn't use the phone to call me. The other mentions it every time I go see the doc, she keeps me up on who has passed. I enjoyed the thread on buying and getting AF trains at non hobby places, I think that if I could get a different, weighted, can motored, plastic  unit with smoke and choo choo at a reasonable price, I probably would go stand in line. So many folks I don't want to talk with, right now I am happy right here. If I see a suggestion or trick to use when/if I get a layout or just because, I save the message or URL so I can go back later.   Paul in cool wet Dayton, OH. On 4/30/2016 3:14 AM, 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives. Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77823	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

But Jerry, you have been on social media since you joined Yahoo groups. Just saying. CB From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:14 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77824	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

Chris,   Perhaps I should have said “social networks”, but I am very sure most readers knew I was referring to Facebook, Tumblr, Twitter, Viber, Google+, Linkedin, and all the others of that ilk.  There are some very real distinctions between the individual Yahoo Groups and the aforementioned “social networks”.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 6:50 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     But Jerry, you have been on social media since you joined Yahoo groups. Just saying. CB   From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:14 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77825	From: calleytwo	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

Its along time since I made any comment on this group but can I just say this thread is no surprise. We are dinosaur collectors, builders and operators with an orphan gauge which deserved more. Unfortunately Gilbert never managed to popularise  the scale to the degree it deserved and without that commercial backup the modelling aspect fails to attract new interest.  Ever since it started it has been a group prone to insecure self navel examination. Just get on with it - enjoy it and forget about declining interest. Go for Face Book if you dont have a steam powered server - they can only hack into the information you chose to put up there. All the best to you all. Alistair McAllister ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Cc: Sent: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 13:49:33 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   But Jerry, you have been on social media since you joined Yahoo groups. Just saying. CB From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:14 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77826	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 01 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77827	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 4/30/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

From: Alan Lambert Chris, I will add this much. With this group you post a question, It goes to a moderator for approval. Then it gets posted on the page. With Facebook You ask a question on any of the train related pages(groups) you get an instant reply in most cases. At least I do. So this may be 1 reason this list is dying.   Alan Lambert   From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 5:52 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   Chris,   Perhaps I should have said “social networks”, but I am very sure most readers knew I was referring to Facebook, Tumblr, Twitter, Viber, Google+, Linkedin, and all the others of that ilk.  There are some very real distinctions between the individual Yahoo Groups and the aforementioned “social networks”.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 6:50 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     But Jerry, you have been on social media since you joined Yahoo groups. Just saying. CB   From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:14 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77828	From: traindavid	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

And most of this posting is OT too! Jerry, I am SO jealous of your "two-day-a-week Job"! How are the new '14s doing? I'm still working on my '25 so I can drive it around; my '16 needs a whole lot of work before it will be back on the road; the frame and axles are al that's done right now (and some small parts and bits). Paul, I'm a lot like you, few friends in high school (and we're talking a school with 200 kids in it, about 50 in my class. I had about 4 friends who were there for all 4 years, and a few that were there only a year or so. All but one has literally disappeared from sight! She and I have kept in touch (my last name was Dewey, her's was Dugger, so guess who usually sat behind me in most classes? We used to share boyfriend-girlfriend problems, always just friends; she had kept more in touch with the other kids we knew, but they really have "dropped off the face of the earth." )However, back to the thought I wanted to share, I did go to a 40th reunion, and was surprised at what some of the kids said they thought of me when I was in school--I had NO idea that some thought I was a "nice guy." So you might actually have an OK time at a reunion. Train content: Yep, we are an "orphan" group. ACG had a great idea--if Marx had followed the lead, S would probably be as big as O is. They both made S sized trains, but kept the 0 trucks and 3-rail track. Oh well. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77829	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 01 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77830	From: paul	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media

Dave, I probably would be considered as OK now, I worked Fri evenings and all day Sat freshman and sophomore years, signed out after lunch and worked afternoons and evenings the other two years. My dad was a city cop, folks didn't want to hang around with me, either in my wheels or worse theirs, cops kids were watched by other cops, if the kids were out, they WOULD get pulled over just to make sure we were still on the up and up, and dad knew before I got home where I was and who I was with. not that there were bad people I would have been with, they just didn't want the hassle nor "red flags" on their cars, and I don't blame them.  getting pulled over just to find out who was with you and "does your old man know where you are?" killed a good part of the evenings, the others that were not with us drove by and saw the red bubble gum machines spinning, saw whose car was pulled over, and giggled, real happy they weren't in the offending car. I was ornery as any normal kid, just had to leave the city limits to be so. one evening one daring fellow and I were stopped at the curb in a residential neighborhood, after graduating, we were smoking and joking with a couple of nice girls in there neighborhood, next morning at breakfast I got grilled about why I was there, what was I doing, and "WHO WAS THE BLONDE KID WITH ME, THE ONE WITH LONG HAIR AND SMOKING A CIGARETTE." guess mine must have been hidden and missed. it was a nice blue collar neighborhood, only about a mile from home, and dusk, not dark yet. add that to me volunteering for the draft and serving in the Nam, being married with a kid. I was a weirdo problem to associate with in the day. I didn't drink much (couldn't afford it and liked the harder stuff) nor rolled left handed doobies before, during, or after the service. Right now I am just not real sociable, fighting prostate cancer the second time when the first time they cut everything plus more out, gave me 40 beam radiation treatments, and the testosterone killing drugs that give PMS and menopause. I'm back on the drugs, they make me irritable and fat. I may go yet, take the wife in a wheelchair and be prepared to blame her if I want to walk out. I agree about Jerry P. I always wanted to drive a 3 pedal car that would stop by pressing any two, and to have to get up and be forced to play, aww I mean work like that would be a dream. someday I am going to meet him, have communicated a few times, meant to find him last year at our Spree, just didn't catch up. Jerry F, Chris got you by pulling the technical card as a trump on the social media comment, but I know he is just pulling a chain and hoping for a loud whistle sound. I'll talk behind Chris's back like he's not here. He knows his comparison is like dial-up vs a T3 at a big business, both will connect to the internet. green apples and prunes are alike too. if Yahoo starts sending my name to the "should Barbie wear a white wedding dress" group or the "is a brass door knob colder in the winter than a nickle plated lever" group, telling everyone that I am on S Trains and need lots of friends, like I understand FB does, I'm dropping Yahoo too. Right Chris??  :)   he knows I'm not going to say anything worse behind his back than I would to his face, grinning either/both times. back to train content. we are just orphans, but Lionel has brought us some nice (expensive, brittle, and undependable) stuff in the past few years, somebody told them we are beginning to retire and supposedly have a few extra bucks to blow. since the Mikado, I have accumulated a half dozen new steam engines with electronics, I love playing with them and kids at shows. I have not pulled the trigger on Legacy control, but get enough out of my Legacy engines on TMCC to keep me happy. I enjoy being the joker catching the dickens for blocking almost half way around the club layout pulling 50 cars like HO or N with several locomotives, I do it with just one. no personal layout, so MVSG was nice to let me join and come play a couple of times a year. I would like to see some mid price ranged freight motive offerings though, even a selection of critters. I always liked Lionel's out of scale 57-59 Dodge inspection car, maybe they could base one, more to scale, in the thirties or forties for us steam nuts. a rotary snow plow, an interurban. as said before, put a picture in a catalog and see if there is interest. see why I don't write often? my fingers start and don't stop until I have written a book,   paul On 5/1/2016 1:24 PM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   And most of this posting is OT too! Jerry, I am SO jealous of your "two-day-a-week Job"! How are the new '14s doing? I'm still working on my '25 so I can drive it around; my '16 needs a whole lot of work before it will be back on the road; the frame and axles are al that's done right now (and some small parts and bits). Paul, I'm a lot like you, few friends in high school (and we're talking a school with 200 kids in it, about 50 in my class. I had about 4 friends who were there for all 4 years, and a few that were there only a year or so. All but one has literally disappeared from sight! She and I have kept in touch (my last name was Dewey, her's was Dugger, so guess who usually sat behind me in most classes? We used to share boyfriend-girlfriend problems, always just friends; she had kept more in touch with the other kids we knew, but they really have "dropped off the face of the earth." )However, back to the thought I wanted to share, I did go to a 40th reunion, and was surprised at what some of the kids said they thought of me when I was in school--I had NO idea that some thought I was a "nice guy." So you might actually have an OK time at a reunion. Train content: Yep, we are an "orphan" group. ACG had a great idea--if Marx had followed the lead, S would probably be as big as O is. They both made S sized trains, but kept the 0 trucks and 3-rail track. Oh well. . . .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77831	From: snstrains	Date: 5/1/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]

Pheeeeeew! I'm exhausted....   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77832	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Bent tender step

A while back I asked this group about how to fix a bent tender step on a Hudson tender. Apologies for not getting back sooner. Several people responded with ideas, mainly a hair dryer or heat gun along with a lot of patience. Thank you all.  Well I ran that hair dryer for about ten minutes. I could still touch it with my fingers although it was quite warm. But my patience ran out. In the past I have repainted a couple of steamers with Scalecoat paints. After painting with this paint I was told to bake the parts or shells for two hours at 175 degrees. My sons tell me I get dangerous when I start to think, but I decided to try a different approach.  I figured boiling water at 212 degrees isn't that much more than 175 degrees, so I placed the end of the tender in the water for about a minute.  I was able to lift the tender by the other end with my fingers as the part that was not in the water was warm but not to hot yet. I quickly set the shell on a block of wood I had set up and very gently tapped the step backwards with a small hammer until it was straight. Then a few minutes of cooling. This process was repeated a few times. Next a needlenose plyers staightened the remaining curve ( the step was bent forward and curved inward ). It came out great and the paint wasn't even damaged. Again, my thanks! Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77833	From: paul	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media

sorry Steve, I don't know when to quit. don't talk to anybody for a week then unload on a captive audience.  :-)   p On 5/1/2016 5:57 PM, boss31@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Pheeeeeew! I'm exhausted....   Steve Blackburn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77834	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: SHS F-3 shorting plugs

Hello,     I am in need of two shorting plugs that were with the S Helper Service  F-3's . These would be excess to one's needs if the engines were used with AC power.      Also, awhile back I posted that a friend was hoping to get windshields cut in clear plastic for the Am Flyer PA's. Well months later he still has not moved forward in getting these done so it might be awhile and now I'm not even sure it will happen at all. Will send a post if and when it does.      Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77835	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77836	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Well, Tom I guess your search engine did not bring up all the other 1/64th scale groups nor the actual American Flyer FB page. I belong to about 5 different FB groups for Flyer.   As for your comment on the Confederate Flag, you obviously don't know the true History of it and thus your comment. But that is all I will say as this is not a group for political discussion. . Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 2, 2016 11:15 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Group dying??   Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77837	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

Alan,  very true. But the FB groups also have admins just in case someone gets out of line . I have been on FB 6 years now maybe a little longer and never had a problem that some fear. It is exactly the same reasoning I heard back 20 years ago when I joined the Yahoo group. I'm not sure why people are so afraid of technology change sometimes. Chris B From: "Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 8:32 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   From: Alan Lambert Chris, I will add this much. With this group you post a question, It goes to a moderator for approval. Then it gets posted on the page. With Facebook You ask a question on any of the train related pages(groups) you get an instant reply in most cases. At least I do. So this may be 1 reason this list is dying.   Alan Lambert   From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 5:52 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media   Chris,   Perhaps I should have said “social networks”, but I am very sure most readers knew I was referring to Facebook, Tumblr, Twitter, Viber, Google+, Linkedin, and all the others of that ilk.  There are some very real distinctions between the individual Yahoo Groups and the aforementioned “social networks”.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 6:50 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     But Jerry, you have been on social media since you joined Yahoo groups. Just saying. CB   From: "'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 3:14 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Group dying?? >> OT Social Media     Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives.   Jerry F.       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 29, 2016 4:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group dying??     FB is terrific! I have reconnected with old school chums and there are a bunch of model train and prototype pages with tons of cool photos. Many is the time when I have had a question about trains or anything, posted it to fb and in a couple of minutes I have dozens of good answers. Well, and a few wise akers too :) I cannot imagine a world without fb. Roy Inman on 4/29/16, 2:29 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:            IT will be a cold day in Timbutu when I go to Facebook —— Too many negatives  — I don’t need a party  line in my life. On Apr 29, 2016, at 1:26 PM, Rick Evans bassflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I’m a big Facebook person…… but I’m still here too!  lol On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:41 AM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Chris B. mentioned that "this group is dying, most having moved to Facebook." Well, I hope he's wrong as many folks won't or CAN'T go to Facebook. I'm in the latter camp, as Facebook and dial-up are not compatible--and before you start posting me about all the other options to dial-up I have investigated them and keep checking, but so far the canyon I live in is not compatible with any of them, except maybe satellite & that is too spotty and expensive for me to bother with (the neighbor tried it, said, "don't bother"). Others won't use Facebook because it exposes them to too much spam and recording of their computer usage. There's no "free lunch" with Facebook! OK, off soapbox, back to trains.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77838	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]

Attachments : COMBAT_INFAN_NICK_QB.jpg These discussions about FB remind me of hen I first joined the Yahoo group 20 years ago. Same complaints from people about Phishing, and snooping and spam LOL! Paul, you have my number on the roster sheet. Please call me. I'll help you get hooked up. Chris B From: "paul dilly@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2016 9:40 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]     High five Jerry,    The other day I was reminded that I have not been doing/saying much on any of the groups I belong to. Once in a while I have hit the club (MVSG) mailing group, but been really quiet on the S Trains and I realized also the Crosley auto group I belong to. I am wondering though about Dale's settings, I have considered a FB account, but the only associations I have with them are negative. my grand-daughter came to visit a while back, used the wife's laptop to access her own FB and I spent a couple of evenings making the laptop run again. I admit it was likely the kid's fault but I got skeeerd. I have lots of family on FB and I don't want any of them to find me if I venture that direction. This year is my 50th high school reunion, nobody wanted to associate with me back then for various reasons, I have never been to a reunion, but they are hunting me hard this year, I'm not looking for rekindling friendships that didn't exist then, I choose who I want to communicate with for obvious reasons. The only 2 who know I am still alive are a girl who lived close back then and my doctor's receptionist, one used to tell my dad I should come, she didn't use the phone to call me. The other mentions it every time I go see the doc, she keeps me up on who has passed. I enjoyed the thread on buying and getting AF trains at non hobby places, I think that if I could get a different, weighted, can motored, plastic  unit with smoke and choo choo at a reasonable price, I probably would go stand in line. So many folks I don't want to talk with, right now I am happy right here. If I see a suggestion or trick to use when/if I get a layout or just because, I save the message or URL so I can go back later.   Paul in cool wet Dayton, OH. On 4/30/2016 3:14 AM, 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Each to his/her own taste, and what works for one person will not necessarily work for another.  I am one of the individuals who thinks the negatives of social media far outweigh any conceivable positives. Jerry F.

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77839	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

From: Alan Lambert Tom, Just type in American Flyer in the search window. You should see all of the links to American Flyer trains. Alan   From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 2, 2016 10:15 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Group dying??   Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77840	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs

Hi Bud,  not sure if the shorting plugs were the same for the F'3 as the Switchers. If they are, I have 2 shorting plugs available. Chris B From: "BlackDiamondRR@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 2, 2016 7:20 AM Subject: [S-Trains] SHS F-3 shorting plugs   Hello,     I am in need of two shorting plugs that were with the S Helper Service  F-3's . These would be excess to one's needs if the engines were used with AC power.      Also, awhile back I posted that a friend was hoping to get windshields cut in clear plastic for the Am Flyer PA's. Well months later he still has not moved forward in getting these done so it might be awhile and now I'm not even sure it will happen at all. Will send a post if and when it does.      Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77841	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]

Attachments : COMBAT_INFAN_NICK_QB-77841.jpg Ha ha, you are killing me Paul! I did make the comment to get things stirred up, but only in a positive way. 20 years ago, I remember talking to guys in the club about the yahoo groups, some were extremely hesitant to join. When they did they were really happy they did. It was like when I changed over to a DC can motor from Timko in my 336, people in the club were really skeptical at first. Our club was strictly only classic AF. Although I have not been as active in the club since I moved back to Mason, I like to think that I helped the club evolve over the years.  Also, the chat on Sunday night had quite a few people compared to the last few months. So maybe my post helped a little. Maybe it didn't. I do know I am thankful for the group and the people who are in the group past and present.  But I still believe well, never mind. Chris B From: "paul dilly@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, May 1, 2016 3:08 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: OT Social Media [1 Attachment]   Dave, I probably would be considered as OK now, I worked Fri evenings and all day Sat freshman and sophomore years, signed out after lunch and worked afternoons and evenings the other two years. My dad was a city cop, folks didn't want to hang around with me, either in my wheels or worse theirs, cops kids were watched by other cops, if the kids were out, they WOULD get pulled over just to make sure we were still on the up and up, and dad knew before I got home where I was and who I was with. not that there were bad people I would have been with, they just didn't want the hassle nor "red flags" on their cars, and I don't blame them.  getting pulled over just to find out who was with you and "does your old man know where you are?" killed a good part of the evenings, the others that were not with us drove by and saw the red bubble gum machines spinning, saw whose car was pulled over, and giggled, real happy they weren't in the offending car. I was ornery as any normal kid, just had to leave the city limits to be so. one evening one daring fellow and I were stopped at the curb in a residential neighborhood, after graduating, we were smoking and joking with a couple of nice girls in there neighborhood, next morning at breakfast I got grilled about why I was there, what was I doing, and "WHO WAS THE BLONDE KID WITH ME, THE ONE WITH LONG HAIR AND SMOKING A CIGARETTE." guess mine must have been hidden and missed. it was a nice blue collar neighborhood, only about a mile from home, and dusk, not dark yet. add that to me volunteering for the draft and serving in the Nam, being married with a kid. I was a weirdo problem to associate with in the day. I didn't drink much (couldn't afford it and liked the harder stuff) nor rolled left handed doobies before, during, or after the service. Right now I am just not real sociable, fighting prostate cancer the second time when the first time they cut everything plus more out, gave me 40 beam radiation treatments, and the testosterone killing drugs that give PMS and menopause. I'm back on the drugs, they make me irritable and fat. I may go yet, take the wife in a wheelchair and be prepared to blame her if I want to walk out. I agree about Jerry P. I always wanted to drive a 3 pedal car that would stop by pressing any two, and to have to get up and be forced to play, aww I mean work like that would be a dream. someday I am going to meet him, have communicated a few times, meant to find him last year at our Spree, just didn't catch up. Jerry F, Chris got you by pulling the technical card as a trump on the social media comment, but I know he is just pulling a chain and hoping for a loud whistle sound. I'll talk behind Chris's back like he's not here. He knows his comparison is like dial-up vs a T3 at a big business, both will connect to the internet. green apples and prunes are alike too. if Yahoo starts sending my name to the "should Barbie wear a white wedding dress" group or the "is a brass door knob colder in the winter than a nickle plated lever" group, telling everyone that I am on S Trains and need lots of friends, like I understand FB does, I'm dropping Yahoo too. Right Chris??  :)   he knows I'm not going to say anything worse behind his back than I would to his face, grinning either/both times. back to train content. we are just orphans, but Lionel has brought us some nice (expensive, brittle, and undependable) stuff in the past few years, somebody told them we are beginning to retire and supposedly have a few extra bucks to blow. since the Mikado, I have accumulated a half dozen new steam engines with electronics, I love playing with them and kids at shows. I have not pulled the trigger on Legacy control, but get enough out of my Legacy engines on TMCC to keep me happy. I enjoy being the joker catching the dickens for blocking almost half way around the club layout pulling 50 cars like HO or N with several locomotives, I do it with just one. no personal layout, so MVSG was nice to let me join and come play a couple of times a year. I would like to see some mid price ranged freight motive offerings though, even a selection of critters. I always liked Lionel's out of scale 57-59 Dodge inspection car, maybe they could base one, more to scale, in the thirties or forties for us steam nuts. a rotary snow plow, an interurban. as said before, put a picture in a catalog and see if there is interest. see why I don't write often? my fingers start and don't stop until I have written a book,   paul On 5/1/2016 1:24 PM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   And most of this posting is OT too! Jerry, I am SO jealous of your "two-day-a-week Job"! How are the new '14s doing? I'm still working on my '25 so I can drive it around; my '16 needs a whole lot of work before it will be back on the road; the frame and axles are al that's done right now (and some small parts and bits). Paul, I'm a lot like you, few friends in high school (and we're talking a school with 200 kids in it, about 50 in my class. I had about 4 friends who were there for all 4 years, and a few that were there only a year or so. All but one has literally disappeared from sight! She and I have kept in touch (my last name was Dewey, her's was Dugger, so guess who usually sat behind me in most classes? We used to share boyfriend-girlfriend problems, always just friends; she had kept more in touch with the other kids we knew, but they really have "dropped off the face of the earth." )However, back to the thought I wanted to share, I did go to a 40th reunion, and was surprised at what some of the kids said they thought of me when I was in school--I had NO idea that some thought I was a "nice guy." So you might actually have an OK time at a reunion. Train content: Yep, we are an "orphan" group. ACG had a great idea--if Marx had followed the lead, S would probably be as big as O is. They both made S sized trains, but kept the 0 trucks and 3-rail track. Oh well. . . .

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77842	From: George Cohn	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying?? >> OT Social Media

On 5/2/2016 9:12 AM, Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > Alan, > very true. But the FB groups also have admins just in case someone gets > out of line . I have been on FB 6 years now maybe a little longer and > never had a problem that some fear. It is exactly the same reasoning I > heard back 20 years ago when I joined the Yahoo group. I'm not sure why > people are so afraid of technology change sometimes. Chris B The problem that I have with most of these social network pages is the data mining. It seems like today you can't even get a new app on your phone without giving away all of you contacts and location. I just feel that that is too much info to give away. I teach computer science and security is one of the issues that I teach. Too many of these social pages and apps want too much of your personal information like age, address and who you know. I feel that this is a betrayal of trust and choose to share as little as possible if I join one of them. That was the good things about mailing lists as you had a choice to share only your e-mail address and little more. Keep in mind that the 3 letter agencies monitor this stuff. How much do you trust them? Not much I'm afraid, although I have very little to hide. Hell, I'm 70 years old and even my driving record is clean as a whistle. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77843	From: traindavid	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media

"Pheeeeeew! I'm exhausted.... Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho " Been standing behind a Bus Steve?? (Confucius say man who stand behind bus get exhausted. Confucius also say man who stand in front of bus get run down.) :) Paul, wow that WAS a mouthful! I didn't live such a "colorful" life. Most of my High School days were spent working on my Model A, and in winter when it was too cold to work on the car, playing with my American Flyer--see, I really was a mis-fit!! :) David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77844	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

I don't think "closed group" means no one can join anymore.   I think it only means that you need to join to see the posts. Dale Smith On 5/2/2016 8:15 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77845	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

Closed group on FB means you need approval from the admins to join Dale. Chris From: "Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 2, 2016 2:20 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Group dying??   I don't think "closed group" means no one can join anymore.   I think it only means that you need to join to see the posts. Dale Smith On 5/2/2016 8:15 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77846	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs

Chris, I will try to find out from Don Thompson, if they are the same I'll buy them off you.     Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77847	From: bud9351	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: SHS F-3 shorting plugs

Chris, OK, will take the to shorting plugs. How much did you want for them? Email me at blackdiamondrr@... so we can communicate off list.     Thanks,      Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77848	From: Cindy Buehling	Date: 5/2/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

This is correct. We have a family page on FB that is a closed group and it just means you have to invite specific people to join. On May 2, 2016, at 7:55 PM, "Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Closed group on FB means you need approval from the admins to join Dale. Chris From: "Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 2, 2016 2:20 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Group dying??   I don't think "closed group" means no one can join anymore.   I think it only means that you need to join to see the posts. Dale Smith On 5/2/2016 8:15 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Well, I took a look at FB… the only thing I could find was ‘American Flyer Trains’ with a membership of 1,573.  It is a closed group so the only thing I could do was scroll through the members.  I never came across a familiar name, however I did notice a lot of people with Confederate flags as their backdrop.  You can count me out of any group that would allow that kind of mentality.   As for the S-Trains Yahoo group, I can’t see how a Flyer only site could kill off a group that encompass a wider range of topics… meaning including Hi-rail.   Maybe I missed something???   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77849	From: snstrains	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: OT Social Media

Nay David, I is the bus driver.....   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/2/2016 3:30:03 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   "Pheeeeeew! I'm exhausted.... Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho " Been standing behind a Bus Steve?? (Confucius say man who stand behind bus get exhausted. Confucius also say man who stand in front of bus get run down.) :) Paul, wow that WAS a mouthful! I didn't live such a "colorful" life. Most of my High School days were spent working on my Model A, and in winter when it was too cold to work on the car, playing with my American Flyer--see, I really was a mis-fit!! :) David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77850	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

<From: Alan Lambert Tom, Just type in American Flyer in the search window. You should see all of the links to American Flyer trains.Alan> I think I found it okay:   “This group is designed solely for the purpose so that members can have a place to discuss different topics of American Flyer Trains… Any questions? Please feel free to contact one of the administrators of the group listed below Christopher Burger, Tim Coe, Rich Falzini, , Donald Mills, and Gary Nessel”   <"Dale Smith" dale2680 I don't think "closed group" means no one can join anymore. I think it only means that you need to join to see the posts.>   Thanks, I do know that.  However, I would like to preview, lurk or whatever before I go through the process of joining FB.   OTOH if there were a FB group that was for Hi-rail, I would be way more interested.  I don’t do just Flyer anymore. Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77851	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying??

It would be better if the posts would be open for viewing. As far as dying is concerned model building is dying because we are dying and there are few replacements. Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77852	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: turnout tune-up

The bottom return loop of my new Ft. Wayne has track laid, rail joints soldered and feeder wires on.  Tortoise switch machines are working on the two AM turnouts in this section.  Time to test! Pushing rolling stock by hand around everything seems smooth.  But a locomotive identified a couple of "clickety" spots.  No problem.  The real mystery is the two identical AM turnouts.  Received the same day and installed the same day.  But one has an issue with the straight route with a 6-wheel truck heavyweight.  The other does not.  On the offending turnout the first wheel of the second truck hits the point rail and jumps up.  The point is tight against the rail but apparently protrudes.  My first inclination is to notch the diverging rail.  But before getting out the needle files, I thought it might be wise to check with experts. Does anyone have a systemic approach to tuning up turnouts they could share?  Any articles on-line you could recommend? Thanks! Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77853	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 5/3/2016
Subject: Re: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S

This is great news. Thanks, Mike, for sharing. I'm hopeful that one or more vendors at the NASG 2016 convention in Novi, Mich., August 10-14 will have these for sale. Mark Charles

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77854	From: paul	Date: 5/4/2016
Subject: lets talk

Chris, ok, just how tight can one set up a FB account? somebody said the other day they could see the members of a group without joining. was that for anyone to see or just general FB members not part of that particular group? that still doesn't cure my problem, if any FB member can see who belongs to a particular group, my name and ass would hang in the wind. control is a huge problem in my life, my Nam PTSD holds me close to home, I need trust and control b4 I venture outside. train shows used to kill me until I joined the club, being inside the layout is almost like being inside a room, my back is safe. I'm like the old timey gunfighter, go out to eat and unless I know who has my back, I have to have it against a wall. I know it's paranoid, but that's life, my life. I'm not afraid of Yahoo, but it seems like FB just puts too much of me out there to be ambushed, maybe I'm wrong. seems like everybody I know who is on FB bitches about it, then again, they are not always the brightest bulbs in the string. they jump in and don't take the time to study settings, many of them shouldn't have a computer, they are the ones who forward jokes with 500 e-mail addresses still attached, drives me crazy, those are the ones I want to hide from. hell if anybody from the class of 66 wants me, I live in the same house we bought in 1972. until 2 years ago my dad or brother lived in the same house that we moved into in 1956. my 3 brothers are well known enough if anyone asked them, wife (only sometimes) and her family still attend the church they started at in 1954, they lived (one sister still does live) right against the fence line of the grade school we attended, the church is only a block away and back in 61,62,63 held dances or other activities every Friday night, all the kids in the neighborhood came. I can be found, nobody has bothered, but I still don't want a whole bunch of friends all at once. I don't try to push my religion or politics on anyone and just don't wish anyone to try and convince me about theirs. Becky's health sucks and I cannot be counted on to be anywhere for sure since I am Mr Caregiver 24/7. I may stick a toe into FB if I can be sure it is on my terms, not just give FB a key to my front door. know what I mean? make sense?   paul --

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77855	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/4/2016
Subject: Re: lets talk [1 Attachment]

Attachments : COMBAT_INFAN_NICK_QB-77855.jpg Hey Paul,  I understand what you are telling me. I did not know you were dealing with the PTSD. My cousin Ron was in Nam also. Dealt with it early when he came home. Only once in all these years has he talked to me about anything that happened there.   FB could be very overwhelming at first. My suggestion is to make a FB profile and make it Private. The only thing people can see then Is what you allow your friends to see. Since you know most of the guys on the Miami Valley S-Gaugers you might start with that group first. Keep your profile private. If you don't want anyone to contact you you can set that in your privacy settings I believe. Anyone who is not your friend may be able to send a message to you, but it will go to a message box where you can see it and accept it or decline it.  You can pretty much control everything on FB. As you are on there and feel more comfortable you can join more groups as your confidence builds up.    If you have more questions let me know. Sorry it took so long to get back to you.    Also, thanks for confiding in me about things in your life. Every thing we discuss will be kept in confidence. If you ever need to talk just give me a call. 513-501-7917 Chris From: "paul dilly@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, May 3, 2016 12:57 PM Subject: [S-Trains] lets talk [1 Attachment]   Chris, ok, just how tight can one set up a FB account? somebody said the other day they could see the members of a group without joining. was that for anyone to see or just general FB members not part of that particular group? that still doesn't cure my problem, if any FB member can see who belongs to a particular group, my name and ass would hang in the wind. control is a huge problem in my life, my Nam PTSD holds me close to home, I need trust and control b4 I venture outside. train shows used to kill me until I joined the club, being inside the layout is almost like being inside a room, my back is safe. I'm like the old timey gunfighter, go out to eat and unless I know who has my back, I have to have it against a wall. I know it's paranoid, but that's life, my life. I'm not afraid of Yahoo, but it seems like FB just puts too much of me out there to be ambushed, maybe I'm wrong. seems like everybody I know who is on FB bitches about it, then again, they are not always the brightest bulbs in the string. they jump in and don't take the time to study settings, many of them shouldn't have a computer, they are the ones who forward jokes with 500 e-mail addresses still attached, drives me crazy, those are the ones I want to hide from. hell if anybody from the class of 66 wants me, I live in the same house we bought in 1972. until 2 years ago my dad or brother lived in the same house that we moved into in 1956. my 3 brothers are well known enough if anyone asked them, wife (only sometimes) and her family still attend the church they started at in 1954, they lived (one sister still does live) right against the fence line of the grade school we attended, the church is only a block away and back in 61,62,63 held dances or other activities every Friday night, all the kids in the neighborhood came. I can be found, nobody has bothered, but I still don't want a whole bunch of friends all at once. I don't try to push my religion or politics on anyone and just don't wish anyone to try and convince me about theirs. Becky's health sucks and I cannot be counted on to be anywhere for sure since I am Mr Caregiver 24/7. I may stick a toe into FB if I can be sure it is on my terms, not just give FB a key to my front door. know what I mean? make sense?   paul --

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77856	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Re: Bent tender step

Ernest, Your thinking sounds clear to me. And the successful result confirms that. Thanks for sharing. Mark Charles

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77857	From: nsupbnsf@juno.com	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Check the gauge of the'offended' wheelset first. Or is your observation consistent with most of your six wheel trucks? Alan Udy ____________________________________________________________ Affordable Wireless Plans Set up is easy. Get online in minutes. Starting at only $9.95 per month! www.netzero.net?refcd=nzmem0216

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77858	From: aleisen@juno.com	Date: 5/5/2016
Subject: Group Dying ??

Before you all start moving to facebook here is an article from Kim Komando about facebook. http://www.komando.com/tips/348588/3-facebook-scams-happening-right-now?utm_medium=nl&utm_ source=kimsnewsletter&utm_content=2016-04-30-featured_show_pick-a ____________________________________________________________ StyleBistro Her Dress Dropped Jaws At The Met Gala http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/572b3f57121793f5643f2st04vuc

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77859	From: racin510	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

I am of the impression that this group works pretty well so why bother with facebook?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77860	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk [1 Attachment]

Chris wrote:  I did not know you were dealing with the PTSD. My cousin Ron was in Nam also. Dealt with it early when he came home.   As a Viet Nam vet, I find this hard to believe.  There was no dealing with it when we came home – it wasn’t even acknowledged back then.  The only thing I remember was the campaign ‘don’t forget, hire a vet’.  I went to therapy soon after getting out of the army and there again was no mention of PTSD.  It wasn’t until the late ‘70s that it even got any press time and sometime around 2003 before the VA would even hear your case.  Once the VA recognized PTSD, if you had a CIB, you had just about zero waiting time for an interview and testing.   Ask me how I know,   Tom Stoltz in Maine   Train content: I have American Flyer trains

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77861	From: Mike Andrzejewski	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S

Hi Mark, I'm not sure if any will be at the convention, but since the Tichy S line is expanding, maybe one of the vendors will have some.  In the meantime, I've purchased Tichy items direct from Tichy.  Check at the Tichy website.  In addition to the signs, they carry doors, windows, and other details in S.   Also Bob the Train Guy is a Tichy dealer.  Bob advertises and sells primarily HO, but he sells some S items.  You can contact him at his website. Bob the Train Guy Digitrax TCS Soundtraxx Tichy Blair Line AM Models LaserKits BLMA Rapido MEC Atlas Good Luck!  Mike Andrzejewski From: "mark_h_charles@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, May 3, 2016 8:13 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: New Signs, Tools, and Windows Added to S   This is great news. Thanks, Mike, for sharing. I'm hopeful that one or more vendors at the NASG 2016 convention in Novi, Mich., August 10-14 will have these for sale. Mark Charles

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77862	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Thanks Alan. The offending trucks are in gauge.  What they have in common is that they are all Lionel heavyweights.  Everything else runs through with no problem, including original AF heavyweights and every AF and AM locomotive I have.  I have not checked the Lionel Berk as it is out having its wobble problem checked out.  So I will probably be looking for hi-rail wheelsets for the Lionel heavyweights.  Or relegating them to be admired on the shelf. I still wonder why the heavyweights run through one of the turnouts but not the other though. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77863	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/6/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

It's nice to see a face from time to time. Facebook offers that. For those of us that don't make it to shows etc. Mike   In a message dated 5/6/2016 5:04:05 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I am of the impression that this group works pretty well so why bother with facebook?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77864	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Help request from a group dying membert

Parting is such sweet sorrow, but before ya'll go over the FB cliff maybe someone can help me with a Lionel accessory problem. On one of my modules for our club layout I use several of the Lionel Gateman accessories. All of them work right except for the Wylie Coyote Ambush. When his button is pushed, Old Wylie comes out but does not go in. He just hangs outside. What I have done is is to use a button super magnet as a door stop which restricts the door opening and Wylie goes back in. Eventually the button get moved from the repeated operation by the attendees and Wylie is stuck outside. Of all the gateman accessories Wylie is the favorite of all ages. Has anyone had a similar problem with Wylie,or another gateman, and what fixes have you devised. This is really too much information for a FB post. So please respond before it is too late and thank you for even taking the limited time you have left for reading this. Yours until the end. Jack

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77865	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Tim Wrote: On the offending turnout the first wheel of the second truck hits the point rail and jumps up.  The point is tight against the rail but apparently protrudes.  My first inclination is to notch the diverging rail.  But before getting out the needle files, I thought it might be wise to check with experts. Does anyone have a systemic approach to tuning up turnouts they could share?  Any articles on-line you could recommend? Hi Tim,   What I used to do was to file the point rail at a 45° angle and also file it to make it thinner.  Doing this will prevent the wheelset from picking the point.  The other thing with Flyonel heavyweights is the gauging of the wheels.  I saw you mentioned the wheels are in gauge, but try using a ¾” scrape of plywood and see if it will fit between the wheels.  The ply is really 23/32” and is perfect to use as a spacer.  Some people use a dime which is also about 23/32”.   You might take a look at this old video, it is the second one down:  http://www.tomsturnouts.com/video/VideoTTT.html  Flyonel heavyweights are specifically mentioned.   Good luck,   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77866	From: zemouse2001	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

I agree.  I do enjoy the email forum format better for these discussion.  Facebook is certainly ok (I do use it) but not as well suited (IMHO) for topic discussions,etc.  Frankly why not have both? Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77867	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

In it's time this group was wonderful. When new things first come out on the market they work well. But improving on a product has always been a good thing.Cars, planes, trains, computers, all have a 1.0 version and then improve and keep improving for versions that look nothing like the original. I would hate to see if the first person who invented a car or boat or train never improved them what this country would be like.  If Gilbert went with status quo we would still be running trains on 3 rail. Just saying, Chris B From: "racin510@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 6, 2016 1:45 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Group Dying ??   I am of the impression that this group works pretty well so why bother with facebook?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77868	From: paul	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk

Amen Tom, PTSD didn't even have a name until later. being busy with families and jobs if we had them helped put it to the back of our minds in the beginning, but it still popped out as flashbacks, nightmares, swift mood changes and anger problems etc. it was then that post offices and McDonalds restaurants weren't safe. not knowing what it was helped give us that reputation. suicides have always been the only coping method for some. not recognizing nor admitting that something was wrong, not having the government admit we were different, having the government break it's promise to give us health (and mental) care for life, not being welcome at many VFW posts because we "weren't in a real war," jumping on a plane and being turned loose in the USA within 24 hours of leaving the combat zone, never talking to anyone nor decompressing, facing the general public with their attitude made us stay quiet and even try to hide where we had been, all these added to our distress. we believed we were right and the whole world was wrong, we had played God and decided who lived or who died on a particular day. we were confused and often acted out, multiple marriages were common. as we aged and our responsibilities became fewer, the PTSD had space in our heads to fill. now we are also facing the gifts of Agent Orange full on, many different cancers, diabetes when none has been in our family before, heart problems, bypasses, Hodgkin's disease to name a few and all seem to strike us faster, harder, and more aggressive than in the normal population. don't ask when we were in Viet Nam, it may have been just last night if we slept at all. if you haven't worn Tom's boots don't ask what it's like, it is indescribable, but he can tell you it exists. those badges and awards with fifty cents got us the same nasty cup of coffee as every one else. where was our parade? WWII and Korean vets were heroes, we were trash not to be hired nor recognized. we were taught how to fight, how to cheat to win, and some bozo wants to push our buttons? we only did the same as those heroes before us, we did what our wonderful country asked us to do. me a hero? no way, but I was a very effective soldier. addressing Tom's comment about the CIB, Combat Infantry Badge, only those soldiers with infantry training qualified to receive one after being in a combat situation. those fellows on the big guns, the ones in tanks and helicopters, the truck drivers, supply people, cooks, guards. sorry, there are many more vets I missed, but not on purpose. Air Force, Navy, especially Marines, none of them could get a CIB, no matter how much they had to fight, what's fair about that? they took incoming rounds in camp, they had enemy troops come through the wire to attack. they were attacked on the roads, Marines were among the first in the field.     my nickel, now give me three cents change.   I'm off my soapbox! I want a man cave to play with my American Flyer trains including the ones nicknamed as Flyonel products. let's get together, bring your scale trains, your DC trains, let's make them run together.  paul On 5/5/2016 9:21 AM, 'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Chris wrote:  I did not know you were dealing with the PTSD. My cousin Ron was in Nam also. Dealt with it early when he came home.   As a Viet Nam vet, I find this hard to believe.  There was no dealing with it when we came home – it wasn’t even acknowledged back then.  The only thing I remember was the campaign ‘don’t forget, hire a vet’.  I went to therapy soon after getting out of the army and there again was no mention of PTSD.  It wasn’t until the late ‘70s that it even got any press time and sometime around 2003 before the VA would even hear your case.  Once the VA recognized PTSD, if you had a CIB, you had just about zero waiting time for an interview and testing.   Ask me how I know,   Tom Stoltz in Maine   .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77869	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: letsc talk

You know what you know Tom, but you like a few others in this group who know everything, really don't know everything about everyone. For that matter, the more I here those few talk like this, it makes me realize why this group is dying.  Chris B From: "'Thomas Stoltz' tstoltz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 5, 2016 9:21 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: letsc talk   Chris wrote:  I did not know you were dealing with the PTSD. My cousin Ron was in Nam also. Dealt with it early when he came home.   As a Viet Nam vet, I find this hard to believe.  There was no dealing with it when we came home – it wasn’t even acknowledged back then.  The only thing I remember was the campaign ‘don’t forget, hire a vet’.  I went to therapy soon after getting out of the army and there again was no mention of PTSD.  It wasn’t until the late ‘70s that it even got any press time and sometime around 2003 before the VA would even hear your case.  Once the VA recognized PTSD, if you had a CIB, you had just about zero waiting time for an interview and testing.   Ask me how I know,   Tom Stoltz in Maine   Train content: I have American Flyer trains

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77870	From: srjaynes	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Chech the rim measurements of the Lionel cars. The rims may be ok deep.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77871	From: rj4010d	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Tim, You need to get the new track, wheel , & coupler gauge that Alan Smith from Hamilton oh has developed . It fits on the wheels at the point of contact with  the rail . I find my self using it VERY often , I thought I had wheel gauging under control but since he came out with this gauge I have found out other wise. A few thousands can make a big difference ! & most Lionel wheel sets are out of gauge !!! Good luck with your layout . I have mine clear around basement walls & islands in between . No room left for even a table , just a stool here & there. Miss your company & and again good luck !!.      Bob Guckian P.S. Did you ever get your RS 3 problem solved ?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77872	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 08 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 08 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77873	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Flyer fans ! This is the gauge to which Bob is making reference.  Being an old flyer guy from the 40’s  I, like many of you have fought the problems of derailing thru turnouts, etc.  I found that all wheels are NOT alike and the old accepted use of a dime for gauging is NOT accurate. I got fed up with battling the issue. In consulting with Port lines ( Doug) the only way to correctly set the wheels is to measure the spread of the wheels at the point of the flange transition. Doug offered as a good dimension for all “S” gauge wheels a space of .840” at this transition point.  I made the gauge to this specification as the inside dimension for ALL “S” gauge track is .875” no matter the type track.  The .840” spread allows for a little variance so the equipment can traverse the layout in harmony with the trackage. As noted:  The gauge helps set the axles thru wheels for a starting reference ( for installing new wheels on axles) The flange to flange spacing A reference tang to the top surface of a std flyer coupler.  (The tang can be tuned to correspond with your type couplers). Thanks To Doug this seems to work out perfectly.  Doug carries my gauge in his inventory of Flyer items as well.  Happy railroading, Hamilton Alan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77874	From: snstrains	Date: 5/7/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Why don't you check the gauge of the wheels on the second truck. If the first goes well, then........................................?   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/7/2016 2:21:26 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Tim Wrote: On the offending turnout the first wheel of the second truck hits the point rail and jumps up.  The point is tight against the rail but apparently protrudes.  My first inclination is to notch the diverging rail.  But before getting out the needle files, I thought it might be wise to check with experts. Does anyone have a systemic approach to tuning up turnouts they could share?  Any articles on-line you could recommend? Hi Tim, What I used to do was to file the point rail at a 45° angle and also file it to make it thinner.  Doing this will prevent the wheelset from picking the point.  The other thing with Flyonel heavyweights is the gauging of the wheels.  I saw you mentioned the wheels are in gauge, but try using a ¾” scrape of plywood and see if it will fit between the wheels.  The ply is really 23/32” and is perfect to use as a spacer.  Some people use a dime which is also about 23/32”. You might take a look at this old video, it is the second one down:  http://www.tomsturnouts.com/video/VideoTTT.html  Flyonel heavyweights are specifically mentioned. Good luck, Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77875	From: allscalerails	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #8 May / June 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #8  May / June 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.AllScaleRails.com Subscribe to out free email list & get notified when new issue come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join Click  HERE for Issue  http://www.allscalerails.com/ Included in this issue:  The Challenge Answered, What is Scale, How-To Scale Real Life Items Down to the Scale You Want, Artist Bruce Friesch, "Gypsy Trolley Line", How-To Rock Castings from Molds Using Hydrocal, Union Pacific's Grand Canyon Lodge, ES&NA Turntable in Eureka Spring AR Blueprints,News & New Products, Snap Shots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77876	From: racin510	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

"Just saying" what? Show me a group on Facebook that I can actually find and easily get into and is just as specifically oriented to 'S' and only 'S', and I'll look into an improved version. AC also did 2 rail because he couldn't compete in 3 rail.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77877	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/8/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 08 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 08 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77878	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: American Models Catalogs -- fw

I recently received the following > > > > > > from "Ronald Bashista" <americanmodels@...> To: "Tom Hawley" <t.hawley@...> . . . . . . . . . I have a lot of catalogs and would like to send any to anyone who may want them for shows, etc. Please make mention on the blogs or where ever you may deem approbate. Best regards Ron B < < < < < < < < tom Hawley -- Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77879	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

Think this group is dying?  Then the 0 Gauge Forum S division is just about DOA.  Two days without a single post, on the weekend, no less.  I’ll go with Paul on this one – it’s cyclical.   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77880	From: nsupbnsf@juno.com	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: S-Helper 2-8-0 Gear Replacement

Now that my NWSL replacement gear is here, has anyone done this replacement before that would be willing to share their experiences? Alan Udy Idaho Falls ____________________________________________________________ The Conservative Investor Leaked Wall Street Software Turns $1,500 Savings Into $2.7 Million Fortune http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/5731326099094326042d5st04vuc

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77881	From: attic02	Date: 5/9/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

I have not said anything with all these posts.  Consider this please.. I was a true postwar lionel fan.  I did that for 35 years.  I was even a tca chapter president.  Lionel was my thing. The new owners of Lionel are in it for the money only. They killed the real lionel model railroaders club and shoved everybody into the LCCA.  WOW.  I could not believe it.  The ultimate screw you.. I quit. I sold all my Lionel Trains.. PERIOD. I could not stand not having trains in my life.. I though.. Hey Lionel may have bought flyer in 67 but they are not postwar flyer so why not. I started last september buying flyer trains.  WOW.. With the Internet and U-tube videos why it makes learning about trains fun. I also joined this group.  I have read every line of every message. I love it..  WOW.. Lionel Trains doesn't have this at all as far as I am concerned.  I am not a quitter.  Lionel quit me.  I dumped Lionel O gauge trains. You all say you are concerned about the future of the S gauge and the American Flyer trains. Then do NOT shut this group down.  It doesn't cost anything to be a member.  You do not have to post anything.  But for those of use who are now doing S gauge and learning, it is the lifeline that we need. I do not and will never have facebook emails coming to my phone.  I look forward to reading these emails, daily. One thing is clear.  The new engines these companies are making will never be on collectors shelves in 60 years.  This is a great place to share and learn.  I am for one am not quitting reading these emails.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77882	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying?

An interesting line of discussion, but NO, S Trains is not dying.  It has become one of the most valuable resources for S gauge information and discussion over many years, serving Toy, Scale, and Hi-rail.  Less activity on some Groups?  Could it be because there are fewer hobbyists of all kinds as time goes on? Since I started to come here about 15 years ago (gee, it doesn't seem that long), the biggest upheaval was when Yahoo itself made the big technical change over Labor Day weekend a few years back.  That finished off a LOT of Groups due to the transition being SO screwed up (and biased to the latest MicroSoft product of that period) that many Group owners were no longer able to manage their Groups and shut them down.   Being into many interests, I was on 19 Groups and ran two.  Four months later there were seven left, and eventually five.  Today I am back up to being a member of nine. I have seen nothing which has endangered the popularity of the S Trains Group as much as what Yahoo itself did.  But it survived due to the hard work of the "management" guys who keep it going, and has continued to thrive because of the S gauge folks of all stripes who keep posting.  I suspect that S Trains will be around a while, at least until most of us are looking at the grass from the side with roots. Meanwhile, my wife and I have had enough trouble with social media  and it's hackers, spyware, adware, and so on, that I'll probably never go back to it.   Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"   See ya' at the Spring S Spree this coming weekend!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77883	From: william lewis	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

To the previous poster: Excellent Post. Could not have said it better myself Guys, I cant stand Facebook. It is for the young people to play games on and complain about everything... It can also get you into trouble if your friends/ co-workers / boss/ etc see your rants on Facebook.. I love S scale and love seeing all the posts in here. . I too was a Postwar Lionel collector/ operator. Wont tolerate the build to order pricing scheme. Cant understand why items are in the catalog and then cancelled. Dont do the fancy electronics. Heck anyone still using a Mac G4 from 10 years ago? nuff said about fancy electronics. Hey Lionel the way your business model is structured will only keep you afloat for a limited lifespan. Also did you ever consider that people eventually run out of room in their houses to store all of those Large trains?? Do the math. In the 90's a top notch Lionel O gauge diesel was what $300 Not today try $900 or more. Who are these people that are buying all of the $1800.00 legacy engines. Eric Siegel and a who else. Have not bought anything new from Lionel in 5 or more years. O gauge pricey huh... Yup Hey Lionel just re-built/ hot rodded a Scout steamer and in process of re-building / hot rodding a GP7 all from junk box scrap..... HA HA HA I HAVE THE REPAIR MANUALS SUCKAS!!! New Lionel trains only will have spare parts based on the defective trains that are sent back and tore down and all usable parts are sold off. Ever wonder why many parts suddenly become unavailable or out of stock on the Lionel website? Cus their arent any more parts until some sends another defective one back in. Weaver Gone, Pecos River, Gone UMD- Gone - RMT - Gone, Williams sold off to Evil Bachman. Menards A HARDWARE Store from Wisconsin is Giving the big companies a run for their money. A HARDWARE STORE. Also is now the only supplier of Tubular style track Its either S scale for me or go back to N or HO.. In five years time, I have accumulated over 100 pieces of rolling stock, three passenger sets, and 10 engines. Way more than I ever had or had room for in O gauge. . -------------------------------------------- On Mon, 5/9/16, attic02@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Group Dying ?? To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, May 9, 2016, 10:03 PM I have not said anything with all these posts. Consider this please.. I was a true postwar lionel fan. I did that for 35 years. I was even a tca chapter president. Lionel was my thing. The new owners of Lionel are in it for the money only. They killed the real lionel model railroaders club and shoved everybody into the LCCA. WOW. I could not believe it. The ultimate screw you.. I quit. I sold all my Lionel Trains.. PERIOD. I could not stand not having trains in my life.. I though.. Hey Lionel may have bought flyer in 67 but they are not postwar flyer so why not. I started last september buying flyer trains. WOW.. With the Internet and U-tube videos why it makes learning about trains fun. I also joined this group. I have read every line of every message. I love it.. WOW.. Lionel Trains doesn't have this at all as far as I am concerned. I am not a quitter. Lionel quit me. I dumped Lionel O gauge trains. You all say you are concerned about the future of the S gauge and the American Flyer trains. Then do NOT shut this group down. It doesn't cost anything to be a member. You do not have to post anything. But for those of use who are now doing S gauge and learning, it is the lifeline that we need. I do not and will never have facebook emails coming to my phone. I look forward to reading these emails, daily. One thing is clear. The new engines these companies are making will never be on collectors shelves in 60 years. This is a great place to share and learn. I am for one am not quitting reading these emails.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77884	From: racin510	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

I hope everyone who hasn't run to facebook reads this. Why go to multiple scattered groups when this one does it all?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77885	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

I am the one who posted about this group being a dying group. It was meant to suggest shutting this group down. No way No how. All I was doing was stating what I have seen over the past few years. There are some great people in this group still. I don't always agree with opinions of some and some disagree with me. It is what it is. I am really sorry I ever brought this up after some things said about me. Especially being called a racist because I have read the History of the confederate flag and made a comment about it. Anyway. Never mind. Keep on reading and enjoying your postwar AF Trains. Chris From: "attic02@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 9, 2016 11:03 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Group Dying ??   I have not said anything with all these posts.  Consider this please.. I was a true postwar lionel fan.  I did that for 35 years.  I was even a tca chapter president.  Lionel was my thing. The new owners of Lionel are in it for the money only. They killed the real lionel model railroaders club and shoved everybody into the LCCA.  WOW.  I could not believe it.  The ultimate screw you.. I quit. I sold all my Lionel Trains.. PERIOD. I could not stand not having trains in my life.. I though.. Hey Lionel may have bought flyer in 67 but they are not postwar flyer so why not. I started last september buying flyer trains.  WOW.. With the Internet and U-tube videos why it makes learning about trains fun. I also joined this group.  I have read every line of every message. I love it..  WOW.. Lionel Trains doesn't have this at all as far as I am concerned.  I am not a quitter.  Lionel quit me.  I dumped Lionel O gauge trains. You all say you are concerned about the future of the S gauge and the American Flyer trains. Then do NOT shut this group down.  It doesn't cost anything to be a member.  You do not have to post anything.  But for those of use who are now doing S gauge and learning, it is the lifeline that we need. I do not and will never have facebook emails coming to my phone.  I look forward to reading these emails, daily. One thing is clear.  The new engines these companies are making will never be on collectors shelves in 60 years.  This is a great place to share and learn.  I am for one am not quitting reading these emails.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77886	From: UNLV666@...	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: S-Helper 2-8-0 Gear Replacement

Try contacting this man: Bill Clark at billclark424@.... His ability to repair S Helper product is second to none.   In a message dated 5/9/2016 9:56:38 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Now that my NWSL replacement gear is here, has anyone done this replacement before that would be willing to share their experiences? Alan Udy Idaho Falls __________________________________________________________ The Conservative Investor Leaked Wall Street Software Turns $1,500 Savings Into $2.7 Million Fortune http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/5731326099094326042d5st04vuc

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77887	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/10/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Tim Wrote: On the offending turnout the first wheel of the second truck hits the point rail and jumps up.  The point is tight against the rail but apparently protrudes.  My first inclination is to notch the diverging rail.  But before getting out the needle files, I thought it might be wise to check with experts. Hey Tim,   Somehow I forgot about this, it is something I did frequently when I was a turnout tester.  Try turning the problem car around making the second truck now the first.  If every other piece of rolling stock you have traverses the turnout, then it is obviously something about that particular car and/or truck.   Let us know,   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77888	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Modern Freight Cars

As you are all aware, outside of the Cylindrical Hoppers Lionel has not produced any modern freight cars to go along with their SD70/ES44 engines.  An effort was made on another discussion group to come up with 5 Cars S gauge members would be willing to purchase if made  Below is that list.  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.  Please share this with others who belong to S clubs so we can include their findings.  I feel if we don't tell Manufactures what we want we can't blame them, (Lionel, MTH or American Models) for not making it.   1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)   please pick only one from the above. Thanks --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77889	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Number 1, the Modern Tank Car is my preference.  Thanks Rocco.           From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2016 12:31 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Modern Freight Cars     As you are all aware, outside of the Cylindrical Hoppers Lionel has not produced any modern freight cars to go along with their SD70/ES44 engines.  An effort was made on another discussion group to come up with 5 Cars S gauge members would be willing to purchase if made  Below is that list.  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.  Please share this with others who belong to S clubs so we can include their findings.  I feel if we don't tell Manufactures what we want we can't blame them, (Lionel, MTH or American Models) for not making it.   1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)   please pick only one from the above. Thanks   --Rocco-- Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77890	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

 ----- Original Message ----- From: passare@... [S-Trains] . . . . . . . . . . . .  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.. . . . . . > > > > > > > Great idea, but I wonder how impressed Lionel is by this sort of thing.    Anyway. my opinion and my vote  -- < < < < < < < < 1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) > > > > > > > Should be distinctly different from AM's tank car.  I personally don't need, I got lots of Iron Rail tank cars. < < < < < < < 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) > > > > > > > > Good idea too.  I made one by narrowing and lowering a Lionel ceterbeam car. < < < < < < < < 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) >> > > > > > > Also good idea, but will 89 scale ft length run on your AF layout?  < < < < < < < < 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) > > > > > > > > YES, MY VOTE.  I want TBOX cars.  See http://paul1953h.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1133029 < < < < < < < < 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) > > > > > > > > The TTX company has zillions of cars of different styles.  The most popular, the 89 footers, will be awkward on AF layouts.  .  < < < < < < < < 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) > > > > > > > > > Good modern car, but different enough from AM's covered hopper? Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michgian

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77891	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/11/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Just a question, If people are running the newer engines and running scale, would any of those be running on AF 20 inch radius track. I know I run my PA's from American Flyer on the 25 inch radius and 30 inch radius from MTH.   I understand a lot of guys still run the older AF on 20 inch radius, but would they by the new cars? Chris, Trying not to stir the pot.  From: "passare@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2016 1:30 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Modern Freight Cars   As you are all aware, outside of the Cylindrical Hoppers Lionel has not produced any modern freight cars to go along with their SD70/ES44 engines.  An effort was made on another discussion group to come up with 5 Cars S gauge members would be willing to purchase if made  Below is that list.  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.  Please share this with others who belong to S clubs so we can include their findings.  I feel if we don't tell Manufactures what we want we can't blame them, (Lionel, MTH or American Models) for not making it.   1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)   please pick only one from the above. Thanks --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77892	From: afot7	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77893	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Spring Spree

Dale Baker & I are just about to leave Lansing for the Spree.  In spite of downsizing, I found lots of stuff around the house that didn't get wholesaled off, including some real moldy oldies that will have clearance sale prices on them.   BCNU   tom Hawley

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77894	From: vu68	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Modern tank car John Z

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77895	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

I think that is an individual decision.  I run wider radius when I set my layout.  I would like the option of longer cars that are more modern.  With the R27 Switches now out I think the option for longer cars may be more acceptable then before.  Vote as to what you would buy.  I am trying to help Lionel/MTH/American Models decide where to put their next effort so that it will sell and they can make money (And at the same time make what we are willing to buy not what they want to sell) --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77896	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying

Just a couple of things here.  First off, we have a Constitutional Right to Freedom of Speech, despite the attempt of Political Correctness to stifle discussion of things that don't suit certain people.  However, we are also expected to adhere to the common sense rules of decency.  Too often I see this "verbal politeness" abused on the Internet as common decency and decorum is being lost among the younger generation.  This is mainly because they can "get away with it" online without a punch in the mouth.  Chris has as much right to speak his mind as I do (and I sometimes push the envelope to make a point as well.) Secondly, as a student of history who also has been in Talk Radio and still does a weekly internet commentary, Chris is 100% correct about the history of the "Confederate flag."  Actually the "Stars and Bars" flag was a battle flag, NOT the actual "Flag of The Confederacy."  Even in the South, where you would expect it to be racist, this battle flag is flown in respect for the dead of the Civil War and to proclaim that the people of the South are still proud. A group known as the Ku Klux Klan appropriated the battle flag for their 1924 march in Washington D.C. when over 100,000 Klansmen paraded.  That is where the racist connotation came from, not from the people of the former Confederacy.  To call the flag "racist" is to ignore actual history, just as it has been convenient to ignore the fact that the cession was really about State's Rights, and that only 9% of Southerners ever owned slaves. Here's an important final historical tid-bit that ties into trains:  The North's denser railroad network allowed Union troops and equipment (manufactured in the more plentiful factories in the North) allowed much faster transport and supply.  Meanwhile, the lesser Southern railroad network was choked and caused serious delays that in the end would cost the South the war.   It can truthfully be said that it was a "Railroad War." Like anything else in human history, events turn time and again on the personalities of the people involved.   There ARE those of us who sometimes let that personality show through with slightly rough edges.  Surely Josh Cohen of Lionel fame didn't care much for A.C. Gilbert, but it's a good thing he was allowed to do what he did!   Happy Railroading!  See ya' at the Spree! Stumpy Stone in Ahia  ...that's "Appalachian" for Ohio. :-)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77897	From: n6ojj	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

2) Centerbeam 73' car.  David McBrayer Sent from my iPad On May 11, 2016, at 10:30 AM, passare@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   As you are all aware, outside of the Cylindrical Hoppers Lionel has not produced any modern freight cars to go along with their SD70/ES44 engines.  An effort was made on another discussion group to come up with 5 Cars S gauge members would be willing to purchase if made  Below is that list.  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.  Please share this with others who belong to S clubs so we can include their findings.  I feel if we don't tell Manufactures what we want we can't blame them, (Lionel, MTH or American Models) for not making it.   1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)   please pick only one from the above. Thanks --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77898	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/12/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Something like this one ? Al On May 12, 2016, at 4:06 PM, d_mcbrayer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: 2) Centerbeam 73' car.  David McBrayer Sent from my iPad On May 11, 2016, at 10:30 AM, passare@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   As you are all aware, outside of the Cylindrical Hoppers Lionel has not produced any modern freight cars to go along with their SD70/ES44 engines.  An effort was made on another discussion group to come up with 5 Cars S gauge members would be willing to purchase if made  Below is that list.  Please vote as to which one car you would be most likely to buy if they were made for S gauge.  Please share this with others who belong to S clubs so we can include their findings.  I feel if we don't tell Manufactures what we want we can't blame them, (Lionel, MTH or American Models) for not making it.   1) Modern Tank Car (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car (73' may have issues/63' will have no issues with R20 Curves) 3) Auto Racks (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 4) 60' Boxcar (Should have no issues with R20 Curves) 5) TTX Flat Cars (May have issues with R20 curves but should be OK with R27) 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper (Should have no issues with R20 Curves)   please pick only one from the above. Thanks --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77899	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Yes.  Something like that one. --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77900	From: paul	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying

Stumpy, you and all the others that can make the spree have a great time, find that special piece you have been looking for at a real good price, get some rest being away from the everyday crap, meet and greet old friends and find a few new ones. wish I could be there.  I have followed the "group dying" thread closely and even gone back to carefully read the archives. a couple of us, Chris included have spoken off list, I took it off list so as not to air laundry in public. I have known Chris for several years, back to the days when he did his best to run a shop dedicated to 1/64th trains. there wasn't enough local trade to keep him going and he couldn't get large enough to compete by internet sales. Chris said a couple of things on list that rubbed me and at least one other real wrong, I jumped hard on Chris with both feet and accused him of having his bare hind end out for folks to see. what he said was his opinion true and slapped me like the folks who call and do their best to convince me how to vote.  Chris seemed to be pushing an agenda. I see the Stars and Bars from the historical side as important, it was never intended to upset people. around here it is being used by wannabees as the KKK used it in 1924. it has become racist as a tool to instigate, used by "rebels" who are not actually rebelling against anything, only playing the BadA game. used that way, to me it says F the USA and what she stands for, much like the swastika did to WWII and other vets, it too suffered a lot of misuse, some by innocents not understanding but often by ones wishing to cause riffs. most often the Stars and Bars are not used as an historical display.  just my opinion and others may get different mileage. some how, some way Chris took a comment about one person not wishing to be a part of a FB group where many people are using a picture of the Stars and Bars for background as calling him racist.  as for him being called any names, on list anyhow I can find no such accusations in the archives, I didn't remember seeing one so I went back and searched. the battle guidon was not a part of my original rant on Chris, but he and I have discussed it since, he claims not to be using it on his page and I believe him. he was the first to use the word "racist,"  I don't know why but hope he will share his reasons. I see the group slowing as and hope it is just a normal spring lull. sure FB has taken some thunder but "dying" is a strong word.   paul rinehart On 5/11/2016 5:22 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Just a couple of things here.  First off, we have a Constitutional Right to Freedom of Speech, despite the attempt of Political Correctness to stifle discussion of things that don't suit certain people.  However, we are also expected to adhere to the common sense rules of decency.  Too often I see this "verbal politeness" abused on the Internet as common decency and decorum is being lost among the younger generation.  This is mainly because they can "get away with it" online without a punch in the mouth.  Chris has as much right to speak his mind as I do (and I sometimes push the envelope to make a point as well.)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77901	From: daleminard	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Memphis, Tennessee Area

I'm heading to the Memphis area next week for a couple of months and was wondering if there's any model railroad related stores, places or sites anyone would like to recommend I check out. Thanks, Dale Minard San Diego, CA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77902	From: njma41	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

This group isnt dying.  I read the stuff that is posted daily.  As I post this I have my mom's china cupborard (Curio) filled up with my best pieces of American Flyer.  Top to Bottom.  plus more tucked away in my attic.  Sure I have some lionel trains too...I have just as much flyer if not more than Lionel.  Keep on collecting!!  Nick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77903	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Memphis, Tennessee Area

Lots or live railroads and rail yards are in the southwestern  area and lots of live RR on the Mississippi River too. IC had a hump yard in President island and it should still be there now. You can also visit Elvis too.  Sent from my iPhone On May 13, 2016, at 1:03 PM, daleminard@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I'm heading to the Memphis area next week for a couple of months and was wondering if there's any model railroad related stores, places or sites anyone would like to recommend I check out. Thanks, Dale Minard San Diego, CA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77904	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Rocco,  I’ll soon have the parts to make a std flat car into a similar car.   In design and production pending.   Alan PS         For the love of trains ——— I’m not ready to throw in the towel  ——- !!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77905	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/13/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

Ladies and gentlemen. In a moment of thought,  I was wandering how Flyer (1/64 ) railroading was doing in the grand scheme of model railroading. Who better to ask than the major player in 1/64 railroading parts and goodies than Port lines Hobbies.  Per Doug the hobby is growing not dying as some would indicate. The trend is to buy the newer products that are on the market. The sad part is the new products will not be around in 60 years like the old rough and ready ACG products.  So, one could say the interest in the older “S” gauge is waining.  There is a couple ways to look at this trend.    1. It’s good for 1/64 railroading in general.  The scale still has the interest to many in the general public. It’s the right size for creating a layout where space is somewhat limited, yet not so delicate that a young family with         children can still enjoy the hobby without fear of handling the cars, etc. 2. The down side ( initially) will be lack of interest in the older S gauge items —  the market price will suffer as a result of this lack of interest.   However, long term, as the new hobbyist become engaged in our beloved 1/64       gauge the interest in the historic side of flyer will evolve and will bring some back to the table for such items.     I’ll add a reflection:  We old guys grew up during the heyday of railroading - 40’s  & 50s even into the early 60’s.  We remember the dream of someday being in command of the fire breathing beast that ruled the rails. The smell of coal smoke bellowing out of a big steamer, the spinning of steel drivers , the sound of the steam whistle wailing far off in the night,  Train terminals full of travelers, Hobo’s, track gangs driving spikes and moving rail sections all the a common chant, the caboose bringing up the rear, signal torpedoes strapped to the rails going off under the weight of a locomotive, high speed passenger trains, mail handling coaches. These are a few of the things WE remember.   Times change — there is no longer a dream among the youth of today to be a railroad engineer.  Now railroading is no more that a pair of powerful diesels that hum down the track.  NO flare for any dramatic visual effects either in sight or sound.   The good—- cleaner motive power. The Bad —- youth robbed of the sights and sounds we enjoyed.  The Ugly — Massive iron beast with the heart of a fire breathing dragon.  TIme marches on and waits for no one.     JUST saying, Old Alan On May 13, 2016, at 9:28 AM, njma41@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: This group isnt dying.  I read the stuff that is posted daily.  As I post this I have my mom's china cupborard (Curio) filled up with my best pieces of American Flyer.  Top to Bottom.  plus more tucked away in my attic.  Sure I have some lionel trains too...I have just as much flyer if not more than Lionel.  Keep on collecting!!  Nick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77906	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Re: Group Dying ??

From: Alan Lambert          fort Wort, Texas Alan, You answered everyone's question. The older ACG flyer is giving way to the newer offerings. I don't have any Hobby shops that stock any of the older or newer Flyer. my club "Lone Star Flyer Club sets up at or 2 Plano, Texas Train shows each year. We have 2 or 3 dealers that sell AC Gilbert, and our club member that sells American Models Trains. Sometimes I get lucky and find Some older Flyer, But most of my new comes from American Models. I do have a small home layout that I can run my trains on.  Thanks from another old Alan   From: "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 13, 2016 7:53 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Group Dying ??    Ladies and gentlemen. In a moment of thought,  I was wandering how Flyer (1/64 ) railroading was doing in the grand scheme of model railroading. Who better to ask than the major player in 1/64 railroading parts and goodies than Port lines Hobbies.  Per Doug the hobby is growing not dying as some would indicate. The trend is to buy the newer products that are on the market. The sad part is the new products will not be around in 60 years like the old rough and ready ACG products.  So, one could say the interest in the older “S” gauge is waining.  There is a couple ways to look at this trend.    1. It’s good for 1/64 railroading in general.  The scale still has the interest to many in the general public. It’s the right size for creating a layout where space is somewhat limited, yet not so delicate that a young family with         children can still enjoy the hobby without fear of handling the cars, etc. 2. The down side ( initially) will be lack of interest in the older S gauge items —  the market price will suffer as a result of this lack of interest.   However, long term, as the new hobbyist become engaged in our beloved 1/64       gauge the interest in the historic side of flyer will evolve and will bring some back to the table for such items.     I’ll add a reflection:  We old guys grew up during the heyday of railroading - 40’s  & 50s even into the early 60’s.  We remember the dream of someday being in command of the fire breathing beast that ruled the rails. The smell of coal smoke bellowing out of a big steamer, the spinning of steel drivers , the sound of the steam whistle wailing far off in the night,  Train terminals full of travelers, Hobo’s, track gangs driving spikes and moving rail sections all the a common chant, the caboose bringing up the rear, signal torpedoes strapped to the rails going off under the weight of a locomotive, high speed passenger trains, mail handling coaches. These are a few of the things WE remember.   Times change — there is no longer a dream among the youth of today to be a railroad engineer.  Now railroading is no more that a pair of powerful diesels that hum down the track.  NO flare for any dramatic visual effects either in sight or sound.   The good—- cleaner motive power. The Bad —- youth robbed of the sights and sounds we enjoyed.  The Ugly — Massive iron beast with the heart of a fire breathing dragon.  TIme marches on and waits for no one.     JUST saying, Old Alan On May 13, 2016, at 9:28 AM, njma41@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: This group isnt dying.  I read the stuff that is posted daily.  As I post this I have my mom's china cupborard (Curio) filled up with my best pieces of American Flyer.  Top to Bottom.  plus more tucked away in my attic.  Sure I have some lionel trains too...I have just as much flyer if not more than Lionel.  Keep on collecting!!  Nick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77907	From: traindavid	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Group dying? ant other stuff that came up.

Hmm, some folks seemed to think I took offense at Chris' posting, mostly because I CAN'T do Facebook--not I did not say I wouldn't do it, but my internet connection just doesn't LET me do it. When I'm somewhere with my laptop I can access it--but do so cautiously!! No, I like that Chris brought this up, it has resulted in a lot of thoughtful postings. Unfortunately it also upset a few members. That's probably not unavoidable in a group this size! I recently sent a slightly political joke to an old friend and she took offense to it--ooops, I just thought it was kinda funny (mostly about how used to be you couldn't drink the water in Mexico & now you can't drink it in Flint. . .). As to the "Bars & Stars" yes, it once represented a group who rebelled for States' Rights, but has taken on a different connotation in most folks minds--it didn't help that the Duke brothers painted it on the roof of their car either! Other symbols have changed meaning over the years; the Swastika was an early native American symbol (granted, the legs went the other direction), but the Nazis changed its connation, probably forever. the 1960s "Peace" symbol had earlier uses too, that had nothing to do with peace. So things change with time--even our enjoyment of old time railroading will be changing--Many, many folks today think that wonderful plume of steam racing down the tracks is a big sign of pollution! Never mind that it's mostly water vapor, or low temperature combustion gases (which have a far less impact on the environment than the high-temperature combustion gasses of internal combustion engines, but we don't see them!). So there is public pressure to NOT run any steam! The public's perception is tainted by "enviro-nuts" who oftentimes do not have scientific basis in their beliefs. It's not the same world I grew up in! I am now off to the Sacramento Valley AF club meeting where I'm to give the "program." I'm going to talk on the many variations of the ACG Atlantic locomotive, why most of the changes were made and (I believe) it is the most changed engine of any of ACGs steam locomotive line. Being the bottom-line, economy model, and probably the largest group made, that makes sense! Run 'em if ya got 'em! :) David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77908	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 15 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 15 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77909	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

As of this evening 5-14-16 the voting is as follows:   1) Modern Tank Car 23% 2) Centerbeam 73' Car/ 63' Car 15.4% 3) Auto Racks 30.8% 4) 60' Boxcar 23% 5) TTX Flat Cars 3.9% 6) Pullman Standard 4750 CUFT PS-CD2 covered hopper 3.9%   Please continue to vote.is you have note done so already.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77910	From: beebear	Date: 5/14/2016
Subject: Great S Spree show!!

Well how did everyone do at the S Spree? I myself was lucky enough to score a great deal on 24533 Service car with everything intact and would give it an Excellent condition for  $30. I also bought 4 right and left hand AM manual switches from Tom Hawley but I think I forgot to pick up the free book he was handing out  for the large payment I made on the switches. With any luck “maybe” he could send it to me??   There was a lot more stuff I wanted to purchase, just have to get my layout up and running first.   Very nice layouts to see AF running on. It gave me a lot of ideas for mine.  I did see Terry Stone’s layout but didn’t get a chance to stop and chat. I saw a couple guys from our local train club.  All in all we had a very good day!!   John Frankforther Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77911	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Sorry for the delay in my reply.  I was traveling for work, couldn't reply from the office and the Send button wouldn't work on the iPad at night.  Strange. Anyway, the Lionel heavyweights will not go through the straight route in no matter which way they turn.  Sometimes they derail and sometimes just a major clunk and hop. I never thought of using 3/4" (23/32") ply for a gauge.  There is plenty of that around from cutting sub-roadbed.  Next step will be to order a proper track and wheel gauge.  I'll check the gauge again today, adjust and report back.  Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77912	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 15 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 15 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77913	From: Thomas Stoltz	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying ??

<Especially being called a racist because I have read the History of the confederate flag and made a comment about it.>   This keeps coming up, yet no one has shown the origin of this name calling.  I can’t even find a post where it is inferred.  There seems to be two threads about this and I’ve looked them both over.  I probably missed something so if anybody could enlighten me (on list or off) I would appreciate it.    Thanks,   Tom Stoltz in Maine

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77914	From: rj4010d	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Tim, There are all kinds of " thickness " & shapes of wheels out there . When you measure " back to back "  with what ever object you bring that variation into play. Like I stated before, Alan's new track gauge measures at the point of contact with the rail.. Bob Guckian

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77915	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

 ----- Original Message ----- From: passare@... [S-Trains] . . . . . . .Vote as to what you would buy.  I am trying to help Lionel/MTH/American Models decide where to put their next effort. . . . . . . . > > > > > > > > Good luck to this project.  I spoke to Ron Bashista of AM this weekend and he mentioned that 50 ft boxcars are not selling as well as one would hope, considering that Lionel has the two modern engines out in many realistic paint schemes.  My sales have indicated the same.  Ron's perception, he told me several years ago, is "Modern doesn't sell."   And how about the 3-bay covered hoppers, 50 ft boxcars, and Gunderson "Husky Stack" container cars by Des Plaines Hobbies?  They may represent cars a little old for the 21st century, but they're not that ancient for the Lionel locomotives.  Is everyone who's calling for modern cars running those?    If they do anything modern, Lionel would most likely do something they've already done in O Scale.  I have a paper & ink 2014 Lionel O gauge catalog in front of me and it has an O scale section with full O scale 86 ft hi-cube boxcars and 89 ft O scale autoracks.    I can't find the Lionel O gauge catalog in their web pages right now, but that doesn't mean it's not there.  If you can find it, have a look.   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77916	From: Edward Loizeaux	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Lost & Found Help Needed

Friends..... The USPS recently "lost" a large box with 18 S scale freight cars. No explanation, no apology, hardly any communication at all. Insurance check was quite prompt. One person has speculated that theft, rather than loss, was at work here. But nobody really knows anything factual. On the assumption that S scale stuff will eventually find its way to a convention, swap meet, eBay, club meeting, hobby shop or elsewhere, I am posting the contents here in the hope that if someone runs across these items they will let me know promptly. Please feel free to print this message and pass it around to your friends or other online places. I have been told that the police and eBay are very good at dealing with these kinds of situations. Your eyes and ears at work on my behalf will be most appreciated. Thank you.......Ed L. 1-650-962-1577 or Loizeaux@... CONTENT DESCRIPTIONS Most, but not all, cars have Kadee HO couplers and NWSL non-magnetic scale wheels installed. This a good identifier that the cars are mine. Some cars have the standard wheels/couplers, but these are in the minority. Most cars are not weathered, but a few are. They were packed in individual foam bags placed into a wine shipping box with 18 individual compartments each sized for a bottle of wine. 40' box cars 1. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 2. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 3. PRS DRGW cookie box, white 4. PRS SP Overnight, aluminum 5. AF NH orange 6. AM Rutland, yellow & green 7. PRS NP, green 8. PRS NH, orange 9. PRS GN, red 34' covered hoppers 2-bay 10. NASG/Overland Lehigh Valley, gray, brass 11. SHS B&M, gray 12. SHS Polyborchlorate (sp?), gray 13. SHS NYC, gray 14. SHS ATSF, red 15. SHS SOO, red 50' covered hoppers 3-bay 16. SHS ATSF, gray 17. SHS Bakelite, white & red 53' gondola 18. AM KOPPERS, white (striking custom paint job) --- END OF LIST ---

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77917	From: garydmccullah	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Rocco,    Based on my local shoreline railroad, I have to vote for the center beam flatcar with the 60 foot bad as alternate (if that is allowed).   Have you run this over to the SScale list for their input? Gary McCullah Farmington, AR

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77918	From: racin510	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Group dying ??

Why don't we just drop this over worked subject before it starts running people away from the group?! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77919	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed

What state was it shipped out of and where was the delivery state ? Did they say where it was lost/stolen in ? Sent from my iPhone On May 15, 2016, at 4:15 PM, 'Edward Loizeaux' Loizeaux@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Friends..... The USPS recently "lost" a large box with 18 S scale freight cars. No explanation, no apology, hardly any communication at all. Insurance check was quite prompt. One person has speculated that theft, rather than loss, was at work here. But nobody really knows anything factual. On the assumption that S scale stuff will eventually find its way to a convention, swap meet, eBay, club meeting, hobby shop or elsewhere, I am posting the contents here in the hope that if someone runs across these items they will let me know promptly. Please feel free to print this message and pass it around to your friends or other online places. I have been told that the police and eBay are very good at dealing with these kinds of situations. Your eyes and ears at work on my behalf will be most appreciated. Thank you.......Ed L. 1-650-962-1577 or Loizeaux@... CONTENT DESCRIPTIONS Most, but not all, cars have Kadee HO couplers and NWSL non-magnetic scale wheels installed. This a good identifier that the cars are mine. Some cars have the standard wheels/couplers, but these are in the minority. Most cars are not weathered, but a few are. They were packed in individual foam bags placed into a wine shipping box with 18 individual compartments each sized for a bottle of wine. 40' box cars 1. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 2. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 3. PRS DRGW cookie box, white 4. PRS SP Overnight, aluminum 5. AF NH orange 6. AM Rutland, yellow & green 7. PRS NP, green 8. PRS NH, orange 9. PRS GN, red 34' covered hoppers 2-bay 10. NASG/Overland Lehigh Valley, gray, brass 11. SHS B&M, gray 12. SHS Polyborchlorate (sp?), gray 13. SHS NYC, gray 14. SHS ATSF, red 15. SHS SOO, red 50' covered hoppers 3-bay 16. SHS ATSF, gray 17. SHS Bakelite, white & red 53' gondola 18. AM KOPPERS, white (striking custom paint job) --- END OF LIST ---

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77920	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

Fellas, IF Bob says my  “Ficus track, wheel and coupler gauge”  Is good U can believe it.  If anyone is interested U can contact me off yahoo or direct.     Remember IF U DON’T LIKE IT SEND IT BACK.  I guarantee MY stuff to operate as intended.  The Proof is in the pudding.  I made these for the very reason that is being discussed.   It comes with an illustration sheet to explain the different functions.  Bob puts one under his pillow at night  for safe keeping. Cheers, Alan Smith in Hamilton,OH  On May 15, 2016, at 4:40 PM, bjg@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Tim, There are all kinds of " thickness " & shapes of wheels out there . When you measure " back to back "  with what ever object you bring that variation into play. Like I stated before, Alan's new track gauge measures at the point of contact with the rail.. Bob Guckian

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77921	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Auto transport car for new auto/car delivery.  Sent from my iPhone On May 15, 2016, at 4:05 PM, 'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:    ----- Original Message ----- From: passare@... [S-Trains] . . . . . . .Vote as to what you would buy.  I am trying to help Lionel/MTH/American Models decide where to put their next effort. . . . . . . . > > > > > > > > Good luck to this project.  I spoke to Ron Bashista of AM this weekend and he mentioned that 50 ft boxcars are not selling as well as one would hope, considering that Lionel has the two modern engines out in many realistic paint schemes.  My sales have indicated the same.  Ron's perception, he told me several years ago, is "Modern doesn't sell."   And how about the 3-bay covered hoppers, 50 ft boxcars, and Gunderson "Husky Stack" container cars by Des Plaines Hobbies?  They may represent cars a little old for the 21st century, but they're not that ancient for the Lionel locomotives.  Is everyone who's calling for modern cars running those?    If they do anything modern, Lionel would most likely do something they've already done in O Scale.  I have a paper & ink 2014 Lionel O gauge catalog in front of me and it has an O scale section with full O scale 86 ft hi-cube boxcars and 89 ft O scale autoracks.    I can't find the Lionel O gauge catalog in their web pages right now, but that doesn't mean it's not there.  If you can find it, have a look.   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77922	From: Roger Haag	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed

Hello, I wonder if the wine shipping carton instead of a nondescript carton was part of the reason for the heist?  The compartments are perfect for protection, but a thief took a chance on wine being the contents, even though, as most thieves are stupid enough, as this one certainly was, to not perceive that the carton was not heavy enough for wine bottles??  I use cartons that do not give any impression of value.  What a terrible loss for the much anticipated arrival of eighteen cars!  Hope they show up and I will certainly keep an eye out.  Trains have surfaced in the past, Yours in the hobby, Roger Haag. �� Sent from my iPhone On May 15, 2016, at 7:54 PM, Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   What state was it shipped out of and where was the delivery state ? Did they say where it was lost/stolen in ? Sent from my iPhone On May 15, 2016, at 4:15 PM, 'Edward Loizeaux' Loizeaux@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Friends..... The USPS recently "lost" a large box with 18 S scale freight cars. No explanation, no apology, hardly any communication at all. Insurance check was quite prompt. One person has speculated that theft, rather than loss, was at work here. But nobody really knows anything factual. On the assumption that S scale stuff will eventually find its way to a convention, swap meet, eBay, club meeting, hobby shop or elsewhere, I am posting the contents here in the hope that if someone runs across these items they will let me know promptly. Please feel free to print this message and pass it around to your friends or other online places. I have been told that the police and eBay are very good at dealing with these kinds of situations. Your eyes and ears at work on my behalf will be most appreciated. Thank you.......Ed L. 1-650-962-1577 or Loizeaux@... CONTENT DESCRIPTIONS Most, but not all, cars have Kadee HO couplers and NWSL non-magnetic scale wheels installed. This a good identifier that the cars are mine. Some cars have the standard wheels/couplers, but these are in the minority. Most cars are not weathered, but a few are. They were packed in individual foam bags placed into a wine shipping box with 18 individual compartments each sized for a bottle of wine. 40' box cars 1. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 2. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 3. PRS DRGW cookie box, white 4. PRS SP Overnight, aluminum 5. AF NH orange 6. AM Rutland, yellow & green 7. PRS NP, green 8. PRS NH, orange 9. PRS GN, red 34' covered hoppers 2-bay 10. NASG/Overland Lehigh Valley, gray, brass 11. SHS B&M, gray 12. SHS Polyborchlorate (sp?), gray 13. SHS NYC, gray 14. SHS ATSF, red 15. SHS SOO, red 50' covered hoppers 3-bay 16. SHS ATSF, gray 17. SHS Bakelite, white & red 53' gondola 18. AM KOPPERS, white (striking custom paint job) --- END OF LIST ---

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77923	From: wcbeverly	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Slim Gauge Guild Open House 6/5 & 6/7

The Slim Gauge Guild Model RR Club would like to invite you to their open house Sunday June 5th from 10am to 6pm and Tuesday June 7th from 6pm to 10pm.   The Slim Gauge Guild is located on the South East corner of Raymond and Del Mar in Old Town Pasadena CA. The address is 300 S. Raymond, Pasadena CA. 91105   The club features two layouts in a 2000 sq. ft. basement. The HO/HOn3 layout has a Colorado theme and centers around Salida in the 1920s as the track goes up the Black Canyon and enters Cimarron Colorado. From there the track joins the Rio Grande Southern part of the layout with Ophir and the Gallagher Loop.   The S/Sn3 layout has a California high country theme with massive mountains and high bridges. The upper level has a West Side Lumber logging scenes.   Please ask about membership. With membership you will receive a door key that will allow you to come down and run trains or work on the layout whenever you want.   Come join us. Admission is always free.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77924	From: snstrains	Date: 5/15/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

And I have mine on a key chain....Super tool   Steve Blackburn SnS Trains Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/15/2016 6:06:55 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:  Bob puts one under his pillow at night  for safe keeping. Cheers, Alan Smith in Hamilton,OH

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77925	From: tennsgauger	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Trying to contact Rhett Graves of Huntsville Alabama

Rhett, please contact me regarding S scale decals you expressed an interest in.  The email I have for you bounced,     -  Earl Henry, Nashville, TN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77926	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Back from the Spree

We are, I hope, all safely back from the Spring Spree in Strongsville OH. The organizers, the Cuyahoga S Gauge Club, had some scheduling difficulties. . . .They told us the hotel had unilaterally withdrawn, until noon Friday, a contracted room There were a lot of dealers with tables full of AF and other brands of S products. Kathy Nimelli & son James were selling some of the late Tom Nimelli’s trains. Ron Bashista and Joe Calamia were there with 2 tables of American Models products. Their new products included three new paint schemes for their GG1 locos. These were one all blue in Conrail livery and two black in Penn Central paint schemes. They also had a new variation on the Budd passenger cars, a dome car. The domes were lit and one could see seats in the domes (supply your own people). These will apparently be available in every road name the other Budd cars come in. Not surprisingly there was no official representation of Lionel or MTH. Des Plaines Hobbies was also not represented, so we will have to keep waiting to find out what the rumored "Thrall Gondola" is. In my quick tour around the halls, I saw no one with the new MTH TOFCs, and not much DPH/SSA goods.   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Mich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77927	From: rpassarette	Date: 5/16/2016
Subject: Re: Modern Freight Cars

Thanks Tom, The selection of cars was based on what people suggested to be considered on another forum.  I used that to lock down the list and not keep it open ended, but rather focus on a select few cars.  The comment that Modern cars won't sell is interesting but tainted be the fact that until a few years ago we did not have modern engines in S.    As more  SD70's and ES44's sell, the need for modern cars will grow.  To keep S growing we need more diversity and selection not less.  At least this is the way I feel (as well as others).  Lionel backed off after the Cylindrical hopper fiasco where they messed up the trucks and made it un appealing to 2 groups (Scale and non scale).  Instead of admitting that this cost them sales they backed off more modern cars.  The real mistake is that they did not take to time to find out what their customers wanted.  Instead they made the decision for them.  What I am trying to do here is show them that there is a market if they make the right cars that people want. --Rocco--

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77928	From: Edward Loizeaux	Date: 5/17/2016
Subject: Lost & Found Help Needed

Friends..... The USPS recently "lost" a large box with 18 S scale freight cars. No explanation, no apology, hardly any communication at all. Insurance check was quite prompt. One person has speculated that theft, rather than loss, was at work here. But nobody really knows anything factual. On the assumption that S scale stuff will eventually find its way to a convention, swap meet, eBay, club meeting, hobby shop or elsewhere, I am posting the contents here in the hope that if someone runs across these items they will let me know promptly. Please feel free to print this message and pass it around to your friends or other online places. I have been told that the police and eBay are very good at dealing with these kinds of situations. Your eyes and ears at work on my behalf will be most appreciated. Thank you.......Ed Loizeaux,  1-650-962-1577 or Loizeaux@...     Loizeaux  (aht)  SBC  (Global)  /daht/  net CONTENT DESCRIPTIONS Most, but not all, cars have Kadee HO couplers and NWSL non-magnetic scale wheels installed. This a good identifier that the cars are mine. Some cars have the standard wheels/couplers, but these are in the minority. Most cars are not weathered, but a few are. They were packed in individual foam bags placed into a wine shipping box with 18 individual compartments each sized for a bottle of wine. 40' box cars 1. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 2. PRS B&O Sentinel, blue & silver 3. PRS DRGW cookie box, white 4. PRS SP Overnight, aluminum 5. AF NH orange 6. AM Rutland, yellow & green 7. PRS NP, green 8. PRS NH, orange 9. PRS GN, red 34' covered hoppers 2-bay 10. NASG/Overland Lehigh Valley, gray, brass 11. SHS B&M, gray 12. SHS Polyborchlorate (sp?), gray 13. SHS NYC, gray 14. SHS ATSF, red 15. SHS SOO, red 50' covered hoppers 3-bay 16. SHS ATSF, gray 17. SHS Bakelite, white & red 53' gondola 18. AM KOPPERS, white (striking custom paint job) --- END OF LIST ---

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77929	From: tbennerohio	Date: 5/18/2016
Subject: Re: turnout tune-up

I have mine on order.  It should be here in a few days.  In the meantime the dial calipers will fill in.  Don't know why I didn't think of that before. The offending 6 wheel truck wheelsets measure 0.825" tread to tread pretty consistently.  After adjusting one to 0.840" it rolls through the turnout nicely.  My conclusion is that the points had nothing to do with the clunk and hopping through the turnout.  It was the back of the wheel on the opposite side hitting the guardrail.  Just a guess. Another conclusion is that despite wanting to go scale, getting hi-rail flanges to track reliably is probably at the limit of my abilities. Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77930	From: srjaynes	Date: 5/18/2016
Subject: Re: Lost & Found Help Needed

To help find these items, where were they shipped from, and what was the destination?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77931	From: traindavid	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: 499 won't come out of its shell!

HI all, I am Stumped! (no, nothing to do with Stumpy, although he might have the solution) Have a 499 NH Electric, took the big  through-the-roof shell screw out, but the shell refuses to let go of the body--it acts like its glued to the nose; the frame is loose in the middle, but won't budge from the nose. Don't want to damage the shell, so am asking for advice!  I even put a screwdriver through the windshield hole and pried the frame away from the roof, but no go!  Any suggestions?? Thanks all!!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77932	From: snstrains	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

Kinda hard to diagnose cancer via the internet.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/19/2016 3:23:14 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HI all, I am Stumped! (no, nothing to do with Stumpy, although he might have the solution) Have a 499 NH Electric, took the big  through-the-roof shell screw out, but the shell refuses to let go of the body--it acts like its glued to the nose; the frame is loose in the middle, but won't budge from the nose. Don't want to damage the shell, so am asking for advice!  I even put a screwdriver through the windshield hole and pried the frame away from the roof, but no go!  Any suggestions?? Thanks all!!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77933	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/19/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

mare sure all the screws are out...   In a message dated 5/19/2016 5:21:03 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Kinda hard to diagnose cancer via the internet.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/19/2016 3:23:14 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HI all, I am Stumped! (no, nothing to do with Stumpy, although he might have the solution) Have a 499 NH Electric, took the big  through-the-roof shell screw out, but the shell refuses to let go of the body--it acts like its glued to the nose; the frame is loose in the middle, but won't budge from the nose. Don't want to damage the shell, so am asking for advice!  I even put a screwdriver through the windshield hole and pried the frame away from the roof, but no go!  Any suggestions?? Thanks all!!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77934	From: race944t	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

If you have removed the large screw from the top, remove the truck side frames and make sure you don't have any of the traditional diesel frame to body screws.  I have seen some with one or two screws.  If you don't have any screws connected, CAREFULLY take a dental pic or very small blade screwdriver and place it between the sheet metal frame and body.  Then slightly move the frame outward to relieve the tension.  Sometimes the frame itself can act like a locking spring washer and until you break that friction with the body it will appear stuck.  Hope this works. "Banker" Bill Clark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77935	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

As i recall, there is a tab as part of the base (front) that goes into a slot in the shell nose.  To release slide the shell forward and lift.  Does the shell slide forward??  al From: "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2016 5:22 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!   mare sure all the screws are out...   In a message dated 5/19/2016 5:21:03 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Kinda hard to diagnose cancer via the internet.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 5/19/2016 3:23:14 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HI all, I am Stumped! (no, nothing to do with Stumpy, although he might have the solution) Have a 499 NH Electric, took the big  through-the-roof shell screw out, but the shell refuses to let go of the body--it acts like its glued to the nose; the frame is loose in the middle, but won't budge from the nose. Don't want to damage the shell, so am asking for advice!  I even put a screwdriver through the windshield hole and pried the frame away from the roof, but no go!  Any suggestions?? Thanks all!!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77936	From: Thomas Barker	Date: 5/20/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

There is an indentation (slot) in the non-motor end of the shell and a tab on the chassis that fits into this slot. Pull down on the motor end of the chassis and slide the chassis back out to remove the chassis. Tom Thomas B Barker 1223 Lake Point Drive Webster, NY 14580 (585) 265-4015 tbbeqa@... Your Guide in the World of Gilbert American Flyer S Gauge Trains

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77937	From: Ted Walton	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

David, There are a couple photos on ebay of a sold AF 499 (see llink below) with the shell off. You can see the front tab. Ted http://www.ebay.com/itm/Postwar-American-Flyer-499-New-Haven-EP-5-1956-57-Electric-Locomotive-Pantograph-/121983909407?hash=item1c66cebe1f%3Ag%3A3UgAAOSwWntXM8Wh&nma=true&si=B81JKiUBYBZt1hDu3TH4XRJsTvQ%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 At 04:58 AM 5/21/2016, you wrote: >HI all, I am Stumped! (no, nothing to do with >Stumpy, although he might have the solution) >Have a 499 NH Electric, took the >big through-the-roof shell screw out, but the >shell refuses to let go of the body--it acts >like its glued to the nose; the frame is loose >in the middle, but won't budge from the nose. >Don't want to damage the shell, so am asking for >advice! I even put a screwdriver through the >windshield hole and pried the frame away from >the roof, but no go! Any suggestions?? Thanks all!!  --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77938	From: traindavid	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

Hi all, Thanks for the suggestions. Yes, we removed the truck sideframes and looked for additional screws. Looked inside the cab windows for screws or other fasteners. I suspect it is as Bill Clark suggested, the frame is locked to the front nose--but we even flexed the frame a bit, which should have released that tension. Dental pick is a good idea, however the locomotive is still at the friend's house and not handy for me to try these ideas--I will send them on to him, in case he's not reading the list. Yes, do not want to pry at the tab end of the chassis--a sure way to break out the bottom of the shell nose there! I'm not new to this game, so was/am stumped at this one. BTW, has anyone documented the different versions of the Electric frame? I think I've seen 3 different versions, with different locations for the rear nose light bulb socket--this is not counting the change for the two-step late reverse unit.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77939	From: traindavid	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: New vehciles & trailers for layout

Hi all; I just got a mail-order catalog from DiecastDirect, an internet shopping company showing some upcoming 1/64 vehicle releases coming next month, mostly, it appears, from Greenline; some of the neat things, and the main reason I'm posting this, are three Vintage Travel Trailers!! One is a Shasta trailer (very much like the one Linda's family went to Alaska with back in the late 1960s) another is a small airstream trailer (these were pretty much unchanged in looks for decades, so lottsa time periods there), and a small teardrop trailer. There's also a number of Volkswagen bugs and vans listed (including a few with Surfboards--Cowabunga dude!) and there's even a pink Caddy so Elvis can be driving down your street. That one is also available in Black if you want the Mafia, or the Men in Black to be chasing him. . . I also like that these are mostly around the $6 range, as I AM cheap! I have no connection with these folks, I just buy layout stuff from them now and then--and NO, I haven't started the layout, but when I do, I will need parking lots and streets and used car dealers for all this stuff! Oh, train tracks?? on a train layout??? :) So far I only have found one '48 Tucker, so maybe I'll need "Honest John's Used Cars" to be selling it as "This Week's Special!" since my layout will be more in the late 50s time frame (Steam & Diesel co-existing, even if only temporarily). Have to have ONE Tucker, as my dad put down a deposit on one, and I met the designer, Alex Tremuls who told me that if they'd had 2 more weeks they would have had 1,000 cars out of the plant, and there would have been no question of their legitimacy (which, after a long trial, they were vindicated, but by then all the investors were gone, as well as the plant (repossessed by the US government)); but they were held up waiting on some parts, so only 50 cars made it out--basically the pre-production assembly line test cars. But I am straying far from the original reason for my post, and far from S trains stuff. Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77940	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 22 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 22 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77941	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/21/2016
Subject: Re: New vehciles & trailers for layout

Thanks for the heads up Duck! Trainnut From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2016 5:13 PM Subject: [S-Trains] New vehciles & trailers for layout   Hi all; I just got a mail-order catalog from DiecastDirect, an internet shopping company showing some upcoming 1/64 vehicle releases coming next month, mostly, it appears, from Greenline; some of the neat things, and the main reason I'm posting this, are three Vintage Travel Trailers!! One is a Shasta trailer (very much like the one Linda's family went to Alaska with back in the late 1960s) another is a small airstream trailer (these were pretty much unchanged in looks for decades, so lottsa time periods there), and a small teardrop trailer. There's also a number of Volkswagen bugs and vans listed (including a few with Surfboards--Cowabunga dude!) and there's even a pink Caddy so Elvis can be driving down your street. That one is also available in Black if you want the Mafia, or the Men in Black to be chasing him. . . I also like that these are mostly around the $6 range, as I AM cheap! I have no connection with these folks, I just buy layout stuff from them now and then--and NO, I haven't started the layout, but when I do, I will need parking lots and streets and used car dealers for all this stuff! Oh, train tracks?? on a train layout??? :) So far I only have found one '48 Tucker, so maybe I'll need "Honest John's Used Cars" to be selling it as "This Week's Special!" since my layout will be more in the late 50s time frame (Steam & Diesel co-existing, even if only temporarily). Have to have ONE Tucker, as my dad put down a deposit on one, and I met the designer, Alex Tremuls who told me that if they'd had 2 more weeks they would have had 1,000 cars out of the plant, and there would have been no question of their legitimacy (which, after a long trial, they were vindicated, but by then all the investors were gone, as well as the plant (repossessed by the US government)); but they were held up waiting on some parts, so only 50 cars made it out--basically the pre-production assembly line test cars. But I am straying far from the original reason for my post, and far from S trains stuff. Run 'em if ya got 'em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77942	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Back from the Spree

I had planned to write earlier, but several problems have gotten in the way, including  ongoing breaks in Internet service by Crumcast.   Once again, we had a good time, and we always enjoy old friends and talking to new folks (yes, there are a few new people coming into S!)  It's good to see everyone again because we've had to cut  down to only two shows a year in recent years.  Despite several problems dealing with the Holiday Inn, the Cleveland area club did a pretty good job.  Cindy and I are members of the H.I. Rewards Club and sent in a somewhat less than glowing report about this location. I especially want to thank the many people who helped me sell off what remained of an old friend's S layout.  We made over $250. for George to spend on popcorn and other goodies at the nursing home on Movie Night!  The look on his face when we handed over the money was well worth it!  He sends his thanks to all who helped him out! We had some minor problems with the new layout which has some scenery and scratch built structures, and uses all PikeMaster track.  Dropping it while unloading at Strongsville did some damage to the track, but overall the layout ran well for being made with low grade and well used track!  (I had spent three weeks cleaning and de-rusting a couple of boxes of old track to come up with what I used.)  Painting the rails and ties and settling the track into ballast fooled a lot of people who asked what kind of track it was! Of course, for me, no Spree would be complete without trolling the vendors for possible future projects.  Under the table "junk boxes" have become increasingly scarce, and prices for "junk" have climbed.  I think they've caught on to the "Mad Butcher" lurking in Ohio!   Even so, I managed to unearth a few tasty items to rebuild and customize.  If there was anything good about my Internet interruption problems, it's that I have already gotten a good start on these projects. My thanks to the folks of the Cuyahoga Valley S Gaugers for job well done under trying circumstances.  Good job! Stumpy Stone in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77943	From: traindavid	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Re: 499 won't come out of its shell!

Ted, thanks for the ebay link with the good photos. The tab is on the non-motor end (back?) and it shows the motor end without any tabs, just the screw hole at the top (and it appears the headlight wire was pinched by the body on this one --something to watch out for when putting a shell back on! That is, BTW, a very nice condition example, the sliders show almost no wear, and the shell is very, very nice, I can see why it bid so high. I would call that frame the "normal" version with the headlamp socket mounted vertically, I have also seen them mounted on the 45 degree area of the frame, and also vertically. Perhaps ACG was trying to avoid "headlight bulb melt" on the shell (some shells have factory applied tin foil to act as a heat shield). So far still no luck on shell removal--I'll keep you posted! I do wonder if someone glued things together for some reason. . . . . And I thought cracked out steamer shell screw holes were a pain!! :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77944	From: sageviehe@att.net	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: American Flyer 12B transformer

I understand that this transformer was not one of their best. What would member of the group recommend as a replacement and source of the replacement. The unit I have has a short. Thanks! George S

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77945	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 22 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 22 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77946	From: Art Cooper	Date: 5/22/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer

Hi George   Gilbert produced several dual transformers in addition to the 12B   18B    2 x 95w = 190w 30B    2 x 150w = 300w 22090     2 x 175w = 350w   The 18B is fairly common while the 30B and 22090 are less so.  Alternately consider using 2 model 22035 transformers, a single unit, which is essentially 1/2 of the 22090, which is more common than its dual counterpart. I believe that the 22090 and 22035 were the last large capacity model transformers produced by Gilbert.   The Lionel ZW is another dual option, 275w.   All can be had via Ebay   Good Luck in your search!   Best Regards,   Art Cooper North Texas       From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2016 12:32 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] American Flyer 12B transformer     I understand that this transformer was not one of their best. What would member of the group recommend as a replacement and source of the replacement. The unit I have has a short. Thanks! George S

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77947	From: Sage Viehe	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer

Thank you!!! George

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77948	From: racin510	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer

Perhaps a 15B for a simple operation; much nicer to use and more power. There's one on Ebay for Buy Now for $26.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77949	From: chuck_7612	Date: 5/23/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer 12B transformer

I like my recently purchased refurbished lionel KW which is dual control w/ 190W. The push buttons for reverse are very convenient.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77950	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 5/24/2016
Subject: June/July 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ The Buffalo & Chautauqua Railroad Adding to a Spartan Railgon Kit A Railroad Car Outbuilding What's on Your Workbench Relocating A Railroad S West 11 Shows, Meets and So Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77951	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77952	From: snstrains	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

A bit more realistic than white. Steve B.   In a message dated 5/25/2016 2:54:16 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77953	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

From: Alan Lambert   I would be. It would look more realistic.   Alan   From: "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 9:58 AM Subject: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77954	From: racin510	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Sure, more visible is good. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77955	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Yep, same here. on 5/25/16, 4:53 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           From: Alan Lambert   I would be. It would look more realistic.   Alan          From: "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com>  To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com  Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 9:58 AM  Subject: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID               Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77956	From: markaflyer	Date: 5/25/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I'd be very interested to try it out. Mark Anderman Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (4) Have you tried the highest rated email app? With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage. Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group New Members 1 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77957	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Well I'm there, just working out a few issues. It does not stain or leave any crud (Tech Term) anywhere.Will keep you guys posted, after a few trials. Mike   In a message dated 5/25/2016 3:17:39 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   From: Alan Lambert   I would be. It would look more realistic.   Alan   From: "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 9:58 AM Subject: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77958	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I'll keep you in mind Mark...As soon as I get more of the stuff I need...It's a bit hard to get & I only got enough to make a few 4 oz bottles...     In a message dated 5/25/2016 6:34:33 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I'd be very interested to try it out. Mark Anderman Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (4) Have you tried the highest rated email app? With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage. Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group New Members 1 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77959	From: bowlsalot2	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I'd try it.  Neil in Oregon On May 25, 2016, at 7:58 AM, "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77960	From: Al Baker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

YES !! Al Baker Portland   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 7:59 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID     Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77961	From: alhbaker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

YES !!! Al Baker Portland

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77962	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Count me in for it! Jack Ruth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77963	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Are you referring to the color of the smoke or the color of the fluid? Vic Bereskin >  Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Wed May 25, 2016 1:54 pm (PDT) . Posted by: rudypenne Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid? Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501 >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77964	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Yes, add me to the list Carey Probst Pennsyltucky RR Chief Microferroequineologist On 5/25/2016 10:58 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77965	From: Ben E. Colley	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Yes, count me in…   Ben Colley Hallsville Missouri Follow the Flag!   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 9:59 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID     Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77966	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

It would be the color of the smoke, not the fluid. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:47:12 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Are you referring to the color of the smoke or the color of the fluid? Vic Bereskin >  Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Wed May 25, 2016 1:54 pm (PDT) . Posted by: rudypenne Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid? Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501 >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77967	From: yorktown26	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77968	From: chuck_7612	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Me too

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77969	From: reefma_99	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Add me to the list as well.      On 5/25/2016 10:58 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77970	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77971	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I will let you guys know when I have it ready. I'm about 2 weeks out at this time, Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:49:30 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Me too

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77972	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77973	From: Lon Walker	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

For what purpose?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77974	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Dan,   You are probably correct.  Inhaling this, or ANY other toy train smoke is very likely not beneficial to one’s short or long-term health.  HOWEVER - Even water, which is vital for life, is toxic if you consume too much of it.    This leads us to the Swiss philosopher Paracelsus who is considered to be the “father” of the study of toxicology, and who is credited with first expressing the concept that "All things are poison and nothing is without poison; only the dose makes a thing not a poison."  In other words, “The poison is in the dose”.    So the real question is, how much of that material can one inhale over what time period (acute or chronic exposure?) before that material will cause harm?  The information very likely exists as toxicological information from the manufacturer (possibly on the material safety data sheet), but since the material is a secret, we have no way of knowing.   If you have COPD, you would likely be more susceptible than a healthy individual to any damaging effects and should probably avoid it.     Just my opinion.   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 2:32 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID     Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77975	From: leflak	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Yes, count me in, specially if it doesn’t stain or leave any “crud” Raul Catta Buenos Aires Argentina

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77976	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

OK, I've done some testing with White tissues & paper towels & there is NO particulate mater deposited from smoke fluid. I sure you know that cigarrettes (SP) leave a really heavy amount of particulate matter in each usage. My opinion only is that you would get far more harm for one smoke that you would get from a months running your trains.  Sorry about your COPD, I got mine from 2nd hand smoke & am death on smoking...Ask anyone I run into.   In a message dated 5/26/2016 3:18:33 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77977	From: traindavid	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Well, this sounds like it would be perfect in a diesel with smoke, especially an Alco PA! Now out here in oil fired territory, a black or grey stack meant you were wasting fuel! Mike, this should be a real hit with more than just the S community. What's it mean when white smoke comes out of your diesel exhaust stack? A new Pope was just elected!! :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77978	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Some people think it might be more realistic, including me. Roy Inman on 5/26/16, 5:35 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           For what purpose?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77979	From: Roy Inman	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I have occasional need to use smoke generating machines in my photo shoots. There are at least two different types of smoke fluid, one that dissipates rapidly and another that hangs in the air longer. Some talent (models) cannot handle breathing either one. I have two family members who become immediately congested when I turn on the smoke generator on the AF Challenger. While at some level of exposure the mist is probably toxic to everyone, in my experience not everyone  has an immediate and negative reaction. Roy Inman on 5/26/16, 6:32 PM, S-trains at S-trains@yahoogroups.com wrote:           Dan,   You are probably correct.  Inhaling this, or ANY other toy train smoke is very likely not beneficial to one’s short or long-term health.  HOWEVER - Even water, which is vital for life, is toxic if you consume too much of it.    This leads us to the Swiss philosopher Paracelsus who is considered to be the “father” of the study of toxicology, and who is credited with first expressing the concept that "All things are poison and nothing is without poison; only the dose makes a thing not a poison."  In other words, “The poison is in the dose”.   So the real question is, how much of that material can one inhale over what time period (acute or chronic exposure?) before that material will cause harm?  The information very likely exists as toxicological information from the manufacturer (possibly on the material safety data sheet), but since the material is a secret, we have no way of knowing.   If you have COPD, you would likely be more susceptible than a healthy individual to any damaging effects and should probably avoid it.     Just my opinion.   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 2:32 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID    Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77980	From: Alan Smith	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77981	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Mike: I would probably be interested in gray smoke. Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway)  I do have a shipping address in the US (well, actually 3 addresses). On 5/26/2016 19:53, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77982	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Keep in mind that everyone will have a different opinion as to the color.   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:55:11 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77983	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

This is about what I have done...   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:55:11 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77984	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

OK Rance...To be fair to this group,any others interested, please contact me off list at Anormal1@...  Thank You   In a message dated 5/26/2016 6:25:42 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike: I would probably be interested in gray smoke. Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway)  I do have a shipping address in the US (well, actually 3 addresses). On 5/26/2016 19:53, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77985	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I was always under the impression that a locomotive belching black smoke, even diesels(except Alcos, of course, they Always emitted high volumes of black smoke), was a signature of a locomotive either accelerating or under a heavy load. I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to have our locomotives belching dark smoke, cause it would. For more years than I can remember I have wished for just this breakthrough. What I am saying is to make sure it is 100% safe before you place it on the market or at least place a warning until you know for sure. I would most definitely hate to see you lose everything in a lawsuit for simply trying to improve the hobby. You can fix your product but recovering from a huge lawsuit isn't as easy. Just some advice from someone who considers all in this group as friends.   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77986	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

From: Alan Lambert I always thought that when more power was added, the blacker the smoke was. watch vidio's on You Tube, you will see what I mean.   From: "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 8:09 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Keep in mind that everyone will have a different opinion as to the color.   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:55:11 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77987	From: bud9351	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: AF PA windshield info

I must apologize for the notice I posted late last year regarding a friend who wanted to have clear plastic window inserts made to fit AF PA's. While I had quite a few responses with potential orders if and when they got made. I am sad to report that nothing has been done thus far. This is not my project as I originally stated but the friend is just too busy to pursue it at this time. If this changes I will repost.      Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77988	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Well, my take on this is that, as children and all the way up to the present day, if you had an engine that smoked and you ran your trains, you’ve been breathing it in for years.  And, guess what?  We’re still here.  So, my logical guess is that if any of the tree-huggers out there thought that breathing in a little of that smoke was anything similar to sucking on a cigarette, we would have known by now and they would have already tried to ban its use.   Bruce DeGailler, Sr.     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 2:32 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID     Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77989	From: rick flaherty	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Attachments : Bugs P-38[5].png Well said.  It’s all a matter of preference. Rick "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 6:09 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Keep in mind that everyone will have a different opinion as to the color.   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:55:11 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 77990	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I tend to agree. I would say you need to have determined if the stuff is toxic or not. For instance is it dangerous to someone like me who has congestive heart failure.....would it be harmful to them. Just thinking ahead to prevent a possible lawsuit if it is.....I might suggest a disclaimer THIS PRODUCT COULD CAUSE POTENTIAL HEALTH PROBLEMS. UNTIL FURTHER TESTING HAS BEEN DONE USE WITH CAUTION.                                                                Bob Lampe                                                                Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77991	From: rick flaherty	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Life is toxic.  You eventually die from it. Rick From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 3:33 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   I tend to agree. I would say you need to have determined if the stuff is toxic or not. For instance is it dangerous to someone like me who has congestive heart failure.....would it be harmful to them. Just thinking ahead to prevent a possible lawsuit if it is.....I might suggest a disclaimer THIS PRODUCT COULD CAUSE POTENTIAL HEALTH PROBLEMS. UNTIL FURTHER TESTING HAS BEEN DONE USE WITH CAUTION..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77992	From: JOHN METZGER	Date: 5/26/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID [1 Attachment]

To clean the boiler stack sand is shoveled into the firebox. This cleans the engine, but causes the stack to bellow dark black smoke. So when the Frisco 1522 steam engine did run by's we did two. One with no sand for light gray smoke and one with sand put into the fire box to cause dark black smoke.   Sent from my iPhone On May 26, 2016, at 9:28 PM, rick flaherty flick23@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Well said.  It’s all a matter of preference. Rick <Bugs P-38[5].png> "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits". Albert Einstein From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "anormal1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 6:09 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] RE: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Keep in mind that everyone will have a different opinion as to the color.   In a message dated 5/26/2016 5:55:11 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   HUM, If my memory serves me correctly.  The only time an engine should belch black or dark gray smoke is when the engineer is force feeding the firebox will too much fuel (Coal or Oil).  A clean burning fire ( the hottest) will burn a very pale gray to white, with the white being mostly steam exhaust from the cylinders.  This is done on excursions to charm the public. —- “Gee LOOK Dad at the black smoke” There has to be and old engineer out there to correct my memory IF I’m wrong. Just saying, Hamilton Alan On May 26, 2016, at 1:53 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: My testing shows that it is right about the color of the combo of steam & coal. Mike   In a message dated 5/26/2016 10:08:44 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike, I think this stuff would fly off the shelves. Can anyone imagine their big boys, challengers Mallets etc. coming done down the pike belching dark gray smoke, just like the real thing !!!   This is a major development !! Please let me know, as I would love to high light this on our club layout. thanks, Dennis Caruso,  CT S Gaugers. <Bugs P-38[5].png>

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77993	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Bob, I think that having no particulate matter coming from the smoke fluid, & coupled with the fact, that a cigarette has far more particulate matter, I'd be safe..Mike     In a message dated 5/26/2016 7:40:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I was always under the impression that a locomotive belching black smoke, even diesels(except Alcos, of course, they Always emitted high volumes of black smoke), was a signature of a locomotive either accelerating or under a heavy load. I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to have our locomotives belching dark smoke, cause it would. For more years than I can remember I have wished for just this breakthrough. What I am saying is to make sure it is 100% safe before you place it on the market or at least place a warning until you know for sure. I would most definitely hate to see you lose everything in a lawsuit for simply trying to improve the hobby. You can fix your product but recovering from a huge lawsuit isn't as easy. Just some advice from someone who considers all in this group as friends.   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77994	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Here is a Material Safety Data sheet (MSDS) for plain white mineral oil:  http://www.chemistry.mcgill.ca/msds/msds/8042-47-5.pdf   The “health effects” from the materials used in the smoke fluid are likely to be similar.   Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77995	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Interesting question. But train buffs have been using the smoke fluid for years and years. I know I can only run maybe 1 engine with smoke at a time as my wife and I both have asthma. Her complaint is the smell of the cedar. But I love it. So I bought a Christmas Pine scent for when she runs the trains for guest if I am not home. Also we have our layout in a small crammed basement with no way to vent the smoke except turning the fan on to the furnace which is right next to the layout.   I also will use a fan on low in the basement to help move the fresh air and we seem to do just fine.   Can you just imagine getting a 2 chamber smoke unit that both the regular in one chamber and the grey in the second, controlled by legacy so you have both coming out at different times or together just like the real engines do?  Nice to see every ones ears pop up on this thread. I feel alive again! ( Just a joke now guys) Chris, CBtrainnut From: "Daniel Waskes dwaskes@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 5:32 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Group, Someone has to ask. I might as well be the wet blanket. What does this stuff do to your lungs? I quit smoking tobacco eight years ago, why would I want to inhale this stuff? It can't be good for you to do it. Especially, if you have some youngsters in your house breathing it in or if you have COPD like I do? Just wondering? Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77996	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Oh so well said Rick! I would also say, and I have my health problems , but if you have a health issue like COPD, Congestive Heart failure, Asthma, we should all be careful as to what we  breathe in, in our daily lives. Not just our Hobby. It's up to us to protect ourselves. Chris, CBtrainnut From: "rick flaherty flick23@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 11:21 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Life is toxic.  You eventually die from it. Rick From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 3:33 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   I tend to agree. I would say you need to have determined if the stuff is toxic or not. For instance is it dangerous to someone like me who has congestive heart failure.....would it be harmful to them. Just thinking ahead to prevent a possible lawsuit if it is.....I might suggest a disclaimer THIS PRODUCT COULD CAUSE POTENTIAL HEALTH PROBLEMS. UNTIL FURTHER TESTING HAS BEEN DONE USE WITH CAUTION..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77997	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info

In the past i have ordered the PA  window inserts from Doug Peck at Portlines and probably still have several.  Does he no longer carry them?? Al Paolozzi From: "BlackDiamondRR@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2016 6:21 PM Subject: [S-Trains] AF PA windshield info   I must apologize for the notice I posted late last year regarding a friend who wanted to have clear plastic window inserts made to fit AF PA's. While I had quite a few responses with potential orders if and when they got made. I am sad to report that nothing has been done thus far. This is not my project as I originally stated but the friend is just too busy to pursue it at this time. If this changes I will repost.      Bud Rindfleisch

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77998	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID [1 Attachment]

I had asked a simple question about the toxicity of the smoke. That's all. This has led to many unneeded lectures by the righteously indignant smoke proponents who viewed this as an opportunity to hammer me. Citing philosophers, life experiences, personal philosophy, etc.? Give me a break. You can rest assured I will never bother any of you with product safety questions again. Save your proselytizing view points and life philosophy for somebody else. I didn't ask to be flamed or denigrated by a group of so-called experts. Thank you. Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 77999	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Mike,    Thanks for that info. Until I know for sure it is absolutely 100% safe I will use it with caution. BTW coming up on 13 years since I smoked my last cigarette. I can thank Agent Orange for the congestive heart failure.     Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 26 May 2016 22:45:36 -0400 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Bob, I think that having no particulate matter coming from the smoke fluid, & coupled with the fact, that a cigarette has far more particulate matter, I'd be safe..Mike     In a message dated 5/26/2016 7:40:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I was always under the impression that a locomotive belching black smoke, even diesels(except Alcos, of course, they Always emitted high volumes of black smoke), was a signature of a locomotive either accelerating or under a heavy load. I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to have our locomotives belching dark smoke, cause it would. For more years than I can remember I have wished for just this breakthrough. What I am saying is to make sure it is 100% safe before you place it on the market or at least place a warning until you know for sure. I would most definitely hate to see you lose everything in a lawsuit for simply trying to improve the hobby. You can fix your product but recovering from a huge lawsuit isn't as easy. Just some advice from someone who considers all in this group as friends.   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78000	From: Charlie Vlk	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Whoever is doing the Dark Gray Smoke Fluid should keep in mind that BLI and MTH HO locomotives now have smoke units. I would contact both of those companies to see if they would be interested in having the fluid packaged for their resale. Or, at a minimum, direct market to the HO market as it may result in significant extra sales volume. Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78001	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Lighten up.  It was a reasonable discussion and nothing I read implied any denigration of anyone. Differing viewpoints does not constitute flaming or denigration. Luckily I still have my flame proof driving suit from my track days. Carey On 5/27/2016 12:43 PM, Daniel Waskes dwaskes@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I had asked a simple question about the toxicity of the smoke. That's all. This has led to many unneeded lectures by the righteously indignant smoke proponents who viewed this as an opportunity to hammer me. Citing philosophers, life experiences, personal philosophy, etc.? Give me a break. You can rest assured I will never bother any of you with product safety questions again. Save your proselytizing view points and life philosophy for somebody else. I didn't ask to be flamed or denigrated by a group of so-called experts. Thank you. Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78002	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Thank You, Mike   In a message dated 5/27/2016 1:30:49 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Whoever is doing the Dark Gray Smoke Fluid should keep in mind that BLI and MTH HO locomotives now have smoke units. I would contact both of those companies to see if they would be interested in having the fluid packaged for their resale. Or, at a minimum, direct market to the HO market as it may result in significant extra sales volume. Charlie Vlk

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78003	From: racin510	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Sounds like some operators need to just turn off their smoke units! With all the potential legal ramifications I'm sure Mike is paying attention and his lab will create smoke that is as safe as the usual stuff. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78004	From: hugoroundhouse	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Bob - Here we are pulling up on another Memorial Day.  Thanks for your service. Jim Ensign From: "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: "S-Trains" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 12:53:06 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Mike,    Thanks for that info. Until I know for sure it is absolutely 100% safe I will use it with caution. BTW coming up on 13 years since I smoked my last cigarette. I can thank Agent Orange for the congestive heart failure.     Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 26 May 2016 22:45:36 -0400 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Bob, I think that having no particulate matter coming from the smoke fluid, & coupled with the fact, that a cigarette has far more particulate matter, I'd be safe..Mike     In a message dated 5/26/2016 7:40:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I was always under the impression that a locomotive belching black smoke, even diesels(except Alcos, of course, they Always emitted high volumes of black smoke), was a signature of a locomotive either accelerating or under a heavy load. I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to have our locomotives belching dark smoke, cause it would. For more years than I can remember I have wished for just this breakthrough. What I am saying is to make sure it is 100% safe before you place it on the market or at least place a warning until you know for sure. I would most definitely hate to see you lose everything in a lawsuit for simply trying to improve the hobby. You can fix your product but recovering from a huge lawsuit isn't as easy. Just some advice from someone who considers all in this group as friends.   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78005	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/27/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Jim,    And if you are a vet thank you as well.                                                              Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Sat, 28 May 2016 01:30:58 +0000 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Bob - Here we are pulling up on another Memorial Day.  Thanks for your service. Jim Ensign From: "Robert Lampe danceswithwolves49@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: "S-Trains" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 12:53:06 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Mike,    Thanks for that info. Until I know for sure it is absolutely 100% safe I will use it with caution. BTW coming up on 13 years since I smoked my last cigarette. I can thank Agent Orange for the congestive heart failure.     Bob From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 26 May 2016 22:45:36 -0400 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Bob, I think that having no particulate matter coming from the smoke fluid, & coupled with the fact, that a cigarette has far more particulate matter, I'd be safe..Mike     In a message dated 5/26/2016 7:40:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I was always under the impression that a locomotive belching black smoke, even diesels(except Alcos, of course, they Always emitted high volumes of black smoke), was a signature of a locomotive either accelerating or under a heavy load. I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to have our locomotives belching dark smoke, cause it would. For more years than I can remember I have wished for just this breakthrough. What I am saying is to make sure it is 100% safe before you place it on the market or at least place a warning until you know for sure. I would most definitely hate to see you lose everything in a lawsuit for simply trying to improve the hobby. You can fix your product but recovering from a huge lawsuit isn't as easy. Just some advice from someone who considers all in this group as friends.   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78006	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

This assumes that the new smoke fluid will contain a variety of plain white mineral oil.  The formulation for the various smoke fluids available today seems to be a secret more tightly guarded than Colonel Sander's recipe.  We all know that traditional smoke fluids do contain blends of mineral oil and cedar oil or other scent oils, but very few of us bother to try to make it ourselves.   We buy it because it is more convenient and because we are not chemists.  With this new product, I think in fairness we need a little bit more information about the makeup of this new product.  We don't need the details, but maybe some information about whether it is still based on mineral oil, perhaps of a different type, or if the color is obtained by additives.  Maybe some information on the flash point would be nice too. Dale Smith -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Date: Fri, 27 May 2016 00:29:49 -0700 From: 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Here is a Material Safety Data sheet (MSDS) for plain white mineral oil:  http://www.chemistry.mcgill.ca/msds/msds/8042-47-5.pdf   The “health effects” from the materials used in the smoke fluid are likely to be similar.   Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78007	From: Doug Peck	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info

Sold out, and I haven’t been able to obtain these for several years. Another one of those parts items Lionel doesn’t release. Still have some for Geeps and EP5 though.   <<<< In the past i have ordered the PA  window inserts from Doug Peck at Portlines and probably still have several.  Does he no longer carry them??Al Paolozzi >>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78008	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 29 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 29 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78009	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Dale,   As I already commented, everything in the world is toxic (even the ingredients in the Colonel’s secret recipe).  It is a question of how much material one is exposed to, the route of exposure, the time over which one is exposed, and the type of toxicity one is concerned about (plus a handful of other variables).  I suspect that ingesting the saturated fats in the Colonel’s chicken may be worse for you than the small dose of smoke one might inhale while playing with toy trains.   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 10:44 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID       This assumes that the new smoke fluid will contain a variety of plain white mineral oil.  The formulation for the various smoke fluids available today seems to be a secret more tightly guarded than Colonel Sander's recipe.  We all know that traditional smoke fluids do contain blends of mineral oil and cedar oil or other scent oils, but very few of us bother to try to make it ourselves.   We buy it because it is more convenient and because we are not chemists.  With this new product, I think in fairness we need a little bit more information about the makeup of this new product.  We don't need the details, but maybe some information about whether it is still based on mineral oil, perhaps of a different type, or if the color is obtained by additives.  Maybe some information on the flash point would be nice too. Dale Smith -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Date: Fri, 27 May 2016 00:29:49 -0700 From: 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Here is a Material Safety Data sheet (MSDS) for plain white mineral oil:  http://www.chemistry.mcgill.ca/msds/msds/8042-47-5.pdf   The “health effects” from the materials used in the smoke fluid are likely to be similar.   Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78010	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Jerry, That wasn't my issue at all.  I replied to your message because of the mention of mineral oil.  Are we sure this new formula will be mineral oil based?  Since this is something new and possibly something the unit was not designed to handle, I simply wonder whether it might leave undesired deposits in the unit or what it's relative safety might be in terms of flash point.  At one point, Lehigh Valley was making a coal scented smoke fluid and I got a bottle of it.  I tried it and it did indeed smell like coal smoke, but there were small black particles floating around in suspension in the fluid, so I stopped, figuring that those particles were probably coal dust and could not be too good for the smoke unit.  Dale Smith On 5/29/2016 1:36 AM, 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Dale,   As I already commented, everything in the world is toxic (even the ingredients in the Colonel’s secret recipe).  It is a question of how much material one is exposed to, the route of exposure, the time over which one is exposed, and the type of toxicity one is concerned about (plus a handful of other variables).  I suspect that ingesting the saturated fats in the Colonel’s chicken may be worse for you than the small dose of smoke one might inhale while playing with toy trains.   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 10:44 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID       This assumes that the new smoke fluid will contain a variety of plain white mineral oil.  The formulation for the various smoke fluids available today seems to be a secret more tightly guarded than Colonel Sander's recipe.  We all know that traditional smoke fluids do contain blends of mineral oil and cedar oil or other scent oils, but very few of us bother to try to make it ourselves.   We buy it because it is more convenient and because we are not chemists.  With this new product, I think in fairness we need a little bit more information about the makeup of this new product.  We don't need the details, but maybe some information about whether it is still based on mineral oil, perhaps of a different type, or if the color is obtained by additives.  Maybe some information on the flash point would be nice too. Dale Smith -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Date: Fri, 27 May 2016 00:29:49 -0700 From: 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Here is a Material Safety Data sheet (MSDS) for plain white mineral oil:  http://www.chemistry.mcgill.ca/msds/msds/8042-47-5.pdf   The “health effects” from the materials used in the smoke fluid are likely to be similar.   Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78011	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 29 May 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 29 May 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78012	From: traindavid	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: 499 out of its shell--at last!

Well, the 499 came home with me last night. More inspecting, and then a "treatment" with a dental tool around the front nose and out she came! The chassis, which on these engines is about as straight as a pretzel was just a tad too straight, and the sharp edges of the metal just dug into the plastic shell's nose and wouldn't let go. I have un-straightened the chassis so now the nose metal clears the shell, and the shell sits level--also the mounting screw hole lines up too. However, in spite of the shell having dings etc. on it, the chassis appears to have had very little running time--because the rear truck is somehow electrically connected to the frame, so when the motor truck swivels, and reaches the stop, it causes a direct short. Hmmm, this has also burnt one finger on the reverse unit. Hmmm. Haven't had time to look farther, but I suspect it left ACG this way! Will let you know when I find the culprit! I have a 484 unit that was missing an insulating washer on one mount, and it too, has very little run time--one reason I got it "inexpensively." That one was a quick fix, and again, likely an ACG factory oops the didn't show up in running it around the final assembly station to the packing station (watch the video of the factory, apparently that's how they did it! Test and delivery! Pretty clever, actually.) Chat tonight!! I will probably be late, Picnic this afternoon, Tri-Tip marinated 48 hours----MMMMMMMM (Jack Lindsay's secret recipe--it's GOOOOOD! Later gators! Run 'em if ya go 'em (without short circuits!) :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78013	From: traindavid	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: AF PA windshield info

Doug Peck wrote, "Sold out, and I haven't been able to obtain these for several years. Another one of those parts items Lionel doesn't release." Which does go to show, as someone posted here, that Lionel is only an investment company, making stuff for instant financial gain, and product support--even customer support is secondary to their mission. Parts sales can also be an income source--not immediate and not as lucrative, but it can provide customer loyalty too. I would love to be able to buy a challenger tender to replace the one on my Big Boy--even a Challenger trailing truck too! That would eliminate 80% of the problems with the Big Boy! I would probably by windshields to "bling out" my ACG Alcos too. OK, preaching to the choir here, I'll step off the soapbox. Run 'em if ya go 'em--and enough parts to keep them running!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78014	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/29/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

OK, guys. My fluid is not mineral oil based per se. My fluid does NOT leave a residue, in fact it will work to loosen any deposits from past smoke fluid that has hardened, as is the case with mineral oil based fluids.  As far as flash points, they are varied, depending on the  lab doing the testing. I don't post mine as all you need to do is look up the flash point & it will give you a ballpark, of the carrier fluid I use. So you can see why I would not list it. but it is safe if used as intended. Mike   In a message dated 5/29/2016 9:55:45 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Jerry, That wasn't my issue at all.  I replied to your message because of the mention of mineral oil.  Are we sure this new formula will be mineral oil based?  Since this is something new and possibly something the unit was not designed to handle, I simply wonder whether it might leave undesired deposits in the unit or what it's relative safety might be in terms of flash point.  At one point, Lehigh Valley was making a coal scented smoke fluid and I got a bottle of it.  I tried it and it did indeed smell like coal smoke, but there were small black particles floating around in suspension in the fluid, so I stopped, figuring that those particles were probably coal dust and could not be too good for the smoke unit.  Dale Smith On 5/29/2016 1:36 AM, 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Dale, As I already commented, everything in the world is toxic (even the ingredients in the Colonel’s secret recipe).  It is a question of how much material one is exposed to, the route of exposure, the time over which one is exposed, and the type of toxicity one is concerned about (plus a handful of other variables).  I suspect that ingesting the saturated fats in the Colonel’s chicken may be worse for you than the small dose of smoke one might inhale while playing with toy trains. Jerry F. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 10:44 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   This assumes that the new smoke fluid will contain a variety of plain white mineral oil.  The formulation for the various smoke fluids available today seems to be a secret more tightly guarded than Colonel Sander's recipe.  We all know that traditional smoke fluids do contain blends of mineral oil and cedar oil or other scent oils, but very few of us bother to try to make it ourselves.   We buy it because it is more convenient and because we are not chemists.  With this new product, I think in fairness we need a little bit more information about the makeup of this new product.  We don't need the details, but maybe some information about whether it is still based on mineral oil, perhaps of a different type, or if the color is obtained by additives.  Maybe some information on the flash point would be nice too. Dale Smith -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID Date: Fri, 27 May 2016 00:29:49 -0700 From: 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Here is a Material Safety Data sheet (MSDS) for plain white mineral oil:  http://www.chemistry.mcgill.ca/msds/msds/8042-47-5.pdf The “health effects” from the materials used in the smoke fluid are likely to be similar. Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78015	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Ok,  How do we look up the flash point to get the "ballpark" when you don't identify the non-mineral oil carrier fluid you are using.  I am not trying to get you to divulge your formula, or even parts of it.  If you don't want to divulge the carrier fluid, then why not simply state the flash point.  Other manufacturers do list flash points.  I understand that it can vary by different labs, but that "ballpark" is what I am interested in. Dale Smith On 5/29/2016 10:44 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote: As far as flash points, they are varied, depending on the  lab doing the testing. I don't post mine as all you need to do is look up the flash point & it will give you a ballpark, of the carrier fluid I use.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78016	From: Carey Probst	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Are you guys this negative about everything or just enjoy trying to stop all development in S? The minimal amount of smoke in a normal session is probably negligible in real life.  You remind me of the people who inject rats with 10,000 times the normal dosage of something and declare it cancerous. Maybe we should support those who try to bring improvements to our hobby instead of bitching and whining about everything they do. In short, give it a rest guys. Carey On 5/29/2016 8:35 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ok,  How do we look up the flash point to get the "ballpark" when you don't identify the non-mineral oil carrier fluid you are using.  I am not trying to get you to divulge your formula, or even parts of it.  If you don't want to divulge the carrier fluid, then why not simply state the flash point.  Other manufacturers do list flash points.  I understand that it can vary by different labs, but that "ballpark" is what I am interested in. Dale Smith On 5/29/2016 10:44 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote: As far as flash points, they are varied, depending on the  lab doing the testing. I don't post mine as all you need to do is look up the flash point & it will give you a ballpark, of the carrier fluid I use.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78017	From: Paul Krause	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I do not know about some of the folks here..but I am excited about it and plan to use it when available.  And the same fora lot of the guys in my club!  Kudos for a new product.  Paul K.  CT S-Gaugers. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Mon, May 30, 2016 at 8:07 AM, Carey Probst s-scale@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Are you guys this negative about everything or just enjoy trying to stop all development in S? The minimal amount of smoke in a normal session is probably negligible in real life.  You remind me of the people who inject rats with 10,000 times the normal dosage of something and declare it cancerous. Maybe we should support those who try to bring improvements to our hobby instead of bitching and whining about everything they do. In short, give it a rest guys. Carey On 5/29/2016 8:35 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ok,  How do we look up the flash point to get the "ballpark" when you don't identify the non-mineral oil carrier fluid you are using.  I am not trying to get you to divulge your formula, or even parts of it.  If you don't want to divulge the carrier fluid, then why not simply state the flash point.  Other manufacturers do list flash points.  I understand that it can vary by different labs, but that "ballpark" is what I am interested in. Dale Smith On 5/29/2016 10:44 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote: As far as flash points, they are varied, depending on the  lab doing the testing. I don't post mine as all you need to do is look up the flash point & it will give you a ballpark, of the carrier fluid I use.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78018	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid

Pretty simple. Just look on a chart. Mine is not on this chart Fuel Flash Point (oF) Acetaldehyde -36 Acetone 0 Benzene 12 Biodiesel 266 Carbon Disulfide -22 Diesel Fuel (1-D) 100 Diesel Fuel (2-D) 126 Diesel Fuel (4-D) 130 Ethyl Alcohol, Ethanol 63 Fuels Oil No.1 100 - 162 Fuels Oil No.2 126 - 204 Fuels Oil No.4 142 - 240 Fuels Oil No.5 Lite 156 - 336 Fuels Oil No.5 Heavy 160 - 250 Fuels Oil No.6 150 Gasoline -45 Gear oil 375 - 580 Iso-Butane -117 Iso-Pentane less than -60 Iso-Octane 10 Jet fuel (A/A-1) 100 - 150

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78019	From: George Cohn	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

On 5/30/2016 5:07 AM, Carey Probst s-scale@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > Are you guys this negative about everything or just enjoy trying to stop > all development in S? > > The minimal amount of smoke in a normal session is probably negligible > in real life. You remind me of the people who inject rats with 10,000 > times the normal dosage of something and declare it cancerous. > > Maybe we should support those who try to bring improvements to our hobby > instead of bitching and whining about everything they do. > > In short, give it a rest guys. > > Carey Kind of reminds me of the "Safety Trolls" that criticize almost every saw cut on the YouTube woodworking channels that I follow. I grew up in a time before seat belts, "childproofing" your home and most of the other legislated rules that we follow today. I made it to 70 with all my body parts intact mostly by just using common sense once I survived childhood. If we are going to criticize, how about all those sharp edges on stamped metal pieces in many of the original AC Gilbert accessories? Or how about those dangerous voltages on that exposed track? :-) As Carey says, give it a rest folks and just enjoy the hobbies while you can. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78020	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid

Why does everyone think I am being negative.  I would like to try this stuff, but since when is asking a few questions deemed to be negative?  I am not raising issues as to the health effects, which I am sure are minimal.  This list below is a fine list, but what is it a list of?  What does the fact that your carrier fluid is not on the list mean?  I don't know how to figure out a ball park figure for it from this chart.  Maybe you can answer the flash point question this way.  Can you say that the flash point is in the same range as your regular smoke fluid?  My understanding is that smoke fluid is not that simple.  Some fluids are better for different applications.  Is this designed for traditional flyer?  How will it work in new $600 to $1000 Lionel Flyer engines?  Will it probably be considered by Lionel to void warranties?  That is why the question of contacting Lionel made by one member is certainly something to be considered.   It would be great if you could become a supplier to Lionel and avoid warranty issues.  Lionel smoke fluid works, but it stinks, which brings up another issue, and that is the scent.   Will it have the same cedar scent?  This is what discussion is all about or are the only acceptable responses either "I will buy it" or "I won't buy it."  I have been told that yours is the best smoke fluid available and the only reason I haven't ordered any is because I have no layout and no place to run trains right now.  When I am able, I will be ordering your smoke fluid, either the original or this one or both.   By the way has anyone even asked when this will be available?  I have read all the posts, but don't recall if that was mentioned. Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 6:46 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:    Pretty simple. Just look on a chart. Mine is not on this chart Fuel Flash Point (oF) Acetaldehyde -36 Acetone 0 Benzene 12 Biodiesel 266 Carbon Disulfide -22 Diesel Fuel (1-D) 100 Diesel Fuel (2-D) 126 Diesel Fuel (4-D) 130 Ethyl Alcohol, Ethanol 63 Fuels Oil No.1 100 - 162 Fuels Oil No.2 126 - 204 Fuels Oil No.4 142 - 240 Fuels Oil No.5 Lite 156 - 336 Fuels Oil No.5 Heavy 160 - 250 Fuels Oil No.6 150 Gasoline -45 Gear oil 375 - 580 Iso-Butane -117 Iso-Pentane less than -60 Iso-Octane 10 Jet fuel (A/A-1) 100 - 150

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78021	From: racin510	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78022	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: Gray Smoke Fluid

The chart was in response to how easy it would be to find the flash point of the carrier that I use. As far as the other questions, most are up to you to find out. As far as the $600-$1,000 engines Carl Tuevison uses it in his &  he has had no questions. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:43:16 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Why does everyone think I am being negative.  I would like to try this stuff, but since when is asking a few questions deemed to be negative?  I am not raising issues as to the health effects, which I am sure are minimal.  This list below is a fine list, but what is it a list of?  What does the fact that your carrier fluid is not on the list mean?  I don't know how to figure out a ball park figure for it from this chart.  Maybe you can answer the flash point question this way.  Can you say that the flash point is in the same range as your regular smoke fluid?  My understanding is that smoke fluid is not that simple.  Some fluids are better for different applications.  Is this designed for traditional flyer?  How will it work in new $600 to $1000 Lionel Flyer engines?  Will it probably be considered by Lionel to void warranties?  That is why the question of contacting Lionel made by one member is certainly something to be considered.   It would be great if you could become a supplier to Lionel and avoid warranty issues.  Lionel smoke fluid works, but it stinks, which brings up another issue, and that is the scent.   Will it have the same cedar scent?  This is what discussion is all about or are the only acceptable responses either "I will buy it" or "I won't buy it."  I have been told that yours is the best smoke fluid available and the only reason I haven't ordered any is because I have no layout and no place to run trains right now.  When I am able, I will be ordering your smoke fluid, either the original or this one or both.   By the way has anyone even asked when this will be available?  I have read all the posts, but don't recall if that was mentioned. Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 6:46 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:    Pretty simple. Just look on a chart. Mine is not on this chart Fuel Flash Point (oF) Acetaldehyde -36 Acetone 0 Benzene 12 Biodiesel 266 Carbon Disulfide -22 Diesel Fuel (1-D) 100 Diesel Fuel (2-D) 126 Diesel Fuel (4-D) 130 Ethyl Alcohol, Ethanol 63 Fuels Oil No.1 100 - 162 Fuels Oil No.2 126 - 204 Fuels Oil No.4 142 - 240 Fuels Oil No.5 Lite 156 - 336 Fuels Oil No.5 Heavy 160 - 250 Fuels Oil No.6 150 Gasoline -45 Gear oil 375 - 580 Iso-Butane -117 Iso-Pentane less than -60 Iso-Octane 10 Jet fuel (A/A-1) 100 - 150

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78023	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78024	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DRAK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Some guys just keep trying. Just got an E-Bay question from Dave from LBR asking the flash point of my fluid. Mike

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78025	From: Dale Smith	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Thanks,   Question answered, but will it be cedar scented or odorless, if that is not being too inquisitive? Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 1:52 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78026	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Cedar, it is the same as my other fluid, just darker.   In a message dated 5/30/2016 3:54:06 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Thanks,   Question answered, but will it be cedar scented or odorless, if that is not being too inquisitive? Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 1:52 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78027	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 5/30/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Hmmmmm too bad you can't get it to smell like coal, fuel oil or diesel smoke. I know...wishful thinking but a cool idea........later maybe.                                                                                    Bob Lampe                                                                                    Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 30 May 2016 15:46:22 -0700 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Thanks,   Question answered, but will it be cedar scented or odorless, if that is not being too inquisitive? Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 1:52 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78028	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

I might already have one of those, if I omit the Cedar...I'll need another smoke unit to test it. I was testing without cedar in the mix & it did smell a lot like fuel oil...     In a message dated 5/30/2016 7:42:44 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hmmmmm too bad you can't get it to smell like coal, fuel oil or diesel smoke. I know...wishful thinking but a cool idea........later maybe.                                                                                    Bob Lampe                                                 &nb sp;                                  Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 30 May 2016 15:46:22 -0700 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Thanks,   Question answered, but will it be cedar scented or odorless, if that is not being too inquisitive? Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 1:52 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78029	From: Charles Hancock	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Yes! Charlie in W MI On May 25, 2016, at 10:58 AM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Would there be any interest in a dark Gray smoke fluid?   Anormal1 Smoke Fluid Michael Strickland 211 Summit Ave Medford, Ore 97501

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78030	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Who wants the room to smell like diesel smoke or fuel oil??:-) Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) On 5/31/2016 05:15, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:    I might already have one of those, if I omit the Cedar...I'll need another smoke unit to test it. I was testing without cedar in the mix & it did smell a lot like fuel oil...     In a message dated 5/30/2016 7:42:44 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hmmmmm too bad you can't get it to smell like coal, fuel oil or diesel smoke. I know...wishful thinking but a cool idea........later maybe.                                                                                    Bob Lampe                                                 &nb sp;                                  Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 30 May 2016 15:46:22 -0700 Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID   Thanks,   Question answered, but will it be cedar scented or odorless, if that is not being too inquisitive? Dale Smith On 5/30/2016 1:52 PM, anormal1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK Anywhere from 400 to 600 deg. F.  I have sent samples to a few already. There is a slight increase of $1.50 per 4oz bottle. Mike   In a message dated 5/30/2016 1:42:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   So give them an approximate flash point and put it to rest. If it is the same cost as your present stuff and if it actually does produce grey smoke, the sales will come readily. Would you send some samples out for real world testing and feedback? I will happily volunteer and run it in all types of smoke units. Rick up the road in Seattle Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78031	From: Alan Evans	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2

List:                Looking for 1 pair of the Pacific blind drivers.                  Have in stock 4 HiRail 4-6-2 drivers (NIB)                                              2 HiRail 4-6-2 gription drivers (NIB)   -        Alan Evans -        Gahanna, OH   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 1:21 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF PA windshield info     Doug Peck wrote, "Sold out, and I haven't been able to obtain these for several years. Another one of those parts items Lionel doesn't release." Which does go to show, as someone posted here, that Lionel is only an investment company, making stuff for instant financial gain, and product support--even customer support is secondary to their mission. Parts sales can also be an income source--not immediate and not as lucrative, but it can provide customer loyalty too. I would love to be able to buy a challenger tender to replace the one on my Big Boy--even a Challenger trailing truck too! That would eliminate 80% of the problems with the Big Boy! I would probably by windshields to "bling out" my ACG Alcos too. OK, preaching to the choir here, I'll step off the soapbox. Run 'em if ya go 'em--and enough parts to keep them running!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78032	From: traindavid	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

Bob Lampe posted, "Hmmmmm too bad you can't get it to smell like coal, fuel oil or diesel smoke. I know...wishful thinking but a cool idea........later maybe." Supersmoke made some fluid with those scents. I tried them. The idea sounds good, but the nasal effect was NOT pleasant! Too much of a "good thing" -- think about a busy bus station shelter, not really a pleasant aroma! The cedar or even their "Christmas tree scent" which was slightly different, were fine. This sounds like it will be a really popular product, especially if it performs like your "old fluid." Of course, if you wanted to make some scents like, Popcorn, Pancakes, Coffee, Steaks Grilling. . . . Those might be popular!! :) Oooh, or Cinnamon Rolls baking! Now we're talking FUN! Oh, and Mike, yep inquiring minds want to know your secret! Consider it a compliment! Next time I'm up visiting my brother in Ashland, I should call you up! Run 'em if ya got 'em!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78033	From: racin510	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

All my steamers burn nothing but cedar wood regardless of what seems to be in the tender! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78034	From: rudypenne	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

I just came back from Ashland...What a trip that was..Don't let him drink the "WATER" Mike   In a message dated 5/31/2016 12:40:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Bob Lampe posted, "Hmmmmm too bad you can't get it to smell like coal, fuel oil or diesel smoke. I know...wishful thinking but a cool idea........later maybe." Supersmoke made some fluid with those scents. I tried them. The idea sounds good, but the nasal effect was NOT pleasant! Too much of a "good thing" -- think about a busy bus station shelter, not really a pleasant aroma! The cedar or even their "Christmas tree scent" which was slightly different, were fine. This sounds like it will be a really popular product, especially if it performs like your "old fluid." Of course, if you wanted to make some scents like, Popcorn, Pancakes, Coffee, Steaks Grilling. . . . Those might be popular!! :) Oooh, or Cinnamon Rolls baking! Now we're talking FUN! Oh, and Mike, yep inquiring minds want to know your secret! Consider it a compliment! Next time I'm up visiting my brother in Ashland, I should call you up! Run 'em if ya got 'em!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78035	From: Dr Trains	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2

May have a set of blind drivers, will have to check.....are you intending to sell or exchange for flanged drivers??? What do yo feel is a fair price for blind driver set....two wheels +axle....????...Peter loeb -------------------------------------------- On Tue, 5/31/16, 'Alan Evans' alan@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, May 31, 2016, 9:46 AM List:                Looking for 1 pair of the Pacific blind drivers.                Have in stock 4 HiRail 4-6-2 drivers (NIB)                                              2 HiRail 4-6-2 gription drivers (NIB) -        Alan Evans -        Gahanna, OH From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 1:21 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF PA windshield info Doug Peck wrote, "Sold out, and I haven't been able to obtain these for several years. Another one of those parts items Lionel doesn't release." Which does go to show, as someone posted here, that Lionel is only an investment company, making stuff for instant financial gain, and product support--even customer support is secondary to their mission. Parts sales can also be an income source--not immediate and not as lucrative, but it can provide customer loyalty too. I would love to be able to buy a challenger tender to replace the one on my Big Boy--even a Challenger trailing truck too! That would eliminate 80% of the problems with the Big Boy! I would probably by windshields to "bling out" my ACG Alcos too. OK, preaching to the choir here, I'll step off the soapbox. Run 'em if ya go 'em--and enough parts to keep them running!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78036	From: Michael	Date: 5/31/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Guys!! It's one dollar and 50 cents for a bottle, with shipping, it costs what, two dollars??!? I spend more than that on a Coke and a pack of Twinkies...I tested one of the first formula's Mike put out back in 2001... Good stuff, I've used Anormal1's smoke fluid ever since. Mike, put me down for a bottle, I'll through in a free review! Thanks for your support. Michael South Jersey S Gaugers Waybill Editor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78037	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Thought he said it was $1.50 more than his other smoke. Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) On 6/1/2016 04:44, Michael msmcconn@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Guys!! It's one dollar and 50 cents for a bottle, with shipping, it costs what, two dollars??!? I spend more than that on a Coke and a pack of Twinkies...I tested one of the first formula's Mike put out back in 2001... Good stuff, I've used Anormal1's smoke fluid ever since. Mike, put me down for a bottle, I'll through in a free review! Thanks for your support. Michael South Jersey S Gaugers Waybill Editor Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78038	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

No it's an increase of $1.50 so a $10 bottle with the increase is $11.50 + $3.50 shipping..So its a total of $15   In a message dated 5/31/2016 8:59:49 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Guys!! It's one dollar and 50 cents for a bottle, with shipping, it costs what, two dollars??!? I spend more than that on a Coke and a pack of Twinkies...I tested one of the first formula's Mike put out back in 2001... Good stuff, I've used Anormal1's smoke fluid ever since. Mike, put me down for a bottle, I'll through in a free review! Thanks for your support. Michael South Jersey S Gaugers Waybill Editor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78039	From: chuck_7612	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

Mike - From what website may we order your current fluid and your forthcoming product when available?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78040	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID

You can E-Mail me at  Anormal1@...   In a message dated 6/1/2016 5:12:32 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike - From what website may we order your current fluid and your forthcoming product when available?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78041	From: traindavid	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

Mike wrote; "I just came back from Ashland...What a trip that was..Don't let him drink the "WATER" Interesting you should mention that. We grew up on the family resort which had a natural sparkling mineral spring on it, so we're used to THE WATER and it's fun to waltz up to the fountains and take some big drinks of it, as the locals like to hang out and see outsider's reactions--we're a great disappointment! I LIKE the stuff! It makes great lemonade, BTW. Until about 15 years ago we pumped the water at our place to a fountain alongside the street, which back in the 50s was Hwy 99 (now I-5). I remember one hot summer day sitting on a bench near the fountain when a big truck stopped, and the driver ran out to the fountain and stuck his head in, drinking in all he could--for about 30 seconds. Then his head shot up and he was spitting out water as fast as he could! It was soo funny the expression on his face! I guess all the mineral deposits on the fountain's bowl didn't give him a clue! I should put a photo of the fountain in the files, but my dial up is particularly slow today.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78042	From: rudypenne	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

Just joking with you Dave. As the water there is known for it's Lithiam....   In a message dated 6/1/2016 12:17:12 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Mike wrote; "I just came back from Ashland...What a trip that was..Don't let him drink the "WATER" Interesting you should mention that. We grew up on the family resort which had a natural sparkling mineral spring on it, so we're used to THE WATER and it's fun to waltz up to the fountains and take some big drinks of it, as the locals like to hang out and see outsider's reactions--we're a great disappointment! I LIKE the stuff! It makes great lemonade, BTW. Until about 15 years ago we pumped the water at our place to a fountain alongside the street, which back in the 50s was Hwy 99 (now I-5). I remember one hot summer day sitting on a bench near the fountain when a big truck stopped, and the driver ran out to the fountain and stuck his head in, drinking in all he could--for about 30 seconds. Then his head shot up and he was spitting out water as fast as he could! It was soo funny the expression on his face! I guess all the mineral deposits on the fountain's bowl didn't give him a clue! I should put a photo of the fountain in the files, but my dial up is particularly slow today.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78043	From: sgaugian	Date: 6/1/2016
Subject: Re: DARK GRAY SMOKE FLUID--more????

If the gray smoke fluid is ready please fedex me a bottle and I will test it outdoors with our S gauge club Saturday at the Manassas Railfest.  Thank you.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78044	From: Alan Evans	Date: 6/2/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2

Attachments : Peter,                Check & let me know what you have.  Fair price would be  $13.00 for set of blind drivers.     – Alan   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 8:51 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2     May have a set of blind drivers, will have to check.....are you intending to sell or exchange for flanged drivers??? What do yo feel is a fair price for blind driver set....two wheels +axle....????...Peter loeb -------------------------------------------- On Tue, 5/31/16, 'Alan Evans' alan@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2 To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, May 31, 2016, 9:46 AM List:                Looking for 1 pair of the Pacific blind drivers.                Have in stock 4 HiRail 4-6-2 drivers (NIB)                                              2 HiRail 4-6-2 gription drivers (NIB) -        Alan Evans -        Gahanna, OH From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 1:21 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF PA windshield info Doug Peck wrote, "Sold out, and I haven't been able to obtain these for several years. Another one of those parts items Lionel doesn't release." Which does go to show, as someone posted here, that Lionel is only an investment company, making stuff for instant financial gain, and product support--even customer support is secondary to their mission. Parts sales can also be an income source--not immediate and not as lucrative, but it can provide customer loyalty too. I would love to be able to buy a challenger tender to replace the one on my Big Boy--even a Challenger trailing truck too! That would eliminate 80% of the problems with the Big Boy! I would probably by windshields to "bling out" my ACG Alcos too. OK, preaching to the choir here, I'll step off the soapbox. Run 'em if ya go 'em--and enough parts to keep them running!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78045	From: roninscho	Date: 6/4/2016
Subject: Re: Blind drivers for AM 4-6-2

Alan was checking on this for Me, I am doing a change over scale to hi-rail please let Me know ? thanks  Ron roninscho@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78046	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 05 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 05 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78047	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/5/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 05 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 05 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78048	From: aftrains4u	Date: 6/6/2016
Subject: 21812 Baldwin Question

I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78049	From: R G	Date: 6/6/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Your loco should pull about 6 cars max. Is there a weight in your locomotive?  Also are the pulmor tires soft or have they harden with age which can make the loco wheels slip?  I did a can motor conversion on one of my baldwins that never operated well and I am quite pleased with the results. Port Line hobbies carry the conversion. Included is additional weight that makes it a better puller. On Monday, June 6, 2016 7:39 PM, "aftrains4u@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78050	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

My Baldwin was the same. They are crappy runners. I bought my conversion directly from the man who makes it. Steve Blackburn at S-n-S trains. He is on the list here. Check his website for more info. Took about 30 minutes to convert it. Can run DC straight or add rectifier and still use the reverse unit. Personally, I like running straight DC. Smoother and quieter. No F-N-R-N-F garbage. All my engines and my handcar run on DV conversion motors.  Smooth Operation! Chris B. From: "R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, June 6, 2016 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question   Your loco should pull about 6 cars max. Is there a weight in your locomotive?  Also are the pulmor tires soft or have they harden with age which can make the loco wheels slip?  I did a can motor conversion on one of my baldwins that never operated well and I am quite pleased with the results. Port Line hobbies carry the conversion. Included is additional weight that makes it a better puller. On Monday, June 6, 2016 7:39 PM, "aftrains4u@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78051	From: Doug Peck	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Bob, Like other diesels, Baldwins are subject to worn trucks as well.  Are the axles in the power truck sloppy? If so, it will definitely affect how well the unit runs, and can ultimately heat-damage the motor. We now have a replacement Baldwin chassis available that has been milled, and is supplied with appropriate axle bearings, for $29 . Sold on an exchange basis, so just send us your worn, stripped chassis.   << I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars. It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean. Is there something else that I can check to find the problem? Gear? Wheels slipping? Any help is appreciated. Thanks. >>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78052	From: frank emiro	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Great info, it makes me now aware of any issue. From: "Chrisandmhel Burger chrisandmhelburger@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, June 6, 2016 11:25 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question   My Baldwin was the same. They are crappy runners. I bought my conversion directly from the man who makes it. Steve Blackburn at S-n-S trains. He is on the list here. Check his website for more info. Took about 30 minutes to convert it. Can run DC straight or add rectifier and still use the reverse unit. Personally, I like running straight DC. Smoother and quieter. No F-N-R-N-F garbage. All my engines and my handcar run on DV conversion motors.  Smooth Operation! Chris B. From: "R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, June 6, 2016 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question   Your loco should pull about 6 cars max. Is there a weight in your locomotive?  Also are the pulmor tires soft or have they harden with age which can make the loco wheels slip?  I did a can motor conversion on one of my baldwins that never operated well and I am quite pleased with the results. Port Line hobbies carry the conversion. Included is additional weight that makes it a better puller. On Monday, June 6, 2016 7:39 PM, "aftrains4u@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78053	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

The 21812 needs a lot of added weight to pull well and to prevent the front (non motorized) truck from jumping the tracks. Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78054	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

 ----- Original Message ----- From: 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains] . . . . . Like other diesels, Baldwins are subject to worn trucks as well.  Are the axles in the power truck sloppy?. . . . . . . . > > > > > > > > > > There was a fellow in the S business years ago by the name of Bill Daymo (I think) who sold a repowering unit for the AF Baldwin.  I understand it was simply an American Models drive unit for their Baldwin, modified to fit the AF unit.  I never examined it closely, but he said that for some reason, he could only get one truck powered.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Mich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78055	From: traindavid	Date: 6/7/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

If the slider contact button springs are too stiff, they will lift the wheels enough to lose traction. If your motor has been overheated, sometimes the armature windings develop shorts with reduces the motor's power, causing it to overheat more (eventually it doesn't run). Remember, this was an entry level locomotive, the diesel equivalent of the 307, and wasn't really well-engineered as the much as the earlier engines. Even the 355 versions take some "special handling" to make them into useful switchers. There is a modern electrical modification, that' cheap, and will make the Baldwin much better behaved with original ACG innards (including the ACG reverse unit). The main problem is the motor is designed for lower voltages than most ACG stuff. While the design pre-dates Wrather's take-over, it sure seems to look like something they'd do! There must have been a turn-over in the engineering department around 1955 or so. Would be interesting to know what went on.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78056	From: snstrains	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: 21812 Baldwin Question

A can motor kit with Dallee reverse unit and some weight will take care off all the problems except possible axle holes wear. Steve Blackburn, Boise in a message dated 6/7/2016 1:52:19 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   If the slider contact button springs are too stiff, they will lift the wheels enough to lose traction. If your motor has been overheated, sometimes the armature windings develop shorts with reduces the motor's power, causing it to overheat more (eventually it doesn't run). Remember, this was an entry level locomotive, the diesel equivalent of the 307, and wasn't really well-engineered as the much as the earlier engines. Even the 355 versions take some "special handling" to make them into useful switchers. There is a modern electrical modification, that' cheap, and will make the Baldwin much better behaved with original ACG innards (including the ACG reverse unit). The main problem is the motor is designed for lower voltages than most ACG stuff. While the design pre-dates Wrather's take-over, it sure seems to look like something they'd do! There must have been a turn-over in the engineering department around 1955 or so. Would be interesting to know what went on.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78057	From: RONALD KEMP	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: (no subject)

I have to thank my 21812 and Gilbert.  It taught me to be skeptical of advertising, product quality.  It helped teach me to overcome disappointment in something I really liked.  It taught me not to fear trying to fix something I knew nothing about.  Still can't get the thing to run well after 56 years.  Can't  make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. RONALD KEMP kempfam@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78058	From: John Keating	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

I have used an American Models Baldwin chassis in AF Baldwin shells. It requires either grinding away some plastic inside the shell or filing or milling away a small amount of the AM chassis in order to get a good fit. I chose to file away material of the AM chassis. Shell can be placed back on the AF chassis at any time. The AM chassis will out pull the AF chassis at every chance and both trucks on the AM chassis are powered. John Keating Sent from my iPad On Jun 7, 2016, at 12:37 PM, 'Tom Hawley' t.hawley@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:    ----- Original Message ----- From: 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains] . . . . . Like other diesels, Baldwins are subject to worn trucks as well.  Are the axles in the power truck sloppy?. . . . . . . . > > > > > > > > > > There was a fellow in the S business years ago by the name of Bill Daymo (I think) who sold a repowering unit for the AF Baldwin.  I understand it was simply an American Models drive unit for their Baldwin, modified to fit the AF unit.  I never examined it closely, but he said that for some reason, he could only get one truck powered.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Mich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78059	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 6/8/2016
Subject: STILL NOTHING

Another deadline has come and gone and still no MTH F-3 locomotives.What is it now 3 years? I'm seriously thinking of giving up on ever seeing them in production?     Bob Lampe     Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78060	From: snstrains	Date: 6/9/2016
Subject: Re:

I'm truly sorry that the sows ear won't run, but I guarantee you that if you send it to SnS Trains in Boise Idaho, it will come back to you as a silk purse (and then some).   Steve Blackburn.   In a message dated 6/8/2016 8:05:41 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes: I have to thank my 21812 and Gilbert.  It taught me to be skeptical of advertising, product quality.  It helped teach me to overcome disappointment in something I really liked.  It taught me not to fear trying to fix something I knew nothing about.  Still can't get the thing to run well after 56 years.  Can't  make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78061	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 12 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 12 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78062	From: Bill Lane	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: American Flyer LCL container

Attachments : container.jpg Please reply directly if anyone has 5 to 10 of these American Flyer containers on the CHEAP. Quality of paint and original lettering not important. No cracks or big scratches though please. Repro containers (if they even exist) are also good too.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78063	From: markaflyer	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer LCL container [1 Attachment]

Doug Peck at Portlines has them for $10.00 per set of 5. Mark Anderman From: "'Bill Lane' bill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:58:03 AM Subject: [S-Trains] American Flyer LCL container [1 Attachment]   Please reply directly if anyone has 5 to 10 of these American Flyer containers on the CHEAP. Quality of paint and original lettering not important. No cracks or big scratches though please. Repro containers (if they even exist) are also good too.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78064	From: bowes.craig	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer LCL container

I this how you reply to these. I got engines for sale. Challenger and SD70ACe Sent from my iPod On Jun 12, 2016, at 11:51 AM, "Manderman@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Doug Peck at Portlines has them for $10.00 per set of 5. Mark Anderman From: "'Bill Lane' bill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:58:03 AM Subject: [S-Trains] American Flyer LCL container [1 Attachment]   Please reply directly if anyone has 5 to 10 of these American Flyer containers on the CHEAP. Quality of paint and original lettering not important. No cracks or big scratches though please. Repro containers (if they even exist) are also good too.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78065	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/12/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 12 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 12 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78066	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 19 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 19 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78067	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 19 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 19 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78068	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 6/19/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum

I just dug out an AF observation passenger car marked 663 American Flyer Lines 663.  The body appears to be extruded aluminum with a nice sheen, but the tail end is an aluminum casting of a very different appearance, rather shiney but greyish.   Can anything be done with that end piece to make it look a little more like the rest of the car?   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78069	From: snstrains	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum

You could try some Testors "aluminum" paint.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 6/19/2016 8:46:38 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I just dug out an AF observation passenger car marked 663 American Flyer Lines 663.  The body appears to be extruded aluminum with a nice sheen, but the tail end is an aluminum casting of a very different appearance, rather shiney but greyish.   Can anything be done with that end piece to make it look a little more like the rest of the car?   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78070	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum $ Aluminum

Tom...  I've dabbled with these I've rebuilt from junk box stuff I bought at at train shows.  Despite having also been into auto restoration too, and polishing the cast car ends by a couple of different methods, I could never get them to match the extruded sides.  In fact a few actually got a bit worse!  While the regular cars ends not matching the sides is "okay," the observation car end sticks out like a sore thumb! I know from auto experience that aluminum metallurgy has changed a LOT since the early years of it's use, as have manufacturing methods.  And I noticed that some of the cast ends seem to be different which leads me to believe there might have been a change in the alloy of the aluminum at some point.  Some ends can polish up to somewhat near the sides, but most are fairly hopeless. However, my experience is in dealing with cars that were worn and often abused, so I don't consider this "the last word" on the subject. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78071	From: Alan Smith	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum $ Aluminum

Tom,  U might try a rattle can of Kentucky chrome - which will likely be too bright and tone it down with a Krylon Matt asa top coat. Just a suggestion - aluminum paint will be too dull - I tried that with unhappy results.  Al in Western Ahia On Jun 20, 2016, at 7:05 AM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Tom...  I've dabbled with these I've rebuilt from junk box stuff I bought at at train shows.  Despite having also been into auto restoration too, and polishing the cast car ends by a couple of different methods, I could never get them to match the extruded sides.  In fact a few actually got a bit worse!  While the regular cars ends not matching the sides is "okay," the observation car end sticks out like a sore thumb! I know from auto experience that aluminum metallurgy has changed a LOT since the early years of it's use, as have manufacturing methods.  And I noticed that some of the cast ends seem to be different which leads me to believe there might have been a change in the alloy of the aluminum at some point.  Some ends can polish up to somewhat near the sides, but most are fairly hopeless. However, my experience is in dealing with cars that were worn and often abused, so I don't consider this "the last word" on the subject. Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78072	From: Ray Puls	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum

Tom, If you can locate a product called "Simichrome" it will bring that tail piece back as good as new. This is a polishing paste that works very easily to bring the finish back to brightness. You can usually find Simichrome at motorcycle shops, I have found this to be the easiest polish to work with. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78073	From: poniaj	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum

Tom, I don't think that the ends are aluminum.  They may be a type of zamac, in which case they will never look as nice as polished aluminum.  The ends of the cars may have been "chromed" by the vacuum process that was used on the locomotive and car bodies.  At least I have found traces of that process on some coach ends that weren't exposed to the outside of the cars.  The observation ends may have been "chromed" in the same way, and have lost their coating, which never was all that robust.  If I were to fully restore one of these observation cars (or any other aluminum car) I would get the ends chromed at an auto chrome shop, or possible see if Doug Peck's process will work on these pieces.  I have never seen a chrome paint that is actually worth the name.  The best process is the Alcad system, and that still isn't as nice as a polished piece of aluminum.  Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78074	From: traindavid	Date: 6/20/2016
Subject: Aluminum & Aluminum

Tom, Yes, the body is extruded aluminum. The end piece is Zamak (Pot Metal) that may or may not have been flash plated with nickel to match the car; the plating is long gone. HOWEVER, you can get a fairly good match by polishing the end piece. I have the luxury of a polishing stand and polishing "sticks" but you can do it with a liquid polish like Flitz or Semichrome and some elbow grease. This can also be used to freshen up the body piece too. Don't use it on the nameplates though, as it will quickly take off the lettering. You can take the plates off by pushing the pins out from inside the shell. The pins will fairly easily push back in when your done with the polishing project. The two pieces won't entirely match, but they'll look pretty close and be fine.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78075	From: race944t	Date: 6/21/2016
Subject: Re: Aluminum & Aluminum

I've had good luck with Mother's Aluminum mag wheel polish.  It is available in almost any auto parts store.  Like others have said, you will never get it perfect, but the ones I've done have come out much better.  Yes, be ready for lots of elbow grease to be used.  I've thought about using a dremel tool and a soft polishing wheel with the polish, but been afraid I would burn the metal, so I just do it manually. "Banker" Bill Clark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78076	From: michael Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Missouri pacific diesel

I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info. Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78077	From: sageviehe@att.net	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Alco PA Wheel Spin

I do not want to paint anything on the wheels to increase the traction of this unit. It is connected to a dummy unit also. It just seems to need some weight on the front where the drive wheels are located. I am pulling the dummy unit and 4 passenger cars. Thank you! George Viehe

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78078	From: Tom Crowley	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel

Attachments : 81E67071F572441889E7FF8E5DCA9D1C.png Mile, I have a MP passenger set new in the box plus 2 exra cars.  Let me know if you are interested?   Tom Crowley 404.375.5578   Sent from Mail for Windows 10   From: michael Cantu mpcantu@... [S-Trains] Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 7:42 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Missouri pacific diesel     I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info.   Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78079	From: michael Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel [1 Attachment]

How much is the set worth?  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone On Wednesday, June 22, 2016, 8:52 AM, Tom Crowley crowleytj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Mile, I have a MP passenger set new in the box plus 2 exra cars.  Let me know if you are interested?   Tom Crowley 404.375.5578   Sent from Mail for Windows 10   From: michael Cantu mpcantu@... [S-Trains] Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2016 7:42 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Missouri pacific diesel     I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info.   Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78080	From: Mark Kiner	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel

Lionel or original Gilbert? I have the Lionel with all the extra cars. MK On Jun 21, 2016, at 11:01 PM, michael Cantu mpcantu@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info. Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78081	From: Mike Cantu	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel

I should have been more specific. Looking for an original set.  On Wednesday, June 22, 2016, Mark Kiner robbe_wan@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Lionel or original Gilbert? I have the Lionel with all the extra cars. MK On Jun 21, 2016, at 11:01 PM, michael Cantu mpcantu@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info. Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78082	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel

Oops. forgot to ID myself. Set is magnificent....   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 6/22/2016 12:21:45 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes: I should have been more specific. Looking for an original set.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78083	From: racin510	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Alco PA Wheel Spin

Add chunks of lead around the head light bulb. Wheel balance weights can work.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78084	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Alco PA Wheel Spin

Well then, add some aftermarket traction wheels. Steve SnS Trains   In a message dated 6/22/2016 7:52:17 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I do not want to paint anything on the wheels to increase the traction of this unit. It is connected to a dummy unit also. It just seems to need some weight on the front where the drive wheels are located. I am pulling the dummy unit and 4 passenger cars. Thank you! George Viehe

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78085	From: snstrains	Date: 6/22/2016
Subject: Re: Missouri pacific diesel

I have one. Freight set, completely boxed and like new. Interested? I have photos.   In a message dated 6/22/2016 12:21:45 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I should have been more specific. Looking for an original set.  On Wednesday, June 22, 2016, Mark Kiner robbe_wan@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Lionel or original Gilbert? I have the Lionel with all the extra cars. MK On Jun 21, 2016, at 11:01 PM, michael Cantu mpcantu@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am looking for a Missouri pacific set; passenger or freight. Looking for a good conditioned one. Let me know if anyone has any info. Mike  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78086	From: Bill Lane	Date: 6/25/2016
Subject: SHS SW1 for sale or trade

Attachments : IMG_6620.JPG I bought this CB&Q SW1 with the intention of stripping it for Reading. This is an undec SW1 on eBay now.   The CB&Q currently has the scale wheels and couplers, and a NCE motor decoder. All runs fine. I am trying to convert the CB&Q into the undec SW1 somehow.   The CB&Q has the hirail wheels extra pilots and shorting plug in the original box. I usually toss the hirail wheels…..   So – buy the CB&Q just as is for $130.00 + shipping Buy without the decoder for $110.00 + shipping I could gut it and keep the trucks and motor for another project. Buy the carcass and all the remains for $60.00 shipping included.   ****This is all contingent on me winning the undec SW1.**** Just trying to line up the new owner of the CB&Q! It is a nice paint job. I would hate to strip.   If you have an undec SW1 and want to do a trade that is OK as well. We could just swap shells. Easy peasy.   Please reply directly to bill@...   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  ***Join the PRR T&HS*** The other members are not ALL like me! http://www.prrths.com http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRTHS_Application.pdf Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

@@attachment@@

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78087	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 26 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 26 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78088	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 26 June 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 26 June 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78089	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/28/2016
Subject: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

The wiring plan for my new layout is to be compatible with AC, possibly TMCC in the interim and ultimately DCC.  The initial plan is to use TMCC for the wireless throttles to control track power.  This allows use of all the AC locos on the roster for now.  After the layout is built there will be time to convert and acquire DCC locos but that will some time from now. The track plan looks like a double track main but is actually a dogbone with a reversing loop at each end.  The plan is to run 2 power busses with DPDT switches on the fascia to select which power bus is to control the track in front of the user.  All good so far.  For the reversing loops I saw a post on the O gauge forum about using an auto reverser by DCC Specialties; model PSX-AR-AC which is compatible with AC.  The idea is that when wheels bridge the gap between a main track and the reversing section it creates a short if it is out of polarity.  The auto reverser then reverses the polarity of the reversing section faster than the speed of light and the train continues.  The beauty of these things is that fast response and no need for additional sensors, optical or otherwise.  Has anyone tried these? My only concern is that on the site it says to refer to the instructions for the DC version.  And the DC version says it will not operate reliably under 10 volts.  All but a couple of my locos have been re-motored so 10 volts is a pretty fast track speed.  Most run at a scale speed at 4-7 volts. If you are using these auto-reversers or a similar product I would like to hear about your experience. Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78090	From: Ray Puls	Date: 6/29/2016
Subject: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

Tim, I have almost the the exact layout that you are describing, the main difference is I am using TMCC/Legacy and have set up blocks on my layout that end in the middle of the reverse loops. I am also set to run conventional or TMCC/Legacy. I used an ATLAS relay along with an 8 pole dpdt relay on each loop. I activate the Atlas relay with the button that throws the switch and the relay reroutes the power depending on which way the switch is thrown. If I am remembering correctly you may get by with the Atlas relay by itself to do what you want to do that is reverse the current on the entire loop. I need to look for the instructions for the relay which you may find on the Atlas website. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78091	From: lhralco21	Date: 6/29/2016
Subject: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78092	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

Ray, Thanks for that.  Something like that might work for now.  I had not thought of using the turnout switch to also route power.  I'll look into the Atlas relays.  The turnouts are powered by Tortoise switch machines so they are always on.  That would not work out with a relay. But you got me thinking.   There are extra contacts in the tortoise motors.  Not sure if they would work for routing track power or just burn out. Probably just for powering indicator LEDs.  Something else to read up on. In the meantime I'll keep ballasting the bottom loop so the top loop can go on.  That is another subject.  Woodland Scenics medium ballast looks too fine.  Coarse looks too big.  I have had some luck putting the coarse into an old coffee grinder and mixing the result with medium ballast.  What is everyone using for S ballast? Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78093	From: Dale Smith	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016

Where?  This message is blank. Dale Smith On 6/29/2016 6:38 PM, bigbrotherlar@... [S-Trains] wrote:

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78094	From: first.lurk	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

Tim, I have two of the PSX-AR-AC units on the reverse loops on my layout.  I am very happy with them and they work as advertised. I ran some tests to answer your voltage question.  I have a 303 Atlantic that has been converted with a SnS can motor and ran it through the reverse loops at various voltages.  The reverse loop circuit worked fine at all voltages down to 4 volts.  At 3.5 volts, the circuit worked OK and the engine kept moving, but it ran rough.  At 3 volts, the circuit was not able to keep the engine moving even though it would move slowly when outside of the reverse loop. I run everything conventional on the layout.  I have run unmodified Flyer, can-motor Flyer, SHS, and American Models engines and trains through the reverse loops without a problem. I have not used the other controls on the PSX-AR-AC boards like the switch machine controls, so I cannot give an opinion about that part.  At this point, I am throwing the switches by hand, with hopes to remote control them in the future. Hope this helps.  Good luck with your layout. Marvin Hillsborough, NC mthiel at nc dot rr dot com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78095	From: tbennerohio	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

Marvin, That's the best news I have had all month!  Now to find who has them in stock.  Do you have any DCC supplier recommendations?  It will take 4 to get started, 2 for reverse loops and 2 for crossovers (which essentially make a reverse loop). I really appreciate your doing testing on them.  That was above and beyond the call of duty.  I probably will not use the ancillary features either.  The reverse loop functionality is magic enough.  As long as the smoke stays inside. Many thanks! Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78096	From: lhralco21	Date: 6/30/2016
Subject: Re: O and S Scale Train Show Sunday 7/10/2016

The Metrowest Model Railroading Society (A Not-For-Profit Organization) Proudly Presents….. O And S Scale Train Show SUNDAY, JULY 10th, 2016 Hudson Elk’s Hall 99 Park Street   Hudson, MA 01749 Ticket Prices:                                 Show Hours: $6 – Adults                                    10 AM - 4 PM $8 – Family Maximum FREE – Children 15 and Under ONE TIME SHOW OFFER! FOR SALE - Two Tables of American Flyer Parts From the 1950’s - 1960’s 2 Rail O Scale                                              2 Rail S Scale 3 Rail O Scale (Hi-Rail)                                2 Rail S Gauge American Flyer Narrow Gauge (Yes! Both O and S)             S and O Scale Door Prizes Books and Videos                                        Operating On-Site Modular Layout Refurbished, Bright New Display Hall          Close to Boston and Historic Sites Take I-495 to exit 25 (route 85 connector) to Hudson. Get on route 85 north (take a left at the intersection where The 99 Restaurant is on your right), go half way around the rotary and continue north on 85. Take a left on Brigham and a right on Park. The Elk’s Hall is on your left. For More Information: Larry Grant 347 Balcom Street Mansfield, MA 02048 508-337-6661 BigBrotherLar@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78097	From: racin510	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Lionel marker led's

Does anyone know of a source for the 2mm Challenger tender led's .... other than BiG-L?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78098	From: onghoe2002	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: wow!

Not able to show full e-mail message. You will view it by pressing here Yahoogroups error msgID: 211479 (Thu Jun 30 22:59:34 2016)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78099	From: srjaynes	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

The Atlas wiring diagram actually includes instructions for a reverse loop application.  Also if you haven't used the American Flyer reverse-loop relay, they are cinch-net simple.  They are powered from the turnout and change polarity when the turnout changes to accommodate returning to the main track.  This nifty trick is much more complicated with DC 2-rail operation.  This is a case where the AC 2-rail wiring is actually simpler than DC 2-rail wiring.  The 3-rail guys get a pass on this one.  Darn...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78100	From: first.lurk	Date: 7/1/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

Tim, I got my PSX-AR-AC circuits from the http://tonystrainexchange.com/ site. When I ordered them, they said that there is not much call for the AC version and they are not kept in stock.  But it only took about a week to get them. Marvin Hillsborough, NC

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78101	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78102	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 03 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 03 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78103	From: tbennerohio	Date: 7/4/2016
Subject: Re: Wiring plan and reverse loop questions

I have a couple coming from Tony's Train Exchange.  The funny thing is, when I spoke with them they had one ready and would ship a second, 'after we build it.' Apparently they modify the PSX-AR to operate on AC in their shop.  My bottom return loop should be wired and ready to test by the time the first one gets here.  Really looking forward to that! Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78104	From: dphobbies	Date: 7/5/2016
Subject: New S Manufacturer at Indy NMRA TRainshow

There will be a brand new S Scale manufacturer at Indy this week.  He will be exhibiting samples of his new S Scale line. As a favor to us (Des Plaines Hobbies/S Scale America), he will be showing an assembled model of our Thrall 2743 gondola. We received the production parts from our molder last week. They will be going to China for assembly shortly, but for those that can't wait, we will be bringing a few kit versions to Novi next month. Oh, you want to hear about the new S manufacturer.  It is Fox Valley Models (almost sounds like an adult escort service), respected manufacturer of N and HO.  Sitting under our gondola will be a sample of their new S Scale flex track. It will be code 138, compatible with Lionel and MTH. What's that you say? We need switches, not just flex track. Well, sitting beside the track will be prototype samples of true #5 turnouts. Next question, scale or hirail? Both. He is doing both a scale #5 left and right and a hirail left and right.  Yes Mildred, that is correct, a total of 4 turnouts, two for scale guys and 2 for the hirailrailers. Questions? Go to Indy and stop by the Fox Valley Models booth and see for yourself. Cost? Don't have a clue. Ask FVM. DCC  compatible? Come on, this is 2016. Thanks for reading, and oh, thanks to all of you who participated in our 33rd anniversary sale and our July 4th flash sale. No man should be allowed to have this much fun. Ron Sebastian Des Plaines Hobbies/S Scale America Disclaimer: I am not Fox Valley Models

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78105	From: beebear	Date: 7/5/2016
Subject: Re: New S Manufacturer at Indy NMRA TRainshow

Hey Ron   Have you given a thought to adding pictures on your web site of the S stuff you are selling.  If I don’t know what it looks like I probably won’t buy it.   John   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2016 8:16 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] New S Manufacturer at Indy NMRA TRainshow     There will be a brand new S Scale manufacturer at Indy this week.  He will be exhibiting samples of his new S Scale line. As a favor to us (Des Plaines Hobbies/S Scale America), he will be showing an assembled model of our Thrall 2743 gondola. We received the production parts from our molder last week. They will be going to China for assembly shortly, but for those that can't wait, we will be bringing a few kit versions to Novi next month.   Oh, you want to hear about the new S manufacturer.  It is Fox Valley Models (almost sounds like an adult escort service), respected manufacturer of N and HO.  Sitting under our gondola will be a sample of their new S Scale flex track. It will be code 138, compatible with Lionel and MTH. What's that you say? We need switches, not just flex track. Well, sitting beside the track will be prototype samples of true #5 turnouts. Next question, scale or hirail? Both. He is doing both a scale #5 left and right and a hirail left and right.  Yes Mildred, that is correct, a total of 4 turnouts, two for scale guys and 2 for the hirailrailers.   Questions? Go to Indy and stop by the Fox Valley Models booth and see for yourself. Cost? Don't have a clue. Ask FVM. DCC  compatible? Come on, this is 2016.   Thanks for reading, and oh, thanks to all of you who participated in our 33rd anniversary sale and our July 4th flash sale. No man should be allowed to have this much fun.   Ron Sebastian Des Plaines Hobbies/S Scale America   Disclaimer: I am not Fox Valley Models   Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78106	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/7/2016
Subject: Beautiful Trestle for sale

I have a like new 23750 lighted trestle bridge in a like new original box for sale. Lists for $75 in Excellent without box in the Greenberg's 2015 catalog. This looks to have never been used. If interested make me an offer I can't refuse. Photos available, but you can just look on page 211 of David Doyle's "American Flyer Trains" book. Looks EXACTLY like that one.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78107	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: AF locos

I know this list is officially S-gauge, but is AF O and HO discussion also allowed.  I don't know what other list to join for that.  Part of a junk collection that I just acquired turned out to have a 1938 AF Hudson in restoreable condition, and I'd like to throw out some questions about it.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78108	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Is this O or HO.  If it is HO, you may find information of interest on gilbertho.org.  Look for catalog number 200 for the 1938 HO Hudson. If it is O, I believe the 1938 version was actually a 2-6-4, but referred to as a Hudson.  If it is a 3/16 scale Hudson, which looks much like an S gauge Flyer Hudson, it is probably from 1939 or later.  Can you post a photo?  I'd like to hear more. Dale Smith On 7/8/2016 2:16 PM, Malcolm Laughlin mlaughlinnyc@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I know this list is officially S-gauge, but is AF O and HO discussion also allowed.  I don't know what other list to join for that.  Part of a junk collection that I just acquired turned out to have a 1938 AF Hudson in restoreable condition, and I'd like to throw out some questions about it.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78109	From: Bill Eppler	Date: 7/8/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Trains are cool Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78110	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

It's HO - looks exactly like the drawing on page 6 of the 1938 catalog.  At the moment, it's sitting in a shoe box top as a collection of mechanism and motor parts - an unusual and interesting mechanism to one who is accustomed to Lionel.  I'll post some photos later this weekend. I'm going to see how well I can restore it to close to original appearance and operating condition.  Hope someone on this list can explain the wiring to me.  As it came, there are wires from the two brushes to the tender, one to each truck.  What is odd is that on the two tender trucks the insulated wheels are on the same side, which doesn't seem like a way to get a voltage across the brushes.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78111	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Malcolm, There are a lot of variations on the prewar HO Hudsons.  In HO, the prewar Hudsons, along with the early post-war Hudsons, bear the same cab number, 5318, which is a prototype number and has nothing to do with the catalog number.  With the help of some very experienced Gilbert HO collectors, I have tried to illustrate many of the variations of these Hudsons at the gilbertho.org website.  Your loco is probably a 200 from 1938 or 1939, or a 112 from 1940 or 1941.  Go to http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/200.htm for information on the 200 or http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/112.htm for information on the 112.  Catalog illustrations are usually not detailed enough for comparisons and Gilbert played fast and loose with the illustrations, sometimes showing prior year production or similar items if they were "close enough." From what you said about two wires going to the brushes, I think you probably have a DC version of the locomotive, either a later model (early postwar) or an earlier one that has been converted.  As to the insulated wheels being on the same side, I would guess that they have been twisted around.  Are the couplers body mounted or truck mounted?  The 200 had body mount, but the 112 had truck mounted couplers as did the postwar models.  If you are seriously interested in Gilbert HO, you might consider the Gilberthotrains Yahoo group. Dale Smith On 7/9/2016 8:16 AM, Malcolm Laughlin mlaughlinnyc@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It's HO - looks exactly like the drawing on page 6 of the 1938 catalog.  At the moment, it's sitting in a shoe box top as a collection of mechanism and motor parts - an unusual and interesting mechanism to one who is accustomed to Lionel.  I'll post some photos later this weekend. I'm going to see how well I can restore it to close to original appearance and operating condition.  Hope someone on this list can explain the wiring to me.  As it came, there are wires from the two brushes to the tender, one to each truck.  What is odd is that on the two tender trucks the insulated wheels are on the same side, which doesn't seem like a way to get a voltage across the brushes.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78112	From: racin510	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

I would think American Flyer pre war would be fine as it seems they were much closer to 'S' scale, just running on 'O' gauge track.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78113	From: Bill Eppler	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Do you ever use the Thomas the tank trains? Sent from my iPhone On Jul 9, 2016, at 6:02 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I would think American Flyer pre war would be fine as it seems they were much closer to 'S' scale, just running on 'O' gauge track.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78114	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78115	From: mike rosz	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

I like it too.  wt '38 to WWII  just can not find it.  I do have some engines and cars,  wonder if a 'friend " has it.  and the link was there too. From: "racin510@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, July 9, 2016 5:02 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: AF locos   I would think American Flyer pre war would be fine as it seems they were much closer to 'S' scale, just running on 'O' gauge track.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78116	From: allscalerails	Date: 7/9/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #9 July / August 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #9 July / August 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.AllScaleRails.com Subscribe to out free email list & get notified when new issue come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join Click  HERE for Issue  http://www.allscalerails.com/ Included in this issue: Origins of the Engineer's Cap, How-To Card Stock Modeling, "Midwest Lines", B&O Headquarters, C&O Railroad Coaling Station Thurmond, WV Blueprints, News & New Products, Snap Shots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78117	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 10 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 10 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78118	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: New file uploaded to S-Trains

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the S-Trains group. File : /AF HO Hudson.JPG Uploaded by : mlaughlinnyc <mlaughlinnyc@...> Description : American Flyer HO Hudson - in kit form, I'm guessing this it a 1938/39 version You can access this file at the URL: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/files/AF%20HO%20Hudson.JPG To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398 Regards, mlaughlinnyc <mlaughlinnyc@...>

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78119	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Malcolm, After looking at the photo you posted in files, I think you are right about it being a 1938 or 39 version.  I also think it is the less detailed body which was early production, which probably makes it 38.  I can see the Bakelite and brass rimmed drivers.  There is also a field, so it is an AC motor.  I don't see any reverse unit, but these used either a sequence type (earlier models) or a DC Pulse unit.   I think getting a sequence reverse unit would be your best bet.  No couplers on the trucks, so this appears to be a model 200.  I don't see a tender shell, but that should be available.   Good luck in getting this restored.  It will be a major project, but it would be nice to see this running again. Dale On 7/9/2016 10:26 AM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Malcolm, There are a lot of variations on the prewar HO Hudsons.  In HO, the prewar Hudsons, along with the early post-war Hudsons, bear the same cab number, 5318, which is a prototype number and has nothing to do with the catalog number.  With the help of some very experienced Gilbert HO collectors, I have tried to illustrate many of the variations of these Hudsons at the gilbertho.org website.  Your loco is probably a 200 from 1938 or 1939, or a 112 from 1940 or 1941.  Go to http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/200.htm for information on the 200 or http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/112.htm for information on the 112.  Catalog illustrations are usually not detailed enough for comparisons and Gilbert played fast and loose with the illustrations, sometimes showing prior year production or similar items if they were "close enough." From what you said about two wires going to the brushes, I think you probably have a DC version of the locomotive, either a later model (early postwar) or an earlier one that has been converted.  As to the insulated wheels being on the same side, I would guess that they have been twisted around.  Are the couplers body mounted or truck mounted?  The 200 had body mount, but the 112 had truck mounted couplers as did the postwar models.  If you are seriously interested in Gilbert HO, you might consider the Gilberthotrains Yahoo group. Dale Smith On 7/9/2016 8:16 AM, Malcolm Laughlin mlaughlinnyc@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It's HO - looks exactly like the drawing on page 6 of the 1938 catalog.  At the moment, it's sitting in a shoe box top as a collection of mechanism and motor parts - an unusual and interesting mechanism to one who is accustomed to Lionel.  I'll post some photos later this weekend. I'm going to see how well I can restore it to close to original appearance and operating condition.  Hope someone on this list can explain the wiring to me.  As it came, there are wires from the two brushes to the tender, one to each truck.  What is odd is that on the two tender trucks the insulated wheels are on the same side, which doesn't seem like a way to get a voltage across the brushes.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78120	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Thanks Dale for the input.  I've just looked at your web site and now I understand a lot more about what I have. I have uploaded a photo of the locomotive to the group files as "AF HO Hudson".  The photo shows it in kit form after I disassembled and cleaned it. Given that the coupler is body mounted and I have brass rimmed drivers, would I be correct in concluding that this is probably a late 1939 200 ? One thing that is obvious to me now is that there must have been a reverse unit in the tender, and the wires from the brushes went to that and not directly to the trucks.  Apparently the previous owner (unknown to me) had messed around with the wiring.  The tender trucks don't have the nuts and bolt shown in your photos and there were wires directly from the trucks to the front wire tunnel. If Doug Peck from Portlines is monitoring this list, I'd like to hear if your inventory includes the AF reverse unit.  I'm thinking of a trip to Newburyport soon.  As is evident in the photo, the boiler front and lead truck also are missing. I suppose both trucks picked up from one rail.  The way the trucks are attached makes it impossible to turn them.  It looks like the current path to ground was through the frame to the pilot and trailing trucks and through the gears to the driver rims.  But if the earlier drivers had Bakelite tires, then what ?? This locomotive was part of a collection of mostly HO scale equipment that our club (NSMRC) bought as part of our show dealer operation.  Anything from the tinplate world is junk to them and that gives me a cheap source of all kinds of random stuff, which is how I got the AF Hudson - I take any Lionel, Marx and AF stuff that shows up when they buy a collection.  My main interest is Lionel, so I'm a casual dabbler in Marx and AF. Overall, this one is turning into an interesting restoration project.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78121	From: wyoaf	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Dump, dagnabit !!

I have an old 751 Log Loader on my layout that works perfectly.  Since I run knuckle couplers, I have two 914 log dump cars.  Last week, while playing with my grandkids and the trains I could not get either 914 to dump; the 3 big 7/8" log load was too much for them.  I thought that they used to handle it, but I may be wrong and just used them as receptacles for the 751.  A voltmeter shows 18v going to the special rail that powers the solenoid.  The solenoids work and dump  empty cars decisively.  I retrieved an old 717 link coupler log dump car, and it throws the 3 logs off as it should.   Does anyone in the Group have 914's that can handle the 3 big logs for a 751?  Thanks, John Davis Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78122	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF HO locos

Malcolm, Looking more closely at the tender trucks, the truck on the right has a slightly extended bolster.  I am not sure of the significance of that, as I was under the impression that the drawbar connected to the shell, not the truck and if this is a 200, as indicated by the two window rather than four window cab, we should not be dealing with truck mounted couplers.  I checked some source photos I have and the brass wheels on that truck should be on the left, or fireman's side, of the loco, but they are not.  I can only assume that this was not a hard and fast rule.   I think the other truck is the problem.  The wheel sets within that truck are on the wrong side, as the wipers should be next to the brass wheels.  You should check for insulation between the trucks and the frame and should find that one truck is insulated and one isn't.  Unless your previous owner tried to "improve" the pickup by putting 6 wheels on the same side in the tender and picking up ground from the locomotive, you should find one insulated truck.  The trucks should be attached by rivets. As to dating, I would say 1939 but you have the simplified two window chassis which was early production, but "early" eras may differ for bodies, as opposed to drivers. Dale On 7/10/2016 6:38 PM, Malcolm Laughlin mlaughlinnyc@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Thanks Dale for the input.  I've just looked at your web site and now I understand a lot more about what I have. I have uploaded a photo of the locomotive to the group files as "AF HO Hudson".  The photo shows it in kit form after I disassembled and cleaned it. Given that the coupler is body mounted and I have brass rimmed drivers, would I be correct in concluding that this is probably a late 1939 200 ? One thing that is obvious to me now is that there must have been a reverse unit in the tender, and the wires from the brushes went to that and not directly to the trucks.  Apparently the previous owner (unknown to me) had messed around with the wiring.  The tender trucks don't have the nuts and bolt shown in your photos and there were wires directly from the trucks to the front wire tunnel. If Doug Peck from Portlines is monitoring this list, I'd like to hear if your inventory includes the AF reverse unit.  I'm thinking of a trip to Newburyport soon.  As is evident in the photo, the boiler front and lead truck also are missing. I suppose both trucks picked up from one rail.  The way the trucks are attached makes it impossible to turn them.  It looks like the! current path to ground was through the frame to the pilot and trailing trucks and through the gears to the driver rims.  But if the earlier drivers had Bakelite tires, then what ?? This locomotive was part of a collection of mostly HO scale equipment that our club (NSMRC) bought as part of our show dealer operation.  Anything from the tinplate world is junk to them and that gives me a cheap source of all kinds of random stuff, which is how I got the AF Hudson - I take any Lionel, Marx and AF stuff that shows up when they buy a collection.  My main interest is Lionel, so I'm a casual dabbler in Marx and AF. Overall, this one is turning into an interesting restoration project.   Malcolm Laughlin,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78123	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016

I received  a postcard today announcing this event. Contact the email address below for details. September 17, 2016 Info:  ffg2016@...  SES Hall, Elk Grove, Ca Sponsored by the Sacramento Valley American Flyer Club

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78124	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016

I left my name off intentionally!. The last time I posted for this group, questions came to me. I just posted it. Ed Eckert Contact ffg@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78125	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/11/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016

September 17, 2016 Info:  ffg2016@...  SES Hall, Elk Grove, Ca Sponsored by the Sacramento Valley American Flyer Club

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78126	From: Doug Peck	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Malcolm, I’m not too knowledgeable about Gilbert HO, although I do have a fair accumulation of original HO parts, as well as repro parts, and some junker engines.  I do have the boiler fronts, and I should have the Hudson pilot truck. But I’m not sure about the HO reverse unit, which I assume was different from the postwar “S” units.  I could use some guidance (even a photo???)  from Dale on that, and then I can do some hunting. You are certainly welcome to come by here, but just check first to confirm my availability. But also be aware that most of my inventory is not here….it is at my off-site warehouse, so it’s a good idea to let me know in advance what you may be looking for when you come. If I don’t have it here, I can bring it back from the warehouse before you come. I’m well familiar with NSMRRC….in fact, I have a couple of AF “S” engines here for repair, from Ron N.     <<< One thing that is obvious to me now is that there must have been a reverse unit in the tender, and the wires from the brushes went to that and not directly to the trucks.  Apparently the previous owner (unknown to me) had messed around with the wiring.  The tender trucks don't have the nuts and bolt shown in your photos and there were wires directly from the trucks to the front wire tunnel. If Doug Peck from Portlines is monitoring this list, I'd like to hear if your inventory includes the AF reverse unit.  I'm thinking of a trip to Newburyport soon.  As is evident in the photo, the boiler front and lead truck also are missing. >>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78127	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016

Long way to drive for a 1 day shindig.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com   In a message dated 7/11/2016 9:03:57 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   September 17, 2016 Info:  ffg2016@...  SES Hall, Elk Grove, Ca Sponsored by the Sacramento Valley American Flyer Club

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78128	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Doug and Malcolm, My understanding is that the reverse units were the same as in S gauge.  I have a detailed photo of a sequence type of reverse unit posted at http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/200.htm   Just scroll down.  It looks like a standard post war unit might also fit.  As to the DC activated reverse unit, I have seen a photo of such a unit in an old version of Gary Klein's guide to Gilbert HO and the main unit looks much like the unit in the photo referenced above, but the coil side is raised about 1/2 way up.  In addition, there is what appears to be a separate DC relay next to it.  If I were doing the restoration, I would avoid the DC activation for a couple of reasons.  First of all it was pretty complicated in operation, requiring 3 pushes of the button if the train was in motion and only 1 when stopped.  Second, I am not sure exactly how it was wired and would probably have to seek out other more experienced collectors who could look inside a loco and draw up a wiring diagram.  Anyway, from the body details, Malcolm's appears to be an early unit which probably had the sequence reverse unit.  As to the boiler front, from Malcolm's picture it looks like his model had a headlight, which would require an appropriate boiler front.  I am not sure if the ones without headlight had a hole in the front.   In some ways, his unit matches the earlier variations and in others, the later variations.  I think the dating of the early/later dividing line may have differed for the different variations. I hope you are able to help him out. Dale On 7/12/2016 3:48 AM, 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Malcolm, I’m not too knowledgeable about Gilbert HO, although I do have a fair accumulation of original HO parts, as well as repro parts, and some junker engines.  I do have the boiler fronts, and I should have the Hudson pilot truck. But I’m not sure about the HO reverse unit, which I assume was different from the postwar “S” units.  I could use some guidance (even a photo???)  from Dale on that, and then I can do some hunting. You are certainly welcome to come by here, but just check first to confirm my availability. But also be aware that most of my inventory is not here….it is at my off-site warehouse, so it’s a good idea to let me know in advance what you may be looking for when you come. If I don’t have it here, I can bring it back from the warehouse before you come. I’m well familiar with NSMRRC….in fact, I have a couple of AF “S” engines here for repair, from Ron N.     <<< One thing that is obvious to me now is that there must have been a reverse unit in the tender, and the wires from the brushes went to that and not directly to the trucks.  Apparently the previous owner (unknown to me) had messed around with the wiring.  The tender trucks don't have the nuts and bolt shown in your photos and there were wires directly from the trucks to the front wire tunnel. If Doug Peck from Portlines is monitoring this list, I'd like to hear if your inventory includes the AF reverse unit.  I'm thinking of a trip to Newburyport soon.  As is evident in the photo, the boiler front and lead truck also are missing. >>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78129	From: Dale Smith	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Oops, I misspoke.  That should be same as in O gauge, though the S gauge units will probably work. Dale On 7/12/2016 10:02 AM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: My understanding is that the reverse units were the same as in S gauge.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78130	From: R G	Date: 7/12/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Not all of the reverse units in Gilbert's prewar 3/16th for  O scale are the same as post war locomotives. I have two early Gilbert prewar locomotives that have a unique reverse unit different than other ones. The 4-4-2 versions of the K-5 and B&O streamline locos have a reverse unit that does not have the same internal configuration, it works basically the same but the internal parts are totally different. On Tuesday, July 12, 2016 1:02 PM, "Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Doug and Malcolm, My understanding is that the reverse units were the same as in S gauge.  I have a detailed photo of a sequence type of reverse unit posted at http://www.gilbertho.org/rolling_stock/200.htm   Just scroll down.  It looks like a standard post war unit might also fit.  As to the DC activated reverse unit, I have seen a photo of such a unit in an old version of Gary Klein's guide to Gilbert HO and the main unit looks much like the unit in the photo referenced above, but the coil side is raised about 1/2 way up.  In addition, there is what appears to be a separate DC relay next to it.  If I were doing the restoration, I would avoid the DC activation for a couple of reasons.  First of all it was pretty complicated in operation, requiring 3 pushes of the button if the train was in motion and only 1 when stopped.  Second, I am not sure exactly how it was wired and would probably have to seek out other more experienced collectors who could look inside a loco and draw up a wiring diagram.  Anyway, from the body details, Malcolm's appears to be an early unit which probably had the sequence reverse unit.  As to the boiler front, from Malcolm's picture it looks like his model had a headlight, which would require an appropriate boiler front.  I am not sure if the ones without headlight had a hole in the front.   In some ways, his unit matches the earlier variations and in others, the later variations.  I think the dating of the early/later dividing line may have differed for the different variations. I hope you are able to help him out. Dale On 7/12/2016 3:48 AM, 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Malcolm, I’m not too knowledgeable about Gilbert HO, although I do have a fair accumulation of original HO parts, as well as repro parts, and some junker engines.  I do have the boiler fronts, and I should have the Hudson pilot truck. But I’m not sure about the HO reverse unit, which I assume was different from the postwar “S” units.  I could use some guidance (even a photo???)  from Dale on that, and then I can do some hunting. You are certainly welcome to come by here, but just check first to confirm my availability. But also be aware that most of my inventory is not here….it is at my off-site warehouse, so it’s a good idea to let me know in advance what you may be looking for when you come. If I don’t have it here, I can bring it back from the warehouse before you come. I’m well familiar with NSMRRC….in fact, I have a couple of AF “S” engines here for repair, from Ron N.     <<< One thing that is obvious to me now is that there must have been a reverse unit in the tender, and the wires from the brushes went to that and not directly to the trucks.  Apparently the previous owner (unknown to me) had messed around with the wiring.  The tender trucks don't have the nuts and bolt shown in your photos and there were wires directly from the trucks to the front wire tunnel. If Doug Peck from Portlines is monitoring this list, I'd like to hear if your inventory includes the AF reverse unit.  I'm thinking of a trip to Newburyport soon.  As is evident in the photo, the boiler front and lead truck also are missing. >>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78131	From: traindavid	Date: 7/13/2016
Subject: Re: Flyer Fling 2016

" Posted by: SnSTrains@... Date: Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:36 am ((PDT)) Long way to drive for a 1 day shindig. Steve Blackburn" Steve & all; this is not a toy train meet with lots of extras, it's intended as an "All S" train swap; no one is expecting you or anyone else to drive from Idaho to attend, however, we do hope folks will drive from northern and central, and even coastal California to attend! Of course, if you want to drive from Idaho, or even New Jersey, you will be most welcome here!! Oh there will be food on-site though, by a local youth group as a fund raiser (and their food is GOOOOD!) :) S'incerely, David Dewey (just a member of the sponsoring club, no official capacity!)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78132	From: Malcolm Laughlin	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: Re: AF locos

Thanks Doug and Dale for the input. Doug, I'm the guy who showed up in the spring last year with the prewar 401 that I'm restoring.  I'll check with you by email before I come. In regard to whether the s gauge revers unit would fit, the dimensions inside the tender casting are: W -1 5/16 H - 1 3/16       L -  front to first mounting hole  13/16, total length about 2 3/4   Malcolm Laughlin, 19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478 617-489-4383

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78133	From: Robert Graves	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: For Sale: American Flyer 175W 16B Transformer

Made from 1954 to 1956. It is in beautiful condition with no rust, only light scratches, and a little paint loss in the speed lettering. The cord has been replaced with a nice new one and the roller contact has been cleaned. My voltmeter says it works properly. The 2015 Greenberg guide lists it at $82.00 in excellent condition. The 2012 TM guide lists it at $70.00 in excellent condition. Pictures are available on request. Make me an offer I can't refuse!   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78134	From: Robert Graves	Date: 7/14/2016
Subject: For Sale: American Flyer 585 Tool Shed

Made from 1946 to 1952, it is in TCA Very Good condition with no rust, only light scratches, and a little paint loss in the trim and lettering. The door slides easily. The 2015 Greenberg guide lists it at $118.00 in excellent condition. Pictures are available on request. Make me an offer I can't refuse!   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78135	From: Tom	Date: 7/15/2016
Subject: Chuff chamber question

I have taken apart a non-functioning smoke-in-tender smoke unit and am preparing to re-assemble it. I noticed that there are slots in the two sides of the chuff chamber and I want to determine if a metal plate or sound board of some sort should be inserted in the chamber. A friend told me that he thought some AF smoke units have a plate in the chuff chamber with a hole in the middle that amplifies the chuff sound. I am not referring to the hole from the cylinder that the piston moves in that goes into the chuff chamber. Also I don not mean the hole that goes into the smoke chamber from the chuff chamber. The so-called plate, if it even exists, fits into the middle (approximately) of the chuff chamber of the SIT unit. There may or may not be a similar plate in each of the two versions of the smoke units used in AF locomotive boilers. I don’t recall seeing one previously but my memory may be failing me. So the question is whether or not such a plate exists and if I need to obtain one to put in the chuff chamber before re-assembling it. I don’t see enough detail in old service manuals or in Tom Barker’s books to determine if one exists. The follow up question is where can such a plate if it exists be obtained. I do not see a part like this listed on Doug Peck’s website or in his Repair clinic number one on smoke unit repair which makes me question the existence of such a plate. Any help or information any of you can provide is appreciated. Tom Detmer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78136	From: racin510	Date: 7/15/2016
Subject: Re: Chuff chamber question

All smoke in boiler units have that plate and it is essential for chuff sound. I don't have a cylinder type SIT unit but would have to assume it also essential for what ever chuff sound they create. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78137	From: traindavid	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: MTH F3---Wait until October!

Latest news about the MTH F units, delivery now scheduled for October. They say that we will like them. Hmmmm. (diesel roar sound effect) :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78138	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: New S-scale Figures

Model Tech Studios has some new, ready-to-go figures. They are pre-painted, so all you have to do is find a good spot for them on your layout! I just updated the NASG web site with their info. http://www.nasg.org/News/NewProducts.htm#688 More figures are in the works from the company, and they are open to your suggestions! - Peter (as NASG webmaster) -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78139	From: thecitrusbelt	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Layouts Needed For Central Coast RR Festival - Oct. 7-9 (Calif.)

The Central Coast Railroad Festival ( http://www.ccrrf.com/ ) returns this year on October 7, 8 and 9 (Friday-Sunday).   As in past years I will organize a tour of model railroads and garden railroads.   If you have an operating model railroad or garden railroad in San Luis Obispo County or northern San Barbara County please consider participating in the tour.   We are only asking railroad owners to be open for one day. Additional days are at the owner’s option. And we are asking owners in Santa Maria and areas south to be open only on Sunday.   Participating in a layout tour is a great way to share your work and meet your fellow model and garden railroaders.  You’ve probably worked hard on your railroad so you might as well get some recognition from people who will appreciate your efforts. And you probably will meet model railroaders from your own community.   All you need to do is operate your trains.  I will do all the planning and publicity, as I have done for forty-eight previously tours since 2006, including five previous tours for the Central Coast Railroad Festival. Last year we had nearly thirty layouts on the tour in almost all scales.   This will be a free, self-guided tour. No buses will be used.   If you have any questions before committing to the tour, please ask.  In any event, please contact me within two weeks if you are interested so we can schedule your tour. Contact me OFF LIST at:   chiefbobbb@... [chiefbobbb AT verizon DOT net]   Thank you.   Bob Chaparro Moderator Model Railroads of Southern California https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Model_Railroads_Of_Southern_California/info

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78140	From: tennsgauger	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Re: MTH F3---Wait until October!

The MTH rep that I talked to at the NMRA said that the F3s will probably be shipped with two paint schemes per month.     - Earl Henry, Nashville   In a message dated 7/16/2016 12:58:06 P.M. Central Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Latest news about the MTH F units, delivery now scheduled for October. They say that we will like them. Hmmmm. (diesel roar sound effect) :)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78141	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78142	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/16/2016
Subject: Re: MTH F3---Wait until October!

I'm not holding my breath Earl. They were scheduled for 2013, then 2014 followed by 2015 then May of this year now October of this year. All I can say is after a 3 plus year wait I hope they are everything we anticipated and more.    Bob Lampe    Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78143	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: you tube

Hi: Saw an interesting youtube video on real track problems. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0zpw6qUUXk Fairly interesting (as well as accompanying other videos). Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78144	From: traindavid	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

That is one BIG difference between SHS and MTH, for SHS the S stuff was their bread & butter, so all efforts were directed towards S. For MTH, I'm afraid S is sort of an afterthought, and only as important as Big L makes it appear (competition there). As for AF & L hurting S scale--BALONEY!!! S wouldn't even exist as a scale if it weren't for them. As for HO not having Hi-Rail--BALONEY! Hook couplers, oversized flanges are all on the starter sets. Granted, the visual difference isn't that great, as it is in S, but if you're an HO SCALE guy, you are changing wheelsets and couplers on lots of RTR stuff, and detailing it, weathering it, just like in S, although more folks are doing it because of the popularity of HO. One thing HO has had almost since the start is a more realistic looking standard (or universal) track system, S now has realistic track systems, not universal however, big downside there. IF a manufacturer were to market a REAL S line, by that I mean starter sets sold in major retail outlets, add-ons also and a full-line READY FOR DELIVERY catalog, then you'd see a growth spurt in S--however, in spite of what the government agencies tell us, the economy STINKS, and you will not likely find anyone willing to go out on a limb like that. One of the problems with a 4 year wait period is that folks move on, lose "discretionary income" or even die while waiting for the product. Even in a limited sales market, somehow the length of time of product announcement and product delivery HAS to be shortened. NO EXCUSES ANYMORE! That's what (IMHO) it will take to see growth in S.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78145	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 17 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 17 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78146	From: Roy Inman	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

The excuse that MTH makes for the slow delivery of S locos is that they had to reengineer them so that all the electronics would fit. 4 years seems kinda long a drawn out. Roy Inman On 7/17/16 12:23 PM, djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   That is one BIG difference between SHS and MTH, for SHS the S stuff was their bread & butter, so all efforts were directed towards S. For MTH, I'm afraid S is sort of an afterthought, and only as important as Big L makes it appear (competition there). As for AF & L hurting S scale--BALONEY!!! S wouldn't even exist as a scale if it weren't for them. As for HO not having Hi-Rail--BALONEY! Hook couplers, oversized flanges are all on the starter sets. Granted, the visual difference isn't that great, as it is in S, but if you're an HO SCALE guy, you are changing wheelsets and couplers on lots of RTR stuff, and detailing it, weathering it, just like in S, although more folks are doing it because of the popularity of HO. One thing HO has had almost since the start is a more realistic looking standard (or universal) track system, S now has realistic track systems, not universal however, big downside there. IF a manufacturer were to market a REAL S line, by that I mean starter sets sold in major retail outlets, add-ons also and a full-line READY FOR DELIVERY catalog, then you'd see a growth spurt in S--however, in spite of what the government agencies tell us, the economy STINKS, and you will not likely find anyone willing to go out on a limb like that. One of the problems with a 4 year wait period is that folks move on, lose "discretionary income" or even die while waiting for the product. Even in a limited sales market, somehow the length of time of product announcement and product delivery HAS to be shortened. NO EXCUSES ANYMORE! That's what (IMHO) it will take to see growth in S.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78147	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Magnificent Passenger cars for sale.

I have a set of 952-953-954 Maroon  passenger  cars with silhouettes and boxes. They are near mint. So good it is almost impossible to tell they are the painted version. Boxes for 952 and 953 are poor, but the 954 box is worthwhile. Offers accepted, but don't insult me. TCA and NASG member   Steve Blackburn 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78148	From: snstrains	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Magnificent passenger cars for sale.

I have a set of 952-953-954 Maroon  passenger  cars with silhouettes and boxes. They are near mint. So good it is almost impossible to tell they are the painted version. Boxes for 952 and 953 are poor, but the 954 box is worthwhile. Offers accepted, but don't insult me. TCA and NASG member   Steve Blackburn 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78149	From: Mark Kiner	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: F3 sf aba

All the talk about MTH F3 sets made me think about mine. I bought a set of the SHS F3 Santa Fe units about 4-5 years ago from someone on the list. I probably should sell them as they have not been out of the box since I bought them. I looked at them when I got them and they looked to be in nice shape. I believe they are DC but I don't remember as it is been four or five years since I have seen them. I did not pay much attention to AC or DC because I was going to convert them to to TMCC. They have been in a gladiator storage cabinet since I got them. Let me know if there is any interest and I will get more details. Someone should be playing with these as it seems as though I am not going to. Mark

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78150	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/17/2016
Subject: Re: F3 sf aba

Last year I bought an SHS A-B-A set of Santa Fe F-7's from a private party with the intention of stripping the Santa Fe paint and repainting them for the Northern Pacific's North Coast Limited. When my wife saw the Santa Fe F-7's she not only said no but  Hell no....you ain't gonna do it. Those are now mine get your own. I ended up getting 2 sets of SHS F-3's from Jeff Wilson Just before he closed Hoquat Hobbies. An A-B set of NYC and a set in EL. I was going to convert the 2 A's and one B to F-7's but might just leave them as F-3's and paint them for NP freight and get an MTH set of A-B-A's and convert them to F-7's and paint them for the North Coast Limited. Unless MTH has F-7's hot on the tail of the F-3's. Bob Lampe Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78151	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: About S gauge

David makes some valid points about the condition of S gauge, SHS vs. MTH, and the economy being flatlined.  It seems that the only people who believe the economy is doing better are in government, Wall Street, and the corporate media, and that's because they want US to think it is.  But enough about the economy as there is virtually nothing we can do about it. In pointing out the differences between S gauge and HO gauge, I would expand upon why S is in some disarray compared to HO.  First of all the difference in popularity is too vast to make a real comparison, but we can consider the distinctly different evolution of the two scales for a clue.  S was treated as a "toy" train and HO was treated as a "scale" train from their beginnings.   While the NMRA is concerned with all model railroad scales, they treat S and O gauges far different than HO and N, as if everyone in S and O still "plays with trains" while HO and N people are all "scale modelers.  While there are "standards" for both HO and N, there is little done for S and O, with the exception of when there was a sizable O "scale" following of many years ago.  Hence, S and O gauges are pretty much left to the manufacturer's whims. The "toy" train manufacturers have always seen their part of the train market as a competitive situation and make little or no attempt to standardize anything.  They do not want people to buy or use anything except what they each manufacture.  And this is not just between MTH and Lionel, but goes back almost 100 years.  Remember manufacturers such as Carlise & Finch, Ives, and Dorfan?  No? That's because they are long gone!  This long held competitive atmosphere works against standardization of track and other components. A further complication is the "Hi-rail" option.  Early HO and much foreign made HO up to the late sixties might be considered "Hi-rail," and most early O gauge was modified from toy like to more scale appearance in the early years of the "model" railroad hobby's development.  Today's "high end" O three rail is pretty close to "scale" but is actually "Hi-rail" with clunky wheels, couplers, and track.  And, of course we in S have a good following of "Hi-railers," scale modelers, and toy train folks.  The problem is that S is such a minority size, and split into three distinct styles of practicing it, that few manufacturers take it seriously. And that brings us back to why SHS worked hard to develop and produce products for S while MTH drags it's feet.  We are a "side show" to MTH, not it's focus.  The same is true of Lionel, compared to their primary business of making O gauge trains.  Picture MTH and Lionel as competing major circuses and S as the freak show outside.  They have no reason to make much high quality product in large numbers for S gauge.  And these two companies pretty much despise each other to boot! But one other thing separates S from the other scale/gauges; loyalty.  In all the years I have dabbled in S, be it as a child with American Flyer, or during the seventies when so much had to be built because there was no mass produced product, and since 1999 when I returned to S pretty much "full" time (I'm a "rubber gauger"), S gaugers of all stripes are loyal and fervent enthusiasts of the scale/gauge.  And that might well be BECAUSE we can "do our thing" in different ways.  We're not just "toy" train people, or "scale" model railroaders, but encompass every aspect of the train hobby. Weird, huh?  But it seems to work.  We defy direct comparison with the other scale/gauges because we are unlike any of the others.  And maybe such a "disadvantage" isn't one at all. Stumpy Stone ...in the hills of Eastern "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78152	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

Hi Stumpy, Not quite true. See this page: http://www.nasg.org/About/NASGStandards.htm Not only are there well-defined standards for S-scale standard-gauge, there are also standards for Sn3, some for Sn2, and, yes, there are some for "hi-rail" (what the NMRA calls "deep-flange"). The only place where the "manufacturer's whim" came into play, according to SHS' Don Thompson, was in the "hi-rail wheel contour" dimensions, and that was because, when they started working on it, there was no one else developing the standard. I've included their original documentation into that NASG page as well (see RP-24.3). - Peter. On 07/18/2016 9:14 am, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote: > While there are "standards" for both HO and N, there is little done > for S and O, with the exception of when there was a sizable O "scale" > following of many years ago. Hence, S and O gauges are pretty much > left to the manufacturer's whims. -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78153	From: Gary Chudzinski	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

traindavid comments: NO EXCUSES ANYMORE! That's what (IMHO) it will take to see growth in S.  BALONEY!!  As I previously mentioned, some are willing to spend someone else's money in their eagerness to get what they want!  It takes money; a person or company willing to take the risk and invest, and a customer's ability to buy!  What's in your inventory? Most of us don't mind posting our names so we can identify who we are communicating with! Gary Chudzinski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78154	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Thanks to those S-Trains operators who provided information to me with my 21812 Baldwin problem.    It is running well. It is appreciated and S-Trains is a great AF resource.   On another note, I’ve added 5 new American Flyer classics to my website – americanflyertrains4u.com.    Please scan the K335 Northern; 295 Pacific with air-chime whistle; 21100 Reading Atlantic;  355 C&NW Baldwin Switcher; and a 593 Signal Tower that is collector quality.   Have a great rest of the week.   Bob                          From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, June 06, 2016 5:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question     I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks.   Bob Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78155	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Hello Bob, check to see how much play you might have in the truck housing and the axles. Mark -------------------------------------------- On Mon, 7/18/16, 'Bob Iannacone' biannaco@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: RE: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, July 18, 2016, 4:44 PM   Thanks to those S-Trains operators who provided information to me with my 21812 Baldwin problem.    It is running well. It is appreciated and S-Trains is a great AF resource.  On another note, I’ve added 5 new American Flyer classics to my website – americanflyertrains4u.com.   Please scan the K335 Northern; 295 Pacific with air-chime whistle; 21100 Reading Atlantic;  355 C&NW Baldwin Switcher; and a 593 Signal Tower that is collector quality.  Have a great rest of the week.  Bob                         From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, June 06, 2016 5:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question    I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks.  Bob Virus-free. www.avast.com #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198 -- #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp #yiv3538114198hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp #yiv3538114198ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad p { margin:0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc #yiv3538114198hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78156	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 7/18/2016
Subject: Re: 21812 Baldwin Question

Good evening Mark.  There is 5” from wheel to wheel.  This is about normal.  I also changed out the truck assembly and tightened the screws.  I found out that 2 screws were loose.  I tested it out and at high speed, ran through 2 back-to-back crossovers with no problem.    Thanks for the contact Mark.  Have a great rest of the week.   Take care.   Bob         From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, July 18, 2016 9:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question     Hello Bob, check to see how much play you might have in the truck housing and the axles. Mark -------------------------------------------- On Mon, 7/18/16, 'Bob Iannacone' biannaco@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: RE: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, July 18, 2016, 4:44 PM   Thanks to those S-Trains operators who provided information to me with my 21812 Baldwin problem.    It is running well. It is appreciated and S-Trains is a great AF resource.  On another note, I’ve added 5 new American Flyer classics to my website – americanflyertrains4u.com.   Please scan the K335 Northern; 295 Pacific with air-chime whistle; 21100 Reading Atlantic;  355 C&NW Baldwin Switcher; and a 593 Signal Tower that is collector quality.  Have a great rest of the week.  Bob                         From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, June 06, 2016 5:35 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] 21812 Baldwin Question    I have a 21812 that only pulls 2 cars.  It has Pul-mors and track and wheels are clean.   Is there something else that I can check to find the problem?  Gear?  Wheels slipping?  Any help is appreciated. Thanks.  Bob Virus-free. www.avast.com #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198 -- #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp #yiv3538114198hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp #yiv3538114198ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad p { margin:0;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-mkp .yiv3538114198ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc #yiv3538114198hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv3538114198 #yiv3538114198ygrp-sponsor #yiv3538114198ygrp-lc 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78157	From: traindavid	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

Gary's posting: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP     Posted by: "Gary Chudzinski" chudgr@... grchud     Date: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:51 pm ((PDT)) traindavid comments: NO EXCUSES ANYMORE! That's what (IMHO) it will take to see growth in S. BALONEY!!  As I previously mentioned, some are willing to spend someone else's money in their eagerness to get what they want!  It takes money; a person or company willing to take the risk and invest, and a customer's ability to buy!  What's in your inventory? Most of us don't mind posting our names so we can identify who we are communicating with! Gary Chudzinski"   Sorry Gary, I didn't think my "user name" was any secret, I'm happy to post my "real" name: David Dewey Yes, it takes money, but if you (the manufacturer) are committed to producing a product, in today's communications and production world, I see NO excuse for the product to take 4 years to ship!  The "normal" retail world doesn't work that way--would you wait 4 years for a custom-built window for your house remodel?? My point being is that by the time the product is delivered, many folks have moved on to other stuff, or have passed away, or lost their income source. I think it's time All the toy train manufacturers faced reality--their marketing model is dying--or already dead! ACG had that problem when the made the NP passenger sets--didn't get them out in time for the Christmas market; really hurt the bottom line that year, and gave us a "collectable" after they (ACG) were gone. Run 'em if ya got 'em! (But you have to have them to run them!) :) S'incerely, David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78158	From: rm_hirailer	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

Gary Chudzinski wrote: "Most of us don't mind posting our names so we can identify who we are communicating with!" Gary, I don't know you (that's okay--you probably don't know me, either) or how long you've been a subscriber to S-Trains, but I will tell you that David J. Dewey, a.k.a. traindavid, is a well-known contributor to this chat board and is the former American Flyer Editor of the NASG Dispatch. He certainly has never attempted to hide in anonymity, nor is there any reason for him to do so. David has a deep well of knowledge and experience to share with us, and the hobby is much richer for his contributions. He offered his opinion, as is his right. Don't excoriate him for that. If you looked at his email address, you would see that his name, "djdewey," is present. YourS in fraternity, John Eichmann Boise

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78159	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

Pete...I stand corrected about the standards.  The question then becomes why are the track, wheels, and couplers so different?  Even the bodies don't match in scale in some cases.  Evidently, only the "scale" standards are being followed, and then not always 100%. This goes back to the "toy" manufacturers' competitive and proprietary natures.  Even if meant to follow the NMRA and NASG standards many of the toy/Hi-rail couplers won't correctly couple with other brands' products, nor will track connect to a competitors.   That being said, there ARE ways around this, just as we did in HO back in the fifties before NMRA standards were written.  Coupler conversion cars were very common in those days where you had one brand of coupler at one end and a different brand at the other in order to couple different brands of cars together.   Joining different manufacturer's track was often overcome by soldering them together if brass, and making rail joiners to glue track together if the rail was aluminum.   It was "where there;s a will, there's a way. In the end, I stand by my contention that practitioners of S scale/gauge tend to be more loyal despite the problems we face.  Unfortunately, there are not enough of us. Stumpy Stone in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78160	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Identifying self, was -- Re: [S-Trains] Re: MTH = YAWN

 ----- Original Message ----- From: number22@... [S-Trains] To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com . . . . . David J. Dewey, a.k.a. traindavid, is a well-known contributor to this chat board . . . . . > > > > > > > > Why should anyone sign his name to anything?  Back in the old days, when we wrote letters (before the time of some of you), we didn't sign out letters.  We just had a return address on the envelope one could check.   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan Edited by moderator With all these irrelevant name handles and new members, moderators sometimes have no idea who is posting. Remember polpock or something like that who constantly kept changing his id until Paul could completely ban him?  It is always friendlier for moderators to contact some one knowing their name, Mine is from my CB days, cars and trains. Sometimes when they see ironhorse_, they don't know who is who from the list. Also for the same reason for this latest post response. When posting,, please sign your name. New members will learn who posts on a regular basai and who has knowledge of our AF trains. We even get friendlier by knowing someones name. Thank you, Ed Eckert moderator

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78161	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

 ----- Original Message ----- From: mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] . . . . . . . .why are the track, wheels, and couplers so different? . . . . . . . . > > > > > > > > Perhaps that's just a rhetorical question, but it does have answers - and more questions.  Why doesn't newer AF couple with my original AF with the link couplers?    Maybe the track & wheel differences are related to the situation of there being two entirely different groups of people practicing essentially two different hobbies.  The first is the preservation & continuation of the AF toy train system of our youth.  Its prototype or ideal is found in the AF catalogs of various years, '46 to '66.  The second is model railroading in 1/64 scale.  Its prototype is the real railroads, now & in years gone by.  Expecting both hobbies to have iidentical track & wheel standards is like expecting world peace any time soon.  I think it's great that track can be devised, closed frogs &c, that will allow the operation of the rolling stock of both systems.   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78162	From: Doug Peck	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: SW-9 parts needed

Seeking highrail drive wheel sets and highrail couplers for two SHS SW-9 switchers. If anyone is operating these engines as scale units, and is willing to sell the highrail components, please let me know, with your price.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78163	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 7/19/2016
Subject: Re: Identifying self, was -- Re: [S-Trains] Re: MTH = YAWN

I sign my name ( when I remember to do so) as a courtesy to others so they know who said what. As for forgetting to sign my name hey gimme a break I'm 67 and had 2 mini-strokes on the same day a few years ago. I'm lucky I even remember my name lolol.                                                Bob Lampe                                                Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78164	From: traindavid	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Re: MTH = YAWN -- Its time to WAKE UP

Egads John, I'm going to have to wear a mask or a wig now! Way too much praise, but thank you! I will try to remember to sign things--I guess it's a sign of the times?? :) S'incerely, David "two rails" Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78165	From: trndad	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Franklin Factory Presentation Model

Just a heads up.  I typically start my day by checking a variety of auction web sites for any unusual American Flyer trains.  Today I found one of the Franklin Factory Presentation Models listed on shopgoodwill.com.  It's a bit rough but has the display board with the brass plate and looks complete.  My old 2012 TM guide lists it as worth $1200 and trending up.  No idea what it is worth today or what it might go for, but it is too rich for my blood (and pocketbook).  Check it out at:   http://www.shopgoodwill.com/auctions/The-Franklin-Train-31586673.html   Hope someone here gets it.  Good luck!   Dean Hall

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78166	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 7/20/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

Tom and all...  No question that there are standards for "scale" model railroading,  Even back when O "scale" (two rail) was still popular, they had standards when the "toy" three rail trains did not.  My "gripe" is not about "scale," it is about "toy" and "Hi-rail." Running and coupling O gauge three rail "toy" trains of various manufacturers isn't much of a problem.  The rail height, wheel flange depth, and couplers are "Lionel compatible" from the fifties.  These are the  "standards" for O gauge "toy" trains today and all brands are compatible, except for the electronics.   So perhaps my question should have been why wasn't this same process followed in S gauge "non-scale" trains?  I'll use couplers as an example:  Years ago, S Helper Service and American Models did this, and old Flyer, SHS, and AM equipment coupled up easily.  Lionel, who bought American Flyer in 1966 and still uses some of the tooling, naturally met these "defacto standards."  Others did not.  Worse yet, "Flyonel's" new trucks and couplers don't follow the old standards. There are "work arounds" to adapt different track and couplers, but they are not usually easy or cheap.  Even though there is fierce corporate competition in O "toy" trains, they "standardized" in a way that S is not.  Why not? Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78167	From: chuck_7612	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

As someone who decided to get into model railroading 6 months ago, my first decision was what scale and gauge to select. I ultimately chose S since it seemed large enough for me to be able to work on effectively and small enough to build an interesting enough layout in the space I have. But the barrier to entering S for me was the complication of rail, wheels and couplers that seemed to abound in my research. In weighing pros and cons, these 3 aspects comprised the biggest con on my list as rail, wheels and couplers seemed like a non-issue in HO and O from what I found. I'm still happy with my choice. But I certainly understand why those getting into the hobby would look to another scale because of the perception I felt after reading material on dozens of sites that incompatability among brands and eras was going to take way too much energy and time away from the fun of desigining, building and playing. Again, still pleased with my choice to get into S and with the help I have received from this group. I just hope others aren't staying out of S now and especially in the future because of this perception. Chuck

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78168	From: Ted Weiler	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

For you new, check out this S Scale model rr here in the Dallas area.  The owner converted to S from HO. Go here:  Colorado & Silver River Railroad - Home               Colorado & Silver River Railroad - Home Home Chip's Comments   Pictures New - 02/13 Videos Links   View on www.coloradoandsilve... Preview by Yahoo   Ted Weiler Weatherford TX On Thursday, July 21, 2016 12:50 PM, "chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: As someone who decided to get into model railroading 6 months ago, my first decision was what scale and gauge to select.  I ultimately chose S since it seemed large enough for me to be able to work on effectively and small enough to build an interesting enough layout in the space I have.  But  the barrier to entering S for me was the complication of rail, wheels and couplers that seemed to abound in my research.  In weighing pros and cons, these 3 aspects comprised the biggest con on my list as rail, wheels and couplers seemed like a non-issue in HO and O from what I found. I'm still happy with my choice.  But I certainly understand why those getting into the hobby would look to another scale because of the perception I felt after reading material on dozens of sites that incompatability among brands and eras was going to take way too much energy and time away from the fun of desigining, building and playing. Again, still pleased with my choice to get into S and with the help I have received from this group. I just hope others aren't staying out of S now and especially in the future because of this perception. Chuck ------------------------------------ Posted by: chuck_7612@... ------------------------------------ Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/S-Trains/ <*> Your email settings:     Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/S-Trains/join     (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email:     S-Trains-digest@yahoogroups.com     S-Trains-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:     S-Trains-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to:     https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78169	From: ac312	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Need hirail trucks and couplers

Fellow members, Years ago I purchased a Pacific Rail 40' boxcar kit not realizing it was less trucks & couplers. If someone has the trucks/couplers I need to complete this project please contact me off list. If you know of a dealer who stocks these items please respond to the list. Maybe someone else could use this information as well. Thanks for your time, Don Abrams

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78170	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: About S gauge

Great Pictures, great layout. Ed Eckert On Thursday, July 21, 2016 2:19 PM, "Ted Weiler flier61@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   For you new, check out this S Scale model rr here in the Dallas area.  The owner converted to S from HO. Go here:  Colorado & Silver River Railroad - Home               Colorado & Silver River Railroad - Home Home Chip's Comments   Pictures New - 02/13 Videos Links   View on www.coloradoandsilve... Preview by Yahoo   Ted Weiler Weatherford TX On Thursday, July 21, 2016 12:50 PM, "chuck_7612@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: As someone who decided to get into model railroading 6 months ago, my first decision was what scale and gauge to select.  I ultimately chose S since it seemed large enough for me to be able to work on effectively and small enough to build an interesting enough layout in the space I have.  But  the barrier to entering S for me was the complication of rail, wheels and couplers that seemed to abound in my research.  In weighing pros and cons, these 3 aspects comprised the biggest con on my list as rail, wheels and couplers seemed like a non-issue in HO and O from what I found. I'm still happy with my choice.  But I certainly understand why those getting into the hobby would look to another scale because of the perception I felt after reading material on dozens of sites that incompatability among brands and eras was going to take way too much energy and time away from the fun of desigining, building and playing. Again, still pleased with my choice to get into S and with the help I have received from this group. I just hope others aren't staying out of S now and especially in the future because of this perception. Chuck ------------------------------------ Posted by: chuck_7612@... ------------------------------------ Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/S-Trains/ <*> Your email settings:     Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/S-Trains/join     (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email:     S-Trains-digest@yahoogroups.com     S-Trains-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:     S-Trains-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to:     https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78171	From: Dr Trains	Date: 7/21/2016
Subject: Re: Need hirail trucks and couplers

I have original prs trucks....they are scale....I also have highrail trucks and couplers ....check my eBay listings under.....bidt4u.... peter -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 7/21/16, donabrams@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Need hirail trucks and couplers To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, July 21, 2016, 3:26 PM Fellow members, Years ago I purchased a Pacific Rail 40' boxcar kit not realizing it was less trucks & couplers. If someone has the trucks/couplers I need to complete this project please contact me off list. If you know of a dealer who stocks these items please respond to the list. Maybe someone else could use this information as well. Thanks for your time, Don Abrams

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78172	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 7/22/2016
Subject: Re: Need hirail trucks and couplers

Don,  You can look up American Models as a source. MTH makes the S Helper wheel sets. A company in Colorado has these at reasonable prices as well as many others.  Try www.sidetracks.net.  Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78173	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 7/23/2016
Subject: June/July 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ Getting Together          Glenn visits with two groups  S and O Scale Using Soldering Fixtures          Glenn explains how not to burn your fingers Building a Kinsman 30ft Composite Hopper          Raymond H. Hall shows us how he built his State-Line S Gaugers          Glenn visits State-Line S Gaugers What's on your Workbench Shows, Meets and So Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78174	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 24 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78175	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 24 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 24 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78176	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Paul Yorke's Web Site?

I noticed that Paul Yorke's web site is gone. Anyone know what happened, or is there a new web site address? http://www.trainweb.org/s-trains/ - Peter. -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78177	From: ejenterp@pacbell.net	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?

MONDAY, July 25, 2016 - IMPORTANT NOTICE: TrainWeb.org had a major web server failure a few days ago. After doing a restore we realized that many accounts and files are still missing. We had the professional backup service that we use do some research and they found that the most recent valid backup that can be recovered is from June 2015. It is going to take us a couple of days to get all the files recovered from that backup. Many of the links throughout TrainWeb might not be working during this process. Please check back later if they are not working now. We are instituting new backup procedures and notification alerts to insure this backup failure is not repeated. While repairing our web server we have also performed a significant upgrade to disk hardware and memory capacity of the system that will provide better performance and increased reliability. Sorry for the inconvenience and thank you for your patience. In the meantime, if you are a webmaster with your website hosted on TrainWeb.org and have your own personal copy of all your files on your computer, please re-upload them to your website. We will not overwrite any files that have been uploaded on or after Saturday, July 23, 2016. If your web account is completely missing, or if you require additional disk space, or run into any other upload problems, please send us an email at zz2@.... Once you have finished re-uploading your files, please send an email to zz2@... with your web address (URL) at TrainWeb.org. We will put you on the priority queue to be featured as "Today's Featured TrainWeb Site" on the main page of TrainWeb and on the TrainWeb Facebook Pages. We will also add your website to the new TrainWeb Directory atTrainWeb.com/directory if your website is not already listed there. Thank you!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78178	From: Richard Falzini	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?

Maybe he did not pay his hosting fee or decided not to keep it on line. Or he didn't renew his domain name Or both Rich Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 3:35 PM, Peter Vanvliet groups@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I noticed that Paul Yorke's web site is gone. Anyone know what happened, or is there a new web site address? http://www.trainweb.org/s-trains/ - Peter. -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78179	From: EDWARD ECKERT	Date: 7/26/2016
Subject: Re: Paul Yorke's Web Site?

MONDAY, July 25, 2016 - IMPORTANT NOTICE: TrainWeb.org had a major web server failure a few days ago. After doing a restore we realized that many accounts and files are still missing. We had the professional backup service that we use do some research and they found that the most recent valid backup that can be recovered is from June 2015. It is going to take us a couple of days to get all the files recovered from that backup. Many of the links throughout TrainWeb might not be working during this process. Please check back later if they are not working now. We are instituting new backup procedures and notification alerts to insure this backup failure is not repeated. While repairing our web server we have also performed a significant upgrade to disk hardware and memory capacity of the system that will provide better performance and increased reliability. Sorry for the inconvenience and thank you for your patience. In the meantime, if you are a webmaster with your website hosted on TrainWeb.org and have your own personal copy of all your files on your computer, please re-upload them to your website. We will not overwrite any files that have been uploaded on or after Saturday, July 23, 2016. If your web account is completely missing, or if you require additional disk space, or run into any other upload problems, please send us an email at zz2@.... Once you have finished re-uploading your files, please send an email to zz2@... with your web address (URL) at TrainWeb.org. We will put you on the priority queue to be featured as "Today's Featured TrainWeb Site" on the main page of TrainWeb and on the TrainWeb Facebook Pages. We will also add your website to the new TrainWeb Directory atTrainWeb.com/directory if your website is not already listed there. Thank you! On Tuesday, July 26, 2016 12:48 PM, "Peter Vanvliet groups@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I noticed that Paul Yorke's web site is gone. Anyone know what happened, or is there a new web site address? http://www.trainweb.org/s-trains/ - Peter. -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78180	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 31 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78181	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 31 July 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 31 July 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78182	From: mark_h_charles	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: a favorite loco and color scheme

Attachments : DSCF0290-lores.jpg Here is one of my favorite diesels -- Fairbanks-Morse Trainmaster by American Models -- in a FM demonstrator color scheme. The attached shows Tom Hess's model running on his hi-rail layout. He'll be hosting an open house at the NASG 2016 convention, August 11-14.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78183	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

Hi Group, I purchased a 310 Penn 4-6-2 steam engine a couple of years, one in need of some tender loving care. I now have some time to clean it up and repaint. Placed it on the track yesterday after replacing the motor with a dc can motor.  Runs fine until I get to a AF switch (turn out) then more times than not it will derail. More on right turns than on left.  I noticed 2 spring loaded buttons on the bottom of the under the front driver. I do not know what they are for. Any chance this could be causing the derail?  What are they fore any way?  Thanks for any help. Wayne in ILLINOIS

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78184	From: R G	Date: 7/31/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

The buttons were for a track trip that was never produced. They are probably not the problem anyway. make sure that the driver metal tires are tight on the rims. if they have shifted then the locomotive can derail due to too narrow of a wheel gauge.  Early production locomotives are known for loose rims on the drive wheels.  Also check one other thing. I had a K-5 that sat too low and would also derail due to the front trucks not being able to move to the sides. I place  small washers at the front screw holes between the shell and the frame to raise the boiler shell higher. This cured the derailment problem. Rich On Sunday, July 31, 2016 10:27 PM, "Wayne Zebron zebbie61354@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hi Group, I purchased a 310 Penn 4-6-2 steam engine a couple of years, one in need of some tender loving care. I now have some time to clean it up and repaint. Placed it on the track yesterday after replacing the motor with a dc can motor.  Runs fine until I get to a AF switch (turn out) then more times than not it will derail. More on right turns than on left.  I noticed 2 spring loaded buttons on the bottom of the under the front driver. I do not know what they are for. Any chance this could be causing the derail?  What are they fore any way?  Thanks for any help. Wayne in ILLINOIS

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78185	From: traindavid	Date: 8/1/2016
Subject: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

Wayne, The brass buttons indicate your loco is '46 or early '47. They shouldn't interfere with anything, though if you are worried about them, you could always use a little RTV to "glue" them in a recessed position. They activated signals when a trip was put in the tracks. These trips are very scarce, not many made apparently. You problem is more likely mis-gauged drivers, caused by shrinking whitewall plastic, which lets the driver tires become loose. This was a known problem early on, and the cause of a factory "recall" in '47 where service stations drilled holes in the tires & wheels and inserted wooden pins to keep everything together. Nowadays we use epoxies or "super glue" to do the job. As all Gilbert steamers only ride on the four "corner" drivers, gauge is critical for smooth operation through turnouts.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78186	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

There seems to be some disagreement as to whether the 695 track trip was ever actually produced.  I don't remember ever seeing one.  Does anyone have a sample?  It just occurred to me that it would an interesting project to make a working replica, even if it doesn't look exactly like the catalog illustration.  It's obvious enough how it worked.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78187	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 8/2/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

Lonny Beno owns one 695 trip and knows of another one.  Those may be the only two in existence.   Carl Rudolph

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78188	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/3/2016
Subject: Re: 310 K$ Penn 4-6-2 steam engine

Yes, I’ve seen one, at York, a few years ago, complete with the original paperwork as I recall.  But they definitely qualify as “rare” !   << There seems to be some disagreement as to whether the 695 track trip was ever actually produced. I don't remember ever seeing one. Does anyone have a sample? It just occurred to me that it would an interesting project to make a working replica, even if it doesn't look exactly like the catalog illustration. It's obvious enough how it worked. >>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78189	From: reefma_99	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

http://thegilbertgallery.org/Infrastructure%20Gallery/infrastructure_Track_Accessories.html There's one shown on this page! Doug K     On 08/04/16, 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]com> wrote:     Yes, I’ve seen one, at York, a few years ago, complete with the original paperwork as I recall.  But they definitely qualify as “rare” !   << There seems to be some disagreement as to whether the 695 track trip was ever actually produced. I don't remember ever seeing one. Does anyone have a sample? It just occurred to me that it would an interesting project to make a working replica, even if it doesn't look exactly like the catalog illustration. It's obvious enough how it worked. >>    Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78190	From: lionely6b	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: Digest Number 7155

Re: 310 K5 Penn 4-6-2 steam engine As has Doug and Carl, I have handled a few No. 695s, as well. The existance of original paperwork indicates that  there was a very small production run in '46. The No. 695 is listed on page 70 of the 2012 edition of the TM AF Guide. Bob Bubeck  Re: 310 K5 Penn 4-6-2 steam engine Yes, I've seen one, at York, a few years ago, complete with the original paperwork as I recall. But they definitely qualify as "rare" ! << There seems to be some disagreement as to whether the 695 track trip was ever actually produced. I don't remember ever seeing one. Does anyone have a sample? It just occurred to me that it would an interesting project to make a working replica, even if it doesn't look exactly like the catalog illustration. It's obvious enough how it worked. >> Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78191	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

That's the 695 reverse loop relay, a different and later item with the same number.  We were talking about the 695 track trip, which is shown on p. 28 of the 1946 catalog.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78192	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/4/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

I have just updated that page of the Gilbert Gallery to include the picture from the 1946 catalog.   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "randallhicks@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2016 6:05 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 695 track trip   That's the 695 reverse loop relay, a different and later item with the same number.  We were talking about the 695 track trip, which is shown on p. 28 of the 1946 catalog.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78193	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/5/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

Thanks to Lonny Beno, a picture of the real thing is now on the Gilbert Gallery website:           <www.thegilbertgallery.org/Infrastructure%20Gallery/infrastructure_Track_Accessories.html>   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "randallhicks@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2016 6:05 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 695 track trip   That's the 695 reverse loop relay, a different and later item with the same number.  We were talking about the 695 track trip, which is shown on p. 28 of the 1946 catalog.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78194	From: michael Cantu	Date: 8/6/2016
Subject: 24221 Hopper and 24633 Caboose

Looking for a 24221 Hopper and 24633 Caboose in excellent condition for sale. Contact me here or at mpcantu@... Mike Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78195	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 07 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78196	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: 314 AW

Anybody out there in the ether have a whistle control for a 314 AW that they don't need or want??  I Need one.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78197	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW

Have functional repros if you don’t come up with an original.   <<< Anybody out there in the ether have a whistle control for a 314 AW that they don't need or want?? I Need one. >>>   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78198	From: ken	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

I have a customer who wants to convert a large number of link couplers to knuckle couplers.  He has converted a large number of locos to Dead Rail DCC and now wants to upgrade his rolling stock. I have done a few conversions, generally due to a broken link coupler, and the cost of the Flyer conversion  pack runs around $7 a pair plus shipping on the internet.  I am looking to convert up to 50 cars, were these conversion couplers ever sold in large bulk packs?  The biggest I have seen was only 3 pairs.   ken clark Repower and Remotor moderator Flyer operator since '53

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78199	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 07 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 07 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78200	From: snstrains	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

I have four #520 conversion kits in original packages. (NOS) available if that will help you in any way. Otherwise Port LInes Hobby can sell you individual couplers and pins in any amount you need.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 8/7/2016 10:44:18 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I have a customer who wants to convert a large number of link couplers to knuckle couplers.  He has converted a large number of locos to Dead Rail DCC and now wants to upgrade his rolling stock. I have done a few conversions, generally due to a broken link coupler, and the cost of the Flyer conversion  pack runs around $7 a pair plus shipping on the internet.  I am looking to convert up to 50 cars, were these conversion couplers ever sold in large bulk packs?  The biggest I have seen was only 3 pairs.   ken clark Repower and Remotor moderator Flyer operator since '53

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78201	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW

Not original, but I can build one of Tom Barkers versions for you.CB From: "SnSTrains@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2016 10:30 PM Subject: [S-Trains] 314 AW   Anybody out there in the ether have a whistle control for a 314 AW that they don't need or want??  I Need one.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78202	From: rhicks308	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

I made a working replica of the 695 track trip, and at least I can tell you why this item wasn't produced for very long.  First of all, the tolerance on the vertical clearance of the contact surfaces is very small, although I suppose this wouldn't be so much of a problem for a production item.   But the time during which contact is made is very short and can't be adjusted.  And I think we must be having problems with the brass buttons bouncing as they hit the trip, so contact is intermittent.  And the faster the locomotive goes, the worse these problems become.  So while it works, it's not very reliable, not like the 697 we all know and love.  But it was nice to get those little brass buttons to do what they were designed for. I have a brief video of it in operation, but I couldn't figure out how to add it to the photo gallery. And don't even ask.  You couldn't pay me enough to make another one of these things.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78203	From: snstrains	Date: 8/7/2016
Subject: Re: 314 AW

I found one, thanks everybody.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 8/7/2016 2:47:59 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Not original, but I can build one of Tom Barkers versions for you.CB From: "SnSTrains@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2016 10:30 PM Subject: [S-Trains] 314 AW   Anybody out there in the ether have a whistle control for a 314 AW that they don't need or want??  I Need one.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78204	From: Phyllis Bothwell	Date: 8/8/2016
Subject: Auction at Novi

Hello Folks, I'm putting on my Auctioneer Hat (Actually it's one of those beanies with a propeller.) again to remind everyone that good items make good auctions. If you're coming to Novi consider bringing a few things to sell. Clean out those closets, and add to the fun. You get 90% of the sale. The NASG gets the other 10%, and we all have fun. It's a win-win-win! Hope to see you there. Jamie Bothwell Currently 7 miles from Novi

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78205	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

Ken,   I have ordered the conversion pins from Doug at Portlines by the bulk pack of 100, enough for 50 cars. I am sure he would also have a bulk price for the split couplers that yo need also. I would call him Tuesday and talk to him. CB From: "ken ken@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 7, 2016 12:42 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Knuckle coupler conversion kits   I have a customer who wants to convert a large number of link couplers to knuckle couplers.  He has converted a large number of locos to Dead Rail DCC and now wants to upgrade his rolling stock. I have done a few conversions, generally due to a broken link coupler, and the cost of the Flyer conversion  pack runs around $7 a pair plus shipping on the internet.  I am looking to convert up to 50 cars, were these conversion couplers ever sold in large bulk packs?  The biggest I have seen was only 3 pairs.   ken clark Repower and Remotor moderator Flyer operator since '53

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78206	From: Noplowboy@...	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

ebay had pack of 60 -----Original Message----- From: ken ken@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 7, 2016 11:44 am Subject: [S-Trains] Knuckle coupler conversion kits   I have a customer who wants to convert a large number of link couplers to knuckle couplers.  He has converted a large number of locos to Dead Rail DCC and now wants to upgrade his rolling stock. I have done a few conversions, generally due to a broken link coupler, and the cost of the Flyer conversion  pack runs around $7 a pair plus shipping on the internet.  I am looking to convert up to 50 cars, were these conversion couplers ever sold in large bulk packs?  The biggest I have seen was only 3 pairs.   ken clark Repower and Remotor moderator Flyer operator since '53

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78207	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: Re: 695 track trip

No, that picture isn't the track trip. It's the 695 Reverse Loop Relay. My apology for the confusing web page layout.   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "scubadoo22@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2016 4:13 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] 695 track trip   http://thegilbertgallery.org/Infrastructure%20Gallery/infrastructure_Track_Accessories.html There's one shown on this page! Doug K     On 08/04/16, 'Doug Peck' doug@... [S-Trains]com> wrote:     Yes, I’ve seen one, at York, a few years ago, complete with the original paperwork as I recall.  But they definitely qualify as “rare” !   << There seems to be some disagreement as to whether the 695 track trip was ever actually produced. I don't remember ever seeing one. Does anyone have a sample? It just occurred to me that it would an interesting project to make a working replica, even if it doesn't look exactly like the catalog illustration. It's obvious enough how it worked. >>    Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78208	From: acgilbertguy	Date: 8/9/2016
Subject: a-Koostikin AF 595 Talking Tool Shed

Does anyone on this group have one of these AF 595 Talking Tool Sheds?  If so, could you post a video of it in operation?  I'm curious to know what it sounds like. Thanks, Rich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78209	From: stevew970	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: room share at Novi

My wife decided not to come with me to the NASG convention, so I have a room to share.  Contact me offline if interested. Steve Wolcott

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78210	From: William J. Gill	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

Good luck on finding AF compatible knuckle couplers. I have heard the supply is dwindling and the price is going up. Also heard that whoever was making reproductions is no longer doing so. Sounds like a job for a creative person with a 3-D printer. It may be cheaper to cannibalize cheap junker cars if you can find them. I’ve seen lots on ebay 20 or so at a time but some in the lot broken. Alternatives abound like scale or Kadee couplers but it will be a challenge to find 50 in one swoop. It is likely hunt & peck time. Good Luck again, Bill, Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78211	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/10/2016
Subject: I gave in to temptation - my AF fleet doubled in size yesterday

I had promised myself that I would not fall prey to temptation - i.e. the temptation to buy more model train stuff. A couple of weeks ago, I failed my first test when I found a rather neat Marx Diesel freight set. And then yesterday I failed again when I went to an estate sale (on the 2nd day yet!  50% discount day) and there was not one but two AF steam engines and a couple of freight cars.  And I do so love those old AF steam engines. So out came the checkbook and I walked away with a 322 (nice condition but missing the trailing truck - no big deal - smoke unit and chuff in the engine - now I have a smoking AF to go along with my 310), a 302 (pretty much complete - also has smoker in the engine - yeah!! ).  Both of these engines do have tenders. There is some work to do on each of them but I will get to that this winter when I have a bit of time. Also picked up two more cabooses, a 716 side dumping hopper, a 623 IC refrigerated car, a 641 Frisco gondola, a 625G tank car and a 629 MoPac stock car. Nothing great but it does expand my AF fleet by a bunch.  So do I feel guilty?  Well, not really! Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78212	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

Forgot to add....if the price of new KCs increases at all, it will be minor. Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby  www.portlines.com  Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78213	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: Knuckle coupler conversion kits

Still have plenty of KCs available.  But we also expect to have a new supply available by  York.  Don't  panic !!! Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78214	From: bill hoglund	Date: 8/11/2016
Subject: Re: I gave in to temptation - my AF fleet doubled in size yesterday

Sound like a once in a lifetime opportunity! A.F. stuff is hard to find in the wild! On Wednesday, August 10, 2016 4:09 PM, "bob.groh@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I had promised myself that I would not fall prey to temptation - i.e. the temptation to buy more model train stuff. A couple of weeks ago, I failed my first test when I found a rather neat Marx Diesel freight set. And then yesterday I failed again when I went to an estate sale (on the 2nd day yet!  50% discount day) and there was not one but two AF steam engines and a couple of freight cars.  And I do so love those old AF steam engines. So out came the checkbook and I walked away with a 322 (nice condition but missing the trailing truck - no big deal - smoke unit and chuff in the engine - now I have a smoking AF to go along with my 310), a 302 (pretty much complete - also has smoker in the engine - yeah!! ).  Both of these engines do have tenders. There is some work to do on each of them but I will get to that this winter when I have a bit of time. Also picked up two more cabooses, a 716 side dumping hopper, a 623 IC refrigerated car, a 641 Frisco gondola, a 625G tank car and a 629 MoPac stock car. Nothing great but it does expand my AF fleet by a bunch.  So do I feel guilty?  Well, not really! Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78215	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: K4 penn steam engine

Thanks to all who offered suggestions. This is what is great about the group, lots of help!  It is running much better, but a few bugs yet to be worked out. Thanks, Wayne

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78216	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

I played around with a new shelf layout the other day and, because quiet running is highly desirable, I wanted to use the pink insulating board you buy at Lowe's, Home Depot, etc. The pink board also makes it easy to carve in creeks, etc.  BUT darned if I know how to hold the tracks down! One layout is AF S gauge using old AF track, a 2nd will be O gauge (using either Marx or old style Lionel track) - in either case, I can use the holes in the ties to tie things down. But the pink stuff is just awful at retaining nails or screws!  In fact, I would go so far as to say neither works. Plus the problem, with screws, they just are too big to go through the holes in the ties (on the Marx track at any rate). If I build on top of a plywood sheet (adds a lot of weight - I want to try a simple grid) then I could go through the pink foam into the plywood but that transmits the noise through the foam. So any thoughts out there? Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78217	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

Bob,    I have never used pink insulation board but might I suggest liquid nails? Mark your centerline and then lay a bead down either side and using a putty knife level it out.                                                                Bob Lampe                                                                Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78218	From: poniaj	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

Bob, I'll echo another's reply in that Liquid Nails works well, but be sure to use the type that's compatible with foam insulation, otherwise it will melt the foam.  However, I used a roadbed in addition to further insulate the sound, California Roadbed which is a homosote material.  I used Liquid Nails on that too to hold down the track.  It's not easlily available any more, but there's a lot of other types out there.  One company, which I cannot remember, makes a foam rubber type that looks like it will REALLY isolate the tracks from any surface, especially if you're going to put it all on a plywood base..  Look into it. Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78219	From: jhannawald	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

Bob,   On my portable layout I use florist wire though the hole in the tie and on the out side of the tie and then push each end though the insulation board and tie it off by twisting the ends together on the bottom then it can be pushed up into the foam so the foam will lay flat.   Jim Hannawald   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 12, 2016 12:56 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board     I played around with a new shelf layout the other day and, because quiet running is highly desirable, I wanted to use the pink insulating board you buy at Lowe's, Home Depot, etc. The pink board also makes it easy to carve in creeks, etc.  BUT darned if I know how to hold the tracks down! One layout is AF S gauge using old AF track, a 2nd will be O gauge (using either Marx or old style Lionel track) - in either case, I can use the holes in the ties to tie things down. But the pink stuff is just awful at retaining nails or screws!  In fact, I would go so far as to say neither works. Plus the problem, with screws, they just are too big to go through the holes in the ties (on the Marx track at any rate). If I build on top of a plywood sheet (adds a lot of weight - I want to try a simple grid) then I could go through the pink foam into the plywood but that transmits the noise through the foam. So any thoughts out there? Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78220	From: Jim	Date: 8/12/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

You might consider a product called RV Goop. You can get it at Wallyworld in the RV section.  It will stick the track down but will allow you to remove it if necessary. Similar to silicone but more of an adhesive. Jim  On 8/12/2016 5:56 PM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Bob, I'll echo another's reply in that Liquid Nails works well, but be sure to use the type that's compatible with foam insulation, otherwise it will melt the foam.  However, I used a roadbed in addition to further insulate the sound, California Roadbed which is a homosote material.  I used Liquid Nails on that too to hold down the track.  It's not easlily available any more, but there's a lot of other types out there.  One company, which I cannot remember, makes a foam rubber type that looks like it will REALLY isolate the tracks from any surface, especially if you're going to put it all on a plywood base..  Look into it. Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78221	From: Eric	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

I used clear RTV.  Not the paintable Caulk (although that may work) but the regular RTV.  This stuff sticks well to the foam, the plywood and in my case, many pieces of SHS track and switches. I just put the track together then slip the nozzle under and leave a large blob every few inches. Put some heavy weights on it overnight and it is done. Make sure it is held down firmly everywhere you are glueing.  I do just a few feet at a time.   The best thing is that it is removable!  Use a thin putty knife and a hammer forceing the knife under the track and it pops free.  The RTV can then be scraped off the plywood or peeled off the track or foam. I have made many changes in track layout and done this. Liquid nails would work but I doubt if will ever come off the track. Eric Reis Kenmore, Wa. On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 4:56 PM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Bob, I'll echo another's reply in that Liquid Nails works well, but be sure to use the type that's compatible with foam insulation, otherwise it will melt the foam.  However, I used a roadbed in addition to further insulate the sound, California Roadbed which is a homosote material.  I used Liquid Nails on that too to hold down the track.  It's not easlily available any more, but there's a lot of other types out there.  One company, which I cannot remember, makes a foam rubber type that looks like it will REALLY isolate the tracks from any surface, especially if you're going to put it all on a plywood base..  Look into it. Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78222	From: railandsail	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: How to hold tracks down to pink insulating board

I like this idea as I can think of many situations where I have found a need to change my trackplan, even if ever so slightly. Brian I used clear RTV.  Not the paintable Caulk (although that may work) but the regular RTV.  This stuff sticks well to the foam, the plywood and in my case, many pieces of SHS track and switches. I just put the track together then slip the nozzle under and leave a large blob every few inches. Put some heavy weights on it overnight and it is done. Make sure it is held down firmly everywhere you are glueing.  I do just a few feet at a time.   The best thing is that it is removable!  Use a thin putty knife and a hammer forceing the knife under the track and it pops free.  The RTV can then be scraped off the plywood or peeled off the track or foam. I have made many changes in track layout and done this. Liquid nails would work but I doubt if will ever come off the track. Eric Reis Kenmore, Wa. On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 10:00 PM, Eric ericrhere@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I used clear RTV.  Not the paintable Caulk (although that may work) but the regular RTV.  This stuff sticks well to the foam, the plywood and in my case, many pieces of SHS track and switches. I just put the track together then slip the nozzle under and leave a large blob every few inches. Put some heavy weights on it overnight and it is done. Make sure it is held down firmly everywhere you are glueing.  I do just a few feet at a time.   The best thing is that it is removable!  Use a thin putty knife and a hammer forceing the knife under the track and it pops free.  The RTV can then be scraped off the plywood or peeled off the track or foam. I have made many changes in track layout and done this. Liquid nails would work but I doubt if will ever come off the track. Eric Reis Kenmore, Wa. On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 4:56 PM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Bob, I'll echo another's reply in that Liquid Nails works well, but be sure to use the type that's compatible with foam insulation, otherwise it will melt the foam.  However, I used a roadbed in addition to further insulate the sound, California Roadbed which is a homosote material.  I used Liquid Nails on that too to hold down the track.  It's not easlily available any more, but there's a lot of other types out there.  One company, which I cannot remember, makes a foam rubber type that looks like it will REALLY isolate the tracks from any surface, especially if you're going to put it all on a plywood base..  Look into it. Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78223	From: Ray Puls	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Pink foam

Hi Bob, I have built my entire layout on the pink foam-board with a grid under. I do need to warn you that my layout is not very quiet. To get back to your question of how to fasten the track to the foam-board I have used the silicon as recommended here but you need to keep in mind that you will need to put your track in place with the silicon and use weight to hold it down until the silicon sets up. What I had used in place of the silicon on a large part of my layout was a dual heat hot glue gun set to the low temp setting and low temp glue. With this you can move along pretty fast because the hot glue sets much faster. I tied with regular hot glue first but that will melt the foam. My track has been down for five years not and is holding tight. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78224	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Extruded Styrofoam layouts

I first found out about using extruded styrofoam insulation board in 1999.  Before that I had been using hollow core doors for portable layouts.  And of course before that the typical plywood.  I briefly tried the white styrofoam "bead board" commonly used for packing, and discounted it as flimsy, crumbly, and just about useless for anything...but packaging! I quickly fell in love with extruded styrofoam as my primary layout material.  Light, relatively durable, and easy to work with, it is excellent for portable layouts!  I don't build framing or lags, I use card tables and folding tables for support.  I did as many as ten train shows a year in scales O, S, HO, and N in this manner.  I  Have two in S gauge, one now eleven years old.  I also recently started on my 18th extruded foam layout! Attaching or painting styrofoam REQUIRES the use of non-solvent based materials.  Solvents such as toluene, acetone, and others will dissolve styrofoam (learned this the hard way early on.)  For attaching track, I have been using silicone caulking or bathtub sealer.  They allow you to use a putty knife and gently pry up the track if you need to adjust the route.  I do NOT use the silicone construction adhesives for this reason, because you have to damage the styrofoam to get the track up. For those who find the sound of trains moving a problem,  I find that silicone helps, but the real trick is to use something soft and pliable between the track and the styrofoam, same as you would on plywood.  Solid materials "resonate" any vibrations, and sound IS a vibration!   Rubber roadbed by model railroad manufacturers works well, but even cork helps.   It is available in HO, but you'll have to use "half again" or double the width under S track. KEEP all your cut offs from cutting the extruded foam.  It can be used for a number of  things, especially for scenery, and carves easily.   It's handy stuff, particularly if you apply your imagination! Stumpy Stone...  Foam Fan in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78225	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam

Thanks, Ray (and also to the other's who have replied).  Good information.  I have been playing around with the 1 ft x 4 ft chunk of pink foam and I can certainly understand your comment about the noise! I was a bit dismayed by how 'resonant' the board was.  Darn! A year or so ago, there was a long exchange on the Lionel FasTrack forum about track selection, noise, etc.  As a retired engineer (electrical), I like to think about the problem from a engineering stand point and, given the rigidity of the foam board, I can understand how it fails from the sound standpoint. Back to square one. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78226	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam

You might try a strip of rubber roof membrane under your roadbed. - Commonly used on flat roof buildings. It is easy to cut with scissors. However, U won’t find it a big box stores  ie. Home depot, Lowes    It also works for making blacktop roadways on your layout.    Alan in Hamilton   On Aug 13, 2016, at 10:49 AM, bob.groh@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks, Ray (and also to the other's who have replied).  Good information.  I have been playing around with the 1 ft x 4 ft chunk of pink foam and I can certainly understand your comment about the noise! I was a bit dismayed by how 'resonant' the board was.  Darn! A year or so ago, there was a long exchange on the Lionel FasTrack forum about track selection, noise, etc.  As a retired engineer (electrical), I like to think about the problem from a engineering stand point and, given the rigidity of the foam board, I can understand how it fails from the sound standpoint. Back to square one. Bob

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78227	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam

Hi Bob, I am currently building a set of four modules (2' wide, 4' deep) to make up a coal tipple layout/diorama. I hand-lay my track, but I placed 3 inches of blue insulation foam board on top of the typical plywood module box (so that I could cut a creek into the scene). I had used foam board before in a "permanent" N-scale layout. The foam is not quiet. I have track on two of my four modules right now, and the movement of the engine and the cars is clearly audible. Even using something like silicone glue won't work if you later on ballast your track with some sort of glue (e.g. white glue). The ballast glue then forms a hard layer from the rail back to the foam board underneath. I guess, you could use a non-hardening silicone glue and then loosely sprinkle ballast on top, but that is just not practical. I am using foam board in my current layout/diorama purely because of weight; I want the modules to be easily moveable. On my previous layout (S-scale, "permanent", around-the-walls), I used plywood cookie-cutter style sub-roadbed, and then I cut and placed ceiling tiles on top of that. I used wood glue to glue it down. The ceiling tiles can be bought in a box of 10 12"x12" sections, and can be cut with a utility knife. When cutting, it is a bit messy, but the vacuum cleaner takes care of it. If I were building a permanent layout again, I would use ceiling tile in a heartbeat. It is also relatively lightweight. I have found that to be very quiet, even after gluing ballast to it (make sure the ballast only glues to the tile). Also paint the tile right away, because it will continue to produce dust if not "sealed". Just a few more thoughts,  - Peter. On 08/13/2016 9:49 am, bob.groh@... [S-Trains] wrote: Thanks, Ray (and also to the other's who have replied).  Good information.  I have been playing around with the 1 ft x 4 ft chunk of pink foam and I can certainly understand your comment about the noise! I was a bit dismayed by how 'resonant' the board was.  Darn! A year or so ago, there was a long exchange on the Lionel FasTrack forum about track selection, noise, etc.  As a retired engineer (electrical), I like to think about the problem from a engineering stand point and, given the rigidity of the foam board, I can understand how it fails from the sound standpoint. Back to square one. Bob -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78228	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam

Hey Guys, I'll chime in at this point. I use the 2 inch white bead board for my layout. I use hot glue to hold my track in place. The thing you need to do is use a low setting on your glue gun. I tried the hi setting and yes it will melt the foam board. The white board seems to give me better results for quietness. Also if you are trying to remove hot glue from the track at a later date, you can use a hair dryer or heat gun to re melt the glue to remove it.  Hope this helps. CHris B From: "Ray Puls rpuls3@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2016 8:36 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Pink foam   Hi Bob, I have built my entire layout on the pink foam-board with a grid under. I do need to warn you that my layout is not very quiet. To get back to your question of how to fasten the track to the foam-board I have used the silicon as recommended here but you need to keep in mind that you will need to put your track in place with the silicon and use weight to hold it down until the silicon sets up. What I had used in place of the silicon on a large part of my layout was a dual heat hot glue gun set to the low temp setting and low temp glue. With this you can move along pretty fast because the hot glue sets much faster. I tied with regular hot glue first but that will melt the foam. My track has been down for five years not and is holding tight. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78229	From: rudypenne	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Re: Extruded Styrofoam layouts

When using cork roadbed for "S" use 1/2 HO & half "O"..Mike   In a message dated 8/13/2016 8:17:06 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I first found out about using extruded styrofoam insulation board in 1999.  Before that I had been using hollow core doors for portable layouts.  And of course before that the typical plywood.  I briefly tried the white styrofoam "bead board" commonly used for packing, and discounted it as flimsy, crumbly, and just about useless for anything...but packaging! I quickly fell in love with extruded styrofoam as my primary layout material.  Light, relatively durable, and easy to work with, it is excellent for portable layouts!  I don't build framing or lags, I use card tables and folding tables for support.  I did as many as ten train shows a year in scales O, S, HO, and N in this manner.  I  Have two in S gauge, one now eleven years old.  I also recently started on my 18th extruded foam layout! Attaching or painting sty rofoam REQUIRES the use of non-solvent based materials.  Solvents such as toluene, acetone, and others will dissolve styrofoam (learned this the hard way early on.)  For attaching track, I have been using silicone caulking or bathtub sealer.  They allow you to use a putty knife and gently pry up the track if you need to adjust the route.  I do NOT use the silicone construction adhesives for this reason, because you have to damage the styrofoam to get the track up. For those who find the sound of trains moving a problem,  I find that silicone helps, but the real trick is to use something soft and pliable between the track and the styrofoam, same as you would on plywood.  Solid materials "resonate" any vibrations, and sound IS a vibration!   Rubber roadbed by model railroad manufacturers works well, but even cork helps.   It is available in HO, but you'll have to use "half aga in" or double the width under S track. KEEP all your cut offs from cutting the extruded foam.  It can be used for a number of  things, especially for scenery, and carves easily.   It's handy stuff, particularly if you apply your imagination! Stumpy Stone...  Foam Fan in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78230	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: Synopsis: pink foam good for layout but NOT good for noise

Got a great batch of information to chew on and time for a bit of a summary: 1. Pink foam insulation board is a great component to use for low(er) weight layouts. Also makes it easy to carve in features such as stream beds, ravines, etc.  Combine with a low weight grid to provide stiffness. As a side note, I would think it makes it easier to run wiring. 2. Pink foam insulation board is NOT quiet. The general consensus seems to be that you need some road bed material of some sort (e.g. cork) between the track and the foam. I did a quick check on the web and there certainly is a wide variety of such road bed out there (yes, it has been a loooooong time since I last built a layout). Cost is not terrible. 3. Using one of the RTV type products to secure the road bed to the foam seems to be the hot setup.  The track can be secured to the road bed by ??  I don't know if road bed is better at retaining nails or screws. 4.  I don't know what one would do for a yard or other area where you don't want to use road bed under each line of track.  Something to insulate the noise for sure. I'm going to go back over all the responses and capture them in a document and do some experimentation. Thanks to everyone and keep the suggestions coming. Bob Groh, BLue SPrings, MO.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78231	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 14 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78232	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: Re: Synopsis: pink foam good for layout but NOT good for noise

I guess you could call me a traditional die hard. Or could it be "old school"? I recall back in the late 70's when the idea for using the styrofoam came about. A friend of mine, who was (and still is) a TT modeler, began using it. I was not impressed to say the least. It was way noisier than my traditional layout with cork roadbed. So bottom line is I will stay with tried and true. Use the styrofoam to insulate your house. That's what it was designed for.                                                                   Bob Lampe                                                                   Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78233	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 14 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 14 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78234	From: garydmccullah	Date: 8/14/2016
Subject: Roadbed

S Folk,    I found a black foam roadbed at the Hobby Town USA in Tulsa, OK. The pieces are marked for HO and cost $0.89 each. Might this solve some of the problems noted with pink foam? Another possibility is something Steve of S-N-S used on his layout several years ago. It is a blue foam product that is put down to block air infiltration between concrete slabs and wall framing. It comes in rolls 25 feet long by 6 inches wide.  Just a thought. Gary McCullah Farmington, AR

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78235	From: kensington3121	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Re: Pink foam

I have built my layout with pink foam board over a wooden grid framework.  For the roadbed, I first put down a strip of sound-deadening rubber material "Dynaliner" from Dynamat.  It's available through Amazon.com.  It comes with its own adhesive-backing (covered with wax paper which is pulled off for installation).  I top that with either cork or American Models roadbed "S-Flex Bed".  I find the AM material to be better:  easier to work with, more flexible and more sound-deadening.  I use silicone caulk to adhere the cork/AM roadbed to the Dynaliner, pinning it down while the caulk dries. I then paint the roadbed with flat black primer.         Pink foam bed is a joy to work with.  It is sturdy, can be cut and shaped with ease, takes paint well,  and can be used to replicate all sorts of land forms.  It pairs well with Woodland Scenics subterranean light system for raising track levels.        The sound-deadening properties of the Dynaliner with the AM roadbed is superb. I run four trains at one time on the layout and the only noise heard is wheel noise.       I've been very pleased with the above combination of materials and would recommend it.   Paul Schilling       -----Original Message----- From: Ray Puls rpuls3@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Aug 13, 2016 10:15 am Subject: [S-Trains] Pink foam   Hi Bob, I have built my entire layout on the pink foam-board with a grid under. I do need to warn you that my layout is not very quiet. To get back to your question of how to fasten the track to the foam-board I have used the silicon as recommended here but you need to keep in mind that you will need to put your track in place with the silicon and use weight to hold it down until the silicon sets up. What I had used in place of the silicon on a large part of my layout was a dual heat hot glue gun set to the low temp setting and low temp glue. With this you can move along pretty fast because the hot glue sets much faster. I tied with regular hot glue first but that will melt the foam. My track has been down for five years not and is holding tight. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78236	From: traindavid	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Missed chat, probably will miss a lot for a while

Missed anyone on Chat tonight, partly because my desktop tower fell off a desk, and I've lost the hard drive. So for now, I'm on an 11 year-old laptop running Win 98 with a 33K modem--I can barely pick up plain emails, let alone "surf" the web. Probably take me a week or so to get  back up--and I'll still be lacking my email address list as well as most of my passwords to get to various places. So, don't count me completely gone, just "on holiday" for a bit!! S' David Dewey (traindoctordavid)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78237	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 8/15/2016
Subject: Re: Missed chat, probably will miss a lot for a while

It's OK I was there 8:30 Eastern and No one was there.  CB From: "djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 4:00 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Missed chat, probably will miss a lot for a while   Missed anyone on Chat tonight, partly because my desktop tower fell off a desk, and I've lost the hard drive. So for now, I'm on an 11 year-old laptop running Win 98 with a 33K modem--I can barely pick up plain emails, let alone "surf" the web. Probably take me a week or so to get  back up--and I'll still be lacking my email address list as well as most of my passwords to get to various places. So, don't count me completely gone, just "on holiday" for a bit!! S' David Dewey (traindoctordavid)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78238	From: portlines	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Dave Garrigues

Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78239	From: Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues

Agreed, Doug.  What a wealth of knowledge Dave had.  Another huge loss for our relatively small community.   I can’t remember which issue, but the S Gaugian had a nice article that involved Dave back in the mid 70s.   My condolences to his family.   Bruce DeGailler, Sr.     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2016 6:03 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Dave Garrigues     Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78240	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues

Thank you for the message about Dave.  This is a great loss to our American Flyer family.  There were many, many times over the last 35 or so years that we spent hours reflecting on A. C. Gilbert and America Flyer pre & post war trains.  I too will miss him very much. Harwood Owings  -----Original Message----- From: 'Bruce R. DeGailler Sr.' goatfarm7@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tue, Aug 16, 2016 7:35 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Dave Garrigues     Agreed, Doug.  What a wealth of knowledge Dave had.  Another huge loss for our relatively small community.   I can’t remember which issue, but the S Gaugian had a nice article that involved Dave back in the mid 70s.   My condolences to his family.   Bruce DeGailler, Sr.     From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2016 6:03 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Dave Garrigues     Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78241	From: Dale Smith	Date: 8/16/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues

This is indeed a big loss for the American Flyer community.  Fortunately a lot of his knowledge has been preserved as he was a prolific contributor to the Train Collectors Quarterly and other publications and that knowledge will live on.  My condolences to his family and friends. Dale Smith On 8/16/2016 6:03 AM, doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78242	From: kissimmeeaf	Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Painted or unpainted.

HI everyone, I have been gathering American Flyer trains now for about 5 years. I find a wealth of information here and never found the need to ask questions, but I guess the time has come. A couple of things in the Greenberg's catalog I haven't been able to figure out. A car is referred to a painted or unpainted. I have taken them apart and either I have all unpainted cars or they paint the inside also. What is an easy way to tell? The other question is, on the 652 for example, it says thick or thin body. How do I tell if I don't have both types to compare to each other? Thank you, Doug in Kissimmee

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78243	From: Robert Graves	Date: 8/17/2016
Subject: Re: Painted or unpainted.

Scrape the bottom or inside with a knife blade; if it's painted, just a little scrape will reveal whether it's painted. Usually the underlying plastic is a different color. Be aware, however, that sometimes red plastic was painted red.   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org From: "dougmclaughlin@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2016 2:40 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Painted or unpainted.   HI everyone, I have been gathering American Flyer trains now for about 5 years. I find a wealth of information here and never found the need to ask questions, but I guess the time has come. A couple of things in the Greenberg's catalog I haven't been able to figure out. A car is referred to a painted or unpainted. I have taken them apart and either I have all unpainted cars or they paint the inside also. What is an easy way to tell? The other question is, on the 652 for example, it says thick or thin body. How do I tell if I don't have both types to compare to each other? Thank you, Doug in Kissimmee

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78244	From: skibbs4	Date: 8/20/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues

This is very said to hear.  My father worked with Dave at Bill's hobby shop when he was in high school, and I used to love visiting Dave's house as a little kid to talk about trains and run Dave's latest acquisitions on the bar loops in his basement.  They'd talk, and I'd sit and take it all in.  It was a magical place.   One of my most cherished possessions is the Flyer 5545W work train set that Dave received for Christmas in 1955.   He was good to this kid, and I'm crushed to hear that he has passed away. High Greens on the other side, Dave. Mike Skibbe ---In S-Trains@yahoogroups.com, <doug@...> wrote : Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78245	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 21 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78246	From: traindavid	Date: 8/21/2016
Subject: Sunday Night Chat

Hi All, gonna miss chat again, will be at a meeting drooling over player pianos, nickelodeons, and Wurlitzer Theatre Pipe organ. Maybe Next Sunday!!! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78247	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/21/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 21 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 21 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78248	From: The Laniers	Date: 8/22/2016
Subject: Re: Dave Garrigues

Has anyone seen an obituary for Dave?   Herb paflyrman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2016 9:03 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Dave Garrigues     Just received word of Dave's passing this past weekend.  A BIG loss for the S community, and his knowledge of American Flyer !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78249	From: Ingram-James4-YahooGrps-17701	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: =New Video: DCC Automatic Yard Controls 3 Trains on 1 Mainline

New Video:  DCC Automatic Yard Controls 3 Trains on 1 Mainline THE LINK: ===>>  http://youtu.be/6-WuZpwXV3o   or    http://vimeo.com/179618760 Three trains automatically run on 1 track — with an NCE DCC “Mini-Panel” controlling everything.   If you watch the first 4 minutes of this video (a fast-forwarded overview), it should give you a good idea of how it operates.   DOING THIS IN S GAUGE:  This Video #814 is done in HO scale, but would work the same way in S Gauge.  (The 2015 AutoControls.org Video #813 {http://youtu.be/KGTcWJlJkf4} shows this same Mini-Panel controlling two S gauge turnouts and two trains to operate an "Automatic Passing Siding".) The earlier 2009 Video #660 (http://youtu.be/N_Pf-JMAzkQ), showed an “Automatic Switching Block” controlling 3 S-gauge trains using DCC current and DCC engines on the track, but using “old school” relays controlling “on-off blocks” to stop the trains.  This latest video #814 uses the same “Automatic Switching Block” logic -- but now there are no blocks and no relays; it is fully DCC.   COMMENTS ABOUT THE MINI-PANEL:  The NCE “Mini-Panel” is a $49 off-the-shelf, approximately 3-1/2 inch-square component that plugs into the “control bus” (cab bus) of an NCE DCC system.  It can be considered a simple “Programmable Controller for DCC Trains”. THE LOGIC: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ * The logic is to hold 2 trains stopped on the sidings, while the 3rd train is running on the mainline.  * When the train on the mainline passes over the “GO” reed switch, a train is started out of the siding.  * The train that was on the mainline then pulls into the just-vacated siding and stops. * When the train that left the siding reaches “GO” reed switch on the mainline, the 3rd train is started out of the other “leg” of the siding.  * This process keeps repeating as all 3 trains “take their turns” running, and then "parking" on the siding.   Magnets on the bottom of the first car of the train, activate three reed switches located underneath the track, which activates two inputs on the Mini-Panel. Here is the link to the directory containing a copy of the commands, the wiring diagram, and the “sequence diagram” (logic):  http://track2.com/ingram/plans/814/ |---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Thanks.   - Jim Ingram, VMS 570-322-7597,  Williamsport PA, Apache Junction AZ | AutoControls.org //  PhxRail.org //    track2.com  //  JamesIngram.net, , MacBook Pro/OS 10.10.2 |---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78250	From: Roy Meissner	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: Fall S Fest

The Fall S Fest is still 10 weeks away, but the early bird registration is only 1 week away, Sep 1. Get your registration in now and save money. We have about two thirds of the tables sold so there is sure to be a good selection of goodies. The S Fest will be held in Oconomowoc WI, just west of Milwaukee and just of of I 94. The dates are Nov 4 to 6. The banquet speaker will be Roger Carp from Classic Toy Magazine. It will be a banquet worth attending.  If you don’t have a registration form, email me for one.   Roy J Meissner registrar rmeissner@...   Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78251	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 8/23/2016
Subject: Loud grinding noise on a 326

I am restoring a 326 Hudson with a large motor. The engine had a loose left rear drive wheel. I was unable to tighten it on the axle which is apparently stripped. the axle has ridges on its surface which appear worn. I cleaned up the axle and the pulmor wheel and epoxied it on to the axle. It seems to be holding Ok. The wheel gauge on the drivers is correct. The gear has been properly lubricated. The brushes seem OK. The engine runs very well but makes a grinding sound that is unlike that of any of my other Hudsons. Would there be a problem with the motor and the alignment of attached worm gear? Is it possible to remove and replace the worm gear and axle? How does one remove the axle and worm gear if replacement is necessary?  John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78252	From: Paul Krause	Date: 8/24/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326

Try putting of drop of AF approved lubricant on the non worm gear end of the motor.  That is the side of the armature that faces out toward the cab.   Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 10:21 PM, lsc332tcu67ifkh6fntk4qupslchnxi2onsqx63h@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am restoring a 326 Hudson with a large motor. The engine had a loose left rear drive wheel. I was unable to tighten it on the axle which is apparently stripped. the axle has ridges on its surface which appear worn. I cleaned up the axle and the pulmor wheel and epoxied it on to the axle. It seems to be holding Ok. The wheel gauge on the drivers is correct. The gear has been properly lubricated. The brushes seem OK. The engine runs very well but makes a grinding sound that is unlike that of any of my other Hudsons. Would there be a problem with the motor and the alignment of attached worm gear? Is it possible to remove and replace the worm gear and axle? How does one remove the axle and worm gear if replacement is necessary?  John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78253	From: The Laniers	Date: 8/24/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326

Sometimes the choo choo gear gets dry and starts grinding also, if you haven’t lubed that.   Herb paflyerman   From: mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2016 8:04 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Loud grinding noise on a 326     Try putting of drop of AF approved lubricant on the non worm gear end of the motor.  That is the side of the armature that faces out toward the cab.  Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android   I am restoring a 326 Hudson with a large motor. The engine had a loose left rear drive wheel. I was unable to tighten it on the axle which is apparently stripped. the axle has ridges on its surface which appear worn. I cleaned up the axle and the pulmor wheel and epoxied it on to the axle. It seems to be holding Ok. The wheel gauge on the drivers is correct. The gear has been properly lubricated. The brushes seem OK. The engine runs very well but makes a grinding sound that is unlike that of any of my other Hudsons. Would there be a problem with the motor and the alignment of attached worm gear? Is it possible to remove and replace the worm gear and axle? How does one remove the axle and worm gear if replacement is necessary? John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78254	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 8/25/2016
Subject: Double head Pacifics

Hi, I have now turned my attention to a new project. I have a 283 Pacific and a 21085 Pacific, both with plastic boilers.  Both have dc can motors and run great. I would like to find a way to double head a long freight on my layout.  Any hints on to to install a coupler on the front end.   Thanks, Wayne

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78255	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

I have a 282/283 doubleheader setup that I made several years ago.  The front coupler arrangement consists of a brass plate of the same size as the pilot platform.  The plate is attached with a long machine screw to the locomotive through a hole that I drilled in the pilot platform of the boiler shell.  A nut holds the plate in place, and above the nut, I made a swinging coupler bar out of a strip of brass.  If I remember correctly, the coupler bar has two offset bends forward of the point where it overhangs the brass plate.  This brings the coupler down to the same height as a standard AF knuckle.  I then attached a solid coupler to the end.  The coupler bar is held on the machine screw by a nut with a jam nut above it.  That allows the coupler bar to swing loosely side to side without causing the nut to back off.   It works really well (never had a derailment).  I can take some photos this weekend if you would like. Scott Griggs Louisville, KY

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78256	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double Heading Pacifics

Not a big problem.  Portliness Hobby Supplies sells a front coupler kit for adding a front coupler to most American Flyer steam locomotives.  Basically it is a coupler on a stamped metal bracket that attaches to the screw that holds the headlight in place and fits under the pilot ("cowcatcher") and up into position for a front coupler. Another way to do it is to cut a slot through the front of the pilot and make your own swiveling mount that attaches to the headlight screw to mount a coupler on the front.  I've done it both ways, but the Portlines part is nicer and doesn't require cutting on the loco shell.  (Of course since I build stuff from junk boxes, there's not a "loss" of investment!)  ;-) Even with both engines DC can motor equipped, you'll need a lot of electrical "horsepower" to run both and a heavy train too, so be sure to use a BIG power pack or transformer! Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78257	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Loud grinding noise on a 326

A couple of questions: 1) Does the mechanism run smoothly if you rotate the armature by hand through one full drive wheel revolution? 2) Are the brushes arcing more than other Gilbert steamers without the problem? I have heard grinding-like sounds from the commutators on AF engines if the commutator face is worn near the commutator slots.  Other sources of grinding may present themselves when you turn the mechanism by hand.  Make sure all axles are oiled and all gear teeth are lubricated with grease. Scott Griggs Louisville, KY

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78258	From: John Davis	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

Wayne: I would Dremel cut a horizontal slit in the cowcatcher of one engine   and mount a drawbar to the headlight screw through the slit, with a bend at the other in to hook into a closed knuckle coupler, sort of like the old Marx couplers to see how the rig works.  /  John Davis  Noblesville IN

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78259	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: S-Mod - any action at all out there?

Along with my 'planning' for a layout, an idea exists in my brain (poor creature that it is) to start out with a simple shelf layout.  Then I had the additional thought that I might as well make my shelf layout fit into one or the other module concepts.  And then I wondered what was doing the S-gauge world on modules.  Did a bit of checking on the web (NASG et al) and still a bit confused.  Anybody have a few succinct words to say on the subject? Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri (just east of Kansas City, MO)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78260	From: ken	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Double Heading Pacifics

Actually DC can motor equipped motors do not draw that much current to preclude the doubleheading.  Replacing the headlight with an LED helps but the big current draw is the smoke unit, as much as four times greater current draw as the can motor.   ken clark   On August 26, 2016 at 6:26 AM "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:     Not a big problem.  Portliness Hobby Supplies sells a front coupler kit for adding a front coupler to most American Flyer steam locomotives.  Basically it is a coupler on a stamped metal bracket that attaches to the screw that holds the headlight in place and fits under the pilot ("cowcatcher") and up into position for a front coupler.   Another way to do it is to cut a slot through the front of the pilot and make your own swiveling mount that attaches to the headlight screw to mount a coupler on the front.  I've done it both ways, but the Portlines part is nicer and doesn't require cutting on the loco shell.  (Of course since I build stuff from junk boxes, there's not a "loss" of investment!)  ;-)   Even with both engines DC can motor equipped, you'll need a lot of electrical "horsepower" to run both and a heavy train too, so be sure to use a BIG power pack or transformer!   Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"       ken

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78261	From: Tom	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299

I have two S Helper remote turnouts (these are SHS #00299) that are new in the box and that I’ve had for a couple of years and am just getting around to installing them. The problem I’m having is that both switches do not operate either manually or using the controller. They are stuck in one position. I have two right hand switches as well (SHS #00298) and they work fine. The manual lever is stuck in one position. When the controller is activated the switch buzzes and the lever on the side of the switch clearly wants to move but it can’t. I’ve taken the back off the switches and when the controller is activated the plunger or piston in the long silver tube on the inside tries to move but it can’t. I don’t know if the tube is a solenoid similar to the old Flyer switches or if it is another type of activation device. Whatever it is the plunger or piston can’t move as required to change the rail positions. Also on the good switches I have the manual lever can be used to change the switch position. On these two malfunctioning switches, the manual is “stuck” as well and can’t move so apparently what is blocking the plunger movement in the silver tube also prevents manual operation. The makes me wonder if the problem is mechanical and not electrical because the manual operation is not possible. If I could manual operate the switch at least it would have some use but at this point that is not even possible. Does anyone have experience with these switches so they can suggest what could be wrong and what the fix is? Any ideas would be appreciated. Tom Detmer Madison, WI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78262	From: zemouse2001	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299

Certainly sounds like you have a 'mechanical' bind someplace.  Not familiar with that switch but a number of things occur to me: 1.  If you can figure out a way to 'disconnect' some of the linkages (solenoid (which I'm sure it is), manual lever and rod to the points assembly), you can narrow down your search. 2.  It is possible that the guts in the solenoid (using a steel or iron rod) proper can get a bit of corrosion on it which binds the rod to the outer case.  It might be possible to put a bit of thin light weight oil in there to break loose the corrrosion. You'll figure it out!  S Helper is a pretty good brand. Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78263	From: Tom	Date: 8/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help with S Helper Remote Turnout 00299

Hi Bob, Thanks for the suggestions on what to try to fix the SHS remote turnout.  You were correct - it was a mechanical bind that I’ve now corrected and all is working well.  The electronics work perfectly.  I found that the plastic lever mechanism was misaligned and needed to be adjusted.  It was an easy fix and just required carefully opening the bottom of the switch and then the inner mechanism holding the lever and making the proper adjustment in the mechanism.  Disconnecting the solenoid was what led me to discover the problem so I appreciate your advice. Tom Detmer, Madison, WI On Aug 26, 2016, at 5:49 PM, bob.groh@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Certainly sounds like you have a 'mechanical' bind someplace.  Not familiar with that switch but a number of things occur to me: 1.  If you can figure out a way to 'disconnect' some of the linkages (solenoid (which I'm sure it is), manual lever and rod to the points assembly), you can narrow down your search. 2.  It is possible that the guts in the solenoid (using a steel or iron rod) proper can get a bit of corrosion on it which binds the rod to the outer case.  It might be possible to put a bit of thin light weight oil in there to break loose the corrrosion. You'll figure it out!  S Helper is a pretty good brand. Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78264	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

Trains are us folks.  Double header Frt coupler. on a 312 using a KC Hamilton AL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78265	From: thecitrusbelt	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: Layout Tour #51: Riverside-San Bernardino (So. Calif.)

Model Railroads Of Southern California's first layout tour of 2017 will take place on Saturday, February 25, in the Riverside-San Bernardino area.   Tentatively, the Roundhouse Gang will hold a swap meet that same day in San Bernardino so you can visit the swap meet in the morning and take the self-guided layout tour later that same morning through the late afternoon.   There will be at least two layouts on the tour for the first time and possibly more new layouts, plus some layouts that have appeared before but you may have missed.   If you wish to participate as a layout owner, please contact me OFF LIST at chiefbobbb At verizon DOT net.   Bob Chaparro Moderator Model Railroads Of Southern California https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Model_Railroads_Of_Southern_California/info   P.S.: Don't for get the next three layout tours -   September 21-25: PSR Convention, 30 layouts in Southern California September 26: Non-PSR Layout Tour, 13 layouts in Southern California October 6-9: Central Coast Railroad Festival, 25 layouts in San Luis Obispo & Santa Barbara Counties

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78266	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 28 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78267	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 28 August 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 28 August 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78268	From: srgriggs	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

Attachments : IMG_4455.JPG IMG_4454.JPG IMG_4453.JPG Here are the photos I took of my AF 282/283 double header coupler.  It is mounted on the pilot of the rear engine.  It does require drilling a small hole in the boiler shell. Scott Griggs Louisville, KY

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78269	From: Alan Smith	Date: 8/28/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics [3 Attachments]

Railroading fun.     Other methods:  Make a drawbar         Reference a Hudson   .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78270	From: ken	Date: 8/29/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

Sixty years ago my father performed surgery on my first Flyer Loco, a #302AC 4-4-2.  We had just acquired a second 4-4-2, but with a plastic boiler it didn't pull as well and was relegated to helper service.  My dad cut off the pilot and soldered a mounting tab onto the lead truck frame for the link coupler.  Still works fine after all this time.  But I've upgraded to DC power and equipping my roster with DC can motors, but I'll keep my dad's front coupler.  Double heading is a lot easier with DC without the original E-units.   ken clarkl   On August 28, 2016 at 7:42 PM "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:    Railroading fun.       Other methods:    Make a drawbar         Reference a Hudson   .                              made with a swing limiter             2. Cut off most of the cowcatcher and add the Coupler fitting.     It works slick .  Results:  a set of triple header Atlantic’s          OLD Al in Hamilton       On Aug 28, 2016, at 6:01 PM, sgriggs@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Here are the photos I took of my AF 282/283 double header coupler.  It is mounted on the pilot of the rear engine.  It does require drilling a small hole in the boiler shell.   Scott Griggs Louisville, KY     <IMG_4454.JPG><IMG_4453.JPG><IMG_4455.JPG>   ken

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78271	From: Doug Peck	Date: 8/29/2016
Subject: Re: Double head Pacifics

We have a limited number of our Doubleheader-Drawbar kits left available, at $10.95. Intended for Hudsons and Northerns because they can be installed with no permanent modifications, but they can be used on other models by drilling one hole in the pilot of the rear engine. Be sure your 2 engine motors run at near-identical speeds (can motor conversions are ideal for this). Otherwise, the motors will be stressed as they “fight” each other and overheat. STEAMERS: HUDSONS (ID: 225) DOUBLE-HEADER DRAWBAR; easily adapts an AF Hudson or Northern to double-heading (Not an original AF item) $10.95     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78272	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 9/1/2016
Subject: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift

Since assuming the role of webmaster for the NASG's web site in late 2011, I have studied how the web site has been used, and what its favorite sections or pages are. Feedback and comments along the way have also been helpful. The "old" web site was a significant improvement over the "older" one. However, it is now time to re-organize the site to, hopefully, better help you find anything you want to know about S-scale (in all of its various flavors). So, as of today, the web site has received a completely new facelift. All of the old content is still there. Some has been moved, and some has been reworked, but nothing has been deleted. As a matter of fact, a lot of new content has been added that wasn't on the "old" site. This has been a project I've been working on since about May of this year, and I've really been pushing it this last month. The Sept/Oct issue of the NASG's The Dispatch should be arriving in the mailboxes of NASG members, in which you will find my regular NASG web site column covering this new web site design. That has been my hard deadline for completing this project. However, whether or not you read the column in the magazine, I would strongly recommend that everybody read through the top 2/3rds of the "I'm new to this web site" page (accessible from the top, right-hand corner of the web site's home page). It will help you orient yourself if you are familiar with the "old" web site, and get you up-to-speed on the new layout. Enjoy the new home page at: http://www.nasg.org/ and be sure to read through the introductory page here: http://www.nasg.org/NASG/NewToSite.php#siteupgrade Have fun exploring the new web site!  - Peter (NASG webmaster). -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78273	From: rebendever	Date: 9/1/2016
Subject: FS: Double Stall Engine House Model *Built-Up* Building & Structure

Double Stall Engine House Model *Built-Up* by Richard Ruggles in S-scale S/1:64    Free Insured FedEx Home Delivery Shipping Offered! "2 inch Base: Overall: 11" x 16" x 10" tall" Doors are 3-7/8" tall x about 2-7/8 wide Built up diorama by Richard Ruggles several years ago for a customer who changed scale. This model has two issues: 1) Roof peak on the double door side has some very minor damage about 1" long. 2) One of the doors on the single door side has fallen off and need to be re-attached. Neither issue is significant. Model is lightly weathered. The direct link to this listing is: Double Stall Engine House Model *Built-Up* by Richard Ruggles 1;64/S/Sn3/Sn2 Double Stall Engine House Model *Built-Up* by Richar...   View on www.debenllc.com Preview by Yahoo Please feel free to share this information. Thank You.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78274	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: NASG Website update & all Websites Updates

With the "modern, high-speed internet" of today, coding and website presentation takes more and more bandwidth. For the majority of users this isn't a problem, but for those of us in rural areas with slower access speeds it is. A few years ago Facebook "updated" itself, and now is inaccessible to many on the slow connection level. The new NASG site is there now, or at least fast-approaching it. And YES, I have investigated other ways of connecting, but in my area they don't exist--or are extremely expensive (satellite, which my neighbors tell me doesn't really work when it rains etc. is around $90 a month here). I have thought of suing AT&T to provide equivalent service to us as they offer (and we pay for) to the residents in town, but I can't afford to do that either. I called the Feds, who claim they want high-speed internet to all rural areas, but they told me that "California isn't a rural area!" I think they believe we all live in LA or on the beach out here. OH well, I know y'all can't do anything about it, but I had to rant to someone! It's getting so frustrating that I really am considering going off the grid; I waste far too much time waiting for stuff to download, and then sometimes just giving up on it--and forget U-Tube; that ain't gonna happen here! Yes, I could go downtown to the public library and wait in line for 15 minutes of computer use--this is an economically depressed area and LOTS of folks use the library for their media connection. Well, Run 'em if ya got 'em, and view 'em if ya can! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78275	From: Dale Smith	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Website update & all Websites Updates

David, Here is what you need to do.  Persuade an ATT executive to build a posh rural retreat near you.  Then you will get anything you want.  That's why I have service up on Donner Summit.  My little subdivision has become trendy with the addition of a few 4500 square foot "cabins," at least one of which, I hear, is now owned by an ATT executive.  I have "Uverse phone and internet (3.0 mps only,) though I hear that TV isn't yet available.  Closer to I80 in less posh Soda Springs, they don't have it. Dale On 9/2/2016 8:45 AM, David Dewey djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   With the "modern, high-speed internet" of today, coding and website presentation takes more and more bandwidth. For the majority of users this isn't a problem, but for those of us in rural areas with slower access speeds it is. A few years ago Facebook "updated" itself, and now is inaccessible to many on the slow connection level. The new NASG site is there now, or at least fast-approaching it. And YES, I have investigated other ways of connecting, but in my area they don't exist--or are extremely expensive (satellite, which my neighbors tell me doesn't really work when it rains etc. is around $90 a month here). I have thought of suing AT&T to provide equivalent service to us as they offer (and we pay for) to the residents in town, but I can't afford to do that either. I called the Feds, who claim they want high-speed internet to all rural areas, but they told me that "California isn't a rural area!" I think they believe we all live in LA or on the beach out here. OH well, I know y'all can't do anything about it, but I had to rant to someone! It's getting so frustrating that I really am considering going off the grid; I waste far too much time waiting for stuff to download, and then sometimes just giving up on it--and forget U-Tube; that ain't gonna happen here! Yes, I could go downtown to the public library and wait in line for 15 minutes of computer use--this is an economically depressed area and LOTS of folks use the library for their media connection. Well, Run 'em if ya got 'em, and view 'em if ya can! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78276	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 9/2/2016
Subject: Doujble Head

Thanks for all the suggestions and especially the pictures on double heading the steamers.  What a great place to get some help!!!!! Wayne

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78277	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: No train deliveries for a while???

Just read this on another forum; it's all over the Internet. A Hanjin ship in Oakland has been confiscated due to a $500k unpaid fuel bill. Hanjin is something like the 5th biggest container shipper, and is insolvent. There's an article on BBC that says many boats are stuck at sea as ports won't allow them to dock. I don't know what shippers big L or MTH uses, but this could put a real dent in deliveries!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78278	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Flyer Fling 2016, Saturday, 17 September 2016

Attachments : "Flyer Fling 2016" reminder When Saturday, 17 September 2016 10:00 AM to 04:00 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where SES Hall, Elk Grove, CA From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78279	From: roninscho	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for a while???

watch this turn into a good example of how you can't do trade with someone that don't have money . :(

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78280	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 04 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78281	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/3/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

Hanjin has gone bankrupt, so thousands of containers and Kia automobiles are sitting idle off shore all over the Pacific with unpaid dock fees and crews.  That is going to be a problem for a LOT of people, not just the railroads who will see a downturn in container traffic.  Retailers and small businesses have their freight tied up for an undetermined period.  And who knows how many "as seen on TV for $19.95" items are in limbo? This turn of events raises another question; Just how vulnerable are we as a nation that relies heavily on products made in other nations?  You may remember from World War Two history that early in the war, the British were nearly starved into surrender to Hitler because of the "U-boat Menace."   The Germans were sinking ships supplying Great Britain at an alarming rate.   The war was eventually won by American industry and manpower.  We supplied all the Allied Nations with food, fuel, war materiel, and troops.  And most of it moved across the seas in ships.  This cannot be done today, and America is vulnerable because too much comes here from somewhere else.  There are too many weak links in our supply chain that can be broken. We again fail to learn from history, and it will cost us sooner or later. Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78282	From: Ben Perry	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

Amen Sent from Outlook Benjamin Perry 700 Smith St APT 244 Providence RI 02908 From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, September 3, 2016 8:53 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] RE: No train deliveries for awhile     Hanjin has gone bankrupt, so thousands of containers and Kia automobiles are sitting idle off shore all over the Pacific with unpaid dock fees and crews.  That is going to be a problem for a LOT of people, not just the railroads who will see a downturn in container traffic.  Retailers and small businesses have their freight tied up for an undetermined period.  And who knows how many "as seen on TV for $19.95" items are in limbo? This turn of events raises another question; Just how vulnerable are we as a nation that relies heavily on products made in other nations?  You may remember from World War Two history that early in the war, the British were nearly starved into surrender to Hitler because of the "U-boat Menace."   The Germans were sinking ships supplying Great Britain at an alarming rate.   The war was eventually won by American industry and manpower.  We supplied all the Allied Nations with food, fuel, war materiel, and troops.  And most of it moved across the seas in ships.  This cannot be done today, and America is vulnerable because too much comes here from somewhere else.  There are too many weak links in our supply chain that can be broken. We again fail to learn from history, and it will cost us sooner or later. Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78283	From: william lewis	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

There was recently announced a surprising and abrupt development in the world of trans ocean shipping. One which may lead to ripple effects on global supply-chains and worldwide "just-in-time" logistics, the biggest South Korean shipping company and the world's 7th largest container shipper, Hanjin Shipping, filed for bankruptcy leaving its assets frozen as ports from China to Spain denied access to its vessels. It did not take long for the fallout from this historic bankruptcy - the largest ever for a container shipper in terms of capacity - to reach the US, because as Bloomberg reported earlier today, at least three Hanjin ships are currently stranded off the California coast. Hanjin had a large piece of the global shipping trade business. They recorded on average 3.7 million TEU containers a year. Maintained a fleet of 104 container ships. 14 total dock yards; 4 in korea, 2 in USA, 2 in Japan, and the remainder in Spain and Europe. Hanjin also owned Korean Air lines Hanjin is a majority owner or was of Long Beach Terminal Hanjin is the major shipping vessel of choice to Korean based Samsung and LG This will certainly lead to Rate increases for ocean vessel shipping and we are headed into the busy season of ocean shipping all the ships are already full and then if you have Hanjin pull out. This will lead to clogged ports, long export waiting lines and longer transit times. Currently the average time from manufacturer in China to warehouse is approximately one month (average sea voyage 2.5 weeks) 10 vessels have been seized at Chinese ports 98 Vessels at approximately 2000 containers per vessel = 196,000 containers possibly delayed / seized Last year Hanjin shipped 3.7 million TEU TEU = twenty foot equivalent or one TEU is one twenty foot container. A 40 foot container would be 2 TEU http://www.alphaliner.com/top100/ http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-02/ripple-effect-could-be-tremendous-retailers-demand-government-bailout-after-hanjin-c http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hanjin-bankruptcy-20160831-snap-story.html https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/sep/02/hanjin-shipping-bankruptcy-causes-turmoil-in-global-sea-freight http://www.cnbc.com/2016/08/31/hanjin-shipping-vessel-unable-to-dock-at-south-korea-port-yonhap.html http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-08-31/three-hanjin-ships-stranded-california-coast http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2016/09/02/hanjin-shipping-goes-bust-this-does-not-show-that-world-trade-is-collapsing/#b23e422389aa Besided owing untold millions in back payments, Hanjin also owes massive amounts of money for fuel purchased on credit and already contained in the ships. In addition to those costs, another rising cost will be Detention and Demurrage costs. If you place all roughly 200,000 containers into demurrage or detention starting today, then the penalties could rise into the millions. Detention & Demurrage charges will be applicable for shipments wherein customers have exceeded the standard free time applicable both in the import & export cycles. Demurrage: This charge will be levied when the Customer holds Hanjin equipment inside the terminal for longer than the agreed free days and is applicable to all containers that remain at the terminal longer than the agreed free time. Detention: Detention charges will be levied when the Customer holds Hanjin equipment outside the terminal longer than the agreed free time : it is applicable throughout the duration of Customer’s possession of Hanjin container(s) in his custody, and until its safe return to Hanjin.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78284	From: Carey Probst	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

Unfortunately until we get away from the idea that everyone needs a college education to flip burgers this will continue. I keep reading of the 1000's of jobs available but nobody to fill them because Americans have been fed the bill of goods that manual labor is bad.  We need tool and die makers, machinists and all of the trade jobs of the past but nobody wants to do the work. Carey  <rant off/> On 9/3/2016 8:53 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Hanjin has gone bankrupt, so thousands of containers and Kia automobiles are sitting idle off shore all over the Pacific with unpaid dock fees and crews.  That is going to be a problem for a LOT of people, not just the railroads who will see a downturn in container traffic.  Retailers and small businesses have their freight tied up for an undetermined period.  And who knows how many "as seen on TV for $19.95" items are in limbo? This turn of events raises another question; Just how vulnerable are we as a nation that relies heavily on products made in other nations?  You may remember from World War Two history that early in the war, the British were nearly starved into surrender to Hitler because of the "U-boat Menace."   The Germans were sinking ships supplying Great Britain at an alarming rate.   The war was eventually won by American industry and manpower.  We supplied all the Allied Nations with food, fuel, war materiel, and troops.  And most of it moved across the seas in ships.  This cannot be done today, and America is vulnerable because too much comes here from somewhere else.  There are too many weak links in our supply chain that can be broken. We again fail to learn from history, and it will cost us sooner or later. Stumpy Stone in "Ahia" -- Carey Probst Chief MicroFerroEquinologist PennsyltuckyRR

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78285	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

You are correct.  Sent from my iPhone On Sep 3, 2016, at 8:53 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hanjin has gone bankrupt, so thousands of containers and Kia automobiles are sitting idle off shore all over the Pacific with unpaid dock fees and crews.  That is going to be a problem for a LOT of people, not just the railroads who will see a downturn in container traffic.  Retailers and small businesses have their freight tied up for an undetermined period.  And who knows how many "as seen on TV for $19.95" items are in limbo? This turn of events raises another question; Just how vulnerable are we as a nation that relies heavily on products made in other nations?  You may remember from World War Two history that early in the war, the British were nearly starved into surrender to Hitler because of the "U-boat Menace."   The Germans were sinking ships supplying Great Britain at an alarming rate.   The war was eventually won by American industry and manpower.  We supplied all the Allied Nations with food, fuel, war materiel, and troops.  And most of it moved across the seas in ships.  This cannot be done today, and America is vulnerable because too much comes here from somewhere else.  There are too many weak links in our supply chain that can be broken. We again fail to learn from history, and it will cost us sooner or later. Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78286	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 04 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78288	From: Tom	Date: 9/4/2016
Subject: For sale: Lionel TMCC Direct Lock-On - NIB

I have two of these items for sale. Please contact me off list if interested. Tom Detmer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78289	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Finding work today (no train content)

I have several friends in railroading, a few in construction, family in mining, and various "associates" in other trades and occupations.  All of them tell me these industries are having trouble finding people to fill openings. The biggest complaints are too many don't have the skills required, too many can't pass drug tests, and too many just don't want to work.  The jobs are there, but there are few young people to fill them. During my 28 years in the local school system I started talking to High School kids about everyone wanting a "clean hands, high paying job...instantly."  That just does not happen in the real world.  For those not college bound, I urged them to get technical schooling in a "trade."  Carpentry, heating and cooling, plumbing, auto repair, and so on.  Jobs where people "work with their hands" are the way to go if you're NOT able to go to college, and maybe even if you can. Guess what... The kids who went to technical schools are doing better than the ones that went to college.  One young man had an interest in guns and was not college material, but ended up as a prototype machinist for Remington Arms.  Two others went a slightly different route and ended up as state auditors.  One young man went into machine shop type work, got additional training, and now sets up all the CNC machines at a company which makes equipment for the oil and gas industry.  I can't tell you the number of plumbers, electricians, auto techs, and HVAC guys that are working every day for decent wages.  Most making more than those who went to college and are now shift managers at fast food joints. Even though we are a heavily electronics focused nation, there will ALWAYS be people needed who can do "hands on" occupations.  And as folks with those skills get fewer, the costs for their services get higher.  Have you needed to hire a plumber lately?  An electrician?  Computers can't reach out and do these things, nor can most people who are into computers. This is not to say that college is a bad thing, far from it!  But not everyone is college material, or can afford the obscene costs of a college education.  Tech schools off er alternatives that are a lot more economical, and you get into the workforce faster and at a quicker financial return.  All you have to do is put forth the effort.  After all, somebody has to make the lights come on and the toilets flush,  And those skills are worth money. Stumpy Stone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78290	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)

Amen!! Bob Groh Retired electronics engineer.  Enjoyed my work bu oh so glad that I am retired!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78291	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)

Absolutely agree with you! From: "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, September 4, 2016 7:47 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Finding work today (no train content)   I have several friends in railroading, a few in construction, family in mining, and various "associates" in other trades and occupations.  All of them tell me these industries are having trouble finding people to fill openings. The biggest complaints are too many don't have the skills required, too many can't pass drug tests, and too many just don't want to work.  The jobs are there, but there are few young people to fill them. During my 28 years in the local school system I started talking to High School kids about everyone wanting a "clean hands, high paying job...instantly."  That just does not happen in the real world.  For those not college bound, I urged them to get technical schooling in a "trade."  Carpentry, heating and cooling, plumbing, auto repair, and so on.  Jobs where people "work with their hands" are the way to go if you're NOT able to go to college, and maybe even if you can. Guess what... The kids who went to technical schools are doing better than the ones that went to college.  One young man had an interest in guns and was not college material, but ended up as a prototype machinist for Remington Arms.  Two others went a slightly different route and ended up as state auditors.  One young man went into machine shop type work, got additional training, and now sets up all the CNC machines at a company which makes equipment for the oil and gas industry.  I can't tell you the number of plumbers, electricians, auto techs, and HVAC guys that are working every day for decent wages.  Most making more than those who went to college and are now shift managers at fast food joints. Even though we are a heavily electronics focused nation, there will ALWAYS be people needed who can do "hands on" occupations.  And as folks with those skills get fewer, the costs for their services get higher.  Have you needed to hire a plumber lately?  An electrician?  Computers can't reach out and do these things, nor can most people who are into computers. This is not to say that college is a bad thing, far from it!  But not everyone is college material, or can afford the obscene costs of a college education.  Tech schools off er alternatives that are a lot more economical, and you get into the workforce faster and at a quicker financial return.  All you have to do is put forth the effort.  After all, somebody has to make the lights come on and the toilets flush,  And those skills are worth money. Stumpy Stone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78292	From: Ted Walton	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

With all the new stuff basically locked up and unavailable, does that mean the older stuff may be in more demand? Ted --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78293	From: George Cohn	Date: 9/5/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)

On 9/4/2016 4:47 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote: > This is not to say that college is a bad thing, far from it! But not > everyone is college material, or can afford the obscene costs of a > college education. Tech schools offer alternatives that are a lot more > economical, and you get into the workforce faster and at a quicker > financial return. All you have to do is put forth the effort. After > all, somebody has to make the lights come on and the toilets flush, And > those skills are worth money. And don't forget your local community college. Most of them offer two year degrees or certificate programs in almost anything from welding, auto mechanics, culinary arts, HVAC, to computer systems administrator. Tuition costs are usually about 1/4th of what a four year college or private school charges and you can often live at home while getting training. I just happen to teach computer science topics at our local community college after retiring from a career in IT of 30+ years. The pay is lousy, the hours are long, but it gives me great pleasure to pass on the things I learned in a lifetime to young students who want to get into the workforce but can't afford the money or time to attend a four year college. Be careful when choosing a private for-profit tech school as many of them are just high priced diploma mills whose primary goal is extracting as much tuition as they can, especially from veterans. You read every day about how another one is closing their doors after being investigated for high costs and poor training programs. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78294	From: Scott Holm	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift

Unfortunately, the new site doesn't work very well from my mobile phone. I can't shrink it down like I could with the old one, so I can only see the center of most of the pages and it won't let me scroll to the right or the left. It won't be very useful to people traveling to train shows. Scott Holm

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78295	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding work today (no train content)

what's wrong with becoming a AF repairman?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78296	From: Carey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift

Just tried it on my Note 5 and I can control size but unfortunately the left few characters are off the page and I can only scroll to the right which doesn't help.  Works the same on both Chrome and the internal Samsung browser. Everything else works fine though. On 9/6/2016 2:54 AM, Scott Holm imsscott@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Unfortunately, the new site doesn't work very well from my mobile phone. I can't shrink it down like I could with the old one, so I can only see the center of most of the pages and it won't let me scroll to the right or the left. It won't be very useful to people traveling to train shows. Scott Holm -- Carey Probst Pennsyltucky RR Chief MicroFerroEquinologist

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78297	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: NASG Web Site Receives Facelift

Thanks guys, here I thought it was easier to blame my phone.  Peter has done a excellent job so far, just a few more tweaks are needed

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78298	From: Lee Brown	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

nope, just means the old stuff will go up in price

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78299	From: snstrains	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

Probably won't affect the "old stuff" prices much. Been dropping steadily now for quite some time. And by the way, why don't many of you people who comment identify yourselves?   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 9/6/2016 8:40:44 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes: nope, just means the old stuff will go up in price

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78300	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

As some of you know, I grew up in Dunsmuir, a small mountain railroad town that was the SP Shasta Division headquarters. Mostly because of that, the high school was heavily weighted, even back then (1960s-70s) to College Preparatory schooling; what with all the upper management types in town. So, this is not a new trend! Even back then (as a student!) I thought it was not serving the students well. I agree completely! Reading this this morning is quite topical as the radio news is saying that ITT is closing their training doors. And as for no new train deliveries; well, so far we are just speculating as we don't know which shipper has the train-containing containers (try saying that fast five times). Run 'em if ya got 'em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78301	From: Carey	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: No train deliveries for awhile

We are in hiding from the TSA and afraid they will find us if we do. 8-) And because when I switched email from POP to IMAP I lost my signatures. Carey Probst On 9/6/2016 11:54 AM, boss31@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Probably won't affect the "old stuff" prices much. Been dropping steadily now for quite some time. And by the way, why don't many of you people who comment identify yourselves?   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 9/6/2016 8:40:44 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes: nope, just means the old stuff will go up in price -- Carey Probst Pennsyltucky RR Chief MicroFerroEquinologist

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78302	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

Please pardon my ignorance but what does the topic of this thread have to do with S scale model trains?                                                Bob Lampe                                                Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78303	From: snstrains	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

Bob, It started out because of the shipping boondoggle from China and some folks were just commenting that the "S" gauge train stuff of the different manufacturers might be out to sea for a long time.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 9/6/2016 2:27:28 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Please pardon my ignorance but what does the topic of this thread have to do with S scale model trains?                                                Bob Lampe                                                Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78304	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

Steve,    Thanks for the heads up on that but there's nothing definite on what really is aboard any of those ships but I'd bet those new MTH F-3's are or did they move manufacturing back to the U.S.?                                Bob Lampe                                Kalispell,MTy

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78305	From: George Cohn	Date: 9/6/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

On 9/6/2016 9:43 AM, 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Reading this this morning > is quite topical as the radio news is saying that ITT is closing their > training doors. They are closing their doors because they were under investigation for numerous reasons. Check out this article: http://gizmodo.com/itt-is-officially-closing-1786243058 As I mentioned in an earlier post, many of the now closed for profit schools were basically just cashing in on federal aid and VA benefits and providing very little education. We have seen a half dozen close in our city over the last few months. Some of them were charging up to $20,000 a semester which is about twice what tuition costs in our state run four year colleges. And right now, IT jobs are begging for candidates. I have received a half dozen offers in the last few months but am not interested because I have already put in my 50+ years. :-) My teaching gig is part time and leaves me with just enough time for other projects like playing with trains. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78306	From: ken	Date: 9/7/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries

David,      My father graduated from Dunsmuir High as did several of my cousins.  My youngest three cousins graduated after the Shasta Division was closed in 1964. I was in a college prep high school at the time.  The high school curriculum in Dunsmuir was not comparable, and to be honest it would have been impossible for a small town high school to have the same academics as a large urban high school. Dunsmuir High did prepare their students to learn when they pursued their careers in the military, in college or in trades.  You have to learn 'how to learn' before you can really learn and that is how my cousins benefited from Dunsmuir High. And to be blunt, a lot of students graduate from high school (and some colleges) without knowing how to learn.     Funny, having grown up in San Francisco, I never noticed many college educated management types when visiting Dunsmuir (except for the St. Germaine attendees). RR officials at the time started at the bottom and worked their way up; no shortcuts by going to college.  My cousin dropped out his freshman year of college to hire on as a brakeman.  At the time I was ready to graduate from engineering school.  I told him that is he wanted to live in a small town like Dunsmuir; going to college was  a waste.  His starting wage as a trainman was more that that of the city manager and any of the civic and school employees.  The blue collar, RR employees were the highest paid sector of the local labor force.  I think Dunsmuir High prepared its students to be able to become 'competent in whatever they chose as a career'.  A lot of college prep schools fail to do that.     As far as ITT, their ads always seemed to be too much smoke and mirrors for my comfort.  Still there was/is a need that needs to be filled.  When I started my career, there were still large apprenticeship programs training the workers of the future for highly skilled crafts.  For a variety of reasons those programs have largely disappeared in the last 30+ years.  The government used to have large programs training workers; however those occupations have been outsourced so the training programs were suspended.  The private sector contractors now doing the work never needed to train workers in the past, and training workers now will keep them from being cost competitive. The situation has gotten so bad that these contractors charge extra if they are unable to hire skilled workers.  The Navy was expected to pay a bonus if the contractor could not  hire workers to perform the contract work.  Easy money or a bonus for failure to perform the required work.   ken clark   On September 6, 2016 at 9:43 AM "'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   As some of you know, I grew up in Dunsmuir, a small mountain railroad town that was the SP Shasta Division headquarters. Mostly because of that, the high school was heavily weighted, even back then (1960s-70s) to College Preparatory schooling; what with all the upper management types in town. So, this is not a new trend! Even back then (as a student!) I thought it was not serving the students well. I agree completely! Reading this this morning is quite topical as the radio news is saying that ITT is closing their training doors. And as for no new train deliveries; well, so far we are just speculating as we don't know which shipper has the train-containing containers (try saying that fast five times). Run 'em if ya got 'em! David Dewey     ken

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78307	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/7/2016
Subject: Topics, topics.....

While the bankruptcy of Hanjin MAY effect the shipment of toy trains from the Orient, and lighten the container trains moving East across this country, the significance I see to this story  is that we Americans are vulnerable to seagoing commerce disruptions just as the British were during WWII.  It's another reason to get manufacturing back here. As for finding jobs, we are having a lot of problems filling what jobs there are with untrained and uncaring youth these days.  This is also a warning that things in this nation aren't right anymore and we need a turn around. As for there being "no train content," I would say that when someone posts something about trains, the "conversation" will most likely swing back that way.   Stumpy Stone in a very HOT eastern "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78308	From: David Dewey	Date: 9/8/2016
Subject: Re: Finding Work Today & No Train Deliveries OT!

Well, Ken’s posting made me aware that I wasn’t very clear in my posting about DHS. First, yes, few Division Officials were College educated—BUT they wanted their kids to be so! It was part of the “Upward Mobility” of the time. And my education was miles ahead of what my wife’s was in comparison—in her high school she was one of about 300 kids in her class—heck there were barely 200 kids in my whole school! We knew our teachers, and most of them were very well-trained and educated teachers. Mr. Wright, the science/math teacher turned down a job offer at the Lawrence Livermore linear Accelerator so he could teach—he felt he could a better contributor to society by teaching. Both of his sons became teachers too.  However, by the time I was in high school, most of the students were destined for trade work than academic work, and that was where I thought the school was not responding well to their needs. I think one of the great things about the school was that the teachers really knew their students, and the teachers were very approachable and dedicated. Most teachers are dedicated, but when you have hundreds of students, you can’t give the individual attention that you can when there’s only 200 kids in the whole school! Oh, and Ken, BTW, my layout plans for at least some of the Shasta Spring’s trackside facilities in one corner curve. I remember when SP tore down the pagoda building, and how upset I was at the lack of respect for history—at the time I was told they just didn’t want it on their taxes. I was lucky enough to have actually been “in” the building (it was open on the sides, so being “in” is kind of a stretch).  A few years ago I was there and you can’t see a thing anymore, although the I AMers have kept up the bridges on the trail on their property.  My folks almost bought Shasta Springs when it went up for sale in the ‘40s.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78309	From: racin510	Date: 9/9/2016
Subject: Re: Topics, topics.....

I don't see the US of A as being much more 'vulnerable' than most other industrialized countries. The economy is globally interdependent and is a world economy now. Our billionaires wreck Wall Street and repercussions are felt in Europe and Asia. China has a big stock market check up and it is felt here. The clock is not to be turned back. It is what it is and it ain't going to change. Toy trains and ties made in China I can easily live without.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78310	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 11 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78311	From: allscalerails	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #10 Sept / Oct 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #10  Sept / Oct 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.allscalerails.com Subscribe to our free email list & Get notified when new issues come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join http://www.allscalerails.com Included in this issue: What is Gauge?, How-To: Modify Märklin 8592 Z Scale Adjustable Straight Track, "L&S Division of the B&O", How-To: Card Stock Modeling Pt.2, DL&WRR Oil House Scranton PA Blueprints, News & New Products, Snapshots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, All Scale Rails Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78312	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: Re: Topics, topics...

You're right, of course, we do live in a Global Economy.  I'm into history and follow the old adage about it:  "You can't know where you're going if you don't know where you've been."  I try to learn the lessons that history has to teach.   From this perspective, I observe that the Global Economy has not raised the standard of living of nations world wide, but it has lowered the standards of living of those former Industrialized Nations.   This means that GATT and NAFTA actually helped no one in the "lesser countries,"  dragged Europe and America down, and in the long run enriched only a few very wealthy financial manipulators.  Along with planetary warming, overpopulation, a declining infrastructure, and the numerous other problems we face, we have weakened the only nation who has consistently been able to help others in the world, and has the track record to p[rove it.  Now, we can no longer even help ourselves! And that brings me back around to trains.  I have loved them (and cars, and vintage aircraft, etc) all my life.  Even on the most stressful days of working for the local school system, I always knew I could escape to "go play with my trains."  I am currently dabbling in S, HO, HOn30, and On30, and even a computer Trainz Simulator.  To make it affordable, I do more building than buying, which takes a lot more time, but the diversion and satisfaction of accomplishment are counteracting what I see on the Evening News! While, like my Father, try to keep up with and consider the effects of world events,  I find balance in hobbies.  And I must be doing this better, because he always told me I had "too many hobbies!"  Or could it be that in today's world we NEED to have more hobbies to counteract the depressing effects of the world we live in? I think it's past time to go plug in the transformer and "railman" my layout...  :-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78313	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 11 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78314	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 9/11/2016
Subject: Re: All Scale Rails Issue #10 Sept / Oct 2016

Why is it I am unable to view the magazine? From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of allscalerails@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2016 9:41 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] All Scale Rails Issue #10 Sept / Oct 2016     All Scale Rails Issue #10  Sept / Oct 2016 has just hit the internet! http://www.allscalerails.com ALL SCALE RAILS - Home Page www.allscalerails.com Your mom, your dad, your kids, your club, your friends, and your favorite hobby shop. “Like,” “Share,” “Follow,” “Tweet,” & “Pin” us! Subscribe to our free email list & Get notified when new issues come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join http://www.allscalerails.com Included in this issue: What is Gauge?, How-To: Modify Märklin 8592 Z Scale Adjustable Straight Track, "L&S Division of the B&O", How-To: Card Stock Modeling Pt.2, DL&WRR Oil House Scranton PA Blueprints, News & New Products, Snapshots and much more! Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, All Scale Rails Bonnie & Kevin www.allscalerails.com www.facebook.com/allscalerails www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78315	From: Tom	Date: 9/13/2016
Subject: 588 block signal including modern Lionel version

I’m trying to hook up the new Lionel version of the 588 block signal and I do not want to use the insulated track section. Instead I’d like to manually raise and lower the semaphore from the control box with the red and green buttons. I’ve hooked up the semaphore with the yellow wire from the semaphore control box (not the wires from the base of the semaphore) going to the power and the black wire going to the base, as is customary with AF/Lionel wiring. The semaphore base has a black wire that according to the instructions is supposed to be connected to the base rail via a track clip in the insulated section. There is ribbon wire from the semaphore base to the control box. How should I wire this accessory to use the semaphore in a manual mode without the insulated section? If I simply connect the yellow and black wires from the control box as directed and do not connect the black wire from the semaphore base to anything, I can get the semaphore to raise by pushing the green button on the control box. However, there is no drop down function and the red button does nothing. What am I missing and how should I wire this accessory to achieve the desired manual operation? I don’t know what the circuits in the semaphore base look like so I don’t have direction from that wiring. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks. Tom Detmer Madison, WI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78316	From: George Guzewicz	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

Anyone find a solution to old stiff link couplers that won’t move?   Sent from Mail for Windows 10

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78317	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

George, What's worked for me is to take a soldering gun and CAREFULLY heat the head of the metal link pin while working the link coupler around.  The heat helps melt the mold release wax that leaches out from the plastic and usually prevents the link coupler from moving freely around the pin.  Too much heat and you'll totally distort the hole and you'll ruin the coupler, so be careful.  That being said, you can get away with using the heat to slightly enlarge the hole to give you a coupler that will move nicely, but again be careful. Daryl On 9/17/2016 11:06 AM, George Guzewicz flguz@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Anyone find a solution to old stiff link couplers that won’t move?   Sent from Mail for Windows 10

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78318	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 18 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78319	From: poniaj	Date: 9/17/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

George, Daryl has a good solution.  I use that plus a compressed air nozzle to blow the release agent from the coupler.  I'll also echo his caution on too much heat.  I've also used a hair dryer, on the coupler, but you have to be extremely careful in any case.  Good luck! Jerry Poniatowski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78320	From: ken	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

Normally, Unless there is obvious heavy corrosion,  I squirt the coupler moving parts with Pure Electronics Contact Cleaner and Lubricant.   The stuff is highly flammable and works great on freeing up  balky motors/brushes but if the motor is running while the stuff is vaporizing you have an engine fire.  Pure Electronics has a non-flammable version but it is 3 times more expensive.  Deoxit D5 works if there is obvious corrosion but again it is 3-4 times more expensive.  Most electronics cleaners are plastic compatible which is a plus when working on plastic models.   ken clark moderator repower and regear Yahoo group "I have been repowering HO, S and O scale models, two rail only, for over 35 years. Love the sound, smell, and operation of Flyer steamers converted to operate on DC.   On September 17, 2016 at 8:06 AM "George Guzewicz flguz@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:     Anyone find a solution to old stiff link couplers that won’t move?   Sent from Mail for Windows 10         ken

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78321	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 18 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78322	From: William Lewis	Date: 9/18/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

I guess im a little more low tech. I just kinda flex it a little and give it a couple drops of labelle oil. Then i just work it up and down a lot. Seems to work ok for me. Sent on a Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® III -------- Original message -------- From: "poniaj@... [S-Trains]" Date:09/17/2016 6:26 PM (GMT-06:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP   George, Daryl has a good solution.  I use that plus a compressed air nozzle to blow the release agent from the coupler.  I'll also echo his caution on too much heat.  I've also used a hair dryer, on the coupler, but you have to be extremely careful in any case.  Good luck! Jerry Poniatowski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78323	From: Fred Alles	Date: 9/19/2016
Subject: Re: OLD LINK COUPLER WON'T DROP

A couple times I found the hole to go our of round due to heat so oil or cleaning doesn’t cure it.  I used a hair dryer to “soften” the coupler some and then by hand work the coupler to get the plastic to go back to “round”.   That has worked several times and then the oil and cleaner to get rid of other material that caused some friction.  That has worked for me.  Carful about the heat as mentioned by others.  Fred

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78324	From: rm_hirailer	Date: 9/19/2016
Subject: Trains in the park

If you'll be in the southern Idaho region on Saturday, October 24, stop by Julia Davis Park in Boise to see the Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers' iconic layout, "Lookout Junction." We'll be displaying outdoors on the grass all day, and it promises to be another beautiful fall day in Boise. Be sure to say hello. http://idahocalendar.com/Events/model-trains-in-the-park-listing-7842-53410.aspx YourS, John Eichmann, Coordinator Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers Home of Lookout Junction, "Route of the S Gaugers" Boise, Idaho www.rockymountainhirailers.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78325	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 9/20/2016
Subject: Baldwin Derailmant

I am having derailment problems with my Baldwin locomotive going through the switches on my switching layout. It seems to me that the pick up shoes are hanging up on the AF switches but I maybe missing something else that is causing the problem. I am also not sure that the trucks are able to make the turns when the switches are back to back. I am using the Baldwin switcher because I need a short loco keep the layout under 12 foot in length.  Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Jack Ruth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78326	From: snstrains	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

Try some added weight . These are notoriously light. When I convert one to can motors and electronic reverse unit I add 6 oz of lead under the reverser. Does the trick.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 9/20/2016 4:58:01 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   I am having derailment problems with my Baldwin locomotive going through the switches on my switching layout. It seems to me that the pick up shoes are hanging up on the AF switches but I maybe missing something else that is causing the problem. I am also not sure that the trucks are able to make the turns when the switches are back to back. I am using the Baldwin switcher because I need a short loco keep the layout under 12 foot in length.  Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Jack Ruth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78327	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

If the problem is with the front truck, you need to add weights to the chassis.  Baldwins are very light in front and jump the tracks with ease. Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78328	From: timstrains2000	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

It could be that the shoe springs have been replaced somewhere along the line and they are too long and/or strong. You could remove them and cut a little off, but I am hesitant to suggest this unless you have replacements - in case this doesn't work. There has to be enough pressure to make good contact between the pick-up shoes and the track, but not so much that it tends to lift the front end up a wee bit, causing insecure wheel contact. Good luck! ...Tim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78329	From: thomas.kaufman@ymail.com	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

I know this may sound stupid but along with Vic's comment, make sure your rail joints are smooth. Also check to see if the small springs are missing from the pickups on the trucks. If the pickups aren't sprung they can hang up as well. But as Vic said add a ittle weight to the front truck. An easy way to do that is take a medium size door hinge, folded on itself that will fit in and lay onthe frame. The additional weight will not tax the locomotive too much, ( remember the CNW set had only three cars), and you should be fine.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78330	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

The length of the train may be the magic word. You said you are using a Baldwin to keep the layout shorter than 12 feet. Are you pulling a 12 foot long train with a Baldwin? Incredible!  Pulling a heavy consist around a curve has a tendency to cause derailments. Does it derail if you're pulling only three or four light cars? Adding weight to the Baldwin may help, but if you're pulling 12 feet of cars, 5 pounds probably isn't enough! Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org On Sep 21, 2016, at 5:10 AM, thomas.kaufman@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I know this may sound stupid but along with Vic's comment, make sure your rail joints are smooth. Also check to see if the small springs are missing from the pickups on the trucks. If the pickups aren't sprung they can hang up as well. But as Vic said add a ittle weight to the front truck. An easy way to do that is take a medium size door hinge, folded on itself that will fit in and lay onthe frame. The additional weight will not tax the locomotive too much, ( remember the CNW set had only three cars), and you should be fine.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78331	From: John Schoonenberg	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derailmant

John; Have you checked the gauge of all wheel sets. I believe the width between the wheels should be equal to the diameter of one dime (per, I believe, Portliness Hobbies). Sometimes one or more wheel sets is out of gauge and needs to be adjusted. Does it derail on every switch or just one? In that case have you checked the switch to see that the points are closing completely? John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78332	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 9/21/2016
Subject: October/November 2016 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ 2016 NASG National Convention          A look at this year���s convention Let���s Build A Fuel Storage Tank          Jay Mellon has a Novice Scratch Project Developing an Industrial Scene          Glenn Guerra says: It���s All About the Details Adventures In S Scale          George Sorensen���s Journey What's on your Workbench What's on your Workbench Shows, Meets and So Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78333	From: Ray Puls	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin deraiment

I agree with these folks about adding the weight to the chassis. I have two of these Gilbert Baldwins and have added the weight and solved the problem of the front truck derailing. I have found though when pulling a heavy train that the rear or power truck will some times derail. For this problem I cemented a piece of Styrene plastic to the chassis above the rear end of the power truck. This has done the job on these two engines. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78334	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Baldwin Derrailment

Attachments : photo (5).JPG Thanks for all the suggestions. I was missing something: the weight! I will be sure to put the weight on the chassis before I run it the next time.  The switching layout is 12 foot long and in in order to move a loco and at least two cars on to the main line I needed a short loco. The Baldwin was the only short loco I had.  We, ACSG;Carolinas Div., ran the layout at the Great Train Show in Raleigh, NC this past weekend. It was really a lot of fun to see kids of all ages operating the switching layout to spot cars or pick up cars to put them on the main line. Some problem solving skills were put to the test. I have attached a pic of this very simple switching layout. Thanks again for all helpful advice. Jack Ruth

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78335	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: AF 715 915 Automatic Flatcar Load

A while back I got some more AF at a big outdoor antique sale. I also picked up a Manoil Coupe. You know that 30s art deco car that goes on the 715 or 915 automatic flatcar. It had no wheels and it had a bad repaint. I stripped the paint off and polished the bare metal. I put wheels on it and it looks great. It almost looks like Mercedes German silver. I'm not painting it. If you ever come across a distressed Manoil coupe. Try it. One of the other AF pieces I picked up was a knuckle coupler plastic 4-6-2 pacific. I cleaned it up and tested it. Reverse was fine but forward, the motor would turn but the wheels weren't. What I found was the main gear that meshes with the worm was worn on one side. The side that meshes in the forward direction. What I bought was a engine that had a lot of miles on the virtual odometer. Definitely not a shelf queen. I got the drivers of and replaced the gear. Problem solved. I'm an Computer Engineer in my 5th decade of fixing computers. I did the mainframes and now the blades. I had a VP say years ago "Do two things every day, learn something and have fun. I did both that day. Regards Bob Moyer

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78336	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derrailment

John, your idea of an interactive switching layout for train shows really gave me a nice mental jolt!  What a great way to add interest and allow the public (particularly the younger crowd) a chance to really run trains and not just around and around!  Going to propose an idea like that to the Kansas City S gauge club. Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78337	From: Bob Groh	Date: 9/22/2016
Subject: Re: AF 715 915 Automatic Flatcar Load

Very nice, Bob.  From another Bob (Bob Groh, Blue Springs, Missouri)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78338	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Manoil Coupes

I have/had several Manoil Coupes as they were not only made for the American Flyer cars, but were common die cast toys.  Being a "car guy" I had lots of toy cars as a child and still love cars, almost as much as trains.   The long nose and "fastback" styling were a "version" of a very rare Bugatti coupe from the mid-thirties. This type of styling was popular in the1930's as the long hood denoted power, then equated by a big engine.  The "fastback" or "torpedo" cabin was considered "cutting edge" styling then and into the forties.  For some reason, such cars tended to be driven by bad guys in movies and cartoons for some reason. Of course, the rights and molds from Manoil were long ago sold off when the company changed hands and then closed.  The cars are actually "out of scale" for S, but a particular "scale" was not a consideration to toy makers.  Actually 1/43 "scale" came about early on by accident as the number of molds that fit into a foundry's "casting box" to pour the castings set the size of most such toys. There are a lot of the coupes around, and are even reproduced for S collectors for high prices.  A lot of folks just throw away the damaged and/or bad paint cars.  Good show to redo one yourself!  You can now call yourself an "automobile restorer!" ;-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78339	From: poniaj	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

The Manoil coupes were a favorite of mine too.  A few years ago, I made a number of resin copies for my own use, and sold a few at an S event.  They turned out nice, but only a few were sold.  Attached are a few photos of the cars.  I kept most of them or gave them to a good friend who's in O gauge.  The real problem was that it took about an hour to finish off one car.  The casting needed clean up and preparation for paint.  It was a fun project, but the mold wore out, and I have moved on to other train related projects. Here's a few in from of the "Manoil Factory" on my previous layout:

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78340	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

Thanks Stumpy for the info on the Manoil coupes. Yes that's the easiest car restoration I've ever done. I'm a member of the Mercedes Club in SW Florida. Sometimes its more of a addiction support group but its fun. I still do some light car work, brakes, interior, filters, detailing but that's about it. All the rest of the work goes to a garage I trust. I know you also did some slot car work. We're hosting the National Mercedes club meeting in Naples this November. At one of the events I'm setting up a 1/32 slot car track with accesories and of course, Mercedes slot cars. On Fri, Sep 23, 2016 at 7:04 AM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have/had several Manoil Coupes as they were not only made for the American Flyer cars, but were common die cast toys.  Being a "car guy" I had lots of toy cars as a child and still love cars, almost as much as trains.   The long nose and "fastback" styling were a "version" of a very rare Bugatti coupe from the mid-thirties. This type of styling was popular in the1930's as the long hood denoted power, then equated by a big engine.  The "fastback" or "torpedo" cabin was considered "cutting edge" styling then and into the forties.  For some reason, such cars tended to be driven by bad guys in movies and cartoons for some reason. Of course, the rights and molds from Manoil were long ago sold off when the company changed hands and then closed.  The cars are actually "out of scale" for S, but a particular "scale" was not a consideration to toy makers.  Actually 1/43 "scale" came about early on by accident as the number of molds that fit into a foundry's "casting box" to pour the castings set the size of most such toys. There are a lot of the coupes around, and are even reproduced for S collectors for high prices.  A lot of folks just throw away the damaged and/or bad paint cars.  Good show to redo one yourself!  You can now call yourself an "automobile restorer!" ;-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78341	From: snstrains	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

I have a 715 (black weight coupler) with black body, blue-gray ramp and a green metal Manoil tanker truck on it. Does anyone know of this?   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78342	From: albert paolozzi	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

No one has mentioned the Manoil convertibles.  They were not Flyer loads but they sure are nice and came with two different front grillworks.  One is more common than the other.  They were available during the same time period as the coupes and are the same size.  I have a small collection of them in various colors.  From  also a car and Flyer train guy.  I drive a 59 MGA  Al Paolozzi in Pahrump, Nv From: "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 23, 2016 4:04 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Manoil Coupes   I have/had several Manoil Coupes as they were not only made for the American Flyer cars, but were common die cast toys.  Being a "car guy" I had lots of toy cars as a child and still love cars, almost as much as trains.   The long nose and "fastback" styling were a "version" of a very rare Bugatti coupe from the mid-thirties. This type of styling was popular in the1930's as the long hood denoted power, then equated by a big engine.  The "fastback" or "torpedo" cabin was considered "cutting edge" styling then and into the forties.  For some reason, such cars tended to be driven by bad guys in movies and cartoons for some reason. Of course, the rights and molds from Manoil were long ago sold off when the company changed hands and then closed.  The cars are actually "out of scale" for S, but a particular "scale" was not a consideration to toy makers.  Actually 1/43 "scale" came about early on by accident as the number of molds that fit into a foundry's "casting box" to pour the castings set the size of most such toys. There are a lot of the coupes around, and are even reproduced for S collectors for high prices.  A lot of folks just throw away the damaged and/or bad paint cars.  Good show to redo one yourself!  You can now call yourself an "automobile restorer!" ;-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78343	From: poniaj	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

Attachments : trains on 2-16-05 003.jpg Manoil display ready LO.jpg Manoil colors.jpg I'll try again to inbed a few photos of my resin Manoils.  And by the way, those convertibles and tankers all fit nice on the auto unloader cars.  But I have to be careful so they'll not become another hobby like 1:64 cars are... Jerry Poniatowski

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78344	From: rick gough	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

How often do you find the Manoil roadster? I have a nice original yellow one. According to Greenberg's a few made it on to 715's but I've never seen one on a 715 on Ebay.   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Friday, September 23, 2016 12:32 PM, "albert paolozzi amflyral@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   No one has mentioned the Manoil convertibles.  They were not Flyer loads but they sure are nice and came with two different front grillworks.  One is more common than the other.  They were available during the same time period as the coupes and are the same size.  I have a small collection of them in various colors.  From  also a car and Flyer train guy.  I drive a 59 MGA  Al Paolozzi in Pahrump, Nv From: "mrstumpy@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 23, 2016 4:04 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Manoil Coupes   I have/had several Manoil Coupes as they were not only made for the American Flyer cars, but were common die cast toys.  Being a "car guy" I had lots of toy cars as a child and still love cars, almost as much as trains.   The long nose and "fastback" styling were a "version" of a very rare Bugatti coupe from the mid-thirties. This type of styling was popular in the1930's as the long hood denoted power, then equated by a big engine.  The "fastback" or "torpedo" cabin was considered "cutting edge" styling then and into the forties.  For some reason, such cars tended to be driven by bad guys in movies and cartoons for some reason. Of course, the rights and molds from Manoil were long ago sold off when the company changed hands and then closed.  The cars are actually "out of scale" for S, but a particular "scale" was not a consideration to toy makers.  Actually 1/43 "scale" came about early on by accident as the number of molds that fit into a foundry's "casting box" to pour the castings set the size of most such toys. There are a lot of the coupes around, and are even reproduced for S collectors for high prices.  A lot of folks just throw away the damaged and/or bad paint cars.  Good show to redo one yourself!  You can now call yourself an "automobile restorer!" ;-) Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78345	From: racin510	Date: 9/23/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

Greenberg says that roadster loads did come on 715's.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78346	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil coupes

I have at least one of each of the vehicles that came on Flyer cars, and a bunch of other odd die cast toy cars, many still in need of restoration, but no Manoil Roadsters.  When I do see them, the price is usually too high.  Those in my price range need restoration (which is fine by me) but the windshield frames are broken off. As to resin casting toy cars, I did this about twenty years ago making O scale coupes, sedans, roadsters, trucks, a vintage race car, bulldozers, and a WWI style tank.  They were "generic," not  something actually made in cast metal, and I sold them through the hobby shop I worked at part time.  This led to casting skeleton log cars in O, S, and HO, and an O flatcar.  After about three years of doing resin, I swore off ever doing it again too.  The cost of resin went up and finishing time was too high and I was actually loosing money! Starting as a teen in the sixties,  have raced slot cars in 1/32, 1/24, and HO scales, both on home and commercial tracks.  Lots of fun but can get costly, especially if (like me) you raced with a group or hobby shop circuit and travel was involved.  I ran an HO circuit that you had to travel as much as two hours one way for about five years and threw in the towel last winter.  Now I race at home with spotless HO cars on vintage sets. I have collected.  (See http://slotless.weebly.com for my website about that. Meanwhile, after years of having no full size "specialty car," I have a Mustang for cruise ins and shows. My Dad told me way back in 1990 that I had too many hobbies.  They're all great stress relievers, but he was right.  I'm running out of space for all the trains, cars, airplanes, and other stuff.  But I'm having fun! Stumpy in Ahia

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78347	From: timstrains2000	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Baldwin Derrailment

If adding a little weight to the front works, do it. But also know that it is a band aid, masking an underlying problem. A stock Baldwin in proper working order should not need added weight to keep it on the track; switching or otherwise. Have fun! ...Tim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78348	From: George Guzewicz	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

I'm fortunate to have many 707 coupes including the solid yellow, solid silver, and solid orange which are seldom seen. Anyone ever seen yellow or orange w silver hood? Sent from Outlook

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78349	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 25 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78350	From: UNLV666@...	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: S Helper Right Hand Turnouts

I would like to purchase two S-Helper right hand turnouts, preferably manual, but will consider automatic. Please contact me.     Joe New Hampshire

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78351	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Re: S trax system

Hi all: I have been trying to use SHS turnouts in the single train mode to isolate the branches of a 'tree' siding. What I would like to do is to have 2-3 engines on the branches of the tree siding and be able to use the engine that I want on the layout by using the turnout direction for power. I have read the SHS instructions, but am probably a little confused, or some of the turnouts aren't operating in two train mode as they should, so I do have a few questions: 1) If operating in two train mode, is power directed to the turnout direction? [the first two turnouts do this, but the third doesn't - there appears to be no power in the two train mode in the direction the turnout is switched]. 2) Is this an observed problem with the interior electronics and is there some way to fix the third turnout? I am using ac so that might be a problem (for some, that is). I also have a 6 place rotary switch that I could use to direct power, but that might become a little complex. thanks for any help, suggestions, etc. Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78352	From: Don Abrams	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

I have both yellow and orange with silver hoods/tops. Got them off eBay about 15 years ago. I wonder what their value would be in today's market? Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78353	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 September 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 25 September 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78354	From: Richard Reichard	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: York Tables

To ALL:       I'll be there, Silver Hall - Table M 9. Featuring the RAIL BENDER and Switch Building Manuals.  Please Stop BUY!   Dick Reichard (TCA 76-9747)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78355	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: O and S Scale News!

As many of you know, this past weekend was the O Scale Show in Indianapolis, IN.  Jim Canter was the heart and soul behind this show for the past 15 years. Jim has now decided to pass this on to someone else. Amy and I here at the Model Rail Resource have taken the challenge, and are pleased to announce the new "Indianapolis O Scale & S Scale Midwest Show". Since there is not currently a dedicated scale S show in the Midwest, we have decided to include the S Scale community. Dates for next year's show will be September 22-23, 2017 The location will stay the same -- the Wyndham Indianapolis West Website: http://indyoscaleshow.com/ Much more information to come, so stay tuned! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78356	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 9/25/2016
Subject: Derailment

Hi All, I’ve noticed lately that quite a few individuals are having derailment issues caused by what appear to be relatively minor imperfections in the rails/switches/crossovers in their layouts.  I just ran across the following link shows what is needed in the real world to cause a derailment.     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-8gV4DJZUw     I suspect that a lack of mass is the primary culprit as the cause of our toy train derailments, and that a lack of compliance in the trucks to small vertical displacements in the rails (no real springs) is a contributing factor.  This might be a good opportunity for those with the time to conduct some experiments and let us know what they find.  Any other ideas? Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78357	From: Bob Moyer	Date: 9/26/2016
Subject: Re: Manoil Coupes

Don't know value but they are colorful and period correct. If you played with Flyer trains, you probably played with cars like these. I junk around the flea markets and antique malls. The ones I buy are the ones missing wheels etc. Definitely played with. I don't have any of the "better" Manoils. The ones with two castings, the fintail, and the Zepplin bus. The bus is a Deco classic. On Sun, Sep 25, 2016 at 10:10 AM, Don Abrams donabrams@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have both yellow and orange with silver hoods/tops. Got them off eBay about 15 years ago. I wonder what their value would be in today's market? Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78358	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: American Flyer S in the garden

Hello, I am new to this group. I collect toy and model-trains in various gauges including S and I did add an S gauge track to my garden layout. I wonder if there are more S collectors or operators that run their trains in the garden. Here is a view from a run with a 312 pacific: American Flyer S Gauge K5 PRR pacific in the garden American Flyer S Gauge K5 PRR pacific in the garden S Gauge American Flyer 312 4-6-2 PRR pacific from 1947 with smoke unit in the tender running in the garden with a contemporary American Fleyer freight t... View on www.youtube.com Preview by Yahoo Regards Fred

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78359	From: William J. Gill	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

Fred, where do you live such that this is possible/practical to do. I live in the Northwest on the wet side of the mountains. I would be cleaning rusting track and killing moss every time I looked around at a garden layout. At least I wouldn’t have snow to contend with. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78360	From: n6ojj	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

Fred,  Nice video.  Interesting track arrangement.   Please tell us how you made the video. What camera did you use?  What did you mount the camera on and how did you keep the 312 a consistent distance from the camera through most of the video.   Cheers,  Dave McBrayer  ----------------  On Sep 27, 2016, at 4:52 AM, fred.van.der.lubbe@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hello, I am new to this group. I collect toy and model-trains in various gauges including S and I did add an S gauge track to my garden layout. I wonder if there are more S collectors or operators that run their trains in the garden. Here is a view from a run with a 312 pacific: American Flyer S Gauge K5 PRR pacific in the garden American Flyer S Gauge K5 PRR pacific in the garden S Gauge American Flyer 312 4-6-2 PRR pacific from 1947 with smoke unit in the tender running in the garden with a contemporary American Fleyer freight t... View on www.youtube.com Preview by Yahoo Regards Fred

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78361	From: Eric	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: engines for sale

I have 2 S Helper engines for sale.  Make me an offer These are from an estate of a friend from a couple of years back. First:  S Helper  #01106  Consolidation steam engine This is lettered for the Union Pacific (fairly rare first run only) cab # 580 It was retrofitted with the factory Tsunami and factory PCB These were about $450 plus about $150 to add the DCC unit. It looks and runs like new with original box,  shipping box and manuals. It is Hi-Rail and has a kadee style coupler.  Flyer coupler is in the box. $450. plus shipping Second:  S Helper #01545 SW8  Burlington Northern green cab # 99 Factory equipped Tsunami DCC These were $290 from the factory Set up as High rail with Kadee style couplers includes scale wheels and all Flyer compatible coupler parts. includes original shipping box and manuals. Runs and looks like new. $250. Plus shipping Eric Reis Kenmore, WA. 98028 EricRhere-at-gmail-dot-com Postal money order, check (held to clear) and paypal work. thanks for looking

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78362	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

Bill, I live in the Netherlands which is known for its wet climate. The track is nickel silver and will not rust; the extra rail to make S gauge track is down for a few months but the Gauge 1 track is already there for 25 years. Killing moss I have to do only once a year. Of course the track has to be cleaned before a running session with a rail cleaning block. Regards Fred

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78363	From: fredlubb	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

Dave, Thank you. I made the video with a small JVC HD Camcorder (JVC Everio Quad proof). I made a simple two truck, 8-wheel, gauge 1 car with a tripod like screw. On this car I mount a camera ball head and then the camera, so I can position the camera as I like. I just walk along and push the camera car trying to keep the same speed as the train being filmed; of course it is also possible to run another loco pulling or pushing the camera car or have the camera car in front or tail of the train which is filmed.   Regards Fred

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78364	From: Paul Krause	Date: 9/27/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

Got to admit, now that is different!  Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:31 PM, 'William J. Gill' wjbillgill@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Fred, where do you live such that this is possible/practical to do. I live in the Northwest on the wet side of the mountains. I would be cleaning rusting track and killing moss every time I looked around at a garden layout. At least I wouldn’t have snow to contend with. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78365	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 9/28/2016
Subject: American Flyer in the garden

That's pretty neat!  Obviously having multi gauge track allows several different scales and gauges to be operated, which is a great idea.  And having the layout up of timber saves back problems!   I did garden railroading from 1983 through 1997 and even wrote for Garden Railways magazine for six years, and in that time never saw S gauge outdoors.   Nickel silver rail IS the way to go outdoors with good brass being second if you're going to use track power outdoors. O and "G" (1 gauge track) were most popular then, but we saw folks try HO and one of them even did N gauge outdoors.  The problems with going smaller than O scale (or S) is small size and light weight being harder to operate reliably.  While the heavier larger scale locomotives and cars do okay, even a fallen leaf or gust of wind will derail HO or N scale trains.  Trackage for these scales indoor has to be very well done, but outdoors keeping the track smooth enough is just about impossible due to temperature changes and other factors. I ran live steam on my layout which is about as heavy as you can get and could even plow snow with that.  I also got into scratch building 7/8" scale on gauge one track to represent two foot gauge trains.  It was a lot of fun, but also a lot of work because in America, layouts on the ground is the popular way to do garden railroading.  I suspect there was influence of using live plantings for "scenery" here early on. Good job on the layout and the flexibility of multi gauge track! Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78366	From: Doug Peck	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: ODD SIT PART

Attachments : SIT-ODD BAFFLE-TOP.jpg SIT-ODD BAFFLE-BOTTOM.jpg Recently had to service and repair a smoke-in-tender unit, and found that it had a very odd  “pump-plate” and connection to the SIT gear. I have never seen this type of connector before, but it does appear to be original and factory. I’m suspicious that this may have been a very early version, because we had problems with it stalling if the unit happened to stop when the stud that secures it to the gear was at either extreme end of the slot. Ultimately, we had to replace the entire piece with the more common style plate and connector. Does anyone have any information about this odd style part? Photos are posted in my album, “PORT LINES PHOTOS”. Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays: 2-5 PM (EST) only. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78367	From: racin510	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART

That does look petty experimental. The one they used also can jam at the extremes, but I would see no hope for this gadget for improving the operation!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78368	From: Bill Lane	Date: 9/29/2016
Subject: SHS hoppers wanted

I am looking for 2 SHS 2 bay ribbed side hoppers preferably undec or painted black only. I could buy or trade. I am pretty sure I have red NCY offset or rib side that are dupe numbers.   Reply directly with what you have.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78369	From: walling_m_i	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: American Flyer S in the garden

thanks for the video.  very realistic and smooth!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78370	From: NEIL FERRIS	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART

I have seen one like this too in repairs I've done.   It was in working order so I did not change it but I did wonder what the story was behind it. Neil in Oregon

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78371	From: Dale Smith	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: Re: ODD SIT PART

Attachments : My friend, Lonny Beno, who is not on this list, caught this post and told me that this is from an HO smoke unit.  I will try to attach a copy of a photo of the HO smoke unit, but if that doesn't work, I will upload to the photos section. Lonny said all SIT units for HO engines use this type of bellows. It uses the insides of the small tender shell as a guide. Dale Smith On 9/29/2016 10:04 PM, NEIL FERRIS bowlsalot2@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I have seen one like this too in repairs I've done.   It was in working order so I did not change it but I did wonder what the story was behind it. Neil in Oregon

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78372	From: daleminard	Date: 9/30/2016
Subject: 3-D Printed Details

Just curious:  has anyone else out there been using 3-D printed plastic details on their layouts?  I’ve not only bought from CatzPaw, but I’ve also found www.shapeways.com to be a bonanza of 1/64 items.  I’ve even been able to get some designers to change the scale of a product and print it in 1/64 scale (i.e, from 1/48 to 1/64 and 1/72 to 1/64).  While the items purchased from CatzPaw come ready to use, the ones from Shapeways arrive unpainted and in need of a brief soap & water bath before paint is applied. Dale Minard

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78373	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/1/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 02 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 02 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78374	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 10/1/2016
Subject: Birkshires for sale

I have one Nickel Plate & one Pere Marquette Both are mint in the sealed boxes. Each is $600.00 plus shipping $30.00 each OR,  Both for $1200.00 add $40.00 for both shipped to you. No pay pal.  Only Check or money orders only.  You can email me if interested ;  femiro2002@...  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78375	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/2/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 02 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 02 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78376	From: alsflyer	Date: 10/3/2016
Subject: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

I have forgotten what are the Best paint removers for American Flyer rolling stock that will not harm or pit the plastic? I have several old cars that are damaged. I am gluing new plastic to them to restore them - I need to strip the old paint off first.  I will be making new decals for these cars. Al Clearfield, UT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78377	From: Alan Smith	Date: 10/3/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

Al I have used several products, but have found the best is a product called  “Mean Green”.    “Simple Green” will also do the job. I put the cars in the solution and let them soak overnight or even longer. I use a soft bristle brush to lightly scrub the cars to remove the printing that may be a little stubborn.  I use a 50 /50 mix, (product and water) but you can experiment to suit yourself. I have never experienced any negative results with either  product.  It is not a solvent based product but rather a soap base   The only thing I would recommend is to use rubber gloves as it will take the oils out of your skin.  Disposal is NOT an issue as well.   Good to clean out your drain. Old AL in Hamilton   On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:24 PM, alsflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have forgotten what are the Best paint removers for American Flyer rolling stock that will not harm or pit the plastic? I have several old cars that are damaged. I am gluing new plastic to them to restore them - I need to strip the old paint off first.  I will be making new decals for these cars. Al  Clearfield, UT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78378	From: rick flaherty	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

Excellent advice.  Thank you! Rick From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Monday, October 3, 2016 at 8:50 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock   Al I have used several products, but have found the best is a product called  “Mean Green”.    “Simple Green” will also do the job. I put the cars in the solution and let them soak overnight or even longer. I use a soft bristle brush to lightly scrub the cars to remove the printing that may be a little stubborn.  I use a 50 /50 mix, (product and water) but you can experiment to suit yourself. I have never experienced any negative results with either  product.  It is not a solvent based product but rather a soap base   The only thing I would recommend is to use rubber gloves as it will take the oils out of your skin.  Disposal is NOT an issue as well.   Good to clean out your drain. Old AL in Hamilton   On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:24 PM, alsflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have forgotten what are the Best paint removers for American Flyer rolling stock that will not harm or pit the plastic? I have several old cars that are damaged. I am gluing new plastic to them to restore them - I need to strip the old paint off first.  I will be making new decals for these cars. Al  Clearfield, UT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78379	From: wyoaf	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

I have used auto Brake Fluid with excellent results.  Immerse, baste and let sit for 24hrs plus.  It's gentle thorough and water soluble (sounds lake a laxative).  John Davis Noblesville IN.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78380	From: william lewis	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

DOT 3 Brake Fluid works for me. -------------------------------------------- On Tue, 10/4/16, rick flaherty flick23@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, October 4, 2016, 12:52 AM   Excellent advice.  Thank you! Rick From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Monday, October 3, 2016 at 8:50 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock   Al I have used several products, but have found the best is a product called  “Mean Green”.    “Simple Green” will also do the job.I put the cars in the solution and let them soak overnight or even longer. I use a soft bristle brush to lightly scrub the cars to remove the printing that may be a little stubborn.  I use a 50 /50 mix, (product and water) but you can experiment to suit yourself. I have never experienced any negative results with either  product.  It is not a solvent based product but rather a soap base   The only thing I would recommend is to use rubber gloves as it will take the oils out of your skin. Disposal is NOT an issue as well.   Good to clean out your drain. Old AL in Hamilton   On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:24 PM, alsflyer@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have forgotten what are the Best paint removers for American Flyer rolling stock that will not harm or pit the plastic? I have several old cars that are damaged. I am gluing new plastic to them to restore them - I need to strip the old paint off first.  I will be making new decals for these cars. Al  Clearfield, UT #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613 -- #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp #yiv8840740613hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp #yiv8840740613ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp .yiv8840740613ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp .yiv8840740613ad p { margin:0;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-mkp .yiv8840740613ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-sponsor #yiv8840740613ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-sponsor #yiv8840740613ygrp-lc #yiv8840740613hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv8840740613 #yiv8840740613ygrp-sponsor #yiv8840740613ygrp-lc .yiv8840740613ad { 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78381	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

Some AF paint strips much easier than others. I had a nice 919 (red dump car) that was great, but dirty. Took the body off the frame and proceeded to wash it with warm water and just a drop of hand soap (liquid) EGADS!! the red paint rolled right off, just melted. AAUGH!! So now I have a “weathered” car.  I am much more careful about cleaning now!! On the other hand, I have a nice 372 (UP GP loco) shell that someone painted black. I’ve been using hot water and a plastic pick and have pretty much cleaned off one side. Granted, the paint is a little dull, but it’s still there and might work out as a layout runner—we’ll see how the other side cleans up!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78382	From: snstrains	Date: 10/4/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

If you want it done perfectly. I glass bead locos and cars for $10. Makes painting easy and no muss or fuss for you.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/4/2016 12:52:23 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Some AF paint strips much easier than others. I had a nice 919 (red dump car) that was great, but dirty. Took the body off the frame and proceeded to wash it with warm water and just a drop of hand soap (liquid) EGADS!! the red paint rolled right off, just melted. AAUGH!! So now I have a “weathered” car.  I am much more careful about cleaning now!! On the other hand, I have a nice 372 (UP GP loco) shell that someone painted black. I’ve been using hot water and a plastic pick and have pretty much cleaned off one side. Granted, the paint is a little dull, but it’s still there and might work out as a layout runner—we’ll see how the other side cleans up!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78383	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

I just can’t let this go. DOT 3 Brake Fluid is not “water soluble;” it does absorb water though. If you have any early AF cars, it will seep into the pores of the plastic. Yes, plastic has pores, that white stuff you see on link couplers and heavyweight passenger car bases is the steric soap used as a mold release in the plastic, and it is leaching out of the plastic after all these years. The brake fluid will do the same thing, and it softens the plastic. You are much better off spending money for real plastic paint strippers, or using the other products mentioned here.  Fortunately, most of the early plastics were not painted, but molded in the colors wanted. However, if someone has painted them and you want to remove that paint, be aware! Steve Blackburn mentioned glass beading; this works fine on the die cast parts, I even do it! (well, used to, my cabinet is not yet set up since the move—but it’s close; just some plumbing to do now! ) It’s a bit too aggressive for plastic parts.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78384	From: George Cohn	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

On 10/5/2016 8:58 AM, 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > > I just can’t let this go. DOT 3 Brake Fluid is not “water soluble;” it > does absorb water though. If you have any early AF cars, it will seep > into the pores of the plastic. Yes, plastic has pores, that white stuff > you see on link couplers and heavyweight passenger car bases is the > steric soap used as a mold release in the plastic, and it is leaching > out of the plastic after all these years. The brake fluid will do the > same thing, and it softens the plastic. You are much better off spending > money for real plastic paint strippers, or using the other products > mentioned here. I've done a bit of 1:1 scale car restoration in my time and used a bead blast cabinet. A lot of the media is harmful to your health like sand but there are many other types such as plastic beads, walnut shells, and ground corn cobs that are less aggressive and safer. That being said, most of the chemicals like purple power and such are just very dilute solutions of sodium hydroxide, (lye) with added surficants. That's why they leave your drain clean when you dispose of them. Not sure what the answer really is but a lot of model sites talk about making their own plastic paint stripper using lye. Be careful, it can cause severe burns and is definitely not something you want to breathe. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78385	From: Eric	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} engines for sale

I still have The  S Helper engine steam for sale.   Make me an offer  This are from an estate of a friend from a couple of years back.  S Helper  #01106  Consolidation steam engine  This is lettered for the Union Pacific (fairly rare first run only) cab # 580  It was retrofitted with the factory Tsunami and factory PCB  These were about $450 plus about $150 to add the DCC unit.  It looks and runs like new with original box,  shipping box and manuals.  It is Hi-Rail and has a kadee style coupler.  Flyer coupler is in the box.  $425.00  with shipping to USA included   I also found I have 5 Blue ridge ore car loads for the SHS Ore Cars, Reddish color.  $25 including shipping. excellent shape. These are no longer made.  Eric Reis Kenmore, WA. 98028 EricRhere-at-gmail-dot-comPostal money order, check (held to clear) and paypal work. thanks for looking _._,_.___ Posted by: Eric <ericrhere@...> Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (3) Have you tried the highest rated email app? With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage. Visit Your Group New Members 1 • Privacy • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78386	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running

Hello Group; I have a 1958 AF GP7 that wobbles as it goes down the track. The truck has been rebushed and runs smoothly when I turn it upside down and apply power. The wheels appear to run true and are in gauge. The engine wobbled when I purchased it new in about 1959-60. I had it rebused. This did not correct the problem. I removed the two Pullmor wheels with tires and replaced them with regular metal wheels to see if it was a problem with the traction tires. It still wobbles.  Could there be a problem with the armature being bent or gears on the armature not being lined up properly? What is the correct position for the pullmor wheels? I have seen just about every combination for their placement on GP7s for sale on Ebay I also have a NH PA with a single motor that runs similarly but not with as pronounced a wiggle. Perplexed, John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78387	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

I don't know that I'd really want to remove the paint from an original Flyer body shell but I'd probably use one of the commercial paint removers specifically designed for plastic. Some years ago..almost 30 now...I had several American Models freight and passenger cars that I needed to repaint. It would have been a lot easier to just use undecorated ones but, as in this situation, undecorated models were not available. I used full strength Pine-Sol right out of the bottle into a basin I fabricated to hold the body shells. Luckily I had a part made of the same plastic with which to test the Pine-Sol. After an overnight soak and no problems I commenced. Bottom line it worked great. I would highly suggest if at all possible....test whatever paint removal solution you are using on either  a spare part of the same material as the body shell or an unimportant part.                                             Bob Lampe                                             Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78388	From: snstrains	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running

It is very probable that the yoke is just loose where it attaches to the chassis. Put a washer that will snug it up under or over the pin as is needs and see if that doesn't take care of it. Being a wobbly Goblin is a bugaboo of the GPs. The pullmor wheels work bast for electrical pickup when they are both on the same side opposite the pickup shoe.   Steve Blackburn SnS Trains Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/5/2016 1:15:28 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hello Group; I have a 1958 AF GP7 that wobbles as it goes down the track. The truck has been rebushed and runs smoothly when I turn it upside down and apply power. The wheels appear to run true and are in gauge. The engine wobbled when I purchased it new in about 1959-60. I had it rebused. This did not correct the problem. I removed the two Pullmor wheels with tires and replaced them with regular metal wheels to see if it was a problem with the traction tires. It still wobbles.  Could there be a problem with the armature being bent or gears on the armature not being lined up properly? What is the correct position for the pullmor wheels? I have seen just about every combination for their placement on GP7s for sale on Ebay I also have a NH PA with a single motor that runs similarly but not with as pronounced a wiggle. Perplexed, John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78389	From: snstrains	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Best paint remover for American Flyer rolling stock

I use glass beads that are almost as fine as talcum powder. It cleans the paint off in it's entirety and no harm done to the plastic or metal. No chemical residue of any kind. There are several people out here that can attest to it as I have done many jobs for them.   Steve Blackburn SnS Trains Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/5/2016 11:56:13 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   On 10/5/2016 8:58 AM, 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > > I just can’t let this go. DOT 3 Brake Fluid is not “water soluble;” it > does absorb water though. If you have any early AF cars, it will seep > into the pores of the plastic. Yes, plastic has pores, that white stuff > you see on link couplers and heavyweight passenger car bases is the > steric soap used as a mold release in the plastic, and it is leaching > out of the plastic after all these years. The brake fluid will do the > same thing, and it softens the plastic. You are much better off spending > money for real plastic paint strippers, or using the other products > mentioned here. I've done a bit of 1:1 scale car restoration in my time and used a bead blast cabinet. A lot of the media is harmful to your health like sand but there are many other types such as plastic beads, walnut shells, and ground corn cobs that are less aggressive and safer. That being said, most of the chemicals like purple power and such are just very dilute solutions of sodium hydroxide, (lye) with added surficants. That's why they leave your drain clean when you dispose of them. Not sure what the answer really is but a lot of model sites talk about making their own plastic paint stripper using lye. Be careful, it can cause severe burns and is definitely not something you want to breathe. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78390	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/5/2016
Subject: Re: T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running

There could possibly be a bent axle that is not readily visible. You may have to completely disassemble the trucks and check the axles. It could even be an axle hole in a wheel drilled slightly off center. My guess is something miniscule and not obvious.                                     Bob Lampe                                      Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78391	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/8/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 09 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 09 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78392	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/9/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 09 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 09 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78393	From: HOwingsiii@...	Date: 10/10/2016
Subject: OPEN HOUSE @ TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED York Week

Attachments : Toy Trains Unlimited Store Front.JPG OPEN HOUSE - York Week              WEDNESDAY October 19, 2016 STARTING AT 2:00 PM (around)   TOY TRAINS UNLIMITED (Open attached picture) 38 YORK ST.  HANOVER PA. 17331 ( 25 minutes from York, PA FAIRGROUNDS ) 1-717-637-4717     FOOD, DRINKS & PLENTY OF GOOD CONVERSATION       Toy Trains Unlimited, 38 York St., Hanover PA. 17331,will be having an open house on Wednesday, Oct. 19, 2016 This is the week of the York TCA, Meet.      This Spring's event will start at 2 PM., and will continue until everyone has left or has been thrown out, including myself (Ron). There will be food, drinks, and a large selection of American Flyer & Lionel trains and accessories. Hopefully there will be some very unusual and interesting Flyer items to show and tell about (please bring  in your interesting Flyer items), and of course we will also have a large group of Flyer and Lionel operators and collectors visiting. Make plans to attend this yearly event and please tell your American Flyer & Lionel friends to come along. There is plenty of that stuff here to choose from. DIRECTIONS: From the York Fairgrounds, take Market St. to Carlisle Ave. until you get to Route 30 west.  Follow Route 30 west (for approximately 8 miles) until you come to the intersection of Rt.116 & Route 30.  Turn left onto Rt.116.  From route 116 & 30 you will travel approximately 20 miles where Rt. 116 will become York St. in the town of Hanover.  As you enter the town of Hanover, travel approximately 2 miles. The train shop will be on the right side of York St./116.  Look for the Railroad Flag hanging from the front of the store.    POST & PRE-WAR LIONEL  ////  TRAINS & ACCESSORIES AMERICAN FLYER  ////  New & Used  TRAINS & ACCESSORIES MTH  ////  S & O Gauge TRAINS & ACCESSORIES AMERICAN MODELS, S-HELPER, K-LINE, DISCOUNT  TRAIN SETS THERE IS NO RETAIL PRICES IN THIS STORE !

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78394	From: Ernest Mennecke	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: eBay Auctions

Has any one noticed this eBay auction. I have four extras in stock I would be happy to sell.... 131961217356 Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78395	From: snstrains	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions

Wow, That's a lot of bids for that.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/15/2016 6:51:31 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Has any one noticed this eBay auction. I have four extras in stock I would be happy to sell.... 131961217356 Ernie Mennecke

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78396	From: William J. Gill	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions

I’ve seen this type of thing on ebay before. An item getting bid up way beyond its worth, value, or customary sale price. I’ve always wondered if the auction actually resulted in a sale or if the seller was “stood up”. I tend to think the latter. I’ve heard of ebay I.D.’s getting stolen and people getting their “jollies” bidding up an item with no intention of every actually buying. I’ve also been chastised for being so jaded and suspicious. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78397	From: americanflyer	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: Re: eBay Auctions

Hi bill yes,happened to me several times than when item ended contacted by seller i think hevhad two e bay ids  Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "'William J. Gill' wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: 10/15/16 11:52 AM (GMT-05:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] eBay Auctions   I’ve seen this type of thing on ebay before. An item getting bid up way beyond its worth, value, or customary sale price. I’ve always wondered if the auction actually resulted in a sale or if the seller was “stood up”. I tend to think the latter. I’ve heard of ebay I.D.’s getting stolen and people getting their “jollies” bidding up an item with no intention of every actually buying. I’ve also been chastised for being so jaded and suspicious. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78398	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/15/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 16 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 16 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78399	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: Re: eBay auctions

The hobby shop I worked at some years back was a regular eBay seller.  But the partners also did a lot of train shows everywhere East of the Mississippi River.   They got to know a LOT of other shop owners, vendors, and eBay sellers.   They started to notice there were various guys who sold their better items at shows then put lower quality stuff on eBay.  To get the price up, they had someone with a different eBay name "shill" the price by out bidding each time someone bid on their item.   The real bidder would up his bid and within minutes, the "shiller" had topped it.  If then the item didn't sell to a real bidder, it reappeared a week or two later.  A few got busted by eBay and tossed off. But when they would see these guys again at shows, they were back doing business on eBay under a different name, and doing the same "shilling" to get more money for items.  They told me that there was a guy selling American Flyer and Lionel in Tennessee who had been nailed four times and always got back on eBay by changing his "name." Another tactic is bad photos to cover up the true condition of an item, which sellers know eBay pretty much ignores as not everyone is a good photographer.  Something else the crooks know.  It's "Buyer Beware" for sure!  While I prefer train shows where I can inspect an item, I still buy off eBay from time to time, and I can assure everyone that the same tactics are still alive and well!   Rule of thumb: Don't get "caught up" in the "heat" of the auction!  Be VERY careful if the photos are blurry, dark, or otherwise poor.  Never bid more than the item is worth no matter how badly you want it.  There WILL be another one eventually, on eBay or at a train show. Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78400	From: zemouse2001	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: Re: eBay auctions

Excellent words of wisdom! Thanks Bob Groh Blue Springs, Missouri

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78401	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/16/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 16 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 16 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78402	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: S Scale Aircraft

Hey folks, anyone know of a source for close to s scale aircraft, military civ. Thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78403	From: Peter Vanvliet	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

Hi ? Go to the NASG web site, click on the "S Resources" button, and then click on the "Scenery" menu option. When the page appears, do a text search for "airplanes". There are a few. Here's the direct link to the page: http://www.nasg.org/Resources/Scenery.php Hope this helps,  - Peter (NASG webmaster) On 10/18/2016 8:40 pm, rwmres@... [S-Trains] wrote: Hey folks, anyone know of a source for close to s scale aircraft, military civ. Thanks Posted by: rwmres@... -- Peter Vanvliet (peter@...) Houston, Texas My hobby site: http://pmrr.org/ My business site: http://fourthray.com/ Our club site: http://houstonsgaugers.org/ NASG site: http://nasg.org/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78404	From: snstrains	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

there are a lot of 1/72 scale aircraft kits in hobby stores. I have 2 Mustangs, 1 Corsair, 1 FW190 and a Messerschmit 109 as well as two civilian aircraft on my layout. They are easy to build and 1/72 fits the layout well.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/18/2016 7:44:57 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hey folks, anyone know of a source for close to s scale aircraft, military civ. Thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78405	From: David Dewey	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions

I have talked to Ron at AM, and to some folks from big L and MTH suggesting that a J-611 or an SP GS4 (Daylight) engine would sell very well, if not be sellouts. The problem, I’m told, is the J is one railroad only, and they think the GS4 is too—but GS4 under SP came both daylight and black, also black without side skirts, and in post service has been Freedom Train, Daylight and BNSF (black), and also the WP had two of them too.  Lots of variations possible there! Of course, it would need to be both Scale and Hi-Rail to get large enough sales numbers.  Also, the GS4 is an oil burner—most of these guys (except Ron) think that all tenders must be coal! That’s one nice thing about the AM Northern—the oil tender! Finally a truly western engine! S’ David Dewey PS I’m also pulling for an SP Cab-Forward, sadly, once again only one prototype railroad—but I think the design is so unique that many folks would “Have to Have One.”

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78406	From: daleminard	Date: 10/18/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

I maintain a Military Air Museum on our Club Layout (San Diego S-Gaugers) in San Diego with over 100 military planes from 1916 to the mid-1950s.  I've found that the Military Scale Planes (1/72) are so close in size that the average person has no idea of the difference.  I also have a consist of flat cars that I refer to as my WW II surplus equipment -- it's full of tanks, half-tracks, trucks, etc. that are, again, 1/72 scale.  I've even found a remote control 1/72 scale WW II Sherman Tank that I can drive off of a flat car and down a loading ramp.  It fires its cannon and machine guns and the turret rotates.  I even got good enough to drive it up the loading ramp and park it back on the flat car. Here are some links to some of the internet providers I buy from:      Eztoys - http://www.eztoys.com/military-planes.html      Diecast Airplane - http://www.diecastairplane.com/      Aikens Airplanes - http://www.aikensairplanes.com/ Dale Minard San Diego S-Gaugers

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78407	From: Victor Bereskin	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions

Someday, maybe in the not too distant future, the model for model train manufacturing will be to sell a standard chassis and 3D printed shells to fit it.  Then, limited interest prototypes will become economically feasible. Vic Bereskin

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78408	From: Lee Brown	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions

economically feasible is not part of the business model

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78409	From: Tom	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Piggyback unloader

I’ve just dug a new piggyback unloader (new in box) out of the closet and am preparing to set it up on my layout. A potential trouble spot appears to be that the brake wheel on the flatcar does not clear the unloader structure. My understanding is that the flatcar is supposed to be able to go all the way through the structure - it unloads on one side and loads on the other but perhaps I don’t understand the operation of it yet. If it is supposed to go through the structure the brake wheel seems to be in the way because it sticks up too high. Is the brake wheel supposed to be removed from the flatcar or am I missing something? Any advice from those of you who are familiar with this accessory would be appreciated. Thanks. Tom Detmer Madison, WI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78410	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions

I would like to see detail parts so that you could at least MAKE one look like the prototype you model. I model the NP who had a distinctive headlight on most of their mainline steamers. Switchers usually used a standard type headlight. I have yet to find that distinctive headlight in S.      Bob Lampe      Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78411	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 10/19/2016
Subject: Re: AM 4-8-4 questions

In toy and model trains having a chassis that can use various shells is only part of the situation.    Injection molding equipment is not cheap, and having the tooling made to mold various different shells is VERY costly.  Every manufacturer has tried to get the most "mileage" out of their tooling, hence the popularity of the USRA designs.   The United States Railroad Administration (made up of various railroad leaders and government officials) selected specific designs for steam locomotives during WWI, and all railroads could pick from these designs only.  The idea was to speed up production and standardize railroad motive power in time of war.  USRA lifted this limitation in 1920.  A similar set of restrictions was used during WWII as well. That means that only certain "universal" designs were made at those times and many railroads continued to order the USRA designs even after these wars.   A toy or hobby manufacture can  do an USRA-like shell and be able to decorate it for dozens of roads, therefore cutting tooling costs as much as possible. The bigger Class One roads were able to "go their own way" and create railroad specific designs to suit their particular needs.  However, with few exceptions, these were built in somewhat limited numbers and used almost exclusively on a single road.  This limits the possible sales numbers for the hobby manufacturer and they are naturally reluctant to take such financial risks.   Steam locomotives are far different than diesels in that a steam chassis is more costly to manufacture to start with.  On the other hand huge numbers of diesels can use the same chassis AND the same shells.  Only truck side frames and the paint and decoration need be different for EMC's ALCO's, and GE engines.  For this reason there are MANY more diesels out there than steam engines.  It's a matter of being cost effective. None of this says that a manufacture won't try doing limited runs of specific steam engines, but there MUST be a market for the design AND customers willing to pay the higher production costs required.  In this economy, even HO manufacturers are cutting back, so going out on a limb in S is very unlikely. 3D printing has been brought up and from what I've seen, this is the wave of the future for hobbyists, but probably not manufactures.  Like resin casting, 3D printing is not yet a cheap process and not financially feasible for mass production.   However, Resin and 3D models ARE fine for very small manufacturers and individuals who want to make short "runs" of an item.   Perhaps a small outfit could make resin or 3D printed shells of more rare locomotives to fit the American Models chassis? In the future, 3D printing will be good enough and cheap enough for every hobbyist to have one at home.  At that point, "buying a kit" might mean buying the CAD program the create a model in your home 3D printer! Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78412	From: acgilbertguy	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: Piggyback unloader

Tom, I have added pictures of the Piggyback Unloader instructions to my pictures (acgilbertguy).  As you can see in the first picture, the brake wheel is at the end of the flat car that does not go under the platform.  The Piggyback unloader is designed to be at the dead end of a string of track with the ramp at the end.  Thus, the Unloader is not designed for the flat car to pass through it.  The trailers would be pushed by hand up the ramp onto the unloader.  The flat car would be moved under the unloader with the break wheel end just short of the unloader.  When the metal piece is tilted into place by the hand lever, the trailers are in position to roll down on to the flat car.  As the flat car is moved out from under the loader, the trailers roll down into place.  When the metal piece is the put back into the horizontal position, it is ready to receive the trailers when the flat car is moved back under the loader.  Hope is information is of help. Rich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78413	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

Here is a listing of near S Scale 1/64 aircraft models. Lindberg also has made a B/17 and a wood multi media kit plus a B-24 Liberator is sometimes is available from Monogram in the old Speedee Bilt line. Check on E-Bay. Remember these are large aircraft so good luck! http://www.diecastairplane.com/store/c/1113-1-64-1-60-Scale.html Tony Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78414	From: Tom	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Re: Piggyback unloader

Rich, Thanks for the detailed and clear explanation of the operation of this accessory.  I checked closer and understand everything you’re describing.  It’s too bad the Flyonel instructions aren’t so clear! I was mislead a little by the picture in the instructions that made it appear that the track goes all the way through the unloader so that the car could be moved all the way through the unloader.  That was the source of my misunderstanding.  As you pointed out, the unloader is supposed to be at the end of a track spur.  I appreciate the response and your pictures. Thanks! Tom On Oct 20, 2016, at 9:48 AM, milepost407@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Tom, I have added pictures of the Piggyback Unloader instructions to my pictures (acgilbertguy).  As you can see in the first picture, the brake wheel is at the end of the flat car that does not go under the platform.  The Piggyback unloader is designed to be at the dead end of a string of track with the ramp at the end.  Thus, the Unloader is not designed for the flat car to pass through it.  The trailers would be pushed by hand up the ramp onto the unloader.  The flat car would be moved under the unloader with the break wheel end just short of the unloader.  When the metal piece is tilted into place by the hand lever, the trailers are in position to roll down on to the flat car.  As the flat car is moved out from under the loader, the trailers roll down into place.  When the metal piece is the put back into the horizontal position, it is ready to receive the trailers when the flat car is moved back under the loader.  Hope is information is of help. Rich

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78415	From: kerhart@frontier.com	Date: 10/20/2016
Subject: Tom's Turnouts

There has been some discussion the last couple of weeks regarding turnouts.  In keeping with that, I have been building a new layout using S-Helper flex track and Tom's Turnouts built by Tom Stoltz.  Unfortunately for me, Tom is no longer making his turnouts.  I have been very pleased with the quality and performance of his product.  I have used his #5, #6 and #8 turnouts. I am still in need of a few turnouts so if anyone has some of Tom's Turnouts taking up shelf space and would like to sell them, please contact me off list.  Thank you. Keith Erhart kerhart@... (815) 979-0094

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78416	From: ee_train	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: 710 Steam Whistle Control

Check the instruction files on www.traindr.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78417	From: Daniel Waskes	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

Hello Group, Osborne Model Kits up in Canada offers some 1:66 scale kits for aircraft. There are both civilian and military types offered. They're definitely not a foreground type of model. They take a lot of sanding to bring them up to a usable standard for me. Their offerings include a Piper Cub, a Cessna high wing monoplane, a DH Beaver float plane  and some WWII era fighter planes. I'm currently building a couple of their DH float plane kits. American Models still offers the Lindberg 1:64 scale AFV tanks  (Armored Fighting Vehicles.) for sale. The detail on these is pretty sorry. I'd describe them as being more of caricature than a miniature. The early Patton tank can easily be backdated to a Pershing tank by removing an idler wheel set. I do have a request to make. If someone answers a question that you've asked please acknowledge your receipt of the information. It's called good manners. I'm appalled by the rudeness being exhibited by some questioners. The sun doesn't rise and set solely on them. Common courtesy is fast becoming in short supply. Sometimes I wonder why I bother trying to pass on any information to these types? Okay, end of rant. "Happy Model Railroading", Dan Waskes

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78418	From: Bill Drake	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A new home?

Hi Peter - I don't know if this email address is still valid but thought I would try. We moved from St. Louis to San Jose, CA about a year ago. I now work for Toshiba and still in wireless (Bluetooth, WiFi). We did the packing, packing, packing thing and I drove three trips with 24' Budget Rent a Trucks across the western 2/3 of the country. Big difference in living conditions. We moved from a 3000 sq ft arts and crafts 1913 house on the National Register of Historic Places in a Historic Neighborhood to a 1200 sq ft 196x ranch in a tract where every 3rd house is the same floor plan. 1/3 the house for 3 x the price. Way of life in Silicon Valley. Bonus is that we are about 15 minutes away from our daughter and her family. Also a large part of the motivation to move. Recently our son and his family moved to Ashland, OR so we are all within a 6 hour drive. Nice. But - problem with what to do about the trains. So we decided to "improve" the garage and modify it into a laundry, office, workshop and train room. Train room is about 13' x 18'. Presently putting up display cabinets around the walls, then to be followed by building the layout tables. With one door in the middle of one of the long walls, and no windows the train room should result in a kind of dog bone shape around the edges. Still working on the details, but will probably build the table(s), then just start putting out tracks and accessories to figure out how to make it work.  How have you been? Long time since we did club meetings in Oregon. Best Regards, Bill From: Trains 4 U <t4u@...> To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com; S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 5:02 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A new home?   Well I am trying to do the same thing Bill, Ed et all ...have been looking for years for a layout space with an attached living quarters...was wiling to have an RV hooked up outside of a shed...well I may be looking at one of those large train rooms with a living hovel above, instead of parked alongside. If I am real lucky it may actually have electricity, heat and be dry as well as have enough head room so I do not have to dig out the floor. So I am packing up my stuff (boy there is a lot of that) a lot of boxes that say "train stuff" and "junk"...I know I am going to need some of that one of these days for the train building with attached living quarters. And getting ready to head east...west is a bit of a problem because of the ocean... so about mid November I will be on my way to NE Tennessee, and what appears to be a large group of S people of al ilks. Yes it may be a challenge getting there, snowy mountain passes, blizards, floods, tornados, and the occasional drunk driver to dodge...but I will be leaving this beautiful place in Oregon for another beautiful place in the hills and mountains of NE Tennessee. Yes another adventure for this old fart...and maybe a new RR empire to engineer in them thar hills. So press on Bill and you other empire builders, two blows on the whistle, green board, open the throttle, and let 'er go! For those of you in NE TN area who follow the S yahoo groups, would like to hear from you. For anyone else interested in keeping in touch... This email t4u@... is good for the next two months, alternate email...drktrains@ gmail.com good now and ...? Phone contact till mid Nov. 541-471-8819 or alternate computer phone connection: 605 838-1008 S gaugingly, Peter Loeb (for now in S. Oregon) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78419	From: rick gough	Date: 10/21/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A newhome?

Bill, I would be happy to give you pictures of my 8'X18' dogleg built into a similar size room. It has worked out as pretty ideal especially if you love operating accessories. 17 switches. Rick Seattle   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Friday, October 21, 2016 1:23 PM, "Bill Drake ee_train@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   Hi Peter - I don't know if this email address is still valid but thought I would try. We moved from St. Louis to San Jose, CA about a year ago. I now work for Toshiba and still in wireless (Bluetooth, WiFi). We did the packing, packing, packing thing and I drove three trips with 24' Budget Rent a Trucks across the western 2/3 of the country. Big difference in living conditions. We moved from a 3000 sq ft arts and crafts 1913 house on the National Register of Historic Places in a Historic Neighborhood to a 1200 sq ft 196x ranch in a tract where every 3rd house is the same floor plan. 1/3 the house for 3 x the price. Way of life in Silicon Valley. Bonus is that we are about 15 minutes away from our daughter and her family. Also a large part of the motivation to move. Recently our son and his family moved to Ashland, OR so we are all within a 6 hour drive. Nice. But - problem with what to do about the trains. So we decided to "improve" the garage and modify it into a laundry, office, workshop and train room. Train room is about 13' x 18'. Presently putting up display cabinets around the walls, then to be followed by building the layout tables. With one door in the middle of one of the long walls, and no windows the train room should result in a kind of dog bone shape around the edges. Still working on the details, but will probably build the table(s), then just start putting out tracks and accessories to figure out how to make it work.  How have you been? Long time since we did club meetings in Oregon. Best Regards, Bill From: Trains 4 U <t4u@...> To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com; S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 5:02 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: {S-Scale List} Re: the walls came down! A new home?   Well I am trying to do the same thing Bill, Ed et all ...have been looking for years for a layout space with an attached living quarters...was wiling to have an RV hooked up outside of a shed...well I may be looking at one of those large train rooms with a living hovel above, instead of parked alongside. If I am real lucky it may actually have electricity, heat and be dry as well as have enough head room so I do not have to dig out the floor. So I am packing up my stuff (boy there is a lot of that) a lot of boxes that say "train stuff" and "junk"...I know I am going to need some of that one of these days for the train building with attached living quarters. And getting ready to head east...west is a bit of a problem because of the ocean... so about mid November I will be on my way to NE Tennessee, and what appears to be a large group of S people of al ilks. Yes it may be a challenge getting there, snowy mountain passes, blizards, floods, tornados, and the occasional drunk driver to dodge...but I will be leaving this beautiful place in Oregon for another beautiful place in the hills and mountains of NE Tennessee. Yes another adventure for this old fart...and maybe a new RR empire to engineer in them thar hills. So press on Bill and you other empire builders, two blows on the whistle, green board, open the throttle, and let 'er go! For those of you in NE TN area who follow the S yahoo groups, would like to hear from you. For anyone else interested in keeping in touch... This email t4u@... is good for the next two months, alternate email...drktrains@ gmail.com good now and ...? Phone contact till mid Nov. 541-471-8819 or alternate computer phone connection: 605 838-1008 S gaugingly, Peter Loeb (for now in S. Oregon) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78420	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: 1/64 Scale Aircraft

Thanks to everyone who responded to my request for sources of S compatible Aircraft. This list gives me a good selection. Roger

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78421	From: Anthony Cynor	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

Sounds like the old Strombecker stuff. Tpmy Cynor

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78422	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 23 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 23 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78423	From: Ingram-James-Yahoo-Grps	Date: 10/22/2016
Subject: =VIDEO: NCE Mini-Panel Controls 2 Trains, Using just ONE Reed Switch

1. THE LINK: ===>> http://youtu.be/BsHgihvmJEA or http://vimeo.com/187501147 or use this forwarding link to the Youtube video http://815.AutoControls.org If you can find about 2 minutes to view the first 120 seconds of this video (a fast-forwarded overview), it should give you a good idea of how it operates. You’ll see 2 trains running on 1 track, automatically controlled an NCE DCC “Mini-Panel” -- using only ONE reed switch for train detection. The claimed “BREAKTHROUGH” shown in this video, is that we can use JUST ONE reed switch for two-train “automatic block” type of operation. DOING THIS IN S GAUGE: The video uses HO gauge, but this method will work IDENTICALLY in S gauge -- as long as the decoders used in are NMRA-compatible DCC decoders (as seen in previous AutoControls.org videos doing S gauge demos). |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | 2. ONE REED SWITCH --> EASIER TO INSTALL: This system is an ALTERNATIVE to using the usual TWO reed switches {“stop” and “go”} that are traditionally used. There are number of situations (modules, garden railway, running on somebody else’s layout) where you might be able to fairly easily hook up a SINGLE reed switch, but getting that 2nd reed switch hooked up on the other side of the layout might be more difficult. Being able to do automatic operation using just ONE reed switch (no blocks needed), may open NEW possibilities for automatic control. |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| |~~ ADDITIONAL FYI COMMENTS: . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ~~| |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| <> 3. THE LOGIC: The logic is to have the 1st train stopped in the “parking area” about 12 feet (or more) “downstream” of the single reed switch. The 2nd train is started “upstream” of the reed switch. When the 2nd moving train passes over the reed switch (and the magnet on the front car momentarily closes the reed switch), the Mini-Panel: **(a) starts the 1st stopped train, so it leaves the “parking area”, **(b) executes a 10-second (or more) delay command until the 2nd moving train reaches the recently-vacated “parking area”, then **(c) sends a “Stop” command to stop the moving train. The above 3-step process then repeats when the 1st train, which is now out on the mainline, passes over the reed switch. |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | 4. WHICH METHOD IS BETTER: Two reed switches (as seen in previous Video #814 Part 1/3) is PREFERRED when possible -- because two reed switches gives better control than using only 1 reed switch. But it’s not always easy to get 2 reed switches installed on the layout. |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | 5. THE DRAWINGS ARE ON THE WEB: Here is the link to the directory containing a copy of the wiring diagram, the “sequence diagram” (logic), and the commands: http://track2.com/ingram/plans/815/ |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | 6. ABOUT THE MINI-PANEL: The NCE “Mini-Panel” is a $49 off-the-shelf, approximately 3-1/2 inch-square component that plugs into the “control bus” (cab bus) of an NCE DCC system. It can be considered a simple “Programmable Controller for DCC Trains”. Although this demonstration has been done in HO gauge using Kato track, this same “Mini-Panel” and its “programming” could readily be used for N, HO, S, O gauge, Largescale, or any other DCC trains that adhere to the NMRA standards for DCC. -- |---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Thanks. - Jim Ingram, VMS 570-322-7597, Williamsport PA, Apache Junction AZ | AutoControls.org // PhxRail.org // track2.com // JamesIngram.net, , MacBook Pro/OS 10.10.2 |--------------------------------------------------------------------------- : ==================== end of email ================

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78424	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/23/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 23 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 23 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78425	From: amflyral	Date: 10/23/2016
Subject: For sale

S helper new 0145 Penn MOW boxcar OB including scale wheels,  Flyer compatible $35 plus shipping.  contact me off list at amflyral@...   thanks al Paolozzi

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78426	From: jwschoonenberg@gmail.com	Date: 10/24/2016
Subject: Re: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running

I missed a reply by Steve Blackburn that he sent on 10/5/16. He stated that the the yoke on my GP 7 is probably loose and needs another washer to snug it up. He was right. The entire yoke assembly is extremely loose and wobbles right and left and back an forward. None of my other diesels have motorized trucks that do this.  I disassembled the yoke from the frame and was going to add a washer as he recommended. However, I found that the fiber bushing that goes on the bottom of the assembly was completely worn out . The lip on the bottom of the bushing was disintegrating and just falling apart. Interestingly, the diagragms in the K line "Complete Service Manual" show different combinations of the number of washers, and parts numbers of those washers depending on the vintage of the GP 7s that were produced ( for example 370, 371, 372, 3745 listed in the manual) I will order another bushing from Portlines. Whether or not an additional washer is requred remains to be seen once the bushing is replaced. I will also replace the pullmor wheels  opposite the power pickup shoe as he recommended. I think I have seen just about every possible positioning on the GP7s that are for sale on Ebay. A belated thanks to Steve for his suggestions and help. John

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78427	From: racin510	Date: 10/24/2016
Subject: Re: Re] T&P 21831 GP7 Rough Running

The trucks on the diesels do want a little slop though to act as a suspension. I've made the mistake of setting them up too snug. Also, replacing pull mor wheels with the newer Lionel high flange ones is a real bonus for keeping the engine on track especially when pulling heavy loads.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78428	From: amflyer336	Date: 10/26/2016
Subject: Re: S Scale Aircraft

Hi New Ray made some Lockheed 10 Electras in "American" and "Delta" airlines years ago in 1/60th scale. And, I found two Lockheed P-38 Lightnings.  One is made by MotorMax (gray) and is marked 1/60th scale, the other is by Yat Ming (silver) and is marked 1/64th scale.  There is about a half inch difference in the wing spans and both seem to be scaled correctly.  I found the MotorMax at the US Air Force Museum in Dayton, OH, a couple years ago. Gregg

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78429	From: John Degnan	Date: 10/27/2016
Subject: Gondola Load Of S-Helper Service AF Wheels & Couplers For Sale

Attachments : 1026161345-.jpg Everything you see in the gondola... but not the gondola itself. Ok, so... it's not a real gondola load... depending on what scale you're working in... but it's enough to re-fit two full 1/64 scale... cars. Asking $17 + $3 for shipping. I accept PayPal, Personal Checks, Money Orders and Cash. John Degnan Scaler164@...

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78430	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Lionel TMCC "wallwart"

We (probably me) lost the little transformer ("wallwart") that went with our Lionel TMCC.  Its ouput is 12V AC, 100mA.    It would save me a lot of research if someone might know off-hand of a source for a generic substitute.   Tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78431	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: the wallwart

forgot to mention, contacted Lionel and it's no longer available.   tom H

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78432	From: snstrains	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart

If you can find a Radio Shack still open they should have a substitute. I may even have one that I could get to you.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 10/28/2016 2:50:31 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   forgot to mention, contacted Lionel and it's no longer available.   tom H

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78433	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart

Tom,     Try Wal-Mart for a universal power supply. Take the end that plugs into the unit so as to match it with the new one. Some universals have several different plugs so get one that has a plug like the one you need. Also...even if you get a one amp unit your unit will not draw more amperage than it needs to operate.Case in point i have 2 HAM radios that I want to power from a 12 volt power supply BUT one radio requires 45 amps at 12 volts and the other only needs 11 amps at 12 volts.I got a 50 amp power supply cause neither radio will draw more amps than it needs. Same rule applies to your wall powered device will only draw 100ma even if iit is plugged into a 1 amp power supply Voltage on the other hand IS critical. Too much voltage will fry whatever you plug into a power supply if it requires less voltage. So if the device needs 12 volts.....stay with 12 volts. On the other hand less voltage will burn stuff up too. SO voltage is critical amps not so critical except that if your power supply has less amperage than you need it will not power up.                                                       Bob Lampe                                                       Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78434	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 10/28/2016
Subject: Re: the wallwart

One of these places might have what you need. Allied Electronics - Supplier Line Card and Supplier Links Allied Electronics - Supplier Line Card and Supplier Links Allied Electronics provides an alphabetical listing of the Suppliers and Manufacturers in the Allied Catalog View on www.alliedelec.com Preview by Yahoo   Jameco Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor Jameco Electronics - Electronic Components Distributor Electronic components distributor offering semiconductors, passives, interconnects, electromechanical, power supplies, test and measurement equipment. Lowest prices guaranteed. View on www.jameco.com Preview by Yahoo 12 volt power supply | Mouser Electronics, Inc. 12 volt power supply | Mouser Electronics, Inc. View on www.mouser.com Preview by Yahoo   This is just 3 there are others too. Good luck.                                                      Bob Lampe                                                      Kalispell, MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78435	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/29/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 30 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 30 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78436	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/30/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 30 October 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 30 October 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78437	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Large AF layout

There is a very large American Flyer layout featured in All Scale Rails. www.AllScaleRails.com It is free to subscribe.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78438	From: beebear	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Train show in Dayton this weekend

Does anyone have any information about a train show in Dayton on the 5th and 6th?   John Frankforther This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78439	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 11/1/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend

Attachments : John,  here’s a link to the website:   http://www.daytontrainshow.com   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 4:58 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     Does anyone have any information about a train show in Dayton on the 5th and 6th?   John Frankforther   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78440	From: beebear	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend

Attachments : Thank you Carl   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 9:14 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     John,  here’s a link to the website:   http://www.daytontrainshow.com   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 4:58 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     Does anyone have any information about a train show in Dayton on the 5th and 6th?   John Frankforther   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78441	From: railandsail	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend

Attachments : It is just the 5th,...not the 6th,...is that correct?? On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 9:14 PM, 'Carl & Kathy Rudolph' cakr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   John,  here’s a link to the website:   http://www.daytontrainshow.com   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups. com] Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 4:58 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     Does anyone have any information about a train show in Dayton on the 5th and 6th?   John Frankforther   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78442	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 11/2/2016
Subject: Re: Train show in Dayton this weekend

Attachments : The text printed in red on the website shows hours for both days.   Carl   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2016 7:34 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     It is just the 5th,...not the 6th,...is that correct??   On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 9:14 PM, 'Carl & Kathy Rudolph' cakr@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   John,  here’s a link to the website:   http://www.daytontrainshow.com   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 4:58 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Train show in Dayton this weekend     Does anyone have any information about a train show in Dayton on the 5th and 6th?   John Frankforther   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78443	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 11/3/2016
Subject: Train Show November 5th & 6th in Raleigh, NC

The Neuse River Valley Model Railroad Club will be hosting a train show this weekend. The Atlantic Coast S Gaugers/ Carolinas Division will be setting up their modular layout which will incorporate Rhett George's "S" curve modules into the design. The club will also have a switching layout. Watch us build a train of over 100 cars. Here is the web site for more information: https://nrvclubdotnet.wordpress.com/annual-model-train-show/ The Largest, Longest Running Model Train Show in North Carolina. In the Jim Graham Building, State Fairgrounds, Raleigh, NC. At corner of Blue Ridge Rd. and Hillsborough St. With over 95,000 sq. ft. of Railroading. Multiple layouts in 6 different scales.  Featuring the largest, single entity, portable, HO Scale Layout. Trains 80 cars long and more! Also, a full-size model of THOMAS the TANK ENGINE and a LEGO Layout!!!  Pre & post-war Lionel and Flyer parts and repair will be available. Annual Model Train Show 9am – 5pm November 5th & 6th, 2016 $8.00 admission covers both days, 12 years old and under FREE The Largest...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78444	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/6/2016
Subject: SHS Conrail caboose wanted

Attachments : SHS_extv_caboose_00228.jpg I am still l looking for this S Helper Service Conrail caboose item  00228 if anyone has 1 that could be for sale.   Also looking for SHS Chessie caboose item 00225 or 00593. It does not matter which 1 to me. I do not want the Chessie safety green caboose.   Scale wheels must be included.   Please replay directly to bill@...   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78445	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/6/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 06 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 06 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78446	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: Re: American Models B unit

Hi all, Just wondering if someone on this list might have instruction sheet for American Models AC sound B unit? I bought this at S Fest but without paperwork, might you scan and send to me. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78447	From: Tom Hawley	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: Re: American Models B unit

 ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Puls rpuls3@... [S-Trains] . . . . .someone on this list might have instruction sheet for American Models AC sound B unit?  . . . . . . > > > > > > > There's not much to say about it.  You operate it on AC only.  You of course need a two-button box, such as AM sells.  The big transformer AM sold had the two buttons built it.  One button rings bell, press to turn on bell, press again to turn off.  The other button blows horn.  Hold down to start horn, release to turn off horn.   AM might not tell you this, but you can't get a very short toot.  Once horn starts it blows till it thinks it shoudl stop.  And you may get erratic bell rings occaionally.  And you cannot program different ring-tones into it.   What else to know?   tom Hawley  --  Lansing Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78448	From: allscalerails	Date: 11/8/2016
Subject: All Scale Rails Issue #11 Nov / Dec 2016

All Scale Rails Issue #11 Nov / Dec 2016 has just hit the internet! www.AllScaleRails.com Subscribe to our free email list & Get notified when new issues come out. https://gem.godaddy.com/signups/194276/join   www.AllScaleRails.com Included in this issue: How-To: Add Years of Wear to N Scale Gondolas, Railroad Land Grants, Ron Schlicht's S Scale Layout, How-To: Card Stock Modeling Pt.3, The Sulphite Railroad Bridge, SP Freight Agents Office Harlingen TX Blueprints Visit us on Facebook & Twitter to stay up-to-date on all current events and newest product releases! Striving to Preserve & Inspire, Bonnie & Kevin  www.allscalerails.com  www.facebook.com/allscalerails  www.twitter.com/allscalerails

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78449	From: alhbaker	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

I don't believe that I have heard any recent discussion about Dave at LBR Enterprises.   I haven't bought from him for about 4 years because of problems that I had with him, but I wouldn't mind trying a couple of his recent products.   Any comments about how he has been doing in recent times would be appreciated.  Thanks, Al Baker

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78450	From: hobbycj1	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

Hi-- Ive been buying different items from LBR  for a few years, and am very happy with their products with no problems. Thanks Clemente J Bianchi

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78451	From: jaytewilli	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: NETTE Auctions

Has anybody out there been experiencing problems contacting NETTE Auctions within the last 30 days or so? I won a couple of their lots on Live Auctioneers and haven't been able to get a hold of them either by e-mail or phone.  I've had no issues with them over the past 5-6 years so I'm wondering if something is going on. Anybody aware of anything going on with them? Daryl

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78452	From: Doug Peck	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions

NETTE declared bankruptcy on Oct 26 and dissolved. Join the long list of folks who are out $$$$$$. In my case, they auctioned over $20,000 worth of brand new Lionel O-gauge product for me back in August, and I received NOTHING. I understand there are unpaid claims back to at least May.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78453	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions

Thanks for the info Doug.  Looks like I'm on the outs too!  Never received the lots I won and paid for.  They are probably sitting somewhere... Regards, Daryl On 11/10/2016 3:13 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   NETTE declared bankruptcy on Oct 26 and dissolved. Join the long list of folks who are out $$$$$$. In my case, they auctioned over $20,000 worth of brand new Lionel O-gauge product for me back in August, and I received NOTHING. I understand there are unpaid claims back to at least May.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78454	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

 He never made it right with Me , only lies & then no communications , He is at it again on E-Bay under a new name & they know nothing of his past ?  I will not buy anything until he makes things right with Me, too bad as he has some good stuff

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78455	From: Ron Petersen	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: NETTE Auctions

If you bought Items on NTTE and used your credit card and never received the items then you have a very great chance of recovery if you file a claim with your credit card bank. -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 11/10/16, Daryl Olszeski jaytewilli@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: NETTE Auctions To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, November 10, 2016, 2:33 PM   Thanks for the info Doug.  Looks like I'm on the outs too!  Never received the lots I won and paid for.  They are probably sitting somewhere... Regards, Daryl On 11/10/2016 3:13 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   NETTE declared bankruptcy on Oct 26 and dissolved. Join the long list of folks who are out $$$$$$. In my case, they auctioned over $20,000 worth of brand new Lionel O-gauge product for me back in August, and I received NOTHING. I understand there are unpaid claims back to at least May.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78456	From: tbennerohio	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update

We could have trains running on the new layout by the time the snow flies!  I posted a couple of progress photos in the Ft Wayne Line folder.  Given that the old Gargraves layout did not leave the room entirely until March I am pretty happy with the progress! Benchwork and sub-roadbed are complete. All track is glued down save a couple of dummy tracks going to the Ohio Connecting Bridge. Almost all feeder wires have been soldered to the rails.  only about 10 to go.  All but 2 Tortoise switch machines are installed Wiring will be next.  It will be wired to be DCC compatible.  BUT since all of my existing locomotives are AC Hi-rail I am wiring into 5 blocks (times 2 for the double track main) with a Cab 1/2 DPDT switch for each block mounted on the fascia.  The batteries in the drill used to drive countless screws impressed me so much that I am thinking about skipping conventional DCC altogether.  Dead rail wireless DCC is making much more sense.  That would allow the conventional AC locomotives to run on track power and dead-rail locomotives to run on the same track. Someone recently posted here or on the S Scale forum about dead rail conversion.  I need to find that post.  The next project will be converting an AM RS-3 or Trainmaster as soon as trains are running.  The Winter will be spent running this layout to see if I really like it this way.  Scenery over the next year(s).  It will make much more sense when some scenery and view blocks are in place. Questions and comments are welcome.  If you have any experiences with dead-rail to share I would love to hear them! Regards, Tim Benner Jackson, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78457	From: rudypenne	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

What name is he under on E-Bay?  Mike   In a message dated 11/10/2016 12:55:30 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:    He never made it right with Me , only lies & then no communications , He is at it again on E-Bay under a new name & they know nothing of his past ?  I will not buy anything until he makes things right with Me, too bad as he has some good stuff

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78458	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/10/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ? & new I D

 new id  for lbr  is va251962 ----- Original Message ----- From: anormal1@... [S-Trains] To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2016 5:41 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?   What name is he under on E-Bay?  Mike   In a message dated 11/10/2016 12:55:30 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:    He never made it right with Me , only lies & then no communications , He is at it again on E-Bay under a new name & they know nothing of his past ?  I will not buy anything until he makes things right with Me, too bad as he has some good stuff

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78459	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: LBR

I have done a few small purchases from LBR since I got my situation straightened out. I had five or six sets of tender trucks with them for conversion to all wheel pick up. After a long period of time with no communication from them and many ignored emails that I sentto them I contacted them on the OGR forum requesting information on the progress of my order and received kind of a terse reply asking "who are you", I replied stating who I was and what my order was and got an answer, "Now I know you". We had a few exchanges of email and after several weeks I received a refund check of about $150.00 and the trucks that I had sent. It turned out the idea they had for the conversion did not work as planned. Their communication was quite poor, but they do have some nice products. All of my future dealings with them will only be in small dollar amounts. Ron, you and I communicated some about your situation, I am sorry that you were not able to get your problems with them resolved. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78460	From: Carey	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

I have been an intermittent customer over the years and have yet to have a bad experience.  He has always answered my questions and shipped promptly Carey Probst Pennsyltucky RR Chief MicroFerroEquinologist On 11/10/2016 3:53 PM, 'Ron Inscho' roninscho@... [S-Trains] wrote:    He never made it right with Me , only lies & then no communications , He is at it again on E-Bay under a new name & they know nothing of his past ?  I will not buy anything until he makes things right with Me, too bad as he has some good stuff

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78461	From: vu68	Date: 11/11/2016
Subject: Re: new Fort Wayne Line update

Congats Tim.  Pictures look great. I'm still following in your foot steps (as you know because of our email correspondence).  I'm planning on designing and building something similar, but different because my room is  not quite the same size and I also want to incorporate a few different scenery options. Looking forward to your tips.  Keep up the pictures, as they are worth a 1000 words John Zurad (BAAFC)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78462	From: George Dines	Date: 11/12/2016
Subject: Michigan's Largest Train Show, Sunday 11/13

Train Enthusiasts!   Escape the cold fall weather by getting steamed up for Michigan’s largest model train show. The enormous Lansing Train Show and Sale will be held at the Michigan State University Pavilion on Sunday, November 13, from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m.    If you have attended our show in the past then you know how great a show this is:  - Largest Train Show in Michigan - Live NMRA demonstrations of layout techniques - Visiting layouts from Z to G scales including traction (trolleys) and the award-winning Peninsular Modular Railroad Club - Adults $6, under 12 and Scouts in uniform FREE - Location: Michigan State University Pavilion, 4301 Farm Lane, East Lansing, MI, 48824 - Free Parking Contact Dennis Morley at (989) 723-2870, George Dines (517) 290-9652, or visit www.lmrc.org for more information.  Bring the kids (or grandkids) for a great family event! We hope to see you there, The Lansing Model Railroad Club

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78463	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/12/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 13 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78464	From: rick gough	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

So that makes them [him] less worthless than they have proven out to be to most others?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78465	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 13 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 13 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78466	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/13/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

 Not really , your mileage may vary , mine sure did :(   ----- Original Message ----- From: rick gough racin510@... [S-Trains] To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 5:19 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?   So that makes them [him] less worthless than they have proven out to be to most others?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13405 - Release Date: 11/13/16

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78467	From: Eric	Date: 11/18/2016
Subject: 2 more items for sale

I have found 2 more items to sell to help clear out  some space for other trains. First from the deep archives: Kinsman S Scale ATSF Automobile Box Car Kit Looks new and complete with all small parts in manila envelopes No Couplers or trucks includes Enhorning Decals for ATSF includes 2 instruction sheets. $20  or make me an offer and add about $7 for Shipping, Second: S Helper #11106 Union Pacific Steam engine Engine number 580 Complete with original box and package. Has kadee couplers but should have the Knuckles in the box High Rail wheels Factory DCC with sound.  New these were $600 $400 plus $20 to ship or offer. Check, MO, or Paypal work Eric Reis Kenmore, WA.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78468	From: Eric	Date: 11/18/2016
Subject: Re: 2 more items for sale

The Kinsman kit is sold Thanks to the 5 respomders! The SHS Engine is still available. eric reis

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78469	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/19/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 20 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78470	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: NYC SHS hoppers possibly for sale

Attachments : IMG_7966.jpg If my trade does not happen I have these NYC SHS hoppers that are duplicate to me. Already have Kadees & scale wheels installed. Depending on the deal I might take them off. I cut the wires off my Kadees anyway.   No hi rail wheels and couplers are in this box but I could probably find some if you needed them.   Taking offers for a plan B. Reply directly.       Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78471	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 20 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 20 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78472	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/20/2016
Subject: new Linel S AF track turn out question.

How do they work? I bought manual turn outs and was going to use tortoise  motors and control boxes for my Ring engineering controller. I figured the cost might be the same as buying powered turn outs. I have no idea how they would work. I run the Ring system which is radio controlled and a DCC digital tracks controller that will control DC engines as well. So if the AF turnouts need the Lionel controller I would not buy powered units. It says AF turn outs can be controlled wireless. Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78473	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: cars

Hi: Anyone out there have an extra knuckle coupler, coal or log dump car? Please advise off line (have US address to ship to). Thanks Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78474	From: chuck_7612	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: Re: new Linel S AF track turn out question.

The remote/command versions are operated through the Legacy command system with the CAB2 remote control. It does not indicate any compatibility with DCC.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78475	From: alhbaker	Date: 11/21/2016
Subject: Re: How is LBR Enterprises doing lately ?

I thought in fairness, I should tell you that I just bought three items off of Dave on eBay.  It has been six days since I ordered, and today I received all three !!!    And they look good.  So I am ordering a few more items.  Maybe he is doing much better now! Al Baker Portland (west)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78476	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

a dock side and Polar Express train on same track. Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78477	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: just a great aritcal

http://www.allscalerails.com/Magazine/2016/All%20Scale%20Rails%20Issue%2011%20November%20December%202016.pdf

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78478	From: attic02	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Hi Ron Petersen here.  I am starting to build my first ever flyer layout.  I started this adventure a year ago last August. I have a lot of trains and track.  Now I will take my old Lioinel 8' X 12' layout and lay some postwar flyer track so I can watch some trains run on Thanksgiving.  I am crawling at all this.  Major difference from 33 years of doing O gauge Lionel.  I am now convinced that Lionel doesn't really compare to Flyer.  I have now acquired 37 steam engines and 18 diesels.  Alot of cars and sets.  I have 40 buildings for my layout. Now comes my first problem.. I never looked at the track or anything, just been buying them and getting ready for today.  STARTING. I looked at the track and saw the little hole to hold the track down.  Not even close to Lionel First problem I need some help with.  What size nail or screw do you fasten this track down with. I am a complete novice on this .. amazing and I love it. Someone with a good answer and any ideas you have are always greatly appreciated. I love reading all the great emails I get from this group. Never had anything like it with my Lionel in the years past. thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78479	From: attic02	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

What I am doing now is putting the old flyer track down as a temporary track so I can run some trains on Thanksgiving.  I have not ran a train for over 5 years.  I want to stop watching all the wonderful flyer trains running on youtube and run onw myself again.  Then I will start to work on adding on to my deck.  Thanks

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78480	From: poniaj	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Hi Ron, Welcome to S!  I've nothing against the 3-rail O gauge side of the hobby, but I discovered 60 years ago that Flyer had more in the reality department.  As far as what kind of nails to use on the tracks, I'd suggest going to your local hardware or big box store, bringing a section of track, and see what kind of brads/nails they have.  Keep in mind that you shouldn't nail it down all the way to the head of the brad/nail, just in case you want to tweak your track plan.  I think you'll find that whatever you do in O can be done in S.  Reverse loops are possible, but can get complicated in the electronics department.  I've been avoiding them for 60 years!  As far as S Guys willing to help, there's no shortage of us!  We're a fairly tight nit community, even though we sometimes make up our own divisions: Tinplate (Flyer) vs scale, scale vs hirail, hirail vs Flyer, collectors vs operators, post-war vs modern things made by Lionel, AC vs DC, AC vs TMCC/Legacy, DC vs DCC.... the list goes on.  But don't let anyone sway the way you want YOUR railroad to be!  They're your trains, and you can do whatever you want with them.  If it makes you happy, and nobody is hurt, then go for it.  It sounds like you've jumped into S with both feet, looking at the amount of times you have.  You can get a lot of things on an 8 x 12 layout, but eventually, that may not even be enough. ;>)  Ask me how I know... Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, MI

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78481	From: snstrains	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

Any 100 watt or better Flyer transformer with a 6-10 amp rectifier and a DPDT switch would work just fine.   Steve Blackburn Boise   In a message dated 11/22/2016 3:17:15 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   a dock side and Polar Express train on same track. Thanks Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78482	From: Default	Date: 11/22/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Hi, What revitalized my interest in model railroading 40 years ago was the use of can motors. I had started with Flyer in 1953. Progressed to HO five years later and kept my two 4-4-2s. About 20 years ago I rediscovered Flyer and all those big engines I could never afford. What I had not known was that those UP 4-8-4s had mostly DC motors. Thanks to S-N-S, Timko, and Port Lines I found replacement, easy installed can motors, some with flywheels and a conversion was on. I also discovered Showcase Line track with larger radius curves and a much better appearance. My layout is on the carpet and is all 29" radius curves. The Northerns and PAs look so much better on the wider curves; I no longer use the older Flyer track. I would seriously consider a track upgrade to wider radius curves and a more realistic appearance when you start building. ken On 2016-11-22 16:26, attic02@... [S-Trains] wrote: > What I am doing now is putting the old flyer track down as a temporary > track so I can run some trains on Thanksgiving. I have not ran a > train for over 5 years. I want to stop watching all the wonderful > flyer trains running on youtube and run onw myself again. Then I will > start to work on adding on to my deck. Thanks > > > Links: > ------ > [1] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/conversations/messages/78479;_ylc=X3oDMTJvYTVlaDBkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARtc2dJZAM3ODQ3OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzE0Nzk4NjI0MTM-?act=reply&messageNum=78479 > [2] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/conversations/newtopic;_ylc=X3oDMTJjZXRqdmkwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0Nzk4NjI0MTM- > [3] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/conversations/topics/78478;_ylc=X3oDMTM0ZTEycm9kBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARtc2dJZAM3ODQ3OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0Nzk4NjI0MTMEdHBjSWQDNzg0Nzg- > [4] https://yho.com/1wwmgg > [5] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJjZnA1cHVjBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzE0Nzk4NjI0MTM- > [6] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/S-Trains/members/all;_ylc=X3oDMTJkcDZwajEwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2bWJycwRzdGltZQMxNDc5ODYyNDEz > [7] > https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJicDAzbmdrBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzI2MjgzBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNjUzMzgxOARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTQ3OTg2MjQxMw-- > [8] https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html > [9] https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78483	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Indeed, welcome!  You can do a lot with a 8X12, just plan well. I have it all pretty much on a 17X8 dogleg and I love  operating accessories, so there are a lot of them, 19 switches, a country town, an industrial area with 3 cranes, no end to the fun you'll soon be having!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78484	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

I think screws are better than brads for holding down track ties. To get the length you will need you will have to drill out the existing holes for a bigger diameter screw. Also, I use and like the original track.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78485	From: poniaj	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Hi Ron, I'll echo the use of screws, but like racin510 said, you will have to drill out the hole in the metal tie to do so.  Using postwar Flyer track has the advantage of giving you that period look.  There is also Gilbert rubber roadbed that goes along with the Gilbert track, which makes a big difference in the amount of noise transferred to the table top.  It also makes the track more realistic and you don't have to use nails or screws to affix the track to a table top.  Just a staple on the edge of the roadbed, which will keep the vibration from transferring to the wood.  There are a couple of other track systems out there that are more realistic with wider radii, but it sounds like you already have a supply of Gilbert track. Going from one gauge to another isn't easy.  I've met quite a few O and HO guys who tell me the "If I had to do it all over again..." story.  Few have done it, and I not only applaud and welcome you, but extend a helping hand, as does everyone else on this list.  Hey, we're always glad to help another guy spend HIS money!  Also, consider attending one of the major S events, like the Spring S Spree, Fall S Fest or the National Convention.  They will blow you away with the amount of things, both new and old, that are available.  If you haven't already, I'd recommend going to <nasg.org> to see more specifics.  Our webmaster does a GREAT job on it.  Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78486	From: Ray Puls	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout Ron, I am on board with Jerry, welcome to S, and do your layout as you want it to be. I do not have any problems with Lionel fans, they are doing what they enjoy, playing with their trains. I have a layout in S using the original AC Gilbert American Flyer track with the rubber roadbed and I like the appearance of that but, I am a toy train guy. I would caution you though, the post war Flyer locomotives when not run for years may need a little tweeking, but with a little patience and effort they will run fine. You might also find that you will need some more track clips to supply power to the rails, the steel track and pins do leave something to be desired as far as being good conductors of electricity. Just do not get discouraged if you run into some minor problems, American Flyer post war and Flyonel are great fun. Ray PS Happy Thanks giving

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78487	From: William Gill	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

I guess I’ve been asleep at the throttle… I know the Polar Express train set came with a "wall wart” of a power supply and that it operated the set as provided in the set box. (Gave one to my grandson last Christmas). It never occurred to me that it’s output was DC… I need to pay more attention. From Steve’s reply it sounds like DC it is. Please correct me if I am wrong. I’ve read where this provided “wall wart” is marginally sized and if the optional cars are purchased and added to the load on the engine, the power supply will be overloaded and might even start smoking. So here I am planning to give the additional cars to the grandson this Christmas but looks like I’m headed for disaster. I have also purchased a C80 Lionel transformer with the afore mentioned knowledge but looks like I need to rig up a rectifier to supply DC to the track. What a pain. Again, please correct me if I am wrong. So, what is the DPDT switch for? If you have the Polar Express controller won’t that still control the Polar Express train? I’m familiar with the Dockside trains. I have a few. I thought they were AC. In fact I think I recall running them on my AC layout. What am I missing here? Are the newer Dockside train engines DC? Getting back to the DPDT switch, is it to provide reversing action given the DC current being discussed herein and do you wire it up to do so? Thanks for any clarification you can give this old befuddled mind. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78488	From: wyoaf	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Ron:  as you seem to have the temperament and means to enjoy the "planning & accumulation in contemplation of a layout" aspect of this hobby, I suggest that you start adding rubber roadbed to your target list.  It makes the Gilbert track look much better, keeps it together better, allows you to run your Holiday layout on carpet without leaving the tell-tale oval of black oily grime that inevitably results otherwise.  But most important, on a layout, it's much quieter and you can tack it down through the edge of the roadbed with discreet brads or headless nails in about every 3rd or 4th section to hold everything in place. There is wide radius Gilbert style curve track out there that K-Line made, and entrepreneur Rick Johnson sells wide-radius rubber roadbed to fit it, as well as regular radius roadbed.  I have had S Gauge layouts with and without rubber roadbed, and those "with" look and sound much better.  Good luck.  John Davis Noblesville IN.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78489	From: poniaj	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

Bill, The PE will run just fine on AC provided by a modern or post war Gilbert transformer.  The electronics aboard will convert the power supply to a more usable form.  At least as long as the on board electronics hold out.  I power mine with an 18B, and it gives enough power to keep everything going nicely.  Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78490	From: William J. Gill	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

Jerry, Thanks for the info. That helps a bunch.  Bill Kelso, WA On Nov 23, 2016, at 9:37 AM, poniaj@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Bill, The PE will run just fine on AC provided by a modern or post war Gilbert transformer.  The electronics aboard will convert the power supply to a more usable form.  At least as long as the on board electronics hold out.  I power mine with an 18B, and it gives enough power to keep everything going nicely.   Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78491	From: racin510	Date: 11/23/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

One of the reasons I use brass screws is that I run my original track over dark color carpet over plywood. I've never had a sound problem, but the track can move a little on the carpet. Over time the ties work their way down into the carpet and become a lot more stable. Screws keep track from moving side to side, thus eventually loosening the prong connections and losing current flow. When laying old track, give every piece a lot of TLC. Be sure they are flat and that prongs fit very tight. Pinch them with vice grips in a couple of places to widen them and make them dig into the receiving rail. Take ohm readings every few feet to be sure all track is going to conduct equal current. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78492	From: Default	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

The 18B is a 190 watt transformer, the vast majority of Gilbert/Flyer transformers were much smaller. Also the 18B came in two versions, 7-15 volts and 5-18 volts. Because modern Flyer engines have DC motors, when running on AC power supplies, the onboard DC voltage is reduced by rectifiers about 3 volts. Obviously the 5-18 volt version not only gives a greater range of control for locomotives with modern DC can motors; it also gives 3 more volts at the top end. 5-18 volt transformers are the ones to choose if you are converting to DC rectified power; better low end and top end performance. I notice many sellers of Flyer equipment ignore this rather important distinction (some don't even read the nameplate data when creating their listings). Note the 30B was also available as 5-18 volts, as was the smaller 175 watt 16B. With modern Can motors, the headlights and smoke units draw 4-5 times the current of the motor. LED headlights help, not much you can do about the smoke units. ken On 2016-11-23 09:37, poniaj@... [S-Trains] wrote: > Bill, > > The PE will run just fine on AC provided by a modern or post war > Gilbert transformer. The electronics aboard will convert the power > supply to a more usable form. At least as long as the on board > electronics hold out. I power mine with an 18B, and it gives enough > power to keep everything going nicely. > > Jerry >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78493	From: claudino.john	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: TRAINS

Happy Thanksgiving        John Claudino       aztectrains .com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78494	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: TRAINS

product 5From our Home to your Home, Happy Thanksgiving everyone who celebrates it. If you don't just ignore! Chris and Mhel Burger Introduced: December 1995

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78495	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting to build my first Flyer layout

No question about it: use screws!  I know that for decades toy train instruction sheets told folks to "use small brads or carpet tacks" but that's asking for trouble.  Drive them in too far and you damage the track.  They're also tough to get back out later without damaging the track if you need to adjust the track or want to change the track plan.  Even if you have to drill out the "nail holes" in the ties to make screws work, do it! As far as getting power to the track and rail joints, plain old "snap on" terminals will work but not as well as soldering the wires to the outside of the rails of a section of track to make your own "terminal track."  I even solder all the rail joints in HO, HOn30 and On30 to make electrical continuity  as positive as possible.  I've even done it S with both regular Flyer track and Pike Master track and it works better. I've never been too excited about the noise of trains running, especially the old ones.  It's part of the attraction for me.  However, in smaller scale trains with tiny sound boards it might be a problem for some.  If you have a noise problem just slip some cork roadbed under the track and leave the screws slightly loose.  Actually anything somewhat soft under the track will work, years ago we used linoleum floor tile for road bed.  The sound of the trains follows ties, screws, or anything else solid right down into the plywood which amplifies it by resonance. Planning is part of the game, and running a few trains builds enthusiasm.  Have FUN!  After all, this is a HOBBY, not employment. :-) Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78496	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

All modern "AC" toy trains use DC can motors and use a circuit board with a rectifier circuit in the loco to swap AC track power to DC motor power, and to reverse direction.  (Actually Lionel, MTH, and other O gauge toy trains do this too.) Because of this, you can use either type of power for these modern toy trains.  I run Flyonel Docksiders on DC all the time with no problems. I switched to all DC can motors some years back when I started rebuilding old Flyer locos found in junk boxes.  I decided to try DC and never looked back.  The can motors draw less power and run cooler, which allows for brighter headlights and more smoke.  No troublesome reverse unit is required either, which saves aggravation and some money. Running on DC with no reverse unit, the DPDT (double pole, double throw) switches the power from positive to negative or the opposite to reverse the train.  It's just like an HO power pack with a direction switch. You can use a regular old Flyer transformer with a rectifier, or get a large DC power pack like those used for LGB and other later scale DC trains.  I use the big ones by MRC. Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78497	From: David Dewey	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

I’m one of the odd-ball ones that believes the original ACG made track is very useable, and since I have boxes of it, I will use it on my layout; new track is costly when you have track in hand. yes, I also have some Gargraves and some SHS flex track that will probably be incorporated for special curves, etc. That said, the ACG track is usually well-used and must be inspected for damage. The track can be bowed, up or down, can have dents, or even be slightly bent out of gauge.  A small straight edge, and a flat surface is good for inspecting the track; bows are usually be easily hand-bent to straighten them. Also look for bad insulation—rare, but it does happen.  When laying curves, use a good piece of curved track held upside down against the two joining pieces of curved track to insure the curve is constant. sometimes one has to take a little off the end of one rail or the other to get a tight fit on both joints. I’ve used wide radius track too and it frequently needs the rail ends trimmed. After assembling, feel for any burrs at the joint and file them down smooth—this will help preserve traction tires and pull-more tires too.  I use a little Caig-Lube on the track pins to insure a good connection too.  For temporary layouts, track locks are great. The wire-shaped ones work well with rubber roadbed, otherwise the flat spring steel ones work nicely. Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78498	From: David Dewey	Date: 11/24/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

I’m one of the odd-ball ones that believes the original ACG made track is very useable, and since I have boxes of it, I will use it on my layout; new track is costly when you have track in hand. yes, I also have some Gargraves and some SHS flex track that will probably be incorporated for special curves, etc. That said, the ACG track is usually well-used and must be inspected for damage. The track can be bowed, up or down, can have dents, or even be slightly bent out of gauge.  A small straight edge, and a flat surface is good for inspecting the track; bows are usually be easily hand-bent to straighten them. Also look for bad insulation—rare, but it does happen.  When laying curves, use a good piece of curved track held upside down against the two joining pieces of curved track to insure the curve is constant. sometimes one has to take a little off the end of one rail or the other to get a tight fit on both joints. I’ve used wide radius track too and it frequently needs the rail ends trimmed. After assembling, feel for any burrs at the joint and file them down smooth—this will help preserve traction tires and pull-more tires too.  I use a little Caig-Lube on the track pins to insure a good connection too.  For temporary layouts, track locks are great. The wire-shaped ones work well with rubber roadbed, otherwise the flat spring steel ones work nicely. Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78499	From: Default	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

You can't use straight DC with modern AC locos with on board sound, or bye-bye electronics. ken On 2016-11-24 12:49, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote: > All modern "AC" toy trains use DC can motors and use a circuit board > with a rectifier circuit in the loco to swap AC track power to DC > motor power, and to reverse direction. (Actually Lionel, MTH, and > other O gauge toy trains do this too.) Because of this, you can use > either type of power for these modern toy trains. I run Flyonel > Docksiders on DC all the time with no problems. > > I switched to all DC can motors some years back when I started > rebuilding old Flyer locos found in junk boxes. I decided to try DC > and never looked back. The can motors draw less power and run cooler, > which allows for brighter headlights and more smoke. No troublesome > reverse unit is required either, which saves aggravation and some > money. > > Running on DC with no reverse unit, the DPDT (double pole, double > throw) switches the power from positive to negative or the opposite to > reverse the train. It's just like an HO power pack with a direction > switch. > > You can use a regular old Flyer transformer with a rectifier, or get a > large DC power pack like those used for LGB and other later scale DC > trains. I use the big ones by MRC. > > Stumpy Stone in Ohio > >

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78500	From: Bill Lane	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Bill's Black Friday trades

Attachments : Through a brain fart I recently found myself with a duplicate AM B&O S12, right down to the same number. I am in no hurry for this, but I am looking for an unpainted S12 shell, including handrails and headlight lenses. I will trade even up, we each pay shipping 1 way. That is ALL I will trade for this shell, since my drive is already DCC. Otherwise when the mood strikes I will strip and it will become Reading. Just trying to skip the stripping, as it is going Reading either way.   You would think I would know this by now but… as a S12 side note,  I am confirming that the trucks that came on all AM S12 are really for the RS3. If yes that is great. I am going to really fix 20 S12 with the correct trucks cannibalized from SHS switcher parts leaving me with extra trucks for RS3.   Finally, I have poundage of various old school trucks, mostly taken from all of the Frank Titman cars I have, and converted to SHS trucks. At least 15 cars worth….The code 125 wheels are problematic on my turnouts.  Most are ACE trucks, including Archbar, some have hirail wheels and AF couplers too. Looking for SHS trucks with code 110 wheels. If you are interested I will gather up the various bags for photos. You could even BUY the new MTH trucks to do the trade. We just have to see what the fair trade conversion from old to new is.   Please reply directly with your questions.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78501	From: Dale Smith	Date: 11/25/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

Stumpy, Do you run un modified  Docksiders on DC?   I thought the instructions said AC only.  Obviously the new Flyer Chief Docksider can run on DC, but I hesitate on the older ones with that warning. Dale On 11/24/2016 12:49 PM, mrstumpy@... [S-Trains] wrote:   All modern "AC" toy trains use DC can motors and use a circuit board with a rectifier circuit in the loco to swap AC track power to DC motor power, and to reverse direction.  (Actually Lionel, MTH, and other O gauge toy trains do this too.) Because of this, you can use either type of power for these modern toy trains.  I run Flyonel Docksiders on DC all the time with no problems. I switched to all DC can motors some years back when I started rebuilding old Flyer locos found in junk boxes.  I decided to try DC and never looked back.  The can motors draw less power and run cooler, which allows for brighter headlights and more smoke.  No troublesome reverse unit is required either, which saves aggravation and some money. Running on DC with no reverse unit, the DPDT (double pole, double throw) switches the power from positive to negative or the opposite to reverse the train.  It's just like an HO power pack with a direction switch. You can use a regular old Flyer transformer with a rectifier, or get a large DC power pack like those used for LGB and other later scale DC trains.  I use the big ones by MRC. Stumpy Stone in Ohio

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78502	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

I have NO experience with locomotives using Lionel sound, so it might be a major problem on DC power, or the DC just won't activate it.  Perhaps one of our train repair experts can tell us which?   I have two Docksiders, both of which were bought new from dealers at Spring S Spree train shows.  One is run right out of the box, and one I did my modifying thing with no electronics, cab windows opened up, engineer installed, and so on.  Both run fine on the big MRC DC power packs, the one without the electronics smokes better. Finding high power AC transformers is no problem, there are a LOT of old Lionel and Flyer ones around, and the toy train manufacturers still make AC transformers today so that old trains and new ones can run on the same power, even though the new trains' motors are DC.  A few guys I know have sound problems with the old transformers though, said to be because they create a different wave pattern.  Again, I can't speak to that. The problems and complications with electronics is one of the main reasons I rebuild old flyer steam engines with DC can motors.  That way I have a good running machine with headlight, smoke, and the best mechanical sound unit ever made too!  And it all costs a fraction of a new steamer in S. But I'm an old guy who was brought up by parents who were "children of the Depression" and still like old trains and cars better than the new stuff. Stumpy Stone   official old guy in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78503	From: Ron Inscho	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

   In 60 years of woo-wooing with A.F / Gilbert I have found the # 8 b transformer to be safe & reliable & all you are going to need , even if you are running a bridge rect. . These transformers can still be had at what I think are bargain prices . Usually all is needed is a new cord & cleaniing of the breaker . No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7924 / Virus Database: 4664/13481 - Release Date: 11/26/16

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78504	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Starting To Build My First Flyer Layout

Hi, What revitalized my interest in model railroading 40 years ago was the use of can motors. I had started with Flyer in 1953. Progressed to HO five years later and kept my two 4-4-2s. About 20 years ago I rediscovered Flyer and all those big engines I could never afford. What I had not known was that those UP 4-8-4s had mostly DC motors. Thanks to S-N-S, Timko, and Port Lines I found replacement, easy installed can motors, some with flywheels and a conversion was on. YahooGroups.com has been bouncing my replies so I am resending a few. Hi, What revitalized my interest in model railroading 40 years ago was the use of can motors. I had started with Flyer in 1953. Progressed to HO five years later and kept my two 4-4-2s. About 20 years ago I rediscovered Flyer and all those big engines I could never afford. What I had not known was that those UP 4-8-4s had mostly DC motors. Thanks to S-N-S, Timko, and Port Lines I found replacement, easy installed DC can motors, some with flywheels and a conversion was on. I also discovered Showcase Line track with larger radius curves and a much better appearance. My layout is on the carpet and is all 29" radius curves. The Northerns and PAs look so much better on the wider curves (and track more reliably); I no longer use the older Flyer track.  I would seriously consider a track upgrade to wider radius curves and  a more realistic appearance when you start building. ken Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 On 2016-11-22 16:26, attic02@... [S-Trains] wrote: What I am doing now is putting the old flyer track down as a temporary track so I can run some trains on Thanksgiving.  I have not ran a train for over 5 years.  I want to stop watching all the wonderful flyer trains running on youtube and run onw myself again.  Then I will start to work on adding on to my deck.  Thanks -------------------------  Posted by: attic02@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78505	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need high amp DC power pack to operate

The 18B is a 190 watt transformer, the vast majority of Gilbert/Flyer transformers were much smaller. Also the 18B came in two versions, 7-15 volts and 5-18 volts.  Because modern Flyer engines have DC motors, when running on AC power supplies, the onboard DC voltage is reduced by rectifiers about 3 volts.  Obviously the 5-18 volt version not only gives a greater range of control for locomotives with modern DC can motors; it also gives 3 more volts at the top end.  5-18 volt transformers are the ones to choose if you are converting to DC rectified power;  better low end and top end performance. I notice many sellers of Flyer equipment ignore this rather important distinction (some don't even read the nameplate data when creating their listings). Note the 30B was also available as 5-18 volts, as was the smaller 175 watt 16B. With modern Can motors, the headlights and smoke units draw 4-5 times the current of the motor. LED headlights help, not much you can do about the smoke units. ken On 2016-11-23 09:37, poniaj@... [S-Trains] wrote: Bill, The PE will run just fine on AC provided by a modern or post war Gilbert transformer.  The electronics aboard will convert the power supply to a more usable form.  At least as long as the on board electronics hold out.  I power mine with an 18B, and it gives enough power to keep everything going nicely. Jerry Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78506	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

The 8B transformer is a relatively cheap transformer with a limited voltage range of 7-15 volts (voltage control range of only 8 volts) and limited power (under 100 watts).  When rectifying into DC this transformer will provide a DC voltage range of 4-12 volts.   While the old Flyer (and Lionel) locos were designed to start at 7 volts AC, modern can motors typically start at around 2 volts DC.   The 8B will provide limited low speed control when rectified into DC. However AC Gilbert/Flyer produced many larger AC transformers with a much wider voltage range of 5-18 volts (voltage control range of 13 volts) which when rectified into DC provide a far more usable DC voltage range of 2-15 volts. I use a DC rectified model 30B to run my DC flyer and other S scale locomotives, and also to operate G scale locomtoives.  I also have a 18B rectified transformer.  I am installing LED Digital amperage and voltage meters in a 18B and a 16B.  I have only acquired 5-18 volt transformers and have excessed my 7-15 limited range transformers.  The upgrade in meters from those in Flyer transformers is dramatic.  I first added them to my AF15 rectifiers when I rebuilt them with diode bridge rectifiers after the original rectifier died.  Now I'm taking it a step farther,  installing the diode bridges, meters and reversing switch in the 18B body. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 Re: [S-Trains] RE: Need a high amp power pack From S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date Today 06:01 Message Body    In 60 years of woo-wooing with A.F / Gilbert I have found the # 8 b transformer to be safe & reliable & all you are going to need , even if you are running a bridge rect. . These transformers can still be had at what I think are bargain prices . Usually all is needed is a new cord & cleaniing of the breaker . No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78507	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 27 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78508	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 11/26/2016
Subject: Re: Need a high amp power pack

In addition to being a model railroader I am also a HAM radio operator. Recently I needed a high amp 12 volt power supply to power two of my radios one requires 11 amps and the other 45 amps both are 12 volt. Actually they are 13.8 volts but they say 12 vols. I opted for a QJE brand PS50SWIII regulated 50 amp power supply.  It has a switch that allows voltage to be adjusted between 9 and 15 volts via a rotary voltage adjustment knob on the front which is situated next to a rotary switch labeled noise offset. The rocker switch will transfer between adjustable voltage or a fixed voltage of 13.8 VDC. In addition there is a power socket similar to those found on newer vehicles. It looks like the cigarette lighter socket in older cars. There is a meter for voltage adjustment with 13.8 clearly marked in red so you'd know to stop there. Amperage is not real critical. More amperage os ok cause your device will only use the amperage it needs. Voltage, on the other hand, is very critical. I think we all know too many volts is not good for things electrical but too little voltage is not good either.      This power supply IS spendy but should provide plenty of power for almost any layout                                  Bob Lampe                                 Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78509	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/27/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 27 November 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 27 November 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78510	From: elist@ribbonrail.com	Date: 11/27/2016
Subject: December/January 2017 The S Scale Resource Magazine is Ready

The new issue of The S Scale Resource is now on line. Free to read and download. http://sscaleresource.com/ Badgerland S Gaugers S Fest          Glenn reports on this year���s gathering Norm ���Chic��� Hartert          Glenn visits Norm���s rebuilding of a layout Developing an Industrial Scene PT 2          Glenn continues this with plastic pellet storage ���Pogo Stick��� Couplers?          Michael Fox shows how he fixed this effect                   What's on your Workbench          See what your fellow S Scalers are doing Shows, Meets and So Much More Thanks for reading and tell your friends! Regards, Daniel Dawdy - The Model Railroad Resource LLC 407 East Chippewa St - Dwight, IL 60420 Voice 815.584.1577 / FAX 800.783.0127 daniel@... / http://modelrailroadresource.com http://oscaleresource.com/ and    http://sscaleresource.com/ All outbound mail from rrp is virus scanned for your protection

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78511	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 11/30/2016
Subject: MP 629

HI, I have picked up a two  MP 629 stock cars, ruff shape.  I would like to remove the shell from the chassis so that I can repaint them. The cars I have worked on so far had pins which I could remove with the help of a soldering iron, no problem.  These two cars have no pins or screws. Any help on how to separate the two parts?  How about the hump in the roof, is there a safe way to reduce it?  I would like to paint these tow to go with my circus train. Thanks for and consideration. Wayne in Illinois

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78512	From: Doug Peck	Date: 11/30/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

Wayne, Sounds like you have two cars from 1946. The shells were typically glued to the frame that year………AND the ’46 plastic warped, which is why you have the hump……pretty normal for ’46 cars.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78513	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

Wayne,     I must confess I know nothing about these cars but I had a similar problem with an HO car. Check to see if there might be a rivet holding the car together. If there is you may be able to drill the part of the rivet that is mushroomed which holds it together. Work very slow. You don't want thing getting so hot that it damages something. If no rivet look for lugs which may be holding it together. Good luck and don't rush it.                               Bob Lampe                               Kalispell. MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78514	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

Doug,   Was '46 a bad year for Flyer plastic? In my case I wonder about some New Haven coaches. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Nov 30, 2016 8:10 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Re: MP 629   Wayne, Sounds like you have two cars from 1946. The shells were typically glued to the frame that year………AND the ’46 plastic warped, which is why you have the hump……pretty normal for ’46 cars.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78515	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

A different type of plastic was used in 1946 production, and the majority of cars you find from ’46 show warpage and the roof “bump”.  Gilbert changed plastics thereafter.   <<<   Was '46 a bad year for Flyer plastic? In my case I wonder about some New Haven coaches. >>>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78516	From: Don Abrams	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

I've had some success with old model kits that were glued together by putting them in the freezer for a few days and then trying to separate the pieces. It's not 100% though. Your mileage may vary! Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78517	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Conrail Caboose

I am still looking for the S Helper Service Conrail caboose if you have 1 that could be for sale. Scale wheels must be included.   Please reply directly.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78518	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/1/2016
Subject: Re: Conrail Caboose

I will check out my shs cabooses tomorrow  Sent from my iPhone On Dec 1, 2016, at 8:53 PM, 'Bill Lane' bill@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I am still looking for the S Helper Service Conrail caboose if you have 1 that could be for sale. Scale wheels must be included.   Please reply directly.   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78519	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/2/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

Try some solvant works on desilving glue  Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "Don Abrams donabrams@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: 12/1/16 10:27 AM (GMT-05:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: MP 629   I've had some success with old model kits that were glued together by putting them in the freezer for a few days and then trying to separate the pieces. It's not 100% though. Your mileage may vary! Don

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78520	From: ronaldd757	Date: 12/2/2016
Subject: Brooks Stover article in Jan 2017 Model Railroder

Article about scratchbuilding a S scale Whicomb 65-ton diesel shell from styrene Ron D. Homewood IL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78521	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/3/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

This car is 1946 production. 1946 production cars are usually early styrene glued together. The glue used basically welds the two parts together, so there is no glue left when it dissolves, just the plastic now one piece. I’ve not found anything that can reverse the process; disassembly attempts end up damaging (sacrificing) at least one of the parts.  The nature of this early plastic is to NOT be stable; it warps and shrinks a lot over time. I suspect eventually all collections of ‘46 flyer will end up being warped caricatures of the original items.  I would not waste time trying to “superdetail” one of these cars, just appreciate it for what it is, a (so far) survivor of an early post-war toy. Later 629s are common enough to use them for a detailing project—and far less frustrating to work with.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78522	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/3/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 04 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78523	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

I think the plastic was probably used for at least 47 too.  I have a 4611 freight set with the 629 which exhibits a slight, but not objectionable hump and a searchlight car whose plastic body was probably saved from major warping by being riveted to the cast platform for the light.  The caboose is almost perfect.  I dated the cars at least as being 47 from the thick shank couplers with no weights.  The engine may have been serviced because it has a black coupler weight, but the inspection slip in the set is dated August 47 and the valve gear rivets are hex head. Dale On 12/3/2016 10:55 AM, 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] wrote:   This car is 1946 production. 1946 production cars are usually early styrene glued together. The glue used basically welds the two parts together, so there is no glue left when it dissolves, just the plastic now one piece. I’ve not found anything that can reverse the process; disassembly attempts end up damaging (sacrificing) at least one of the parts.  The nature of this early plastic is to NOT be stable; it warps and shrinks a lot over time. I suspect eventually all collections of ‘46 flyer will end up being warped caricatures of the original items.  I would not waste time trying to “superdetail” one of these cars, just appreciate it for what it is, a (so far) survivor of an early post-war toy. Later 629s are common enough to use them for a detailing project—and far less frustrating to work with.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78524	From: Nick Colleran	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: Re: MP 629

Wasn't the early plastic acetate that was later used up in link couplers and heavyweight passenger car bases? - Nick Colleran Sent from my iPad

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78525	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 04 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 04 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78526	From: Allan V Eisenhaur	Date: 12/4/2016
Subject: WTB

Hi Looking to buy a S Helper SW power chassis or power & dummy trucks for parts. Thanks Al Eisenhaur ____________________________________________________________ 3 Signs You May Have a Fatty Liver [Watch] livecellresearch.com http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/584478ffad71978ff2284st04vuc

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78527	From: snstrains	Date: 12/5/2016
Subject: Re: WTB

Power and dummy trucks of which type? I have some.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 12/4/2016 2:23:18 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Hi Looking to buy a S Helper SW power chassis or power & dummy trucks for parts. Thanks Al Eisenhaur __________________________________________________________ 3 Signs You May Have a Fatty Liver [Watch] livecellresearch.com http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/584478ffad71978ff2284st04vuc

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78528	From: Wayne Zebron	Date: 12/5/2016
Subject: 629 stock car

Thanks to all who responded to my inquest about the 629 stock car.  There is a wealth of knowledge in this group and I really appreciate your inputs. Short of removing the paint without separating the shell from the base, which may require repainting the trucks, I believe I will go along with the member who said enjoy them for what the are. Thanks again, Wayne

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78529	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: AF + Scale Items Mixture For Sale

I have the following item mixture for sale :  - 2 (one set) of American Models 50 Ton Roller Bearing trucks with code 110 wheels     Came off of an AM Gondola     ASKING PRICE : $6.50  - 13 axles (with wheels) American Models AF style 28" wheel sets     Most of these came off an AM 5-Unit Spine Car.  Axles are 1.2750 inches long... +/-     ASKING PRICE : $10.50  - 8 axles (with wheels) American Models? or S-Helper Service? 33" wheel sets?     I have no idea what these came off of.    They have silver/chrome axles, so they may be AM instead of SHS.     Axles are 1.2650 inches long... +/-     ASKING PRICE : $8.50  - 4 AF-style S-Helper Service couplers     ASKING PRICE : $6.50 DEAL MAKER : Buy it all for the discounted price of : $30  (+ shipping) SHIPPING : $8 First Come, First Serve. I accept PayPal, Money Orders, Personal Checks and Cash. John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78530	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: FOR SALE : Three SHS PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers - UNLETTERED (GREY)

I have three UNLETTERED (GREY) S-Helper Service PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers that must go! All three have code 110 (scale) wheels. All three do not come with couplers. All three appear to be like new. All three come in original (yellow and green) boxes. Asking price : $30 each! Shipping : $8 each  (or $14 for all three) First Come, First Serve. I accept PayPal, Money Orders, Personal Checks and Cash. John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78531	From: rogermeekhof	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: Toller AC Poer Packs/Transformers

I have acquired a couple Toller TAC 2001 AC  Transformers. They are 150 Watt AC dual controllers with reverse SW and Whistle controller buttons.Does anyone have any experience with these units?? They appear well made have power and short circuit lights(I assume solid state circuit breakers),operate at 150 Watts and have max circuit settings to prevent overload. roger

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78532	From: hhisgauger	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: Matte Finish AF/Lio hoppers

Anyone know which AF/LIO 3 bay hoppers come in aa matte finish?

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78533	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/6/2016
Subject: SOLD : Three SHS PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers - UNLETTERED (GREY)

Thanks to all interested parties... but these models have been sold. John D. From: "John Degnan Scaler164@... [SSPM]" SSPM@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2016 3:56:31 PM Subject: [SSPM] FOR SALE : Three SHS PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers - UNLETTERED (GREY) I have three UNLETTERED (GREY) S-Helper Service PS-2 2-Bay Covered Hoppers that must go! All three have code 110 (scale) wheels. All three do not come with couplers. All three appear to be like new. All three come in original (yellow and green) boxes. Asking price : $30 each! Shipping : $8 each  (or $14 for all three) First Come, First Serve. I accept PayPal, Money Orders, Personal Checks and Cash. John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78534	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/7/2016
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Toystrainsandotheroldstuff -

I can also vouch for Wylie, and trust in him far more than I should have trusted in the NETTE Auctions fiasco this past summer and fall.   If you’re not aware, NETTE unexpectedly dissolved the business, emptied their warehouse overnight, and locked the doors, leaving many consignees with upwards of a million dollars in losses, based on law enforcement estimations…………..yours truly included.   Won’t happen with Wylie !   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Scale@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2016 10:23 PM To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com Subject: {S-Scale List} Toystrainsandotheroldstuff -     Gentlemen: I emailed Wylie, the fella who listed all of the brass on Ebay last spring.  Go to his website directly.  Toystrainsandotheroldstuff.com.  All 473 lots are listed, though there's no updated bidding.  The message below is what Wylie just sent me regarding payment and shipping questions.  If you're from Kokomo or Kankakee, you can drive to Fowler, Indiana.  For the rest of us, this is an online auction.  Lindsey   We offer shipping through either Fed Ex or USPS.  We do charge a small fee per package that includes packing materials and handling fees.  for example, a Sunset Big Boy would have regular shipping charges plus insurance and signature confirmation plus $4 for the box & peanuts and $3 to pack it up securely, nothing close to what the UPS stores charge, and no headache dealing with them.  We take care of it all from start to finish.  Please post this reply to the S scale board for all to see, unfortunately, this is all that is left of that huge collection but it's all great stuff.  We also do accept postal money orders, personal checks and paypal but with paypal, we charge a 3% convenience fee just like a credit card.  You could just mail it or send priority, you don't need to overnight payment.  It will also take us a few days to a week to get all of the orders packed and shipping quotes before invoices are sent.  We are diligent to get the job done right and pack securely, everyone who has purchased from us before knows that, so there should be no worries there.  Thanks for your interest and the interest of all the others, Bill Morris got every one of the brass locomotives running as they only had very minor grounding or shorting issues that he quickly resolved.  Bill is a great guy and as honest as the day is long and we are now good friends.  take care and enjoy the auction. Wylie

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78535	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: "It Was So Wide..." "How Wide Was It?"

Ok... looking back... WAY BACK... at the infamous AF Gondola... the one that is purported to be a good starting place for modeling ACL (and other?) gondolas... the one that is supposedly too wide to match the width of the prototype on which it is based... ... For those of you who are in the know... those who have done the math... how much "too wide" is it?  I don't have drawings or dimensions of the ACL prototype, but it should be no different in width from the same type gons used by other roads.  Surely someone out there is familiar enough with this type of gondola to have, at least, a general idea as to what the width should be. I'm just wondering if a single cut down the middle (long axis) of the model with a scroll saw or a band saw would be enough to correct the width... or would I need to use something with a thicker blade (table saw?) to get it 'right' (or 'close enough') with only one cut? John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78536	From: Jim V	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals

I am in a quandary with the operation of the left side of an 18B Transformer. One side of the unit is operating normally; the other appears to be in a shorted(?) condition.  When I rotate the dial to add power the red light comes on dim and gets brighter as more power is added.  I removed the engine(s) from the track and now at full power the red light is very dim.  Now I remove any car or whatever has a bulb and the red light does not come on.  Further, I swap the leads to a different loop (which I know is operating to standard) and get the same result confusing result.  Note the red light does not come on as when there is, for sure, a short - that is, fast and full bright. At this point I am (fairly) certain the issue is with the left side of the 18B. Thanks to any and all for your thoughts and input. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and Joyful and safe Holiday Season. Regards, JimV

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78537	From: Carl & Kathy Rudolph	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals

Attachments : Jim,   Sounds like the left side circuit breaker is stuck closed.   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 3:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals     I am in a quandary with the operation of the left side of an 18B Transformer.   One side of the unit is operating normally; the other appears to be in a shorted(?) condition.  When I rotate the dial to add power the red light comes on dim and gets brighter as more power is added.  I removed the engine(s) from the track and now at full power the red light is very dim.  Now I remove any car or whatever has a bulb and the red light does not come on.  Further, I swap the leads to a different loop (which I know is operating to standard) and get the same result confusing result.  Note the red light does not come on as when there is, for sure, a short - that is, fast and full bright.   At this point I am (fairly) certain the issue is with the left side of the 18B.   Thanks to any and all for your thoughts and input.   Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and Joyful and safe Holiday Season.   Regards,   JimV

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78538	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/9/2016
Subject: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

I would like to upgrade two S-Helper AC no-sounds ACL SW9 switcher diesels from their dim incandescent bulb headlights to brighter LED's.  What I should use to do that?  These units have reverse units in them under the hood and a small PCB up front into which the reverse unit 8-pin plug is inserted and the headlight and taillight plugs are also inserted.   Thank you.   Dave

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78539	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Travel Trailers

HI all, Back in the spring I “pre-ordered” some 1/64 Shasta trailers and some other small travel trailers with tow vehicles made by Greenlight. Today they arrived! Wow, super cool. The Shasta trailer is the same as the one Linda’s family took to Alaska back in the ‘70s (used trailer, probably new around 1960) so had to have it for the future layout. While I was ordering those I also got Elvis’ Pink Caddy too, along with a Black Fleetwood Caddy to follow him—or for a mafia hit scene maybe! I even have a little VW bug with a mini-teardrop trailer. I’ve been looking a while to find period towed stuff to populate my future replica of my family’s resort (we have the 3rd license in California for a trailer park), so had to share that these are out there, and they are reasonably priced, around the $6-$12 range. Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78540	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Re: Travel Trailers

Dave, Those, and others, have been on our website Inventory for a couple of months……..were big sellers at York, in fact.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2016 3:32 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Travel Trailers     HI all, Back in the spring I “pre-ordered” some 1/64 Shasta trailers and some other small travel trailers with tow vehicles made by Greenlight. Today they arrived! Wow, super cool. The Shasta trailer is the same as the one Linda’s family took to Alaska back in the ‘70s (used trailer, probably new around 1960) so had to have it for the future layout. While I was ordering those I also got Elvis’ Pink Caddy too, along with a Black Fleetwood Caddy to follow him—or for a mafia hit scene maybe! I even have a little VW bug with a mini-teardrop trailer. I’ve been looking a while to find period towed stuff to populate my future replica of my family’s resort (we have the 3rd license in California for a trailer park), so had to share that these are out there, and they are reasonably priced, around the $6-$12 range. Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78541	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 11 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78542	From: Jim V	Date: 12/10/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals

Carl, Many thanks!  Your prognosis was exactly on the bulls eye. Regards, JimV On Friday, December 9, 2016 6:31 PM, "'Carl & Kathy Rudolph' cakr@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Jim,   Sounds like the left side circuit breaker is stuck closed.   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 3:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals     I am in a quandary with the operation of the left side of an 18B Transformer.   One side of the unit is operating normally; the other appears to be in a shorted(?) condition.  When I rotate the dial to add power the red light comes on dim and gets brighter as more power is added.  I removed the engine(s) from the track and now at full power the red light is very dim.  Now I remove any car or whatever has a bulb and the red light does not come on.  Further, I swap the leads to a different loop (which I know is operating to standard) and get the same result confusing result.  Note the red light does not come on as when there is, for sure, a short - that is, fast and full bright.   At this point I am (fairly) certain the issue is with the left side of the 18B.   Thanks to any and all for your thoughts and input.   Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and Joyful and safe Holiday Season.   Regards,   JimV

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78543	From: Rance Velapoldi	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals

Hi: Assume it is a 'physical' fix by taking off the cover and manually 'releasing' the circuit breaker (or just rapidly pushing the reset button?).  Thus, question is, how best to fix it? Tx Rance Velapoldi (Tranby, Norway) On 12/10/2016 22:16, Jim V jimmyv42@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Carl, Many thanks!  Your prognosis was exactly on the bulls eye. Regards, JimV On Friday, December 9, 2016 6:31 PM, "'Carl & Kathy Rudolph' cakr@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Jim,   Sounds like the left side circuit breaker is stuck closed.   Carl Rudolph   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 3:39 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] AF 18B Transformer showing confusing signals     I am in a quandary with the operation of the left side of an 18B Transformer.   One side of the unit is operating normally; the other appears to be in a shorted(?) condition.  When I rotate the dial to add power the red light comes on dim and gets brighter as more power is added.  I removed the engine(s) from the track and now at full power the red light is very dim.  Now I remove any car or whatever has a bulb and the red light does not come on.  Further, I swap the leads to a different loop (which I know is operating to standard) and get the same result confusing result.  Note the red light does not come on as when there is, for sure, a short - that is, fast and full bright.   At this point I am (fairly) certain the issue is with the left side of the 18B.   Thanks to any and all for your thoughts and input.   Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and Joyful and safe Holiday Season.   Regards,   JimV Virus-free. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78544	From: Walter Jopke	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: Travel Trailers

Speaking of 1/64 vehicles, has anyone ever come across a 1/64 1954 Chevy Handyman Wagon? Lots of '55 Nomads but I have never seen the previous years wagon. The NP had a '54 Handyman high rail car which was used to transport the company officers on inspection trips. Walt Jopke Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78545	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 11 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 11 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78546	From: danceswithwolves49	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

First of all I must tell you I am NOT an electrical engineer in fact I am far from it but I do know a little about electronics. I am a scale modeler and as such us (or will use) DC power for my models and will use DCC for controlling them. One thing to remember is amperage is not as critical as voltage. You electronic device will only draw the amperage it needs. If your system is running at 12 volts  2 amps and your LED is rated less than 12 volts you'll fry it. If on the other hand if the LED is rated 12 volts500 miliamps (ma) no problem. Anything less than 12 volts and you will need to add a resistor or resistors to reduce the voltage.          Bob Lampe          Kalispell,MT

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78547	From: Robert Graves	Date: 12/11/2016
Subject: Two Great Books For Sale

"Greenberg's Guide to American Flyer" Volume I (1991). Contains a brief history of American Flyer S Gauge trains, and detailed descriptions of Flyer Steam and Diesel engines, passenger and freight cars, and couplers and trucks. Beautiful near-new condition. Two tiny dings and an edge scuff on the cover that I didn't notice visually; I found them by carefully running my fingers all over it. The bottom corner of one page was dogeared. There is a small ballpoint pen note on one index entry. From what I've seen, it should sell for $75.00. Make offer. "The History of the Union Pacific" (1989) edited by Marie Hill & Lynne Piade. 128 pictures with lots of pictures. The book, cover, and dust jacket are all in like-new condition. The only flaw I see is a one-word note in ballpoint pen on one page. There is a $12.99 price sticker on the dust jacket. Make offer. Pictures available on request. You can pick it up from me in the San Diego area, or I'll ship it Media Mail.   Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78548	From: JAMES SLEETH	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?

023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S & G SCALE $ 99.98 023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S &... Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78549	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Disposition Of THE SUPPLY CAR Goods?

With the passing of Bob McCarthy, my hopes of completing a number of deals I had going with him are in doubt... the most important one being the acquisition of 10 sheets EACH of two, different sheets of Central of Georgia S scale decals.  He and I discussed this matter at the last RPM meeting he attended in Port Wentworth, GA a few years back. Does anyone know who is the caretaker of his estate and/or how I might get in touch with them concerning this matter? Thanks. John Degnan Scaler164@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78550	From: snstrains	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?

I have a job waiting for one of these. They have just (again?) become available.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 12/12/2016 1:09:01 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S & G SCALE $ 99.98 023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S &... Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78551	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Hi rail wheels & couplers for sale

I have the Hi rail wheels (11 axles) + 2 AF/Hirail couplers from the American Models spine car set. These are significantly smaller OD than regular freight car wheels so would likely only be good for these cars.   Please reply directly with your offer…..   Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78552	From: Bill Lane	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Hi rail wheels & couplers for sale - slight correction

I have the Hi rail wheels (TWELVE axles) + 2 AF/Hirail couplers from the American Models spine car set. These are significantly smaller OD than regular freight car wheels so would likely only be good for these cars.   Please reply directly with your offer…..     Thank You, Bill Lane Modeling the Mighty Pennsy, PRSL & Reading in 1957 in S Scale since 1987 See my finished models at: http://www.lanestrains.com Look at what has been made in PRR in S Scale!   See my layout progress at: http://www.lanestrains.com/My_Layout.htm PRR Builders Photos Bought, Sold & Traded (Trading is MUCH preferred) http://www.lanestrains.com/PRRphotos.xls  Join the Pennsylvania Reading Seashore Lines Historical Society It's FREE to join! http://www.prslhs.com  Preserving The Memory Of The PRSL

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78553	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Thanks.  I plan to use a 470 ohm voltage reduction resistor with a 20mA white LED.  With a source voltage range of 4.5-12.8VDC, that should help avoid frying, along with a diode to prevent reverse voltage and/or spikes.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78554	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/12/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Like I say I'm no electronics genius but that should work. Just remember to check your output voltage with a VOM and ensure voltage is within tolerable limits before connecting the LED   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of davidghorn@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 7:55 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Thanks.  I plan to use a 470 ohm voltage reduction resistor with a 20mA white LED.  With a source voltage range of 4.5-12.8VDC, that should help avoid frying, along with a diode to prevent reverse voltage and/or spikes.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78555	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

The minimum forward voltage drop across a LED is 1.8 volts.  With a supply voltage of 12.8 volts, the voltage dropped across the resistor will be 12.8 – 1.8 = 11 volts.  Thus the current through the resistor (and the LED) will be 11 / 470 = 0.023 A or 23 mA which just slightly exceeds the maximum current limit for a 20 mA LED (but is probably still OK).  If you really want to be safe and are willing to sacrifice a bit of brightness, use a 680 ohm resistor as that will limit the current to 16 mA with the same maximum supply voltage of 12.8.  You can even go as high as 15 volts for the supply and still be below 20 mA in the LED.   Jerry F.        From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 9:14 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Like I say I'm no electronics genius but that should work. Just remember to check your output voltage with a VOM and ensure voltage is within tolerable limits before connecting the LED   Bob Lampe   Kalispell,MT       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of davidghorn@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 7:55 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Thanks.  I plan to use a 470 ohm voltage reduction resistor with a 20mA white LED.  With a source voltage range of 4.5-12.8VDC, that should help avoid frying, along with a diode to prevent reverse voltage and/or spikes.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78556	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?

Steve,    I take it there is no sound sample?                                        Bob Lampe                                          Kalispell, MT From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of boss31@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, December 12, 2016 1:47 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?     I have a job waiting for one of these. They have just (again?) become available.   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 12/12/2016 1:09:01 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S & G SCALE $ 99.98 023500 LOCO GENIE UNIVERSAL STEAM SOUND TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER - O, S &... Jim Sleeth

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78557	From: lgv_57	Date: 12/13/2016
Subject: Re: My Ring Engineering will only run 1 AMP Any one seen this yet?

Steve, You mentioned that these MRC Loco Genies have become available. I just visited the MRC website and they are still listed as on backorder. Would you please share where they are available.  Robert, There are two YouTube videos on the MRC website at the top of the page. Loco GenieTM Loco GenieTM View on www.modelrectifier.com Preview by Yahoo Robert South Rerailer Hobbies LLC

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78558	From: attic02	Date: 12/14/2016
Subject: Thanks From Ron Petersen

I want to thank every member that sent me ideas and ways to help me start to build my layout.  I realized that I wanted to star in the postwar era and you helped me see that the rubber roadbed is the only way to go.  So I have been doing battle on Ebay, (at the wrong time of the year to buy track) and I have acquired 178 pieces of rubber road bed, most with track.  My original layout was my garage one for Lionel and that means a 4' x 16' with 2, 4' x 4' sections on the end to make it look like an E with the center.  Now I am adding a 2' X 16' with a space of 2' from the end of the 4 X 4 section.  I will use bridges to cross over and the new area is 6 inches lower so that an elevated track will come off the main layout and stay elevated.  The 2 foot by 16 feet will be a passenger station with 3 conopies and a switching yard.  When I was a boy, in my dream would be the only way I would get a train set but one christmas, my parents gave me a marx KCS aa diesels with 3 red passenger cars.  I loved it and we would build forts from the lincoln logs and use the cowboys and indians with horses and then the plastic soldiers and we would play it all day long.  So my second level with have that theme going.  To me this is all about toys and trains.  Even in my best dream as a kid I was never going to have a train layout.  I made up for that as an adult and now the boy in me is playing with his toys and trains everyday and soon I will have some running.. Thanks for all your help and the wonderful ideas you shared.  Big thanks to Doug Peck.  He emailed me a sample order of what I would need to start and now I am waitng for my second order to arrive.. I appreciate all the sharing you do on this group.  I have learned a lot..  Thanks and have a very Merry Christmas..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78559	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Thanks from Ron Peterson

I'm sure there will be  some posts saying "you're welcome!"  This is a very active and informative Yahoo Group and there are folks here knowledgeable on all phases of S gauge, from scale to collectors and everything in between.  Better yet, they are all willing to be helpful. As far as "playing with trains" I think that's great!  If even the most serious rivet counter was forced to admit it, we ALL probably started out "playing" with our trains!  We consider ourselves much more "sophisticated" these days, of course.  But there is something to be said for just letting go and returning to childhood sometimes.  It relieves a LOT of stress! My wife constantly teases me about my hobbies, saying you men just HAVE to have your toys, don't you?"  I eventually tired of this and pointed out her dolls, nicknacks, and even her "shoe collection" filling most of a closet.  Imelda Marcos DID have more, but Cindy is still "collecting!" As far as "playing with toys," I bought one of those "Magic Tracks" toys and then got involved in doing a review of them, which led to further research, and finally my grandnephew and I have really gotten into playing with and modifying these little cars!  One of the manufacturers says these toys are for "ages five to adult, so I'm "safe." :-) Have a Merry Christmas, to y'all ! Stumpy Stone in "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78560	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Thanks everyone for your help.  Here is a link to the LED that I'm going to install http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/427/vlhw4100-240359.pdf  It is a 20mA LED with a forward voltage of 3.2 Volts.  So with 12.8 VDC source voltage (which corresponds to 16VAC on the tracks) (12.8-3.2)/.020= 480 ohm.  I figure a 470 ohm resistor should cover it, but without headroom, yet a 1K knocks down the brightness more than I want.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78561	From: Bob Groh	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

You might want to (if you can smuggle a few more parts into the mix) - to use a constant current source to drive the LED. Can be implemented a few different ways and really not as bad as you might think. I can provide more details if anyone wants (the same question came up on another forum recently). Bob Groh On Thu, Dec 15, 2016 at 8:49 AM, davidghorn@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Thanks everyone for your help.  Here is a link to the LED that I'm going to install http://www.mouser.com/ ds/2/427/vlhw4100-240359.pdf  It is a 20mA LED with a forward voltage of 3.2 Volts.  So with 12.8 VDC source voltage (which corresponds to 16VAC on the tracks) (12.8-3.2)/.020= 480 ohm.  I figure a 470 ohm resistor should cover it, but without headroom, yet a 1K knocks down the brightness more than I want.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78562	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson

AH-sweet memories. Gone are the days of smoke and steam. The clickety clack or the rhythm of a track gang in action.  Few probably ever heard the cadence of a gang moving rail and tie into position.  Now we re-create  some of those memories in our own homes by building and running our models.    Long live model trains.     For those that never had the pleasure of riding in a railcar on jointed track and the transition onto welded continuous rail — Unbelievable difference - smooth to say the least.   If U got’im run’im.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78563	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

David,   As I suggested previously, consider using a 680 ohm, ½ watt  resistor (which is a standard value and readily available) to give yourself some “headroom”.  Also, when designing, it is better to use “worst case” values off the data sheet, rather than average values;  and even then you should add some additional derating to reduce the chances of a device failure.     For the lamp specified, your calculation should use 2.8 volts for the forward voltage drop so (12.8-2.8)/.020=500 ohms.  Note also that the lamp can actually withstand 25 mA, but that the specs are given for operation at 20 mA.  When you run components at their maximum ratings you can shorten their lives and end up having to do troubleshooting and repairs.  If operated at 20 mA, the power dissipated by the 680 ohm resistor will be (0.02)(0.02)(680)=0.272 watts (or 0.188 watts if you use a 470 ohm resistor).  In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a ½ watt resistor rather than a ¼ watt.   As someone else suggested, it would not hurt to add a cheap general purpose forward biased diode (1N4001 for example) in series with the lamp to protect it from accidental reverse voltage.  This would have the additional benefit of reducing the potential to the lamp by ~0.7 volts, and thus add a bit more headroom.   Best of luck,   Jerry F.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 6:49 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Thanks everyone for your help.  Here is a link to the LED that I'm going to install http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/427/vlhw4100-240359.pdf  It is a 20mA LED with a forward voltage of 3.2 Volts.  So with 12.8 VDC source voltage (which corresponds to 16VAC on the tracks) (12.8-3.2)/.020= 480 ohm.  I figure a 470 ohm resistor should cover it, but without headroom, yet a 1K knocks down the brightness more than I want.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78564	From: snstrains	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Heavyweights for sale

I have some  American Flyer  952, 953, 954 maroon passenger cars with silhouettes in LIKE NEW condition for sale. Best offer over $395 accepted. Current book is $496 for just "excellent" condition. "Like New" calls for a 25% upcharge. That translates to $620. Oh, did I mention they come with boxes? Tattered ones, but boxes.    Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78565	From: beebear	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson [1 Attachment]

Alan   Is something that you built? I have 3 of those maintenance cars and have never seen one with a top on it.   John Frankforther   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 12:34 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] RE:Thanks from Ron Peterson [1 Attachment]    AH-sweet memories. Gone are the days of smoke and steam. The clickety clack or the rhythm of a track gang in action.  Few probably ever heard the cadence of a gang moving rail and tie into position.  Now we re-create  some of those memories in our own homes by building and running our models.    Long live model trains.     For those that never had the pleasure of riding in a railcar on jointed track and the transition onto welded continuous rail — Unbelievable difference - smooth to say the least.   If U got’im run’im.   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78566	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/15/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson

John,  It’s just one of my prototype projects.   Just something to keep the brain from turning to mush. These hand cars were way out of scale and that stirred up some thought to turn it into something. It was an old damaged shell that I obtained from Doug Peck .  A chassis from another basket of wounded parts from a member of the MVSG club.  SnS - Steve put in a can motor for me.  Steve suggested the slow speed motor to make it more realistic to the actual Putt Putt’s speed  As U all know these don’t have much traction and I wanted it to pull a tool cart ( pictured) over the trestle. The Can has plenty of power .   So - I dreamed up a way to make it 4 wheel drive in place of the standard two wheel drive. It has an L.E.D. headlight and tail light. The rest is styrene and clear plastic for the windshield, It was tricky to get a slight bevel on the roof edges. It has an Engineer and Fireman to represent the track workers.   It runs around the layout very well  now .   I’m still testing it for endurance .

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78567	From: beebear	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson

Thanks for sharing Alan   How did you get 4 wheel drive??       From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 9:56 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] RE:Thanks from Ron Peterson   John,    It’s just one of my prototype projects.   Just something to keep the brain from turning to mush. These hand cars were way out of scale and that stirred up some thought to turn it into something. It was an old damaged shell that I obtained from Doug Peck .  A chassis from another basket of wounded parts from a member of the MVSG club.  SnS - Steve put in a can motor for me.  Steve suggested the slow speed motor to make it more realistic to the actual Putt Putt’s speed  As U all know these don’t have much traction and I wanted it to pull a tool cart ( pictured) over the trestle. The Can has plenty of power .   So - I dreamed up a way to make it 4 wheel drive in place of the standard two wheel drive. It has an L.E.D. headlight and tail light. The rest is styrene and clear plastic for the windshield, It was tricky to get a slight bevel on the roof edges. It has an Engineer and Fireman to represent the track workers.     It runs around the layout very well  now .   I’m still testing it for endurance .       This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78568	From: Donald Mengle	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Heavyweights for sale

Hello, Donald Mengle here, Can you send me photo's  -  very interested djmengle@... Thanks 814-237-9826 On Thu, Dec 15, 2016 at 7:02 PM, boss31@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I have some  American Flyer  952, 953, 954 maroon passenger cars with silhouettes in LIKE NEW condition for sale. Best offer over $395 accepted. Current book is $496 for just "excellent" condition. "Like New" calls for a 25% upcharge. That translates to $620. Oh, did I mention they come with boxes? Tattered ones, but boxes.    Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho -- Donald E. Mengle CMR djmengle@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78569	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Attachments : gfeldman2904 Wrote: David, Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. It occurred to me that if you wanted a constant brightness, regardless of voltage swings, like the lighting inside cars etc., you could accomplish this by using a series regulating IC, say a 3803, which would deliver only 3 volts, and could then be wired through a current limiting resister. These are simple cheap devices, cost less than a dollar in quantity, and would provide a consistent brightness, without headroom issues. >As I suggested previously, consider using a 680 ohm, watt resistor (which is a standard value and readily available) to give yourself some 'headroom'. Also, when designing, it is better to use 'worst case' values off the data sheet, rather than average values; and even then you should add some additional derating to reduce the chances of a device failure. For the lamp specified, your calculation should use 2.8 volts for the forward voltage drop so (12.8-2.8)/.020=500 ohms. Note also that the lamp can actually withstand 25 mA, but that the specs are given for operation at 20 mA. When you run components at their maximum ratings you can shorten their lives and end up having to do troubleshooting and repairs. If operated at 20 mA, the power dissipated by the 680 ohm resistor will be (0.02)(0.02)(680)=0.272 watts (or 0.188 watts if you use a 470 ohm resistor). In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a watt resistor rather than a watt. As someone else suggested, it would not hurt to add a cheap general purpose forward biased diode (1N4001 for example) in series with the lamp to protect it from accidental reverse voltage. This would have the additional benefit of reducing the potential to the lamp by ~0.7 volts, and thus add a bit more headroom. Best of luck, Jerry F. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 6:49 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks. Thanks everyone for your help. Here is a link to the LED that I'm going to install http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/427/vlhw4100-240359.pdf It is a 20mA LED with a forward voltage of 3.2 Volts. So with 12.8 VDC source voltage (which corresponds to 16VAC on the tracks) (12.8-3.2)/.020= 480 ohm. I figure a 470 ohm resistor should cover it, but without headroom, yet a 1K knocks down the brightness more than I want.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78570	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Actually, the BEST solution to lighting a LED is to use a chip that generates a CONSTANT CURRENT, not a constant VOLTAGE.  It turns out there are devices made just for this application (lighting a LED), and a quick search turned up the CL2 device made by Microchip   http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/268/20005448A-1021782.pdf  , by Supertex https://www.ledsales.com.au/pdf/cl2.pdf  , and by others.  The device is placed in series with the LED (or string of LEDs) and when supplied with from 5 to 90 volts DC will output a constant current of 20 milliamperes.  The  Supertex chip sells for $0.40 each at Mouser and can be purchased in unit quantities:    http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=supertex+cl2 .   With this chip, you do not need a resistor, and the LED will have a constant brightness once the circuit is supplied with enough voltage (5 volts).     (Disclaimer – I have no connection or experience with either these manufacturers or with the vendor.)   BTW, I don’t know who wrote the note in green inserted into my earlier e-mail, but it wasn’t from me (gfeldman).  Whomever it was though, supplied what appears to be an incorrect chip number.  The 3803 is a switching flyback voltage converter, not a voltage regulator.  (Perhaps they were thinking of a 7803 voltage regulator.)  In addition, using a 3 volt regulator with this LED will not provide enough voltage to even light the LED should the forward voltage drop of that individual lamp be on the high side of the range shown on the data sheet (3.8 volts).  If you want to go with a voltage regulator (inadvisable in this application), you will need to use at least a 5 volt regulator.   Jerry F.        From: Davidwin@... [mailto:Davidwin@...] Sent: Friday, December 16, 2016 4:27 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com; gfeldman2904@... Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.   gfeldman2904 Wrote: David, Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. It occurred to me that if you wanted a constant brightness, regardless of voltage swings, like the lighting inside cars etc., you could accomplish this by using a series regulating IC, say a 3803, which would deliver only 3 volts, and could then be wired through a current limiting resister. These are simple cheap devices, cost less than a dollar in quantity, and would provide a consistent brightness, without headroom issues. >As I suggested previously, consider using a 680 ohm, watt resistor (which is a standard value and readily available) to give yourself some 'headroom'. Also, when designing, it is better to use 'worst case' values off the data sheet, rather than average values; and even then you should add some additional derating to reduce the chances of a device failure. For the lamp specified, your calculation should use 2.8 volts for the forward voltage drop so (12.8-2.8)/.020=500 ohms. Note also that the lamp can actually withstand 25 mA, but that the specs are given for operation at 20 mA. When you run components at their maximum ratings you can shorten their lives and end up having to do troubleshooting and repairs. If operated at 20 mA, the power dissipated by the 680 ohm resistor will be (0.02)(0.02)(680)=0.272 watts (or 0.188 watts if you use a 470 ohm resistor). In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a watt resistor rather than a watt. As someone else suggested, it would not hurt to add a cheap general purpose forward biased diode (1N4001 for example) in series with the lamp to protect it from accidental reverse voltage. This would have the additional benefit of reducing the potential to the lamp by ~0.7 volts, and thus add a bit more headroom. Best of luck, Jerry F. From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroup! s.com] Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 6:49 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks. Thanks everyone for your help. Here is a link to the LED that I'm going to install http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/427/vlhw4100-240359.pdf It is a 20mA LED with a forward voltage of 3.2 Volts. So with 12.8 VDC source voltage (which corresponds to 16VAC on the tracks) (12.8-3.2)/.020= 480 ohm. I figure a 470 ohm resistor should cover it, but without headroom, yet a 1K knocks down the brightness more than I want. . , . Posted by: 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@...> Reply via web post • Reply to sender * Reply to group * Start a New Topic * Messages in this topic(8) Have you tried the ! highest rated email app? With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage. Enjoy thousands of great photos at http://MyFlyerTrains.org/gallery/ Visit Your Group * Privacy! * Unsubscribe * Terms of Use . , . ,

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78571	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Jerry, Thanks.  I really appreciate your input.  After second thought I too decided I will use a higher resistor (680+ ohm) and and inline diode.   I prefer some headroom and have never cut things close when doing repairs and/or upgrades in the past, so why start now.  What did you mean by " In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a watt resistor rather than a watt."  Did you mean 1K resistor?  But while on the subject of watts -- what wattage resistor would you use -- 1/4W or 1/2W?  I'm thinking 1/4W since its lighting -- 1/2W for motor control circuits and the like.  I'm intrigued by your idea of constant brightness.  Can you please provide more information on the 3803 IC that you mentioned?  Perhaps a link?  I've installed voltage regulators in the past, but the linear units get hot, and take up more room than I have in this case.  I've used switching regulators in the past b/c they run cooler and have that helps avoid melting plastic shells, but then too only when the room for them has been available.  This 3803 sounds as though it has several advantages to either of those -- size/convenience, cost, and outcome.  The regulators I've used all cost more than a dollar each.  Thanks! Dave

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78572	From: racin510	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Thanks from Ron Peterson

Your brain must have been in overdrive to think up 4-wheel drive, so how did you drive the dead axle? Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78573	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/16/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Hello David Horn, Apparently my original comments to you in my e-mail sent at 1:24 PM of 12/15/2016 were “added to” and then “changed” by a “Davidwin ‘at’ TDS.net” in his message sent at 4:27 AM or 12/16/2016.  The sentence in my original message read, “In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a ‘one-half’ watt resistor rather than a ‘one-quarter’ watt.”, but the numbers I had typed in for one half and one quarter got turned into the characters for one half and one quarter, and these in turn apparently disappeared when Mr. Win altered my text.   I did NOT write the paragraph in bold green that begins:   “Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. …” , so I take no responsibility for its content.  To add to the confusion, you apparently had not yet seen my e-mail sent at 11:41 AM of 12/16/2016, as your message was sent just six minutes later with a time stamp of 11:47 AM.   My 11:41 AM e-mail reads as follows: “Actually, the BEST solution to lighting a LED is to use a chip that generates a CONSTANT CURRENT, not a constant VOLTAGE.  It turns out there are devices made just for this application (lighting a LED), and a quick search turned up the CL2 device made by Microchip   http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/268/20005448A-1021782.pdf  , by Supertex https://www.ledsales.com.au/pdf/cl2.pdf  , and by others.  The device is placed in series with the LED (or string of LEDs) and when supplied with from 5 to 90 volts DC will output a constant current of 20 milliamperes.  The Supertex chip sells for $0.40 each at Mouser and can be purchased in unit quantities:    http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=supertex+cl2 .   With this chip, you do not need a resistor, and the LED will have a constant brightness once the circuit is supplied with enough voltage (5 volts).     (Disclaimer – I have no connection or experience with either these manufacturers or with the vendor.) BTW, I don’t know who wrote the note in green inserted into my earlier e-mail, but it wasn’t from me (gfeldman).  Whomever it was though, supplied what appears to be an incorrect chip number.  The 3803 is a switching flyback voltage converter, not a voltage regulator.  (Perhaps they were thinking of a 7803 voltage regulator.)  In addition, using a 3 volt regulator with this LED will not provide enough voltage to even light the LED should the forward voltage drop of that individual lamp be on the high side of the range shown on the data sheet (3.8 volts).  If you want to go with a voltage regulator (inadvisable in this application), you will need to use at least a 5 volt regulator.” To answer your question about what size (wattage) resistors to use in a particular application, that value should be CALCULATED rather than making the assumption that one should use 1/4W for “lighting” and 1/2W “for motor control circuits and the like”.  Fortunately, this is a relatively easy calculation.  We know by definition that power expressed in watts (P) is the product of the current in amperes (I) times the potential in volts (E), or P=IE .   We also know from Ohm’s law that the current in amperes (I) flowing in a circuit is directly proportional to the potential in volts (E) and inversely proportional to the resistance in ohms (R), or I=E/R.   If we multiply both sides of the formula for ohms law by R, we get IR=E, and substituting that IR for E in the power equation will give us P= IE=I(IR) or P = I squared times R.  (I am reluctant to use superscripts here to write the formula in case they too disappear from the e-mail).  Thus, if we know the current going through a resistor in amperes and the value of the resistance in ohms, we can compute the power.  In the case of your LED, the target current is 0.020 amperes, so for a 680 ohm resistor, the power dissipated is 0.02 x 0.02 x 680 = 0.272 watts, or just over 1/4 watt.  While a 1/4 watt resistor work, it will likely run hot and may eventually fail.  So we fold in a safety factor and go to the next larger size and use a 1/2 watt resistor.  Suppose the resistor we want to use is 1000 ohms.  In that case, the power dissipated is 0.02 x 0.02 x 1000 = 0.4 watts.  This is just under 1/2 watt, and while under the rated limit, it is still close enough that we would choose to use a 1 watt resistor here as it will run cooler and will therefore last much longer.    I hope that helps.   Jerry F.     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, December 16, 2016 11:47 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Jerry,   Thanks.  I really appreciate your input.  After second thought I too decided I will use a higher resistor (680+ ohm) and and inline diode.   I prefer some headroom and have never cut things close when doing repairs and/or upgrades in the past, so why start now.  What did you mean by " In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a watt resistor rather than a watt."  Did you mean 1K resistor?  But while on the subject of watts -- what wattage resistor would you use -- 1/4W or 1/2W?  I'm thinking 1/4W since its lighting -- 1/2W for motor control circuits and the like.  I'm intrigued by your idea of constant brightness.  Can you please provide more information on the 3803 IC that you mentioned?  Perhaps a link?  I've installed voltage regulators in the past, but the linear units get hot, and take up more room than I have in this case.  I've used switching regulators in the past b/c they run cooler and have that helps avoid melting plastic shells, but then too only when the room for them has been available.  This 3803 sounds as though it has several advantages to either of those -- size/convenience, cost, and outcome.  The regulators I've used all cost more than a dollar each.  Thanks!   Dave

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78574	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Attachments : gfeldman2904 Wrote: Hello David Horn, Apparently my original comments to you in my e-mail sent at 1:24 PM of 12/15/2016 were 'added to' and then 'changed' by a 'Davidwin 'at' TDS.net' in his message sent at 4:27 AM or 12/16/2016. The sentence in my original message read, 'In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a 'one-half' watt resistor rather than a 'one-quarter' watt.', but the numbers I had typed in for one half and one quarter got turned into the characters for one half and one quarter, and these in turn apparently disappeared when Mr. Win altered my text. Dave: Sorry, my software does not recognize such special characters and simply omits them. I agree with your recommendation to go with a 1 watt. . I did NOT write the paragraph in bold green that begins: 'Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. Dave: Of course not, which is why my name appears followed by the colon, and a unique color is used. '' , so I take no responsibility for its content. To add to the confusion, you apparently had not yet seen my e-mail sent at 11:41 AM of 12/16/2016, as your message was sent just six minutes later with a time stamp of 11:47 AM. My 11:41 AM e-mail reads as follows: 'Actually, the BEST solution to lighting a LED is to use a chip that generates a CONSTANT CURRENT, not a constant VOLTAGE. Dave: Sure, the series voltage regulators are simply plentiful, cheap, and when feeding an LED through a series resister you have sufficient current limiting. It turns out there are devices made just for this application (lighting a LED), and a quick search turned up the CL2 device made by Microchip  http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/268/20005448A-1021782.pdf , by Supertex https://www.ledsales.com.au/pdf/cl2.pdf , and by others. The device is placed in series with the LED (or string of LEDs) and when supplied with from 5 to 90 volts DC will output a constant current of 20 milliamperes. The Supertex chip sells for $0.40 each at Mouser and can be purchased in unit quantities:   http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=supertex+cl2 . With this chip, you do not need a resistor, and the LED will have a constant brightness once the circuit is supplied with enough voltage (5 volts). Dave: It indeed looks ideal. .    (Disclaimer ' I have no connection or experience with either these manufacturers or with the vendor.) BTW, I don't know who wrote the note in green inserted into my earlier e-mail, but it wasn't from me (gfeldman). Dave: You seem to have an attitude here?? This is a public forum my posts have headings with my name, and my posts are in a different color and my posts have my name "Dave:" above my comments. What is your problem? Whomever it was though, supplied what appears to be an incorrect chip number. The 3803 is a switching flyback voltage converter, not a voltage regulator. (Perhaps they were thinking of a 7803 voltage regulator.) Dave: 7803 was what I intended yes. In addition, using a 3 volt regulator with this LED will not provide enough voltage to even light the LED should the forward voltage drop of that individual lamp be on the high side of the range shown on the data sheet (3.8 volts). If you want to go with a voltage regulator (inadvisable in this application), you will need to use at least a 5 volt regulator. Dave: The idea was to enable the LED to light with as low a track voltage as possible. The LED's I have here will all light well with less than 3 volts. .' To answer your question about what size (wattage) resistors to use in a particular application, that value should be CALCULATED rather than making the assumption that one should use 1/4W for 'lighting' and 1/2W 'for motor control circuits and the like'. Fortunately, this is a relatively easy calculation. Dave: Sure. It was BTW someone else who may have suggested 1/4 watt resister. We know by definition that power expressed in watts (P) is the product of the current in amperes (I) times the potential in volts (E), or P=IE . We also know from Ohm's law that the current in amperes (I) flowing in a circuit is directly proportional to the potential in volts (E) and inversely proportional to the resistance in ohms (R), or I=E/R. If we multiply both sides of the formula for ohms law by R, we get IR=E, and substituting that IR for E in the power equation will give us P= IE=I(IR) or P = I squared times R. (I am reluctant to use superscripts here to write the formula in case they too disappear from the e-mail). Thus, if we know the current going through a resistor in amperes and the value of the resistance in ohms, we can compute the power. In the case of your LED, the target current is 0.020 amperes, so for a 680 ohm resistor, the power dissipated is 0.02 x 0.02 x 680 = 0.272 watts, or just over 1/4 watt. While a 1/4 watt resistor work, it will likely run hot and may eventually fail. So we fold in a safety factor and go to the next larger size and use a 1/2 watt resistor. Dave: The current limiter you suggested above eliminates the need for a resister and is an ideal solution. It will provide constant amount of light regardless of voltage throughout the range of input in case one wants to use varying track voltage.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78575	From: jhwysopal	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Talking Union Station not playing

I set up my talking station for Christmas. When I push the button, the record starts revolving but the needle does not engage the record. I adjusted the needle length, used a new needle, used a different record that I know works, but no luck. Any suggestions? Thanks, Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78576	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

To David Win:   You wrote: “You seem to have an attitude here?? This is a public forum my posts have headings with my name, and my posts are in a different color and my posts have my name "Dave:" above my comments. What is your problem?   1) David:  The original sender of the message to whom I was replying is also named David.  When you put the name “Dave:” in front of your comment is seemed as a salutation to him, just as I did here at the start of this paragraph.   Perhaps it would have been less confusing if you had identified your comments with just your initials.   2) When I received the first e-mail with your added comment (the one in green), the only e-mail address shown in the heading was, “S-Trains@yahoogroups.com”.  E-mails from this group almost always arrive on my computer without the name and e-mail address of the specific sender in the header.  Rather, they appear in a separate section at the bottom of the message with the words “Posted by:”.  In this instance, your name and e-mail address were completely absent.       3) By just intercalating your comment into an existing e-mail without entering any text into the “Reply” section of the message screen (such as “Please see my comments below”, you left readers of the e-mail with the impression that I wrote the comment, because mine was the ONLY name and e-mail address that appeared at the bottom of the letter.  This is not just my perception; it appears to have also misled David Horn because he asked ME, “Can you please provide more information on the 3803 IC that you mentioned?”, when it was actually you who mentioned the 3803.    I apologize if you believe I have an “attitude”, as I was just trying to provide some assistance to David Horn.  Much confusion can be avoided if individuals would remember that e-mails (especially formatting) may not appear on other’s computers the same way they appear on their own computer, and that individuals should always sign their messages.   Thanks,   Jerry F.     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2016 3:55 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     gfeldman2904 Wrote: Hello David Horn, Apparently my original comments to you in my e-mail sent at 1:24 PM of 12/15/2016 were 'added to' and then 'changed' by a 'Davidwin 'at' TDS.net' in his message sent at 4:27 AM or 12/16/2016. The sentence in my original message read, 'In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a 'one-half' watt resistor rather than a 'one-quarter' watt.', but the numbers I had typed in for one half and one quarter got turned into the characters for one half and one quarter, and these in turn apparently disappeared when Mr. Win altered my text. Dave: Sorry, my software does not recognize such special characters and simply omits them. I agree with your recommendation to go with a 1 watt. . I did NOT write the paragraph in bold green that begins: 'Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. Dave: Of course not, which is why my name appears followed by the colon, and a unique color is used. '' , so I take no responsibility for its content. To add to the confusion, you apparently had not yet seen my e-mail sent at 11:41 AM of 12/16/2016, as your message was sent just six minutes later with a time stamp of 11:47 AM. My 11:41 AM e-mail reads as follows: 'Actually, the BEST solution to lighting a LED is to use a chip that generates a CONSTANT CURRENT, not a constant VOLTAGE. Dave: Sure, the series voltage regulators are simply plentiful, cheap, and when feeding an LED through a series resister you have sufficient current limiting. It turns out there are devices made just for this application (lighting a LED), and a quick search turned up the CL2 device made by Microchip  http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/268/20005448A-1021782.pdf , by Supertex https://www.ledsales.com.au/pdf/cl2.pdf , and by others. The device is placed in series with the LED (or string of LEDs) and when supplied with from 5 to 90 volts DC will output a constant current of 20 milliamperes. The Supertex chip sells for $0.40 each at Mouser and can be purchased in unit quantities:   http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=supertex+cl2 . With this chip, you do not need a resistor, and the LED will have a constant brightness once the circuit is supplied with enough voltage (5 volts). Dave: It indeed looks ideal. .    (Disclaimer ' I have no connection or experience with either these manufacturers or with the vendor.) BTW, I don't know who wrote the note in green inserted into my earlier e-mail, but it wasn't from me (gfeldman). Dave: You seem to have an attitude here?? This is a public forum my posts have headings with my name, and my posts are in a different color and my posts have my name "Dave:" above my comments. What is your problem? Whomever it was though, supplied what appears to be an incorrect chip number. The 3803 is a switching flyback voltage converter, not a voltage regulator. (Perhaps they were thinking of a 7803 voltage regulator.) Dave: 7803 was what I intended yes. In addition, using a 3 volt regulator with this LED will not provide enough voltage to even light the LED should the forward voltage drop of that individual lamp be on the high side of the range shown on the data sheet (3.8 volts). If you want to go with a voltage regulator (inadvisable in this application), you will need to use at least a 5 volt regulator. Dave: The idea was to enable the LED to light with as low a track voltage as possible. The LED's I have here will all light well with less than 3 volts. .' To answer your question about what size (wattage) resistors to use in a particular application, that value should be CALCULATED rather than making the assumption that one should use 1/4W for 'lighting' and 1/2W 'for motor control circuits and the like'. Fortunately, this is a relatively easy calculation. Dave: Sure. It was BTW someone else who may have suggested 1/4 watt resister. We know by definition that power expressed in watts (P) is the product of the current in amperes (I) times the potential in volts (E), or P=IE . We also know from Ohm's law that the current in amperes (I) flowing in a circuit is directly proportional to the potential in volts (E) and inversely proportional to the resistance in ohms (R), or I=E/R. If we multiply both sides of the formula for ohms law by R, we get IR=E, and substituting that IR for E in the power equation will give us P= IE=I(IR) or P = I squared times R. (I am reluctant to use superscripts here to write the formula in case they too disappear from the e-mail). Thus, if we know the current going through a resistor in amperes and the value of the resistance in ohms, we can compute the power. In the case of your LED, the target current is 0.020 amperes, so for a 680 ohm resistor, the power dissipated is 0.02 x 0.02 x 680 = 0.272 watts, or just over 1/4 watt. While a 1/4 watt resistor work, it will likely run hot and may eventually fail. So we fold in a safety factor and go to the next larger size and use a 1/2 watt resistor. Dave: The current limiter you suggested above eliminates the need for a resister and is an ideal solution. It will provide constant amount of light regardless of voltage throughout the range of input in case one wants to use varying track voltage.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78577	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 18 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78578	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Talking Union Station not playing

Make sure reproducer is sitting in cradle so that when button is engaged record spins and starts playing when it gets to end arm raises up reproducer also make sure needle isnt to long will ruine record look on line i think doug peck may have copy of operating instructions  Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "jameswysopal@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: 12/17/16 5:57 PM (GMT-05:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Talking Union Station not playing   I set up my talking station for Christmas. When I push the button, the record starts revolving but the needle does not engage the record. I adjusted the needle length, used a new needle, used a different record that I know works, but no luck. Any suggestions? Thanks, Jim

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78579	From: JOHN RUTH	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Polar Express Hand Car

We have been running the PE hand car on the club Christmas layout and have noticed a few issues. It seems to get stuck on some of the AF rerailer tracks. Also has a problem with some AF switch frogs. The problem seems to be a clearance issue with the two screw heads that are not flush with the bottom of the motor chassis. Anyone having a similar problem and an idea what can be done to correct it. I am sure they would run better on Lionel fast track, or similar mfg track, but I do not think our club is ready to convert all the modules to fast track. Thanks for listening. Jack Ruth ACSG:Carolionas Div.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78580	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Help identify this layout.

As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78581	From: racin510	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Talking Union Station not playing

It has to do with the mechanism that raises and lowers the phono head. Play with this until things come right. i think I remember it having to do with the correct positioning of a metal lever.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78582	From: Robert Lampe	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Arguing among ourselves is not going to solve or answer the original question. Like I stated previously I am no electronics genius I'm just a retired Army Staff Sergeant and Firefighter who happens to like S scale. What I think needs to be done is convert the AC to DC with what I believe is called a bridge rectifier because to the best of my knowledge most LED's use DC. You will also need a resistor to reduce the output voltage to that required by the LED.                     Bob Lampe                     Kalispell, MT                            From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of 'Gerald Feldman' gfeldman2904@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2016 4:05 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks. - OT         From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2016 3:55 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     gfeldman2904 Wrote: Hello David Horn, Apparently my original comments to you in my e-mail sent at 1:24 PM of 12/15/2016 were 'added to' and then 'changed' by a 'Davidwin 'at' TDS.net' in his message sent at 4:27 AM or 12/16/2016. The sentence in my original message read, 'In either case, I would double the power dissipation and use a 'one-half' watt resistor rather than a 'one-quarter' watt.', but the numbers I had typed in for one half and one quarter got turned into the characters for one half and one quarter, and these in turn apparently disappeared when Mr. Win altered my text. Dave: Sorry, my software does not recognize such special characters and simply omits them. I agree with your recommendation to go with a 1 watt. . I did NOT write the paragraph in bold green that begins: 'Dave: This has been an interesting dialog. Dave: Of course not, which is why my name appears followed by the colon, and a unique color is used. '' , so I take no responsibility for its content. To add to the confusion, you apparently had not yet seen my e-mail sent at 11:41 AM of 12/16/2016, as your message was sent just six minutes later with a time stamp of 11:47 AM. My 11:41 AM e-mail reads as follows: 'Actually, the BEST solution to lighting a LED is to use a chip that generates a CONSTANT CURRENT, not a constant VOLTAGE. Dave: Sure, the series voltage regulators are simply plentiful, cheap, and when feeding an LED through a series resister you have sufficient current limiting. It turns out there are devices made just for this application (lighting a LED), and a quick search turned up the CL2 device made by Microchip  http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/268/20005448A-1021782.pdf , by Supertex https://www.ledsales.com.au/pdf/cl2.pdf , and by others. The device is placed in series with the LED (or string of LEDs) and when supplied with from 5 to 90 volts DC will output a constant current of 20 milliamperes. The Supertex chip sells for $0.40 each at Mouser and can be purchased in unit quantities:   http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=supertex+cl2 . With this chip, you do not need a resistor, and the LED will have a constant brightness once the circuit is supplied with enough voltage (5 volts). supertex cl2 | Mouser Electronics, Inc. www.mouser.com supertex cl2 are available at Mouser Electronics. Mouser offers inventory, pricing, & datasheets for supertex cl2. Simple 90V 20mA Temperature Compensated Constant Current ... www.ledsales.com.au 1 Initial Release Simple 90V 20mA Temperature Compensated Constant Current LED Driver IC Features 5.0V to 90V operating range (V A-B) 20mA ±10% at 5-90V Simple 90V, 20mA, Temperature Compensated, Constant ... www.mouser.com 2015 Microchip Technology Inc. DS20005448A-page 1 CL2 Features • 5.0 to 90V operating range (VA-B) • 20 mA ±10% at 5.0 - 90V • 0.01%/°C typical temperature ... Dave: It indeed looks ideal. .    (Disclaimer ' I have no connection or experience with either these manufacturers or with the vendor.) BTW, I don't know who wrote the note in green inserted into my earlier e-mail, but it wasn't from me (gfeldman). Dave: You seem to have an attitude here?? This is a public forum my posts have headings with my name, and my posts are in a different color and my posts have my name "Dave:" above my comments. What is your problem? Whomever it was though, supplied what appears to be an incorrect chip number. The 3803 is a switching flyback voltage converter, not a voltage regulator. (Perhaps they were thinking of a 7803 voltage regulator.) Dave: 7803 was what I intended yes. In addition, using a 3 volt regulator with this LED will not provide enough voltage to even light the LED should the forward voltage drop of that individual lamp be on the high side of the range shown on the data sheet (3.8 volts). If you want to go with a voltage regulator (inadvisable in this application), you will need to use at least a 5 volt regulator. Dave: The idea was to enable the LED to light with as low a track voltage as possible. The LED's I have here will all light well with less than 3 volts. .' To answer your question about what size (wattage) resistors to use in a particular application, that value should be CALCULATED rather than making the assumption that one should use 1/4W for 'lighting' and 1/2W 'for motor control circuits and the like'. Fortunately, this is a relatively easy calculation. Dave: Sure. It was BTW someone else who may have suggested 1/4 watt resister. We know by definition that power expressed in watts (P) is the product of the current in amperes (I) times the potential in volts (E), or P=IE . We also know from Ohm's law that the current in amperes (I) flowing in a circuit is directly proportional to the potential in volts (E) and inversely proportional to the resistance in ohms (R), or I=E/R. If we multiply both sides of the formula for ohms law by R, we get IR=E, and substituting that IR for E in the power equation will give us P= IE=I(IR) or P = I squared times R. (I am reluctant to use superscripts here to write the formula in case they too disappear from the e-mail). Thus, if we know the current going through a resistor in amperes and the value of the resistance in ohms, we can compute the power. In the case of your LED, the target current is 0.020 amperes, so for a 680 ohm resistor, the power dissipated is 0.02 x 0.02 x 680 = 0.272 watts, or just over 1/4 watt. While a 1/4 watt resistor work, it will likely run hot and may eventually fail. So we fold in a safety factor and go to the next larger size and use a 1/2 watt resistor. Dave: The current limiter you suggested above eliminates the need for a resister and is an ideal solution. It will provide constant amount of light regardless of voltage throughout the range of input in case one wants to use varying track voltage.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78583	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/17/2016
Subject: Re: Polar Express Hand Car

Most chassis cover plate screws are flathead to prevent this problem.  If they are round head screws, using panhead screws might be enough to solve the problem.  If the screws are sticking down below rail height different track will not change the problem. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: JOHN RUTH afdinger@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 17, 2016 5:50 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Polar Express Hand Car   We have been running the PE hand car on the club Christmas layout and have noticed a few issues. It seems to get stuck on some of the AF rerailer tracks. Also has a problem with some AF switch frogs. The problem seems to be a clearance issue with the two screw heads that are not flush with the bottom of the motor chassis. Anyone having a similar problem and an idea what can be done to correct it. I am sure they would run better on Lionel fast track, or similar mfg track, but I do not think our club is ready to convert all the modules to fast track. Thanks for listening. Jack Ruth ACSG:Carolionas Div.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78584	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Hi Bob,   Yes, LEDs do require direct current to operate, but I got the impression that is what David is already running.  (If not, a single general purpose diode in series with the lamp will suffice, but one does have to pay attention to the polarity of the components when hooking them together.)  In response to the original question, I proposed that David use an integrated circuit that is designed to supply a constant current of 20 milliamperes (the rated operating current for the LED he is using).  The IC is available for about 40 cents each, is physically small, and completely eliminates the need for a series resistor.  The primary advantages of using a constant current source instead of a resistor is that no calculations are needed and the LED will always light at full brightness, whether the circuit is supplied with 5 volts, 10 volts, or 20 volts.   Jerry F.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78585	From: dave_w_03303	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Attachments :

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78586	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 18 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 18 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78587	From: carl4flyer	Date: 12/18/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

For some reason these emails are being stripped of the body text by Yahoo?   Carl From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2016 10:51 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78588	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Thanks Jerry.  The Supertax CL2 looks promising.  From page 3 of its data sheet it looks as though it works with AC or DC. Is that true?  Or did I misread that?   From this great exchange and some breadboard testing I've come up with the following summary.  Note: these do not yet include testing a CL2, but I am tempted to buy some and try them before my final conversion of these SHS SW's.  Please provide input, comments, corrections, or suggestions on any of the following.  Thanks. 1) If the LED circuit might see AC of DC voltage, install a bridge rectifier.  That way the LED will always see the same polarity DC regardless of orientation of the engine on the rails or source voltage type (AC or DC) or polarity (DC forward or DC reverse).  Use an appropriate reducing resistor inline with the LED -- I'm not sure if it matters whether the resistor in on the + or - post side of the LED, but I install them on the + side. 2) If the LED circuit will always see DC of the correct polarity for the LED to illuminate, then all that's needed is a correct reducing resistor. 3) If the LED circuit might see DC of the correct or incorrect polarity (opposite or "reverse" as in the engine will run in reverse) then install a diode in series with a correct reducing resistor so as to prevent reverse DC from damaging the LED.  If the diode is installed inline on the + side of the LED following the resistor its end with the line around it should face toward the LED.  If installed on the - side of the LED the lined end of the diode should face away from the LED.   4) If the LED circuit will see AC, such as when replacing a light bulb in a Gilbert AF engine (although some of those have universal motors safe for use on AC or DC), then install a diode after the resistor with its posts across those of the LED with the lined end of the diode attached to the + post of the LED.  Note the LED will also illuminate with DC source voltage of the correct polarity for the LED, but not of the opposite polarity.  So if you're taking power directly off the rails for the LED and you're using AC the LED will light regardless of which direction the engine is facing, but if you're using DC it will illuminate only with the engine facing one way and not the other unless you reverse the polarity of the DC to the tracks at the same time you turn the engine around.   5) If the LED circuit might see AC or DC (I need that confirmed) and you want a constant level of illumination from the LED when 5V or more is applied to the circuit, install a current regulator such as a Supertax CL2 with post VB connected to the + post of the LED and post VA away from the LED.  Post NC is not used or connected to anything.  You do not need a reducing resistor or additional diode in this case, just the CL2. Wire LED's in series with each other - opposite posts touching.  Calculate the correct reducing resistor for ohms and watts based on source voltage and LED current and forward voltage specs (see below).  A diode of the 1N400X family should typically be sufficient.   correct reducing resistor ohms = (Vsource-Vforward)/(LEDamps) watts = (Vsource-Vforward) squared/correct reducing resistor ohms Example:  Vsource=9VDC, Vforward rating of the LED = 2VDC, LED amps=20mA or 0.020A correct ohms= (9VDC-2VDC)/.020=350 ohms, so use a 470ohm resistor to be on the safe side correct watts= (9-2VDC) squared/350 = 49/470=0.10W, so a 1/4W or 0.25W resistor would be OK   Dave

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78589	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

I checked with Mouser -- best to use CL2 only with DC.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78590	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78591	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/19/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Dave,   My comments are shown below in bold and set off with ***asterisks ***   Jerry F     From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 8:09 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Thanks Jerry.  The Supertax CL2 looks promising.  From page 3 of its data sheet it looks as though it works with AC or DC. Is that true?  Or did I misread that?   *** No, the CL2 operates on DC only.  Terminal VA goes the more positive side of the circuit and terminal VB goes to the more negative side. ***   From this great exchange and some breadboard testing I've come up with the following summary.  Note: these do not yet include testing a CL2, but I am tempted to buy some and try them before my final conversion of these SHS SW's.  Please provide input, comments, corrections, or suggestions on any of the following.  Thanks.   1) If the LED circuit might see AC of (s/b or) DC voltage, install a bridge rectifier.  That way the LED will always see the same polarity DC regardless of orientation of the engine on the rails or source voltage type (AC or DC) or polarity (DC forward or DC reverse).  Use an appropriate reducing resistor inline with the LED -- I'm not sure if it matters whether the resistor in on the + or - post side of the LED, but I install them on the + side.   *** Correct.  The components are all hooked in series so it does not matter what ORDER they are in.  What is important is the POLARITY of the terminals on the LED and on the CL2.  The LED should be wired so that its cathode faces towards the negative side of the voltage source.  (See the drawing on the CL2 Datasheet.)  ***     2) If the LED circuit will always see DC of the correct polarity for the LED to illuminate, then all that's needed is a correct reducing resistor.   *** Correct,  but the brightness of the LED will vary as you change the voltage (unless you use a CL2 or other constant current device).  ***     3) If the LED circuit might see DC of the correct or incorrect polarity (opposite or "reverse" as in the engine will run in reverse) then install a diode in series with a correct reducing resistor so as to prevent reverse DC from damaging the LED.  If the diode is installed inline on the + side of the LED following the resistor its end with the line around it should face toward the LED.  If installed on the - side of the LED the lined end of the diode should face away from the LED.     *** Correct.  For a typical two-wire LED, the longer wire (often labeled “+”) is the anode and the shorter wire (often labeled “-“) is the cathode.  For a general purpose diode, the cathode is denoted by the band around the device.  (For an example, see the datasheet at:  http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/1N4001-D.PDF  .)   ***     4) If the LED circuit will see AC, such as when replacing a light bulb in a Gilbert AF engine (although some of those have universal motors safe for use on AC or DC), then install a diode after the resistor with its posts across those of the LED with the lined end of the diode attached to the + post of the LED! .  Note the LED will also illuminate with DC source voltage of the correct polarity for the LED, but not of the opposite polarity.  So if you're taking power directly off the rails for the LED and you're using AC the LED will light regardless of which direction the engine is facing, but if you're using DC it will illuminate only with the engine facing one way and not the other unless you reverse the polarity of the DC to the tracks at the same time you turn the engine around.     *** Correct.  Placing the general-purpose diode in parallel with, but in opposite polarity to the LED will work to protect the LED because the forward voltage drop of the general-purpose diode is only about 0.7 volts while the LED will withstand a reverse voltage of about 5 volts.   Note that if circuit sees AC, the LED will only light for one half of each cycle of the AC, so the number of photons of light will also be halved.  I.E., the light will be dimmer when run on AC when compared to DC.  ***      5) If the LED circuit might see AC or DC (I need that confirmed) and you want a constant level of illumination from the LED when 5V or more is applied to the circuit, install a current regulator such as a Supertax CL2 with post VB connected to the + post of the LED and post VA away from the LED.  Post NC is not used or connected to anything.  You do not need a reducing resistor or additional diode in this case, just the CL2.   *** Yes and No.  The wiring is correct, though the CL2 may also be connected with terminal VA facing the – post (the cathode) of the LED.  Do not run The CL2 on AC.  Adding a series diode as in paragraph 3) above will protect both the LED and the CL2 from reverse polarity. ***     Wire LED's in series with each other - opposite posts touching.  Calculate the correct reducing resistor for ohms and watts based on source voltage and LED current and forward voltage specs (see below).  A diode of the 1N400X family should typically be sufficient.     correct reducing resistor ohms = (Vsource-Vforward)/(LEDamps) watts = (Vsource-Vforward) squared/correct reducing resistor ohms   Example:  Vsource=9VDC, Vforward rating of the LED = 2VDC, LED amps=20mA or 0.020A correct ohms= (9VDC-2VDC)/.020=350 ohms, so use a 470ohm resistor to be on the safe side correct watts= (9-2VDC) squared/350 = 49/470=0.10W, so a 1/4W or 0.25W resistor would be OK   *** The statements and calculations immediately above are OK, but for only a single LED.  For multiple LEDs in series, you first have to multiply the number of LEDs by the forward voltage drop of each LED and subtract that result from the supply voltage.  In your example above, suppose you were running three LEDs in series.  The value of the series resistor would be: (9V – (2V x 3)) / 0.020A = (9V – 6V) /0.020A = 150 ohms. The power dissipated by the resistor would be:  (9V – (2V x 3)) squared / 150 ohms = 0.06 watts Of course, if you put too many LEDs in series without increasing the supply voltage, none of them will light. ***     Dave

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78592	From: sgaugian	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Thanks Jerry.  I appreciate your input and clarifications.  I ordered some 689-CL2N3-G (20mA) and 689-CL25N3-G (25mA) LED drivers from Mouser, along with 810-FK18X7R1H104K 100nF capacitors to put across the circuit as shown in the CL2 typical configuration diagram and recommended by a tech at Mouser.  I look forward to testing and installing these components to gain constant rather than variable LED illumination in these SHS SW9 engines, other engines, and rolling stock.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78593	From: Gerald Feldman	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.

Dave,   It is good practice to never run a device at its maximum ratings, so I would use the 25 mA CL25 device only on LEDs with a maximum current of 30 mA or more.  The output currents of the constant current devices are rated at +/-10% of the nominal output stated on the data sheet, so the actual output currents are 18 to 22 mA for the CL2 and 22.5 to 27.5 mA for the CL25.   And yes, the capacitor is probably a good idea for both devices.  (It is not mentioned in the notes, but is likely there to suppress noise or oscillation).      Best wishes, and let us know how they work for you.   Jerry F.          From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 7:59 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Re: Do you know how to upgrade an SHS SW9 headlight to LED? Thanks.     Thanks Jerry.  I appreciate your input and clarifications.  I ordered some 689-CL2N3-G (20mA) and 689-CL25N3-G (25mA) LED drivers from Mouser, along with 810-FK18X7R1H104K 100nF capacitors to put across the circuit as shown in the CL2 typical configuration diagram and recommended by a tech at Mouser.  I look forward to testing and installing these components to gain constant rather than variable LED illumination in these SHS SW9 engines, other engines, and rolling stock.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78594	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78595	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78596	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I agree 100% with you Doug. Besides American Flyer trains, another hobby of mine is restoring old photographs.  IMHO, the photograph that Dale has presented is an actual photo of a "real" layout that existed at one time.  I did notice that the rubber roadbed used was the "narrow tie" roadbed.  Does anyone know what year that was issued or was it concurrent with the "wide tie" roadbed? On 12/20/2016 9:43 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78597	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/20/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Doug is quite correct on this point.  As an example, the Sibley Department store layout featured wide sweeping concentric curves at on end of the layout that would be impossible with the single radius curves manufactured by Gilbert at that time.  Continuous rail was used and bent to the required radius and mounted on standard ties.  For more on that layout you might want to see this article, Flyer Survivor, by Jeff Faust, Classic Toy Trains, May 1998, page 84. One other point on this mystery layout  photo is that it that it appears to have been taken with a telephoto lens which may have altered the perspective particularly on the distant details, including track sections. Dale Smith On 12/20/2016 6:43 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78598	From: rick flaherty	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties? Rick From: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of "Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 at 8:30 PM To: <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Doug is quite correct on this point.  As an example, the Sibley Department store layout featured wide sweeping concentric curves at on end of the layout that would be impossible with the single radius curves manufactured by Gilbert at that time.  Continuous rail was used and bent to the required radius and mounted on standard ties.  For more on that layout you might want to see this article, Flyer Survivor, by Jeff Faust, Classic Toy Trains, May 1998, page 84. One other point on this mystery layout  photo is that it that it appears to have been taken with a telephoto lens which may have altered the perspective particularly on the distant details, including track sections. Dale Smith On 12/20/2016 6:43 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78599	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Can’t even get original-style sectional track anymore…..never mind “continuous rail” !!   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 1:23 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties?   Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78600	From: hspanier2000	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Gargraves Track Pins - Free

I have no idea whether there is still a demand for these. I must have somewhere between 75 or so, maybe more or less. If anyone wants them please email me off line: hspanier@... Might as well ask. If anyone has any Super O trackage they want to sell please let me know at the same email: hspanier@... Happy Holidays! Mike Spanier

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78601	From: hhisgauger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Prices Falling

Is it me or do the prices on original AC Gilbert Trains appear to be falling in value? Also the AF/Lionel stuff seems to be quite low as well...anyone want to 'weigh-in' with their thoughts this and the overall "S" marketplace?  Thanks and have a Merry Christmas !

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78602	From: Mark Speichert	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

It all depends on the item and condition. The new items are worth about half of what you pay for them but the real flyer made by Gilbert still sells well. The internet has just shown that items people thought were rare like gabe that at one time sold for around 1,100.00 is now 250.00 was over priced. There are many items that still hold there value. Remember these trains only sold for 2.00, 5.00,19.00 for an engine and 19.00 to 67.00 for a set and Missouri set just sold for over 3000.00 not a bad return. I think the the market is still strong. Mark Speichert -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 12/21/16, nrcastricone@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: [S-Trains] Prices Falling To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, December 21, 2016, 7:16 AM   Is it me or do the prices on original AC Gilbert Trains appear to be falling in value? 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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78603	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Doug,   Isn't this due to the fact that it has so little value on the used market?  It can't be cheap to produce the old style track, but when I go to train shows it doesn't sell at 10 cents a section; which is dirt  cheap compared to FastTrak or Showcase Lines track. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 6:33 am Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Can’t even get original-style sectional track anymore…..never mind “continuous rail” !!   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 1:23 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties?   Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78604	From: ecphora123	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: AF Banana Car

The AF No. 24052 UFGE car has, to my knowledge, no close prototype. It mostly resembles something from the civil war era. Recently I watched an episode from an old TV series based on James Michener's Centennial. The episode depicted a passenger train from the 1870s. What's interesting to us S gaugers is that there was a head end car that to some degree resembled the Flyer No. 24052 car. Unlike our familiar car, this one had not one, but two ventilated windows on either side of the "box car" door. The ventilated openings on the 24052 are not exactly windows as they are openings. Seeing the show, I thought it would be a nice project to take our banana car and kit-bash it. That would require that 8 total windows would have to be bashed or otherwise made. Beyond that, the finished model could then be painted and lettered the same as your passenger train. I'm sorry, but so far I have not found any image of the passenger train from the show. That would have been nice to include. Gene Cimino

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78605	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Original-style track isn’t made anymore because none of the “majors” own the tooling for it. As you probably know, K-Line had made 10” straights, and 36” straights, but never any curves. As a result of the lawsuits between K-Line and Lionel, Lionel won the rights to make that track for 3 years. After that, my understanding is that ownership of the tooling reverted to the factory in China that actually made it. ….Lionel no longer held the rights. That’s the main reason Lionel bit the bullet and made FasTrack.   Original track in decent condition still sells OK for me, but certainly nowhere near as well as FasTrack and S-Trax, or even Am. Models track.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 12:12 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Doug,   Isn't this due to the fact that it has so little value on the used market?  It can't be cheap to produce the old style track, but when I go to train shows it doesn't sell at 10 cents a section; which is dirt  cheap compared to FastTrak or Showcase Lines track.   Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921     -----Original Message----- From: Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 6:33 am Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Can’t even get original-style sectional track anymore…..never mind “continuous rail” !!   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 1:23 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties?   Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78606	From: lenscap76@yahoo.com	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains. Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78607	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I'm just curious, could Wellsprings and Associates and Neil Young produce an old style track by adding maybe two more ties to make it different looking than the original? Also make it using wider radius? Not that I would want the old Style track when there is so many new styles of track that work so much better. Chris Burger From: "Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 2:27 PM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Original-style track isn’t made anymore because none of the “majors” own the tooling for it. As you probably know, K-Line had made 10” straights, and 36” straights, but never any curves. As a result of the lawsuits between K-Line and Lionel, Lionel won the rights to make that track for 3 years. After that, my understanding is that ownership of the tooling reverted to the factory in China that actually made it. ….Lionel no longer held the rights. That’s the main reason Lionel bit the bullet and made FasTrack.   Original track in decent condition still sells OK for me, but certainly nowhere near as well as FasTrack and S-Trax, or even Am. Models track.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 12:12 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Doug,   Isn't this due to the fact that it has so little value on the used market?  It can't be cheap to produce the old style track, but when I go to train shows it doesn't sell at 10 cents a section; which is dirt  cheap compared to FastTrak or Showcase Lines track.   Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921     -----Original Message----- From: Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 6:33 am Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Can’t even get original-style sectional track anymore…..never mind “continuous rail” !!   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 1:23 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties?   Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78608	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

On 12/21/2016 12:27 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > > Original-style track isn’t made anymore because none of the “majors” own > the tooling for it. > > As you probably know, K-Line had made 10” straights, and 36” straights, > but never any curves. What about the 54 inch radius curves? I have a bunch of it along with the Johnson rubber roadbed. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78609	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

You are 100% correct  Sent from my iPhone On Dec 21, 2016, at 2:55 PM, lenscap76@... lenscap76@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains. Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78610	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

What I find interesting is that when these older  Gilbert engines are upgraded with new better can motors with improved performance there is no corresponding/appreciable increase in value.  That points to far more collectors than operators. Another operator issue is that the smoke units draw a lot of current, an on/off switch for the smoke units, like found in G gauge locos, would dramatically reduce current draw, especially if the loco has a can motor. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 1:06 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Prices Falling   You are 100% correct  Sent from my iPhone On Dec 21, 2016, at 2:55 PM, lenscap76@... lenscap76@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains. Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78611	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

I believe the newer S Scalers are more interested in the newer pieces being produced and don't care so much about the old American Flyer trains. They don't run as nice, don't have sound except the annoying choo choo sound. I also like upgrading to the new Timko Motors and find they sell better than an older motor. Nothing wrong with old Gilbert trains, but there are better out there now.   I know this will irk the older collectors, but it is what it is. Chris Burger From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 4:23 PM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Prices Falling   What I find interesting is that when these older  Gilbert engines are upgraded with new better can motors with improved performance there is no corresponding/appreciable increase in value.  That points to far more collectors than operators. Another operator issue is that the smoke units draw a lot of current, an on/off switch for the smoke units, like found in G gauge locos, would dramatically reduce current draw, especially if the loco has a can motor. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Frank Emiro femiro2002@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 1:06 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Prices Falling   You are 100% correct  Sent from my iPhone On Dec 21, 2016, at 2:55 PM, lenscap76@... lenscap76@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains. Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78612	From: ecphora123	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: AF Banana Car

Don't know why I typed in an incorrect number in the title.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78613	From: lenscap76@yahoo.com	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: AF Banana Car

I always thought that it was a sort of wood sided reefer but missing the roof hatches and walkway Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78614	From: beebear	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

That may be one of the reasons people don’t buy the older Flyer stuff. All of the good rolling stock and engines are setting in someone’s collection on a shelf. From all the train shows I’ve been to this year, a fair amount of engines have been run pretty hard and the prices are still high.  It’s kind of like shying away from a used car. The younger generation isn’t inquisitive or mechanically inclined to take on a project of restoring these trains. Anyone who knows about the Flyer trains choose not to purchase these worn out toys and thus the price starts to drop.   I have both new and old Flyer and choose the newer diesels because the look better, they run better on the newer track and DCC is much more fun to run in IMHO.   John Frankforther       The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains.   Sent from my Sprint phone This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78615	From: R G	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

I have definitely seen a reduction in prices over the last 10 years. My local Flyer dealer also shares the view that prices are going down. I have seen it at the TCA shows in York. My local dealer and I agree that too many collectors are trying to finance their retirement whit their trains.  The demand is not there anymore. I have collected just about all there is Flyer but I refuse to pay hundreds of dollars for a single freight car. Interesting thing is I have found the "rare" items for very reasonable prices, and will never pay top dollar for these toys! On Wednesday, December 21, 2016 3:39 PM, "lenscap76@... lenscap76@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   The older collectors have most of the common stuff and the younger generation is more into video games than trains. Sent from my Sprint phone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78616	From: John and Carol	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

Mark Speichert wrote: "Remember these trains only sold for 2.00, 5.00,19.00 for an engine and 19.00 to 67.00 for a set." Ah, but let's also remember what those amounts could purchase in 2016 dollars. According to the U.S. Dept. of Labor, Bureau of Labor Statistics' CPI Inflation Calculator, here are the 2016 equivalent values compared to 1952: 1952 = 2016 $2.00 = $18.22 $5.00 = 45.54 $19.00 = $173.05 $19.00 to $67.00 = $173.05 to $610.21 Sounds pretty-much the same to me. John Eichmann Rocky Mountain Hi-Railers Boise, Idaho

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78617	From: Lamont Heppe	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Actually K Line made 27 inch radius curves Monte Heppe Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78618	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Continuous rail was never "available" to customers, only to the display construction department. Dale On 12/20/2016 10:22 PM, rick flaherty flick23@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Is continuous rail still available for AF or similar high rail that would fit the AF ties? Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78619	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Daryl, I am not sure there is any narrow tie roadbed on this layout.  I think the narrowness you can see is a result of the use of a telephoto lens looking down the front lines of track.  Notice how the stamped metal ties are also quite narrow.   Also, the roadbed looks grey to me, which I believe is the earlier version which was only made in wide tie version (6 ties).  The narrow tie roadbed had 23 ties and according to Volume II of the Greenberg guide was made in 1956, too late for this layout based on all the other dating based on rolling stock and buildings. Dale On 12/20/2016 8:34 PM, Daryl Olszeski jaytewilli@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I agree 100% with you Doug. Besides American Flyer trains, another hobby of mine is restoring old photographs.  IMHO, the photograph that Dale has presented is an actual photo of a "real" layout that existed at one time.  I did notice that the rubber roadbed used was the "narrow tie" roadbed.  Does anyone know what year that was issued or was it concurrent with the "wide tie" roadbed? On 12/20/2016 9:43 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78620	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Correct. And the same situation I described previously applies to this track as well, and to its corresponding rubber roadbed.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 7:44 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Help identify this layout.     Actually K Line made 27 inch radius curves Monte Heppe Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78621	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Banana Car and other Frontiersman stuff and falling prices

One problem with the banana car and ALL the frontiersman stuff is it’s all very oversized. The early cars and locomotives were much smaller than the “modern” equipment—they are even oversized for O gauge! I recently reworked a Franklin engine for a friend, and remembering that they seldom smoke well, got to looking at things, and the smoke unit relies on getting one side of its power through the chassis and tender drawbar. Not a very stable power source, so I added a 5th wire from the tender frame to the locomotive frame, utilizing screws already on the locomotive. Voila! Lotsa smoke, but still not much “choo choo”. Speaking of Choo Choo, Chris B spoke blasphemy  by calling it “annoying”!! It’s one of the most beloved sounds that an AF steamer makes, IMHO! When I was showing my Y-3 off, my sister walked in and said, “That sounds like a recording!” She prefers the mechanical sound, and she’s not a train person at all! I’m thinking prices are falling as this past Sunday I won two eBay auctions that I thought I had no chance of winning. I obtained a “like new” Flyonel Daylight PA-PB-PA locomotive, no boxes, for around $145 (can’t nail down the shipping, as it’s combined) and a Silver Flash PA-PB 4778 in fair cosmetic condition, but needing mechanical work for $ 105. It looks good enough in the pics to be a layout runner.  So, that might be a sign—although I think “Mint” stuff is still holding its value. I won’t have them “in hand” until after Christmas, so will report then.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78622	From: rick gough	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

What parts of it couldn't you reproduce because it sure looks like a photo?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing On Tuesday, December 20, 2016 7:57 PM, "Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com is not on your Guest List | Approve sender | Approve domain | Approve S-Trains@yahoogroups.com   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78623	From: Chrisandmhel Burger	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Banana Car and other Frontiersman stuff and falling prices

HA HA Duck! Not Blasphemy at all. The Choo Choo sound was Brilliant, but when you are running two or more well tuned engines the choo choo gets very annoying after a while when trying to have a conversation in a small layout area!  I run 2 302's and a modified 350 with smoke and choo choo with ERR sound and the 3 Choo Choo sounds drown out the Electronics sound of the Royal Blue and the Texas Special. So I find it annoying after a short time. At a train show in a large area it is awesome. CB From: "'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 9:29 PM Subject: [S-Trains] Banana Car and other Frontiersman stuff and falling prices   One problem with the banana car and ALL the frontiersman stuff is it’s all very oversized. The early cars and locomotives were much smaller than the “modern” equipment—they are even oversized for O gauge! I recently reworked a Franklin engine for a friend, and remembering that they seldom smoke well, got to looking at things, and the smoke unit relies on getting one side of its power through the chassis and tender drawbar. Not a very stable power source, so I added a 5th wire from the tender frame to the locomotive frame, utilizing screws already on the locomotive. Voila! Lotsa smoke, but still not much “choo choo”. Speaking of Choo Choo, Chris B spoke blasphemy  by calling it “annoying”!! It’s one of the most beloved sounds that an AF steamer makes, IMHO! When I was showing my Y-3 off, my sister walked in and said, “That sounds like a recording!” She prefers the mechanical sound, and she’s not a train person at all! I’m thinking prices are falling as this past Sunday I won two eBay auctions that I thought I had no chance of winning. I obtained a “like new” Flyonel Daylight PA-PB-PA locomotive, no boxes, for around $145 (can’t nail down the shipping, as it’s combined) and a Silver Flash PA-PB 4778 in fair cosmetic condition, but needing mechanical work for $ 105. It looks good enough in the pics to be a layout runner.  So, that might be a sign—although I think “Mint” stuff is still holding its value. I won’t have them “in hand” until after Christmas, so will report then.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78624	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/21/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I was thinking there was a confusion between diameter and radius.  But I have never used K Line track.  After using 29" radius, it's hard to get used to tighter curves again. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Lamont Heppe monteheppe@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wed, Dec 21, 2016 5:46 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Help identify this layout.   Actually K Line made 27 inch radius curves Monte Heppe Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78625	From: calleytwo	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

Flyer S p[robably owes  more these days to nostalgia than a desire to run. They are actually a pain to run! I also collect the 1939-41 Flyer 3/16th stuff with the same bodies but three rail O gauge track and they are far better runners with non of the pick up problems. BTW the 1946/47 Smoke in Tender locos do have an on off switch for the smoke.. They also are more realistic with the ability to smoke when in neutral in a station. Alistair McAllister ----- Original Message ----- From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: Cc: Sent: Wed, 21 Dec 2016 21:43:20 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Prices Falling   I believe the newer S Scalers are more interested in the newer pieces being produced and don't care so much about the old American Flyer trains. They don't run as nice, don't have sound except the annoying choo choo sound. I also like upgrading to the new Timko Motors and find they sell better than an older motor. Nothing wrong with old Gilbert trains, but there are better out there now.   I know this will irk the older collectors, but it is what it is. Chris Burger

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78626	From: ALAN	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

Attachments : I use Gilbert AF tinplate track, usually in original rubber road, whenever I set up a temporary AF layout.  I bought a Lionel AF Polar Express late last year and ran it on an existing loop of AF tinplate track at our club house as well as on tinplate track with rubber roadbed at home. After two years, I decided to try out the Lionel AF Fastrack that came with the set.  I have used Lionel O gauge Fastrack for years with my wife's Hogwarts Express and have been happy with it However, I am having a problem trying to assemble the AF Fastrack.  No matter how hard I try to force them together, I can't seem to get the two pieces to snap together.  The Fastrack roadbed/track sections look to me like a scaled down two-rail version of the O gauge Fastrack, but the "female" end of the S gauge plastic roadbed does not seem to want to spread apart far enough to accept the"male" part of the other piece of Fastrack and snap together.  The rail/power  connections themselves are not the problem although I have already broken one off (of a terminal section, no less) when trying unsuccessfully to push two sections of Fastrack together.   It is as though the two molded parts of the receiving end are so small and close together that they have no "give" in them in order to separate enough to allow the other piece it snap in. What am I doing wrong?  Is there a trick to it?  I am sure I have applied enough force to expect toy train track to go together. Certainly way more pressure than needed for the O gauge Fastrack pieces to close. I actually like the way Bachmann HO gauge EZ track connects the best. Any tips, tricks or advice on this would be welcome. Thanks, Alan Bennett Keizer, OR Sent from XFINITY Connect Mobile App ------ Original Message ------ From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: December 21, 2016 at 11:33 AM Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   Original-style track isn’t made anymore because none of the “majors” own the tooling for it. As you probably know, K-Line had made 10” straights, and 36” straights, but never any curves. As a result of the lawsuits between K-Line and Lionel, Lionel won the rights to make that track for 3 years. After that, my understanding is that ownership of the tooling reverted to the factory in China that actually made it. ….Lionel no longer held the rights. That’s the main reason Lionel bit the bullet and made FasTrack.   Original track in decent condition still sells OK for me, but certainly nowhere near as well as FasTrack and S-Trax, or even Am. Models track.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78627	From: Daryl Olszeski	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Dale, Yep, you are right.  The lens has distorted the ties. It's all "wide tie" roadbed. Daryl On 12/21/2016 9:10 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Daryl, I am not sure there is any narrow tie roadbed on this layout.  I think the narrowness you can see is a result of the use of a telephoto lens looking down the front lines of track.  Notice how the stamped metal ties are also quite narrow.   Also, the roadbed looks grey to me, which I believe is the earlier version which was only made in wide tie version (6 ties).  The narrow tie roadbed had 23 ties and according to Volume II of the Greenberg guide was made in 1956, too late for this layout based on all the other dating based on rolling stock and buildings. Dale On 12/20/2016 8:34 PM, Daryl Olszeski jaytewilli@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I agree 100% with you Doug. Besides American Flyer trains, another hobby of mine is restoring old photographs.  IMHO, the photograph that Dale has presented is an actual photo of a "real" layout that existed at one time.  I did notice that the rubber roadbed used was the "narrow tie" roadbed.  Does anyone know what year that was issued or was it concurrent with the "wide tie" roadbed? On 12/20/2016 9:43 PM, Doug Peck doug@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was not unusual for Gilbert to use custom-made track sections for store layouts……….different curvatures, different lengths, etc. So most anything is possible on a “factory-built” store layout.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2016 6:30 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I am not sure it is a real layout.  For fun I tried to duplicate the layout using standard AF track and was not able to get even close.  I think it was never built, but is an artist conception only.  The date is probably 1951ish based on the buildings   Scott   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 10:19 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     I received a few private responses to this question, related to the time period of the layout.  I should have mentioned that I was pretty sure it was 1951, both from the rolling stock and buildings.  Andy Jugle had earlier suggested this might be a toy fair layout and placed it as a 1951 layout because of the absence of the Minicraft buildings.  Mike Schmidt further confirmed that by noting that the Minicraft buildings were introduced in 52 and 53.  He also noted that the Gulf tank cars, which were introduced in 1951, was another factor placing it in 1951.   Further evidence of 1951 as the date of the layout came from Don Rosa, who noted that the Plasticville Police Station and School, which appear on the layout, were not introduced until 1951. It is possible we will never know for sure where this layout was, but it is definitely an interesting photo. Dale Smith On 12/17/2016 8:53 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   As you know, I maintain the americanflyerdisplays.org website and am always on the lookout for photos of layouts we haven't heard of before.  Once in a while, I find one with the help of friends.   This happened recently when Bill Drake provided me with a scan of a layout I had never seen before.  Several experienced collectors have been unable to definitely identify this layout and I am hoping you can.   I haven't incorporated it into the indexes of the website yet, but you can see it at this link.   http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/mystery_layout.htm Take a look and see if you can help me out so I know where to put it on the website. Dale Smith

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78628	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I tried to match curves and the cross-overs specifically, but was not able to make it fit.  Mostly I needed larger curves.  I could mimic it if I was using AM or MTH track, but I tried to stick with old AF sectional track.    From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 10:06 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     What parts of it couldn't you reproduce because it sure looks like a photo?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78629	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Banana cars & railroad sonds

Attachments : Just in case others don’t realize it, Chris and I are pretty good “group” friends, so we can (and do) fun each other once in a while, thus the “blasphemy” line. The conversation though, made me recall a conversation with a local Oroville man who lived across the feather river from town. The river makes a 90 degree turn around the northwest end of town, and there’s a fairly high bluff on the “other” side of the river, This area is known as Thermolito and had houses and olive orchards when he was a kid. The rail yard and roundhouse were south-of town.  He mentioned to me that when he was a kid, the sounds of the steam engines switching the yards, making up trains to go up the Feather River canyon was a constant background noise, clanking of cars being coupled, whistle signals, exhaust barks, etc. We tend to forget such things. My mom told me that she couldn’t keep a picture straight on the wall with the steam engines pulling & pushing trains up the Sacramento River Canyon in Dunsmuir—and we were across the river from the tracks and uphill from them too. The Mallets (Cab-Forwards) were the worst, they just shook the place. Also, it was hard to keep things white on the clotheslines! No wonder more folks were aware of the railroad—you couldn’t miss it in everyday life. Since I grew up in Dunsmuir, I heard them daily, and where I live now, there are no tracks and I miss that sound; when I go back to the family home for a visit, it’s one of the things that relaxes me. Hey, it’s almost Christmas day! I hope you have a wonderful one! Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78630	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sonds

Attachments : When my kids were growing up we lived in the country around Villa Ridge MO.  When the Frisco 1522 was going on test runs, it would run from the St. Louis Museum of Transport to around Rolla MO.  As the Frisco 1522 made its way around Moselle, MO (old header service for the Frisco) it would blow its whistle – we could hear it about 10 miles away.  It had a very beautiful and mournful sound – we would pile into the car and race to Pacific MO to see the train pass.  We would also then run to Valley Park MO to see it pass there, and occasionally stop.    Once we say the UP Big Boy at Washington Missouri, and watched the Big Boy hauling a long line of passenger trains through the tunnel just west of Pacific MO.  Its whistle wasn’t as pleasant as the whistle on the Frisco 1522.  This was probably 25 years ago.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 22, 2016 1:41 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Banana cars & railroad sonds     Just in case others don’t realize it, Chris and I are pretty good “group” friends, so we can (and do) fun each other once in a while, thus the “blasphemy” line. The conversation though, made me recall a conversation with a local Oroville man who lived across the feather river from town. The river makes a 90 degree turn around the northwest end of town, and there’s a fairly high bluff on the “other” side of the river, This area is known as Thermolito and had houses and olive orchards when he was a kid. The rail yard and roundhouse were south-of town.  He mentioned to me that when he was a kid, the sounds of the steam engines switching the yards, making up trains to go up the Feather River canyon was a constant background noise, clanking of cars being coupled, whistle signals, exhaust barks, etc. We tend to forget such things. My mom told me that she couldn’t keep a picture straight on the wall with the steam engines pulling & pushing trains up the Sacramento River Canyon in Dunsmuir—and we were across the river from the tracks and uphill from them too. The Mallets (Cab-Forwards) were the worst, they just shook the place. Also, it was hard to keep things white on the clotheslines! No wonder more folks were aware of the railroad—you couldn’t miss it in everyday life. Since I grew up in Dunsmuir, I heard them daily, and where I live now, there are no tracks and I miss that sound; when I go back to the family home for a visit, it’s one of the things that relaxes me. Hey, it’s almost Christmas day! I hope you have a wonderful one! Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78631	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I have found that the key to determining what track sections were used on old layouts seen in photos is to look for the "double" metal tie sets that are found where sections join.  While the resolution on the photo is pretty good, it is from some distance so this may be difficult.  In any case, custom curves usually have no double tie sections except at the start and end of the custom section.  Dale On 12/22/2016 7:47 AM, 'D. Scott MacKenzie' kb0fhp@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I tried to match curves and the cross-overs specifically, but was not able to make it fit.  Mostly I needed larger curves.  I could mimic it if I was using AM or MTH track, but I tried to stick with old AF sectional track.    From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 10:06 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.     What parts of it couldn't you reproduce because it sure looks like a photo?   rick gough mudshark datsun 510 racing

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78632	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds

Attachments : David,   Probably goes to the quality of some homes in Dunsmuir than the old cab-forwards.  My grandfather was an engineer living in Dunsmuir; he retired at the end of steam.  His house was two blocks west of the tracks, north of Scherrer Avenue grade crossing.  I had an aunt living on Scherrer Avenue as well.  Later she moved  to South 1st on Little Castle Creek.  In all those years of visiting and fishing the river until I was in my 40s,  the overwhelming sound I remember were the big trucks on the highway all night long; trains only a hundred  yards away I never heard.  The pictures stayed on the wall.  The end of steam wasn't as dramatic an environmental  change in California as it was in coal-burner territory.  After all those new diesels were oil burners and diesel oil  gets very dirty and grimy as well.   I haven't fished the river since the spill, 25 years ago. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thu, Dec 22, 2016 10:45 am Subject: [S-Trains] Banana cars & railroad sonds   Just in case others don’t realize it, Chris and I are pretty good “group” friends, so we can (and do) fun each other once in a while, thus the “blasphemy” line. The conversation though, made me recall a conversation with a local Oroville man who lived across the feather river from town. The river makes a 90 degree turn around the northwest end of town, and there’s a fairly high bluff on the “other” side of the river, This area is known as Thermolito and had houses and olive orchards when he was a kid. The rail yard and roundhouse were south-of town.  He mentioned to me that when he was a kid, the sounds of the steam engines switching the yards, making up trains to go up the Feather River canyon was a constant background noise, clanking of cars being coupled, whistle signals, exhaust barks, etc. We tend to forget such things. My mom told me that she couldn’t keep a picture straight on the wall with the steam engines pulling & pushing trains up the Sacramento River Canyon in Dunsmuir—and we were across the river from the tracks and uphill from them too. The Mallets (Cab-Forwards) were the worst, they just shook the place. Also, it was hard to keep things white on the clotheslines! No wonder more folks were aware of the railroad—you couldn’t miss it in everyday life. Since I grew up in Dunsmuir, I heard them daily, and where I live now, there are no tracks and I miss that sound; when I go back to the family home for a visit, it’s one of the things that relaxes me. Hey, it’s almost Christmas day! I hope you have a wonderful one! Run ‘em if ya got ‘em! David Dewey

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78633	From: Alan Smith	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Old Versus New ?????

Turning back time IS NOT all as bad as some seem to believe. I’m 75 years old and these OLD  engines, from My era are still running and fixable for the most part.   Yes,  they can be fickle and most if NOT all the problems, related to the old technology can be solved by updating the direction control by installing a Dahlee unit. They also make Sound boards that should satisfy most any railroader.  (so I’m told) .  The OLD engines were built tough with children in mind as the players.  NOW, think about it for a second before U jump in MY (*&^.    All the new engines are much more fickle than the old ones, Sure they have more details and trinkets.  However, they are NOT built to take a lick-in and get on Tick-in.  I have heard more stories from my good friends about having problems with the new Lionel stuff and in some cases the factory boys have a there hands full getting them to work or can’t fix them either ( So, Im told).  They WILL NOT be running in 60 years from now.  To kick start the conversation: Recent banter about the smoke not being able to be shut off is an easy fix by adding a Mini switch under the overhang of the steamers cab  (.099ç) item. Easy as Pie and almost invisible. Adding a Can motor solves the motor issue that many find troublesome. Adding L.E.D.s’  brings new life to the old solders and brings with it a great deal of pleasure and smiles to the person making the upgrade. The old  Engines ( those Plastic model in particular) can be renovated into some very interesting engines.  ( by researching the old steam era engines there are more varieties that U can shale a stick at).  Gilbert just touched the surface in his production to what actually ran on rails. Gilbert focused on most of the eastern arena of Railroads.  Never really produced many Vander or semi-Vander tenders. {332 thru 336 for the most part}   Western rails used more oil than coal  as it was easier to obtain.   The Diesels were never much to stir the imagination of young minds  Or even old minds.  They “ Hum” and that is about the extent of mental excitement.   During most train shows the excitement stems around steam engines and young-ins will follow them around a layout with wonder in their eyes.  The only time I have seen a real smile is when a Diesel passenger consist is rigged to play the “City of New Orleans” while rounding the layout .  THAT IS mental stimulation. OK  —- now Jump on me with your spurs .  Old Alan on “ahia”  ( to borrow a word from Stumpy)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78634	From: racin510	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Prices Falling

I fully enjoy running the 'real' stuff, but a lot of it depends on your ability to tune them back to factory spec, or at least close. It seems the 1954 and later engines run with less issues than the earlier ones, due to those small steps in engineering that always made them better. For just putting on the track and letting her loose you can't beat a good ole 295 Pacific. I too love the SIT's but do find them much more labor intensive to run than any of the later ones due to inferior electrical pickup and their added current draw along with the fact they were run to death in those years [or should have been]. That said I am looking forward to my new Flyer Chief Northern from Charles Roe for Christmas to go with the Berk [which has proven bullet proof], Mikado, Challenger and Y-3. Run & Enjoy em all! Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78635	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????

Alan,   I was responsible for some of the banter; so perhaps I can clarify. The major part of the pickup problems in the post war Gilbert locos is the excessive current draw. I have been installing can motors in older model locomotives for close to 40 years.   I carefully monitor current draw during the process.   With a new can motor the 4-6-2s were still drawing 1300 milliamps of which the motor is only about 200 milliamps.   The smoke unit is the major current draw; lowering the current draw keeps the pickup wheels  cleaner and gives more reliable pickup,  Switching the smoke unit off, using LED headlights (and car lights) and a new can motor can reduce current draw 90%.  Using solid rail N/S track  will also help, as will motor flywheels.  The final step would be nickle silver tender wheels. I use rectified DC for track power in a variety of gauges, it works fine for the original AC motors although when I install a DC can motor I remove the troublesome reversing solenoid mechanism and use a standard DC reversing switch to control direction.  I like to double head power units which is simple with DC models but was always a pain with AC models. My father hated 3rd rail track (he came from a real railroad family) so choosing Flyer was an easy  family choice.   Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Alan Smith alansmith@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thu, Dec 22, 2016 6:18 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Old Versus New ?????   Turning back time IS NOT all as bad as some seem to believe. I’m 75 years old and these OLD  engines, from My era are still running and fixable for the most part.   Yes,  they can be fickle and most if NOT all the problems, related to the old technology can be solved by updating the direction control by installing a Dahlee unit. They also make Sound boards that should satisfy most any railroader.  (so I’m told) .  The OLD engines were built tough with children in mind as the players.  NOW, think about it for a second before U jump in MY (*&^.    All the new engines are much more fickle than the old ones, Sure they have more details and trinkets.  However, they are NOT built to take a lick-in and get on Tick-in.  I have heard more stories from my good friends about having problems with the new Lionel stuff and in some cases the factory boys have a there hands full getting them to work or can’t fix them either ( So, Im told).  They WILL NOT be running in 60 years from now.  To kick start the conversation: Recent banter about the smoke not being able to be shut off is an easy fix by adding a Mini switch under the overhang of the steamers cab  (.099ç) item. Easy as Pie and almost invisible. Adding a Can motor solves the motor issue that many find troublesome. Adding L.E.D.s’  brings new life to the old solders and brings with it a great deal of pleasure and smiles to the person making the upgrade. The old  Engines ( those Plastic model in particular) can be renovated into some very interesting engines.  ( by researching the old steam era engines there are more varieties that U can shale a stick at).  Gilbert just touched the surface in his production to what actually ran on rails. Gilbert focused on most of the eastern arena of Railroads.  Never really produced many Vander or semi-Vander tenders. {332 thru 336 for the most part}   Western rails used more oil than coal  as it was easier to obtain.   The Diesels were never much to stir the imagination of young minds  Or even old minds.  They “ Hum” and that is about the extent of mental excitement.   During most train shows the excitement stems around steam engines and young-ins will follow them around a layout with wonder in their eyes.  The only time I have seen a real smile is when a Diesel passenger consist is rigged to play the “City of New Orleans” while rounding the layout .  THAT IS mental stimulation. OK  —- now Jump on me with your spurs .  Old Alan on “ahia”  ( to borrow a word from Stumpy)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78636	From: racin510	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Kind of fun to look at this layout; note the Seaboard Coal Tower is placed up their on the hill backwards from how it should operate. I think for sure an operational display layout. Only the factory would put that big American Flyer sign up for all to see. And there is the lack of cross over switches between tracks, which most operators would want to incorporate. This would have had to have been in a big department store I would think. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78637	From: snstrains	Date: 12/22/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????

I'm going to jump on you Alan.........Your band wagon that is....   Steve Blackburn Boise, Idaho   In a message dated 12/22/2016 7:18:10 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   Turning back time IS NOT all as bad as some seem to believe. I’m 75 years old and these OLD  engines, from My era are still running and fixable for the most part.   Yes,  they can be fickle and most if NOT all the problems, related to the old technology can be solved by updating the direction control by installing a Dahlee unit. They also make Sound boards that should satisfy most any railroader.  (so I’m told) .  The OLD engines were built tough with children in mind as the players.  NOW, think about it for a second before U jump in MY (*&^.    All the new engines are much more fickle than the old ones, Sure they have more details and trinkets.  However, they are NOT built to take a lick-in and get on Tick-in.  I have heard more stories from my good friends about having problems with the new Lionel stuff and in some cases the factory boys have a there hands full getting them to work or can’t fix them either ( So, Im told).  They WILL NOT be running in 60 years from now.  To kick start the conversation: Recent banter about the smoke not being able to be shut off is an easy fix by adding a Mini switch under the overhang of the steamers cab  (.099ç) item. Easy as Pie and almost invisible. Adding a Can motor solves the motor issue that many find troublesome. Adding L.E.D.s’  brings new life to the old solders and brings with it a great deal of pleasure and smiles to the person making the upgrade. The old  Engines ( those Plastic model in particular) can be renovated into some very interesting engines.  ( by researching the old steam era engines there are more varieties that U can shale a stick at).  Gilbert just touched the surface in his production to what actually ran on rails. Gilbert focused on most of the eastern arena of Railroads.  Never really produced many Vander or semi-Vander tenders. {332 thru 336 for the most part}   Western rails used more oil than coal  as it was easier to obtain.   The Diesels were never much to stir the imagination of young minds  Or even old minds.  They “ Hum” and that is about the extent of mental excitement.   During most train shows the excitement stems around steam engines and young-ins will follow them around a layout with wonder in their eyes.  The only time I have seen a real smile is when a Diesel passenger consist is rigged to play the “City of New Orleans” while rounding the layout .  THAT IS mental stimulation. OK  —- now Jump on me with your spurs .  Old Alan on “ahia”  ( to borrow a word from Stumpy)

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78638	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

My first thought about this layout was perhaps it was from the Miami Hall of Science, that was run by A.C.'s friend Leroy Jahn, another magician.  That is the only one of the 4 Halls of Science that hasn't seemed to have left any photos behind.   There are photos of New York, Chicago and Washington, but never any from Miami.   Does anyone have any memories of that Hall of Science or has anyone seen photos of it? Dale Smith On 12/22/2016 7:43 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Kind of fun to look at this layout; note the Seaboard Coal Tower is placed up their on the hill backwards from how it should operate. I think for sure an operational display layout. Only the factory would put that big American Flyer sign up for all to see. And there is the lack of cross over switches between tracks, which most operators would want to incorporate. This would have had to have been in a big department store I would think. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78639	From: beebear	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Old Versus New ?????

Alan   I think the reason so many people and children follow the steam engines around the track may be because of train pictures they’ve seen. Most train pictures show giant steam engines billowing out huge clouds of black smoke. When you see them in real life you see the same thing along with each engineer’s signature whistle sounds. Then there are all the drive rods moving and steam shooting out, making people wonder how that all works. Most of the train rides around the country are commonly driven by steam.   With a diesel, you basically see a long box on wheels …. nothing impressive to see there.   I will add to your list by saying :  adding the first DCC controller, roof top flashing light and can motor to my chopped down little switcher diesel and see it pull a few cars down the track was a great joy and accomplishment  to me.   Seeing my layout start taking shape after 40 years of my trains sitting in storage boxes is inspiring.   The look in the eyes of my 3 year old grandson as he sees the trains move down the short section of track.   With those moments in mind, it doesn’t matter what gauge you have or if it’s old or new, just to see that you made it run for the first time again is wonderful.   John Frankforther   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, December 22, 2016 8:36 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Old Versus New ?????     Turning back time IS NOT all as bad as some seem to believe.   I’m 75 years old and these OLD  engines, from My era are still running and fixable for the most part.   Yes,  they can be fickle and most if NOT all the problems, related to the old technology can be solved by updating the direction control by installing a Dahlee unit. They also make Sound boards that should satisfy most any railroader.  (so I’m told) .  The OLD engines were built tough with children in mind as the players.  NOW, think about it for a second before U jump in MY (*&^.    All the new engines are much more fickle than the old ones, Sure they have more details and trinkets.  However, they are NOT built to take a lick-in and get on Tick-in.  I have heard more stories from my good friends about having problems with the new Lionel stuff and in some cases the factory boys have a there hands full getting them to work or can’t fix them either ( So, Im told).  They WILL NOT be running in 60 years from now.    To kick start the conversation: Recent banter about the smoke not being able to be shut off is an easy fix by adding a Mini switch under the overhang of the steamers cab  (.099ç) item. Easy as Pie and almost invisible. Adding a Can motor solves the motor issue that many find troublesome. Adding L.E.D.s’  brings new life to the old solders and brings with it a great deal of pleasure and smiles to the person making the upgrade. The old  Engines ( those Plastic model in particular) can be renovated into some very interesting engines.  ( by researching the old steam era engines there are more varieties that U can shale a stick at).  Gilbert just touched the surface in his production to what actually ran on rails. Gilbert focused on most of the eastern arena of Railroads.  Never really produced many Vander or semi-Vander tenders. {332 thru 336 for the most part}   Western rails used more oil than coal  as it was easier to obtain.     The Diesels were never much to stir the imagination of young minds  Or even old minds.  They “ Hum” and that is about the extent of mental excitement.   During most train shows the excitement stems around steam engines and young-ins will follow them around a layout with wonder in their eyes.    The only time I have seen a real smile is when a Diesel passenger consist is rigged to play the “City of New Orleans” while rounding the layout .  THAT IS mental stimulation.     OK  —- now Jump on me with your spurs .    Old Alan on “ahia”  ( to borrow a word from Stumpy)   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78640	From: mrstumpy50	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Prices and Old vs. New

I haven't been on the computer for a few days, so I'm trying to "catch up."  Are prices on the older Flyer S gauge stuff going down?  Well, yes, but as pointed out this depends on condition and rarety.  No surprise there.   Common or worn items are going down faster than "good" stuff, but lack of demand is forcing those down slowly too.    As older collectors sell out of the hobby or pass away, some really good items are coming back on the market.  Some retain their value, many are selling lower.  Again, the demand is no longer there.  I also have felt for a LONG time that ever upward spiraling prices created a value "bubble" that has burst, much like the Real Estate "bubble that popped in 2007-08.  At some point too many people were frozen out of collecting and went elsewhere.  Most never came back. Toy collecting has never paid as well as the Stock Market and rarely as well as a Certificate of Deposit or IRA. We followed the old adage "Collect it only if you like it, not for some unknown future value" at the hobby shop. When it comes to "New vs, Old," I think this is a matter of individual taste and why you're into toy trains.  The new stuff is, literally, stuffed with "all the bells and whistles" and does some fantastic things.  But it is ridiculously expensive and quality control of many items is not what it should be for the price.  Most of the new stuff is virtually "non-repairable" compared to the old Flyer which is still fixable and running after more than half a century!    As most of you know, I have been buying locomotives from junk boxes and rebuilding them for over 15 years and with few exceptions this is FAR less costly than buying complete engines.  (Which, not being financially "well off" is the reason I started doing it to begin with!)  I put a can motor in all of them and don't use the problematic old reverse unit, just run straight DC power.   I guess this is "having both ways" as to new and old!  I doubt that today's costly and high tech stuff will be around in fifty years, let alone finding the circuit boards to make them run again.  On the other hand, since I won't be around in another fifty years, why would I give a damn?  I doubt the entire hobby will be around by 2067 anyway. "You only go around once" says the old adage about life.  I'm having fun the way I do things, and you should too!  In the end, there is no right or wrong way to "play with trains," just what suits you! Stumpy Stone In "Ahia"

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78641	From: poniaj	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Scott, I've had a bit of success with original Flyer track by rebending the curves to a larger radius.  It takes a bit of careful coaxing by hand to keep the track in gauge, and some trimming on the outside rail.  Work the rails just slightly one at a time, and the results will be worth it.  I draw the radius on a piece of plywood or cardboard to match the radius I need, then form the rails to match.  Used Flyer track is quite cheap, especially the curved pieces, so if you mess up, there's more out there.  But it's pretty rugged and it takes a lot of punishment to ruin it completely.  Go for it! The Gilbert factory had it much easier since they made their rails there, they could take a LONG section of rail (before it was cut to length) and bend it to whatever radius they needed, then install the crossties.  The rails were probably rolled from sheet metal in a continuous rolling process, then cut to the 10:" standard length, much like the aluminum extrusions used for the early streamlined passenger cars.  The rubber roadbed, being rubber, could be flexed enough to conform to the track.  I would immagine that the process for hte track was similar to the seamless gutters that people have on their houses, but on a MUCH small scale.  One sixty-fourth, of course...  ;>) Just my two centavos... Merry Christmas guys! Jerry Poniatowski Wayne, Michigan

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78642	From: ljcamp2	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I have seen this picture before, I believe it was in an old Classic Toy Trains article. This may be a layout from a large department store in St Louis that always had a large display. Notice all the toys in the upper left hand corner not made by Gilbert such as the tricycle,dolls, football gear, Hopalong Cassidy, army truck, baseball game and many others.  This display was definitely in a department store.    Larry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78643	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds

Attachments : Ken,    Your Grandfather probably knew Guy Dunscomb then—rats, that’s only old-time engineer’s name that comes to me right now, Carl Nelson was the local special agent. Sounds depended on where you were in town, Our family’s place is in North Dunsmuir, just north of the ballpark, and yes, the truck noise is pretty constant. I suspect the lava cap the family house was on telegraphed the engine pounding as the locomotives bit into the rail starting up the grade to Mount Shasta. You should go back up, the river has recovered nicely and the fishing is again great—sometimes the catching is good too! As for the new diesels, well, the Alco PAs could smoke up a storm! David

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78644	From: paul	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Ok, I'll bite and show my lack of knowledge. did Gilbert build the display layouts and send them out to major retailers for assembly or were they built locally each year? were they torn down and stored each year and revamped to display new accessories? here in Dayton Ohio there was at least one major retailer who put on a big display/layout for Christmas, I remember drooling several years in a row, probably 1954-1957 or 8. if Gilbert did the basics, were there many alike among the larger towns or was each different? the one here in town had a lot of work put into it each year, it had hills and valleys, well painted mountains and tunnels, it was impressive and as I remember different each year. this store was smack in the middle of down town and noted for it's animated Christmas street level window displays as well, but the trains were upstairs in the toy department.  I don't know if they also handled 3 rail and/or H O stuff, Santa had brought me a 307 and set, so I only had eyes for S gauge Flyer. one year I got the 336 and 10 or 11 cars right off the layout, learned later that it was discounted and sold because it was constantly derailed, pulled and replaced by something lighter and more reliable. in about 1962 I caught a neighborhood hobby shop going out of business, bought a 718 from their small layout that had been converted to knuckles, I'd hate to guess how many mail bags were tossed out behind the 336, it was my favorite, maybe the rocket launcher came in a close second, or the fast little docksider, even the 742 reversing handcar was fun but it only reversed faithfully one direction, the other direction pushed the bar too far and I had to manually tap it to run again.  Paul Rinehart On 12/23/2016 11:40 AM, ljcamp1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I have seen this picture before, I believe it was in an old Classic Toy Trains article. This may be a layout from a large department store in St Louis that always had a large display. Notice all the toys in the upper left hand corner not made by Gilbert such as the tricycle,dolls, football gear, Hopalong Cassidy, army truck, baseball game and many others.  This display was definitely in a department store.    Larry  Posted by: ljcamp1@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78645	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds

Attachments : David,   I think Dunscomb worked out to SF HQ.  He probably knew fireman Dick Murdock who was also writing for the Dunsmuir News.  I had an uncle who just hated his stories about fishing and railroading in Dunsmuir.  Murdock may have fired for my grandfather.  My uncle was a brakeman at the time. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 23, 2016 12:58 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Banana cars & railroad sounds   Ken,    Your Grandfather probably knew Guy Dunscomb then—rats, that’s only old-time engineer’s name that comes to me right now, Carl Nelson was the local special agent. Sounds depended on where you were in town, Our family’s place is in North Dunsmuir, just north of the ballpark, and yes, the truck noise is pretty constant. I suspect the lava cap the family house was on telegraphed the engine pounding as the locomotives bit into the rail starting up the grade to Mount Shasta. You should go back up, the river has recovered nicely and the fishing is again great—sometimes the catching is good too! As for the new diesels, well, the Alco PAs could smoke up a storm! David

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78646	From: americanflyer	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Hi larry i think you are right i also think it may have been from chicago area thanks stan Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "ljcamp1@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Date: 12/23/16 11:40 AM (GMT-05:00) To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Help identify this layout.   I have seen this picture before, I believe it was in an old Classic Toy Trains article. This may be a layout from a large department store in St Louis that always had a large display. Notice all the toys in the upper left hand corner not made by Gilbert such as the tricycle,dolls, football gear, Hopalong Cassidy, army truck, baseball game and many others.  This display was definitely in a department store.    Larry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78647	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

It was actually a combination of both.  On the americanflyerdisplays.org website, the section "Factory Display Layouts" covers the ready made layouts shipped to the store in ready to assemble form.   The larger stores had a custom layout built, such as the layouts covered under Department Store Layouts.    Examples included the Sibley layout, the F.A.O. Schwarz layout and others.  Even those were very similar, if not identical.   Sibley and the layout used in the filming of the Boy's Railroad Club TV show were quite similar in size and features.   FAO Schwarz and Jordan Marsh were elongated versions of pretty much the same layout.  I know that the Sibley layout was built by factory employees because they signed their names on the bottom, but other layouts could have been built by independent contractors working for Gilbert.  I also believe that some of the factory layouts were made by contractors also. An interesting point that is demonstrated on the F.A.O. Schwarz Layout is the presence of HO trains on an upper level.  On the photos I have seen of those layouts, only the F.A.O. Schwarz layout actually shows HO trains running.  The HO track is clearly visible on the Boys Railroad Club layout though.  See this link. http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/brrc_gallery/at_controls.htm  I believe that all 4 of those layouts originally had HO track and trains, but that the track was removed after 1950, when Gilbert stopped marketing HO trains for the duration of the Korean War due to the lack of permanent magnet material for the motors.  The photos of the Sibley and Jordan Marsh layouts were taken after that track was removed, probably after the 1950 Christmas season. Dale On 12/23/2016 1:01 PM, paul dilly@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Ok, I'll bite and show my lack of knowledge. did Gilbert build the display layouts and send them out to major retailers for assembly or were they built locally each year? were they torn down and stored each year and revamped to display new accessories? here in Dayton Ohio there was at least one major retailer who put on a big display/layout for Christmas, I remember drooling several years in a row, probably 1954-1957 or 8. if Gilbert did the basics, were there many alike among the larger towns or was each different? the one here in town had a lot of work put into it each year, it had hills and valleys, well painted mountains and tunnels, it was impressive and as I remember different each year. this store was smack in the middle of down town and noted for it's animated Christmas street level window displays as well, but the trains were upstairs in the toy department.  I don't know if they also handled 3 rail and/or H O stuff, Santa had brought me a 307 and set, so I only had eyes for S gauge Flyer. one year I got the 336 and 10 or 11 cars right off the layout, learned later that it was discounted and sold because it was constantly derailed, pulled and replaced by something lighter and more reliable. in about 1962 I caught a neighborhood hobby shop going out of business, bought a 718 from their small layout that had been converted to knuckles, I'd hate to guess how many mail bags were tossed out behind the 336, it was my favorite, maybe the rocket launcher came in a close second, or the fast little docksider, even the 742 reversing handcar was fun but it only reversed faithfully one direction, the other direction pushed the bar too far and I had to manually tap it to run again.  Paul Rinehart On 12/23/2016 11:40 AM, ljcamp1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I have seen this picture before, I believe it was in an old Classic Toy Trains article. This may be a layout from a large department store in St Louis that always had a large display. Notice all the toys in the upper left hand corner not made by Gilbert such as the tricycle,dolls, football gear, Hopalong Cassidy, army truck, baseball game and many others.  This display was definitely in a department store.    Larry  Posted by: ljcamp1@...

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78648	From: dewoods1972	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Help with AF 19B Transformer

I bought an AF 19B transformer at an auction.  It appeared to be in good shape, so I took a chance. I have two questions: 1 - Is it possible to glue bakelite.  Bakelite material for a mounting hole broke away on the control knob.  I noticed that the dead man handle  retaining pin was loose so I partially disassembled the case to remove the control knob to install the two 4-40 hex nuts that were missing.  When I was reassembling the transformer and was tightening one of the screws on the control knob the bakelite broke away.  Any suggestions on how to repair the mounting hole.  I have the piece that broke away.  Can it be glued?  Should I try to drill and tap the remaining bakelite and use a longer screw?  Any other ideas? 2 - I am not sure how the Carbon Roller Contact Arm is supposed to mate up with the contact lever.  As found, the carbon wheel continuously rides on the transformer windings.  I had thought that it would only make contact when the shaft that is connected to the contact lever is pushed down using the dead man handle.  I have looked at the AF 19B Parts List and Diagram and repair instructions, but I can't figure it out. Dave Woods

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78649	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

I don't think the other non Gilbert items rule out the Miami Hall of Science.  Leroy Jahn sold a lot of different toy items in his store which was essentially a general toy store.  Gilbert let him call it a "Hall of Science" because of their friendship and because it served his purpose of tying in his manufacturing base with a retail base.  The odds probably favor your guess, unless someone can remember something about the Miami Store that could connect this layout to it. If there was an article in CTT, I should be able to find it (unless it appeared after 2014), as I have the Complete CD that goes up to 2014.  If you can remember anything more about the article, please pass it on to me so I can perhaps find it. Dale On 12/23/2016 8:40 AM, ljcamp1@... [S-Trains] wrote:   I have seen this picture before, I believe it was in an old Classic Toy Trains article. This may be a layout from a large department store in St Louis that always had a large display. Notice all the toys in the upper left hand corner not made by Gilbert such as the tricycle,dolls, football gear, Hopalong Cassidy, army truck, baseball game and many others.  This display was definitely in a department store.    Larry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78650	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

J-B Weld. With plastic boiler threaded holes victimized by a hammer handed repair person, I have also used J-B Weld to hold a threaded insert in place. The Deadman handle is basically an on-off switch, the roller makes continuous contact, even when the handle is in the off position. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: dewoods@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 23, 2016 7:14 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Help with AF 19B Transformer   I bought an AF 19B transformer at an auction.  It appeared to be in good shape, so I took a chance. I have two questions: 1 - Is it possible to glue bakelite.  Bakelite material for a mounting hole broke away on the control knob.  I noticed that the dead man handle  retaining pin was loose so I partially disassembled the case to remove the control knob to install the two 4-40 hex nuts that were missing.  When I was reassembling the transformer and was tightening one of the screws on the control knob the bakelite broke away.  Any suggestions on how to repair the mounting hole.  I have the piece that broke away.  Can it be glued?  Should I try to drill and tap the remaining bakelite and use a longer screw?  Any other ideas? 2 - I am not sure how the Carbon Roller Contact Arm is supposed to mate up with the c ontact lever.  As found, the carbon wheel continuously rides on the transformer windings.  I had thought that it would only make contact when the shaft that is connected to the contact lever is pushed down using the dead man handle.  I have looked at the AF 19B Parts List and Diagram and repair instructions, but I can't figure it out. Dave Woods

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78651	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

If the transformer is 5-18 volts it is a good candidate for conversion to DC. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: dewoods@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 23, 2016 7:14 pm Subject: [S-Trains] Help with AF 19B Transformer   I bought an AF 19B transformer at an auction.  It appeared to be in good shape, so I took a chance. I have two questions: 1 - Is it possible to glue bakelite.  Bakelite material for a mounting hole broke away on the control knob.  I noticed that the dead man handle  retaining pin was loose so I partially disassembled the case to remove the control knob to install the two 4-40 hex nuts that were missing.  When I was reassembling the transformer and was tightening one of the screws on the control knob the bakelite broke away.  Any suggestions on how to repair the mounting hole.  I have the piece that broke away.  Can it be glued?  Should I try to drill and tap the remaining bakelite and use a longer screw?  Any other ideas? 2 - I am not sure how the Carbon Roller Contact Arm is supposed to mate up with the c ontact lever.  As found, the carbon wheel continuously rides on the transformer windings.  I had thought that it would only make contact when the shaft that is connected to the contact lever is pushed down using the dead man handle.  I have looked at the AF 19B Parts List and Diagram and repair instructions, but I can't figure it out. Dave Woods

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78652	From: R G	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

JB weld and super glue can be used to repair some breaks in bakelite. However you may be able to fine a replacement control knob. I had a similar problem with the two screws that hold the knob to the transformer. The screw holes broke apart. I used JB weld to fix the broken areas.  It worked but eventually I found a replacement knob at a train show.  On Friday, December 23, 2016 10:14 PM, "dewoods@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I bought an AF 19B transformer at an auction.  It appeared to be in good shape, so I took a chance. I have two questions: 1 - Is it possible to glue bakelite.  Bakelite material for a mounting hole broke away on the control knob.  I noticed that the dead man handle  retaining pin was loose so I partially disassembled the case to remove the control knob to install the two 4-40 hex nuts that were missing.  When I was reassembling the transformer and was tightening one of the screws on the control knob the bakelite broke away.  Any suggestions on how to repair the mounting hole.  I have the piece that broke away.  Can it be glued?  Should I try to drill and tap the remaining bakelite and use a longer screw?  Any other ideas? 2 - I am not sure how the Carbon Roller Contact Arm is supposed to mate up with the contact lever.  As found, the carbon wheel continuously rides on the transformer windings.  I had thought that it would only make contact when the shaft that is connected to the contact lever is pushed down using the dead man handle.  I have looked at the AF 19B Parts List and Diagram and repair instructions, but I can't figure it out. Dave Woods

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78653	From: racin510	Date: 12/23/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

Carbon rollers are continually on the windings; contact, off/on, is by the handle, up/down, only. Try JB Weld, sometimes it give enough strength for a repair. Most epoxy's won't. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78654	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: 19B transformer repair

J-B Weld is about the only way I know to repair that, but you’ll have to be careful with it. The metal disk can cut into the mounts.  And, yes, the carbon roller should lift off the transformer when the handle is raised—there is a coil spring on top of the case and under the turret that raises the roller lever. It doesn’t move far, but enough to break the connection. When I put the screw back in after the repair, I use a soldering iron to heat the screw so it can ‘melt’ instead of ‘cut’ the new threads in.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78655	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

On 12/23/2016 2:01 PM, paul dilly@... [S-Trains] wrote: > > > Ok, I'll bite and show my lack of knowledge. did Gilbert build the > display layouts and send them out to major retailers for assembly or > were they built locally each year? were they torn down and stored each > year and revamped to display new accessories? OK, here's my wild guess on some of these displays. Many were built on 4.5 X 5 pieces of framed plywood and had the grass, bushes, track and such already glued\nailed. The buildings and operating accessories were packed in their separate boxes. All the store had to do was a minimal setup of the boards, hook the wires together underneath to the fahnestock connections to bridge them together and set the buildings and accessories in place. How do I know this? It's because I have the No 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 foot display that my dad bought around 1954. It was displayed at the Phelps Dodge Mercantile store in Morenci AZ. It came home as two 4.5 X 5 foot board sections that bolt together and the accessories were all in their original boxes. The flyer from Gilbert suggests that the retailer could display the set then sell the accessories after Christmas for a total of $182.90 Here is the text from that brochure: No. 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 Foot Display Ideal for store window or toy department ... sturdy, all-wood con- struction ... completely wired and ready to set up ... more than 66 feet of track plus numerous accessories .. when you sell access- ories at list (below) your investment is returned: layout can then be sold to model railroad customer. Net price, F.O.B. New Haven: $182.90 They then went on to list the selling price of the accessories which came to $182.90 so basically selling the board was the profit after breaking even on selling the accessories. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78656	From: paul	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Dale, thank you for the explanation, it is mostly as I kind of suspected. I was thinking a new display each year but that would cost a fortune and be counter productive. I figured that the layouts might be altered each year to display new accessories and such, but didn't consider that ACG might have sent plans or even new sections for updating. guess that's why I'm not the CEO of any company, I'd do things the hard way.  craftsmen could make changes to last year's product easily. I see now too why folks are saying "it's close to ?????'s display but not exact."  things like longer, wider radius curves would make sense to be made centrally rather than 30 or 40 stores or areas building their own jigs to produce mirror trackage but still allowing a bit of local license would keep them from being identical. I have loved following this thread and seeing different people date it by their knowledge of what was available and what was not, I've learned a bunch watching he detectives.  Paul Rinehart On 12/23/2016 8:44 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote:   It was actually a combination of both.  On the americanflyerdisplays.org website, the section "Factory Display Layouts" covers the ready made layouts shipped to the store in ready to assemble form.   The larger stores had a custom layout built, such as the layouts covered under Department Store Layouts.    Examples included the Sibley layout, the F.A.O. Schwarz layout and others.  Even those were very similar, if not identical.   Sibley and the layout used in the filming of the Boy's Railroad Club TV show were quite similar in size and features.   FAO Schwarz and Jordan Marsh were elongated versions of pretty much the same layout.  I know that the Sibley layout was built by factory employees because they signed their names on the bottom, but other layouts could have been built by independent contractors working for Gilbert.  I also believe that some of the factory layouts were made by contractors also. An interesting point that is demonstrated on the F.A.O. Schwarz Layout is the presence of HO trains on an upper level.  On the photos I have seen of those layouts, only the F.A.O. Schwarz layout actually shows HO trains running.  The HO track is clearly visible on the Boys Railroad Club layout though.  See this link. http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/promotional_layouts/brrc_gallery/at_controls.htm  I believe that all 4 of those layouts originally had HO track and trains, but that the track was removed after 1950, when Gilbert stopped marketing HO trains for the duration of the Korean War due to the lack of permanent magnet material for the motors.  The photos of the Sibley and Jordan Marsh layouts were taken after that track was removed, probably after the 1950 Christmas season. Dale

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78657	From: Dave	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair

Thanks for the tips   What kind of JB Weld should I use for the Bakelite repair. There is a plethora of types. I have some of the putty type but I have also seen the 2 part epoxy type in tubes. Also there are types for metal or plastic.  Sent from Dave's iPhone On Dec 24, 2016, at 1:43 AM, 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   J-B Weld is about the only way I know to repair that, but you’ll have to be careful with it. The metal disk can cut into the mounts.  And, yes, the carbon roller should lift off the transformer when the handle is raised—there is a coil spring on top of the case and under the turret that raises the roller lever. It doesn’t move far, but enough to break the connection. When I put the screw back in after the repair, I use a soldering iron to heat the screw so it can ‘melt’ instead of ‘cut’ the new threads in.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78658	From: paul	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

George, thank you too, this option would work great for hobby shops and venues that either didn't have room or didn't choose to store a display year after year. each year they could have a fresh new and different layout just by purchasing one from the factory with a different number. this goes more along my thinking but I hadn't considered that the catalog that stores bought out of might have several options, some carried one year to the next with a couple of new ones thrown into the mix or even just add on or replacement new sections for a previous display. were there a Gilbert sales rep traveling store to store, he could help keep locals from having exactly what the other fellow across town had, creating a need for customers to cross shop or at least go see more than one store's wares. hopefully that spread the sales and dollars around some. it also explains why my Santa mother was able to afford the 336 and set one year, it was likely boxed up and sold as a discounted demonstrator about the 23rd or 24th of December.  all with the ego boost and bragging rights that it "came right of ????'s Christmas display."   Paul Rinehart On 12/24/2016 11:03 AM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK, here's my wild guess on some of these displays. Many were built on 4.5 X 5 pieces of framed plywood and had the grass, bushes, track and such already glued\nailed. The buildings and operating accessories were packed in their separate boxes. All the store had to do was a minimal setup of the boards, hook the wires together underneath to the fahnestock connections to bridge them together and set the buildings and accessories in place. How do I know this? It's because I have the No 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 foot display that my dad bought around 1954. It was displayed at the Phelps Dodge Mercantile store in Morenci AZ. It came home as two 4.5 X 5 foot board sections that bolt together and the accessories were all in their original boxes. The flyer from Gilbert suggests that the retailer could display the set then sell the accessories after Christmas for a total of $182.90 Here is the text from that brochure: No. 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 Foot Display Ideal for store window or toy department ... sturdy, all-wood con- struction ... completely wired and ready to set up ... more than 66 feet of track plus numerous accessories .. when you sell access- ories at list (below) your investment is returned: layout can then be sold to model railroad customer. Net price, F.O.B. New Haven: $182.90 They then went on to list the selling price of the accessories which came to $182.90 so basically selling the board was the profit after breaking even on selling the accessories. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78659	From: SnSTrains@...	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Merry Christmas

Merry Christmas and a blessed new year to all of you folks that have what it takes to run trains on the correct number of rails.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78660	From: snstrains	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Christmas wishes

Merry Christmas and a blessed new year to all of you folks that have what it takes to run trains on the correct number of rails.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78661	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Paul, You mentioned the catalogs the stores ordered from.  Most, if not all of them, are available on my website, at http://www.americanflyerdisplays.org/catalogs/index-catalogs.htm If you look through these catalogs, the track plans were very similar from year to year.  What did change every year were the accessories featured.  All a dealer needed to do was sub in the new accessory for the old, for example an animated station for the stockyard.  The really big layouts for the big stores were made by Gilbert staff sent out for the job.  At least one job was done locally though, and that was the layout at the Bon Marche in Seattle.   Maybe their distance from Connecticut was a factor here. Dale On 12/24/2016 8:57 AM, paul dilly@... [S-Trains] wrote:   George, thank you too, this option would work great for hobby shops and venues that either didn't have room or didn't choose to store a display year after year. each year they could have a fresh new and different layout just by purchasing one from the factory with a different number. this goes more along my thinking but I hadn't considered that the catalog that stores bought out of might have several options, some carried one year to the next with a couple of new ones thrown into the mix or even just add on or replacement new sections for a previous display. were there a Gilbert sales rep traveling store to store, he could help keep locals from having exactly what the other fellow across town had, creating a need for customers to cross shop or at least go see more than one store's wares. hopefully that spread the sales and dollars around some. it also explains why my Santa mother was able to afford the 336 and set one year, it was likely boxed up and sold as a discounted demonstrator about the 23rd or 24th of December.  all with the ego boost and bragging rights that it "came right of ????'s Christmas display."   Paul Rinehart On 12/24/2016 11:03 AM, George Cohn gwcohn@... [S-Trains] wrote:   OK, here's my wild guess on some of these displays. Many were built on 4.5 X 5 pieces of framed plywood and had the grass, bushes, track and such already glued\nailed. The buildings and operating accessories were packed in their separate boxes. All the store had to do was a minimal setup of the boards, hook the wires together underneath to the fahnestock connections to bridge them together and set the buildings and accessories in place. How do I know this? It's because I have the No 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 foot display that my dad bought around 1954. It was displayed at the Phelps Dodge Mercantile store in Morenci AZ. It came home as two 4.5 X 5 foot board sections that bolt together and the accessories were all in their original boxes. The flyer from Gilbert suggests that the retailer could display the set then sell the accessories after Christmas for a total of $182.90 Here is the text from that brochure: No. 300 American Flyer 5 X 9 Foot Display Ideal for store window or toy department ... sturdy, all-wood con- struction ... completely wired and ready to set up ... more than 66 feet of track plus numerous accessories .. when you sell access- ories at list (below) your investment is returned: layout can then be sold to model railroad customer. Net price, F.O.B. New Haven: $182.90 They then went on to list the selling price of the accessories which came to $182.90 so basically selling the board was the profit after breaking even on selling the accessories. George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78662	From: Frank Emiro	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes

Lol, your correct. You and your family enjoy a Merry Christmas an a Happy Model Train 🚂 New Year.  Frank.  Sent from my iPhone On Dec 24, 2016, at 12:44 PM, boss31@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:     Merry Christmas and a blessed new year to all of you folks that have what it takes to run trains on the correct number of rails.   Steve Blackburn S-'n-S Trains 3239 N. Pepperwood Dr. Boise, Idaho 83704-4133 208-376-1159 www.snstrains.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78663	From: Bob Iannacone	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes

Attachments : From our family to your family, we wish you many enjoyable hours with toy trains during this Christmas Holiday and wonderful New Year ahead.     Bob This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78664	From: richs009	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair

Dave - I have two suggestions.  Since the turret does get moved when operating the transformer, I'd look at doing something more than just gluing it back together.  If its only the top couple of mm (or so) that broke off and there is enough material remaining to secure a longer screw, I'd do that.  I'd drill out a pilot hole that wasn't too much smaller in diameter than the screw thread OD so you don't risk breaking more of the bakelite (which, at this point is  50+ years old...).  If you decide to epoxy it, I'd use the epoxy liberally and fill the hole as well as the broken edges.  After the epoxy has cured, drill out the pilot hole and, if you can, extend it into the unbroken material so you can use a longer screw - again not too much smaller in diameter than the screw threads. The JB weld epoxy I've used is the two-part epoxy called J-B Kwik.  Its black and works pretty well.  I don't recall if I've used it on bakelite, but it should work.  Make sure with a dry fit the broken piece fits well.  Again, I'd be pretty liberal with the epoxy and make sure it it 'oozes' out of the joint.  Its in a place where neatness doesn't count for much... A previous poster suggested heating the screw to help 'cut' new threads.  I'd be cautious about doing that - I think that requires a more deft touch than I'm willing to risk - especially on old materials.  Dunno how well the epoxy would respond, especially at the joint you've just epoxied.  I think drilling a pilot hole - especially if you can go into unbroken material - would be a better/safer bet and certainly the mechanical strength is more than adequate as long as the bakelite is intact and not fractured from age or abuse. - Rich oops, second suggestion. I'm sure I have seen these turrets on eBay (some time ago) and I suspect folks like Doug Peck, et al. would have one if the above remedy doesn't work.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78665	From: racin510	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Good informative post. Now we know for sure how they did it. So interesting that Gilbert actually wanted the retailer to make profit off the display along with all the sales to be created by the display. Great forward thinking business practice. Great company. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78666	From: racin510	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transformer repair

2-part and give it 24 hours to cure. If you can drill a few little holes into the mating surfaces you will improve the over all strength of the repair as the holes fill with epoxy.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78667	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 25 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78668	From: JFrederick Roberts	Date: 12/24/2016
Subject: Re: Christmas wishes

Attachments : image001-78668.gif Or an outside third rail, or one overhead, MERRY CHRISTMAS, and run'em if you got'em! On Saturday, December 24, 2016 2:59 PM, "'Bob Iannacone' biannaco@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   From our family to your family, we wish you many enjoyable hours with toy trains during this Christmas Holiday and wonderful New Year ahead.     Bob This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78669	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/25/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 25 December 2016

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 25 December 2016 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78670	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/25/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Rick, It was a nice idea in theory, but it didn't always work out that way.  Here is what I said on the website about it, after a bit of research on the subject. Beginning in 1949, Gilbert prepared ready to operate layouts for their dealers use in displaying the latest American Flyer Trains and Accessories.  Many of the changes that took place from year to year were simply the substitution of newly introduced accessories for older accessories.  In some cases the display layout included the trains pictured but in many it did not. The pitch made to dealers was that this was an item that would "liquidate" itself. The dealers were told that they could sell the American Flyer products from the display at list price after the Christmas selling season and then sell the display to a "model railroad hobbyist." In "Flyer Facts" contained in the American Flyer Collectors Column in the July/August 2001 S-Gaugian, Robert Tufts notes that most dealers had to sell the accessories contained in the displays at a discount because they were used merchandise and didn't make a lot of profit on the sale of what was left of the display. Such sales, however, probably account for at least some of the original displays that exist today.  While most of the layouts were produced by the Gilbert Display Department, at least some, especially the early layouts, were produced by subcontractors. Dale On 12/24/2016 4:07 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Good informative post. Now we know for sure how they did it. So interesting that Gilbert actually wanted the retailer to make profit off the display along with all the sales to be created by the display. Great forward thinking business practice. Great company. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78671	From: racin510	Date: 12/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Dale, yea, thinking about it and then looking at the break down shown of the #300 on the display site, I came to conclude there was no way the retailer made money on it, but certainly defrayed a lot of the cost. I had figured that track would come nailed down and go as part of the raw layout [not be considered an accessory], which would be a nice selling point for the base  once the accessories and transformers were gone. It would be a bit easier to sell those two boards with all the track and switches intact and I'm thinking the retailers would have tried to move it this way. Of course some may be smart enough to put it in storage and bring it out next season ready to go, paid for, and just add newer accessories and trains. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78672	From: Dale Smith	Date: 12/26/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

Rick, I think some retailers did put them in storage for the next year because I have seen pictures of displays that were obviously designed for an HO loop on top without the HO track, such as the Jordan Marsh Layout as photographed in Dec 1951, when Gilbert wasn't selling HO.  I am sure it had the HO track in previous years and had been saved.  The FAO Schwarz layout from 49 is virtually identical, but with the HO track.  I also wouldn't put it past some dealers to pry off the track and sell it too.  In a recent auction, there was a 1957 layout that consisted of just the two 4 1/2 by 5 panels bolted together.  It was barely recognizable without the track, but the road pattern was the give away.  One other feature of buying such a layout is that you got the wiring with nice fahnstock clips to which the accessories could be attached, all nicely labeled by the way. Dale On 12/26/2016 2:46 PM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   Dale, yea, thinking about it and then looking at the break down shown of the #300 on the display site, I came to conclude there was no way the retailer made money on it, but certainly defrayed a lot of the cost. I had figured that track would come nailed down and go as part of the raw layout [not be considered an accessory], which would be a nice selling point for the base  once the accessories and transformers were gone. It would be a bit easier to sell those two boards with all the track and switches intact and I'm thinking the retailers would have tried to move it this way. Of course some may be smart enough to put it in storage and bring it out next season ready to go, paid for, and just add newer accessories and trains. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78673	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: 19B transfomer repair

Well not that Christmas day is over and we are back home again, I’ll get back to this transformer repair. J-B weld, regular is stronger than the quick-set version, but it does take a while to cure. I’ve used old soda straws as molds to hold it in place, especially when rebuild steam locomotive frame mounts on plastic boilers. I also use a dremel tool to dress it down, once it has cured. Yes, predrill the hole, but then I still use heat so the screw doesn’t stress the plastic as much—I also use this trick when putting body pins back in the freight cars—that old plastic is much more brittle than it was when new. The ideal thing, though, would be to replace the turret. A longer screw is a good idea too, if there’s enough “meat” in the turret to accept it—I don’t have one apart right now, so I’m going on memory. Another trick, that sometimes works and sometimes doesn’t is to put the screw into position and then add the J-B Weld. When it’s almost cured, heat the screw a bit and then back it out. If you’re lucky, it will leave threads in the hole.  This is a sometimes it works-sometimes it doesn’t and I haven’t done it enough times to figure out why it works when it does! I’ve thought of spraying the screw with PAM to act as a mold release, anyone else tried it? David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78674	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: Re: 19B transfomer repair

David,   There is an anti-seize compound for soldering irons, etc that should work better Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: 'David Dewey' djdewey@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tue, Dec 27, 2016 6:06 am Subject: [S-Trains] 19B transfomer repair   Well not that Christmas day is over and we are back home again, I’ll get back to this transformer repair. J-B weld, regular is stronger than the quick-set version, but it does take a while to cure. I’ve used old soda straws as molds to hold it in place, especially when rebuild steam locomotive frame mounts on plastic boilers. I also use a dremel tool to dress it down, once it has cured. Yes, predrill the hole, but then I still use heat so the screw doesn’t stress the plastic as much—I also use this trick when putting body pins back in the freight cars—that old plastic is much more brittle than it was when new. The ideal thing, though, would be to replace the turret. A longer screw is a good idea too, if there’s enough “meat” in the turret to accept it—I don’t have one apart right now, so I’m going on memory. Another trick, that sometimes works and sometimes doesn’t is to put the screw into position and then add the J-B Weld. When it’s almost cured, heat the screw a bit and then back it out. If you’re lucky, it will leave threads in the hole.  This is a sometimes it works-sometimes it doesn’t and I haven’t done it enough times to figure out why it works when it does! I’ve thought of spraying the screw with PAM to act as a mold release, anyone else tried it? David D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78675	From: George Cohn	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: Re: Help identify this layout.

On 12/26/2016 7:09 PM, Dale Smith dalefsmith@... [S-Trains] wrote: > One other feature of buying such a layout is that you got the wiring > with nice fahnstock clips to which the accessories could be attached, > all nicely labeled by the way. Yep, the accessory positions have the fahnestock clips soldered to the nails going through the board with the wires soldered to the nails on the underside. The cool thing is there is a thin cardboard label stapled to each accessory position with the name and number of the accessory typed on it. Yes I said typed, with an old fashioned manual typewriter, this was long before printed labels. :-) George Cohn

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78676	From: Roger Haag	Date: 12/27/2016
Subject: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS

Hello I am looking for used geared wheelsets for two American Models diesels. So that would be 4 in a set for each engine for a total of 8 geared wheelsets. Maybe there are HI-RAIL sets out there that came with engines that had the desired SCALE -FLANGE sets installed at American Models??? Please contact me off line Thank you Yours in the hobby S Scale man. Roger Haag Sent from my iPhone

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78677	From: attic02	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!

I got an alert tonight from Fed EX about a Charles Ro Shipment.  I ordered the Frisco.  It is being delivered.. I guess I am now into S gauge and american flyer.. Glad I made the switch.. I hope you all had a Very Merry Christmas and may this coming year bring all the best times you deserve.. Ron Petersen A Special Thanks To Doug @ Portlands.. The best .. He really gets it done perfect. Thanks Doug..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78678	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!

Thanks, Ron…….we try !   Yes, the Northerns and the SD70s are shipping. The Frisco and the Milwaukee Northerns have arrived, and we’ve already shipped them out to our customers. The other road names have not arrived here yet, but I would expect them soon.   I believe nearly all of the SD70 road names have arrived. Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2016 12:58 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!     I got an alert tonight from Fed EX about a Charles Ro Shipment.  I ordered the Frisco.  It is being delivered..   I guess I am now into S gauge and american flyer.. Glad I made the switch..   I hope you all had a Very Merry Christmas and may this coming year bring all the best times you deserve..   Ron Petersen   A Special Thanks To Doug @ Port Lines.. The best .. He really gets it done perfect. Thanks Doug..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78679	From: Ray Puls	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS

s scale man You can go to the American Models site and order the wheel sets from them. The cost is not a high, about $5.00 per axle. All you need to do is tell them which type of axles you need and you will have your order in a few days, they are very easy to work with. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78680	From: Roger Haag	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: AMERICAN MODELS HI-RAIL WHEELSETS FOR DIESELS

Hello and thanks.  Great idea. Roger Sent from my iPhone On Dec 28, 2016, at 9:18 AM, Ray Puls rpuls3@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   s scale man You can go to the American Models site and order the wheel sets from them. The cost is not a high, about $5.00 per axle. All you need to do is tell them which type of axles you need and you will have your order in a few days, they are very easy to work with. Ray

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78681	From: biannaco@bellsouth.net	Date: 12/28/2016
Subject: Re: Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!

Sent from my LG Escape2, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone ------ Original message------ From: attic02@... [S-Trains] Date: Wed, Dec 28, 2016 7:11 AM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com; Subject:[S-Trains] Lionel 2016 Northerns Are In!!!   I got an alert tonight from Fed EX about a Charles Ro Shipment.  I ordered the Frisco.  It is being delivered.. I guess I am now into S gauge and american flyer.. Glad I made the switch.. I hope you all had a Very Merry Christmas and may this coming year bring all the best times you deserve.. Ron Petersen A Special Thanks To Doug @ Portlands.. The best .. He really gets it done perfect. Thanks Doug..

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78682	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/29/2016
Subject: PRS Kit For Sale

Attachments : PRS453.3-SAL23315.jpg I've managed, somehow, to end up with a duplicate model... so it needs a new home. Pacific Rail Shops Double Door Box Car kit # B453.3 - SAL # 23315 This kit was started, but never finished. Comes WITHOUT trucks,or couplers. The model in the attached photo is what you will receive. Asking $22 + $8 for shipping. Thanks. John Degnan Scaler164@...

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78683	From: dewoods1972	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

Attachments : IMG_7039.JPG 19B_3.jpg 19B_2.jpg Thanks for all the tips I received about how to repair the 19B transformer knob.  I eventually decided to order a replacement part from The Train Tender.  It was only $8 plus 5.75 shipping, which was just a little more than the price of the J-B Weld adhesive I would have to purchase. And when I inspected the bakelite knob more closely I discovered other damaged areas and cracks. Now to my second question about the neutral position of the contact arm.  As shown in the attached photo, on my transformer the carbon roller touches the transformer winding in that position.  I had thought that it would be slightly above the windings and then be pushed into contact when the contact lever stud presses down when the dead man handle is locked into position. What am I getting wrong? I have included a copy of the 19B Parts Diagram and List. Dave Woods

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Group: S-Trains	Message: 78684	From: wjgill1	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down to backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78685	From: John Degnan	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: PRS Kit For Sale - SOLD

This model has been spoken for.  Thanks to all who replied. John D.

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78686	From: R G	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down to backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78687	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/30/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper? Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78688	From: racin510	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

My opinion is still that the carbon roller never breaks contact with the windings and turned all the way back you will always have a low voltage until you lift the spring loaded control lever. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78689	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

From: Alan Lambert Ken, Yes it is. What Bill said was for Lionel's AF Fastrack which is totally different.  Alan Lambert   From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper? Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78690	From: paul	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

Rick,  you have to be right on the transformers with dead man handles. the constant low voltage keeps the reverse units from cycling.  Paul Rinehart On 12/31/2016 3:53 AM, racin510@... [S-Trains] wrote:   My opinion is still that the carbon roller never breaks contact with the windings and turned all the way back you will always have a low voltage until you lift the spring loaded control lever. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78691	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

From: Alan Lambert Rick, You are right. Why do they call it a dead mans handle. You lift it up to "stop" the train. For some trains having that low voltage will keep the reverse unit from cycling .    Alan From: "racin510@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 2:53 AM Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer   My opinion is still that the carbon roller never breaks contact with the windings and turned all the way back you will always have a low voltage until you lift the spring loaded control lever. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78692	From: William Gill	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

RE: Why do they call it a “dead man’s handle” My observation: You can operate the control in two ways. First, you can defeat the “dead man” feature by clipping/securing the handle in the spring clip. The handle will stay down, maintain contact, and supply voltage to the track even when you are not holding the handle. Second and for the “dead man” feature, you can hold the handle down with just enough pressure to electrically “make-up” the spring loaded contact and supply voltage to the track. When you take your hand off of the handle it springs up, electrical contact is broken, and no voltage is supplied to the track. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78693	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

Alan,   The comment implied that S-Helper ( now sold to MTH) produced a track superior to FastTrak but after S-Helper stopped production the track was no longer available and the alternative was Fast Trak, which is similar but not completely compatible. I have been selling Showcase line track at Train shows and a number of Flyer fans were not aware it existed or was back in production.  I have used it for several years and it is such a big improvement over the OEM track and the competition that I wonder why  some Flyer fans have never considered using it.  I suspect that some dealers and Flyer fans have exaggerated the "death' of the product line.   A regret is that they never produced a turnout for their 29" radius track. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 8:39 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   From: Alan Lambert Ken, Yes it is. What Bill said was for Lionel's AF Fastrack which is totally different.  Alan Lambert   < /div> From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper? Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78694	From: Alan Lambert	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

From: Alan Lambert Ken,  I use S-Helper track and switches. Wish I could Find more at our Plano, Texas train show. Lionel wanted to add a track system to the American Flyonel line.  Alan   From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Alan,   The comment implied that S-Helper ( now sold to MTH) produced a track superior to FastTrak but after S-Helper stopped production the track was no longer available and the alternative was Fast Trak, which is similar but not completely compatible. I have been selling Showcase line track at Train shows and a number of Flyer fans were not aware it existed or was back in production.  I have used it for several years and it is such a big improvement over the OEM track and the competition that I wonder why  some Flyer fans have never considered using it.  I suspect that some dealers and Flyer fans have exaggerated the "death' of the product line.   A regret is that they never produced a turnout for their 29" radius track. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 8:39 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   From: Alan Lambert Ken, Yes it is. What Bill said was for Lionel's AF Fastrack which is totally different.  Alan Lambert   < /div> From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper? Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78695	From: Dave	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

I thought that when the dead man handle was lifted the plunger shaft moves out to remove pressure on the contact arm that would cause the arm to lift up and break contact between the carbon roller and the transformer winding.  However in my 19B transformer I think something is wrong because the contact arm does not spring up when the dead man handle is raised.  I am tempted to bend the arm.  Dave Woods Sent from Dave's iPhone On Dec 31, 2016, at 11:55 AM, William Gill wjbillgill@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   RE: Why do they call it a “dead man’s handle” My observation: You can operate the control in two ways. First, you can defeat the “dead man” feature by clipping/securing the handle in the spring clip. The handle will stay down, maintain contact, and supply voltage to the track even when you are not holding the handle. Second and for the “dead man” feature, you can hold the handle down with just enough pressure to electrically “make-up” the spring loaded contact and supply voltage to the track. When you take your hand off of the handle it springs up, electrical contact is broken, and no voltage is supplied to the track. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78696	From: D. Scott MacKenzie	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Track

I wish that someone (MTH or American Models) would build a ready made WYE.  It could make our layouts much more interesting

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78697	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

The contact roller stays in constant contact with the transformer as the handle turns.  The deadman lever is the switch that opens the circuit when lifted. The roller should not spring up when the lever is lifted. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Dave dewoods@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 10:22 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer   I thought that when the dead man handle was lifted the plunger shaft moves out to remove pressure on the contact arm that would cause the arm to lift up and break contact between the carbon roller and the transformer winding.  However in my 19B transformer I think something is wrong because the contact arm does not spring up when the dead man handle is raised.  I am tempted to bend the arm.  Dave Woods Sent from Dave's iPhone On Dec 31, 2016, at 11:55 AM, William Gill wjbillgill@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   RE: Why do they call it a “dead man’s handle” My observation: You can operate the control in two ways. First, you can defeat the “dead man” feature by clipping/securing the handle in the spring clip. The handle will stay down, maintain contact, and supply voltage to the track even when you are not holding the handle. Second and for the “dead man” feature, you can hold the handle down with just enough pressure to electrically “make-up” the spring loaded contact and supply voltage to the track. When you take your hand off of the handle it springs up, electrical contact is broken, and no voltage is supplied to the track. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78698	From: jhannawald	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

The track is available direct from MTH on their web site.  Search for S gauge track.   Jim H.   From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 1:16 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)     From: Alan Lambert Ken, I use S-Helper track and switches. Wish I could Find more at our Plano, Texas train show. Lionel wanted to add a track system to the American Flyonel line. Alan     From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)     Alan,   The comment implied that S-Helper ( now sold to MTH) produced a track superior to FastTrak but after S-Helper stopped production the track was no longer available and the alternative was Fast Trak, which is similar but not completely compatible. I have been selling Showcase line track at Train shows and a number of Flyer fans were not aware it existed or was back in production.  I have used it for several years and it is such a big improvement over the OEM track and the competition that I wonder why  some Flyer fans have never considered using it.  I suspect that some dealers and Flyer fans have exaggerated the "death' of the product line.   A regret is that they never produced a turnout for their 29" radius track.     Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921       -----Original Message----- From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 8:39 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   From: Alan Lambert Ken, Yes it is. What Bill said was for Lionel's AF Fastrack which is totally different. Alan Lambert     < /div> From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)     Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper?   Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921       -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together   I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck.   Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78699	From: Kenneth Clark	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: S-helper track Was:What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify th

I bring several boxes of S-helper track to the train shows, 10" and 15" straight sections, 29" R curved track and L&R switches. Next show is in two weeks in Costa Mesa.  I also have good condition used track at a lower price that I don't bring.  First show in six months so I'm readying the inventory.  Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 10:22 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   From: Alan Lambert Ken,  I use S-Helper track and switches. Wish I could Find more at our Plano, Texas train show. Lionel wanted to add a track system to the American Flyonel line.  Alan   From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Alan,   The comment implied that S-Helper ( now sold to MTH) produced a track superior to FastTrak but after S-Helper stopped production the track was no longer available and the alternative was Fast Trak, which is similar but not completely compatible. I have been selling Showcase line track at Train shows and a number of Flyer fans were not aware it existed or was back in production.  I have used it for several years and it is such a big improvement over the OEM track and the competition that I wonder why  some Flyer fans have never considered using it.  I suspect that some dealers and Flyer fans have exaggerated the "death' of the product line.   A regret is that they never produced a turnout for their 29" radius track. Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: Alan Lambert alanlambert64@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2016 8:39 am Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   From: Alan Lambert Ken, Yes it is. What Bill said was for Lionel's AF Fastrack which is totally different.  Alan Lambert   < /div> From: "Kenneth Clark kenrclark@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   Isn't the MTH S gauge track the same as S-Helper? Kenneth R. Clark P.O. Box 212454 Chula Vista, CA 91921 -----Original Message----- From: R G keyhole_corona@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> To: S-Trains <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Dec 30, 2016 9:01 pm Subject: Re: [S-Trains] Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)   I took an x-acto knife and put a beveled on each side of the slot to help with the mating of this track. That helped a little. I may bevel the front of  male  connector to ease joining the track. This design for joining the track is not very good. Far too much effort is needed to push the track together. S-Helper was a  far better design.  On Friday, December 30, 2016 6:01 PM, "wjbillgill@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: < /font>   Alan, RE: Trouble putting AF Fastrack together I too have experienced it being harder than what it should be to assemble AF Fastrack.  Here's what I do and what works for me:  Once the metal rail mating pieces are aligned and pushed together, I "wiggle" the track sideways while applying pressure, so you're only trying to push one set of the plastic male/female parts together at a time. This way much of your force is being applied to one set of mating pieces at a time.  Hope this makes some sense. Granted, I don't have a lot of experience, I've only done this twice. First time last Christmas, second time this Christmas with the PE set I gave my grandson. Given the nature of plastic and this connection design, I'm only expecting a finite number of times this track will be put together and taken apart before the plastic breaks. Hopefully someone smarter than me will come up with a fixit kit or screw the track down t o backing boards and "assemble" it that way.  Good luck. Bill Kelso, WA

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78700	From: snstrains	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Help with AF 19B Transformer

Rick is correct. Steve Blackburn Boise   In a message dated 12/31/2016 7:33:49 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, S-Trains@yahoogroups.com writes:   My opinion is still that the carbon roller never breaks contact with the windings and turned all the way back you will always have a low voltage until you lift the spring loaded control lever. Rick

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78701	From: David Dewey	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track

Yes, the carbon roll lifts off the transformer windings by raising the handle—that is the only “off” position that the “dead man” control units have. I think you made the smart move in buying a new turret. Do be careful when putting the screws into the “new” part as it’s already quite old and the plastic or Bakelite is now brittle, or more brittle than when new. As I’ve mentioned, I like to put a hot soldering tip on the screw head and wait for the screw to more easily screw in—you can feel it through the screwdriver when it is easier to turn (you have the screwdriver on the screw and put the iron’s tip against the screwdriver and the screw head—that way it’s harder for it to slip off and do something you don’t like). Fast-Track—yep, it’s a pain to snap together, and I don’t think it can be unsnapped an re-snapped too many times before the plastic fails. It’s great for a permanent layout, but lousy for an “on the floor” “put it down and take it up” operations. The old tinplate track is much better engineered for that.  Everything has its compromises!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78702	From: poniaj	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track

David is correct in his suggestion that care be taken.  However, I'd also suggest that before you insert a screw into a previously threaded hole in any plastic, you gently turn the screw in the opposite direction to fit the screw's threads in the plastic.  Once you find that the screw turns easily in the threads, you can continue until the screw is in place.  If you cross-thread the screw, you will enlarge the hole and damage the threads in the plastic, thus making the piece unusable. I've learned the hard way. Jerry Poniatowski

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78703	From: beebear	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: New Project for 2017

Attachments : I finally got a chance to fiddle around in my garage today and here is a neat thing to play with to make a log loader from a crane. The claw is one of those hair ties for kids. I just removed the pivot pin and the spring then drilled larger holes for a piece of number 12 solid wire or whatever you have handy.  I will need to make a new lighter tension spring to replace the original to make the claw open and close easier. I drilled small holes in the “handles” of the claws and tied string through each one. I will have to make a carrier to raise and lower the claw with one line and use a second line to open and close it.   The included pictures show the basic concept of how it works. If you hold the rod between your fingers and pull on the string the claws will open and close. Replacing the original spring will help hold the claw closed when the second line is released.   Yes it may be oversized but if it adds another option to an overhead crane.     This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78704	From: poniaj	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 19 B tanny fix & Fast-track

before you insert a screw into a previously threaded hole in any plastic, After posting my previous comment, I realize that I should have written "before tightening the screw into a previously threaded hole in any plastic" I guess that's what I get for not paying attention as I should. Jerry

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78705	From: wema103	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Turntables for S Scale?

Hi All, I am a bit new at S scale and was wondering where the best place to find a S scale turntable? I saw a few online but the prices were crazy high. any ideas welcome including kits or how to build your own. Thanks and happy new year!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78706	From: Tom	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?

The current issue of The Dispatch, which is the NASG magazine, for January-February 2017 has a nice article and plan for an “easy to build” turntable for S gauge.  You might want to check it out.  The magazine is available at many hobby stores and on the NASG website - thus the plug for joining the NASG. On Dec 31, 2016, at 4:18 PM, wema10389@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi All, I am a bit new at S scale and was wondering where the best place to find a S scale turntable? I saw a few online but the prices were crazy high.  any ideas welcome including kits or how to build your own. Thanks and happy new year!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78707	From: JOHN METZGER	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?

Look for Bowser turn tables. The O scale turn table is adaptable for S or S Scale use. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 31, 2016, at 4:18 PM, wema10389@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hi All, I am a bit new at S scale and was wondering where the best place to find a S scale turntable? I saw a few online but the prices were crazy high. any ideas welcome including kits or how to build your own. Thanks and happy new year!

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78708	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong. (Was Help identify this layout.)

The fact is that after three years of production, Lionel no longer had the rights to continue to produce the old-style of AF track, a right they had won as a result of the Lnl-Kline lawsuits……but it was only good for 3 years. So that track became history, and Lnl had NO AF track product to offer. In order to consider “starter sets”, they had to do something. It made more sense for them to tool up a snap-track product like their O-gauge system than to tool for old sectional tubular track…………….so they did.   <<< Lionel wanted to add a track system to the American Flyonel line. >>>     Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted. ,_._,___

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78709	From: The Upstairs Train	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: 934 floodlight car repair

I have conductivity from one wheel to the threaded part of the socket, and from the other wheel to the wire underneath the platform, but no conductivity from that wire to the base of the socket. My problem must be at the base of the socket inside the light housing. Is it possible to remove the socket from the light housing to repair the wire connection? If so, how do you do it? I haven't been able to figure anything out. Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78710	From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, Sunday, 01 January 2017

Attachments : "SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT" reminder When Sunday, 01 January 2017 05:00 PM to 11:30 PM (GMT-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) Where http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT, 5/27/2012, 8:00 pm Reminder from: S-Trains Yahoo! Group Title: SUNDAY EVENING S CHAT Date: Sunday May 27, 2012 Time: 8:00 pm - 12:00 am Repeats: This event repeats every week. Location: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ Notes: Sunday night online chat. Everyone welcome. Time: 8 PM **Web Address: http://myflyertrains.org/chat/ ** From S-Trains   Calendar

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78711	From: Doug Peck	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 934 floodlight car repair

Bob, You have to insert something thin like a finishing nail or ice pick through the hole in the rear of the globe. Line it up as best you can with the edge of the socket “frame, and tap it with a hammer. It will pop it loose from the small “prongs which hold it in place. Do your repair, thread the new wire back out through the hole, and epoxy or JB-Weld the “frame” back in place, but don’t apply epoxy all the way around……you need sufficient metal-to-metal contact.   Doug Peck Port Lines Hobby Supply 6 Storeybrooke Drive Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 doug@... www.portlines.com Phone Order Hours - Monday through Thursday:  2-5 PM (EST) only. No other availability. 978-465-8798 (Questions & Information) 1-888-708-0782 (Phone Orders only, please.) VISA-MASTERCARD-DISCOVER-AMEX-PAYPAL-CHECK-MONEY-ORDER  Accepted.   From: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com [mailto:S-Trains@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 7:26 PM To: S-Trains@yahoogroups.com Subject: [S-Trains] 934 floodlight car repair     I have conductivity from one wheel to the threaded part of the socket, and from the other wheel to the wire underneath the platform, but no conductivity from that wire to the base of the socket. My problem must be at the base of the socket inside the light housing. Is it possible to remove the socket from the light housing to repair the wire connection? If so, how do you do it? I haven't been able to figure anything out. Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78712	From: Tom	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: 934 floodlight car repair

Bob, I’ve had some puzzling situations with a non-working light such as yours and a friend tipped me off to the trick of soldering a dot of solder on the base of the bulb to make good contact at the bottom of the socket.  Some new bulbs are not long enough to touch the base of the socket and need a solder “extension” to make contact.  This may not solve all problems but it is always worth a try with a non-functioning socket with a new bulb. Tom Detmer On Dec 31, 2016, at 6:25 PM, The Upstairs Train theupstairstrain@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have conductivity from one wheel to the threaded part of the socket, and from the other wheel to the wire underneath the platform, but no conductivity from that wire to the base of the socket. My problem must be at the base of the socket inside the light housing. Is it possible to remove the socket from the light housing to repair the wire connection? If so, how do you do it? I haven't been able to figure anything out. Bob Graves TheGilbertGallery.org

Group: S-Trains	Message: 78713	From: rick gough	Date: 12/31/2016
Subject: Re: Turntables for S Scale?

There is a fellow on Ebay selling his custom made 24" turn table complete with drive for $300, which to me isn't crazy high. His phone number is listed as: 623 523 7384. Rick   On Saturday, December 31, 2016 3:24 PM, "JOHN METZGER johnm_63379@... [S-Trains]" <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Look for Bowser turn tables. The O scale turn table is adaptable for S or S Scale use. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 31, 2016, at 4:18 PM, wema10389@... [S-Trains] <S-Trains@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   Hi All, I am a bit new at S scale and was wondering where the best place to find a S scale turntable? I saw a few online but the prices were crazy high. any ideas welcome including kits or how to build your own. Thanks and happy new year!